Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

[Miller]

didn't he drop out of hollywood to raise his kids?

Indeed. I believe he owns a farm or a ranch.

 

[Scale Smerch]

It's funny seeing all these dead on arrival announcements come the same time Revenge of the Sith is set to air again in theatres for the 20th anniversary premiere. Probably the first time in a long while I at least have been eager to watch (well, re-watch) a movie in theatres, and not because it's a particularly good movie. Going to laugh hard if it draws higher audience numbers than some of the recent Disney releases.

It’s also going to get 90% sale two years after release.

Quite optimistic. It's bargain bin within six months.

 

[Gondolindrim]

I was curious as to why Visions season 2 was a bunch of a one offs and not building on any of the actually good shorts they had before


It appears that making sequels was a "Break Glass In Case of Emergency" option for Disney. Making more shorts and shooting them off generated zero interest so now they feel forced to make followups. This is just another example of Lucasfilm being stupid, why in God's name did they think people wouldn't want more actual story stuff to start with?

 

[draggs]

didn't he drop out of hollywood to raise his kids? might be a money thing but I assume he rather liked the role and just wants to do something for the fans.

He made enough money off aotc and rots, and he didn't ruin his life with drugs and spending money like a drunken sailor

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Dave again trying to hint that he wants to bring Plo Koon back from the dead I see. Wouldn't be shocked if he asked the game studio that one of the characters seen in the thumbnail was a Kel Dor just so he can desperately wear Koon's flesh and throw him into the fucking dirt to reuse him until forcibly stopped.

Lucas trolling the shit out of Favreau for wanting Plo Koon back was hilarious as fuck. But now that Lucas is gone, Plo can easily come back in more than a few ways:

1) Force shield: Plo used the Force to shield himself when his fighter blew up, and he hid himself in the darker parts of the galaxy, just like Yoda on Dagobah, until he's discovered by Luke, Ezra, or someone else, who brings him back to the fold.

2) Stasis: Plo survives the fighter crash, but then is badly injured; a sympathetic group of people put him in stasis inside a bacta tank, and the healing process would take decades to heal him. Eventually, those decades come and go, and Plo wakes up in the modern, New Republic-era galaxy, ready to help Luke and the others.

3) Time Travel Ass-pull No Jutsu: The most likely way Filoni will save Plo Koon. Ahsoka finds a portal to the World Between Worlds in Peridea, and she sees Plo about to die when his fighter explodes. She "kidnaps" him through the time portal before the flames of his fighter exploding engulf him. Plo then tags along with Sabine and Ahsoka to use the portals and find a way home, and they end up back in Lothal, just in time for Thrawn to start another war.

 

[Gondolindrim]

I can't help but notice that all the Star Wars shill accounts just activated overnight

 

[Michael Wade]

New Star Wars game announcement. For anyone that's still interested (not me).

I actually am. Respawn have been the only consistently good developers of the brand and they usually stay away from sequel shit outside the superficial cross saber or disney alien. XCOM star wars sounds cool and im curious to see how they work them into the lore.

They are quite literally the only ones doing anything worth a dam with license outside of Kingdom hearts eventually getting Vader in.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

I can't help but notice that all the Star Wars shill accounts just activated overnight

It's the same thing with Gamergate and Goonergate.

When Gamergate happened, all the shill game journalists activated and started saying that "gamers are dead".

When Goonergate happened, all the far-right shills started attacking what was at best, mild fanservice from some random Korean game, using language clothed in religion to bash gooners.

Now that Disney's trying for another push on the SW front, it's obvious that a good number of influences got paid in advance and we're told to hype up something coming, like the new cartoon shows or the new season of Andor.

 

[Adamska]

But now that Lucas is gone, Plo can easily come back in more than a few ways:

The options are so fucking terrible and nails how awful the company is that I have to rate your post as dislike because this is completely plausible. That's the state of the IP.

