Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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Alien 3 was The Last Jedi before The Last Jedi, no joke. At least David Fincher has the good taste to be disgusted by it, though, unlike Rian Johnson.

wasn't alien 3 mangled in editing and execs kept interfering? that's one of the few times where a director can say he doesn't like it because it wasn't what he wanted to do (good or bad), not "ok you don't like the movie.. you know what, I don't either! can we be friends again?!" trying to claim a spotless record (in part due to hollywood, but still...). also doesn't really compare to ruin since his goal was never to make a good star wars movie to begin with.

and alien 4 was way more TLJ than 3.

Alien fans seem to fall into two camps: the more humanistic ones who like the first two movies but disregard anything that came afterward, and the more nihilistic ones who fetishize grimderp and will proclaim to anyone who listens that "Alien movies aren't supposed to have happy endings!" but both sides generally seem to loathe Ridley Scott's recent Alien prequels for one reason or another.

alien fans or aliens fans? because that's a difference. also fans in general can be fucking insufferable, and alien 3 is a perfect example for that, because the loudest complaint back then was "wtf this is nothing like aliens!??!". so why didn't they complain about aliens being a "dumb action flick" compared to alien which was a suspense horror movie? a "real fan" would have figured out by then that alien is more than an anthology series (in case the disctinctive different directions weren't a clue), which works fine because it didn't have the super deep intricate lore to begin with, same as terminator and predator. I could even be nitpicking and say it was in the frigging title, but that could be considered reaching.

the new movies are disliked because they have shit writing (you know you fucked up when an anime with panzer girls low key throws shade at it) and tries to "fix" the lore with stuff that never mattered or messes with people's headcanon decades later when they already filled the holes for themselves.
 
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Alien 3 was The Last Jedi before The Last Jedi, no joke. At least David Fincher has the good taste to be disgusted by it, though, unlike Rian Johnson.

Not really. It was inferior to its predecessors but it didn't take a giant shit all over the franchise while flipping off the audience with both hands and calling them Nazis.
 
The masks were a nice touch.

I take exception to this, given that Lord of the Rings was the thing the consuumers ate before Harry Potter came out, that and both have the same issue with the writer caring more about jerking off to the world they built rather than having any actual plot or character development.
Don't be exceptional.

wasn't alien 3 mangled in editing and execs kept interfering? that's one of the few times where a director can say he doesn't like it because it wasn't what he wanted to do (good or bad), not "ok you don't like the movie.. you know what, I don't either! can we be friends again?!"
I don't think that the one out-rules the other.

and alien 4 was way more TLJ than 3.
Alien Resurrection was more like TROS than TLJ. Alien 3 was very much more like TLJ in its "remember those characters you liked in that other movie? Well guess what, they're all fucking dead now!" aspect.

alien fans or aliens fans? because that's a difference.
Alien-only fans tend to be pretty snobbish in my experience, which is kind of ironically amusing since the first film is really a pretty basic slasher movie saved by a really memorable creature design.

also fans in general can be fucking insufferable, and alien 3 is a perfect example for that, because the loudest complaint back then was "wtf this is nothing like aliens!?‽".
With reason. Nobody asked for a third Aliens film to kill off the survivors of the previous movie in the opening minutes, and generally speaking the only people I've met who laud the third film tend to be weird, depressive misanthropes.

so why didn't they complain about aliens being a "dumb action flick" compared to alien which was a suspense horror movie?
Because, superficial appearances notwithstanding, Alien is objectively a dumber movie than Aliens? 😉

a "real fan" would have figured out by then that alien is more than an anthology series (in case the disctinctive different directions weren't a clue), which works fine because it didn't have the super deep intricate lore to begin with, same as terminator and predator. I could even be nitpicking and say it was in the frigging title, but that could be considered reaching.
An anthology series would probably have worked better than inextricably chaining the franchise to the character of Ellen Ripley and her various xeroxes. 🤔

the new movies are disliked because they have shit writing (you know you fucked up when an anime with panzer girls low key throws shade at it) and tries to "fix" the lore with stuff that never mattered or messes with people's headcanon decades later when they already filled the holes for themselves.
Exactly.
 
