The Great (low budget) Hiking Guide and Thread

[Frostnipped Todger]

Water filtration

I have a Lifestraw Peak. I've got one of the old models, but it has a 4l (1 gallon) bag, and filters in about 20 minutes. It's a good thing to be able to sit by a river and relax for 10 minutes while you filter a couple of litres if water.

sleepingbags

I'm a "buy once, cry once" guy with sleeping bags. Get the best you can afford, that goes down to the lowest temperature that you'll be exposed to. Get a sleeping bag liner, you can get them in cotton or silk, and they help extend the life of your sleeping bag.
It's not going to be a brand for you, but I got a One Planet sleeping bag, because they are made in Melbourne. I had an issue with an ember putting a hole in my bag, and I was able to get it repaired at the factory. When it eventually loses its loft, I can take it back and get it refilled. Have a look around and see if you can find a local manufacturer.

 

[卐卐卐]

Very awesome thread here. For bug stuff people have been saying DEET at varying levels, mines been 25 and not really effective. Especially when not moving around.

I've been carrying a cheap hammock (with burn holes from bein too close to the campfire) and a separate hammock bug net attachment. The nets nice and nylon. I've been makin small fires almost immediately before setting up just to smoke out the damn bugs. But when it's too wet lately I've just draped the hammock net over me like a corny halloween ghost.

I've looked into bug net suits, anyone have experience ? I'm coming back with damn near dozens of mosquito bites and I'm trying to actually get out when it's nice.

Anyone carry additional bags aside from backpack? Usually always have a lil shoulder bag but its reaching damn near messenger size now... Good for distributing weight to front?
I've only ever day-hiked (minimal/no gear) up mountains... most of my geared up experience is on bicycle en route to short walks to campsites.

The (also cheap) tent setup I've made fits into a small duffel bag. I want to camp mountainside overnight. But haven't camped overnight cuz the hammock is not very comfortable long term. Would trying to summit a small mountain with no weight ascendance experience, and camping on the side overnight, also no experience, be a terrible idea? Similarly bad idea to carry it bagged? I'm a pro at setting the tent up but should probably try it overnight in a boring spot...

Regarding knives/tools. I carry a standard little multitool with essentials (Does anyone actually use the tiny can opener attachment and it work? I carry a bigger redundant one cuz it sucks), folding saw, Milwaukee hatchback (the razor rusted in place so I need to unstuck it without killing myself), and sometimes a big machete. Rarely I interchange the machete for an axe.

Wimpy paracord cutting easily done with hatchback/multitool blade. Clearing lots of small growth/trees/brush the machete works great. I love chopping down overgrowth clearing old paths, finding out shit, imagining what it'd be like wandering it as the person who last cleared it. Stubborn / tricky cuts can be sawed with the folding saw. Folding saw expenditures far less energy per cut. Large sweeping clearing, machete. Machete getting stuck and felted? Just take the time and saw it instead, will save energy.

Anyhow, the machete is far lighter than an axe, though lacks splitting power. Axe cant really clear for shit unless its big. I'm just going to assume nobody carries a machete on multi day trips. But for it's cost (5 dollars) it has served me well.

a last thing about water bladders I carried the same amount of water (half gallon) in both: a double sealed water bottle, and water bladder. Havin the bladder on my back 100 percent feels better and distributes weight nicer. Even a little shock absorber. The water won't stay cold though, the hose and bag will get musty and bacterial. When you finish sipping, drain alllll water back out of the hose so less bacteria builds up. Especially in the tip.
thanks i plan to future sperg on this thread. i am addicted to never being inside.
P.S. is there any hammock material that's both wicking, and portable? I'm gettin baked in there sometimes. (the burn holes help)

 

[888Flux]

For bug stuff people have been saying DEET at varying levels, mines been 25 and not really effective

There use to be a product called 3M Ultrathon. It's the consumer version of the stuff they use in the US military but is no longer available for sale which fucking sucks.