The wolf time asshole is the worst thing Dave ever wrote, and he's had 15 years, three shows, and cohosted another set to make a list to pick from. If I had to pick my top three, it would be making the Jedi realize the Clone Army was a Sith plot and did nothing to countermand it. Then I'd probably either go with Maul Speedrun any% all the crime in the Galaxy, which is lame and shittily done and ignores Zann and the Black Suns, or his attempts to make magic seperate from the force given Talsin openly admits she's not a force sensitive as she voodoo dolls Count Dooku the Dumb Fucking Retard who Can't Count.

Either that or Thrawn, who thinks getting anally raped, all ribs broken, and left for dead as his enemies by all mean win is victory, loses to farting space whales and came back due to stupidity. Goddamn there's a lot of nonideas this cowboy hat wearing DSP Deepfake does that are horrible.

I mean if I could count outside setting decisions, it's pissing away episodes on garbage and not being smart enough to develop more than one character. Hell, it refused to do any of that but the bare legal minimum to technically make it canon.

Now that Disney's trying for another push on the SW front, it's obvious that a good number of influences got paid in advance and we're told to hype up something coming, like the new cartoon shows or the new season of Andor.

A reminder that Craigslist whores often demand more money for even normal sex than Journoscum to sell their dignity. And bots are like a buck per a few thousand.

It's actually fitting how Trade Federationesque Didney is.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

The options are so fucking terrible and nails how awful the company is that I have to rate your post as dislike because this is completely plausible. That's the state of the IP.

That is exactly my point. Lucas is gone. Any control he had over Filoni is no more. Hell, the crew of the Mandalorian did think Plo was coming back before being hit with the Luke Skywalker special at the end of Mando Season 2. The fact that they were expecting Plo Koon to come back goes to show that if he did come back, nobody over at Lucasfilm would question it, even though Lucas specifically didn't want that to happen.

The wolf time asshole is the worst thing Dave ever wrote, and he's had 15 years, three shows, and cohosted another set to make a list to pick from. If I had to pick my top three, it would be making the Jedi realize the Clone Army was a Sith plot and did nothing to countermand it.

What should've happened is that the Jedi DIDN'T discover that the Clone Army was a Sith plot. Dooku should've been allowed to win for once against the Jedi, and he should've been able to erase all trace of his involvement with the Clone Army or the fact that his alter-ego was Tyranus. That would make Dooku look like a badass, as well as a worthy Sith, while the Jedi reasonably stick with the Clone Army because they don't know any better.

Then I'd probably either go with Maul Speedrun any% all the crime in the Galaxy, which is lame and shittily done and ignores Zann and the Black Suns,

Talking about Tyber Zann just shows me that some writers from a game studio did the crime lord thing better than Filoni did. All Filoni did was have Maul kick around criminal organizations and force them into the collective, whereas Zann had to learn from the Empire how to fight, and he applied what he learned from the Empire to his criminal operations, which made it work.

That, and Zann did the "Mandalore Reborn" thing better with the fact that he had Mandalorian warships in his arsenal that can guard his planetary assets well, not to mention soldiers who wielded fucking DISRUPTOR RIFLES. You know, the guns that can turn people into pixie dust? The kind of guns that made Vader say "no disintegrations" to Boba Fett? Whereas the most Maul had are some commandos and thugs in starfighters. At that point, he'd barely be a threat against a local planetary militia with some aging Dreadnought-class heavy cruisers, much less the Separatists and the Republic who have capital ships and large armies with tanks and artillery that can bomb his little criminal empire into dust.

or his attempts to make magic seperate from the force given Talsin openly admits she's not a force sensitive as she voodoo dolls Count Dooku the Dumb Fucking Retard who Can't Count.

It made no sense that Talzin allowed her Nightsisters to get wiped out, yet she tried to preserve Maul at all costs, even her own life. The writers can't seem to figure out if she's evil but with some shades of good, or just pure evil with no sympathy whatsoever.

Either that or Thrawn, who thinks getting anally raped, all ribs broken, and left for dead as his enemies by all mean win is victory, loses to farting space whales and came back due to stupidity. Goddamn there's a lot of nonideas this cowboy hat wearing DSP Deepfake does that are horrible.

