The Metroid 2 Effect - Is this real or am I insane

Resident Evil's "muh tank controls and fixed camera"
At least the tank controls had a point. It's funny to see people demanding a "press left to go left" type control scheme, but when a game has that as an option, they complain the character runs around like a drunk headless chicken.

That's the only depiction of Samus that is remotely attractive that the fanbase seems to accept. Seriously, even though it is from a non-canon Nintendo Power comic that is over two decades old, the fans will not let go of it, and still hold it up as how she should be drawn, regardless of how much Nintendo has more or less locked down her current appearance.
You're mixing up two fanbases.

There are SJW Brianna Wu types that want Samus to be a buff trans character, then you have the other side (the side Nintendo is on) that want her to be attractive.
 
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And considering how autistic a lot videogame fandoms tend to be (Like Resident Evil's "muh tank controls and fixed camera" or Castlevania's "muh stiff jump") that's a hell of an acomplishment.



That's kind of funny, but that's exactly what Resident Evil REmake did, it added new areas, new weapons, new enemies, better graphics, some gameplay tweaks, it was a game that used the original as a base and used all the power the new generation consoles had to offer at the time to make the best game possible, and, despite how autistic the RE fandom can be, REmake seems to be considered the gold standard when it comes to remakes, an example of how a remake should be done, yet for some reason Metroid fans don't seem to like when a remake of an old game dares to improve or change anything, seriously when it comes to autistic fandoms, Metroid fans are kind of in their own league.
REmake is incredible, despite being a massive RE fan I've never bothered to give the original a full playthrough given how much REmake just shuts it down.

I dig the original's infamous cheesy intro, but for the actual game I honestly see no reason to really bother unless you played it back in the day and want to play it again purely for nostalgia, but outside of that REmake is such a massive improvement on every level that I just don't see why one should bother.

That said it's the only one like that, the RE2 Remake, while very good too, is not a total replacement for the original, the original RE2 is still worth playing as well.

They'd much rather have her look like this.
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I could go on, such as how they absolutely hate anything remotely anime or Japanese related in a new title, saying that only the West gets the series and anything anime or Japanese is a tumor that needs excising (which may imply that the fanbase hates Japan for "ruining the series" due to Other M) in order to appeal to the Western audience and Nintendo needs to stop trying to get Japanese audiences into it (which admittedly, is part of why Other M turned out the way it did), but you get the point.

And I'm not even gonna bother explaining how much they want Sakamoto dead or homeless, and will never again give him another shot at the franchise, all because of one game that he admittedly didn't do a good job on. Only his head on a platter will appease them.
The Metroid fandom is so tied in with "muh feminism" types, even way back in the day before it really became a movement people would still talk about how much "better" Samus was than most female video game characters, another example of that is Alyx in Half-Life 2.

Women and video games were long a sore subject for some people, it just didn't become a specific movement and crusade until Anita Sarkeesian came along.

Bombing that tube was a mind blowing moment exactly because you're not supposed to be able to destroy stuff like that. Removing that part would have made Super Metroid a lesser game.
It reminds me of when you use an imp to unlock a door in Symphony of the Night, games doing things you absolutely did not expect to work is cool.

The one I remember being hit the hardest with the effect you speak of is Majora's Mask, for years it was this black sheep of the Zelda family, with its confusing time travel mechanic and mired in its weird sidequests. It was not like Wind Waker, or Ocarina of Time, or Twilight Princess, which were more traditional.

I don't know when it was, probably the late 2000s, when it started becoming better viewed, and now we've got people proclaiming it to be actually better than Ocarina of Time.
What people seem to forget is how terrible Majora's Mask's dungeons are, like the one where you have to keep switching the flow of water back and forth and back and forth, they're tedious slogs that never managed to be fun, like a whole game of water dungeons from Ocarina of Time.

But where Majora's Mask excels is the overworld and all of the unique, weird details and art style that set it apart from the other games in the series, there's an almost Tim Burton vibe at times which is wonderfully different for Zelda and just a lot of cool things and moments in the overworld in general, it's the polar opposite of the dungeons.

