# IAAF rules against Caster Semenya; rules she'll require hormone treat to compete against women on the international stage



## TerribleIdeas™ (May 1, 2019)

TL;DR - The IAAF has ruled that the hyperandrogenism experienced by Semenya is a competitive advantage, and she'll have to compete without the excess testosterone in her system. The condition is allegedly such a competitive benefit that the top 2 women's runners in the 800m in the world have it.  Naturally, anyone that disagrees is being reed at on social media, because science doesn't matter, but only for this particular mannish black dyke.

 



Spoiler: CNN Article, Screencap, archive








CNN article here  - https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/01/sport/caster-semenya-cas-hearing-spt-intl/index.html
Archive here - http://archive.md/FPzH1





Spoiler: CBC article, screencap, archive








CBC article here - https://www.cbc.ca/sports/olympics/trackandfield/caster-semenya-appeal-1.5117936?adobe_mc=TS=1556716542|MCAID=2BB8FAA9051D392C-6000190CE0002E25&appname=news-ios-app&udid=8c1471d0-f29e-46ec-8294-2e16d9a9d0cb&webview=true
Archive here - http://archive.fo/4rjt4





Spoiler: Original IAAF complaint, 2009








Original IAAF decision here - https://www.iaaf.org/news/news/statement-on-caster-semenya  (This apparently all started in 2009)
Archive here - http://archive.fo/cOm2I





Spoiler: 2018 notice of CAS request for arbitration







2018 Court of Arbitration for Sport notice of arbitration request by Caster Semenya against IAAF - https://www.iaaf.org/news/iaaf-news/iaaf-statement-cas-arbitration-of-new-female
Archive here - http://archive.md/zqqKw





Spoiler: Reaction of the woke twitterati



Here's the twitter salt, which, as can be expected, if absolutely full of angry people crying about racism, sexism, anti-LGBT bigotry because Caster is a lesbian, and everything other fucking excuse you can imagine -
https://twitter.com/search?q="Caster Semenya"&src=tren&data_id=tweet:1123556983372767234

I'm enjoying how many troons, feminists, communists and probably male-feminist-deviant-troon-asspatters are making reeee noises, not gonna lie.


----------



## Haramburger (May 1, 2019)

Bruh...



so demure and ladylike...


----------



## Salubrious (May 1, 2019)

So according to Twitter, this ruling is just because white women hate successful black women like Caster and Serena Williams, and it's unfair because Michael Phelps also has biological advantages.


----------



## sperginity (May 1, 2019)

Seen a 50/50 split in the butthurt on twitter. Half of it is black twitter saying "white tears" cost this brave black woman her natural testosterone. The other black women who raced caster don't count. The other half is troon twitter arguing that men's testosterone levels are "irrelevant" to athletic performance. They can't explain why testosterone is the main performance enhancing drug that athletes use.


----------



## Ginger Piglet (May 1, 2019)

Of course it's a competitive advantage. We don't let athletes roid themselves up before competition and since steroids generally work by boosting one's testosterone levels, the principle is the same.


----------



## EasyPeasy (May 1, 2019)

Well no one can ever say she doesn't have the _balls _to take the IAAF to court...


----------



## KE 521 (May 1, 2019)

Haramburger said:


> Bruh...
> View attachment 743174
> so demure and ladylike...
> View attachment 743177


That’s a man, baby!


----------



## Hatoful Dandy (May 1, 2019)

Salubrious said:


> So according to Twitter, this ruling is just because white women hate successful black women like Caster and Serena Williams, and it's unfair because Michael Phelps also has biological advantages.


Didn't Serena Williams famously hide in a panic room when someone came to her place to test her and she claimed anxiety?


----------



## RG 448 (May 1, 2019)

Correct me if I’m wrong, but she’s a cis woman, right?  And her high testosterone is happening all on its own?  Then it’s basically tantamount to saying she’s too gifted to compete, which is stupid.  It’s like saying Michael Jordan should have cut off one of his legs to make things more fair.


----------



## TerribleIdeas™ (May 1, 2019)

Haramburger said:


> Bruh...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The least feminine of her competitors has noticeable boobs.


----------



## Eryngium (May 1, 2019)

Hatoful Dandy said:


> Didn't Serena Williams famously hide in a panic room when someone came to her place to test her and she claimed anxiety?


https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...3fff17f0689_story.html?utm_term=.2bf1c618c356
yeah there were so many pity-pieces about it too, so many people couldn't get it through their fucking skull that if you run away from a drug test (multiple time) they are going to have to come back and try to make you take it again.


----------



## CWCissey (May 1, 2019)

Finally! A chance to use this!





How long has this been going on now? 4 years? And they've finally admitted that Semenya has an unfair advantage due to a medical condition.


