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- Mar 5, 2021
"Timeless" is something else. I like the sad leitmotif when you see them buried in ice. (It's the VOY theme slowed down.)
Probably the best money shot from that era.
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Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier
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Probably the best money shot from that era.
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- Dec 17, 2021
Voyager is fine, and it has some solid episodes from what I remember. Which episode was it that Neelix and Tuvac merged, that one was interesting.
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- Mar 7, 2016
Episode is literally called Tuvix.
Voyager was a real hit and miss in writing, pacinjg and episode terms as the TNG writers were just... forced to write another 6+ seasons of the same stuff they did, which is why up to at least season 4 you see a lot of reptition of plots and points and even characters in many ways.
Normally a network would release some to go over to say, Deep Space 9 for a season or so, but Ihra had apparently already made the network mildly annoyed enough that they didn't really want to give him more resources than he needed bare minimum, so instead back into the same writing room with the same basic team the TNG writers went to write yet another ship based show.
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I try to give VOY a chance but I just can't sit through it. It thoroughly turns me off, only OG Trek that does.
WhatIsThePunchline
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Voyager has a lot of good stuff. And the characters are solid which is the most important part with Trek.
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VOY isn't known for well-constructed sci-fi plots. I caught a Star Trek marathon on the H&I channel, years ago, and the first episode which came up was "Tinker, Tailor, Doctor, Spy." You could swap Picardo out with Arnold Rimmer and lose nothing.
I think Plinkett would really dig it, since he loves Night Court.
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- Mar 7, 2021
Voyager has the last good Trek theme music.
Yeah some of the early episodes can be very hit or miss. Plot lines dropped include the Kazon (broccoli heads), Macquis crew integration with star fleet, anything to do with Cardassia or Seska. If you have the general situation down, star fleet alone in an unexplored quadrant, you can basically watch any episode. Voyager is flying home, Voyager finds something, they resolve it, status quo reigns, then resume course home. Year of Hell would have made a great season instead of two-parter, but it might also have been awful as an entire season.
Janeway is cultured and rose through the science division before transferring to command. The Da Vinci episodes were fun, and starred John Rhys-Davies. Mulgrew lived in Italy for a while and dated an Italian, and her love for Italy shone through the character, as often happens in Trek shows. While a common criticism is nerfing the Borg, the Borg can't remain all powerful forever, and a ship deep in Borg space would have to adapt or die. Anyway the actor shines through the character, as is good for Trek.
Yeah its a favorite episode of mine. And definitely, seeing Voyager crashed was an emotional blow. Equinox was amazing.
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- Dec 17, 2021
One thing I think Voyager failed to do was explore things like how do people functions with the absence of some of the Trek technology. A big issue why the stranded theme is hard to do is because things like replicators make limited resources not really an issue and that cuts down a lot of the plotlines. Would be cool to see a similar concept but where the replicators get damaged for a season and they have to find ways of obtaining things like food, leading to questions of how do they trade with civilizations on planets that aren't advanced without screwing things up, how do they adapt after being raised in an environment that never had to worry about such things, etc. It doesn't have to be grimdark, just needs to explore some of the situations that happen when a society is reliant on certain technology and that technology fails on some level for a certain amount of time. Could even be that not everything is down, just enough that they can't fully meet necessary requirements so they need to supplement 10% of the food supply or something for an extended period of time, and there's no easy supply line.
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They kind of did that early on, having to limit replicator use due to energy reserves, forcing them to look at alternative methods to feed the crew. Eventually though, that sorta went away as something discussed on screen.
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It didn't help that they kept the holodecks running.
Which... use replicator technology...
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They handwaved that by saying the holodecks used different energy reactors that weren't compatible with replicator systems. Doesn't make a lot of sense, but this is Voyager.
JANEWAY: What about alternative energy sources? Ensign Kim, have you had any luck getting power from the holodeck reactors?
KIM: Not yet. We tried hooking them to the power grid and we ended up blowing out half the relays. The holodeck's energy matrix, it just isn't compatible with the other power systems.
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Remember that Voyager torpedo YouTube video? One of the reasons I just can't sit through it, zero consistency.
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The Doctor and Tuvok heavy episodes are the only reason I kept with it.
And that torpedo video is fucking gold!
Included for anyone who hasn't seen it before
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I don't ever really remember it being a factor though. I'd want something more tangible, for example, maybe an episode where they visit a more primitive planet and negotiate a trade while posing as people from the primitive planet. Then they realize because the resources went to them, one of the countries/tribes on that feudal style planet now might go to war as it was denied resources. So they have to figure out a way to mediate things as otherwise they might have completely fucked up the eco system and violated the prime directive even though they initially didn't think that was the case.
