The Elder Scrolls

[BullfrogBill]

By their own metrics Witcher 3, the original Fallouts, Dragon Age, and BG3 don't even count as "real" RPGs half the time. Go back to circlejerking on NMA.

This could all be true for all I know and it still wouldn't make Skyrim an RPG

 

[Gerelatha]

Cope, if "one of the best RPGs ever made" according to bethesdoids finally getting a re-release only gets so-so numbers then it's a flop. You're right that I will never let it go if it doesn't reach that sales number, however. We're still in week one, let's see how long the new toy syndrome lasts and when the numbers start petering out.

lol, 25k would have been so-so numbers, 190k is selling gangbusters

 

[Brap God]

The Dragonborn being a "blank canvas" is only cosmetics though. I know modern gamers only care about how games look and don't consider anything else, but come on. There's a lot of fucking baggage with your character being the Dragonborn and you can never play as a more simple character because you will always be this mythical divine being with the blood of gods and every NPC points it out to your face every time you walk by them, not to mention that the only thing you can really do in Skyrim is just kill things and talk to people with only two maybe three dialogue options if your lucky, and every one of those dialogue options will just end up with the same result anyway. Compared to Daggerfall where you can just be a simple merchant and open a shop in a small town or large city if that's all you want to do with your character and the game will give enough depth in mechanics with that alone that it could be an entire game.

You conveniently leave out the baggage in Daggerfall where you're the champion of Uriel Septim sent out on a very high stakes mission, not some rando that can decide he wants to be a merchant for the rest of his life. I've never played Daggerfall so I'll take your word for how in-depth you can play as a trader, but you're completely ignoring the premise of the game if that's how you choose to roleplay.

Cope, if "one of the best RPGs ever made" according to bethesdoids finally getting a re-release only gets so-so numbers then it's a flop.

So your basis for reality is the opinion of diehard fans of a series? That sounds like very rational and sane logic.

 

[StacticShock]

I just wanted to shit on slop munching retards, now I'm giving them medals for somehow not being as retarded as some of the other people I've seen here. I don't know whether to laugh or sigh.

spend half a hour sighing and half a hour laughing.
parkour.

Yeah, they also went with the UE5, right?

and it's still as broken as the xray engine, unlike oblivion which uses UE5 as a renderer then uses gamebyro as logics, although ragdolls got fucked in the ass because of it.

 

[Gerelatha]

So your basis for reality is the opinion of diehard fans of a series? That sounds like very rational and sane logic.

when you want to paint 190k concurrent players as a flop you have to do some incredible mental gymnastics, please understand

 

[30+GameOvers]

So your basis for reality is the opinion of diehard fans of a series? That sounds like very rational and sane logic.

Is this an admission that Oblivion is an overrated, mediocre piece of shit and that a fresh set of UE5 sterile paint isn't going to improve it one bit? Not sure that's the take everyone here would agree with, unless they like spending 3500 hours playing overrated, mediocre games.

 

[Übertroon]

9:40 AM at Bravil.

My bravil looks a tad different

 

[duddBwyer]

I downloaded the remaster as soon as

This does not look like a game thats utilizing 125gb worth of space compared to other titles around that range. The OG GOTY Edition only takes up 5.6gb, which was relatively small for 2007 and it included everything. Part of this is indeed optimization since devs back then had to make sure to compact everything into physical retail DVD's, especially if it was for a game designed for the console market.
Now granted, drive space, especially for m2's is steadily lowering in price every 2 years and internet speeds for most outside rural areas is around 100-500mbps or higher, but this just sets a really bad precedent of taking as many short cuts as possible thanks to "well, we no longer have ceilings to limit us and they can just uninstall it after they're done" mindset.

Compression methods can only go so far though. Texture sizes get extremely hungry storage wise the higher you go. I personally liked it when games like Battlefield had a free downloadable add-on that included high-quality textures because then people could just download the base game, and if their computers are beefy, they could just download it, or if you just want to play the game right away, you can just do that.

 

[CryptoHermit]

but you're completely ignoring the premise of the game if that's how you choose to roleplay.