----------



## TerribleIdeas™ (May 1, 2019)

Eryngium said:


> https://www.washingtonpost.com/spor...3fff17f0689_story.html?utm_term=.2bf1c618c356
> yeah there were so many pity-pieces about it too, so many people couldn't get it through their fucking skull that if you run away from a drug test (multiple time) they are going to have to come back and try to make you take it again.



If I refuse a drug test at work, or a breathalyzer at a roadside stop?
Fired for the former.
Vehicle seized and impounded, and license suspended for the latter.

She does it, and she gets asspats.


----------



## gracious bobbly bits (May 1, 2019)

Testaclese Maximus said:


> Correct me if I’m wrong, but she’s a cis woman, right?  And her high testosterone is happening all on its own?  Then it’s basically tantamount to saying she’s too gifted to compete, which is stupid.  It’s like saying Michael Jordan should have cut off one of his legs to make things more fair.



Various leaks, rumors, newspaper reports have suggested that  Semenya is not a cis woman, in fact that  Semenya is a male with an intersex disorder which means Semenya didn't grow a penis and has undescended (internal) testicles.

The testicles would give Semenya an extraordinarily high level of testosterone, far higher than any real woman, which confers a massive athletic advantage.


----------



## GrungyLawnChlorinate (May 1, 2019)

*Pidgin boo:*








						Caster Semenya say IAAF don dey target her since
					

Di athlete lose her case for di Court of Arbitration for Sport to stop IAAF wey wan put limit on testosterone level for female runners bodi.




					www.bbc.com
				





> South African runner Caster Semenya say di decision of di Court of Arbitration for Sports no go hold her back. Di court rule on Wednesday say she gatz take medicine to reduce di amount of man blood wey dey her bodi, if she wan follow women run.
> 
> Semenya say pipo wey dey run athletics don dey target her since.
> 
> ...


----------



## Dropped Burner (May 1, 2019)

If a naturally high-T woman is barred from competing until she regulates her hormones, would a low-T man be allowed to compete if his hormone profile matched the average female runner? If all they care about is the level of hormones and not the gender of the competitor, why not test everyone's hormones and divide up the sports that way?

I love that they've opened this can of worms, it adds so much drama to an issue I couldn't care less about. Sports doping is great and I hope it keeps getting more advanced. Humans pushing past their physical limits through science is cool, even if it's primarily limited to niggers running around a sports field right now.


----------



## Hatoful Dandy (May 1, 2019)

So does this mean they can throw the troons out when their performances are TOO good?


----------



## ZB 584 (May 1, 2019)

The twitter woke folk can't seem to decide which kind of discrimination to file this under. Is it transphobia?




Well Semenya isn't a tranny:


Ok, is it racism then?



Well, Usain Bolt is black, so this isn't an act of racism by the IAAF:



Please make up your sjw hivemind on this issue. Find the right oppression narrative:



Oh nevermind, it's several kinds of discrimination. Because of course it is. On a lighter note, there's this:




Top kek


----------



## Smaug's Smokey Hole (May 1, 2019)

I know I have posted this many times before, but this was from the olympics in 2012(I'm pretty sure). Caster and Francine mentioned above, there's also a third lady on the podium, Margaret I think? It's odd that this condition of producing tons of testosterone is so rare but those from that tiny group that goes into sports dominate women in athletic performance...




Thing is, there was a period where Caster was forced to drop her* testosterone to super-woman levels and his times turned to dog shit, no more medals until they lightened the restrictions.

*really, I believe she's a she a thousand times more than any ratking and for as much as I think she and the other people in the picture above is damaging women's sports it is not even a "respect pronouns" thing. Call me a fag, they look like men and obviously have male advantages physically, but the only problem I have with her and Francine and Margaret is the testosterone. People like Rhys can fuck off.



Testaclese Maximus said:


> Correct me if I’m wrong, but she’s a cis woman, right?  And her high testosterone is happening all on its own?  Then it’s basically tantamount to saying she’s too gifted to compete, which is stupid.  It’s like saying Michael Jordan should have cut off one of his legs to make things more fair.



No, if someone in regulated men's sports have acromegaly and produce excessive growth hormones they have to fix that or it counts as a doping violation.



Dropped Burner said:


> If a naturally high-T woman is barred from competing until she regulates her hormones, would a low-T man be allowed to compete if his hormone profile matched the average female runner?



One thing is for sure, a low-t man aren't allowed to bring himself up to average levels, that's doping, same with women, they can't artificially raise their limits and still be within the limits that is considered natural by WADA.


