# What's the most absolutely wrong "lesson" you've seen taught in media aimed at kids?



## skykiii (Jun 4, 2022)

The rule is it has to be an _intended_ message, as far as you know (that's me giving you wiggle room there).  I don't want to hear any TV Tropes-ish "the message *could* be taken *this* way even though that clearly wasn't the intent" bullshit.

Please go into as much detail as you like, I love reading it.

... For myself, I absolutely can't stand "the importance of family" shit.  Family is just the bunch of idiots you got thrown in with by random lottery, and IRL a lot of people who use this message are using it to abuse and emotionally manipulate kids.


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## thegooddoctor (Jun 4, 2022)

The entire storybook of the The Ugly Duckling, the book should be about self acceptance and learning to be happy with not being a normally attractive being in society, but by the end of the book the duckling doesn't have an epiphany after all the shit that he's been through being shat on by other animals and even his own family, to be like 'Im different, I can be happy with that, fuck them! Instead, the dude turns into a beautiful swan for no reason at the end and is accepted for finally being of a high enough standard to cater to societies shallow outlook. Its basically unintentional or not saying 'If your not beautiful your life is worthless unless you change yourself to cater to other peoples opinions even if they treat you badly' Real nice message to give to like the 4 year olds who first read that guys.


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## Cilleystring (Jun 4, 2022)

That it's ok to mutilate your genitals


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## Shidoen (Jun 4, 2022)

That it’s fine to leave your enemies alive for a second chance.


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## Lady Adjani (Jun 4, 2022)

[USER=25230 said:
			
		

> skykiii[/USER]]
> ... For myself, I absolutely can't stand "the importance of family" shit. Family is just the bunch of idiots you got thrown in with by random lottery, and IRL a lot of people who use this message are using it to abuse and emotionally manipulate kids.



The message is wasted on children anyway, it's only after you've grown up that you realize that your parents and siblings are the only people that will love you unconditionally.


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## Lone MacReady (Jun 4, 2022)

That a Banana Republic of non-assymilating warring tribes can actually remain a functioning body.


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## byuu (Jun 4, 2022)

"Don't trust strangers"
Strangers are awesome. Sometimes they even have candies.


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## The Last Stand (Jun 4, 2022)

Cilleystring said:


> That it's ok to mutilate your genitals


That you're at a disadvantage because of your race.


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## Astro Loafo (Jun 4, 2022)

There's like this under belly within the right leaning groups that whites are this bringer of light race. That every thing modern was brought through them and everyone else is just stone aged monkeys. 

You even have speakers talking about iq to justify it. Like in one Jordan Peterson talks about how low the iq of south africans in uni are. The test he conducted was based on pattern recognition to try to be less biased. But the reality of the test is that pattern recognition at higher levels can also mean autism, not just iq.

And it's not so much a bitter rant but it's almost a blindness. Imagine punk music you would think some British or American band. You would think someone white. But punk originates from Peru. Synth and new wave.... Chile. And even I find it baffling that I can't process this.


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## sadbird (Jun 4, 2022)

"be yourself!" No matter who you are apparently, or what it means for other people including younger children. People have absolutely taken this to mean who you are outwardly because it's easier to change who you are outside than inside.


Lady Adjani said:


> The message is wasted on children anyway, it's only after you've grown up that you realize that your parents and siblings are the only people that will love you unconditionally.


For the most part yeah I would say this is pretty true. The most successful assholes in the world are all putting their own families first and ensuring the passing of wealth through strong generational bonds, while the rest of us are being told single motherhood is fantastic, and that it's okay to spawn abusive psychopaths who will never know love or kindness, etc.


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## Blasted Heath (Jun 4, 2022)

The retarded message that bullies and villains are actually misunderstood and hurting inside and just need a hug. It's such a boring trope. I swear that's the theme in half the shows my younger cousins watch these days, and the same goes for kids' books. Idgaf about that message being used every now and then -- it's not the end of the world, it provides nuance, it's just fiction, who cares -- but let's face it, most assholes will only lay off after a good fist to the face.

Also -- why does every piece of media need a moral in the first place? Some of the best books I read growing up were the ones where the characters were just having a good time.


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## Prophetic Spirit (Jun 4, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> And it's not so much a bitter rant but it's almost a blindness. Imagine punk music you would think some British or American band. You would think someone white. But punk originates from Peru. Synth and new wave.... Chile. And even I find it baffling that I can't process this.


Yeah, take that South American cock, you fucking whinny bitch.


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## Drkinferno72 (Jun 4, 2022)

The episode of Arthur where Arthur finally snaps and hits DW. Muh "hitting is wrong" despite the fact Arthur told dw multiple times not to touch his model airplane


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## Buttigieg2020 (Jun 4, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> There's like this under belly within the right leaning groups that whites are this bringer of light race. That every thing modern was brought through them and everyone else is just stone aged monkeys.
> 
> You even have speakers talking about iq to justify it. Like in one Jordan Peterson talks about how low the iq of south africans in uni are. The test he conducted was based on pattern recognition to try to be less biased. But the reality of the test is that pattern recognition at higher levels can also mean autism, not just iq.
> 
> And it's not so much a bitter rant but it's almost a blindness. Imagine punk music you would think some British or American band. You would think someone white. But punk originates from Peru. Synth and new wave.... Chile. And even I find it baffling that I can't process this.


What fucking kids shows are you watching lol?

 Caillou was famous for teaching kids that being a massive asshole to your parents was how you get what you want. Same with any teenage girls media really.


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## BeaArthurKin (Jun 4, 2022)

thegooddoctor said:


> The entire storybook of the The Ugly Duckling, the book should be about self acceptance and learning to be happy with not being a normally attractive being in society, but by the end of the book the duckling doesn't have an epiphany after all the shit that he's been through being shat on by other animals and even his own family, to be like 'Im different, I can be happy with that, fuck them! Instead, the dude turns into a beautiful swan for no reason at the end and is accepted for finally being of a high enough standard to cater to societies shallow outlook. Its basically unintentional or not saying 'If your not beautiful your life is worthless unless you change yourself to cater to other peoples opinions even if they treat you badly' Real nice message to give to like the 4 year olds who first read that guys.


