Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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He's the cook but also has a role similar to an Indian scout. "Angry tribe here, should go around." He's also necessary because Tom Paris is the only other normie-ish character, and the writers needed more than one guy in boardroom scenes to ask normie questions so that the audience is kept up to speed. "Quadrocytaline? What is that?"
On that note maybe custer had the wrong idea. If he'd had neelix with his unit as a scout he could have fed the indians leola root stew to incapacitate them and maybe the little big horn would have gone in a different direction

Drag-on Knight 91873 said:
When the average Borg drone is strong and impact resistant enough to reasonably fight The Rock, Lt Hawk using the butt of his rifle isn't going to do much. Before you say Worf and his sword, remember that Worf is in the gym every day or on the holodeck playing He-Man with the safety turned off.
Using the butt of the rifle didn't exactly work out so well in first contact:
1:25

Fatsuit Shinji said:
In STO it and Zefram Cochrane's shotgun functionally are standard pick up for nearly all players against the borg. Except against the Mirror Universe borg who are all wearing mostly impervious body armor to projectile weapons.. In which elemental type weapons are needed to either freeze them or fry them.
TR116 works just fine against both
 
The last time I remember seeing Trek toys (not just collector shit on a web storefront) is 2009 Trek movie merch in Big Lots, a few years after the film had aired. I bought a Spock, and on retrospect wish I still had it: it was scaled like GI Joes and had swappable hands and decent articulation.
Once upon a time I had some S1 TNG figures. They were about GI Joe sized with only the shoulder, neck, hips and knees as points of articulation. And even then they were all one directional joints.

Man I loved those things. Got Riker, Geordi, and Worf IIRC. Of course the robot was always denied a Data.... 😥

(That’s OK though. I found a Skippy, the Jedi Droid at a shop the other day and now have him in a proper shrine for me to pray to daily.)
 
Tommy Guns should be standard issue.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=D8hTAuX-CGs
That always bugged me. No one, literally no one was after close encounters with the Borg thinking about using shotguns or machine guns against drones in the close quarter fights. "haha let us use phasers, the borg will adapt, but it's so advanced!!11"

Personally I'd use flamethrowers.
 
I am glad that there was at least one man in all of Starfleet that wants the same. Admiral Leyton did nothing wrong.
I know I said it earlier in this thread, but I like repeating this point, 24th century bad admirals are deemed bad because they had foresight. Good admirals are just bureaucrats in uniform and the reason why Kirk became a useless old man when he became one.

Maxwell: (technically not an admiral but he fits the trope) Claimed the Cardassians were preparing for another war. 3 years later, a proxy war between Federation and Cardassian colonists break out in the DMZ.
Pressman: Colluded with Starfleet Intelligence to get the phased cloaking device off of the Pegasus. Why? Because the Romulans have had cloaked ships for about a century at that point.
Leyton: Committed a false flag attack--which killed no one--to get Earth to seriously consider the threat of the Dominion 3 years before the war started. Also retrofitted the Excelsiors to still be useful on the battlefield.
Satie: (retired, but still evil Admiral) Afraid of Romulan sabotage and terrorism. Three episodes later, Geordi gets kidnapped and turned into a Romulan Sleeper Agent and nearly shot a Klingon Governor.
Hudson: Cleaning up the mess created by the Federation council by letting the Navajo stay where they are.

An unstated reason why the Feds kept losing in the Dominion War is because all their competent hawk Captains and Admirals were arrested years before SHTF. Thus, they're stuck with peacetime leadership for longer than they need.
 
