Megathread Non-binary genders / Enbies - When Male and Female Aren't Special Enough

[Redeemer and Destroyer]

I've also read that some transgender people will use the agender label when they don't feel mentally ready to transition fully to he opposite gender, or their dysphoria is only affecting certain areas (which change to the remaining areas when treated).

There's a couple of nonbinary people I've had the pleasure of being friends. They're nice people and when I asked about the perspective on their gender, they were happy to oblige:

Usually it's dysphoria in chest, but not the bottom. Some take hormones in low doses to have changes, but at a slower pace than binary trans people, both to adjust to the changes and to know when they achieved androgyny. Being gendered causes them dysphoria, but for some they'll choose the "lesser of two evils" and choose gendered pronouns to make it easier for other people in social settings.

One friend in particular feels that having male characteristics (voice, genitals, and body hair) would cause them more dysphoria than having their female characteristics. They have to achieve an "in-between" in order to relieve their own dysphoria.

It seems true nonbinary people are sort of a mixed bag with dysphoria. It's one I'm sympathetic to, but not the Tumblr brand of nonbinary.

 

[Kikomi]

There are only 2 genders, and you're born as either one with no way to change that.

i see what your point of view is, but a mindset that simple about a really complex issue is a bit weird to me. the whole "GENDER IS A RAINBOW UWU MAKE UR OWN GENDER THERE'S 58 GENDERS" thing is a HUGE load of bandwagon bullshit, don't get me wrong, but you're not considering the scientific reasons behind the (legitimately dysphoric) transgender person's mindset. whether or not you consider it a mental disorder doesn't change the fact that it's a valid feeling. i've seen firsthand the effects it can have on a person, and it's really sad to see the issue being made into a trendy joke.

it's still funny as fuck to laugh at the tumblr transtrenders, though.

 

[DiscountLiquor]

but you're not considering the scientific reasons behind the (legitimately dysphoric) transgender person's mindset. whether or not you consider it a mental disorder doesn't change the fact that it's a valid feeling.

About to open a can of worms here and earn myself some good ol' disagreement points.

Spoiler

To start, I'd just like to say that I'll agree with you on everything else you've said so far regarding fakebois and the like- shit's hilarious.

There's only two sexes (I know gender and sex are not the same, but the two definitely correspond with one another).
I'm not sure if the, "it's a valid feeling" part refers to the supposed legitimacy of agender/bigender people (gender is not a feeling or marked by specific feelings, obviously), but it doesn't seem to hold any real weight other than, "accept it or you'll make x sad and dysphoric".
Anyhow, if a trans person experiences sex dysphoria due to their genitals/body being incorrect, the proper way to deal with it/alleviate it is HRT, surgery, etc, to appear and BE the sex you need to be in order to feel comfortable. What is the proper way to deal with "non-binary dysphoria" if there is no...third gender (or lack thereof)? IMO, wanting no genitals or secondary sexual characteristics sounds like more of a legitimate mental illness. I.E.- "I want my fingers gone and I want them gone now". Hopefully this helps you see what I mean.

I know that in some cases, NB people will go through HRT/surgery, but doesn't that technically just make them transmen (most NB people are AFAB olol), since their breasts are gone and they have facial hair/deeper voice/male physique? What is the point of that, anyways, if they're just gonna look like men? To not look like women? Huh...
Simply saying you're "neither gender"...doesn't make you genderless. Especially if you now look like a FtM.

The reason why transgender/transsexual people are valid and acknowledged as the only form of "gender deviation" is because...well, it makes sense in practically every aspect- biologically, neurologically, and mentally. There is observable evidence in each of these categories that prove transgenderism/transsexualism is not a trend, or made up. I have yet to see any longterm, conclusive studies done involving non-binary/bigender/agender people that validate why and how they are the way they are; I don't want to read personal anecdotes, I don't want to read a diary/blog, I want to see some informative, factual evidence that points to enbies being legitimate that isn't biased.

My intention here wasn't to be rude or confrontational, but to really understand why certain people feel as though it exists, as if it's real, that's all. Just morbid curiosity.

My punishment for the TL;DR above is sifting through the depths of Tumblr to find this thread some content.

Spoiler

Her facial hair looks like she took a thick black substance, trimmed some of her hair, then googled "dudebro goatee".

 

[Hypodermic Johnny]

About to open a can of worms here and earn myself some good ol' disagreement points.

