Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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XYZpdq said:
but yeah that one with her and Niles. I picked up "... okay. " from that ep.
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Sitcom characters have a lot of sex partners. I read somewhere that the cast of Friends had sex 138 times.

Scrubs pretty much revolves around sex, on a very immature level even. JD ignores married women to the point where he can't see them, and when he realizes this, he starts trying to grab boobs and butts that he can't see.
 
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JamesFargo said:
Sitcom characters have a lot of sex partners. I read somewhere that the cast of Friends had sex 138 times.

Scrubs pretty much revolves around sex, on a very immature level even. JD ignores married women to the point where he can't see them, and when he realizes this, he starts trying to grab boobs and butts that he can't see.
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I wonder what Barney from HIMYM final number was…shame that show had one of the worst ending ever.
 
Lilith was enough of a regular on Cheers that Bebe Neuwirth made it into the opening credits by Season 9.

On Frasier, she would make a single appearance each season, the best ones being the hookup with Niles after being dumped by her gay boyfriend, and the one where Frasier has an imaginary conversation with his three most prominent exes and his mother.

Shame that David Hyde Pierce never appeared on Star Trek. He would have done well as an uptight and pretentious officer who has a humorous encounter with Data or something like that.
 
Well we got to week 3 before a MUH RAYCISMS episode rocked up....

But it was in context of established cannon.

So the Ilyrians which rocked up in Enterprise where they modify themselves to match the planet's atmosphere and bioshpere make a reappearance.

Which squicks out all the Federation and Humans in particular cause of, ya know, the whole eugenics wars thing. The plots pretty good, and lets us focus a bit more on a bunch of characters who never really got much going for them in TOS. M'Benga and Una specifically get some character development as does La'An, who they seem to have quietly dropped the "Singh" part from her name and it doesn't seem to be ADR.

Kind of a "One in every ten people is a relative of Ghenis Khan" vibe going on there with how she deals with that ancestry.

Oh and it turns out Una's a fucking Ilyrian.

No Joke. She's an alien the federation actively shuns because of the bad experience of one of its leading members with genetics which lets them make a "people have denied things because of raycisms despite no scientific fact backing it up". speech.

Despite the fact the episode also points out why the Ilyrians also fucked up as the main plot point.

They continued to fuck around with their genetic coding to try and undo themselves back to a genetic baseline to apply to join the Federation, only for a massive ion storm to smack into their planet where they caught a virus spread by light and all die running into the Ion Storm trying to expose themselves to lethal levels of light to further propagate the virus.

Some pretty good cinematography this episode, we get a bit of an In the Pale Moonlight nod where Una does a monologue while studiously ignoring the camera and the transition of that scene to M'Benga was really well done. Could do with a bit more of that to show its definitely a show in 2022, and not 2002.

Hemmer was great as well, we see a bit more of his department and considering he's been there all of probably a month for this episode he's already got the entire engineering department so whipped into shape a single snap of his fingers conveys all the command he needs to.

Overall, nice to see some more plots develop and more character development even if its a bit in the blubbery darker Nu-Trek vein.
 
Preferred Penne said:
Lilith was enough of a regular on Cheers that Bebe Neuwirth made it into the opening credits by Season 9.

On Frasier, she would make a single appearance each season, the best ones being the hookup with Niles after being dumped by her gay boyfriend, and the one where Frasier has an imaginary conversation with his three most prominent exes and his mother.

Shame that David Hyde Pierce never appeared on Star Trek. He would have done well as an uptight and pretentious officer who has a humorous encounter with Data or something like that.
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The best we have is this, which is already fantastic so it's not a huge loss:
 
Watching Scorpion Parts 1 and 2.

I had nearly forgotten how powerful Species 8472 was supposed to be. They are blowing up Borg ships and Borg ruled planets left and right.

It must have been so shocking in the nineties being a Trek fan-thinking the Borg were the top dogs and seeing another species just blow through them.
 
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Shamash said:
Watching Scorpion Parts 1 and 2.

I had nearly forgotten how powerful Species 8472 was supposed to be. They are blowing up Borg ships and Borg ruled planets left and right.

It must have been so shocking in the nineties being a Trek fan-thinking the Borg were the top dogs and seeing another species just blow through them.
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Yea it was, there was the Enterprise Borg episodes with Picard, then there was Wolf 359 where every ship you had seen was on fire and adrift with the crews dead or assimilated, the whole battle in First contract where the fleet was getting trounced left and right including the Defiant the ONLY federation warship getting it's shit pushed in and then seeing those Borg Cubes 3 of them get one shotted... was amazing.
 
I remember taping it and talking with my uncle who had seen it and said almost those exact words.

It was badass and 8472 was... well they were like the Borg of old - just so different and alien it felt intimidating.

Like all the best Voyager episodes, it was one where you felt like the ship was truly lost and alone in a dangerous galaxy.
 