Maxwell: (technically not an admiral but he fits the trope) Claimed the Cardassians were preparing for another war. 3 years later, a proxy war between Federation and Cardassian colonists break out in the DMZ.
The crew of Maxwell's ship also went along with it. That is interesting to note here, because you'd expect some kind of mutiny if Maxwell had been batshit insane or unreasonable.
Pressman: Colluded with Starfleet Intelligence to get the phased cloaking device off of the Pegasus. Why? Because the Romulans have had cloaked ships for about a century at that point.
The episode left me with many questions: why was no one in Starfleet Intelligence arrested over this? Why was only Pressman prosecuted? Who else was involved? And why was this cloak not used later during the Dominion War where it really could have made a strategic difference?
Leyton: Committed a false flag attack--which killed no one--to get Earth to seriously consider the threat of the Dominion 3 years before the war started. Also retrofitted the Excelsiors to still be useful on the battlefield.
I assumed Leyton had much more support within Starfleet than the episode led us to believe. You don't refit an active ship of the line, do a complete overhaul and crew it with people you can absolutely rely on without anyone taking notes. You need a dockyard and engineering personell for that, too. You need manufacturers, you need resources available to you that aren't really indicated by your paygrade. In my headcanon Leyton thought he had no time and simply preempted what very likely would have been a much larger coup with a much wider basis than what he ended up using. And even with what little he had, Leyton came really close, because NOBODY except the Defiant and Sisko gave a fuck. The normies on Earth were actually ready for a change for once...
Satie: (retired, but still evil Admiral) Afraid of Romulan sabotage and terrorism. Three episodes later, Geordi gets kidnapped and turned into a Romulan Sleeper Agent and nearly shot a Klingon Governor.
Also was proven right when the Romulans later tried to take over Vulcan. The "refugee ships" were vaporised and everyone forget how to ask questions ever again.
Hudson: Cleaning up the mess created by the Federation council by letting the Navajo stay where they are.
The Federation Council signed a treaty you'd expect is forced upon a defeated power, simply because they were afraid to committ and beat the enemy militarily, which would have been a quick, easy affair. But nope, can't have that because utopia and all that.
Thus, they're stuck with peacetime leadership for longer than they need.
They got what they fucking deserved. There was this interesting chat between the Admiral and Ruafo in Insurrection, which is also a direct consequence of the civilian administrators shitting and farting over the place, while castrating Starfleet enough so they can't do their secondary job, the shooting, effectively.
 
The episode left me with many questions: why was no one in Starfleet Intelligence arrested over this? Why was only Pressman prosecuted? Who else was involved? And why was this cloak not used later during the Dominion War where it really could have made a strategic difference?
At the risk of making the ACKSTULLY sound, the end of the episode does end with an off-hand line from Picard, the Chief of Starfleet Intelligence and other key members of the cover-up were indicted along with Pressman. Still Picard really fucked things up for Starfleet as a whole. Having a bunch of Admirals backing Pressman implies they knew the scope of the project and agreed with him. So, it probably didn't go further than the prototype phase and they couldn't build it to scale.
 
At the risk of making the ACKSTULLY sound, the end of the episode does end with an off-hand line from Picard, the Chief of Starfleet Intelligence and other key members of the cover-up were indicted along with Pressman. Still Picard really fucked things up for Starfleet as a whole. Having a bunch of Admirals backing Pressman implies they knew the scope of the project and agreed with him. So, it probably didn't go further than the prototype phase and they couldn't build it to scale.
That's also something to consider here: assuming Pressman and his backers get dragged through the court system of the Federation, some of the would make it out of there. And they very likely would want to derail Picard's career. If I was Pressman, I'd be super pissed, because that one project I am convinced of WILL be a fucking gamechanger was taken away by a snob tea drinking moralising holier-than-thou-faggot (who also has the tendency to cause untold amounts of trouble for the Federation). I'd rest my defence on the question of "where were you lot at Wolf 359?" and watch them devour themselves in court.

Man, the actual political fallout of a lot of these smaller contained stories would be so much fun if the consequences of all of that was baked more into the series over a longer time, something they did with Leyton in DS9.
 
The last time I remember seeing Trek toys (not just collector shit on a web storefront) is 2009 Trek movie merch in Big Lots, a few years after the film had aired. I bought a Spock, and on retrospect wish I still had it: it was scaled like GI Joes and had swappable hands and decent articulation.
The last time I was at a toy store a couple of weeks ago, I saw a TMNT action figure in a Spock shirt. I've also seen those Playmates figures in stores, and I remember seeing the Mega Bloks figures around 2018/2019. Speaking of JJ-era Trek toys, I got a whole bunch of the Kreo Star Trek stuff in 2013 -- I saw it at Walmart, Target, and Toys R Us. I have a ton from that line -- I have the Enterprise, the transporter, the shuttlecraft, a bunch of the microscale ships, and I think the Bird of Prey; I just never bothered getting the blind bag figures. Also in 2013 (I must have never seen these in stores because I found out about them years later) they had Star Trek "Fighter Pods", which are a bunch of tiny little collectible figures that you can put into small balls you can shoot out of launchers shaped like the big Star Trek spaceships. They also had Star Wars Fighter Pods at the same time, and I got a bunch of the Star Wars ones.
 
