Culture The Bible doesn't fit an Information Age

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By Russell Moore

I recommended the Gospel of Mark to an unbeliever. He read it and found it “creepy.” That’s exactly the response I wanted.

This young man is probably an atheist or an agnostic but has lived in such a secular environment that he doesn’t seem to think of himself in such terms, any more than you would introduce yourself as “non-cannibalistic” or “anti-horse-theft.” He wanted, though, to try to understand—just as an intellectual exercise—why someone would hold to religious views or practices he finds alien.

He asked what he should read in order to do that. There are, of course, many places I would send such a person, but to him I said, “Why don’t you read the Gospel of Mark? Don’t worry about whether you understand it all; just read through it.”

I later ran into the secularist again, and he reported that he had taken my advice. “So, what did you think?” I asked.

He said he was conflicted. Reading the Gospel was, on the one hand, narratively gripping in a way that he hadn’t expected, supposing an ancient religious text would be preachy and propagandistic. On the other hand, he said, “It was kind of creepy.” And that’s when he brought up Cixin Liu’s The Three-Body Problem.

This man knew that I had read the science fiction novel last year—and that I had done so reluctantly. A trusted friend had recommended the book to me with a warning: “Don’t give up. You will feel like you don’t know what’s going on and you’ll want to put it down. Keep reading and, you’ll see, it will all pay off in the end.” My unbelieving conversation partner had not read the book but he had watched some of the Netflix adaptation of it, 3 Body Problem.

Mild spoilers here: in both the book and the series, an alien civilization communicates with human scientists through a virtual reality gaming headset. The scientists are put in scenarios where they must solve the gravity fluctuations that are plunging the distant world into unpredictable periods of chaos and calm.

“At times, it was kind of like playing those games,” the young man said about reading Mark. “It was almost as though someone was on the other side, watching me.”

By that, he meant particularly that the “character” (his word) of Jesus in the text sometimes seemed to be written in a way that felt unexpectedly immediate. “Sometimes I had to remind myself that I wasn’t right there in the middle of everything. That kind of freaked me out a little bit.”

Although virtual reality aliens were not on my mind, this reaction was exactly what I had been hoping for when I’d recommended that he read Mark.

Usually if I’m helping someone “get” what Christianity is, I ask them to read the Gospel of John. With someone like this, though—who I don’t know if I’ll ever get to follow up with—I’ll suggest Mark, partly because it’s concise and relatively easy to read.

I also do this because of a story I heard years ago. If I remember right, a man who had been some sort of New Age Eastern religionist, the kind found often in the hippie countercultural movements of the 1960s and 1970s, became a Christian because a professor in his comparative religion class assigned the Gospel of Mark. Like the young man, he was drawn to the figure of Jesus and started to feel as though he was not only reading the text but that he was being beckoned from the other side of it.

Leon Wieseltier argues that we have too much emphasis on “storytelling” right now—that this leads to a loss of arguments, of persuasion. “Storytelling is designed to inculcate certain responses, certain mental stances, in the listener. They are passivity, credulity, wonder,” Wieseltier writes. “All of them are stances of surrender.”

This, of course, denies that there are important truths one can only see from stances of passivity, credulity, wonder, and even surrender.

Philosopher Byung-Chul Han agrees that we should be worried about how much we hear about storytelling, but that’s because—however much we talk about it—we’ve lost the ability to tell and to hear an actual story.

“We tell fewer and fewer stories in our everyday lives,” Han argues in his new book The Crisis of Narration, because “communication takes the form of the exchange of information.” In an information age, Han writes, an actual story is a disruption. Information, after all, is direct, controllable, and consumable. A story works a different way. A story requires that, in order to be experienced, some information must be withheld as well as revealed.

“Withheld information—that is, a lack of explanation—heightens narrative tension,” Han writes. “Information pushes to the margins those events that cannot be explained but only narrated. A narrative often has something wondrous and mysterious around its edges.” That kind of mystery is startlingly rare in an era of algorithms.

Part of our problem is that we find a plot unsettling in an information age, especially if we start to see our lives as part of that plot. That’s what Han finds diminishing about algorithms. We consume bits of disconnected data—curated by our curiosities and our appetites—to the point that we no longer feel surprise. Reality itself starts to feel dead, like so much abstract data. The deadness brings forth more deadness.