----------



## GrungyLawnChlorinate (May 1, 2019)

GuyKazama said:


> The twitter woke folk can't seem to decide which kind of discrimination to file this under. Is it transphobia?
> View attachment 743246
> 
> Well Semenya isn't a tranny:View attachment 743247
> ...



She looks like a young, fit Ol' Dirty Bastard. Semen-semen-ya semen-yeah semen-yay!


----------



## Cryin RN (May 1, 2019)

Dropped Burner said:


> If a naturally high-T woman is barred from competing until she regulates her hormones, would a low-T man be allowed to compete if his hormone profile matched the average female runner? If all they care about is the level of hormones and not the gender of the competitor, why not test everyone's hormones and divide up the sports that way?



Test in healthy men sits at 300-1000 ng/dL, with "low T" being <300 (so 275 would count).  In women it's 15-70 ng/dL.  Even "low T" men struggle to reach those low numbers without some extra help from drugs.  Plus, most muscle built from test is retained even when levels dip a little.  This is what trans women in athletics are counting on: testers to get a snapshot of their T level at its absolute lowest so regulators have to ignore their 10+ years of normal male muscle development.  I feel bad for Semenya, but growing your own dope is bringing a gun to a knife fight in women's sports.


----------



## chunkygoth (May 1, 2019)

I do feel sorry for her. Despite all the troon jokes, she is a biological woman. All pro athletes have unnatural advantages to some extent: unnatural drive, competitiveness, stamina, height, etc. Caster's advantage is just way more powerful than the normal unnatural advantages. Through no fault of her own, Caster produces an extremely powerful hormone that easily makes her stronger than the strongest woman in her field.  I feel bad for her because she's using her natural strengths to her advantage and is being penalized for it. At the same time, it isn't fair to the other runners.

EDIT: turns out she has XY chromosomes. I withdraw my sympathy.


----------



## Sissy Galvez (May 1, 2019)

Haramburger said:


> Bruh...
> View attachment 743174
> so demure and ladylike...
> View attachment 743177


Bigot!! Caster Semenya looks like Caster Semenya!

I heard that argument the other day. Sure he looks like caster Semenya because that’s who he is but he also looks like a dude who’s ripped and shouldn’t compete with women.


----------



## Corbin Dallas Multipass (May 1, 2019)

There's only one solution. Make all sports accept both genders. Yeah, that means women will mostly be unable to compete at all professionally, but a few could, like these ladies.  

The only way to be properly woke is to put women back in the kitchen so "women" can finally be treated right.


----------



## Zarkov (May 1, 2019)

I hope this is the first step in getting cheating scumbags like McKinnon banned from competing in women's sports.


----------



## Feline Supremacist (May 1, 2019)

Smaug's Smokey Hole said:


> View attachment 743266
> 
> Thing is, there was a period where Caster was forced to drop her* testosterone to super-woman levels and his times turned to dog shit, no more medals until they lightened the restrictions.



This is the most revealing part of this shitfest-also, these three show why black men prefer white women over black women,


----------



## Otterly (May 1, 2019)

It’s never been publicly stated what semenya’s condition is but there are a few conditions that can cause  hyperandrogenism/ elevated testosterone to the level she has. Partial androgen insensitivity in a genetic Male, for example. It’s possible (probable I’d say) that she is actually genetically male. In the 1996 Olympics, I think eight athletes competing as women were found to actually be male.

   I feel for her, because she seems like a decent person and none of this is her fault, but the IAAF are right to say that athletes with elevated testosterone cannot compete. It sucks hugely for her as an individual  but it is fair overall. 

What worries me slightly is the focus solely on testosterone. Testosterone can be lowered - but doing so doesn’t strip a born Male of much of their advantage. A male had a body sculpted by testosterone. Bigger, heavier bones. Bigger heart and lungs. Higher VOmax, greater power output, stronger muscles with more robust muscle attachments. None of those things is removed if testosterone is removed or lowered. Any man on here could have kicked my arse at any sports even when I was at my fittest. Because men outdo women physically on almost every measure. 

What the IAAF are doing is pussyfooting around the real issue  which is that men have an advantage over women. It’s the male physiology that counts. Testosterone is a proxy for that, but it’s NOT the sole determiner in adults. By focusing on testosterone I worry they will create a precedent whereby any male can compete against women as long as he lowers his testosterone.

On the flip side, a woman doped with testosterone will also have permanent changes - studies of the east European athletes who were doped with androgenic steroids show this. Long term health problems and many early deaths. Unscrupulous countries will just take men or intersex athletes and dope them up, cheating and harming their health. 


Drugs to block testosterone (and all hormones, for example puberty blockers given to kids) are harmful - they’re really nasty and have serious, irreversible effects. So I can see why semenya doesn’t want to take them - they would have serious effects on her health beyond just blocking testosterone.