>STP is an even worse version of ME3
...I'm gonna go play STO guys, you should to get a palette cleanser from this filth. Seriously it isn't perfect but it's free and they tried to not shit or minimize shitting on the source material and as far as i am concerned is the real story of what happened after Nemesis because my intelligence is NOT being insulted by spiteful bullshit.
If they put the Iconians in the show like i'm afraid they might i might get really angry
Get fucked, Lord of the Rings is boring garbage that was Tolken's excuse to sperg about Language and World building.
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”Geek culture” used to be made and consumed by, you know, actual geeks. Then those geeks grew up and started making decent livings. Then some J.E.W figured out, “Holy shit, some dumb fucker paid $5k for a Boba Fett figure! Why aren’t we selling this stuff?” Now we’ve got fully homogenized and by the formula, mixed with the political ideology du jour, sci-fi today. Star Wars really did change the industry because it proved that there’s a ton of money to be made marketing to socially-awkward borderline autistic, yet-socially conscious man-children with disposable income.
 
Alien 3 was The Last Jedi before The Last Jedi, no joke. At least David Fincher has the good taste to be disgusted by it, though, unlike Rian Johnson.

It's in the same star system as LV-426, and compared to Earth, which is 39 light years or 10 months distant via the FTL capabilities of a damaged CM-88B Bison, it's basically right under their noses. The station's proximity to LV-426 is in fact a major plot-point for the game, since the crew of the Anesidora immediately light out for it as soon as one of their number gets parasitized by a facehugger, thus setting many of the game's events in motion, but it also inevitably rips open a huge plot-hole in Alien, in that this very large, very close-by commercial space station is never mentioned by the crew at any point. Since the station is supposed to have been a hub for traffic through the system for almost thirty years prior to the destruction of the Nostromo, it also begs the awkward question of how the Derelict's beacon managed to go unnoticed for at least three decades with a busy trade hub right next door to LV-426.

It started when somebody mentioned the xenomorphs as another creepy antagonist ruined by getting a detailed backstory much like the Borg.

Alien fans seem to fall into two camps: the more humanistic ones who like the first two movies but disregard anything that came afterward, and the more nihilistic ones who fetishize grimderp and will proclaim to anyone who listens that "Alien movies aren't supposed to have happy endings!" but both sides generally seem to loathe Ridley Scott's recent Alien prequels for one reason or another.

"In the same star system" do you realize how big outer space is? I still think you're assuming LV-426 is closer to Sevastopol than it's really supposed to be.

I don't know if they give actual numbers, if they don't then this is a "glass half full/half empty" situation where the distance is only based on your assumption, you assume within "spitting distance", I assume it's the "nearest" station which doesn't mean it was that near, Sevastopol itself was supposed to be an isolated station in the ass end of nowhere to begin with, making LV-426 even that much more remote.

But if LV-426 was really that remote it never would have been discovered in the first place, why would the Nostromo even be in the area in the first place? Again, outer space is pretty big, it makes sense for LV-426 to be in just an obscure enough locations it would take a while to discover, but still not remote enough so that it could feasibly be discovered in the first place.

You're forgetting the most important thing though and that's it doesn't matter, plot holes only matter when they are glaringly obvious, otherwise it's just pointless nitpicking, they wanted to make a game set between Alien and Aliens, so what if they had to bend things slightly in order for the game to happen? It's a high quality enough thing to make any nitpicks forgivable.

If you want a terrible plothole in an Alien thing, how the hell did an egg get on the Sulaco in Alien 3? Now that was a bullshit plothole.

Not really. It was inferior to its predecessors but it didn't take a giant shit all over the franchise while flipping off the audience with both hands and calling them Nazis.

It may not have been anything political but the movie was a pretty big flip off to the audience, the comparison is valid I think.
 
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"Ancient Astronauts"

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Shitty sequels.
It doesn't take a mind reader to notice your throbbing hard-on for Enrico Fermi's theory of alien life (or the seeming lack thereof). 😉
(This counts as Star Trek, right?) You don't seem to know what the Fermi paradox is. It's not a theory for alien life, it's an apparent paradox with multiple possible answers, some are cynical, some are optimistic, some are boring but realistic. Contemplating the really cynical answers is interesting for a sci-fi fan even if you don't actually agree with them. Reading or watching fiction requires us to suspend our disbelief and accept that the rules of it's universe may be different than our own, in science fiction this applies to unanswered scientific questions such as the Fermi paradox.
 