It was 30% DEET-based lotion and it worked like magic. It had a chemical formula that allowed the DEET to be time-released and also prevented your sweat from interfering with the DEET on your skin. Also entirely odorless unlike DEET spray products. I don't know what the closest equivalent is unfortunately.

The only effective way to prevent mosquito bites is a light layer of 100% DEET on exposed skin and Permethrin treated clothing. When using 100% DEET, don't put it on plastic and don't stick your hands in your mouth when it's applied and you should be OK. 30% DEET products have a similar efficacy but shorter active duration.

Permethrin should be the second layer of defense. Permethrin isn't a insect repellent but instead an insecticide. When dried, it binds with the fabric in your clothes. When something like a tick or mosquito lands on pemethrin treated clothing, it paralyzes the nervous system of the insect and kills it. It lasts around 2 weeks with heavy UV exposure. It's also safe around animals, though the liquid form before it's dried is harmful to cats. Once its dried it's safe though.

You can get the spray bottles or get a plastic tub + concentrated permethrin and put your clothes in it. You can treat sleeping pads, hammocks, tents, etc.

Also one of these is very helpful if you aren't a fan of applying DEET directly on your face:


Boot gaiters treated with permethrin can prevent ticks from crawling up your legs.

 

[LordOfZhbagva]

A thing I'd add, since I learnt it after quite a bit of back pain, chest and stomach straps on your backpack - use them, or buy them if your backpack doesn't have it.
It helps balance the backpack out and prevents it from pushing your back forwards while pulling your shoulders back as much. It can save you a lot of back and shoulder pain.
Also, a tip I've heard from a really veteran trail runner - avoid heavy foods like sandwiches and such before and during the hike, it takes energy to digest them, stick instead to shit like dates and energy bars, they're easier to digest and provide more energy. I've not found any really major difference in this, but my hikes are mostly single day 20-30km long hikes and I'm young and fit enough to be able to just push through it either way, but I'll trust her since she was the 6th best trail runner in my country in her day.

 

[Mordecai "3 Finger" Brown]

Also, a tip I've heard from a really veteran trail runner - avoid heavy foods like sandwiches and such before and during the hike, it takes energy to digest them, stick instead to shit like dates and energy bars, they're easier to digest and provide more energy. I've not found any really major difference in this, but my hikes are mostly single day 20-30km long hikes and I'm young and fit enough to be able to just push through it either way, but I'll trust her since she was the 6th best trail runner in my country in her day.

There's some first principles wisdom here.

Your physiology has two parallel and somewhat competing nervous systems - the Sympathetic and the Parasympathetic.

The Sympathetic NS is the well-known "fight or flight", running-from-the-tiger one. It's the one innervating systems that lead to better athletic performance - faster heartrate, more adrenaline, more blood shunting to the core organs and to muscles, wider pupils, more adrenaline, more stamina, more speed & power, etc.

The Parasympathetic NS is the opposite. It's all about ramping down. As you mentioned, a big part of its role is shunting blood to the extensive mesenteric arterial & venous system required to absorb food, pass blood through the liver for storing and cleansing and eventually circulating nutrients to the rest of the body.

I'm not 100% sure which foods would be best to avoid prolonged PNS activation, but for the most part it probably involves:

1) reducing total bulk
2) focusing on carbohydrates more than fats & proteins

While fats and proteins are more energy dense and are great for satiety, their digestion pathways are more complex than carbohydrates, which all essentially break down in the gut to simple sugars. Which have easy & rapid pathways for the body to absorb their nutrient and put the energy to work right away.

 

[Newfag14]

Anyone carry additional bags aside from backpack? Usually always have a lil shoulder bag but its reaching damn near messenger size now... Good for distributing weight to front?

Ah, a great question,

I carry a small small ~10€ pouch mounted on my belt, similar to those waiters use to store their pens and notebooks.
In there I carry all the convinient small stuff that is worth having on hand like a bit of cash, a knife, lighter, phone, pen, paper, train tickets, etc...
My backpack also has 2 small pouches as part of the hip belt were I store needles + fishing line, emergency blankets, a heavy duty garbage bag...