I really, really wish I had played it as a kid, I was well aware of the game and wanted to, because I'm sure I would have loved it and been more forgiving of it's flaws, but the expansion pak requirement put the kibosh on that, I just didn't understand what that meant or how to get one, I didn't finally give it a full playthrough until 2017 and while I'm glad I finally did, expectations led to me being a bit disappointed because of the dungeons.

I just really don't get why the dungeons are so bad but everything else is so great though, but history arguably repeated itself with Breath of The Wild, incredible overworld but little if not entirely non-existent dungeons.

A Zelda with an overworld on the quality of MM or BOTW with great dungeons as well could be pretty much be the greatest game of all time, I'm already of the mind that Breath of The Wild might be the greatest game of all time, even with it's flaws.

I always thought Super Metroid was massively overrated. The two GBA games are way better. Not to mention AM2R.
It's definitely massively overrated considering stuff like EGM was always saying it was the greatest game of all time.

One factor for me is the map is to some degree just a bunch of random stuff slapped together, it lacks the logic the way a Castlevania Metroidvania works where you have the library, underground caves, clock tower etc, all arranged as if it's a cross section of a real castle, that to me is the cooler approach.

I mean Super Metroid works in it's own way too with the theme of exploring an alien planet where you don't know what the hell you're going to find, I just think for me Castlevania's gothic theme is more unique and interesting to me than Metroid's sci fi (though Metroid's take on sci fi is very unique and not generic at all) but this is all a matter of personal taste of course.

Super Metroid is definitely still great too and I can also see why it would have been especially mind blowing in 1994, little things like it raining on the surface at the start of the game but later stopping, that right there is genius, making the setting feel more like a real place and less like a "game level" which is something so few other games were doing at the time, just by virtue of the fact that it was a place you explored and traversed back and forth instead of a linear set of levels where you just always push right is very forward thinking for the time.

At least the tank controls had a point. It's funny to see people demanding a "press left to go left" type control scheme, but when a game has that as an option, they complain the character runs around like a drunk headless chicken.
Complaining about tank controls is one of the most overrated criticisms in gaming, there's just something satisfying as hell about the combination of tank controls and fixed camera angles to me, if people just took a little bit of time to get used to them they'd see why it works, once you instinctively get used to it it allows you to just soak up the atmosphere in a way that's better than a different set of controls would be.
 
You're mixing up two fanbases.

There are SJW Brianna Wu types that want Samus to be a buff trans character, then you have the other side (the side Nintendo is on) that want her to be attractive.
Man, I hope you're right. Maybe it's just me judging them based on the Metroid subreddit, but given how vocal they are about her appearance (it must be buff and in no way conventionally attractive, lest it demeans her character), I worry about how she is gonna be portrayed in, say, Prime 4. Especially given how Retro Studios is based in Austin, Texas, and this is who is apparently the main writer of the game.

They fanbase just cannot accept Samus as being anything other than a walking pound of muscle, as they see her current appearance as "unrealistic" due to her wearing the armor. Like, they don't believe she could use it without looking like a body builder.
 
What are some games you'd like to see get the Metroid 2 effect? For me it's The Order 1886 and Batman: Arkham Knight, both from 2015 and both are games that while flawed I feel people were way too dismissive of.

For one thing they're among the very last AAA games made pre-Woke, The Order is mildly Woke, but very mildly, it's not as Woke as Uncharted 4 from a year later, to say nothing of The Last of Us 2 or even God of War 2018 (a game I still like, but it's very Woke)

The only thing that's even vaguely Woke about Arkham Knight is they covered up Ivy's butt, other than that it's not Woke at all, it's maybe the most recent and least Woke AAA game of them all, save for maybe Doom 2016 (which I still need to play the entirety of)

I really hope especially in the case of The Order people realize how cool a game it actually is.