I’m hoping that this is a precursor to the IAAF bringing in sensible rules that just explicitly say that men and women need separate categories. What I worry though is that they will use testosterone as a sole bar, and that will allow men to compete, destroying women’s sports.


----------



## Smaug's Smokey Hole (May 1, 2019)

Otterly said:


> Any man on here could have kicked my arse at any sports even when I was at my fittest. Because men outdo women physically on almost every measure.
> 
> What the IAAF are doing is pussyfooting around the real issue  which is that men have an advantage over women. It’s the male physiology that counts.



It's like with heights, women can be taller than men but the tallest woman won't be taller than the tallest man. And that's sports, it's the extremes.
Buying into, and I know people like this, that men and women are equals when it comes to strength and fitness is just absurd. They get shocked when I win in arm wrestling but they never consider helping with the heavy lifting when someone moves...

Point is, men can run a 100 meters in 9.58 seconds, a woman juiced to the gills ran it in 10.49 seconds, it doesn't sound like much of a difference but calculate the kilowatts of that and... doesn't matter, both are still extremely fast and I can't imagine a workplace or contemporary environment where what would matter. The bench press record for men is a 1000lbs, no woman could do that, but why would that ever matter in real life or work? It would be as if someone could juggle 7 balls and me being because I just can't juggle, so I won't be a street performer then. The obsession of everything having to be equal is weird and women's sports should be within the limits of women doing well in them.

There are men's sports that aren't actually men's sports, it's not gendered and any woman with enough skill can get there, I think I've posted it before but racing and Michele Mouton is a great example of where an individual with skill can do well. She was rally driver, group B - rally on roids, the class that was banned because it killed to many people, helped won the manufactures championship and as an individual driver was a runner up to the world championship. She retired when it was banned because the much more sane group A was for pussies(in kinder words but other drivers said as much).
That was in the 80's.


----------



## Iwasamwillbe (May 1, 2019)

This is potentially discriminatory towards trans rights and I won't stand for it.


----------



## Otterly (May 1, 2019)

Smaug's Smokey Hole said:


> The obsession of everything having to be equal is weird



I think it is too. To me, it’s about being as equitable as possible but total inclusion and equality isnt possible or even desirable. Some things are exclusive- a men’s prostate cancer survivor group shouldn’t have to cater for women. A kids gymnastics class shouldnt have to cater for adults. Men shouldn’t be in the women’s locker rooms. Or their athletics events. 

Equality is having different race classes for age, sex and physical ability so everyone can participate in as level a field as we can. It’s not allowing the able bodied to thrash paralympians or men to thrash women. Or someone thick with the shakes to be your neurosurgeon. Sometimes being exclusive is a good idea.


----------



## La Luz Extinguido (May 1, 2019)

If she's an actual woman with unusual high testosterone then this is really retarded, would be like forcing high IQ chess competitive players to smack their heads with a club until they are less intelligent for a fair competition.


----------



## qt farmer :) (May 1, 2019)

this is pretty horseshit and I sympathize with her. I feel the problem surrounding testosterone levels should be about whether or not they are elevated through unnatural means or not. they should be drug testing instead of hormone level testing because all that does at this point is force naturally gifted people, who the sports industry basically revolves around, out of competition and create this shitstorm.


----------



## queue-anon (May 1, 2019)

La Luz Extinguido said:


> If she's an actual woman with unusual high testosterone then this is really exceptional, would be like forcing high IQ chess competitive players to smack their heads with a club until they are less intelligent for a fair competition.



He’s not. He’s an XY “woman” with internal testes who absolutely has known this since at least puberty, if not sooner. Also, it’s still questionable if Semenya was even raised as a “girl” since there are photos of him in boys’ school uniforms starting at a very early age. Not only is Semenya not a biological woman, he’s been knowingly cheating against women for years.


----------



## qt farmer :) (May 1, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> He’s not. He’s an XY “woman” with internal testes who absolutely has known this since at least puberty, if not sooner. Also, it’s still questionable if Semenya was even raised as a “girl” since there are photos of him in boys’ school uniforms starting at a very early age. Not only is Semenya not a biological woman, he’s been knowingly cheating against women for years.



are there any sources on this? I've heard people mention it before and I've never seen anyone with sources, so I'm curious.


----------



## Splendid (May 2, 2019)

If she's a woman she should compete as a woman.
If he's a man he should compete as a man.
TBH, dropping the pants and shit like that may be the best test here.


----------



## Smaug's Smokey Hole (May 2, 2019)

I saw this.

https://citizen.co.za/sport/south-a...ut-all-those-muscly-white-women-asks-twitter/


> *#CasterSemenya: But what about all those muscly white women, asks Twitter*
> 
> *Accusations have been flying the IAAF is targeting Caster not merely over testosterone, but because she’s black.*
> ,,,
> ...