 

[Newfag14]

...
While fats and proteins are more energy dense and are great for satiety, their digestion pathways are more complex than carbohydrates, which all essentially break down in the gut to simple sugars. Which have easy & rapid pathways for the body to absorb their nutrient and put the energy to work right away.

A great summary for nutrution basics

Fat and protein are something one should only eat when resting for at least a few hours to prevent feeling sluggish/sick on a hike.

 

[Newfag14]

Well, I'm off to the Alps for over a month, hiking through a few hundred miles and at least 60.000meters of up and down elevation.

The entierty of what I wear and carry is :

1 Pair of hikingpoles with shock absorbtion + light winter gloves 50€
1 Backpack (most likely 70 liters) + rain cover ~ 75€
3 fast dry T-shirts ~25€
3 pairs of hikingsocks ~ 15€
3 pairs of fast dry runner boxerbriefs 15€
2 pairs of Hiking pants ~80€
1 pair of fast dry shorts ~ 10€
1 pair of emergency long underwear ~25€
1 light softshell jacket ~ 40€
1 light rain jacket ~ 95€
1 rainponcho ~ 15€
1 pair of Loowa high ankle hikingboots with scholl gel inlays ~ 108€
1 cheap belt ~ 5€
1 belt pouch ~10€
1 pair of flip-flops ~ 10€
1 pair of cheap UV blocking sunglasses ~15€
1 Shemagh ~ 10€
2 Cotton bandanas ~ 10€
1 headlamp ~ 20€
1 charger + cabel 10€
1 shitty 100€ phone
1 light weight diving knife within the legal fixed blade limit ~ 10€
1 emergency blanket - 4€
1 heavy duty garbage bag ~1€
2 stainless steel waterbottles ~ 20€
Misc food, suppliments, emergency meds, a bit of gauze, sports-tape, antiseptic-woundcream, a tiny bottle of wound-spray, superglue, a bit of hot glue, 2 lighters, 10 water desinfect pills, basic hygine stuff, Rei detergent, fishingline+sewing-needles, Anti transpirant foot spray etc... ~50€
1 alpine hut sleeping bag ~ 20€
1 fast dry towel ~ 5€
printed out maps for each day and a small emergency compass 20€
Casio watch ~ 30€
Tons of free Audio-books of classic literature and a small deck of cards

With EVERY item counted i'm at a rough total of 888€
Oh and add in some ear buds + ear plugs, add inflation to get to a rough, generous >1000

Pretty much all of my equipment is black and can be worn outside the context of hiking.
Almost every item was already on a long form hike.
The travel cost + lodging should be under 1000€ if I don't get scammed to much by italian hut keepers.

If I don't post till the 10th of august, I might be dead,
I'm sure I will not slip and fall of a cliff, get hit by a rock slide or get eaten by an animal, but those are things nobody has any controll over.
Dehydration and heat stroke might be bitch to deal with since the summer got to europe early =/
I will also inform people of my route every chance I get.

PS:
I also forgott to get some emergency amphetamines before my travels to (micro) dose in case I have to marsh through a night.
I will not endorse drug use but there is a reason why that stuff is still given by some militaries in specific cases to soldiers on long missions.

 

[8reallybigbirds]

Things I will add and would love to have advice on:

- The best ways on how to deal with bugs, especially ticks and mosquitos

I have a homemade herbal tick repellent balm recipe that gets rave reviews from everyone I give any out to.
I grow and dry my own herbs so they are peak freshness and idk if wholesale dried herbs would have the same effectiveness, but it's worth a shot. If you have the means though I always suggest having an herb garden. Super easy to care for and so many benefits.
I also eyeball my amounts - it's not a hard science here.

