Are those distros compatible with systemd unit files so installing stuff that's outside of distro maintained repos tends to work? I'd like to try S6 but my current setup justworks™
The Linux Thread - The Autist's OS of Choice
- Thread starter tehpope
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I would never advise anyone to leave a setup that currently works for them for one that *might* work for them.
Unless you are, like me, an autist and have multiple cheapo side PCs set up just for tinkering with whatever distro you are currently hyperfixated on.
prollyanotherlurker
kiwifarms.net
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The only thing that has s6 that I know of is artix. At least that can be set up for you by default. With artix. Generally they have the service scripts available for you. But you need to make sure you install the networkmanager-s6 or dhcpcd-runit, or whatever package -whatever init. Otherwise you won't get the scripts. And the aur actually does tend to have alt-init packages available.
All this said. You would really need to look at what you need, and if those will be available. The things I've needed with alt inits generally are already included in the packages. And things that would be systemd timers generally get installed as system cron jobs. So you just need to make sure you set up and enable a crown implementation when you install the distro.
All that said. The only thing you really gain from not using systemd, is not using systemd.
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Bazzite's July 2025 update (archived) replaced KDE Discover with Bazaar (archived), a GNOME/GTK4 Flatpak app store that had its first pre-release two weeks ago.
To say the software is premature is an understatement: among many issues, there's no way to filter searches by category, no Permissions section, not even an Updates tab! But it has a Downloads chart
Some people (archived) are pissed at Ublue's "break it, update it!" method (they did it with Bluefin too), switching apps and uninstalling old ones they were used to. I'm pretty pissed too. If this keeps up, I'm switching distros. I don't need a wannabe Microsoft doing shit like this.
To say the software is premature is an understatement: among many issues, there's no way to filter searches by category, no Permissions section, not even an Updates tab! But it has a Downloads chart
Some people (archived) are pissed at Ublue's "break it, update it!" method (they did it with Bluefin too), switching apps and uninstalling old ones they were used to. I'm pretty pissed too. If this keeps up, I'm switching distros. I don't need a wannabe Microsoft doing shit like this.
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My understanding is that it was built on rpm-ostree (like a Fedora Atomic image) and is immutable, unlike a typical desktop OS.
The only real way to install packages on these is Flatpaks.
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It does with rpm-ostree, but it's very slow and they want to replace it with bootc. Flatpak is Bazzite's recommended method of installing apps.
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What's really the point of an immutable distro if you must maintain it like any other distro with only the added difficulty of dealing with a read only system? I personally don't get it.
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In fairness, that's the way all KDE file managers worked thanks to the beauty of kdeio since KDE 2 at least, if not back to KDE 1. Wouldn't be surprised if they managed to ruin it in future of course. Wouldn't it be better if systemd handled all access to files?
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Shh! Don't give Red Hat ideas!
Waiting for the day that a new systemd module called "systemd-linuxd" comes out and replaces the Linux kernel with systemd.
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It's a Linux desktop for niggers, mixed with Android in a half-assed way while also failing to be a ChromeOS equivalent.
Oh, and given the use of a cloud build system on github/gitlab, I can see this being another avenue for vendor lock-in. Splendid!
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Immutable distros are inherently vendor locked. SteamOS? Vendor Locked and hardware locked. Bazzite? Well whoever makes Bazzite. They seem terrible for personal use. However they seem brilliant for hardware vendors or IT departments in enterprise settings.
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He appeared at a Linux convention fairly recently. Surprisingly, they published a recording of the talk.
prollyanotherlurker
kiwifarms.net
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immutable/atomic distros are the thing I really don't see the point of. Of all the newer movements in the Linux world. At least not the way they are being pushed as some answer to the Linux for normies question.
It seems like they are just asking for wierd edge cases. That would be much harder to solve for people. At least if you are on mint have a problem and someone asks for help. Someone can likely give them a command to blindly type into the terminal and probably fix what's wrong. I feel like if something isn't working in one of these atomic distros people will be truly at the mercy of the maintainers. Unless you actually know what you are doing. And that defeats the purpose of it in the first place.
Not to mention, I see it as starting to take away what makes Linux great. The true freedom to do whatever you want.
Wayland it's newer the ecosystem isn't where as good as xorg's yet. But at least it is trying to be the answer to the problems left behind from xorg not really being made to work the way modern computing is done. Even if it has it's own problems. At least currently.
And systemd was actually an answer to a lot of problems, and shortcomings left behind by the init systems and service managers before it. Even if it has it's own shortcomings too.
I just don't see the real benefit of these immutable distros. Like I can for the other more controversial things in the Linux world. At least the way they are talked about by the people that shill them. I think is complete bullshit.
Nix is a bit different. And is covering a completely different side of things. Normal people shouldn't use nix obviously. But it has it's place.
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With Arch, the TUI installer already sets up seatd, dbus, and the XDG_DIR environment variables necessary to run Wayland. You can just install and run any Wayland environment without extra steps. Void however, and many other non-systemd distros, require tinkering with config files. Even if you're not using X, it's not difficult, but it can be annoying to do this repeatedly with multiple computers. Arch also doesn't separate dev packages. Separate packages can be annoying because they add an unnecessary extra step when building stuff locally. Void, for example, has strange names for packages like "MangoHud" (which is case sensitive) or "gst-plugins-bad1" (which doesn't make any sense. why have a 1?). Most distros don't do that, but having to track down the correct package names can be a pain since it is less intuitive. Additionally, systemd's service activation is much more straight forward than, say, runit or OpenRC, as it uses essentially the same command for running and starting services.
prollyanotherlurker
kiwifarms.net
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The dev package thing is a bit of a different criticism. Which I also find annoying for any of the distros that do that. Void alpine, and from what I remember Debian.
For setting up Wayland environment stuff. It really depends. It depends on the distro, what you are trying to run, and if you are using a display manager also. On how much is going to be set up out of the box by just installing the packages.
But really. I don't tend to use the archinstall script. Because I like having a bit more control than that gives. So in the end setting up arch for me, and setting up something like void, or any of the others. End up being essentially the same.
The commands being different. Idk that just doesn't really bother me. There are front ends for sv and some other stuff on void. I didn't really use them but they get rid of that. On open-rc I haven't even looked into it. Because rc-update rc-service and rc-status are pretty simple to use. Well there technically is rc-config that's a part of eselect on Gentoo. But it gives deprecation warnings when you use it. Not sure why they chose to deprecate it. Because it does solve that criticism for people that don't like them being separate commands.
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- Mar 17, 2019
Why the fuck would anything be compatible with systemd pollution?
The good people at Devuan have done sterling work maintaining packages that restore normal functionality to what Debian Linux has been broken into.
You don't need to install any system daemons that aren't covered by Devuan and its init scripts. Even if you did, I'm sure there are probably several tools for converting Lennart Poettring's .service and .timer cumrags into a normal init script if you must insist on installing other shit.
That's the gstreamer plugins from the 1.x series. Debian and Fedora also put a "1" or "1.0" in the package name. Arch's choice to just call it "gst-plugins-bad" is admittedly smarter because the "1" is there to distinguish the new series from the 0.x one, which most distros don't even package anymore.
Automatic install of dev packages can be added to any package manager with a one line shell function.
That's not a design choice I'd have made. But the search function is case-insensitive, so this isn't really an obstacle to discovery.
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Max Free
kiwifarms.net
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