I wouldn't put it beyond Filoni to have Thrawn lose again in an embarrassing way. The dude hates Empire fans, and he made the Empire look like a joke in Rebels and the Mandalorian. Tony Gilroy got some points in the modern SW fandom because he at least allowed the Empire to look tough.

Gone are the days of Battlefront 2, Dark Forces, TIE Fighter, Rogue Squadron, Galactic Battlegrounds, or Empire at War, where the Empire is allowed to be powerful, allowed to be a threat.

Someone like Rom Mohc whose Dark Troopers cut through the Rebels like a hot knife through butter would be turned into a joke if he ever showed up in the modern canon, because Filoni can't have Imperials be cool outside of maybe Thrawn, Vader, or Tarkin. Especially since the Left doesn't like it if you like fascist characters; I mean, the fuckers go nuts over right-wingers like Warhammer 40K, and they even got mad that some kids dress up as Stormtroopers in Halloween.

Hence why they obsess over making the Empire inefficient for the sake of the plot. Not just in kids' shows like Rebels, but even for "mature" shows like the Mandalorian or the Bad Batch. Outside of main Imperial characters, everyone else is a butt-kissing toady with all the fighting potential of a schizophrenic Gungan. The Grand Inquisitor put up a decent fight, but he lost to the Jedi equivalent of a high school dropout, and Agent Kallus went full Iden Versio and betrayed his cause.

By making the Empire look like a joke, it makes the Rebels look even weaker when they struggle against the Empire. As opposed to the Rebels of the old days, where they legitimately defeated a powerful Empire whose soldiers weren't a fucking joke. Even a badass like Kyle Katarn can get worn down fighting the local Imperial army, much less the supersoldiers like the Dark Troopers or the Dark Jedi Shadowtroopers who can easily kill him if he's not careful.

I mean if I could count outside setting decisions, it's pissing away episodes on garbage and not being smart enough to develop more than one character. Hell, it refused to do any of that but the bare legal minimum to technically make it canon.

The fact that S3 of Mando had filler episodes when each season only has 8 episodes was criminal.

A reminder that Craigslist whores often demand more money for even normal sex than Journoscum to sell their dignity. And bots are like a buck per a few thousand.

Whores give a joyous time to people, and they're at least attractive enough to be a good market commodity. Journoscum are people who applied for a journalism degree, but couldn't get a job with CNN or the New York Times, so they're forced to write about nerd shit that they hate. They're not in demand, so they're willing to lower their standards and work for less than what whores get.

It's actually fitting how Trade Federationesque Didney is.

Hey! I resent that statement! The Trade Federation can actually be imposing and efficient when it's not written by kids' cartoon writers. I mean, their ground forces were able to drive off the fucking Jedi in TPM on certain occasions.

 

[Gondolindrim]

f I had to pick my top three, it would be making the Jedi realize the Clone Army was a Sith plot and did nothing to countermand it.

This is another instance of TCW being a "What If" universe and not an actual attempt at filling in blanks between movies. The motherfucker couldn't stop himself from alluding to Revenge of the Sith. If it wasn't the brain chips, it was the Zillo-Beast detecting that Palpatine was a supervillain, or it was the innumerable hints that he's evil or that Dooku is way too in the know about the Republic that make the Jedi look like idiots. Or Pong Krell deducing everything about the plot despite never interacting with Palpatine once.

Honestly, it's a bigger plot hole that Yoda didn't realize what was going on before Commander Gree put a gun to his head.

 

[BigBadBastich]

This is another instance of TCW being a "What If" universe and not an actual attempt at filling in blanks between movies. The motherfucker couldn't stop himself from alluding to Revenge of the Sith. If it wasn't the brain chips, it was the Zillo-Beast detecting that Palpatine was a supervillain, or it was the innumerable hints that he's evil or that Dooku is way too in the know about the Republic that make the Jedi look like idiots. Or Pong Krell deducing everything about the plot despite never interacting with Palpatine once.

Honestly, it's a bigger plot hole that Yoda didn't realize what was going on before Commander Gree put a gun to his head.