Funny you should mention that, because the one adaptation I can recall from my childhood actually bothered to incorporate a positive message about self-esteem.


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## Queen Elizabeth II (Jun 4, 2022)

You can be anything you want to be.

I can pick my gender
I can be the most special snowflake
I deserve to be given things

Honey shut the fuck up and get back on the production line nobody gives a a shit.


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## A-Stump (Jun 4, 2022)

Cailou is pretty awful. Kid throws a shitfit and gets whatever he wants. That's literally the lesson of the show.


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## PipTheAlchemist (Jun 4, 2022)

thegooddoctor said:


> The entire storybook of the The Ugly Duckling, the book should be about self acceptance and learning to be happy with not being a normally attractive being in society, but by the end of the book the duckling doesn't have an epiphany after all the shit that he's been through being shat on by other animals and even his own family, to be like 'Im different, I can be happy with that, fuck them! Instead, the dude turns into a beautiful swan for no reason at the end and is accepted for finally being of a high enough standard to cater to societies shallow outlook. Its basically unintentional or not saying 'If your not beautiful your life is worthless unless you change yourself to cater to other peoples opinions even if they treat you badly' Real nice message to give to like the 4 year olds who first read that guys.


Spoken like a true ugoid


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## glass_houses (Jun 4, 2022)

"You can be anything you want to be" is right up there.

The other one is that the creepy, isolated, ostracised adult that absolutely everyone tells you not to go near because he's a paedophile murderer, is actually just misunderstood and just needs you to be their friend and they'll suddenly be completely normal under the smell of shit and stale wine. Stay _away_ from the homeless nutjob, for the love of Christ!


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## Dirk Willems (Jun 4, 2022)

Less serious, but when I was learning to drive, my instructor taught me to focus only on the front wheels, and that "the back wheels would follow".  Fortunately, dad made sure I knew how _actually_ to drive, but I often wonder how a driving instructor could get such a fundamental thing so perfectly wrong.


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## Agarathium1066 (Jun 4, 2022)

Blasted Heath said:


> The retarded message that bullies and villains are actually misunderstood and hurting inside and just need a hug. It's such a boring trope. I swear that's the theme in half the shows my younger cousins watch these days, and the same goes for kids' books.


The message is true as a lot of that starts as a form of projection or coping. It should be taught along with the consequences of being a fuckhead and that being willing to defend yourself is perfectly fine. In a similar vein that these sort of problems will be 'solved' by speaking to an adult about it. It will not, most will leave you to hang or in some fashion have their hands tied.


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## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Jun 4, 2022)

thegooddoctor said:


> The entire storybook of the The Ugly Duckling, the book should be about self acceptance and learning to be happy with not being a normally attractive being in society, but by the end of the book the duckling doesn't have an epiphany after all the shit that he's been through being shat on by other animals and even his own family, to be like 'Im different, I can be happy with that, fuck them! Instead, the dude turns into a beautiful swan for no reason at the end and is accepted for finally being of a high enough standard to cater to societies shallow outlook. Its basically unintentional or not saying 'If your not beautiful your life is worthless unless you change yourself to cater to other peoples opinions even if they treat you badly' Real nice message to give to like the 4 year olds who first read that guys.


Basically the equivalent of telling Little Susie that's her problems will go away in the future, so don't worry.
They don't, problems don't fix themselves.


Astro Loafo said:


> There's like this under belly within the right leaning groups that whites are this bringer of light race. That every thing modern was brought through them and everyone else is just stone aged monkeys.
> 
> You even have speakers talking about iq to justify it. Like in one Jordan Peterson talks about how low the iq of south africans in uni are. The test he conducted was based on pattern recognition to try to be less biased. But the reality of the test is that pattern recognition at higher levels can also mean autism, not just iq.
> 
> And it's not so much a bitter rant but it's almost a blindness. Imagine punk music you would think some British or American band. You would think someone white. But punk originates from Peru. Synth and new wave.... Chile. And even I find it baffling that I can't process this.


WTF does that have to do with kids media?



Agarathium1066 said:


> The message is true as a lot of that starts as a form of projection or coping. It should be taught along with the consequences of being a fuckhead and that being willing to defend yourself is perfectly fine. In a similar vein that these sort of problems will be 'solved' by speaking to an adult about it. It will not, most will leave you to hang or in some fashion have their hands tied.


I think the thing is the kids media may be depicting some evil supervillian or tycoon or whatever, but the moral is aimed more at kids dealing with things like Little Billy calling them a poopyface, who probably is like you said. so, aside from the beta cuck no-fighting-back message, the trying-to-understand-others message IS the relevant one to children more than "some people are fundamentally evil and should be hung." Because wtf are kids doing that they have to deal with the latter?


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## Blasted Heath (Jun 4, 2022)

Agarathium1066 said:


> The message is true as a lot of that starts as a form of projection or coping. It should be taught along with the consequences of being a fuckhead and that being willing to defend yourself is perfectly fine. In a similar vein that these sort of problems will be 'solved' by speaking to an adult about it. It will not, most will leave you to hang or in some fashion have their hands tied.


For sure, I should've been more clear about that. A lot of playground bullies (and the adults they become, if they don't change) are driven by being bullied or abused themselves; I'm not saying kids shouldn't be taught to feel sympathy for those cases. I was more talking about the message that movie villains can play the victim and therefore not receive any consequences, that being nice to a bully will make them be nice to you, and that *everyone* who acts mean is actually just a misunderstood softie. Along the lines of Steven Universe-esque idiocy, if you're familiar with all that drama.


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## Xenomorph (Jun 4, 2022)

That you can be anything you want.


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## Meiwaku (Jun 4, 2022)

Most things that end up on retarded posters in western schools are gay and retarded.

An Asian schools, it's probably that you have to know what you're going to do as a career later in life _right_ _now.  _Most people don't even if you have a chinese tiger mother. You will make your own choices even if your parents push you to one profession.

Also needing to know stroke order for every fuckin' kanji or else you will look like a fat retard is GAY minus needing it for dictionaries (which you can infer from just looking at a charachter if you know basics). It's not even the same order in Japanese as it is in Chinese. My ancestors are stupid for not just following Chinese stroke order if it's sooooo important. If you're going to suck off China at least swallow the cum.