Spoiler

To start, I'd just like to say that I'll agree with you on everything else you've said so far regarding fakebois and the like- shit's hilarious.

There's only two sexes (I know gender and sex are not the same, but the two definitely correspond with one another).
I'm not sure if the, "it's a valid feeling" part refers to the supposed legitimacy of agender/bigender people (gender is not a feeling or marked by specific feelings, obviously), but it doesn't seem to hold any real weight other than, "accept it or you'll make x sad and dysphoric".
Anyhow, if a trans person experiences sex dysphoria due to their genitals/body being incorrect, the proper way to deal with it/alleviate it is HRT, surgery, etc, to appear and BE the sex you need to be in order to feel comfortable. What is the proper way to deal with "non-binary dysphoria" if there is no...third gender (or lack thereof)? IMO, wanting no genitals or secondary sexual characteristics sounds like more of a legitimate mental illness. I.E.- "I want my fingers gone and I want them gone now". Hopefully this helps you see what I mean.

I know that in some cases, NB people will go through HRT/surgery, but doesn't that technically just make them transmen (most NB people are AFAB olol), since their breasts are gone and they have facial hair/deeper voice/male physique? What is the point of that, anyways, if they're just gonna look like men? To not look like women? Huh...
Simply saying you're "neither gender"...doesn't make you genderless. Especially if you now look like a FtM.

The reason why transgender/transsexual people are valid and acknowledged as the only form of "gender deviation" is because...well, it makes sense in practically every aspect- biologically, neurologically, and mentally. There is observable evidence in each of these categories that prove transgenderism/transsexualism is not a trend, or made up. I have yet to see any longterm, conclusive studies done involving non-binary/bigender/agender people that validate why and how they are the way they are; I don't want to read personal anecdotes, I don't want to read a diary/blog, I want to see some informative, factual evidence that points to enbies being legitimate that isn't biased.

My intention here wasn't to be rude or confrontational, but to really understand why certain people feel as though it exists, as if it's real, that's all. Just morbid curiosity.

My punishment for the TL;DR above is sifting through the depths of Tumblr to find this thread some content.

Spoiler

Her facial hair looks like she took a thick black substance, trimmed some of her hair, then googled "dudebro goatee".

They should really add "danger piercings" to the snowflake criteria as well as "dangerhair".

Also that second one. My god, guys, I think we found Chris' long-lost sister.

...someone should hook them up.

 

[trashpanda]

What the fuck kind of eyebrows is "Cain" going for?

 

[Hypodermic Johnny]

What the fuck kind of eyebrows is "Cain" going for?

They're trying to do that cutesy round-brow thing like you see on a lot of animals and in anime.

Except as we all know, it doesn't work in real life, so you just make your weeby ass look even more ridiculous than it already is.

 

[Wallace]

Another possible explanation for the various genderspecials is that it's an inversion of the traditional interaction between personality and physiological sex. If certain personality traits are masculine/feminine and you have a trait that doesn't match your sex, you must change your personality; e.g. boys being shamed for being nurturing, girls being shamed for showing aggression. Flipping this trope gives "you must change your sex to match your personality". This also has the added benefit (to genderspecials) of breaking the connect between cisgendered being normal, since the implication that they are "not normal" hurts their precious feelings.

Of course, as I said before, this means that few people would be considered cisgendered at all. Oddly enough, most of these troons still consider everyone else in the world who isn't in their social circle to be cis, and have no problems with using the term as a pejorative, since in a world where gender is subjective, who's to say what is true or not? What happens when two definitions clash with one another?

 

[DiscountLiquor]

Another possible explanation for the various genderspecials is that it's an inversion of the traditional interaction between personality and physiological sex. If certain personality traits are masculine/feminine and you have a trait that doesn't match your sex, you must change your personality; e.g. boys being shamed for being nurturing, girls being shamed for showing aggression. Flipping this trope gives "you must change your sex to match your personality". This also has the added benefit (to genderspecials) of breaking the connect between cisgendered being normal, since the implication that they are "not normal" hurts their precious feelings.

Of course, as I said before, this means that few people would be considered cisgendered at all. Oddly enough, most of these troons still consider everyone else in the world who isn't in their social circle to be cis, and have no problems with using the term as a pejorative, since in a world where gender is subjective, who's to say what is true or not? What happens when two definitions clash with one another?

Oh, that's just rich.

I think it might also have something to do with the fact that now that transgender people are being taken more seriously/somewhat accepted in society, these people think and react with, "Oh, well if Bob can become Bobette now, then I can be an agender demisexual foxkin!"

