The Abortion Debate Containment Thread - Put abortion sperging here.

[Death Grip]

In the UK you can get the termination of pregnancy pills sent through the post.
I approve of this.

 

[Sweetpeaa]

Why can't I just rape a woman when I get the hornies? Why do you want to limit my bodily anatomy? Why can't I kill a kid instead of paying child support for 18 year? That's a real violation of my autonomy.

I want female citizens to have the exact same rights and restrictions I do. No murder allowed.

This is very different from carrying a pregnancy.

Onto the great golden cow of the ''MEN ENSLAVED FOR CHILD SUPPORT'' argument.
Many men don't pay child support. And those that do and earn a low income can have just a measly amount of 79 dollars deducted from their monthly paycheck and yet they still bitch about it.

 

[Not Really Here]

Have you ever heard of the “Appeal to definition” fallacy?

What a wonderful excuse for not knowing what a word means.

 

[Clamsworth]

What a wonderful excuse for not knowing what a word means.

Keep trying to bait-n’-switch. It just proves that pro-life fanatics are not beholden to good faith.

What a gay copout. Due considerations of medical ethics and law. Nazi scientists followed their medical ethics and law too. As did the people performing ice pick lobotomies on women who had premarital sex.

Boo-hoo! “Everything I don’t like is literally Hitler!”

 

[The Demon Pimp of Razgriz]

Many men don't pay child support. And those that do and earn a low income can have just a measly amount of 79 dollars deducted from their monthly paycheck and yet they still bitch about it.

Men who don't pay child support when its mandated by the courts GO TO JAIL. And how much is actually required by a man to pay as child support is different for every case, and that can be a substantial amount of money for certain people. And there have been cases of men being forced to pay ludicrous amounts of child support for children that aren't even theirs, such as in this case.

 

[Not Really Here]

Keep trying to bait-n’-switch. It just proves that pro-life fanatics are not beholden to good faith.

I'm sorry, I can't understand what you're posting because words don't mean anything.

I am however amused at the lengths you will go to so you can avoid admitting you don't know the difference between 'sentient' and 'sapient'.

 

[Freedom Fries]

What does child support have to do with killing babies?

 

[Clamsworth]

What does child support have to do with killing babies?

Nothing, we’re talking about abortion here.

 

[soft breathing]

And how much is actually required by a man to pay as child support is different for every case, and that can be a substantial amount of money for certain people.

Spoiler: child support costs rant

Spoilered since it's drifting off-topic but I have to add this because this guy here is right - it depends where/who/how much you make if you have to pay 'just' 70/month or a lot more.

Just to give people from (abroad) and idea how much this comes down to in Germany.
- You, as the father of the child, can keep up to 1.160 Euros from your earnings for yourself
- Every Euro you make in addition has to go into child support payments
- Child support for a child under 6 years is 369 Euros and goes gradually up to 530 per month until the kid is 18 or older
- The more money you make, the more you have to pay for the child, the 369 are the minimum.
- You have to pay this amount for every offspring you have that doesn't live with you but with it's mother

(you can swap the genders though - if the kids are living with the dad, the mom has to pay etc)

 

[Hollywood Hulk Hogan]

Abortion should be avoided as much as possible. So there should be more access to birth control methods (condoms, pills, IUDs, etc).

That being said, abortion should be 100% legal as a last resort. A teenager fucking up shouldn't have her life ruined because her boyfriend put a condom on wrong. A woman shouldn't be forced to bear her rapist's child. A poor woman who gets pregnant shouldn't be forced to have another mouth to feed.

People are gonna fuck.

 

[ChikN10der]

What does child support have to do with killing babies?

It's only related on a second order. If outlawing abortion is an attack on women's autonomy, then child support for an unwanted child is also an attack on a person's autonomy.
If, on the other hand, paying child support for an unwanted child is simply taking responsibility for one's own actions, maybe not allowing killing a baby is also simply taking responsibility for one's actions.

 

[Hellbound Hellhound]

I've said it in another thread, and I'll say it again: abortion is uncontroversial throughout most of the Western world. It's only in the US and Ireland where the issue still seems to generate controversy, and that's probably in no small part because of the influence religious zealots still have in both countries. You can even see it in the way that arguments against abortion are typically framed: where science, law, and history are invariably jettisoned in favor of reductive deontology.

The argument that abortion is tantamount to murder rests upon two assumptions: 1) that a fetus/embryo is a human being, and 2) that it's right to life trumps the mother's right to autonomy as an ethical consideration. Both of these assumptions are fundamentally at odds with conventional wisdom.

The first supposes that personhood is defined by DNA, which ignores all of the legal, historical, and philosophical arguments concerning personhood, and perhaps more importantly: ignores all of the reasons people understand murder to be such an egregious crime. Namely: that it violates a person's most fundamental will: the will to live (a fetus/embryo has no such will). The second assumption supposes that a person's bodily autonomy must be surrendered if another person's life depends upon it, but if we apply this to any hypothetical scenario outside of abortion, the argument falls flat. If, for instance, I kidnapped someone and hooked their organs up to my body in order to stay alive (think: parabiosis), that person would have every legal right to free themselves and escape, even if it meant me dying.

Perhaps the greatest irony in this conversation is that as much as the pro-life lobby likes to insist that those who defend abortion are "reducing human life to a clump of cells", that's ironically what they're doing, through their dogmatic insistence that a person is defined by nothing more than mere chemistry. It's a reductio ad absurdum which fails to stand up to even basic scrutiny, and to illustrate this, all I have to do is mention identical twins. If possessing unique DNA really is what defines us as people, then it logically follows that identical twins are two halves of the same person. Obviously, this is ontologically false.