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## Bulk Bogan (Jun 4, 2022)

Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer goes out of it's way to make all of the other reindeer (and elves, various other Santa employees) out to be vapid cunts, especially because they start fawning after Rudolph the moment he acquires a powerful patron.  Most of the adaptations go on to have him forgive all these assholes for being just the absolute worst to him his whole mutant life because, again, now they suck up to him because he's powerful so they must actually really like him now.  Forgiveness morals are always taught so badly, and I think it does damage to the kids who internalize those shit lessons.


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## Astro Loafo (Jun 4, 2022)

Ughubughughughughughghlug said:


> Basically the equivalent of telling Little Susie that's her problems will go away in the future, so don't worry.
> They don't, problems don't fix themselves.
> 
> WTF does that have to do with kids media?
> ...


Oh sorry I read kids and thought adolescent not prepubescence


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## urr13 account (Jun 4, 2022)

Blasted Heath said:


> The retarded message that bullies and villains are actually misunderstood and hurting inside and just need a hug.


Once they started teaching kids to befriend Dragons instead of slay them, it was all downhill.


glass_houses said:


> The other one is that the creepy, isolated, ostracised adult that absolutely everyone tells you not to go near because he's a paedophile murderer, is actually just misunderstood and just needs you to be their friend and they'll suddenly be completely normal under the smell of shit and stale wine. Stay _away_ from the homeless nutjob, for the love of Christ!


Home Alone 1 and 2 both did this, first with the scary old man next door, next with the homeless bird lady.

I think there is some value in these type of messages sometimes, but it has to be tempered with the other side. Little Red Riding Hood is about not talking to strangers, and children need to feel comfortable trusting their instincts if someone makes them feel uncomfortable they shouldn't feel like they are the problem.

Adults need to learn this message again too, there are many true crime stories where the victims of assualt/robbery/rape say in their story that they felt something was off or they were scared but still got in the car/went into the house/didnt cross the street. Women literally going into some strange guys house because they don't want to be rude/or be thought of as racist or some other shit.

You have instincts for a reason, if your fight or flight response is kicking in take a hint and get the fuck out.


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## Meiwaku (Jun 4, 2022)

"no bullying"

We lost so many that day.


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## Newman's Lovechild (Jun 4, 2022)

thegooddoctor said:


> Instead, the dude turns into a beautiful swan for no reason at the end



Well to be fair, there was a reason: he was a swan. A cygnet is a gangly looking MFer if you expect a duckling.

The moral still holds true, I think. Ducks, chickens, dogs and cats? It's been a while all reject him. Who accepts him? His own kind. It's when he comes into his own.

You can look at it through the lens of Hans Christian Anderson being a fag, too. Though you have a couple of implications when you think of it in terms of the modern LGBTQMAP. It can be seen as telling kids they have to change the entire presented appearance of their bodies in order to be happy.
Alternatively, all the characters try to assert he's something that he isn't, because he thought he might be that thing when he was young and confused. "Hey kid, you're a walrus duck! You're an ugly duck but you're a duck! Try to be a proper duck!" "Fuck you cunts, I am not a duck. I've got swan chromosomes."

It's tricksy.


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## Milwaukee Macho Man (Jun 4, 2022)

The idea that sewers were filled with Alligators was total bullshit.


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## Blasted Heath (Jun 4, 2022)

ProblematicUser420 said:


> The idea that sewers were filled with Alligators was total bullshit.


Six year old me thought I'd have to face a lot more sewer gators, quicksand traps, and boa constrictors than I have so far. Highly disappointing.


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## Testacles Maximus (Jun 4, 2022)

I don’t watch kids media so I gotta go from my own memory.  Barney the Dinosaur taught that the ideal conflict resolution was to just pretend the conflict wasn’t there which is obviously impractical in the real world.


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## Niobium (Jun 4, 2022)

That getting a job would be as easy as walking into any building and then an hour later being told you start tomorrow. Man, I wish I lived in the 50s when that shit was actually true. These days you need a degree and 5 years of experience for "entry-level" shit.


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## LordofTendons (Jun 4, 2022)

Bulk Bogan said:


> Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer goes out of it's way to make all of the other reindeer (and elves, various other Santa employees) out to be vapid cunts, especially because they start fawning after Rudolph the moment he acquires a powerful patron.  Most of the adaptations go on to have him forgive all these assholes for being just the absolute worst to him his whole mutant life because, again, now they suck up to him because he's powerful so they must actually really like him now.  Forgiveness morals are always taught so badly, and I think it does damage to the kids who internalize those shit lessons.


In the claymation version Burl Ives flat out says in the narration that you can't run away from your problems. I've found that generally, you can, and when you can't, getting someone _else_ to leave can be a remarkable substitute.


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## Archie_Kimkicker (Jun 4, 2022)

"Crime doesn't pay." Is probably the most dangerously spread lessons in our society.



Dirk Willems said:


> Less serious, but when I was learning to drive, my instructor taught me to focus only on the front wheels, and that "the back wheels would follow".  Fortunately, dad made sure I knew how _actually_ to drive, but I often wonder how a driving instructor could get such a fundamental thing so perfectly wrong.


Now imagine what certified flight instructors get wrong on the regular and think about it the next time you board a 50-seat airliner with some baby-faced junior first officer.



ProblematicUser420 said:


> The idea that sewers were filled with Alligators was total bullshit.


Your wording evokes a bitterness that can only have come from the disappointment of having embarked on a quest to find the alligators and finding only stale poo.


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## Colon capital V (Jun 4, 2022)

sadbird said:


> "be yourself!" No matter who you are apparently, or what it means for other people including younger children. People have absolutely taken this to mean who you are outwardly because it's easier to change who you are outside than inside.


I can see the good intentions behind this lesson, but my god is it so misconstrued in the worst way possible. 
"Be yourself!"
"Okay! I'm gonna sit around and play video games and be a useless piece of shit because that's who I am!"

Honestly the real lesson that needs to be beaten into kids' heads is "Don't just be yourself, be your 'Best Self'."


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## Jet Fuel Johnny (Jun 4, 2022)

The book with the fish with the pretty scales.

Then all these faggot fish come up, wanting his scales to wear.

And at the end of the book, he's all happy because he gives his fucking SKIN to these assholes and NOW they're his friends.