In a sense, it's almost like some form of mockery- or, alternatively, maybe they just don't understand transgenderism at all, which isn't that far of a stretch considering the current amount of ignorance surrounding trans people.
Ironic, isn't it?

 

[Trombonista]

My punishment for the TL;DR above is sifting through the depths of Tumblr to find this thread some content.

Spoiler

Her facial hair looks like she took a thick black substance, trimmed some of her hair, then googled "dudebro goatee".

It's funny how all of them are girls except for the second one.

 

[Pedo Bait]

Oh, that's just rich.

I think it might also have something to do with the fact that now that transgender people are being taken more seriously/somewhat accepted in society, these people think and react with, "Oh, well if Bob can become Bobette now, then I can be an agender demisexual foxkin!"

In a sense, it's almost like some form of mockery- or, alternatively, maybe they just don't understand transgenderism at all, which isn't that far of a stretch considering the current amount of ignorance surrounding trans people.
Ironic, isn't it?

Now that you mention it, I kinda wonder if these people are like an incredulity-shield for actual trans people. Like, people often say that all these oppression olympics kids are an insult to actual trans people and devalue the suffering of gender dysphoria and other mental illnesses etc. etc. But maybe they serve a purpose, like, they take the spotlight from haters, so that instead of spending all their energy trying to 'disprove' gender dysphoria, they just take it for granted so they can use it to disprove non-binarism or something.

 

[Kikomi]

It's funny how all of them are girls except for the second one.

to be fair, the last one is actually trying. looks like they're actually on HRT or something and they aren't dressed like a fakeboi(makeup, pastel clothes, etc)
the others are just embarrassing to look at. 3rd one is cringey but actually made me question their gender, so bonus points for that. the makeup on the 4th one reminds me of 2007 rave kids. how little self awareness would one need to have to present themselves like that? the hair on the 5th one might actually be the worst part of the whole set. i'm all for people expressing themselves but there really has to be a point where you draw the line. the 6th one is just sad. the kid totally fucked up her eyebrows to look like shiba uni brows.

 

[Autistic Phil Collins]

I find it a bit interesting that most of these "nonbinary" transtrenders are indeed females at birth. I wonder if there are studies behind this sort of thing.

 

[DirkBloodStormKing]

I find it a bit interesting that most of these "nonbinary" transtrenders are indeed females at birth. I wonder if there are studies behind this sort of thing.

Probably some sort of misogynistic yaoitard thing. A lot of these people seem to be at the very least somewhat sexist, if not outright misogynistic as fuck.

 

[AnOminous]

About to open a can of worms here and earn myself some good ol' disagreement points.

You can see the autism oozing from the pores of every single one of those tardfaced lumps. What a bunch of ridiculous looking utter twats.

 

[Wallace]

I find it a bit interesting that most of these "nonbinary" transtrenders are indeed females at birth. I wonder if there are studies behind this sort of thing.

Autoandrophilia, perhaps?

 

[Argonian Scum]

I find it a bit interesting that most of these "nonbinary" transtrenders are indeed females at birth. I wonder if there are studies behind this sort of thing.

Said transtrenders live in a scene where cis people deserve to be attacked, all their friends reblog about is women being hated and murdered by exes, and "feminism" means "be a vapid slut like men/trannies tell you and you're a sexist pearl-clutching bigot if you don't agree."

You wouldn't want to call yourself a woman/girl either in that shitty, toxic subculture.

 

[RM 810]

I find it a bit interesting that most of these "nonbinary" transtrenders are indeed females at birth. I wonder if there are studies behind this sort of thing.

My theory is that when trans men started to lose favour with the SJ crowd for being evil men most of the fake bois swapped over, you rarely see a male nb because they can just pretend to be trans women for asspats.

 

[DiscountLiquor]

Autoandrophilia, perhaps?

Probably some sort of misogynistic yaoitard thing. A lot of these people seem to be at the very least somewhat sexist, if not outright misogynistic as fuck.

 

[Kled]

I've noticed with NB people, especially since ive had the displeasure of being around a few, they don't have interesting personalities. Their personalities are their not-gender and everything they do revolves around their not-genders.

 

[Kikomi]

I've noticed with NB people, especially since ive had the displeasure of being around a few, they don't have interesting personalities. Their personalities are their not-gender and everything they do revolves around their not-genders.

and months-old tumblr memes. lots of those.