Western Animation - Discuss American, Canadian, and European cartoons here (or just bitch about wokeshit, I guess)

[Steamboat_Bill]

Oh please. That bitch works on TTG. As if she could appreciate the fact she dodged a bullet. She has a freaking bullseye on her forehead when it comes to voiceacting.
Here is a suggestion for new animated shows: Drop the freaking tumblr-like artstyle, stop being "progressive" (I would appreciate a cartoon as racist as 1940s Warner Bros by now more than Steven Universe), rehire whoever worked on Pinky and the Brain and shows like that and you get at least in the right direction.

It'll be worse. Much, much worse.

Frankly, I'd agree with that. We need some more witty, clever, satirical stuff in the vein of the great cartoons of the last two decades. Where is this generation's Rocko or Ren and Stimpy? Has there been a show for adults as good as Space Ghost Coast to Coast or The Critic?

I don't necessarily have a problem with modern cartoons - if only that they're kinda overrated; is it really a new renaissance in animation or are we just still in the age started by the 90s? - but we need some variety.

 

[UglyOldJafar]

I don't necessarily have a problem with modern cartoons - if only that they're kinda overrated; is it really a new renaissance in animation or are we just still in the age started by the 90s? - but we need some variety.

I say there are a couple of exeptional ones (Dan vs., Legend of Korra, the Thundercats remake and Gravity Falls come to mind) as shows that have tried to be more original with their content while also offering some overarching storyarc, but I think the biggest difference between cartoons nowadays and some back then is whatI would consider a lack of popculture satire. The Steven Spielberg stuff back then and even some from Disney had some pretty decent jokes to offer on the expense of 90s popculture and entertainment industry. This is surprisingly missing nowadays. Also, the ratio of really good shows was higher back then than it is nowadays. Lastly, as you mentioned, a lot of stuff is just overrated. On the risk of getting an autism rating now, just look at MLP. I would say that it is actually "good" compared with previous incarnation and if I had a daughter, I would have no problem with her liking the show. If anything, it is just still girly, but less "infantile". Still, the holy grail of animation as some people called it back in 2011? No. Just no. Yet shows like that and actually all reboots, gets the most praise if you ask me. Why? Just because the silliness of the 80s has been replaced by the silliness of modern day animation?

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

I say there are a couple of exeptional ones (Dan vs., Legend of Korra, the Thundercats remake and Gravity Falls come to mind) as shows that have tried to be more original with their content while also offering some overarching storyarc, but I think the biggest difference between cartoons nowadays and some back then is whatI would consider a lack of popculture satire. The Steven Spielberg stuff back then and even some from Disney had some pretty decent jokes to offer on the expense of 90s popculture and entertainment industry. This is surprisingly missing nowadays. Also, the ratio of really good shows was higher back then than it is nowadays. Lastly, as you mentioned, a lot of stuff is just overrated. On the risk of getting an autism rating now, just look at MLP. I would say that it is actually "good" compared with previous incarnation and if I had a daughter, I would have no problem with her liking the show. If anything, it is just still girly, but less "infantile". Still, the holy grail of animation as some people called it back in 2011? No. Just no. Yet shows like that and actually all reboots, gets the most praise if you ask me. Why? Just because the silliness of the 80s has been replaced by the silliness of modern day animation?

There were more outlets back then. Saturday morning hadn't entered its long, Pokemon-influenced heat death...

More shows = more good shows. All there is now are the cable networks, ergo, less good shows.

 

[Trilby]

We're out of ideas as a nation.

And in the case of Danger Mouse, that's a UK thing, I'm sure that was well worth the years laying dormant as an IP.

You know how Tara Strong and her fellow original PPG voices aren't happy that they weren't even considered for the new show? Frankly, as soon as that one airs they're going to be saying "Dodged a bullet there..."

There were more outlets back then. Saturday morning hadn't entered its long, Pokemon-influenced heat death...

More shows = more good shows. All there is now are the cable networks, ergo, less good shows.

True. It was certainly very different when you had less avenues to explore and everything tend to be of expected quality to air.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

Back to animation, though...