Man, I hope you're right. Maybe it's just me judging them based on the Metroid subreddit, but given how vocal they are about her appearance (it must be buff and in no way conventionally attractive, lest it demeans her character), I worry about how she is gonna be portrayed in, say, Prime 4. Especially given how Retro Studios is based in Austin, Texas, and this is who is apparently the main writer of the game.
Oh no, Metroid Prime 4 is going to be Woke?

They fanbase just cannot accept Samus as being anything other than a walking pound of muscle, as they see her current appearance as "unrealistic" due to her wearing the armor. Like, they don't believe she could use it without looking like a body builder.
It's science fiction, that's like saying Tony Stark is not buff enough to use the Iron Man armor, the suit itself does the work, these people are such absolute fucking morons.

What's not to like about a hot, skinny babe strapping herself into a suit that makes her muscled out? That's the essence of the character from the very beginning, muscled out warrior in the armor, hot babe outside of it, these people call themselves fans and yet hate the very essence of the character and what makes her cool?
 
It's science fiction, that's like saying Tony Stark is not buff enough to use the Iron Man armor, the suit itself does the work, these people are such absolute fucking morons.

What's not to like about a hot, skinny babe strapping herself into a suit that makes her muscled out? That's the essence of the character from the very beginning, muscled out warrior in the armor, hot babe outside of it, these people call themselves fans and yet hate the very essence of the character and what makes her cool?
I know. I keep trying to say that, but the fans (at least on the Metroid subreddit) still insist that it must be like that. Again, the notion that she could look attractive and still kick butt is inconceivable to them.

I guess the whole idea that she was raised by bird people to be a warrior, and is now a bounty hunter of few words and goes through many traumatic events makes them think that she would not give a rip about how attractive she looks outside the armor. Like, she must be some sort of grizzled, tough, masculine, unfeeling, and unfeminine tank in order for them to take her seriously as someone who could actually do all that and be able to wield the admittedly imposing armor.

It's one of the many reasons they hate how Other M and the Smash titles pre-Ultimate chose to design her out-of-suit appearance. Admittedly, Other M is a pretty mediocre game, but they take it way too far in the other direction.
 
I know. I keep trying to say that, but the fans (at least on the Metroid subreddit) still insist that it must be like that. Again, the notion that she could look attractive and still kick butt is inconceivable to them.

I guess the whole idea that she was raised by bird people to be a warrior, and is now a bounty hunter of few words and goes through many traumatic events makes them think that she would not give a rip about how attractive she looks outside the armor. Like, she must be some sort of grizzled, tough, masculine, unfeeling, and unfeminine tank in order for them to take her seriously as someone who could actually do all that and be able to wield the admittedly imposing armor.

It's one of the many reasons they hate how Other M and the Smash titles pre-Ultimate chose to design her out-of-suit appearance. Admittedly, Other M is a pretty mediocre game, but they take it way too far in the other direction.
It's so ironically sexist, they're saying that they can't take a woman seriously if she's attractive, ie "feminine", they associate feminine with stupidity and incompetence, the biggest fucking misogynists in today's society are so called "feminists"

Fuck all that shit, absolutely fuck that shit, a woman can be beautiful and still be strong, brave and intelligent, beauty is power, not weakness, Samus being beautiful only makes her a more powerful character, not less, they're the sexists if they think the opposite.

These fucking absolute scumbags who have hijacked our culture just drives me fucking nuts, why are people such idiotic assholes and WHY haven't they been told to fuck off by everyone already?

I mean seriously, how are we not calling out that shit for the sexism and misogyny that it is? When they use those words it's pure projection, just garbage fucking people on every level who have made the world a worse place.
 
Again, the fans (at least on the Metroid subreddit) claim to all be doing this in the name of "realism". Other M really did a number on their mental health.
 
The Metroid fandom is so tied in with "muh feminism" types, even way back in the day before it really became a movement people would still talk about how much "better" Samus was than most female video game characters, another example of that is Alyx in Half-Life 2.
It did, but back then it was somewhat justified. As has been pointed out either here, or in other threads, Other M took a strong female character and made her into a useless waif that needed a mans approval. It was complete character assassination.

