The Linux Thread - The Autist's OS of Choice

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CheepMeds said:
Right now, even if the OS is free, I still see going into BIOS to enable virtualization and/or disabling secure boot a huge ask for most normies. Devices like these sound like a neat way of circumventing that barrier.
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There's an application, called Winbloat , that allows people to run Windows applications from a seamless VM on Linux. It is meant to be normie proof.
 
Frederica Bernkastel said:
There's an application, called Winbloat , that allows people to run Windows applications from a seamless VM on Linux. It is meant to be normie proof.
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I've heard of it. Haven't tried it myself. Probably won't, as wine currently is sufficient for my needs.

Sounds like a really good sales pitch, but from going through half of Mutas vid about it, the set-up does not look nomrie-proof at all to me.
But I appreciate their attempt to document and spoonfeed the instructions as much as they have.

btw
Does anybody have an educated opinion on if WINE has a realistic potential to one day refine it's functionality so well that almost all Windows apps could seamlessly work on Linux as if native?
Or are there some known hopelessly hard limitations? I mean this for just for productivity apps, because the kernel-level anti-cheat problem for gaming seems like one such hard limitation.
 
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prollyanotherlurker said:

Open source bros. Its so bad. :felted:

Also the editing on this video is really annoying.

I'm just thinking. What would people even be able to do to put some kind of pressure on Google. The US government. Thanks to an allegedly, in my opinion completely bought out corrupt judge. Has said. Even though they are a monopoly. They won't do anything about it. Just cuz they didn't feel like it.

I know Google works with the Linux foundation. I'm wondering if people could put some kind of pressure on the Linux foundation. Or some other areas that Google has their hands in.
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I've been reading conflicting information regarding this. Best case scenario is the new Appleification of Android will only affect programs that use Google Services and/or are distributed via the Play Store. If F-Droid stuff and app installs via ADB remain unmolested, you will still be able to get a somewhat functional phone.
 
GNU Abyss said:
I've been reading conflicting information regarding this. Best case scenario is the new Appleification of Android will only affect programs that use Google Services and/or are distributed via the Play Store. If F-Droid stuff and app installs via ADB remain unmolested, you will still be able to get a somewhat functional phone.
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Wondering if this can be extended to the execution of the application. You might've installed an app without a proper certificate, but will it let you run it? They could require phoning home to Jewgle HQ in order to check if the certificate is valid or not.
 
Frederica Bernkastel said:
There's an application, called Winbloat , that allows people to run Windows applications from a seamless VM on Linux. It is meant to be normie proof.
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That looks interesting, seems to be like Win apps but with a more streamlined and user friendly interface.
I found WinApps to work pretty well once you got it going, but the setup and access was very cludgy which is why I didn't really use it much. If WinBloat solves that then it will be an excellent solution, something like VmWare Fusion for Mac
 
Betonhaus said:
If WinBloat solves that then it will be an excellent solution, something like VmWare Fusion for Mac
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It's just another spin on what was already done with VirtualBox Seamless mode and VMware Player Unity mode many many years ago. You run an entire Windows VM in the background and use some clever tricks to pull individual windows out of the VM and render them within your host OS desktop environment. It's basically a VM with extra steps to not make it feel like a VM, for example I can fire up my Windows XP VM on VMware Workstation, enable Unity mode. and have XP native software visible on my Windows 10 desktop, including the Fischer-Price theme border.

The spin that WinBoat does on this concept is using KVM for near-bare metal performance, albeit it's yet to be "there" due to lack of GPU passthrough, which you will want for some of those applications where you'd want a full Windows environment for your software, such as the Adobe suite.
 
Slav Power said:
It's just another spin on what was already done with VirtualBox Seamless mode and VMware Player Unity mode many many years ago. You run an entire Windows VM in the background and use some clever tricks to pull individual windows out of the VM and render them within your host OS desktop environment. It's basically a VM with extra steps to not make it feel like a VM, for example I can fire up my Windows XP VM on VMware Workstation, enable Unity mode. and have XP native software visible on my Windows 10 desktop, including the Fischer-Price theme border.