The Jedi are basically dogmatic sociopaths in the prequels even without Filoni's dumb plotlines. They've grown complacent and completely assured of their continued existence. But again with so much added nonsense from that show it makes you wonder how they could even fall when the writing was on the wall. Then again, they did antagonize their Jesus equivalent and knew he was emotionally unstable despite being a famed and accomplished military hero.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Whenever Filoni writes OT content, he does away with the subtle atmosphere and sinister nature of the Empire that was so present back in the day. You just have an openly evil and incompetent Empire that just makes the good guys look even stupider for not being able to overthrow them in its first year, let alone a decade.

Listen to this track from Dark Forces, and soak in the atmosphere of the old Empire:

This track plays as you explore a base hidden inside a cave system, a base where they were testing out the alloy being used for the Dark Troopers. Yet the atmosphere doesn't just go with the standard Imperial fare; instead, you hear this music as you go through a top-secret, high-tech facility that has its own puzzles and traps, and even though you fight mostly Stormtroopers, officers, and Imperial Navy commandos, you still get the impression that you've infiltrated a fortress belonging to the army of the Dark Side, that they're up to no good in here, and what they were making here is something that spells death for anyone who dared to defy the Emperor.

Not a single Dark Jedi or supersoldier lives in that base, yet it still oozes a sinister atmosphere. And even if you play on Normal, the Imperials inside will fight hard to keep that one shard of special metal away from you.

Now, imagine this base depicted in Rebels or the Mandalorian. The OST would get swapped out with some classic John Williams songs, except kiddie-fied so that it would suit a more comedic tone. The Imperial troops inside will be laughable buffoons, easily tricked by kids with basic tactics or trounced by a dude with plus one infinity armor who doesn't even have to move as everything just bounces off him. They find the metal easily, walk back home with it, as if the whole thing was one big fucking joke.

Here's another track, from Rogue Squadron 3, which plays when you have to take down a Super Star Destroyer on Fondor:

The soundtrack builds up the tone; you're facing a monstrous ship of overwhelming might and power, and you have to keep your fighter down in its cityscape, carefully navigating your fighter through the buildings, lest your ship gets shot down by the AA guns of the SSD if you tried to fly over the cityscape. You have to navigate what seems to be entire city blocks that go on and on, a ship with an entire city on top of its superstructure, dotted with warship guns; you can just imagine the unmitigated death and devastation this vessel can deal unto the Alliance fleet if it was completed and it started its voyage among the stars.

Not to mention that this monster of a ship is equipped with cloaking devices, meaning that it can hit-and-run your forces with impunity if you don't take the SSD down. You have to win this. You have to take this monster down. Or else, you can kiss your Alliance fleet goodbye.

I can just imagine how Rebels or other Filoniverse shows would handle it. Instead of emphasizing the terror of the ship, they'd just make it another target to destroy. They'd just have another generic SW theme playing while Ezra, Zeb, Chopper, and Hera would be cracking jokes as they evade the ship's fire effortlessly while gunning down TIE Fighters and blow up the ship.

Either that, or the Mandalorians would effortlessly board the ship, slaughter the Imperials inside, and sail it back to the New Republic or make it the Mandalorians' new flagship. They'd paint the Mandalorian symbol on it and have it fly around as their mobile fortress.

 

[Gondolindrim]

Then again, they did antagonize their Jesus equivalent and knew he was emotionally unstable despite being a famed and accomplished military hero.

To be fair it was the fact that he was an accomplished military hero that got them concerned. They are a monk order after all, the soldier thing is a role they're forced into because of the whole "I can move heavy objects with my mind" aspect.

 

[Adamska]

Now, imagine this base depicted in Rebels or the Mandalorian. The OST would get swapped out with some classic John Williams songs, except kiddie-fied so that it would suit a more comedic tone. The Imperial troops inside will be laughable buffoons, easily tricked by kids with basic tactics or trounced by a dude with plus one infinity armor who doesn't even have to move as everything just bounces off him. They find the metal easily, walk back home with it, as if the whole thing was one big fucking joke.

Nah, too coherent and focused. They'll waste two to three episodes on a random sidequest that happens during their check of the weapons facility. Like Kyle Katarn gets sidetracked by random asshole pirates led by a knock off of Captain Hook, and it'll be up to a random child slave that was working in the mines to get the metal, but only after they go to a random fucking planet for something stupid.

