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As much as I love Picard, I agree that this is unforgivable.
Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier
- Thread starter Snorlaxative
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- Jun 25, 2020
Picard did have Kirk like moments in TNG. Some episodes let him be a Indiana Jones alike even. That being said, he's still the least ballsy of the Captains at least until First Contact.
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- Dec 25, 2017
I think Drinker, Cullen, and other people who already watched the episodes are coming from the premise that this isn't the TNG we love, but rather TNG for a modern audience and under those standards, it's not as bad as you could expect. Yes, I'm aware that it sounds more like a cope than actual excitement for the show.
Looks like writers have removed the most obvious woke shit from it and focused more on a plot that could be similar to a mediocre TNG episode or a movie. Movies also had some woke stuff, remember one of the bridge officers was gay in FC despite it wasn't in the movie, so the virus was already there and FC is still the best of the lot.
While some people might try to force themselves to like it because "muh favorite YTer says it's good!", I think the opposite can happen too: "I hate it because it's woke" and that's not good either. ST has always had their own share of progressive bullshit. The difference is that it was presented in a way that actually inspired you to be a better person instead of being chastised for being white.
Looks like writers have removed the most obvious woke shit from it and focused more on a plot that could be similar to a mediocre TNG episode or a movie. Movies also had some woke stuff, remember one of the bridge officers was gay in FC despite it wasn't in the movie, so the virus was already there and FC is still the best of the lot.
While some people might try to force themselves to like it because "muh favorite YTer says it's good!", I think the opposite can happen too: "I hate it because it's woke" and that's not good either. ST has always had their own share of progressive bullshit. The difference is that it was presented in a way that actually inspired you to be a better person instead of being chastised for being white.
It was a different way of being ballsy. Kirk would punch you, Picard would mock you and act smug around you.
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- Jun 25, 2020
Didn't they only say that garbage after production and the actor himself didn't even know? It's been a couple decades so I'm kind of fuzzy but I do remember that being a thing after FC was released.
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- May 19, 2018
Honestly, the most interesting thing to me about the new Picard season is that Eragon is apparently in it.
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- Feb 14, 2023
It didn't preach and scolded the audience for having a different opinion or outlook, even when it went 'woke'. It showed how people might be in the future if they're not consumed by race, sexuality and political or religious differences, which isn't really that "progressive" to begin with. The outcomes of that line of thinking are, but I don't mind that, since it feels right, like a natural conclusion of treating everyone equally fair and it doesn't insult my intelligence or force me into a corner. I think that tells a lot about the quality of writing back in the day, compared with the shit the audience has to tolerate in >current year.
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If I remember correctly, it's in a novel or short story that's set later on and it deals with the Lt. Hawk's boyfriend being butthurt at Picard for killing Hawk. Never read it though.
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- Jan 6, 2022
Right like that episode where Riker sends him to space Thailand because he's getting too British and he ends up in a fun little archeology caper with the milfy con artist and the beta Ferengi orbiter. Good times.
His professionalism is charming and fun but it just leaves him the center of gravity for colorful plots and a center for relating to the story during moments of high intrigue. I feel like appreciating TV drama as such is kind of crucial to liking Star Trek. You have to appreciate the limitations and virtues of it being low budget and fundamentally theatrical, the pleasures of weekly high concept adventure formats, and ensemble casts of decent to talented actors with thin but enjoyable characters. It's a hard pitch for streaming and a perfect one for weekly series.
Oh man what was the episode called where they visited the planet and there was just and old man and his wife on it? The old man turned out to be a space deity or something and was just simulating his life with his wife who had died in an alien attack. That one really surprised me with how effective it was. They had to beam down to Planet California a few times and say hello to him, but they made a high concept story like that hum along with an old man, 20 bucks of special effects, a ship model they had laying around, and preexisting sets. Real marvel of production economy. The story itself was touching but I was even more impressed after when I considered the "limited palette" of television at the time.
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- Nov 21, 2020
I was expecting them to do something, anything with the line in Picard. Either the helmsman(er, helmswoman? I guess that's who LaForge was) or maybe Picard: "Really Seven?" And then either Seven: "It's allowed by regulations now, sir." to further point out how out of the loop he is. Or, Riker: "Let her have her fun, Admiral"
Standardized Profile
kiwifarms.net
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- Oct 5, 2018
It was a rumor on Usenet before the movie came out. I don't think there was any confirmation. No cut scenes in the novelization or anything like that.
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- Jan 2, 2018
My biggest issue with Captain Shaw was him starting the dinner early. That's just a douche move, even if I find him totally justified basically telling Picard and Riker no when they want to borrow his ship.
Think if a coworker on paid administrative leave, and a retired former boss, wanted to borrow your company car to give it a test drive all the way across the state, when you need to bring the car to the garage later that afternoon, and they're arguing that if you basically go as fast as the car would allow, you'll still be able to do both.