“Bits of information are like specks of dust, not seeds of grain,” he writes. “They lack germinal force. Once they are registered, they immediately sink into oblivion.” The metaphor immediately brought to mind Jesus’ own words: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit” (John 12:24, ESV throughout).

Journalist David Samuels laments that we now live in the flatness of a time when story and song are hollowed out by Big Data, replaced by “consuming pornography and propaganda.”

“The goal of their governing algorithms isn’t to create beauty, or anything human; it’s to suck out your brains and then to slice and dice them into bits that can be analyzed and sold off to corporations and governments, which are fast becoming the same thing; it’s a mass mutilation of the human,” Samuels writes. “What that sounds like in practice is like a car alarm that keeps going off, at a higher and higher pitch—a sound that has no meaning in itself, except as a warning that something has been shattered.”

Maybe the three-body problemof it all is not the Bible but the rest of life. On the other side of our digital lives are intelligences seeking to question us—nameless, faceless algorithms designed to test us with just one question, “What do you want?” What if, though, our boredom and malaise are themselves signs that we weren’t meant to live like this?

Jesus said that this is a key reason he taught in parables, “because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand” (Matt. 13:13). A story requires a certain kind of participation, a certain lack of control. One must be prepared for, and often through, the story to hear what it is saying. One must be baffled enough to suspend control, to feel the tension, in order to not just share information but to experience something true. Without that sense of bafflement and mystery, a story lacks the ability to astonish and to linger.

Think, for instance, of the Gospel of John’s very familiar account of Jesus’ multiplication of the loaves and fishes—a miraculous sign so important that all the Gospels reference it. We tend to remember that there was a crowd of thousands, that there was not enough to eat, and that Jesus provided a feast from almost nothing. What most people don’t think about when recalling that story, however, is just how Jesus sets up the occurrence.

“Lifting up his eyes, then, and seeing that a large crowd was coming toward him, Jesus said to Philip, ‘Where are we to buy bread, so that these people may eat?’” John records. “He said this to test him, for he himself knew what he would do” (6:5–6).

He himself knew what he would do. The question itself—the kind of momentary perplexity it would create in Philip—was Jesus’ intention. It’s the same pattern God followed with the tribes of Israel in the wilderness after the Exodus. Moses said to them: “And he humbled you and let you hunger and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that he might make you know that man does not live by bread alone, but man lives by every word that comes from the mouth of the Lord” (Deut. 8:3).

Jesus does not just intend to feed; he intends that we would first “hunger and thirst for righteousness” (Matt. 5:6). He did not simply intend to rescue Peter from drowning, but also that Peter would experience what it was like to go under water, to cry out and to feel a hand pulling him up (Matt. 14:30–31).

Jesus’ encounter with us in Scripture is meant to work the same way. We too are meant to find ourselves exclaiming with the Capernaum synagogue, “What is this? A new teaching with authority!” (Mark 1:27). We are meant to start asking the question, “Why does this man speak like that?” (Mark 2:7). We are meant to hear, as though addressed directly to us, “But who do you say that I am?” (Mark 8:29).

When one finds authority amid the algorithms, revelation among the consumption, that can feel creepy—just as after a time of starvation, the smell of baking bread can seem nauseating. It’s not those who find all this strange who are not “getting it” but rather those who find it all familiar and boring. That’s what a plot does, but it’s especially what a plot breathed out by the Spirit of Christ does, a plot in which we are meant to hear the voice of a Shepherd (John 10:4).

What if someone on the other side of those ancient words knows that you’re there? What if, in those words, you can almost hear the Galilean-accented voice that once disrupted the plotlines of some fishermen by saying, “Follow me”? What if it’s speaking to you? If so, finding that disturbingly strange isn’t the end of the story, but it’s a good place to start.
 
The information age is slowly ending. With the rise of AI we will eventually live in a world where nobody implicitly trusts anything they see unless it comes from an authority figure. Which is how things used to be before the rise of literacy in the 20th century.
 
If you had empirical evidence you wouldn't need faith. It would just be fact. That's why it's called a faith. I don't have faith you're retarded, you've proven it very well.
Faith is worthless. If something can't be proven, or at least possibly proven it is a total waste of time.

tldr; god is as real as santa
 
if they did they wouldn't be promoting literacy.
You think a child molester worshipping moloch is a good person because he can READ?
Also even setting aside spiritual elements of "do these exist outside people" demons can be expressed as a corrupting, destructive influence. And being able to fucking read or even teaching to read doesn't discount that.