-NEEDS-
- A cup of dried lemonbalm
- A half cup of dried peppermint
- A heaping cup of dried catnip
- A quarter cup of dried rosemary
- A cup of fresh basil, finely chopped
-Beeswax
-Olive oil
-Thermometer
-Cheesecloth
-Mesh strainer
-Little jars to store it in

-STEPS-
-Take all your herbs and combine them into a saucepan.
-Cover with enough olive oil that all the herbs are submurged.
-Heat on a stovetop on a very low heat for 4-6 hours. What's very important here is that you don't let the oil get above 130 farenheit or you risk damaging the active compounds in the plants that we are extracting. You should stir every 20 minutes or so to prevent burning and get even heating.
-After the 4-6 hours, turn the heat off, but leave the stovetop on the burner and let it come to room temp. Cover and leave at room temp for 12 hours.
-After 12 hours, prepare a mixing bowl with a mesh strainer and a couple layers of cheesecloth lining the strainer. (i also sometimes use scrap t-shirt material in a pinch) pour the oil through the cloth, then twist up the cloth into a bundle so that you can squeeze the herbs and get as much of the oil out as you can.
-If you did it right the oil in your bowl should be very bright green.
-Now pop this into the microwave on 15 second intervals until it's warm enough (not too hot!!) to melt some beeswax into. I put about 1.5 teaspoons in mine, but mine comes in bars and I just thinly sliced off some chunks and mixed them in until it looked right. You don't want too much or your balm will be hard, but too little and it will be runny and gross.
-That's it! Once it's the texture you want put it into your jars and store it in your fridge when you're not using it. I'm not sure how it holds up super long term, but theoretically if you keep it cool it should keep for years. Maybe toss it if the color turns or it starts to smell funny.
I formulated this specifically for ticks as my partner works in wooded areas frequently and this helped. Apply at the ankles, wrists, waistband, and shirtcollar/armpits. Not sure how it holds up against mosquitoes, but they are known to dislike lemonbalm and peppermint so it may help for them too.

For mosquito bites use a heat pen- gets rid of them in literal seconds.

 

[Neodanthril]

After recently going through a painful chafing episode, strongly encourage you all to add some kind of zinc paste to your hiking first aid kit

 

[Newfag14]

For mosquito bites use a heat pen- gets rid of them in literal seconds.

Ah, I remember getting weird looks from people at the camping grounds when I heated up a spoon with a lighter and pressed it on my bug bites to imitate a heat pen ...

Also a great post for a home made remedy, will try it out some time.

 

[Newfag14]

After recently going through a painful chafing episode, strongly encourage you all to add some kind of zinc paste to your hiking first aid kit

Yes, for those with thick thighs it is great advice to have something that prevents chafing or treats it.

I should also add chaffing in general as an addition to my notes on blisters.
Not only feet can chafe, shoulders, thighs and many more things can ...

I sing high praises about antitranspirat / antiperspirant spray for feet and sports tape.
That stuff is 100% a solution for preventing or kinda treating all kinds of chafing, including blisters.
There's also no rule preventing someone to use that spray for feet on any other body part, heck, I've even used it when I was all out of deodorant for my armpits to keep my manly musk at bay.

 

[Newfag14]

Question:

Is it actually a good idea to bulk up on calories when given the chance on an hike at a resupply point ?
If I would burn a total ~4500 cal a day on average, as an estimate on the lower side, and I barely get to 2500cal a day, would it be wise to force down an extra can of corned beef / fatty meats / eggs / butter / an extra helping of carbs to a meal, given the chance, or would it be better to just embrace the caloric deficit in order to make sure my body can actually digest the food i'm eating, given that I'll get most of my calories in the evening ?
What are the limits of digestion for the average male ?

Is a caloric deficit less bad if I at least try to get in some extra protein throughout the day by consuming some whey isolate with water/ milk to prevent mucsle loss ?
Would getting some additional fat throughout the day be a better choice instead of the mentioned protein, as a way to increase the calorie intake with less weight (1g of carbs or protein = 4cal 1g of fat = 9cal), to at least attempt to reduce the caloric deficit ?
I know that more fat also means a risk of having very unpleasant, greasy "biological waste material", and both things can upset a stomache when eaten while still moving arround a lot, so it's also a question of the right dose.
The orthodox awnser would be to just carbs max, but I want to know all of my options and how optimal each and every approach would be, given that I want to add very expansive notes on food in the guide.