That's also something to consider here: assuming Pressman and his backers get dragged through the court system of the Federation, some of the would make it out of there. And they very likely would want to derail Picard's career.
The part that I find irritating is that this would have worked as a backstory for Adm. Sheer Fucking Hubris. That would have taken writers who actually gave a shit about Star Trek, though.
 
The part that I find irritating is that this would have worked as a backstory for Adm. Sheer Fucking Hubris. That would have taken writers who actually gave a shit about Star Trek, though.
Yeah, that would have been a quite intruiging conversation between Picard and Admiral Bitchface and there could have been some cool world building or development being had: the Federation finally got the wake up call during the Dominion War and they reinstated all the 'bad guys' Picard had brought down in his righteousness. And Admiral Bitchface explains to Picard in detail why and how that happened and why it was not only necessary, but a quest for survival. I mean, with the Cardassians, the Borg, the Dominion and a collection of smaller powers knocking on the door, you don't want to be caught with your pants down. It could have been constructed in such a way the audience might get this lingering feeling: wait a minute, was TNG a well crafted Federation-propaganda piece? Did they live in a comfy, fuzzy feeling bubble on the D while the galaxy was much more grey and the Feds knew it, too? Did they actually railroad the more enlightened types like Picard so they don't fuck with the more serious things (the fucking military aspect of Starfleet)?

Man, there is so much cool stuff they could have done with the internal politics of the Federation, telling us a great post-DW-plot from Picard's perspective that has its roots deep, BALLS DEEP, in TNG... That could have had great Space Opera™ potential. But nope. We got slop with three iterations of the Borg and time travel bullshit and some hamfisted, bruteforced social commentary because it's current year+X.
 
Yeah, that would have been a quite intruiging conversation between Picard and Admiral Bitchface and there could have been some cool world building or development being had: the Federation finally got the wake up call during the Dominion War and they reinstated all the 'bad guys' Picard had brought down in his righteousness. And Admiral Bitchface explains to Picard in detail why and how that happened and why it was not only necessary, but a quest for survival. I mean, with the Cardassians, the Borg, the Dominion and a collection of smaller powers knocking on the door, you don't want to be caught with your pants down. It could have been constructed in such a way the audience might get this lingering feeling: wait a minute, was TNG a well crafted Federation-propaganda piece? Did they live in a comfy, fuzzy feeling bubble on the D while the galaxy was much more grey and the Feds knew it, too? Did they actually railroad the more enlightened types like Picard so they don't fuck with the more serious things (the fucking military aspect of Starfleet)?

Man, there is so much cool stuff they could have done with the internal politics of the Federation, telling us a great post-DW-plot from Picard's perspective that has its roots deep, BALLS DEEP, in TNG... That could have had great Space Opera™ potential. But nope. We got slop with three iterations of the Borg and time travel bullshit and some hamfisted, bruteforced social commentary because it's current year+X.
I mean, the Bajoran refugee leader told Picard, "Your world is politics. My world is blankets" or something like that and guilt-trips him into giving blankets. The Maquis really were the Rebel Alliance analogy in these shows and the Feds--while technically not the Evil Empire (that would be the Dominion)--were definitely not all that helpful.
 
In the 4th season TNG episode Who Watches the Watchers, Picard seemed to admire how the Mintakans abandoned belief in supernatural.

"Millennia ago, they abandoned their belief in the supernatural. Now you are asking me to sabotage that achievement, to send them back into the Dark Ages of superstition and ignorance and fear? No!"

And yet it was stated in the 1st season TNG episode Where No One Has Gone Before that "thought is the basis of all reality", there is the use of "psionics" throughout the different series, there's that one TAS episode with straight up "magic" if that counts, and there's the Q with the Q powers who wouldn't be too out of place in mythology.

tl;dr: There's clearly "the supernatural" in Star Trek setting, despite TNG seemingly trying to be more materialist or naturalist.

(doublepost because can't edit previous post anymore)
 
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There's clearly "the supernatural" in Star Trek setting, despite TNG seemingly trying to be more materialist or naturalist.
There's also that immortal alien who made an entire species go extinct for killing his wife and was capable of creating super powerful battleships and habitable spots on barren planets. You can rationalize most of the supernatural aliens as highly-evolved lifeforms.
And yet it was stated in the 1st season TNG episode Where No One Has Gone Before that "thought is the basis of all reality",
That's also something that we will only understand when we're more highly-evolved. My headcanon is that that place they went to the nexus of all universes, and since there are as many universes as there are possibilities, you'll be able to momentarily phase into the universe you want just by thinking of that reality.
 