Fuck that. Whoever wrote that book was a commie.


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## Alex Krycek (Jun 4, 2022)

A lot of the problems we see today start with one thing so many people are taught in Kindergarten: “You are special”.

Now okay, sure people are unique as individuals sure, but that doesn’t make you particularly special. You aren’t important just because you show up to an event. You’re just kind of there. You’re a girl who likes toy tools or a boy who likes dolls? Big whoop. Nobody really cares nor should they. It’s probably just a phase they’ll grow out of during puberty anyway. 

This idea society has saying people are just intrinsically special is what led to a lot of this bullshit we are in now.


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## I'd abeeb bear (Jun 4, 2022)

"If you kill the bad guy, they win"
or
"If you kill a murderer, the number of murderers remains the same"

Obviously, just kill two murders as the memes go.  This is in literally _everything_ JRPG related since the mid-90s, and in most anime too.


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## AMHOLIO (Jun 4, 2022)

Most of the morals discussed so far are good in moderation or certain cases.  The problem is children's media HAS to be simple because kids can't go with the nuances of "this won't work now but it could work in a different situation".  Young kids tend to try on morals and be absolutist about things until something IRL changes their worldview.  Part of growing up is learning the grays of the world.

"I wish family wasn't so important" is true for a lot of abused children, but not true for all children.  If your brother is bullying you, maybe he is a budding douchebag, but maybe he is genuinely acting out and you two can make up over apple juice and transformers later.  Once you grow up YOU make the choices and are in charge.  You can make the call that your family sucks, you can run away from your problems, you don't need to try and understand bullies, and so on. 

Morality and expectations are dependent on situations.  Children's media has to shoot for wide messages that most PARENTS (because they can get a show canceled) are ok with.

TL; DR: of course not everything applies everywhere.


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## Iron Jaguar (Jun 4, 2022)

glass_houses said:


> he's a paedophile murderer


That seems like a good thing to be.


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## Reporterward (Jun 4, 2022)

It's little surprise that some KiwiFarmers are unable to understand the nuances of even the most basic children's story.

OP is wrong, of course. The family is important and vitally so given what we know of social outcasts in the news today. These aren't just some random individuals you get thrown in with. They are literally part of you down to the genetic level.
But the moral was always meant as a two way street. Yes, you are meant to better yourself to live up to your family's expectations and traditions. Help your parents, grandparents, siblings, and relations. But they also must reciprocate in kind.
Why?
Because it's IMPORTANT. And it goes back to your neolithic ancestors scrabbling out a living on the Russia steppe hunting mammoths and fighting off other tribes.
Now. Granted. You might have bad luck. You might be an orphan. Your family might well and truly be shit. But that doesn't mean the concept of "FAMILY" is bad though. That means YOU as the individual must work that much harder to achieve the ideal family and forge a future for yourself and your children.



thegooddoctor said:


> The entire storybook of the The Ugly Duckling, the book should be about self acceptance and learning to be happy with not being a normally attractive being in society, but by the end of the book the duckling doesn't have an epiphany after all the shit that he's been through being shat on by other animals and even his own family, to be like 'Im different, I can be happy with that, fuck them! Instead, the dude turns into a beautiful swan for no reason at the end and is accepted for finally being of a high enough standard to cater to societies shallow outlook. Its basically unintentional or not saying 'If your not beautiful your life is worthless unless you change yourself to cater to other peoples opinions even if they treat you badly' Real nice message to give to like the 4 year olds who first read that guys.



This is completely incorrect. The moral of the Ugly Duckling is that SOCIETY shouldn't judge the "Ugly Duckling" based on something superficial. This is especially relevant today for our young single male Kiwifarmers since the Ugly Duckling metaphor is most often associated with "Ugly" little girls in school. Well it turns out those Ugly little ducklings grow up to be beautiful swans, and aren't you the stupid Goose to make fun of her throughout her entire life in school.



Bulk Bogan said:


> Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer goes out of it's way to make all of the other reindeer (and elves, various other Santa employees) out to be vapid cunts, especially because they start fawning after Rudolph the moment he acquires a powerful patron.  Most of the adaptations go on to have him forgive all these assholes for being just the absolute worst to him his whole mutant life because, again, now they suck up to him because he's powerful so they must actually really like him now.  Forgiveness morals are always taught so badly, and I think it does damage to the kids who internalize those shit lessons.



Again. Completely misunderstanding the moral of a simple children's story. Emphasis. Children's story. This a two-way street for society. The other reindeer shouldn't make fun of Rudolph for something as silly as a glowing nose when you never know what hidden talents that individual has.

More important for this individual. It is absolutely and literally crazy and creepy to respond the way you recommend to the kids who teased him in school. They're reindeer games. These are kids. Kids tease each other. It doesn't matter.

Because Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer grows up and has to act like an adult. And an adult doesn't sit around all day brooding over the fact that some kids in the fourth grade once made fun of him for his stupid looking nose.

Rudolph is a well-adjusted individual. He has girlfriend. He has grown-up friends like an elf dentist and a crazy gold miner. He does fun stuff like travel and fight Bumble Snowmen. Rudolph has adult responsibilities to take care of.

Like KILLING COMMIES!

...

I mean. Delivering Christmas presents.


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## Padam (Jun 4, 2022)

All the "forget your past" bullshit that's all over modern Disney movies. I just don't get it.
If you had a shitty past, I understand that your memories are painful and that you want to get rid of them.
But if your past experiences were positive, what's the point of forgetting them?
Personally, I see the past as something neutral, with its good and bad memories. I'm not a nostalgia fag. And when I look back at negative experiences I think to myself "how to make sure it doesn't happen again".


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## Your Starter for 10 (Jun 4, 2022)

That revenge is bad and leads to an endless cycle of killing.  

That vigilantism is bad and should be left to the police because oh no you might get the wrong guy.


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## Newman's Lovechild (Jun 4, 2022)

Your Starter for 10 said:


> That revenge is bad and leads to an endless cycle of killing.
> 
> That vigilantism is bad and should be left to the police because oh no you might get the wrong guy.



I get the feeling we have to check your hard drive for a manifesto, D-Fens.


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## Your Starter for 10 (Jun 4, 2022)

Newman's Lovechild said:


> I get the feeling we have to check your hard drive for a manifesto, D-Fens.


