Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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Flexo said:
Like given their long age, superior strength, devotion to logic, and clearly superior mental capacity - not to mention mind powers - it becomes a real question of how any human could ever outrank a Vulcan and why every spaceship isn't being captained by a Vulcan. Or why wasn't Data running the Enterprise considering his merits? If Betazeds can read minds, why isn't every ship given one at the comm (or in first officer) to provide superior coordination and intel on enemies?
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A few people kind of got to this already, but all of the races (and Data) you mentioned may have superior aspects to the human race, but those aspects always come with some kind of tremendous disadvantage.

Vulcans are extremely strong and logical, until their murderous desire to fuck something kicks in. On top of that, they're so devoted to logic that in one episode a whole ship with a Vulcan crew is lost because they just couldn't accept that something was draining their energy. Data was very capable and intelligent, but he lacked the creativity a human (or alien) captain could bring to the table. so while he was swift, effecient and took his duties seriously, at the end of the day he lacked the mental growth to really take command in the long term. Though also Starfleet might be a little touchy about letting a robot run a starship ever since that whole M5 thing. Betazeds are empaths/telepaths, but more than once that causes tons of problems for Troi and especially in the episode Tin Man we see a Betazoid who is a total anitsocial nervous wreck because he just can't turn his telepathic abilities off.

If anything the message is that humans make up for their shortcomings by not having any tremendous drawbacks compared to the other races and forms of life we see. In a weird way humans are "superior" in this setting just because they can strike a middle ground that gives all of these diametrically opposed races a neutral ground to negotiate and cooperate.
 
L50LasPak said:
A few people kind of got to this already, but all of the races (and Data) you mentioned may have superior aspects to the human race, but those aspects always come with some kind of tremendous disadvantage.

Vulcans are extremely strong and logical, until their murderous desire to fuck something kicks in. On top of that, they're so devoted to logic that in one episode a whole ship with a Vulcan crew is lost because they just couldn't accept that something was draining their energy. Data was very capable and intelligent, but he lacked the creativity a human (or alien) captain could bring to the table. so while he was swift, effecient and took his duties seriously, at the end of the day he lacked the mental growth to really take command in the long term. Though also Starfleet might be a little touchy about letting a robot run a starship ever since that whole M5 thing. Betazeds are empaths/telepaths, but more than once that causes tons of problems for Troi and especially in the episode Tin Man we see a Betazoid who is a total anitsocial nervous wreck because he just can't turn his telepathic abilities off.

If anything the message is that humans make up for their shortcomings by not having any tremendous drawbacks compared to the other races and forms of life we see. In a weird way humans are "superior" in this setting just because they can strike a middle ground that gives all of these diametrically opposed races a neutral ground to negotiate and cooperate.
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In real life there would be disadvantages, yes. Like SFDebris pointed out, given everything the show ever said about Vulcans, they would have a daily calorie requirement so high, a KFC double down for them would be the equivalent of a grape to us. Klingons probably the same with redundant organs. But of course the writers never examine this. Alas I shouldn't expect any better from something written by meatbags.

Which gets hilarious if you then imagine a Vulcan captain always having to snack while on the bridge. Heck the Orville would probably do that with a stocked cooler by the captain's chair.
 
GentlemanFaggot said:
Midnight Edge is honestly pretty desperate to argue all Star Trek shows as dying and about to be liquidated. His inside sources rarely amount to much.

Nu-Trek is shit but people are (Vacantly, most likely) watching them.
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Besides, they don’t consider the revenue the older shows like TNG pull in for ViacomCBS. The best they should do is put the franchise on ice for five-seven years and then do a hard reboot.

ViacomCBS also just completed their merger a few months back and they are getting hit hard do to having unnecessary redundancies in their company during this pandemic. Once it ends, they’ll cut back the redundancies and then figure out what to do with the people running Star Trek.
 
melty said:
For season 2 of Picard, what are some things Jay knows about that they haven't done in nuTrek yet? Q? Picard facepalming? Worf getting told no over and over? Is that enough content for a full season?
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He probably knows about Captain Kirk and Spock. They can have nuSpock travel forward in time for a Discovery crossover and kill Kirk again in an embarrassing manner.
 
GentlemanFaggot said:
Nu-Trek is shit but people are (Vacantly, most likely) watching them.
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I don't know, CBS still refuses to talk about the actual numbers.

melty said:
For season 2 of Picard, what are some things Jay knows about that they haven't done in nuTrek yet? Q? Picard facepalming? Worf getting told no over and over? Is that enough content for a full season?
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First Contact.
 