You know, stuff like that, which explores the themes of Star Trek with the added difficulties of limited resources.
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I vaguely remember it being only lightly used as a factor early on. Mostly comic relief with Janeway having to try some weird sludge as a "better than coffee substitute"
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Oh I am aware of that. What makes it even dumber is when you're like, "then why not just host meals on the holodeck???
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It's hard to fathom they were that dumb back then not to realize holodecks and replciators are practically the same thing. Shit, the TNG tech manual had been out for a few years by that point and it explictly describes holodecks as being part-replicator.
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On a side note, Ronald D Moore did a great job with that when he made he Galactica reboot. It's almost like he made a wish list of things from Voyager that bugged him and rolled them into his next project.
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Seven beimg rejected from Starfleet is exceptional. Had Voyager died in season 3 and we gotten a late 00's Star Trek series with out talentless hacks behind it, a former Borg crew member is such an obvious go to it would almost be cliche.
"Oh, they just did Worf but with the newer big bads"
A diverse cast(that isn't just skin deep) is what draws people in on Star Trek, even fucking Orville gets that.
-Mr Spock in TOS(plus for the time you could argue Uhura and Sulu).
-Worf and Data, to a lesser extent Troi, on TNG.
-DS9 you have former Terrorist Kira(and the rather unique for Trek of the religiousness of Bajor), a seemingly unique Shape shifter, a symbiotic lifeform living with another person, a criminal Ferangi and his family, eventually a Glowie Cardasssian. I think DS9 is considered the best by some people cause it had so many characters that were alien in concept to a normal human character.
-Voyager starts a little weak, we get a Vulcan, which were kinda sparse in TNG and DS9, Nelix and Kes weren't given a lot of alienness, the Maqui are just wasted and almost forgotten by season 2, Bellanna just retreads Worf as a Klingotto, but weaker. The Doctor, what was essentially an appliance that grew into an individual as a consequence of necessity, was their best "different" character. While he similar to Data, he's a different enough take on it to not feel like a retread. Seven eventually joins and while it's joked that her massive Borg implants are what made her popular, it was more the the uniqueness of someone that largely grew up in a collective hivemind discovering individuality.
I didn't finish Season 1 of Picard, but it doesn't spend any time on developing characters anyways, so the girl that doesn't know she's an Android and the autistic Romulan murderer don't get to be explored and tell interesting stories with characters that don't think like normal humans. And from what I hear, they are just yeeted in season 2, and we have an all human cast for season 2(RLM stated it seems like they just soft retconned Android Picard)
I'm not sure about Brave New Worlds, I've not been talked into it yet, but I'm listening. However, to me, what makes a show feel like Star Trek is episodic nature, and a cast of characters with interesting distinctions from human beings.
Which is why I'm looking forward to it's cheap knock off that manages to do a competent job at playing with these tropes, the Orville.
"Oh, they just did Worf but with the newer big bads"
A diverse cast(that isn't just skin deep) is what draws people in on Star Trek, even fucking Orville gets that.
-Mr Spock in TOS(plus for the time you could argue Uhura and Sulu).
-Worf and Data, to a lesser extent Troi, on TNG.
-DS9 you have former Terrorist Kira(and the rather unique for Trek of the religiousness of Bajor), a seemingly unique Shape shifter, a symbiotic lifeform living with another person, a criminal Ferangi and his family, eventually a Glowie Cardasssian. I think DS9 is considered the best by some people cause it had so many characters that were alien in concept to a normal human character.
-Voyager starts a little weak, we get a Vulcan, which were kinda sparse in TNG and DS9, Nelix and Kes weren't given a lot of alienness, the Maqui are just wasted and almost forgotten by season 2, Bellanna just retreads Worf as a Klingotto, but weaker. The Doctor, what was essentially an appliance that grew into an individual as a consequence of necessity, was their best "different" character. While he similar to Data, he's a different enough take on it to not feel like a retread. Seven eventually joins and while it's joked that her massive Borg implants are what made her popular, it was more the the uniqueness of someone that largely grew up in a collective hivemind discovering individuality.
I didn't finish Season 1 of Picard, but it doesn't spend any time on developing characters anyways, so the girl that doesn't know she's an Android and the autistic Romulan murderer don't get to be explored and tell interesting stories with characters that don't think like normal humans. And from what I hear, they are just yeeted in season 2, and we have an all human cast for season 2(RLM stated it seems like they just soft retconned Android Picard)
I'm not sure about Brave New Worlds, I've not been talked into it yet, but I'm listening. However, to me, what makes a show feel like Star Trek is episodic nature, and a cast of characters with interesting distinctions from human beings.
Which is why I'm looking forward to it's cheap knock off that manages to do a competent job at playing with these tropes, the Orville.