The spin that WinBoat does on this concept is using KVM for near-bare metal performance, albeit it's yet to be "there" due to lack of GPU passthrough, which you will want for some of those applications where you'd want a full Windows environment for your software, such as the Adobe suite.
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The ideal setup is something like you get with Parallels on Mac, where you can have bidirectional file associations so you can just open Mac files in Windows applications and vice versa, it's nearly seamless especially in Coherence mode. Parallels goes so far as to automagically create fake .app files for all Windows applications in the start menu.

I'd hope this gets closer to that but the fact that it's using RDP to talk to the local VM makes me think it'd still be worse as remote desktop while impressive comes with a lot of caveats vs the kind of direct viewport into fully graphically accelerated windows you can get with Parallels.
 
Baraka Obama said:
The ideal setup is something like you get with Parallels on Mac, where you can have bidirectional file associations so you can just open Mac files in Windows applications and vice versa, it's nearly seamless especially in Coherence mode. Parallels goes so far as to automagically create fake .app files for all Windows applications in the start menu.

I'd hope this gets closer to that but the fact that it's using RDP to talk to the local VM makes me think it'd still be worse as remote desktop while impressive comes with a lot of caveats vs the kind of direct viewport into fully graphically accelerated windows you can get with Parallels.
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if I recall from Parallels when i used it way back when, it was rendering the entire desktop in the background but cropping to the windows, which is why you could see a bit of your Windows desktop background in the shadows. RDP RemoteApp lets you stream a single window directly, which should reduce the rendering workload. It seems to work fine, but if a program has a popup and you accidentally click out of it so the pop up is behind the program you can end up soft bricking that app until you close and reestablish the connection.
 
GNU Abyss said:
I've been reading conflicting information regarding this. Best case scenario is the new Appleification of Android will only affect programs that use Google Services and/or are distributed via the Play Store. If F-Droid stuff and app installs via ADB remain unmolested, you will still be able to get a somewhat functional phone.
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f-droid seems to think itll kill their platform and europeans seem to think its a dma violation
i think it's a lot of doom and gloom though i don't see why devs can't just comply with it unless they're trying to publish apps anonymously or are children with no money or from a sanctioned country (which is probably why this is happening)
 
wafflesies said:
i think it's a lot of doom and gloom though i don't see why devs can't just comply with it
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Yeah maybe if you're the most niggerish of goycattle or something you'd think this.

Ignoring that a good amount of devs do publish apps anonymously on f-droid its pretty clear that if this goes through any competent alternative app to popular services that can be obtained from outside the playstore will never get verified and anyone developing them will just be left with no actual platform to develop or provide their programs for, needing to pay with a credit card + providing an ID to google to develop apps for android phones is pretty retarded, it should go without saying why its a problem and why f-droid thinks its a problem, (one of the other reasons being that f-droid has its own issues with security and being friendly to work with for developers, so a change like this kills one of its actual concrete advantages over the play store for devs)
 
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Tremolo said:
Yeah maybe if you're the most niggerish of goycattle or something you'd think this.

Ignoring that a good amount of devs do publish apps anonymously on f-droid its pretty clear that if this goes through any competent alternative app to popular services that can be obtained from outside the playstore will never get verified and anyone developing them will just be left with no actual platform to develop or provide their programs for, needing to pay with a credit card + providing an ID to google to develop apps for android phones is pretty retarded, it should go without saying why its a problem and why f-droid thinks its a problem, (one of the other reasons being that f-droid has its own issues with security and being friendly to work with for developers, so a change like this kills one of its actual concrete advantages over the play store for devs)
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its also confimed not to be a problem on degoogled or sandboxed googled phones so this does seem like something that can be circumvented provided you aren't completely in the botnet
vendors also might have a way around this unless they all unanimously agree this is a good thing for some reason, in which case i could probably just switch to iphone for my next phone cause there won't be a reason to use android anymore
edit: well actually i guess i do use a lot of android specific apps which are on both the play store and f-droid so i'd still use android