Miller said:
I don't know, CBS still refuses to talk about the actual numbers.
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As sketchy as that is, this is common for streaming platforms. This has been Netflix's standard operation for the vast majority of their Netflix Original's existence and we can't deny that, quality aside, lots of people watch them.

I wouldn't say any ST series CBS All Access has shown has reached House of Cards or Stranger Things at their peaks, but I anecdotally know a lot of casual ST fans (Usually got in through the movies) who watch the new shows (And generally have very little to say about them other then, "It's awesome!" especially when pressed about what is good about them) that I think there's enough viewership to push aside that notion that no one is watching.
 
Oaat said:
It's uncharted territory, they can start making things up now ripping off Mass Effect Andromeda.
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I would say if youre going to rip off Mass Effect at least rip off the good games games but from the sound of it they ripped of the organic v synthetic subplot of the series and made it stupid and gay... We should at least be thankful that they didn't ripoff the space brat (This is the only time I'll ever bring up that abomination as I refuse to aknowledge its existence)
 
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Guts Gets Some said:
Maybe someday, but I'd rather not stop the Orville just to attempt to try to salvage Trek right now. That'd be a huge undertaking, whether they're the right person or not.
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I'm not wholly convinced Macfarlane is the best fit for Star Trek either. I'm in the minority that doesn't think of TNG as the quintessential Star Trek, and The Orville clearly has its own distinct style and universe that I think is overall separate from the style and universe of any Trek show. If Macfarlane did take over Star Trek, he'd have to take it in a completely different direction. He could deliver on Discovery's promise of a grittier Star Trek set during TOS/pre-TOS (I wouldn't be surprised if Macfarlane would faithfully recreate the aesthetics of TOS too). Alternatively, maybe he might go for something set on a science vessel and turn it into a semi-educational show, possibly with cooperation from Neil deGrasse Tyson. I know there's been discussion for decades now about using Star Trek as an educational format by keeping the technobabble light but its never materialized because there wouldn't be enough ships firing torpedoes at each other.
 
L50LasPak said:
I'm not wholly convinced Macfarlane is the best fit for Star Trek either. I'm in the minority that doesn't think of TNG as the quintessential Star Trek, and The Orville clearly has its own distinct style and universe that I think is overall separate from the style and universe of any Trek show. If Macfarlane did take over Star Trek, he'd have to take it in a completely different direction. He could deliver on Discovery's promise of a grittier Star Trek set during TOS/pre-TOS (I wouldn't be surprised if Macfarlane would faithfully recreate the aesthetics of TOS too). Alternatively, maybe he might go for something set on a science vessel and turn it into a semi-educational show, possibly with cooperation from Neil deGrasse Tyson. I know there's been discussion for decades now about using Star Trek as an educational format by keeping the technobabble light but its never materialized because there wouldn't be enough ships firing torpedoes at each other.
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MacFarlane is tied to comedy; it's what he's always done. The Orville is HIS Trek, through and through. I don't think he could handle being 99.9% as serious as vanilla Trek has always required, with no tongue in cheek humor at all.

I agree, there are lots of other people who are just as passionate, but might be better picks. Let the Orville co-exist and become its own thing. Nothing wrong with that. We as Trek fans could love both.
 
Guts Gets Some said:
MacFarlane is tied to comedy; it's what he's always done. The Orville is HIS Trek, through and through. I don't think he could handle being 99.9% as serious as vanilla Trek has always required, with no tongue in cheek humor at all.

I agree, there are lots of other people who are just as passionate, but might be better picks. Let the Orville co-exist and become its own thing. Nothing wrong with that. We as Trek fans, could love both.
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Besides, people like Midnight’s Edge don’t understand that ViacomCBS doesn’t need to rely solely on Star Trek all the time. They got Paramount’s film library they could just decide to use next should they give Star Trek some hiatuses.
 
Godzilla@1989 said:
Besides, people like Midnight’s Edge don’t understand that ViacomCBS doesn’t need to rely solely on Star Trek all the time. They got Paramount’s film library they could just decide to use next should they give Star Trek some hiatuses.
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They've never needed or cared about it. That's why it's at where it is now.

And in all honesty, it needs another hiatus for awhile again, before any sort of revival; the right kind or not.
 
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