Pragmata

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Zenos Yae Viator said:
Do you have theory of mind? Can you conceive that I wouldn't know this obscure factoid about the creators of what I remember as an innocent cartoon from 25 years ago?

And obviously fuck people who do sexualize Angelica or whoever, but that wasn't the point I'm making and only furthers it.

Does outside influence on media infect the product/media/game, and if so, what can you really actually create going forward.
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OK then maybe you can explain this:

You know what this website is. You know what we do here. You know who we are. Maybe you don't know me, maybe my posts on this website aren't enough to inform you. But you damn well know who the admin of this site is.

Specifically, you know the admin of this site is one of the most informed people in the world regarding the behavior of sick internet fucks. You know he knows more about this than you. There is no possible situation in which you could possibly know more about this than him. You know this.

Why are you arguing with him? Why are you telling him he's crazy? He gave you a very clear explanation of what is fucked up here, exactly how it is fucked up, and gave examples of fucked up behavior.


Why, instead of listening to him, do you declare that he can't possibly be right? What gives you grounds to make that assertion?

You can't just fucking say "I don't believe it" or "it's not convincing". It doesn't matter what you think about it. Someone that you know knows drastically more about it than you believes it. Someone with far more experience on the topic than you is convinced.

I nor nobody else gives a flying fuck whether your tiny mongoloid brain is capable of performing abstract thought. All you need to know is that the experts agree - the preponderance of discussion around this game is pedophilic in nature and most of the people playing it are publicly broadcasting pedophilic memes and dogwhistles all over Steam and social media. The developers are doing it, the publisher is doing it, they're all doing it. This is a fact.

Explain how you can possibly know more about this topic and explain what justifies your disagreement or shut the fuck up and go back to gooning to little girl feet you fucking sicko creep
 
Estate said:
Look dude, if you don't see or you don't get it, nothing I or anyone else say will change that.
Honestly, I believe you're probably autistic to some extent. You do not grasp implied things
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Like I said earlier, don't assume others are working with all the info you already have, it's subhuman thought processing.

My points are about the broader discussion on media that surrounds this issue, you can't have that discussion because you want any questioning voices, even ones like mine that agree with you, to just concede to the braintrust or get the jacket
 
ringtones said:
There is no possible situation in which you could possibly know more about this than him. You know this.
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1, I do not disagree with Null on Pragmata, however I reject the "just accept he knows more than you"
It's a thought terminating demand, fuck you on that

2, my points aren't about disagreement it's about broader media discussion going forward, nothing about what I'm saying denies the weirdos around this game
 
There are pedo freaks that sexualize Angelica but I don't see hundreds of people trying to convince themselves and others that those pedos don't exist because they want to watch Rugrats.
 
Zenos Yae Viator said:
Like I said earlier, don't assume others are working with all the info you already have, it's subhuman thought processing.

My points are about the broader discussion on media that surrounds this issue, you can't have that discussion because you want any questioning voices, even ones like mine that agree with you, to just concede to the braintrust or get the jacket
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Will you look at all this discussion?
pedo001.PNGpedo002.PNGpedo003.PNGpedo004.PNG
 
Okay, look. The fact is this game has designs that attract pedophiles.

The real question is this: was this intentional on the part of the devs?

The historical evidence points to a resounding "almost definitely" when in a just world it should be "hell no."

This is the central point.
 
Estate said:
And I said this was a game designed to attract pedophiles, not that the game had explicit child predation.
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Yea that's where things can get murky with some products, this one has enough stink around it that people have posted, but it something that you will struggle to sell to normies on

Nothing from in-game is overtly or even implied sexual unless bare feet are now inherently so.

It's all the social media and implications and the degens around it
 
X Prime said:
Okay, look. The fact is this game has designs that attract pedophiles.

The real question is this: was this intentional on the part of the devs?

The historical evidence points to a resounding "almost definitely" when in a just world it should be "hell no."

This is the central point.
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The Pragmata director has given a interview about Diana's design and it pretty much confirms that Capcom intentionally wanted her to look like a little girl instead of an actual android.

https://automaton-media.com/en/news...han-wouldve-been-difficult-to-achieve-says-d/

According to Cho, he originally wanted to have Diana look and feel like a full-blown android, but due to certain restrictions, the devs at Capcom settled for conveying her robotic vibes in a more understated manner, through small gestures and mannerisms
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X Prime said:
I am having some difficulty figuring out what "restrictions" these would be. If anything making them more robotic would loosen restrictions heavily, especially if the issue is the Japanese rating agency CERO.
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I'm going to guess that's an awful translation by shitty underpaid "game journalists" who drank through college and are completely worthless at their jobs

From the original article, https://www.famitsu.com/article/202602/65244
――『プラグマタ』では、少女型アンドロイド・ディアナが登場しますが、どういった部分でアンドロイド的な要素を強めていますか？

趙
　ゲーム制作を行ううえではさまざまな規制があるので、表現にはある程度の壁が存在します。生身の人間ではないアンドロイドだからこそできる表現を多く盛り込みたかったのですが、ディアナの見た目などもふまえてとても苦労しました。

　たとえば『Dr.スランプ アラレちゃん』みたいに、自身の頭を持つみたいなわかりやすい表現は難しいです。その代わり、彼女の細かい仕草でアンドロイド感を出したりしています。
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—*Pragmata* features Diana, a young girl-like android; in what specific ways have you emphasized her android-like characteristics?