Strike Jarmila Kratochvílová's record? Sure, people have been trying to do that for a long time, not only hers but a few others as well, for very good reasons.

Articles from 2011
https://slate.com/culture/2011/08/the-women-s-track-and-field-record-book-needs-to-be-expunged.html


> With women’s track records out of reach for even admitted druggies, the book needs to be wiped clean. The fairest solution would be to remove every mark set before track and field instituted random drug testing in the wake of the Seoul Olympics. *That would get Kratochvilova, Koch, and Flo Jo off the books.* Such a move would quickly raise the profile of women’s track. Remove Griffith Joyner, and the 100-meter mark would have been broken six times since 1996, by such never-got-their-due athletes as Carmelita Jeter and Frenchwoman Christine Arron, who missed out on meet bonuses and endorsement contracts because they were pursuing an impossible standard.



There's more than that, the effort to remove a few of the "unfairly advantaged" women from the record books have been going on for decades and it might not be a movement the troons and Semenya nuthuggers wants to empower.

Jarmila, for comparison, her world record is till THE world record and it goes back to 1983.





The way they're arguing about it makes it sound like the official standard for women's sport should be the eye test, not a t-test, and I don't think they've thought that one through.


----------



## Otterly (May 2, 2019)

Just a fag said:


> are there any sources on this? I've heard people mention it before and I've never seen anyone with sources, so I'm curious.



There’s never been an official statement, which is fine, it’s her private medical information. BUT the relevant committee should know and act accordingly. The most common conditions that give someone with semenya’s phenotype is Partial androgen insensitivity in an XY individual. That individual is male. 

It’s really tough for the individual concerned, and rough for her to have all this dragged out in public, but the rules have to be fair. Competing as a Male XY individual in a female category is not fair. Semenya hasn’t set out to cheat, she possibly had little to no real idea about her condition until she was being tested. But it’s fair that she can’t compete with women. 

This is why TRAs latch like lampreys onto the intersex conditions - because of complicated situations like this. Instead of each individual being dealt with sensitively and in a fair and scientific way, they’ve twisted it to their advantage and to totally screw over women.


----------



## Brillig (May 2, 2019)

Couldn't corroborate this anywhere but for me it confirms Caster is male. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ao8GjMMttw

There is a lot of evidence suggesting he has undescended testicles. Consensus is from all the ton of articles I've read on this is that he was wrongly assigned female either at birth or when his birth certificate was issued.  He was definitely raised as a boy on his own choice. He was born in a tiny village where it's unlikely health services could have determined his sex for certain.

His parents have to have known something was up when he didn't start menstruating at puberty.

Some lesbians are saying he looks and acts exactly like a butch lesbian but I'm not convinced. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvg50P4FwTk&feature=youtu.be


----------



## millais (May 2, 2019)

Castor is a boy's name though, innit. Like Castor & Pollux, the male twins from the Greek mythology


----------



## Brillig (May 3, 2019)

millais said:


> Castor is a boy's name though, innit. Like Castor & Pollux, the male twins from the Greek mythology


Apparently it means 'to excel'! His actual first name is Mokgabi which is known to be a female name that means 'swears a lot'.

Bottom line is that if he were actually female, the information would have been released a decade ago.

Then there's additional evidence of an early cover up. https://archive.md/cAwKL

Edit: added ss of birth cert (http://archive.md/xmFo ). Unfortunately I can't find where I ss'd the comment from...





This link has been disappeared; http://archive.md/https://www.elle.co.za/caster-semenyas-venture-for-girls-menstrual-health/

There's also this sketchy vid which I can't confirm via any other source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKTKr2fk6Hw




Your browser is not able to display this video.



There's also a lot of controversy around his marriage. In 2014, both his dad and he denied there were no marriage plans. Caster got married that year.

Then there was an announcement that his wife
was pregnant in 2017. There was never any further article to confirm that a child was born to the couple.

I do start to believe that there are definitely mysteries behind Caster's story and that information has been deliberately suppressed.

It would be interesting to see if super Kiwis are able to find more info on this. I've done multiple advanced searches in three different search engines with numerous key words. I've also checked Wayback Machine and archive sites and no dice.