Nah, I'm too lazy to write one.


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## Spunt (Jun 4, 2022)

Transformers told us that collecting plastic Transformer toys was cool. 35 years later we have Kevin Gibes.

Thanks a lot, Hasbro.


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## Bass (Jun 4, 2022)

Doug was pretty bad for having Doug never confronting his problems and him just daydreaming until the problem went away on its own.

So the moral was when you have troubles in life, shit yourself and do nothing about it and the universe will reward you for it.  Every time.


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## Sperghetti (Jun 4, 2022)

Sharing and taking turns.

The way this was always portrayed, at least when I was growing up, was letting other people play with toys and such when they ask to. The problem with that is that power in that exchange _always_ lies with the person who does not have the thing, while the owner/user is obligated to placate them or else be considered rude for "not sharing". Obviously kids don't pick up any notions about actual generosity from that because it doesn't involve _offering_ anything, nor do they pick up anything about having respect for other people's belongings; all they pick up is that when they ask somebody for something, they should get it or else the other person is being mean. (And needless to say, this also quickly leads to learning that other people can be careless and ruin your stuff.)

I think a similar but much better lesson would be to emphasize taking care of and having respect for things that are public resources, i.e., not breaking or using them up, not leaving things a mess, not taking more than you need, etc.


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## Kerwin White (Jun 4, 2022)

Xenomorph said:


> That you can be anything you want.



You can be one thing, if you're lucky. Most people are nothing.


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## Gig Bucking Fun (Jun 4, 2022)

> For myself, I absolutely can't stand "the importance of family" shit. Family is just the bunch of idiots you got thrown in with by random lottery, and IRL a lot of people who use this message are using it to abuse and emotionally manipulate kids.


Okay bro, we get it: your uncle molested you


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## Bulk Bogan (Jun 4, 2022)

Reporterward said:


> The other reindeer shouldn't make fun of Rudolph for something as silly as a glowing nose when you never know what hidden talents that individual has.



I mean, isn't that kinda part of the core poorly communicated message?  "Don't be mean to people because at some point they may become useful to you/famous/beautiful" is sociopathic.



Reporterward said:


> Rudolph is a well-adjusted individual. He has girlfriend. He has grown-up friends like an elf dentist and a crazy gold miner. He does fun stuff like travel and fight Bumble Snowmen. Rudolph has adult responsibilities to take care of.



He has people who actually give a shit about him, not his connection to the god-king of the north pole.  The better lesson for it to teach should probably be something along the lines of "find your real friends and be polite to but wary of people who only like you for your social status" or something like that.  Kids aren't that dumb, shades of nuance get across.

My point is that I feel the core message of forgiveness is mishandled, too simplified even for the intended audience of small children.


----------



## Bees (Jun 4, 2022)

That it’s bad to secure the existence of our people and a future for white children.


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## Manul Otocolobus (Jun 4, 2022)

You can trust the police.

Your teachers have your best interests in mind and you can trust them.

The US Government has a series of checks and balances to guarantee that the system works. You can also trust the government, they have your best interests in mind.

Things will turn out for the better in the end.

If you are an honest, moral, hardworking person, you will be rewarded accordingly for it.

Diversity and inclusion is a strength.



Bass said:


> Doug was pretty bad for having Doug never confronting his problems and him just daydreaming until the problem went away on its own.
> 
> So the moral was when you have troubles in life, shit yourself and do nothing about it and the universe will reward you for it.  Every time.


 
Doug had undiagnosed ADD and possible autism.


----------



## Dirk Willems (Jun 4, 2022)

Archie_Kimkicker said:


> Now imagine what certified flight instructors get wrong on the regular and think about it the next time you board a 50-seat airliner with some baby-faced junior first officer.


I can't board planes anyway lmao.


----------



## Shitted Scaredless (Jun 5, 2022)

The Disney Death.


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## skykiii (Jun 5, 2022)

Shitted Scaredless said:


> The Disney Death.


.... is not a moral lesson, unless I'm missing something like a retard.


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## PaleTay (Jun 5, 2022)

Most puritanical safe life messages. My grandfather was bad for this, he thought Call of Duty would make people serial killers because it went into a kill cam. He also freaked out at games which let you ragdoll bodies like Skyrim.


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## Skitarii (Jun 5, 2022)

War is bad and peace is good

Nigga I want to destroy cultures and turn kids into orphans


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## Shitted Scaredless (Jun 5, 2022)

skykiii said:


> .... is not a moral lesson, unless I'm missing something like a retard.


It's like a sort of "death is never permanent" message.


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## AMHOLIO (Jun 5, 2022)

Spunt said:


> Transformers told us that collecting plastic Transformer toys was cool. 35 years later we have Kevin Gibes.
> 
> Thanks a lot, Hasbro.


Finally, something truly poisoning the youth today.



PaleTay said:


> Most puritanical safe life messages. My grandfather was bad for this, he thought Call of Duty would make people serial killers because it went into a kill cam. He also freaked out at games which let you ragdoll bodies like Skyrim.


The ragdolling freaking him out is amazing.

I haven't seen many cartoons where the message is "violence on tv and games is bad", most of the animators of the world are very aware that it doesn't happen that way.  I remember things like Captain Planet which avoid violence at all cost since Ted Turner was insane, but can't think of any other examples from the top of my head.  Captain Planet was shit of course, further proving the point.



Skitarii said:


> War is bad and peace is good
> 
> Nigga I want to destroy cultures and turn kids into orphans


You know what, I can't blame a man for following his dreams.


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## skykiii (Jun 5, 2022)

Gig Bucking Fun said:


> Okay bro, we get it: your uncle molested you


No, man, its worse than that..... _he made me listen to Caramell Dansen!_


----------



## please (Jun 5, 2022)

The shy socially inept person who is outcast or ostracized from the community is usually the smartest and kindest in the room, bonus points if they're conventionally unattractive 

Truth is they're usually not liked for a reason and you shouldn't waste time or sanity helping the glue eaters. It's a nice gesture to be sure, but you gotta watch out for yourself too and understand weirdos are usually labeled as such for a reason. 

Don't bully them either though I mean be cool with them, just understand.