Fuck it let's make it Ord Mantell, which will look different and the sidequest is to get the allegiance of Blimpo the Hutt and his gay crime empire, since they're too retarded to come up with other venues for hutts. God forbid they specify what crimes and industries they do. Kyle then teams up with this slave child, some weird genderfluid or butch alien; probably twi'lek or togrutan since Dave's fucking uncreative as shit and Disney wants to pretend they are totally progressive, a mad bomber/explosive specialist since he always spams that shit too, and like one or two producer influenced add ons. Oh, and Maul's here too; and he's contemplating strangling babies to tell you why he's evil.

The admin of the research lab is some poor fucking EU figure getting raped for this go, probably played by an actor who gave a shit and is forced to play the scenery chewing mentally challenged sub-saturday morning cartoon villain, and a Smugly Chuckling Thrawn, who remarks that his plan for the twi'lek/togrutan to cuckhold him by fucking his wife is going to plan. Right as the base explodes and by all means the real Vader would stare in silent rage before killing them as brutally as possible to make a point. Because the actual empire would not brook this shit.

Oh and despite having three episodes to build this team's character and dynamic, it only slightly builds on like two of them at best.

 

[Ghostse]

I was curious as to why Visions season 2 was a bunch of a one offs and not building on any of the actually good shorts they had before
View attachment 7254106

It appears that making sequels was a "Break Glass In Case of Emergency" option for Disney. Making more shorts and shooting them off generated zero interest so now they feel forced to make followups. This is just another example of Lucasfilm being stupid, why in God's name did they think people wouldn't want more actual story stuff to start with?

"The Village Bride" oh good, we can get explicit confirmation she's a muff diver instead of just implication.

I can't help but notice that all the Star Wars shill accounts just activated overnight

New NPC updates were just pushed out.
Celebration just completed so there is new product to get excited for.
May 4th coming up so gooning is reaching a new fever pace.

 

[draggs]

To be fair, in the post-RotJ part of the EU the bad guys, usually the Empire, take huge losses almost all the time and the good guys take minimal losses almost all the time. Thrawn's campaign and Dark Empire are really the only times the New Republic feels in true and honest danger, taking big Ls, until NJO

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

In both Rebels and Dark Forces, characters like Darth Vader and Grand Admiral Thrawn glaze the hero to show how important the hero is. Yet with Vader in Dark Forces, that makes more sense, because when he says that Kyle Katarn was a resourceful foe whose threat level possibly surpasses the Dark Troopers, the dude blew up an Imperial base all by himself, whereas Tak base had to be taken down by several Dark Troopers, so Vader's concerns are valid. Whereas Thrawn in Rebels glazes Commander Sato and calls him one of the finest commanders in the sector, despite the latter having the strategic acumen of a brick, sending fighters against a superior foe like Vader, and charging the blockade at Atollon despite it costing tons of ships on the Rebel side because that's exactly what the Empire wanted them to do.

So with the former, it comes off as a valid concern that Vader brought up to Rom Mohc, whereas with the latter, it just seems that Filoni wants established characters to praise his OCs without having to earn it. You don't see the bad guys in the Rogue Squadron games praising Crix Madine out of the blue. The most they did was praise Sarkli, and that was because Sarkli managed to score a victory against the Alliance.

Nah, too coherent and focused. They'll waste two to three episodes on a random sidequest that happens during their check of the weapons facility. Like Kyle Katarn gets sidetracked by random asshole pirates led by a knock off of Captain Hook, and it'll be up to a random child slave that was working in the mines to get the metal, but only after they go to a random fucking planet for something stupid.

If they bring in Kyle Katarn, he'll get the Mace Windu treatment where some OC Filoni made is going to be more preachy and morally righteous than him. Like, for instance, Ahsoka. She'll say that Jedi are supposed to be peacekeepers, not warriors, and she'll say something along the lines of Kyle being too close to the Dark Side because he revels in combat and slaughtering enemies.