As for Half-Life 2, the fanbase for Half-Life games (or Valve games in general) is insane. You have crazy or deliberately offensive modes like Crack Life and Trump Quest and they're applauded, but you hide a dildo prop in Alyx's room or have an anime reference in your mod and the fanbase will flip out.
 
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It did, but back then it was somewhat justified. As has been pointed out either here, or in other threads, Other M took a strong female character and made her into a useless waif that needed a mans approval. It was complete character assassination.
Too bad that the fanbase is now overcorrecting to the extreme, going to the complete opposite end of the spectrum regarding Samus's character.

I also blame a lot of Other M's problems with how it portrayed Samus on the shoddy translation (which the game director tried to do himself, despite not speaking English well). This video explains it better than I can.


Also, here's a few more Reddit posts regarding Samus's appearance in response to me asking the question (yeah I downvoted some of them. Honestly, I am ashamed of several of my Reddit posts in several of the subreddits regarding my favorite shows and the like, as some of the owns I posted are quite autistic, to say the least).

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This next one is especially telling.
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I gave some counter arguments
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Response
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One last time.
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Yes, I know I am getting really autistic with all these posts and this could be seen as power leveling. But dang it, I have been letting this stew in my head for far too long, and I really wanted to let this out.

On the note of the series, I also noted how much the fanbase seems to detest anime aesthetics being placed in it, along with how they want only Western dev teams on it as well.
 
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one of my biggest gripes about Metroid "lore" is the way Samus' suit works post-Other M (or arguably post-Zero Mission), Like I can accept a suit can disappear and reappear at will, but it's stated somewhere that Samus has to continuously concentrate on the suit to maintain it. This is supposed to explain why Samus can't use the suit when she's worried/scared.

I don't know about you, but when I think about my blinking/breathing, so they become manually-controlled, that's my day ruined. I don't know how Samus is supposed to concentrate on fighting enemies while knowing the only thing protecting her from the hostile environment is her suit and concentrate on maintaining said suit at the same time.

It just bugs me that the otherwise supremely intelligent Chozo would design a suit that way. Fusion's intro handled the suit much better IMO.
 
I just realized that it is not a bad idea to separate Metroid fans from the Metroid fandom in this thread. A fandom will always be incredibly creepy and insane.
 
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It did, but back then it was somewhat justified.
Not really though, all they mostly did back in the day was make female characters look sexy, big fucking whoop, the actual instances of sexism in games were far rarer than they would have you believe and they almost always were in games that were shitty anyway that no one wanted to play anyway like The Guy Game.

I'm just not one of those people that thinks "sexy is sexist"

As has been pointed out either here, or in other threads, Other M took a strong female character and made her into a useless waif that needed a mans approval. It was complete character assassination.
In the case of Other M maybe the anger was justified, but it was anger over the story, not how she looked, which is what it's evolved into these days.

As for Half-Life 2, the fanbase for Half-Life games (or Valve games in general) is insane. You have crazy or deliberately offensive modes like Crack Life and Trump Quest and they're applauded, but you hide a dildo prop in Alyx's room or have an anime reference in your mod and the fanbase will flip out.
Indeed, Valve, as much as I love them, is basically ground zero for the type of fan we hate today and the style of making games that we hate today.

Basically what Half-Life 2 tried to do a video game in the "real world", taking a very video game plot and set up (blasting aliens) and doing it in a way that felt very realistic and grounded in a way no other games were doing and in a way that felt totally mind blowing at the time.

The trouble is it set a bad tone that almost 20 years later has evolved into a "no fun allowed" approach where fantasy fun and escapism is no longer allowed because it's not "realistic" enough, "realism" is always an SJW's complaint about why we can't have fun anymore like "oof, her back" and "where are her organs!?" or "that armor is not practical!" and so on and so forth, it's a war on escapism and fantasy, a desire to bring everything down to a boring, banal reality.

We start off with Alyx Vance and while she wasn't a sex object, she was still attractive, now it's evolved into making female characters flat out ugly, that's a perfect example of the devolution games have been on.
 