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## TheGoodNamesHaveBeenTaken (Jun 5, 2022)

"You should pick a career based on what you enjoy"

You should pick a career based on what you are able to do and what pays good.
Use the money from your job to do things you enjoy.
We can't all live our dreams.
The world only needs so many astronauts & ballerinas.
No one dreams about being a janitor or driving a trash truck but those are 2 very important jobs.
The cities would collapse much faster if we ran out of janitors and trash truck drivers than if we didn't have enough astronauts or ballerinas.


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## M3xus (Jun 5, 2022)

I may be dating myself, but fuck it. 

The D&D cartoon (among others, but it was one of the few that had the writers spell it out after the fact) was saddled by the moral guardians of its time with the message of "the group is always right, so the one that complains or points out something is a bad idea is wrong".  To the writers' credit, they knew right away this wasn't a good message for kids, seeing as peer pressure was a thing as far back as they can remember, so they had the complainer be right most of the time.  In light of current-year peer pressure to troon out as just a recent example, I don't think I need to explain why "you must always be in lockstep with the group" isn't a good lesson for kids.


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## skykiii (Jun 5, 2022)

M3xus said:


> I may be dating myself, but fuck it.
> 
> The D&D cartoon (among others, but it was one of the few that had the writers spell it out after the fact) was saddled by the moral guardians of its time with the message of "the group is always right, so the one that complains or points out something is a bad idea is wrong".  To the writers' credit, they knew right away this wasn't a good message for kids, seeing as peer pressure was a thing as far back as they can remember, so they had the complainer be right most of the time.  In light of current-year peer pressure to troon out as just a recent example, I don't think I need to explain why "you must always be in lockstep with the group" isn't a good lesson for kids.


Date yourself all you want.  I'd rather read about the Dungeons & Dragons cartoon than read another 1000 pages of people talking about [insert anime fad of the moment].

Ironically Eric was one of the more nuanced and ultimately correct portrayals of the complexity of group dynamic.  He wasn't wrong because he complained (despite what moral guardians wanted), in fact when he complained he was usually spot-on.  The only time he was wrong was when he (as Spoony would say) wound up splitting the party and cowboying out alone.  And that had less to do with being "wrong" and more to do with that his survival was more guaranteed if he were part of a group.  Which is probably where tribal morality like this comes from in the first place.


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## Xarpho (Jun 5, 2022)

Blasted Heath said:


> The retarded message that bullies and villains are actually misunderstood and hurting inside and just need a hug. It's such a boring trope.



The Simpsons parodied this in the first season, even if it ended with the bully (Nelson) eating cupcakes with everyone else.

The problem is a lot of bullies (not all of them, some of them are just spoiled assholes) _do_ come from broken homes, but that's not something that can be solved by kids themselves. A grade schooler is in a no way a psychologist that can help others work out their inner demons.



Meiwaku said:


> Most things that end up on retarded posters in western schools are gay and retarded.



I remember back in 5th grade a poster that said something like "What is popular isn't always right, what is right isn't always popular". It seemed pretty subversive back in the more conservative first-term Bush W era, but I was probably right in thinking that it was a one-way street.


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## Slap47 (Jun 5, 2022)

You should always share.... no, I purchased this and it is mine. I will respect your property and you should respect mine.


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## Meiwaku (Jun 5, 2022)

I've noticed in a lot of Western children's media they kind of will baby or sensor certain things about death and dying. Like... death is not something that is shied away from in Japanese media for kids where it's often sheltered to westerners.

It's something that I personally think is wrong just because I don't think that kids are unable to deal with that concept.


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## BlaireWhitesBottom (Jun 5, 2022)

how about Rudolph the red nosed reindeer? your friends will only care when you can do something for them


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## Hepativore (Jun 5, 2022)

One book that rubbed me the wrong way was The Giving Tree by Shel Silverstein.

It is kind of fucked up that the tree gives the kid everything and even lets him cut it down, yet the boy gives little in return.

This seemed like an abusive relationship.


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## PipTheAlchemist (Jun 5, 2022)

please said:


> Don't bully them either though


So, just let them be autistic fucking glue-eaters?
Fucking cuck


----------



## Milwaukee Macho Man (Jun 5, 2022)

BlaireWhitesBottom said:


> how about Rudolph the red nosed reindeer? your friends will only care when you can do something for them


This has proven true time and time again in my life.


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## Duke Nukem (Jun 5, 2022)

The Last Stand said:


> That you're at a disadvantage because of your race.


This kind of shit makes me nostalgic for the 90s of all eras. At least then it was optimistic and race wasn't weaponized the way it is now.


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## Blasted Heath (Jun 5, 2022)

Meiwaku said:


> I've noticed in a lot of Western children's media they kind of will baby or sensor certain things about death and dying. Like... death is not something that is shied away from in Japanese media for kids where it's often sheltered to westerners.
> 
> It's something that I personally think is wrong just because I don't think that kids are unable to deal with that concept.


I've never understood that. Most kids are naturally a little morbid and VERY curious, and young enough that they're not going to think too hard about death in books (there are exceptions, of course, and they're usually fine; they'll adjust at their own pace). Sometimes books that involve character deaths can be really good for them, especially if it'll help them understand the death of a relative or pet. 

Not that all kids books should be filled with death doom and destruction, but you know what I mean.


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## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Jun 5, 2022)

Blasted Heath said:


> I've never understood that. Most kids are naturally a little morbid and VERY curious, and young enough that they're not going to think too hard about death in books (there are exceptions, of course, and they're usually fine; they'll adjust at their own pace). Sometimes books that involve character deaths can be really good for them, especially if it'll help them understand the death of a relative or pet.
> 
> Not that all kids books should be filled with death doom and destruction, but you know what I mean.


My parents raised me going to funerals (mostly it was people I didn't hardly know if at all, the first actual close relative that died I was about 20) and apparently there were lots of parents in that generation who wouldn't take kids to funerals because they thought it would traumatize them. Granted, my parents also gave me the Talk when I was a little kid in blunt terms about yard chickens and human anatomy textbooks.