You can rationalize most of the supernatural aliens as highly-evolved lifeforms.
There's no realistic way I can see for there to be "psionic" powers and "energy beings of pure thought" -- like the Organians or the Q -- within physics (not even quantum), leaving such to "magic" which defies physics. And if physics in Star Trek setting can allow such, they're indistinguishable from straight up "magic" to "ordinary beings" in "normal" spacetime then. Like a Q making something appear with a flash using some unknown physics would look a lot like physics-defying "magic" which conjures something up.

Also, unlike "sufficiently advanced technology that's indistinguishable from magic", "psionic" powers and "energy beings of pure thought" do not rely on technologies to be.
 
I know I said it earlier in this thread, but I like repeating this point, 24th century bad admirals are deemed bad because they had foresight. Good admirals are just bureaucrats in uniform and the reason why Kirk became a useless old man when he became one.

Maxwell: (technically not an admiral but he fits the trope) Claimed the Cardassians were preparing for another war. 3 years later, a proxy war between Federation and Cardassian colonists break out in the DMZ.
Pressman: Colluded with Starfleet Intelligence to get the phased cloaking device off of the Pegasus. Why? Because the Romulans have had cloaked ships for about a century at that point.
Leyton: Committed a false flag attack--which killed no one--to get Earth to seriously consider the threat of the Dominion 3 years before the war started. Also retrofitted the Excelsiors to still be useful on the battlefield.
Satie: (retired, but still evil Admiral) Afraid of Romulan sabotage and terrorism. Three episodes later, Geordi gets kidnapped and turned into a Romulan Sleeper Agent and nearly shot a Klingon Governor.
Hudson: Cleaning up the mess created by the Federation council by letting the Navajo stay where they are.

An unstated reason why the Feds kept losing in the Dominion War is because all their competent hawk Captains and Admirals were arrested years before SHTF. Thus, they're stuck with peacetime leadership for longer than they need.
Don't forget Admiral Nechayev (or however its spelled) who orders Picard to use the math problem that will destroy the Borg, an unstoppable enemy, and Picard simply ignores the order because it Hugh is basically an enemy private and its unfair to inflict such suffering on the unwilling and he's an individual and blahblahblah. Does he get relieved? Nope. Everyone acts like nothing happened. Then a few years later the Borg attack Earth again, they kill a bunch more Starfleet crews, and here we are.

Starfleet should have made Picard go to each and every dead crewman's house and tell his family "yeah, I could have stopped this years ago and saved the Federation all this pain and effort, but I needed to moralize more."
 
There's no realistic way I can see for there to be "psionic" powers and "energy beings of pure thought" -- like the Organians or the Q -- within physics (not even quantum), leaving such to "magic" which defies physics. And if physics in Star Trek setting can allow such, they're indistinguishable from straight up "magic" to "ordinary beings" in "normal" spacetime then. Like a Q making something appear with a flash using some unknown physics would look a lot like physics-defying "magic" which conjures something up.

Also, unlike "sufficiently advanced technology that's indistinguishable from magic", "psionic" powers and "energy beings of pure thought" do not rely on technologies to be.
I'm not a psysicist, and to be honest, these things make my head hurt if I think about it too long, but it could be something like this.
Q and the other "God" beings live in another dimension from ours. What we precieve as "magic" is just another level of the universe that we can't see because we're not on it.

As for the "on a certain level, magic and technology are indistinguishable" bit. (Which is my second thought) We all know what a cel phone is, but if you brought one back to the middle ages and used it to play a movie for a peasant, they would not be able to wrap their brain around what they were looking at. They would not even understand the concept of a movie, let alone a recording. They might think you were casting a magic spell to show some far off other plane of reality.

Perhaps whatever technology that gives those powers is so far outside our realm of understanding, like the phone would be to the peasant. That's we say it looks like magic.

But I admittedly don't know what the hell I'm talking about.
 
it could be something like this
More physical dimensions alone still could not explain stuff like being made of pure thought, though. As for the mobile phone example, that is still using a physical object to do stuff. But maybe in Star Trek setting, there could be some kind of tech that can be used to manipulate spacetime remotely, sort of like what Trelane was using in TOS?

In any case, there is still the presence of ESP that can be used in Star Trek setting -- unaided by technology -- by ordinary humans, mentioned in the TOS episode Where No Man Has Gone Before. So even if Q powers can be explained by physics, there is still straight up "magic" in Star Trek setting -- despite that materialist tone seen in TNG.

(Doesn't DS9 have a more religious tone to it?)
 
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