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one of my biggest gripes about Metroid "lore" is the way Samus' suit works post-Other M (or arguably post-Zero Mission), Like I can accept a suit can disappear and reappear at will, but it's stated somewhere that Samus has to continuously concentrate on the suit to maintain it. This is supposed to explain why Samus can't use the suit when she's worried/scared.

I don't know about you, but when I think about my blinking/breathing, so they become manually-controlled, that's my day ruined. I don't know how Samus is supposed to concentrate on fighting enemies while knowing the only thing protecting her from the hostile environment is her suit and concentrate on maintaining said suit at the same time.

It just bugs me that the otherwise supremely intelligent Chozo would design a suit that way. Fusion's intro handled the suit much better IMO.
That sound stupid as fuck.

Wow am I glad I never even gave Other M a chance.
 
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That sound stupid as fuck.

Wow am I glad I never even gave Other M a chance.
I distictly remember that almost all lines in the game are borderline retarded to the point where you can make a 4 hour long video pointing everything out in how it countradicts the lore or is all round stupid.

It does not try to folow lore but tries to be the lore.
 
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Basically what Half-Life 2 tried to do a video game in the "real world", taking a very video game plot and set up (blasting aliens) and doing it in a way that felt very realistic and grounded in a way no other games were doing and in a way that felt totally mind blowing at the time.
What did Half-Life 2 do that Half-Life 1 didn't already do except for physics gimmicks?
 
I think LightDragonman1 just went too deep down the rabbit hole and has to pull it back from a place that is clearly just pissing him off.
Sorry, I just had to vent out my frustrations there. Maybe the best thing for me to do is to stop visiting the Metroid subreddit.

I distictly remember that almost all lines in the game are borderline retarded to the point where you can make a 4 hour long video pointing everything out in how it countradicts the lore or is all round stupid.

It does not try to folow lore but tries to be the lore.
Once again, I strongly recommend you check out Lexicon Lookout's video on Other M that I posted. As it turns out, the original Japanese version, while still not exactly good per se, was a lot less stupid and contradictory to both Samus's character and the overall series lore. It's just that a TON of stuff was lost in translation, due to the director, despite not speaking English well, deciding to do it all himself.
 
Sorry, I just had to vent out my frustrations there. Maybe the best thing for me to do is to stop visiting the Metroid subreddit.

As someone that enjoys Metroid games but doesn't follow the fandom directly, I'd recommend this.

I recommend this in general TBQH. You should enjoy a property for what it is, not for the community that surrounds it because they'll inevitably end up being mostly retarded. It's just way less aggravating.
 
What did Half-Life 2 do that Half-Life 1 didn't already do except for physics gimmicks?
Generally a more grounded art style and tone than the first game, to say nothing of other shooters like Halo or Doom.

Like I said, the vibe Half-Life 2 was going for was video game stuff happening in the "real world" and this set a tone that developers still sometimes follow, for a more recent example look at Bioware's Anthem.

For an example of the opposite of what I'm talking about look at Gears of War, there's games that are unapologetically "video game" and then there's games that pretentiously go for a "grounded" tone, which these days usually just translates to bland and boring.
 
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Sorry, I just had to vent out my frustrations there. Maybe the best thing for me to do is to stop visiting the Metroid subreddit.


Once again, I strongly recommend you check out Lexicon Lookout's video on Other M that I posted. As it turns out, the original Japanese version, while still not exactly good per se, was a lot less stupid and contradictory to both Samus's character and the overall series lore. It's just that a TON of stuff was lost in translation, due to the director, despite not speaking English well, deciding to do it all himself.
Nah man its all good. I just don't want you to give up good games like AM2R /Metroid in general just cause of stupid people ruining something you can easily avoid. I honestly want more heartful post in the Games section of Kiwifarms since it would be great to grow this subsection cause it one of the few places on the net where if someone takes it too far you can tell them they talk like a fag and their shit is all retarded.
 
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