Or, Kyle would get the Aayla treatment where they remove every other trait outside of making them generic AF. Aayla had an interesting background where she had feelings for Jedi Master Kit Fisto and had a bond with Quinlan Vos. She even had a bond with Commander Bly, which made Order 66 particularly hard for him. They removed that in TCW and exchanged it for the standard Jedi character who sermons Ahsoka about attachments. As if she doesn't have her own bonds with those on her side.

Fuck it let's make it Ord Mantell, which will look different and the sidequest is to get the allegiance of Blimpo the Hutt and his gay crime empire, since they're too retarded to come up with other venues for hutts. God forbid they specify what crimes and industries they do. Kyle then teams up with this slave child, some weird genderfluid or butch alien; probably twi'lek or togrutan since Dave's fucking uncreative as shit and Disney wants to pretend they are totally progressive, a mad bomber/explosive specialist since he always spams that shit too, and like one or two producer influenced add ons. Oh, and Maul's here too; and he's contemplating strangling babies to tell you why he's evil.

Kyle would probably get teamed up with Ahsoka or Ezra, and Ezra would be cracking jokes and acting like the Empire isn't serious business. Kyle would reprimand him, but is proven wrong when they run into a Stormtrooper battalion and the fuckers have the backbone of a chocolate eclair, and they're so clumsy, Jar Jar Binks would look like an elite Prussian soldier compared to them. Bonus points if Sabine shows up and paints graffiti on the base walls, or on a TIE fighter they steal as a getaway vehicle.

The admin of the research lab is some poor fucking EU figure getting raped for this go, probably played by an actor who gave a shit and is forced to play the scenery chewing mentally challenged sub-saturday morning cartoon villain, and a Smugly Chuckling Thrawn, who remarks that his plan for the twi'lek/togrutan to cuckhold him by fucking his wife is going to plan. Right as the base explodes and by all means the real Vader would stare in silent rage before killing them as brutally as possible to make a point. Because the actual empire would not brook this shit.

Given that Filoni rarely even uses Vader, I highly doubt he'd make an appearance. Usually it would be the smugly chuckling Thrawn or some other stuffed-shirt Imperial general who'd react to the Rebels blowing up the base by saying "just as planned" because they learned more of how the Rebels fought.

To be fair, in the post-RotJ part of the EU the bad guys, usually the Empire, take huge losses almost all the time and the good guys take minimal losses almost all the time. Thrawn's campaign and Dark Empire are really the only times the New Republic feels in true and honest danger, taking big Ls, until NJO

The Empire took Coruscant from the New Republic in the timeskip between Dark Empire and the Thrawn Trilogy. And they almost got to ruling the galaxy again in Jedi Knight 1 and Jedi Academy, had they succeeded with Jerec and Ragnos. Even in their weakened state, they were a force to be reckoned with. To the point where the New Republic would rather make peace with them instead of finishing them off. Not to mention they gave the Vong one hell of a black eye when the New Republic couldn't.

 

[draggs]

The Empire took Coruscant from the New Republic in the timeskip between Dark Empire and the Thrawn Trilogy. And they almost got to ruling the galaxy again in Jedi Knight 1 and Jedi Academy, had they succeeded with Jerec and Ragnos. Even in their weakened state, they were a force to be reckoned with. To the point where the New Republic would rather make peace with them instead of finishing them off. Not to mention they gave the Vong one hell of a black eye when the New Republic couldn't.

Now this is an interesting topic, but two things first. The New Republic inflicted multiple defeats, and, even in its own defeats, losses on the Vong much bigger than the defeat the Empire inflicted on them when they invaded the Remnant. I love Pellaeon telling the Vong commander the Empire will always strike back as much as the next guy, but they make it clear that Vong fleet was C-tier led by a C-tier commander. And it still almost knocked the Remnant out at the first blow. The black eye the Remnant gave the Vong came during the Vong counteroffensive after the New Republic had turned the tide by kicking the Vong's asses at at Borleias and Ebaq 9. Indeed it was established that they attacked the Remnant precisely because Pellaeon had given the New Republic the Empire's hyperspace lane charts for the core, which allowed the ambush at Ebaq 9 to be brought off in the first place. Please don't split hairs about Ebaq 9 okay, the Empire did contribute the charts which were crucial, but it was all New Republic military forces that fought that battle. Lumiya's Sith also helped secretly but again not with warships and snubfighters or anything