Also you put a lot of FAITH in believing gender BS so you aren't exactly one to talk.
 
Why start with Mark and not Matthew?

Also calling it an Information Age when scientists are bribed and leaders still misinform deliberately is a tad ironic. Though I guess you can look smugly at your anscestors that you "know more academic things" while they had practical knowledge.
 
checkmate.png

Checkmate, Atheists :smug:
 
“What is talkativeness? It is the result of doing away with the vital distinction between talking and keeping silent. Only some one who knows how to remain essentially silent can really talk--and act essentially. Silence is the essence of inwardness, of the inner life. Mere gossip anticipates real talk, and to express what is still in thought weakens action by forestalling it. But some one who can really talk, because he knows how to remain silent, will not talk about a variety of things but about one thing only, and he will know when to talk and when to remain silent. Where mere scope is concerned, talkativeness wins the day, it jabbers on incessantly about everything and nothing...In a passionate age great events (for they correspond to each other) give people something to talk about. And when the event is over, and silence follows, there is still something to remember and to think about while one remains silent. But talkativeness is afraid of the silence which reveals its emptiness.”

“Thus our own age is essentially one of understanding, and on the average, perhaps, more knowledgeable than any former generation, but it is without passion. Every one knows a great deal, we all know which way we ought to go and all the different ways we can go, but nobody is willing to move.”
― Søren Kierkegaard, The Present Age
 
Sometimes I had to remind myself that I wasn’t right there in the middle of everything. That kind of freaked me out a little bit.”
This is a bit sad isn’t it? Good stories are supposed to immerse you
Journalist David Samuels laments that we now live in the flatness of a time when story and song are hollowed out by Big Data, replaced by “consuming pornography and propaganda.”

“The goal of their governing algorithms isn’t to create beauty, or anything human; it’s to suck out your brains and then to slice and dice them into bits that can be analyzed and sold off to corporations and governments, which are fast becoming the same thing; it’s a mass mutilation of the human,” Samuels writes. “What that sounds like in practice is like a car alarm that keeps going off, at a higher and higher pitch—a sound that has no meaning in itself, except as a warning that something has been shattered.”
I agree, and I think attention spans and the ability to create a calm internal world to reflect us being shattered by this onslaught of stimulus. TV blaring, hundreds of emails a day, constant noise and chatter and information. It shatters you. I hate it. I’d rather go man (or woman) a lighthouse for a year and bring a pile of books, yarn and art materials. And just sit and be quiet inside
Demons don't exist. Adults are supposed to grow out of ghost stories.
I would have posted the same pic as @Bloom Worm Cross Field did, but I’ll also refer you to the SRS and general Troon horror threads . Demons absolutely do exist. But perhaps the secular may see it more as a malign mind virus, either way works
Transpeople are proven by science.
Well people who think they are the opposite sex exist, is that what you mean? They’re certainly quite loud about it. Nobody can change sex of course, so they are deluded and unwell and generally a threat to others.
 
Of course it is dated. It is a fairy tale that had its last major Da Updaet 2 thousand years ago.

Expecting it to magically change to accomodate smartphones is just as silly as taking it for real.

What's next, expecting Hercules to clean stables with those little plate shaped drones?
 
  • Dumb
Reactions: indomitable snowman
tldr; you can't call religious people on their bs
Quite right:
If you refuse to validate a Troon they threaten to kill themselves.
That’s what you meant right? Troonism is a cult. It has mantras, like TWAW. It has tithing, all those begging go fund mes. It has a central myth that defies reality (that men can turn into women) and if you object to that myth you’ll get outcast or punished. Those who are apostates, detransitioners, are punished and shunned.
It’s about as culty as you can get, only unlike Christianity it does not a shred of positivity in the world, only destruction and pain and death and corruption.
 
It's up to those practising the faith to show why said faith is worth practising. I feel like far too many Christians use the faith for their own self-serving reasons, usually to make themselves look better or others look worse. In John 13:15, upon washing Peter's feet, Jesus said "I have set you an example that you should do as I have done for you" as a way to tell people to be humble and compassionate, two things I don't see in many Christians. Don't alienate people and be shocked when people are alienate, all I'm saying.
 
i don't know why this article was written or who wrote it, and i think it's ironic it comes from a site called "christianitytoday". i 100% agree with @Positron.