Zhao: When creating video games, we face various regulations, which inevitably places certain limitations on creative expression. I really wanted to incorporate many forms of expression that are only possible precisely because the characters are androids—rather than flesh-and-blood humans—but taking into account factors such as Diana’s visual design, I encountered quite a few difficulties along the way.

For instance, it is difficult to employ straightforward visual cues—such as the ability to remove one's own head—in the style of *Dr. Slump*. Instead, we convey her android nature through subtle mannerisms and gestures.
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It seems to me that he's saying he wanted to be a lot more perverted and include scenes such as her removing her head.


Interestingly the director of Pragmata seems to be the same person who directed Ginga Tokyuu Milky Subway, which I really like.
 
X Prime said:
I am having some difficulty figuring out what "restrictions" these would be. If anything making them more robotic would loosen restrictions heavily, especially if the issue is the Japanese rating agency CERO.
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It makes no sense, so it leads me to believe that they mean arbitrary "restrictions" imposed by a higher-up - or it's just some slimy weasel's copout.

EDIT:
ringtones said:
I'm going to guess that's an awful translation by shitty underpaid "game journalists" who drank through college and are completely worthless at their jobs

From the original article, https://www.famitsu.com/article/202602/65244




It seems to me that he's saying he wanted to be a lot more perverted and include scenes such as her removing her head.


Interestingly the director of Pragmata seems to be the same person who directed Ginga Tokyuu Milky Subway, which I really like.
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Well, shit...
 
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This is Ginga Tokyuu Milky Subway, characters designed by Zhao, and the one on the right is probably representative of the general direction he originally intended for the character before Capcom stepped in

character is the driver in this video
 
An Ordinary Ordinator said:
I do find it funny Null brought up the Walking Dead example in his post because I remember playing Season 2, the one where you play as Clementine, and there was an adolescent girl you met while you were sneaking around trying to find medical supplies to dress a dog bite. She was a CHILD acting within the parameters of how CHILDREN normally act,
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Not to split hairs but I think it's a jarring contrast because in season 2 you are also playing a child, one younger than the one you're talking about. So when the story already contains an example of a child not acting like a child, every other child in comparison just looks like a retard. The first thing you see of Clementine is her more or less recognising the situation isn't a good one (hiding in her tree house. whispers over the walkie talkie with Lee) so seeing a character a couple years into her teens displaying less awareness than a pre-teen just makes her far more annoying.

People fantasise about having the perfect family, and like any other fantasy, it tends to skip over all the steps required to get to that point. "Don't let your dreams be dreams" and all that.
If you want to start a family, you need to go outside and actually put the effort in.
General Zoider said:
does anyone know if the game will be fully cracked or will a hypervisor crack be needed for the forseeable future?
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Might not be popular enough to warrant it, plus there might be more popular titles in need of cracking first, like the Yakuzas, Total Warhammer 3, etc.
If it gets easier for the guy to crack the game after cracking RE9, then yeah. it might just get done for the sake of completeness unless there's a huge demand, which I don't think there is.
Zenos Yae Viator said:
And my question is there a separation from people sexualizing a product or thing from the thing itself.
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Issue is there's fallacies fighting fallacies so any debate/argument on the subject will only be couched in bad faith, primarily because the subject is revulsive.
When people see you ask this question, and taking into consideration that some of the people defending the game could be actual pedophiles, this could be seen as Begging the Question:
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And above that: Reductio Ad Absurdum.
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Psychologically:
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Though even if you spot or see any of these there's still the ever-important:
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Someone pointing out an error in your logic does not mean you can dismiss them right away as trying to disregard your argument, but just because you spot one too does not mean the conclusion is incorrect (at least its core, even if some of its parts don't fit)

I think the question you are asking is one that isn't the one being argued.
The statements: "Capcom is a creep company who hires pedophiles and caters to them." & "Pragmata's Diana was designed to appeal to pedos."
Are two statements being said.
Because people feel those accusations on X (Capcom) and Y (Pragmata) are being said, they must defend Z (themselves), but because they are not the direct target, the arguments end up being in defence of X and Y, which appears like a defence of pedophilia.

This defence occurs because you are in an abstract sense, affirming a disjunct at your foundation:
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"I am not a pedophile. Therefore X does not appeal to pedophiles in some way."
Essentially, you do not need to defend Capcom or this game to defend yourself unless you are being attacked or accused personally of pedophilia.
 
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