Got this from Miranda Yardley's blog in which intersex activist Claire Jones gives her take on the issue. http://archive.md/Yiql8  https://mirandayardley.com/en/caster-semenya-no-one-wins/


----------



## gracious bobbly bits (May 3, 2019)

The regulations that are being applied to Semenya are only applied to XY chromosome individuals (i.e males):









						What No One Is Telling You About Caster Semenya: She Has XY Chromosomes - LetsRun.com
					

Somehow the Associated Press, Reuters, NY Times, NPR, Washington Post, and BBC all failed to tell you a very key fact about Caster Semenya - she has XY chromosomes. Since the mainstream media's reporting on Semenya has been so biased, Robert Johnson thought it was important to clear up three...




					www.letsrun.com
				






> It was generally accepted by people following the case closely that Semenya was XY, but now it’s been confirmed as fact since the CAS press release specifically says, “The DSD covered by the Regulations are limited to athletes with ’46 XY DSD’ – i.e. conditions where the affected individual has XY chromosomes.” If she wasn’t XY, the IAAF’s regulations wouldn’t apply to her and she’d have no reason to challenge them.
> 
> (In case you forgot what you learned in junior high biology, typically females have XX chromosomes while males are XY).
> 
> How the Associated Press, Reuters, _NY Times,_ NPR, _Washington Post_, and BBC could all leave this CRUCIAL fact out of their reporting is beyond me. Not a single one of them mentioned it at all. It should have been in the lead paragraph of every story so people like my mother, who sent me a confused email after she saw an article on Semenya, can really understand what this is all about. Instead, the closest we get to the truth was that some of the articles talked about how Semenya has intersex “traits” or “characteristics.” Let’s be real, if you are an XY woman, you are the very definition of what virtually everyone would think of as intersex.


----------



## Ruin (May 3, 2019)

I'm not sure how I feel about this. Michael Phelps has semi webbed toes and fingers as well as extremely long limbs. He's got the combination of several genetic mutations that result in incredible performance in swimming so should he be forced to undergo surgery before competing? 

I get the idea but the thought that athletes have to be medically gimped before performing to be fair to everyone is some weird sounding futuristic Harrison Bergeron shit.


----------



## Truthspeaker (May 3, 2019)

Ruin said:


> I'm not sure how I feel about this. Michael Phelps has semi webbed toes and fingers as well as extremely long limbs. He's got the combination of several genetic mutations that result in incredible performance in swimming so should he be forced to undergo surgery before competing?
> 
> I get the idea but the thought that athletes have to be medically gimped before performing to be fair to everyone is some weird sounding futuristic Harrison Bergeron shit.


I do get this to a degree, but there has to be measurable criteria to divide male and female athletes in competition for there to even be women's athletics.

The fact is, Caster's already the best in the world even on hormone suppressants. She won multiple retroactive gold medals once those Russian women she lost to were revealed to be doping, and I doubt that'd change if she was forced back on the suppressants.

It's understandable how having testes where her ovaries should be still gives her an advantage even on the suppressants. She's so butch, Lea DeLaria'd wear a dress on a date with her. But if Caster wants to keep competing with her natural hormone levels, she should be required to compete against men.

She'd get fucking mulched. Her best time is still short of the men's world record of a century ago, let alone today, but that's the whole reason why athletic events are sexually segregated to begin with.

At least she's not in the same boat as those troons in women's weight lifting.


----------



## thejackal (May 3, 2019)

Interesting thread to say the least.  Just a couple points as a lot of great ones have already been made:

1) if "she" really does have testes and was wrongly assigned AFAB then she should compete against men, full stop.

2) T is a helluva drug.  Just looking at "her" jawline, pecs and thighs anybody at all familiar with weight training and athletics would assume "she" is roided up beyond belief.  Women without T don't get that muscle density.


----------



## Smaug's Smokey Hole (May 3, 2019)

Ruin said:


> I'm not sure how I feel about this. Michael Phelps has semi webbed toes and fingers as well as extremely long limbs. He's got the combination of several genetic mutations that result in incredible performance in swimming so should he be forced to undergo surgery before competing?
> 
> I get the idea but the thought that athletes have to be medically gimped before performing to be fair to everyone is some weird sounding futuristic Harrison Bergeron shit.



It's not unheard of to change the rules based on someone having too much of a physical advantage. The most obvious one is weight classes but there's more.

This is the feet of Tom Dempsey, kicker in the NFL and an incredibly successful one at that. He held the record for longest field goal for 43 years. It is easy to see the advantage of kicking a football with the toes if the kicking foot is a sledge hammer.




Eventually they made a rule change:


> Then, in 1977, the NFL added a rule, informally known as the "Tom Dempsey Rule", that "any shoe that is worn by a player with an artificial limb on his kicking leg must have a kicking surface that conforms to that of a normal kicking shoe."


Wearing a normal shoe with a foot like that would suck ass and make him less of a player, but those are the rules. Those are the rules now, they changed it because one person made it unfair.