I've never been in the position of having to explain death to a small child, but if I were I'd just analogize it to something being broken. What happened to Grandpa? His body broke, like when a kid breaks a toy or a plate is broken. That ought to be easy to understand, the body has been destroyed, it won't "turn on," it is not functional anymore. Where does his soul go? At an older age, nobody knows. For kids, that's a cruel thing to inflict on them, you make up Heaven. I would never lie to a kid about a dog on a farm or anything like that. Rex is on a farm in the clouds, but his body is busted up and is going in the ground, and you're going to participate.

Cannot understand, sympathize, or agree with the desire to raise children in some Buddha-like cage of fake utopia.


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## Sumptinsfuckey (Jun 5, 2022)

Every. Kindergarten teacher. Ever.

"Did you bring enough for the whole class?"


No. Fuck you bitch. I bought my kid a fucking treat. Commie piece of shit.


----------



## Muttnik (Jun 5, 2022)

I feel like the early 2000's and even today's beanmouth Steven Universe-esque shows have this standard of LOL KIDZ RULE!!! ADULTS ARE OLD-FASHIONED AND DON'T UNDERSTAND YOUR [Dreams/sexuality/life goals/friends/etc.] HOW DARE THEY BE PROTECTIVE THEY'RE SOOOO DORKY AND LAME AMIRITE?!
Like, parents are pretty shitty now, given the degree of messed up tykes on twitter and discord, but the standard of pushing kids farther and farther away from valuing family and parental bonds isn't healthy. Especially nowadays when it's an easy means of grooming idiotic minors who feel like their parents don't "get" them.


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## Haint (Jun 5, 2022)

Any one could be president, you could become president, even little retard Timmy here. Now we know what it's like to elect "anyone" to the office.


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## Blasted Heath (Jun 5, 2022)

Muttnik said:


> I feel like the early 2000's and even today's beanmouth Steven Universe-esque shows have this standard of LOL KIDZ RULE!!! ADULTS ARE OLD-FASHIONED AND DON'T UNDERSTAND YOUR [Dreams/sexuality/life goals/friends/etc.] HOW DARE THEY BE PROTECTIVE THEY'RE SOOOO DORKY AND LAME AMIRITE?!
> Like, parents are pretty shitty now, given the degree of messed up tykes on twitter and discord, but the standard of pushing kids farther and farther away from valuing family and parental bonds isn't healthy. Especially nowadays when it's an easy means of grooming idiotic minors who feel like their parents don't "get" them.


I think part of that comes from the natural kid/teenage desire to get some freedom and independence from your parents. And rebellion is always a fun plot point, as are coming-of-age stories in which the protagonist discovers something new or makes a good change in the world.

But yeah, some shows are reeeally beating that trope to death, and adding the extra dimension of "the people who love you can't be trusted..._as opposed to these new ones here,_ who barely know you and conveniently hold all the trendy, mainstream-approved political views."


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## NoReturn (Jun 6, 2022)

glass_houses said:


> The other one is that the creepy, isolated, ostracised adult that absolutely everyone tells you not to go near because he's a paedophile murderer, is actually just misunderstood and just needs you to be their friend and they'll suddenly be completely normal under the smell of shit and stale wine. Stay _away_ from the homeless nutjob, for the love of Christ!





please said:


> The shy socially inept person who is outcast or ostracized from the community is usually the smartest and kindest in the room, bonus points if they're conventionally unattractive


One thing I'll give to the millinial parents I know - especially the moms - is that they aren't putting up with the whole "Saying no is bullying!" and "Ostracizing people is bullying!" shit with their own kids. 
I have seen far too many people who didn't know how to say no, or who ended up in bad/dangerous situations or relationships, all because they didn't want to be "mean". 



Jet Fuel Johnny said:


> The book with the fish with the pretty scales.
> 
> Then all these faggot fish come up, wanting his scales to wear.
> 
> ...


_The Rainbow Fish_ was written by Marcus Pfister.


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## Hepativore (Jun 6, 2022)

Another platitude that has been around for quite awhile that I take issue with, is the whole "you can be or do anything that you want to do if you put your mind to it." While I do think that some degree of optimism for people should be encouraged, a lot of people's success in their intended career or life in general depends on luck more than many are willing to admit. This has only become more true for the past few decades as there are numerous cases of people who did indeed bust their asses to get somewhere, there are also people who did the very same thing yet things did not go their way. You only hear about the success stories.

Before I come off as too much of a doomer, I think that to balance this out, people should be encouraged to realize how fortunate they really are if things do pan out for them in the long run and not be selfish assholes.


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## skykiii (Jun 6, 2022)

Hepativore said:


> Another platitude that has been around for quite awhile that I take issue with, is the whole "you can be or do anything that you want to do if you put your mind to it." While I do think that some degree of optimism for people should be encouraged, a lot of people's success in their intended career or life in general depends on luck more than many are willing to admit. This has only become more true for the past few decades as there are numerous cases of people who did indeed bust their asses to get somewhere, there are also people who did the very same thing yet things did not go their way. You only hear about the success stories.
> 
> Before I come off as too much of a doomer, I think that to balance this out, people should be encouraged to realize how fortunate they really are if things do pan out for them in the long run and not be selfish assholes.


You would like the computer game "The Crooked Man" (an RPG Maker game).  It's all about this kind of thing, and honestly is something I wish had become more mainstream.


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## InoperableForumCancer (Jun 6, 2022)

Not the absolute worst, but there have been endings that I have questioned.

1) The end of the new jungle book where the boy doesn't rejoin society and instead lives as a permavirgin with the retarded talking animals. Seem like a rejection of 'Adulting'

2) The end of Cars, when lightning throws the race to help the other guy. He could have helped after he won. You don't have to throw the race is to be a good sport. Is it a race or a morality purity test?


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## thebananaonion (Jun 8, 2022)

That rainbow fish book/animation
so you refuse to give what's rightfully yours to others who beg you for it, only to be ignored and hated by everyone, shit talked and guilt tripped by a supposed adult  into giving it up for the sake of sharing? 
Not only that but only then do others care about you and want to be your friend because you gave them something?
no those are fake friends and a bad lesson to kids. No body needs fake friends like that.