One of Rankin-Bass's best works is Mad Monster Party? - Though it doesn't have the cultural cachet that their Christmas specials do, which is a shame, because it is a fun, fun piece of cinema.

(It admittedly has its own cult following. The only other Rankin-Bass movie release with a fanbase is The Last Unicorn. And maybe their attempt at animating Tolkien.)

There's a script by Harvey Kurtzman, character designs by Jack Davis, and the voice talents of Boris Karloff and Phyllis Diller - how could you not love it?

 

[AnOminous]

Oh please. That bitch works on TTG. As if she could appreciate the fact she dodged a bullet. She has a freaking bullseye on her forehead when it comes to voiceacting.

It's not like Tara Strong has some shortage of paying gigs.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

 

[Abethedemon]

So I'm currently watching Gravity Falls.
Aside from the spergy fanbase, I quite like it. They get away with a lot of stuff. There's also a lot of interesting fantasy elements.
"I made this in my blood, sweat, tears and other fluids."

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

View attachment 61563

I honestly don't know what to say about this.

At least Tartakovsky is involved, that much I can say.

 

[Trilby]

So I'm currently watching Gravity Falls.
Aside from the spergy fanbase, I quite like it. They get away with a lot of stuff. There's also a lot of interesting fantasy elements.
"I made this in my blood, sweat, tears and other fluids."

Also one of the few shows to know when to quit while ahead.

 

[The Knife's Husbando]

View attachment 61563

Just finished reading the graphic novels after the series. SO. HYPED. Jack is going to lead a fucking revolution against Aku. All in, and th' devil take th' hindmost.

Godspeed, you crazy Bastard. Godspeed.

 

[Tempest]

Star Wars: The Clone Wars was very good

 

[Pickle Inspector]

Is it me or has rebooting tv shows of the past become pretty much one of the main objectives in the last five years?
I am not necessarily complaining about it and I am aware that there have been reboots of old cartoons/new incarnations also prior to 2010 and so on. Like 4Kids TMNT show.
But looking over it, there have been more reboots of merchandise driven licences and general cartoons than before.
TMNT, MLP, Thundercats, Carebears and Transformers come to mind when it comes to merchandise driven stuff and general cartoons are represented by the Looney Tunes Show, the new Mickey Mouse shorts, a supposed Powerpuff Girl reboot, a failed Xiaolin Showdown show and so on. Even the british seem now to get on it.

I just wonder, why? I get it for merchandise driven stuff like TMNT and Transformers, but Danger Mouse of all things?

They did the same thing with The Clangers which might be even odder of a franchise to reboot (A stop motion show from the 70's) but I guess both shows have some potential for nostalgia merchandise in the UK even though I don't think they're that well known elsewhere.

Spoiler: The Clangers

 

[Trilby]

Back to animation, though...

One of Rankin-Bass's best works is Mad Monster Party? - Though it doesn't have the cultural cachet that their Christmas specials do, which is a shame, because it is a fun, fun piece of cinema.

(It admittedly has its own cult following. The only other Rankin-Bass movie release with a fanbase is The Last Unicorn. And maybe their attempt at animating Tolkien.)

There's a script by Harvey Kurtzman, character designs by Jack Davis, and the voice talents of Boris Karloff and Phyllis Diller - how could you not love it?

Perfect crew, really. When she was alive, my mom thought Harvey Kurtzman was related to me since he shared her maiden name. I suppose I'll never know, but it was still fun to notice that through an issue of Comics Scene she had to bring to my attention.

They did the same thing with The Clangers which might be even odder of a franchise to reboot (A stop motion show from the 70's) but I guess both shows have some potential for nostalgia merchandise in the UK even though I don't think they're that well known elsewhere.

Spoiler: The Clangers

They did air "The Clangers" some 30+ years ago on a program Nickelodeon aired called "Pinwheel" (where I saw another stop-motion series produced by the same group called "Bagpuss" about a stuffed cat who comes to live with these other toys in a shop). I suppose though since it was on cable TV at a time when hardly anyone had it, it probably didn't leave much of a dent at all outside of those like me who saw it.