The reunited Empire immediately after Thrawn's death took Coruscant in a lightning strike and then promptly fell into civil war, and the New Republic was knocked down but getting on its feet when Palpy returned and raised the stakes immensely. I intended that brief period between Thrawn's death and Palpy's return to be included in what I was talking about because the they were all so closely intertwined

Now here is the canon sperging. Until NJO, there was a wall of sorts between the EU novels/short stories and the comics, between the EU novels/short stories and the EU video games, and between the EU comics and the EU video games. There were exceptions like Shadows of the Empire, but that was deliberately intended for all the media to be canon from the start. Until NJO, people like Kyle Katarn didn't appear in the EU novels. Some things like the events and characters of the Rogue Squadron comic books were referenced or showed up in the Rogue Squadron novels. For NJO, Lucasfilms' big EU continuity/canon team decided to smooth things out, and characters like Kyle Katarn and the events of various video games were soft retconned as being 100% EU canon. They weren't explicitly canon or non-canon as a whole before, but they simply were avoided by the novels. I think there was one reference to Katarn and his Commandos in the EU novels/short stories before NJO, and another reference or two to the Pentastar Alignment. Even after that, the events of the Katarn video games were basically left twisting in the wind, these momentous events apparently left no impression in anyone's memory. The EU timeline was already jammed with huge wars and incidents coming one after another after another, they didn't want the headache of explicitly jamming even more stuff into it

If you want to say that it's all canon, Lucasfilm decided so, deal with it, you can, but I'm not going to agree with that and I think we both have justifications for those opinions

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Now this is an interesting topic, but two things first. The New Republic inflicted multiple defeats, and, even in its own defeats, losses on the Vong much bigger than the defeat the Empire inflicted on them when they invaded the Remnant. I love Pellaeon telling the Vong commander the Empire will always strike back as much as the next guy, but they make it clear that Vong fleet was C-tier led by a C-tier commander. And it still almost knocked the Remnant out at the first blow. The black eye the Remnant gave the Vong came during the Vong counteroffensive after the New Republic had turned the tide by kicking the Vong's asses at at Borleias and Ebaq 9. Indeed it was established that they attacked the Remnant precisely because Pellaeon had given the New Republic the Empire's hyperspace lane charts for the core, which allowed the ambush at Ebaq 9 to be brought off in the first place. Please don't split hairs about Ebaq 9 okay, the Empire did contribute the charts which were crucial, but it was all New Republic military forces that fought that battle. Lumiya's Sith also helped secretly but again not with warships and snubfighters or anything

The thing is, the Vong could've been defeated by the New Republic if they didn't half-ass their defense. Instead, they dragged their feet just to snub the Jedi, and even when they fought, NR leadership was so incompetent that morale was at an all-time low.

And even before the Vong appeared, the New Republic was so tired of war that they had to make peace with the weakened Empire instead of wiping them out completely. Not to mention the fact that the Empire was still strong enough to the point where soliciting their aid was vital to the Jedi agenda in the early years of the Vong War.

Not to mention the fact that the New Republic was only able to win against the pre-Thrawn Imperial remnants because they were divided. The individual warlords still posed a considerable threat against the New Republic. If these warlords joined forces, the NR would've been strangled at its crib. And the fighting against these remnants was no walk in the park. Indeed, the Alliance/New Republic was more overstretched and overstressed by fighting several different empires, and they won by the skin of their teeth. Even by the time Thrawn entered the picture, the Empire still controlled half the galaxy, and the balance of power was horribly thin.

The New Republic won for the same reason the Alliance did on Endor: thanks to plot. If the Empire's leaders sorted their shit out and elected a leader to lead them post-Endor, they would've won the war.

Shit, they won the war in the Legacy era, effortlessly crushing the Galactic Alliance and reducing them to a hit-and-run rebel force once more, before they had their own civil war between a Jedi Emperor and a Sith Emperor.