Captain Shaw is basically being asked to risk his ship, crew, career, and likely his own life for two people he doesn't really know beyond reputation. I'd probably order them both off the fucking ship.
Think if a coworker on paid administrative leave, and a retired former boss, wanted to borrow your company car to give it a test drive all the way across the state, when you need to bring the car to the garage later that afternoon, and they're arguing that if you basically go as fast as the car would allow, you'll still be able to do both.
Captain Shaw is basically being asked to risk his ship, crew, career, and likely his own life for two people he doesn't really know beyond reputation. I'd probably order them both off the fucking ship.
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- Sep 13, 2018
Kurtzman Trek also doesn't work because none of the characters act like normal people.
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- Dec 25, 2017
A reputation that not everybody seems to agree with, on top of it.
It's a similar situation as ST:TMP. Kirk was assigned a mission and he's meant to take over the new Enterprise, despite the Captain's obvious discomfort. The only difference is that here, the order came from Starfleet. Even if Kirk was considered a hero, being asked to step aside for them when you're capable and you've earned your rank is still a bit insulted.
Ike Aim
kiwifarms.net
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- Sep 20, 2021
He's Captain Swagger Stick from Star Trek III but updated for a more gay and snarky generation. This show is "borrowing" from the TOS movies hard. It's basically pulling out all the stops to give the TNG cast one good long movie in the spirit of those 80's films, which was the original promise and assumption of the shitty TNG films in the first place, but which never materialized because it turns out the TOS crew and the TNG crew are two totally different sets of characters and really only the TOS crew is amenable to adventure movies. What this show is doing is taking the opportunity of the entire franchise being gutted and humiliated and going for one last shot at it with the assumption that fans won't notice the complete and abrupt change in direction, characterizations, and tone (from TNG to Picard) this time if it seems like an improvement over prior nuTrek. They may be correct in that assumption.
Ironic since I believe it was Saavik who ordered impulse power when she was given the honor in Wrath of Khan to take the ship out of Space Dock and Kirk looks like he's about to faint. I don't think anyone knows how fast impulse or warp are supposed to be, but probably too fast for that regardless. I think what is most important with Star Trek is that the dialogue sounds like it's trying to be sufficiently nerdy, not necessarily internally consistent (but that's ideal). Star Trek is the fandom of technobabble that is used both as a plot device and a worldbuilding device to lend a sense of verisimilitude to an otherwise far-flung setting. So, when in this episode of Picard it starts out with Dr. Crusher spooling up her warp drive but not setting a course, something seems off. I think it's because fans expect a kind of procedure or protocol to the way the world operates on top of the very common sense notion that you should have a direction in mind of where you'd like to go or at least say "any heading"
Oh, @Harambe I envy you.
I believe that Decker Unit is supposed to be Commodore Decker's son and confirmed off-screen but it never made it into the final script. That would add an entirely other dimension to the insult.
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khaine
kiwifarms.net
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- Jan 31, 2021
I thought Impulse was sub-light speed, and then Warp was faster than light, with warp 1 being c
Edit, I looked at Memory Alpha, and I am wrong
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- Jan 6, 2022
Just watched Silicon Avatar. Turned out Ensign Ro was the last episode I saw, which was all right, even if it felt like a bit of a 'stock' episode where an untrustworthy low level officer is revealed to be competent, but misunderstood for political and/or personal reasons. Was worried it'd be a lame episode starting off with Riker teeing up the old goofy seduction grin, but it ended up being a really touching episode about grief and revenge. The idea that Frakes and his girdle work as the lothario of the bridge crew always gets a chuckle out of me, and episodes that hinge on him fucking his way out of a problem are honestly goofier than they are meant to be.
But this was good, lots of great little touches and subtle scenes. Data not being able to understand he's aggravating a tense situation with a grieving and vengeful mother by letting her wallow in her memories and regrets about choosing her career over raising her son was an excellent, subtle conflict and really something only Trek could pull off well. The conflict between a civilian's sense of ethics and an officer's sense of duty get highlighted really well, especially since Data is this personification of the rigor of command and duty, with only superficial humanity. Everyone meant well, and given the information and limitations each character had, acted competently and rationally. Picard had no chance to see Data reading the son's journal entry in his voice, nor knowledge that Data had such extensive records of Doctor Mahr's (Marr?) son, and Data had no reason or ability to suspect that she had lied to him and written a different subroutine. It even has a little moral lesson in there about the difference between kindness and empathy. Data can be kind, but he cannot be empathetic, and here he fails to make the proper decisions that would benefit the mission and the doctor. Really elegant plot construction where the mistakes hinged on the dynamic guest character's flaws and drives, building off the foundation of the seemingly positive actions of the more static main characters. Spiner in particular manages that easy compassion in his voice and demeanor very well as it gets revealed to be a mere skin on programming, especially in the final scene where he tells Doctor Mahr that her son would have been disappointed with her taking revenge at the cost of her career and likely her freedom. Also, is Spiner a guitarist? We see him play instruments a lot, but I am curious if he's ever actually playing anything. I'd guess in the violin scenes at least that's not him playing, but what do I know.