The Holy Spirit has beckoned to the two people the author mentioned. It is the author's opportunity to explain to them what it is about, and to assure them the there is nothing malevolent about the gaze of God.

i feel it's a disservice to new readers and potential converts to not help them understand just where that unease comes from. when learning about God, when immersing yourself in the Gospel, when reading about Jesus and coming to know Christ, it's natural to be afraid. for one, you know on some level that you're being tested, being observed, and your pride and ego bristle at the thought. two, God is good, and that is terrifying, because, for instance, pureness is terrifying. anyone can imagine pure evil and how terrifying it is, especially the pure evil in this world that we don't know explicitly. you wonder, "how can pure good can be terrifying?" well, it's because you are not good, yet God is.

one of the most important parts about understanding why God is righteous and just is that He is perfectly righteous and you are not. as a loving, caring, and just God, he is obligated to punish wickedness and sin. that is, you. Jesus took all the sins and filth of humanity onto himself and drank from a cup which contained the wrath of Almighty God. in this way, God saved you (humanity) from Himself, not from Satan. Jesus hung on a tree, and his Father turned away, for Jesus had taken all of the sins of humanity and taken God's undeniable justice and wrath upon Himself. it's just not possible for anyone to comprehend how much pain Christ held when he took all sin upon Himself.

you are not good, and God is. He is obligated to rid the world of you, the sinner. but through Jesus Christ, you can be saved. if you turn away from God and Christ, then when the day of judgment comes, "On your first step into Hell you will hear behind you all of creation applauding God for getting rid of you." Hell is not Hell because God's not there... it's Hell because God is there in all his wrath. God defined existence. truth becomes inherent in structure. man cannot shape reality just from imagining. the pagans twist things to their end, but same goes for human construction itself. you cannot escape how God inherently designed humans. that includes the need for us to have a god that rules over us. even the atheists inevitably designate a god for themselves through behavior alone. we all know that cars need motor oil to run. well, humanity needs God like a car needs oil: you have to have a highest ideal that rules over you and that you use to compare decisions. Sin itself? it's just an inversion of God's will on every point. nothing is new in it. Satan's way is just taking what is God's and inverting it.

no one is free of their father's sins, either - think of all kinds of sinful behavior that was never confronted or resolved and how that carries on to any children that kind of faithless and unsaved person has sired. Sin itself is genetic, and consequences to pass generation to generation. Adam and Eve bit into the forbidden fruit and all of humanity suffers for it. each generation inherits their forebear's malice and hate in themselves. same goes the other way: making sure your children are taught the Gospel properly is a big topic in scripture. there's no excuse for generations of fathers to not personally tutor their kids in the Bible. if they don't inherit your faith, what will they inherit? rot. almost everyone born today inherits rot, and knows nothing but rot. digging yourself out of rot is near impossible and it has lingering conditions. and all those people wish they could have come to God and Christ sooner.

lessons have gotten so twisted nowadays that i'm positive anyone here can outline some things they were told by their parents that were probably biblical lessons but were bereft of God and Christ. so they made no sense and were ultimately powerless to provide solutions. bereft of light and context, a lot of lessons don't work, and they might have the opposite effect: you just get frightened and have no one to turn to except the god that is "distraction". without Christ and knowledge of salvation, there is no point in withstanding the world's slings and arrows for a sense of higher morality. you die the same as them, then... what? what did you think as a kid? any pagan or modern thought is equally nihilistic in pointlessness alone. the bodies of the pharaohs rot surrounded by gold they can't take with them. all the omnipotent moral busybodies - known as humanitarians - of the world are with them. any attempt to teach someone to turn the other cheek instead of defending themself, or perhaps told to 'defend yourself' without explaining how to, is pointless. not only can you not do that without knowledge of Christ, without Christ the act of suffering insult for greater purpose is gone... so you resolve to be free of pain, because that's all you really have left. or maybe you turn into a self-satisfied moralist who places yourself at the center of the Gospel where God should be...

i listen to Paul Washer's preachings as often as i can. i would recommend this sermon especially to anyone new to him, and anyone with even the faintest sense of feeling drawn towards Christianity.
 
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