It's why the opening of Morrowind is so good. You get an intro scene about a prophecy to set up the story but nothing about the prophecy is explained to you. You get let off as a freeman and go to Balmora and get told to do whatever the fuck you want since you're a level 1 pleb and going to contribute jack shit as you are for the obvious main quest hook. That leads you into the Guilds and Houses and before you know dozens of hours have gone by until you actually go into the main quest.

 

[The Ugly One]

Yeah, the character creator in Skyrim and Oblivion are mostly just cosmetic and might as well be the same as choosing between playing as Mario and Luigi. This is true now more than ever since even gender doesn't affect gameplay beyond cosmetics anymore.

In Daggerfall, you are an emissary of the Emperor sent to free the ghost of King Lysandus. You cannot choose to not be this. You can fuck off, refuse to play the main quest, and just chew on randomly generated fetch quests until you get bored out of your mind. Very few DMs for tabletop games humor players who want to do this, so I suppose none of us are "truly" running RPGs. Only Daggerfall, in the whole history of gaming, is "truly" an RPG.

So you're just splitting hairs, trying to choose some arbitrary point at which the programmer's constraints on the player make it not a "true RPG" versus one which it is. In your case, it's how much back story the developer provided to begin with. Daggerfall is an RPG, but Skyrim isn't. Neither is Baldur's Gate. Neither is Betrayal at Krondor. Neither is Fallout. Neither are the AD&D 1e Dragonlance modules. Etc.

Seems like a narrow definition to me. Seems almost like nothing is an RPG except Daggerfall and sitting at the table with the barebones World of Greyhawk set and random encounter tables.

 

[Deus Exica]

And I don't care about Fallout, you might be on to something that Fallout isn't really an RPG, I wouldn't know.

Kill yourself instead of talking out of your ass, thanks.

 

[Gerelatha]

game i like: is an RPG
game I don’t like: is not an RPG

 

[BullfrogBill]

You conveniently leave out the baggage in Daggerfall where you're the champion of Uriel Septim sent out on a very high stakes mission, not some rando that can decide he wants to be a merchant for the rest of his life. I've never played Daggerfall so I'll take your word for how in-depth you can play as a trader, but you're completely ignoring the premise of the game if that's how you choose to roleplay.

No I didn't, I mention it in one of the posts before that one.

In Daggerfall the only absolute about the player character is that Uriel Septim considers you as something of a friend, and that's it. Sure I would have rather they made it more ambiguous than that but it's such a small detail that it's not going to affect most player's head canons, there's so much room to work with. Everything else about the player character is 100% up to you to invent even when participating in the main quest.

This doesn't mean that much anyway since he calls you his "champion" after buttering you up trying to convince you to complete his quest and receive his dirty letter saying "I'll great make it worth your while." Sure it could mean that you are a knight or a noble if that's the character you are going into it wanting the play, but it could also just be the Emperor trying to butter you up. Maybe you are an adventurer for hire who's had run ins with the Emperor, maybe you're known for doing secretive jobs, maybe you're an inmate desperate for freedom and the Emperor has some kind of trust that you wouldn't fuck him over with the letter. They worked hard to make sure that the Daggerfall into could have many different implications based on whatever perspective you go into it with. At most you could argue that it forces you to be a native of the Imperial City or nearby in Cyrodill but that's not going to affect who you are in the Imperial City or what your background or character is like. No one is going to refer to you as "The Emperor's Champion" or mention you having any ties with the Emperor in Daggerfall, not like they do in Skyrim and Oblivion. It certainly doesn't make you a divine being with the blood of the gods that people worship like in Skyrim.

 

[Brap God]

Is this an admission that Oblivion is an overrated, mediocre piece of shit and that a fresh set of UE5 sterile paint isn't going to improve it one bit?

You seem unable to exist outside of hyperbole. Oblivion is a product of its time that would've benefitted more from a remake than a visual remaster. Even if Bethesda themselves did an in-house godly job of making the most soulful visual touch up you ever done seen and just left it at that, it'd still be a flawed re-release in my books. Plenty of areas to improve upon, which is what Skyblivion aims to do and I hope they can pull off a decent job doing it.