Oh and how bad is my habit of drinking a at least 1 liter / 33 ounces of sheep or goat milk everytime I get the chance ?
I'm low key addicted to that stuff and also use it as a substitute for water and or a substitute or addition to a meal.
Not that I would stop doing that, but I would still like to know what a more optimal move would be.

I know at least that I will 100% not go down the route of bulking up on junkfood since I want actual vitamins, minerals, nutritional value from my food.

PS: I found something on the topic of muscle loss and nutrition, I still appreciate alternative takes and such since it's a vast topic

https://thruhiker.co/not-losing-muscle-thru-hiking/

 

[Newfag14]

The entierty of what I wear and carry is :

Final, total weight :
13,5kgs + 750g of boots + ~500g walking poles for a toal of 14,75kg.
~2kg of it Water
~2,5kg Food that's going to be eaten rather quickly and refilled to a lesser degree.
~ 1 kg Deodorant, Antistranspirant-spray, Sun-care and other hygiene related products + first aid, so it will be at half after ~2 weeks

= ~ 9,25kg actual Equipment load

It's a rough estimate and there were 100% things where I could have saved at least 1kg, but this should be a decent example for a low budget kit for a trip that lasts over a month.

Next time I will post / be online will be at like the 10th of August.

 

[Jhonson the Two]

Oh and how bad is my habit of drinking a at least 1 liter / 33 ounces of sheep or goat milk everytime I get the chance ?
I'm low key addicted to that stuff and also use it as a substitute for water and or a substitute or addition to a meal.
Not that I would stop doing that, but I would still like to know what a more optimal move would be.

I know shit nothing because I do small hiking but I wonder if it can contribute to dehydratation since milk tend to accelerate the bowel activity, even if it's more digestible that cow milk

 

[Frostnipped Todger]

Is it actually a good idea to bulk up on calories when given the chance on an hike at a resupply point ?

How long is your hike? The phrase "resupply point" makes it sound like you're out for weeks.
If it's less than a week, I just embrace the suck and deal with the calorie deficit (I'm not fat,but losing a kilo or two isn't going to kill me). I make sure that there is at least one good meal and several litres of water in my vehicle so I can eat and rehydrate before I have to drive anywhere.
More than a week, and I carry more weight than I'd like to have the extra calories. I will take peanut butter or coconut oil as supplements to my rations. It's not a bad idea to start adding them to your food a few days before you depart, just to get over any digestive issues that might arise.

 

[Internet-Based Lobotomy]

How long is your hike? The phrase "resupply point" makes it sound like you're out for weeks.

He said over a month in the alps not too far above.

If I would burn a total ~4500 cal a day on average, as an estimate on the lower side, and I barely get to 2500cal a day, would it be wise to force down an extra can of corned beef / fatty meats / eggs / butter / an extra helping of carbs to a meal, given the chance, or would it be better to just embrace the caloric deficit in order to make sure my body can actually digest the food i'm eating, given that I'll get most of my calories in the evening ?

You might know what you're capable of by now but personally I'd say you should be eating until you're satisfied. Doing a multiple day ordeal without anything but protein is a recipe for disaster, if you wanted to you could have some trail mix or what have you and snack on that while you walk. Just something with carbs and a bit of protein and fats to keep you topped up.

 

[Dracaena marginata]

Is it actually a good idea to bulk up on calories when given the chance on an hike at a resupply point ?

In my experience, it doesn't really matter that much. I think it's more important to consume nutrition you can't carry with you as easily: fresh fruits and vegetables, meat/protein, etc. Getting to eat food that isn't trail slop is a huge morale boost.

Is a caloric deficit less bad if I at least try to get in some extra protein throughout the day by consuming some whey isolate with water/ milk to prevent mucsle loss ?