Shamash said:
It must have been so shocking in the nineties being a Trek fan-thinking the Borg were the top dogs and seeing another species just blow through them.
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Voyager was too silly to be shocking. Species 8472 were handily defeated in their second episode and were never again a credible threat. And their ships look like rejected Vorlon models from Foundation Imaging.
 
Standardized Profile said:
Voyager was too silly to be shocking. Species 8472 were handily defeated in their second episode and were never again a credible threat. And their ships look like rejected Vorlon models from Foundation Imaging.
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Yea but that introduction was fucking amazing, Trek has been building the Borg as The Big bad for nearly 15 years by that point and seeing something handily take out 3 of the baddest ships in the franchise in one shot was a jaw dropper.
 
Phalanges Mycologist said:
Yea but that introduction was fucking amazing, Trek has been building the Borg as The Big bad for nearly 15 years by that point and seeing something handily take out 3 of the baddest ships in the franchise in one shot was a jaw dropper.
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It was just visual effects. There was no conflict between characters, between ideals. No threat to anything we cared about. No build-up of tension. No ebb and flow of battle, of hope and despair. It was nothing more than "those models that used to blow things up? Watch new models blow them up!" Stupid one-upmanship like JJ Abrams making bigger Death Stars or each successive antagonist in Nu Trek threatening the entire planet quadrant galaxy universe. Is anyone actually impressed by that? And it wasn't even visually interesting.
 
Flexo said:
It was badass and 8472 was... well they were like the Borg of old - just so different and alien it felt intimidating.
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Then immediately undermined species 8472 by making them build a replica of Starfleet HQ and befriending the Voyager crew. And this was after Janeway gave the Borg a weapon of mass destruction to use against them.

Of course then in typical Voyager pattern.. never heard from again. Was the Voyager-Borg treaty even mentioned in the finale?
 
ditto said:
Then immediately undermined species 8472 by making them build a replica of Starfleet HQ and befriending the Voyager crew. And this was after Janeway gave the Borg a weapon of mass destruction to use against them.

Of course then in typical Voyager pattern.. never heard from again. Was the Voyager-Borg treaty even mentioned in the finale?
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Pretty sure the treaty was just for one particular area of space.

And we can now say it’s not the dumbest thing they’ve done with the Borg….

Though I hope this means Janeway still blows up the Borg Queen in Picard’s timeline.
 
Scorpion does have quite a bit of internal character conflict tho.

Janeway and Chakotay's conflict over the Borg alliance stretches the entirety of the two parter.

As it stands-Voyager pretty much needed a Kes Ex Machina to get out of Borg Space at the end of it.

Having rewatched it earlier today I'd say its positive reputation is well deserved.
 
Shamash said:
As it stands-Voyager pretty much needed a Kes Ex Machina to get out of Borg Space at the end of it.
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It was a send off to the actress more than anything, to get 7 they had to kill off someone else Garret Wang was the fore runner for that (and 7 fit's Harry Kim's roll even better) but he somehow got voted one of the sexyest people on TV so they kept him because the studio didn't want to let him go, so they looked at it and decided Kes was nearly useless for plot so killed her off instead but she was supposedly really popular with the cast (again apart from Mulgrew) but she was showing early signs of instability.

I'd have liked them to have had a series where 7 was slowly becoming less Borg, and taking over harry's bridge roll naturally and having to play a game of hide and seek with the collective to get out of Borg space, but back then Trek had an aversion to story arks that lasted longer than a 2 parter.
 
Phalanges Mycologist said:
It was a send off to the actress more than anything, to get 7 they had to kill off someone else Garret Wang was the fore runner for that (and 7 fit's Harry Kim's roll even better) but he somehow got voted one of the sexyest people on TV so they kept him because the studio didn't want to let him go, so they looked at it and decided Kes was nearly useless for plot so killed her off instead but she was supposedly really popular with the cast (again apart from Mulgrew) but she was showing early signs of instability.

I'd have liked them to have had a series where 7 was slowly becoming less Borg, and taking over harry's bridge roll naturally and having to play a game of hide and seek with the collective to get out of Borg space, but back then Trek had an aversion to story arks that lasted longer than a 2 parter.
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Well, the Voyager writers did.
 
Ponderous Pillock said:
Well, the Voyager writers did.
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No it was the studio, and the show runner Rick Berman was Rottenberrys protege and wanted a new monster / species / planet every show with very little cross over of story inbetween, that's one of the reasons RDM dropped out of the writing team because they couldnt make story's last over multiple episodes even in part.

That's why the crew of Voyager despite being a mix of Starfleet, and maquis made up of Fleet flunkies, and never beens gelled together in under 3 episodes, and the shortages of supplies, equipment and alike never resulted in Voyager changing in appearance or obviously non star fleet specification or production parts where ever seen outside of 7's regeneration pods, hell you never saw Nelix's ship and it was bigger than a shuttle and the flyer and took up a whole spot in the shuttle bay.
 
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