No I didn't, I mention it in one of the posts before that one.

In Daggerfall the only absolute about the player character is that Uriel Septim considers you as something of a friend, and that's it.

He might sound a bit chummy when he refers to you as friend in the opening, but that "as Emperor" tacked on doesn't mean what he asks of you is just a suggestion. Seems like your only concern is whether NPCs acknowledge you as someone special or not.

 

[30+GameOvers]

You seem unable to exist outside of hyperbole. Oblivion is a product of its time that would've benefitted more from a remake than a visual remaster. Even if Bethesda themselves did an in-house godly job of making the most soulful visual touch up you ever done seen and just left it at that, it'd still be a flawed re-release in my books. Plenty of areas to improve upon, which is what Skyblivion aims to do and I hope they can pull off a decent job doing it.

Funny how fans can improve on the game for free, make it look better, play better ect. and yet you still see retards coping how a bland UE5 slopjob is worth 50$. If anything, the more this sells the more it shows how little taste bethestoids have, just like with how much copies Starfield and 76 sold despite being positively awful in every regard. All this sets is an even lower bar for the future and even more seething from Bethesda fanboys when their third game in a row flops, and I am all for it.

 

[Saint Agustin]

Morrowind is the best. The rest suck. I want a Morrowind remastered goddamit

 

[Coldsteel the Hedgehog]

It's the same shit these retards say literally every time. Any answer as to what makes a True And Honest RPG will ever be anything other than someone just not liking how something is done.

• "You will always be the Dragonborn." In F:NV you are always the courier. In Witcher 3 you are always Geralt. In KOTOR 2 you are always a Jedi Knight. You're not forced to be the DB in any meaningful way. Nothing stops you from never doing the MSQ, in which case you might as well just be some random guy. Literally the only place off-limits to a non DB character is a couple of endgame dungeons and High Hrothgar.
• "There's no variance or alternate routes." At least three of the major quest lines have split routes, almost every single Daedric quest has alternate endings, there's the entire civil war. Blood on the Ice exists. Having 37 endings to every quest that account for meta-gaming sequence breaking isn't even something the best RPGs do. Even NV only has a handful of quests like this.
• "You can't make meaningful choices." My brother in Christ you can destroy at least half of the major factions, what more "major" do you want? You can permanently miss out on quests and rewards by killing whoever you feel like. You can assassinate the Emperor of Tamriel. The Civil War has you usurp and replace the Jarls of entire holds. What games are you playing that do any better than this?
• "There's no opportunity for roleplay." Try having an imagination instead of making the game do it for you, genuinely. It's called self-control.

I'm not even a Skyrim dickrider, it just drives me up a goddamn wall that people can be this purposefully obtuse because they're mad that Skyrim has a minimap or that they can't accidentally put the game in a failstate because they let a gnome kill a quest NPC or something.

 

[Anti Lolicon Bomb]

The Vault Dweller from Fallout 1 is always a vault Dweller and a character Black Isle made up, guess Fallout 1 isn't a real RPG anymore. Hmm.

One of the least interesting discussions in gaming, RPG was casually used to describe a character-story driven game, often with levelling and class elements. FF7 is an RPG pillar despite Cloud being a distinct character with a path the player cant really dictate, OoT has even been called one of the greatest RPGs despite having no levelling system or builds or story choices.

Resident Evil despite having a story was first and foremost survival horror, the story was very lightweight in the originals. The "genre" really was just something to distinguish games with a heavy emphasis on at a time when that was still rare or at least somewhat rare, a time that has passed and hence why almost anything can or cant be called one today.
Of course you always get anal assholes who just want to argue over a word that lost all meaning by the PS2 era lol.

 

[Gerelatha]

“Todd derangement syndrome” really describes some of the individuals in this thread.

 

[Pierre D'Olnique]

Another QoL: you probably didn't know this, but the Hackdirt caves feauture ambient roars of some unseen beasts (likely the Deep Ones mentioned by the residents), except in the original you pretty much had to tune the voices and music all the way down to hear them. Remaster made them audible again, and I say that with every audio slider at 6, with the exception of music, which is at 10.
Also - never change, Oblivion.