The NBA instituted rules for goal tending when in the modern era the players became so insanely tall that they could snatch or swat the ball away before it hit the basket, NFL even has a similar rule because a team recruited a tall as fuck basketball player to do the same thing. His physique wasn't great for american football, but he was tall enough and could jump high enough to block field goals. So they changed the rules.

Rules in sports change all the time when people figure out a loophole or a way to exploit the rules and starts dominating everyone else, it is constantly evolving.

edit: Dustin Carter and Kyle Maynard was also a strange one.


----------



## Truthspeaker (May 3, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> He’s not. He’s an XY “woman” with internal testes who absolutely has known this since at least puberty, if not sooner. Also, it’s still questionable if Semenya was even raised as a “girl” since there are photos of him in boys’ school uniforms starting at a very early age. Not only is Semenya not a biological woman, he’s been knowingly cheating against women for years.


I doubt the African equivalent of a hillbilly was given proper sex education, and it's hardly unusual for heavily butch women (or heavily femme men) to dress up as the opposite sex in their youths. She was still born with a vagina and given a girl's name.

I'm still certain she's XY with testes instead of ovaries. She's so butch, she makes Teresa Witherspoon look like Tyra Banks. But that was already accounted for in 2012, where she won retroactive gold after the Ruskies were caught on gas.

Unlike most of the women's athletic issues we've seen, Semenya's a rare case of an actual intersex individual. In a better world, her sexual problem could've been corrected with the power of medical science, but we don't live in such a world, and we have to deal with her case on its own terms.


----------



## Brillig (May 4, 2019)

Truthspeaker said:


> I doubt the African equivalent of a hillbilly was given proper sex education, and it's hardly unusual for heavily butch women (or heavily femme men) to dress up as the opposite sex in their youths. She was still born with a vagina and given a girl's name.
> 
> I'm still certain she's XY with testes instead of ovaries. She's so butch, she makes Teresa Witherspoon look like Tyra Banks. But that was already accounted for in 2012, where she won retroactive gold after the Ruskies were caught on gas.
> 
> Unlike most of the women's athletic issues we've seen, Semenya's a rare case of an actual intersex individual. In a better world, her sexual problem could've been corrected with the power of medical science, but we don't live in such a world, and we have to deal with her case on its own terms.


Caster (a male name) is his second name. There is no evidence he has a vagine, only that he has undescended testicles which account for his typical male levels of testo and his consequent appearance, physical shape and to some degree his manner. 

(oops accidentally pressed post) 

The current ruling was specifically made for men with the male specific DSD 46,xy. Only males with this configuration will be made to reduce their testo level and only if they want to compete against women. Even tw can't reduce their testo level to the average level of women. http://journals.aace.com/doi/10.4158/EP-2017-0116?code=aace-site  ; http://archive.md/kHkM6 , so it's unlikely he'll qualify under the new rules. Perhaps this is why he's already saying he's going to appeal the decision. He knows there's too much money behind him to go down without him continuing the deception. 

I've read that there are whole women's teams in Kenya composed of almost exclusively this type of male sex specific form of intersex. So it will likely have a wide effect on women's sport and prevent men like this from taking advantage of the old loophole which is now plugged by new ruling. Scouts deliberately looked for these guys.

It's true that the conditions in the village where he grew up would not have been conducive to genetic testing but there's no evidence that he was in any way female while growing up. As an 'imperfect male', his parents no doubt would have had to some face saving. But from what I've read, he was 'all boy' and still is. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ster-Semenyas-father-sex-riddle-daughter.html  ; http://archive.md/v4Xu  .

He actually doesn't resemble a butch lesbian at all though a fem lesbian tried to tell me he looks exactly like a butch lesbian. LOL. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvg50P4FwTk&feature=youtu.be  (couldn't upload as KF doesn't accept .mkv it says). Not like any other butch lesbian I've known that is.

Here's another article detailing the corruption behind the scam: https://sportsscientists.com/2009/09/caster-semenya-cover-ups-lies-and-confusion/ ; http://archive.md/kHkM6 

"Correcting" his condition is exactly what intersex activists have been arguing against for ages. They are very much in favour of intersex ppl not being wrongly assigned sex at the first ultrasound or at birth. They wish to remain their natural selves unless they feel they need 'correcting'. 

There is no doubt in my mind that Caster knew what was going on all along but saw the advantage (or was made to see it) and continued to insist on his womanhood despite all evidence to the contrary. This all could have been resolved 10 yrs ago when he was first tested. And even now, if he were actually a woman, the Olympic judges (even after consultation with a myriad of experts), they would have crowed it from the rooftops. Instead they made this ruling which only targets 46,xy men. 

There are rumours that he and his (ex?) wife were expecting a child and that child never materialized. Also rumours that Caster himself was pregnant, an impossibility without a full working female reproductive system. 