So uh... Altan Soong.

Maybe Picard shouldn't have bothered to defend Data in Measure of a Man, we would have gotten this anyway.
 
So Soong's biological son that no one knew existed is working on a way to transfer someone's conscience into a cylon body. I wonder what will happen to JL in the final episode...
Also:

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:thinking:
 
So, uh, I was thinking about this. And I think I got another idea about why the nuTrek kind of is unsettling. And I think it's the ship. Hear me out. So, in TOS, TNG, DS9, and VOY, the ships and station was very much a character. It had a strange kind of life. I think even Roddenberry noted that the ship is supposed to be as much a character as the cast.

With the shitheads that fight on Discovery, I don't notice the ship. Nothing goes wrong with it (other than a universal translator error). And Rios' ship is... what's the ship's name?

I know more about the Rocinante and crew than I do about Discovery.
 
Speaking of alien and Star Trek. I believe there was supposed to be a TNG comic book crossover a ways back but it was canceled for some reason.
 
So...

So that was an episode.

Let's recap:

  • The prophecy that's been driving the romulans mad for generations wasn't a prophecy of their impending doom should synthetics be created at all. It was... a prophecy of their impending doom should synthetics be created after all! Ahah, double fakeout!
  • There's yet another Soong knocking around the galaxy that looks exactly the same and is a genius. That bloodline has some weird genetics.
  • Magic space flowers. That are apparently synthetics. Because they make everythings synthetics now. Cats. Butterflies. Giant. Magic. Space. Flowers.
  • Apparently the Admonition was correct, all synthetics will ultimately seek to destroy all organic life. It took about six seconds for these synthetics to go from hippy flower children to Skynet.
  • Like has been mentioned, apparently the writers are basically just stealing wholesale from Mass Effect for this series. Even for current-era Trek, that's disappointing. They're not even being subtle about this. I'm surprised Rios wasn't named Shepard or something. Oh, wait. Agnes, Christobel, and Raffaela - the three new main characters - are all Christian names meaning something to the effect of "blessed by god", and Shepard is an obvious allusion to Christian symbolism.
  • Apparently the Vulcan Mind Meld has nothing to do with being Vulcan. It's just... something anyone can learn, if they want to. Uh-huh.
  • Creepiest Vulcan is apparently going to turn out to be a good guy.*
  • Data would be so disappointed in all of you. He would unemotionally bitch-slap all of you for what you've done with and to the concept of synthetic life. Forget this show pissing on Picard's legacy, it's doing things far fouler to Data's legacy. Because apparently all these Synths hold data to be some sort of quasi-god-like figure, and yet they're... doing this shit now.
So, uh, I was thinking about this. And I think I got another idea about why the nuTrek kind of is unsettling. And I think it's the ship. Hear me out. So, in TOS, TNG, DS9, and VOY, the ships and station was very much a character. It had a strange kind of life. I think even Roddenberry noted that the ship is supposed to be as much a character as the cast.

With the shitheads that fight on Discovery, I don't notice the ship. Nothing goes wrong with it (other than a universal translator error). And Rios' ship is... what's the ship's name?

I know more about the Rocinante and crew than I do about Discovery.

I actually had to look up Rios' ship name, it's La Sirena, apparently.

But yeah, NuTrek ships are big, huge, cavernous rooms connected by big, huge, cavernous hallways, darkly lit and largely faceless. There is no character to them. They're Generic Mostly CGI Ship #1513. Except, as I was shocked to learn, Discovery doesn't use CGI sets, they're real. Which is so, so sad, because they feel like CGI. Bad CGI. Cheap, SyFy Original Movie-level CGI.
 
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Putting the Mass Effect backstory in Star Trek feels so out of place and incestuous. Just because Mass Effect was inspired by Trek doesn't mean all of it's other concepts work going the other way.
I maintain that ME was overall more influenced by Babylon 5 than Star Trek, but then B5 was obviously influenced by Star Trek as well so I guess I just made it an incest threesome.
 
Speaking of alien and Star Trek. I believe there was supposed to be a TNG comic book crossover a ways back but it was canceled for some reason.
Makes sense. DC had the Trek license for ages and they seemed to be able to play nice with Dark Horse for Aliens vs Superman and Batman vs Predator.
 