I also quite liked the scene where Riker confronts Picard about whether to confront the crystalline entity and destroy it or communicate with it. Some nice touches in that scene. Picard takes his feet off the desk as he gives Riker permission to enter. Great choice there. The dynamic of how they disagree with each other is great, the kind of conflict that keeps a plot running without turning the episode into a spoof as everyone double crosses everyone and ignores military discipline, then agrees to go back to normal next week.
Also found it funny that everyone on the bridge knows Riker is a fuckboy and who he's fucking this week, everyone acts like they knew he was about to tap that and give him their sincere regrets. In the script he literally just sets up the assignation. LaForge is probably down in engineering seething. How Riker and Troi end up together at the end is beyond me, she watches him fuck his way through the galaxy and every time she's had a suitor he's acted like a petulant jerk.
But this was good, lots of great little touches and subtle scenes. Data not being able to understand he's aggravating a tense situation with a grieving and vengeful mother by letting her wallow in her memories and regrets about choosing her career over raising her son was an excellent, subtle conflict and really something only Trek could pull off well. The conflict between a civilian's sense of ethics and an officer's sense of duty get highlighted really well, especially since Data is this personification of the rigor of command and duty, with only superficial humanity. Everyone meant well, and given the information and limitations each character had, acted competently and rationally. Picard had no chance to see Data reading the son's journal entry in his voice, nor knowledge that Data had such extensive records of Doctor Mahr's (Marr?) son, and Data had no reason or ability to suspect that she had lied to him and written a different subroutine. It even has a little moral lesson in there about the difference between kindness and empathy. Data can be kind, but he cannot be empathetic, and here he fails to make the proper decisions that would benefit the mission and the doctor. Really elegant plot construction where the mistakes hinged on the dynamic guest character's flaws and drives, building off the foundation of the seemingly positive actions of the more static main characters. Spiner in particular manages that easy compassion in his voice and demeanor very well as it gets revealed to be a mere skin on programming, especially in the final scene where he tells Doctor Mahr that her son would have been disappointed with her taking revenge at the cost of her career and likely her freedom. Also, is Spiner a guitarist? We see him play instruments a lot, but I am curious if he's ever actually playing anything. I'd guess in the violin scenes at least that's not him playing, but what do I know.
I also quite liked the scene where Riker confronts Picard about whether to confront the crystalline entity and destroy it or communicate with it. Some nice touches in that scene. Picard takes his feet off the desk as he gives Riker permission to enter. Great choice there. The dynamic of how they disagree with each other is great, the kind of conflict that keeps a plot running without turning the episode into a spoof as everyone double crosses everyone and ignores military discipline, then agrees to go back to normal next week.
Also found it funny that everyone on the bridge knows Riker is a fuckboy and who he's fucking this week, everyone acts like they knew he was about to tap that and give him their sincere regrets. In the script he literally just sets up the assignation. LaForge is probably down in engineering seething. How Riker and Troi end up together at the end is beyond me, she watches him fuck his way through the galaxy and every time she's had a suitor he's acted like a petulant jerk.
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- Aug 31, 2020
Well, not really. As Sisko said, "the Tenth fleet was out of position on a training exercise" and they lost Betazed over it. Also, Earth got blitzed. Granted, that fleet got completely destroyed when the cavalry showed up, but it turned San Francisco into... well... modern-day San Francisco.
Which has always been the chronic problem of Starfleet ship assignments. They are always too far out of range to assist other ships in an emergency, which also means that ships aren't covering each other for ambushes, which would happen all the time against the Jem'Hadar. I suspect a lot of Starfleet's attrition rate had more to do with this stupid need to cover as much space as possible with the least amount of ships than in the actual battles.
EDIT: @Harambe I'm pretty sure the wedding in Nemesis was an agreement: "If we're both not married by the time we're 50, we'll marry each other."
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- Aug 5, 2022
Remember they called it the "Time-Warp Drive" initially in TOS; they dropped that after like one episode but clearly they were thinking about it in a totally different way back then.
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- Jan 6, 2022
Makes sense, and by that point, even a 24th century girdle couldn't keep Riker's big belly in check.
Uranus Pink
kiwifarms.net
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- Mar 6, 2019
Losing Betazed was a huge deal with it being extremely close to Earth, Vulcan, and Andor.
Star Fleet and the Federation didn't had enough ships to do everything they needed to do. Hence them raiding the boneyards and barely do fuck all aside from turning them on and throwing into the fight as is. When for much of those boneyard fleets could've better serve in support roles and patrolling the other Federation borders in where the war is taking place.
Federation is bordering a lot of hostile and opportunistic
neighbors. And also they have treaty obligations with other neighbors tying up more ships due to those commitments. Plus the Dominion had been contacting other species in the Alpha and Beta Quadrants in trying to get them to side with them in the war.