You're allowed to eat carbs on the trail, dude. It's how you power yourself and you can carry way more of it.
If you're seriously worried about losing muscle, the main thing is to not be in a caloric deficit. You can carry a small bottle of olive oil to add some to your dinner or whatever as a supplement. You'd have to carry and consume an unreasonable amount of protein if it's most of your diet like you're suggesting. Protein just isn't as efficient of a fuel source especially by weight. On the other hand you'll still probably lose some muscle especially if you have a lot of mass. Bodybuilding just isn't very compatible with hiking.

Doing 8-10 hrs of hiking a day for weeks on end forces your body to adapt in unavoidable ways. You'll burning pretty much everything you eat and you'll still feel hungry all the time regardless. And unless you have IBS or are drinking pond scum I wouldn't worry about having an upset stomach, your body learns pretty quickly it needs to be more efficient with food than when you're sitting on your ass in the frontcountry. You'll learn "the limits of digestion for the average male" pretty quickly. It turns out to be pretty hard to consume too much food when you're hiking. Stop overthinking it. The question you should be asking is "how many calories can I carry for the least amount of weight?"

Also, a tip I've heard from a really veteran trail runner - avoid heavy foods like sandwiches and such before and during the hike, it takes energy to digest them, stick instead to shit like dates and energy bars, they're easier to digest and provide more energy.

This is good advice.

The entierty of what I wear and carry is :

This is all pretty good but here are my thoughts:
-There's no need for both a rain jacket and a poncho. Ditch whichever one is heavier. You could probably lose the jacket too since it's the middle of the summer. The rain jacket will be enough in most cases but I've never hiked in the alps so I could be wrong.
-Switch to trail running shoes unless you have glass ankles. The saying goes: every pound on your feet is like 5 pounds on your back.
-Use the garbage bag to line the inside of your pack, and keep your sleeping bag and clothes inside. The worst thing that can happen is if those get wet.
-Consider carrying another pair of socks. Rotate between three pairs for hiking and reserve the fourth for sleep. If not, two pairs for hiking and one pair for sleep.
-Reserve one t-shirt and the long underwear for sleep. Don't sleep in the clothes you hike in unless it's very cold, in which case you should use your remaining clothes as outer layers.
-Get another pair of shorts and lose one of the pants. Unless you're always hiking above the treeline or at very high elevations, it's much more comfortable in my experience to hike in shorts.
-No need for the belt. A backpack hip belt on top of another belt is a recipe for chafing.
-Carry nail clippers and keep your toenails short.
-Get plastic water bottles. Metal bottles just aren't worth the weight.

= ~ 9,25kg actual Equipment load

Your base weight could be lower since you're not carrying a tent or sleeping bag, IMO.

Here's a great website for managing/monitoring your gear weight and cost:

https://lighterpack.com/welcome

 

[ellroy]

I don't think this has been posted but needs to be posted. When you buy a pair of hiking boots, look up the sole type and learn how to take care of them.

I had a pair of Asolo TPS 520s I bought at REI back in 2014 and they were great boots but had a polyurethane soles. Those are common soles on higher end boot because they are extremely comfortable and can handle heavy weight well, something one will appreciate when they have 60+ pounds on their back. They also are temperamental and need moisture to keep them from delaminating from the boot itself. My boots finally fell apart in early 2024 because I hadn't worn them in several years and just failed when I wore them to work on a snow day. Here is an example of what I am talking about:

You have to wear them consistently to prevent this. Storing them inside a house is not enough to keep them from delaminating, you have to put them on your feet and move around in them to stop this from happening. That said, unless you're hauling heavy loads often and/or not hiking on a monthly basis, consider a cheaper pair of boots not using the Vibrams polyurethane soles. I still have a cheap pair of Merrell Moabs that have held up for ten years now, their only drawback is they are less comfortable for heavy loads and lack breathability.

Vulcanized rubber like the Goodyear welts are the most durable souls you can get on a hiking boot but the market for those has shrunk and you have to pay a lot to get them. They aren't as comfortable as polyurethane soles but are way more durable and won't delaminate. Mountain climbing boots from La Sportiva still use this material because of the durability.

 

[CoolGuy1990]

whats the best packable wide brimmed hat preferably felt