The comments from ppl on FB etc defending this poor helpless 'woman' are hilarious.


----------



## Sissy Galvez (May 5, 2019)

gracious bobbly bits said:


> The regulations that are being applied to Semenya are only applied to XY chromosome individuals (i.e males):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Came here to post this as I just read it. The media and all the asshole shills on twatter or totally misrepresenting this situation.

When people learn the truth and that the media was lying/trying to cover it up they get red pilled.


----------



## DDBCAE CBAADCBE (May 5, 2019)

Haramburger said:


> Bruh...
> View attachment 743174
> so demure and ladylike...
> View attachment 743177


This is a tranny? Did this dude even try? It's literally just a black man with earrings. Even Chris, YES EVEN CHRIS, is a more convincing woman that Jamal here.


----------



## Positron (May 5, 2019)

I can't find Semenya's testosterone level.  Has that ever been disclosed?  At anyway I repeat what I said in the Rat King subforum.  Barring any new info, this is my final say on this matter.

Having a T level above than 5 nmol/l is almost diagnostic that the person is male.  If the person is 46XY, it all but clinches it, barring some freakish multiple diseases in the same person (malignant androgenic tumor of the adrenal cortex  in an XY-female with androgen insensitivity).  If the person actually looks phenotypically male since childhood, you tell me the chances that he is NOT a man.  The more subterfuge the IAAF takes, in the pretext of protecting Semenya's privacy, the less integrity they possess.

At any rate, the verdict may be hard on Semenya, if he genuinely believes he is a woman, but this belief is due to the misdiagnosis of whatever village witch doctor who attended Semenya's birth, and the IAAF is not one bit responsible for that.  Indeed, I think he should be prohibited in compete in women's event at all, with or without androgen suppression, because there is plenty of pointers that he is a man (and I haven't even considered the rumors that he has testes and no internal female genital organs) and _no_ evidence at all that he is a woman.


----------



## JektheDumbass (May 5, 2019)

So, some man who wants to beat women can get their dick cut off and do so, but an actual woman with a hormone inbalance can't compete?

Honk honk


----------



## Safir (May 5, 2019)

If he has a Y chromosome, he's a man and should compete with men.
If she doesn't, she's still pro-troon. The upper bound on T is the only barrier protecting most women's sports from "women", so, all else being equal, it's fair if she gets booted out.

In an ideal world, sex would be determined by chromosomes and women (XX people) would compete with other women regardless of their natural advantages. All competitions are "unfair", otherwise you might as well just flip a coin and go home.


----------



## Anonymus Fluhre (May 5, 2019)

Ginger Piglet said:


> Of course it's a competitive advantage. We don't let athletes roid themselves up before competition and since steroids generally work by boosting one's testosterone levels, the principle is the same.


That's logical though, logic doesn't exist on Twitter.


----------



## Brillig (May 8, 2019)

Still finding that a lot of ppl (esp women and troons!) think this cheater is a woman. Still no evidence that he's any kind of female. Still no evidence that he was raised a woman. Ppl seem to like holding onto their pity for liars. Internalized misogyny dies hard.

If anyone does have info about his womanishness, pls post.

Also still looking for info around that court case where he demanded R50,000 in alimony when his wife tried to get a peace bond against him.

Too bad that they just didn't rule that anyone with a Y who wants to compete against women, can't. 

Check out some of the troons on FB testerically wailing about how much of a woman Caster is, especially this guy who things he can baffle with bullshit:  
*Mags McCreery-Dumont *

http://archive.md/7mMzf


----------



## RadicalCentrist (May 14, 2019)

Smaug's Smokey Hole said:


> It's not unheard of to change the rules based on someone having too much of a physical advantage. The most obvious one is weight classes but there's more.


You also cannot hire a dwarf to play professional baseball ever since Eddie Gaedal played for the Browns.  A players strike zone is based on their space between their knees and arms so it would be an astronomical task to strike a dwarf out.


----------



## Feline Darkmage (May 26, 2019)

ITT: What is an intersex? Also I'm very feminist, so feminist I believe not wearing dresses is a sign that someone is definitely not any kind of woman.


----------



## Remove Goat (May 26, 2019)

Feline Darkmage said:


> ITT: What is an intersex? Also I'm very feminist, so feminist I believe not wearing dresses is a sign that someone is definitely not any kind of woman.


So feminist you became a woman.

Intersex is when real life RNJesus fucks up a sperm-dart throw and you have a little of column A, little of column B.

if this was a satirical question, I welcome the dumb and autistic ratings


----------



## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Jun 19, 2019)

Haramburger said:


> Bruh...
> View attachment 743174
> so demure and ladylike...
> View attachment 743177



So, an average Black woman, then?


----------