 

[ChikN10der]

I've said it in another thread, and I'll say it again: abortion is uncontroversial throughout most of the Western world. It's only in the US and Ireland where the issue still seems to generate controversy, and that's probably in no small part because of the influence religious zealots still have in both countries. You can even see it in the way that arguments against abortion are typically framed: where science, law, and history are invariably jettisoned in favor of reductive deontology.

The argument that abortion is tantamount to murder rests upon two assumptions: 1) that a fetus/embryo is a human being, and 2) that it's right to life trumps the mother's right to autonomy as an ethical consideration. Both of these assumptions are fundamentally at odds with conventional wisdom.

The first supposes that personhood is defined by DNA, which ignores all of the legal, historical, and philosophical arguments concerning personhood, and perhaps more importantly: ignores all of the reasons people understand murder to be such an egregious crime. Namely: that it violates a person's most fundamental will: the will to live (a fetus/embryo has no such will). The second assumption supposes that a person's bodily autonomy must be surrendered if another person's life depends upon it, but if we apply this to any hypothetical scenario outside of abortion, the argument falls flat. If, for instance, I kidnapped someone and hooked their organs up to my body in order to stay alive (think: parabiosis), that person would have every legal right to free themselves and escape, even if it meant me dying.

Perhaps the greatest irony in this conversation is that as much as the pro-life lobby likes to insist that those who defend abortion are "reducing human life to a clump of cells", that's ironically what they're doing, through their dogmatic insistence that a person is defined by nothing more than mere chemistry. It's a reductio ad absurdum which fails to stand up to even basic scrutiny, and to illustrate this, all I have to do is mention identical twins. If possessing unique DNA really is what defines us as people, then it logically follows that identical twins are two halves of the same person. Obviously, this is ontologically false.

This logic doesn't work for abortions at 9 months. Again, if you want abortion up to 8 weeks, that's very different from the current no limits abortion Dems want.

And yes, fetuses, after a certain point in development, do have a will to live and a pain avoidance reflex.

The dna thing is a weird straw man position nobody takes so good job convincing me that twins are different people I guess.

 

[Cpl. Long Dong Silver]

What are your thoughts on late term abortions?


Those two goblins ruined their brother's life, they were in a state of perpetual suffering. Children with that condition have literal pea sized brains, there is no logical reason for something like that to be birthed and nurtured for almost two decades.

Pic is the brother and his date at prom, imagine having to nurse potatoes that smell like spoiled milk for your entire life.
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Stop posting the cheddar goblins as if that is fuel for the argument. Both Lola and Claire would have died naturally if no intervention was taken. These aren't reasons for abortion to be legal, these are arguments for why palliative care is all we should offer tard babies. I was a long time Hartley thread poster so I know what lengths that bitch Gwen went to keep these tardos going.

 

[Freedom Fries]

perhaps the greatest irony in this conversation is that as much as the pro-life lobby likes to insist that those who defend abortion are "reducing human life to a clump of cells", that's ironically what they're doing

Yes. All humans and indeed all living things could be accurately described as clumps of cells (except single-cellular organisms I guess).

abortion is uncontroversial throughout most of the Western world. It's only in the US and Ireland where the issue still seems to generate controversy

Perhaps it only is so controversial in the US because in Europe they have restrictions on it, typically more or less 1st trimester or earlier type restrictions except in cases of medical necessity. There are no such restrictions in the US.

I will never understand why people insist on applying the liberal / sexually liberated European stereotype to each and every situation when it rarely if ever applies.

 

[Cpl. Long Dong Silver]

If abortions are so safe why is there higher rates of depression and difficulty conceiving a planned pregnancy later in life?

Let me guess, its the stigma and bullyings fault from chuds just like how transphobia is the cause of the 41%ers

 

[Sweetpeaa]

This logic doesn't work for abortions at 9 months. Again, if you want abortion up to 8 weeks, that's very different from the current no limits abortion Dems want.

And yes, fetuses, after a certain point in development, do have a will to live and a pain avoidance reflex.

The dna thing is a weird straw man position nobody takes so good job convincing me that twins are different people I guess.

Please watch ''After Tiller''. It's on Youtube for free. There are only 3-4 doctors that actively do late term abortions in the U.S and it's only for significant fetal anomalies. And no, I don't mean just the run of the mill ''Down Syndrome baby''. There are catastrophic fetal defects/disease that warrant a late abortion that we have never heard of. Defects so terrible you couldn't imagine them in the worst of your own nightmares.

 

[Freedom Fries]

Please watch ''After Tiller''. It's on Youtube for free. There are only 3-4 doctors that actively do late term abortions in the U.S and it's only for significant fetal anomalies. And no, I don't mean just the run of the mill ''Down Syndrome baby''. There are catastrophic fetal defects/disease that warrant a late abortion that we have never heard of. Defects so terrible you couldn't imagine them in the worst of your own nightmares.


View attachment 1613933

nobody is against this type of abortion. Nobody is arguing against them. I don't understand why you feel the need to keep pretending we are talking about them.

Late term abortions account for about 1.3% of them according to CDC studies done in 2015. Other private studies agreed.

 

[ChikN10der]

nobody is against this type of abortion. Nobody is arguing against them. I don't understand why you feel the need to keep pretending we are talking about them.

Late term abortions account for about 1.3% of them according to CDC studies done in 2015. Other private studies agreed.

Because saying "look man, I want to be able to knock bitches up on the reg and make them get an abortion" sounds fucked up.
More men support abortion than women.

 

[byuu]

I support it because it's the only way to stop Rosemary Ralph's baby.