Anyways I'm not coming at this from an ideological standpoint cause there's no reason to argue the ethics of the devil himself
Picrel is your "open platform"
Google-Play-Services-App-984x1024-2099501577.jpg
 
Even Microsoft doesn't force you to pay and dox yourself to create and distribute Windows software, the certificate racket they run is purely optional and plenty of GitHub projects don't sign their shit and everything's fine. But I guess it's okay for Google to do it because Google is not the one to be unconditionally hated.
 
Slav Power said:
Even Microsoft doesn't force you to pay and dox yourself to create and distribute Windows software, the certificate racket they run is purely optional and plenty of GitHub projects don't sign their shit and everything's fine. But I guess it's okay for Google to do it because Google is not the one to be unconditionally hated.
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yeah tbh i think people have this misconception that because android itself is licensed apache that it means google is benevolent compared to apple and how they treat ios/ipadOS
there's all sorts of proprietary shit that goes into a phone and each vendor has their own rom with their own proprietary shit built on top of android. if you use google services at all you're running a proprietary OS for all intents and purposes, it doesn't matter if your rom is mostly open source.
when microsoft does something shitty with windows my reaction isn't to cuck to microsoft and complain while using their software, it's to switch to an ethical alternative that isn't trying to fuck me in the ass
for phones, i'm just waiting on linux phones to become viable in the US on major carriers. that's really all i can do other than degoogle my phone
 
wafflesies said:
degoogled or sandboxed googled phones so this does seem like something that can be circumvented provided you aren't completely in the botnet
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I mean yes you could degoogle your phone OS, but the actual demographics for people who do that will be low unfortunately. F-droid (and other altstores) get a lot out of connecting to the greater google android market, main one being that it probably serves as some good justification for devs to use the platform, because there's a safe guarantee of outreach. If revanced or a similar service could only work on grapheneOS phones or something similar I have doubts that the devs would really continue working on it when their userbase gets cut down to 5% of what it used to be.
 
Tremolo said:
I mean yes you could degoogle your phone OS, but the actual demographics for people who do that will be low unfortunately. F-droid (and other altstores) get a lot out of connecting to the greater google android market, main one being that it probably serves as some good justification for devs to use the platform, because there's a safe guarantee of outreach. If revanced or a similar service could only work on grapheneOS phones or something similar I have doubts that the devs would really continue working on it when their userbase gets cut down to 5% of what it used to be.
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revanced i think is a bad argument because thats the kind of thing google is actually trying to shut down, people modifying official apks
vendors dont like it so that's a policy that they've probably been talking about for a long time
open source apps is a different story, i think you could make an argument that restricting who can push apps to the platform may be a dma violation but i'm not sure it's explicitly written, or that mandating people give their dox to google as a european citizen is a gdpr violation since they're publishing to a proprietary platform run by an american company
basically i don't personally see this going anywhere legally and it's just one of those things we'll have to deal with by using proprietary software
 
wafflesies said:
f-droid seems to think itll kill their platform and europeans seem to think its a dma violation
i think it's a lot of doom and gloom though i don't see why devs can't just comply with it unless they're trying to publish apps anonymously or are children with no money or from a sanctioned country (which is probably why this is happening)
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Part of the ACTUAL security promise provided by F-Droid, as opposed to Google crap, is that their build system produces reproducible builds of the software they distribute. I.e. they're not just distributing random APKs supposedly signed by an author that may or may not actually reflect the source that is available (at least in theory) for review. Instead, you're guaranteed that the builds you see come from the source you see.

Leaving any 'individual installation approval' crap aside, that doesn't work for F-Droid. Either you would have to drop the reproducible builds and just distribute shit signed by the original author- if they want to dox themselves- or Google would have to open the 'individual developer' option up to allow F-Droid to sign thousands of different apps.
 
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