The only episode of Clangers that comes to my mind is how they got their tablecloth we see in some episodes. The tablecloth itself was a flag that was placed on their little planet by what appears to be a joint American-Soviet space mission from earth (because I guess that would eventually happen).

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

Perfect crew, really. When she was alive, my mom thought Harvey Kurtzman was related to me since he shared her maiden name. I suppose I'll never know, but it was still fun to notice that through an issue of Comics Scene she had to bring to my attention.

It's one of the best things ever done with stop-motion, period. I like it even more, to an extent, than the great Rankin-Bass Christmas specials - sure, I think they're great, but they weren't full movies, were they?

Speaking of Rankin-Bass, though, probably the best non-stop-motion work they did is, as I mentioned earlier, The Last Unicorn.

I recently saw it on Netflix, and the animation looks absolutely great in that high resolution. It pops out at you. I could rant about how this really is one of the best animated films ever made, one that puts most of them to shame, but I'm pretty sure thousands of others have already done so anyway.

 

[Trilby]

It's one of the best things ever done with stop-motion, period. I like it even more, to an extent, than the great Rankin-Bass Christmas specials - sure, I think they're great, but they weren't full movies, were they?

Speaking of Rankin-Bass, though, probably the best non-stop-motion work they did is, as I mentioned earlier, The Last Unicorn.

No arguments there (saw it when I was 6)!

I recently saw it on Netflix, and the animation looks absolutely great in that high resolution. It pops out at you. I could rant about how this really is one of the best animated films ever made, one that puts most of them to shame, but I'm pretty sure thousands of others have already done so anyway.

I'm sure five times over!

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

It's hard to believe that there was a time in the 70s and early 80s when unconventional animated films like this could get made.

The Last Unicorn, for example, is pretty sophisticated for its time and genre, deals with subjects and themes rarely brought up in kids' films, and is pretty bittersweet at that. Shinbone Alley, mentioned earlier in this thread, was advertised as "Sophisticated enough for kids and simple enough for adults," and I'm not certain it can fit into either category well enough. It maybe only appeals to Don Marquis fans.

And aside from that, you had the adult animated film explosion as typified by Ralph Bakshi - whose works ran the gamut from sex comedies to fantasy adventures to even more realistic stuff... And I'm sure I'm missing something, though that may be just about it.

Then after a brief spell where most cinematic animation was based off merchandise-driven TV shows along came the 90s; barely any adult animated films, and the stuff for kids was more often than not trying to rip off Disney and the godforsaken formula that every Disney film in those days had... Believe me when I say Disney was never the same after Walt died.

 

[Trilby]

Then after a brief spell where most cinematic animation was based off merchandise-driven TV shows along came the 90s; barely any adult animated films, and the stuff for kids was more often than not trying to rip off Disney and the godforsaken formula that every Disney film in those days had... Believe me when I say Disney was never the same after Walt died.

We didn't ask for another "What I Want" song!

The 90's was an odd time for that.

But yeah, not the same without Walt.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

We didn't ask for another "What I Want" song!

The 90's was an odd time for that.

But yeah, not the same without Walt.

At least the "What I Want" songs - and, to be honest, many of the other songs - in Disney's 90s stuff, formulaic as they generally were, were competently written and didn't make you want to shoot a nail gun at your head.

Take, for example, this Razzie-winning piece of music:

And just to wash your ears out, here is something more competent:

Just about the last film Disney made I would ever call a full-on great film was The Jungle Book, which was - incidentally - the last film with Walt involved. And my enjoyment of the film is mainly due to Phil Harris and Louis Prima's performances in the film, and the great musical numbers...

 

[Trilby]

At least the "What I Want" songs - and, to be honest, many of the other songs - in Disney's 90s stuff, formulaic as they generally were, were competently written and didn't make you want to shoot a nail gun at your head.

Take, for example, this Razzie-winning piece of music:

And just to wash your ears out, here is something more competent:

Just about the last film Disney made I would ever call a full-on great film was The Jungle Book, which was - incidentally - the last film with Walt involved. And my enjoyment of the film is mainly due to Phil Harris and Louis Prima's performances in the film, and the great musical numbers...

Good examples (though with The Jungle Book, I wish they did more with the wolves but that was a minor quibble).