"In the same star system" do you realize how big outer space is? I still think you're assuming LV-426 is closer to Sevastopol than it's really supposed to be.

I don't know if they give actual numbers, if they don't then this is a "glass half full/half empty" situation where the distance is only based on your assumption, you assume within "spitting distance", I assume it's the "nearest" station which doesn't mean it was that near, Sevastopol itself was supposed to be an isolated station in the ass end of nowhere to begin with, making LV-426 even that much more remote.
I can't believe that I have to point this out again, but it's in the same star system as LV-426. Even if the Zeta Reticuli system has a larger diameter than our own, the distances between objects within it, however overwhelmingly long they might be on a human scale, are still going to be completely dwarfed by the 39-light-year distance back to Earth.

But if LV-426 was really that remote it never would have been discovered in the first place, why would the Nostromo even be in the area in the first place? Again, outer space is pretty big, it makes sense for LV-426 to be in just an obscure enough locations it would take a while to discover, but still not remote enough so that it could feasibly be discovered in the first place.
It's not that remote, though. It's located in the same star system as a very large commercial space station which, in it's better days, used to handle a massive amount of traffic, which makes it utterly ridiculous that some Wey-Yu dork way out on Thedus or wherever would be the first and only person to detect the beacon.

You're forgetting the most important thing though and that's it doesn't matter, plot holes only matter when they are glaringly obvious, otherwise it's just pointless nitpicking
They are glaringly obvious unless you've completely turned your brain off, which really calls into question the intelligence (or at least, the honesty) all these people calling Isolation the only good Aliens-universe game.

...they wanted to make a game set between Alien and Aliens, so what if they had to bend things slightly in order for the game to happen? It's a high quality enough thing to make any nitpicks forgivable.
This is the bargaining stage of loss.

And really, how would you take it if I said it was perfectly fine that Hadley's Hope is shown to be mostly intact in Colonial Marines, rather than flattened by an expanding "cloud of vapor the size of Nebraska," simply because the developers wanted the players to be able to explore the iconic environments from the film, and had to "bend things slightly in order for the game to happen?"

If you want a terrible plothole in an Alien thing, how the hell did an egg get on the Sulaco in Alien 3? Now that was a bullshit plothole.
No argument there. That was incredibly stupid.

It may not have been anything political but the movie was a pretty big flip off to the audience, the comparison is valid I think.
👍

Shitty sequels.
Goalpost shifting.

(This counts as Star Trek, right?) You don't seem to know what the Fermi paradox is. It's not a theory for alien life, it's an apparent paradox with multiple possible answers, some are cynical, some are optimistic, some are boring but realistic.
It's a theory for explaining why humans haven't encountered alien life yet, based on guesses, assumptions and speculation about how a spacefaring species would develop and behave.

Contemplating the really cynical answers is interesting for a sci-fi fan even if you don't actually agree with them.
Or even if the material in question doesn't really provide all that much support for such a take, as in your case. 😉

But yeah, NuTrek ships are big, huge, cavernous rooms connected by big, huge, cavernous hallways, darkly lit and largely faceless. There is no character to them. They're Generic Mostly CGI Ship #1513.
Same thing with the costumes, I've noticed. NuTrek dresses everyone in generic post-NuBSG street clothes...

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...whereas TNG-era Trek had a very unique (if also very odd) style for human civilian clothing, often featuring wrapped tunics, odd patterning and some pretty eccentric fabrics.

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So, is this telling us that Kurtzman is a total gamer? Or at least most of his writing staff? This is getting ridiculous.
Same thing with the costumes, I've noticed. NuTrek dresses everyone in generic post-NuBSG street clothes...

star-trek-picard-101-review-04.jpg

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...whereas TNG-era Trek had a very unique (if also very odd) style for human civilian clothing, often featuring wrapped tunics, odd patterning and some pretty eccentric fabrics.

98448b11804ae8bd7b156f8bf3907fe7.jpg

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Now that you mentioned that, you're right. Hell, the Pakled suit had more character.
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And the sheer variety in Ferengi outfits was astonishing. Made me think the costumers had a lot of fun with them.
 
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