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## Lady Bizness (Jun 8, 2022)

I'll add in again with the moral ambiguity of the bad guy. As an adult, it's certainly more interesting than black and white good vs. bad, and sometimes I think a lot of this trend in media comes from my generation, as old as we are, still consuming children's media and expecting it to evolve as we have. I also think the trend comes from a well-intentioned push to curb bullying and prejudice. The problem is, as complex and explicable a bad guy's history leading to his bad behavior is, murdering and cannibalizing grandma in order to gain access to a child is still incredibly bad. That wolf deserved to get the axe from the woodsman and turning that story into anything else in the eye's of children does a disservice to them and their self-preserveational instincts.

How many modern versions of Cinderella have I seen where the step sisters were just misunderstood? It misses the whole point where vanity and clout-chasing is unvirtuous and foolish. It's similar to the ignorant take that the Columbine shooters did what they did because they were bullied. With time we finally found out no, they were the assholes themselves, and you can't love assholes into not being assholes.

It's fine to help children understand there are grey areas, to help them develop empathy, but it's not okay to promote being a doormat.


----------



## Merried Senior Comic (Jun 8, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> There's like this under belly within the right leaning groups that whites are this bringer of light race. That every thing modern was brought through them and everyone else is just stone aged monkeys.


It's true, though.


----------



## Coldgrip (Jun 8, 2022)

InoperableForumCancer said:


> 1) The end of the new jungle book where the boy doesn't rejoin society and instead lives as a permavirgin with the retarded talking animals. Seem like a rejection of 'Adulting'


It's been decades, but I think that's how the book ended. Mowgli and the animals wind up slaughtering the village IIRC.


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## Wraith (Jun 8, 2022)

There are loads of crap, but the top one on my mind was this: back in the 1980s there was a Dungeons & Dragons cartoon. One of the writers for the show was interviewed about his contributions to the thing. He openly said he was given instructions to attack the little wizard boy character, I think his name was Eric- I'm not sure, it's been decades. The reason was this: the wizard boy would be put in situations where he was 100% about situations. I mean deadly right, but because the 'group' disagreed with him, he had to be shut down and I think mocked or some such. The guy who wrote for that show wasn't happy about it. That was some communist (((special ass munches))) propaganda.
Lesson: Being right is completely worthless and will be mocked and you will be mocked if you're not accepted by the group.
I hate the media and how deep knowledge I have about (((them))).


----------



## PaleTay (Jun 10, 2022)

Muttnik said:


> I feel like the early 2000's and even today's beanmouth Steven Universe-esque shows have this standard of LOL KIDZ RULE!!! ADULTS ARE OLD-FASHIONED AND DON'T UNDERSTAND YOUR [Dreams/sexuality/life goals/friends/etc.] HOW DARE THEY BE PROTECTIVE THEY'RE SOOOO DORKY AND LAME AMIRITE?!
> Like, parents are pretty shitty now, given the degree of messed up tykes on twitter and discord, but the standard of pushing kids farther and farther away from valuing family and parental bonds isn't healthy. Especially nowadays when it's an easy means of grooming idiotic minors who feel like their parents don't "get" them.


I do think that's actually true of a lot of older parents, a lot of problems in society seem to stem from parents wanting to protect kids from great relationships because their friends smoke weed, or their friend's family has guns in the house or something. The parents don't actually know what they should be protective over their kids over and when they should give freedom.


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## A Grey Cat (Jun 10, 2022)

Peppa Pig...remember kids whine and complain and cry hard enough and you'll get what you want eventually, same with Caillou actually


----------



## Afinepickle (Jun 10, 2022)

That violence is never an acceptable response no matter what and that conflict resolution happens magically on its own so long as you just 'use your words' or whatever stupid platitude used to justify being a punching bag.

Sometimes you just have to pop a motherfucker in the mouth.


----------



## Sho'nuff (Jun 10, 2022)

Hepativore said:


> Another platitude that has been around for quite awhile that I take issue with, is the whole "you can be or do anything that you want to do if you put your mind to it." While I do think that some degree of optimism for people should be encouraged, a lot of people's success in their intended career or life in general depends on luck more than many are willing to admit. This has only become more true for the past few decades as there are numerous cases of people who did indeed bust their asses to get somewhere, there are also people who did the very same thing yet things did not go their way. You only hear about the success stories.
> 
> Before I come off as too much of a doomer, I think that to balance this out, people should be encouraged to realize how fortunate they really are if things do pan out for them in the long run and not be selfish assholes.



This one kind of reminds me of the misunderstanding of "the pursuit of happyness" and people thinking they have a right to be happy.  You only have the right to the pursuit.
The you can be anything you want to be crowd, needs to rebrand to make kids understand that they are welcome to try to be whatever they want, but the outcome is never decided. Still in the modern world that simple truth, that you can try to be whatever you want, is rare.  Most places you are locked into a certain amount of freedom, not so much here. 
The natural conclusion still being, most people will fail and will die homeless and alone, which is fine.


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## Rear Admiral Butthole (Jun 10, 2022)

It's not explicitly children's media, but since it was marketed to and consumed by the youth of its time, I'd have to say Grease. The movie basically ends with the message "if you do what your friends do, especially if they're the cool kids of the time, then you're cool ". Fast forward 30 years and if you do that you have a 50-50 chance of killing yourself.

If that still doesn't qualify as kid's media, then there's this one episode of Popeye (it was written like a PSA but it was an actual episode) that ends with him singing "if ya spank kids I betcha, your conscience will getcha". Nigger, discipline your kids (when you're old enough to have them).


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## Cloaca Rimjob (Jun 10, 2022)

That old fable about the Roman pulling a thorn out of a lions paw. 

Never approach an injured animal.


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## 𝕺𝖑' 𝕯𝖎𝖗𝖙𝖞 𝕱𝖆𝖙𝖘𝖔 (Jun 10, 2022)

The Last Stand said:


> That you're at a disadvantage because of your race.


I'm a libtard but at the same time its fucking insane to me that schools are teaching about white privilege and shit. Kids are too young to really understand any kind of sociological nuance and it only serves to reinforce the hierarchy through mutual resentment.


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## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Jun 10, 2022)

InoperableForumCancer said:


> Not the absolute worst, but there have been endings that I have questioned.
> 
> 1) The end of the new jungle book where the boy doesn't rejoin society and instead lives as a permavirgin with the retarded talking animals. Seem like a rejection of 'Adulting'
> 
> 2) The end of Cars, when lightning throws the race to help the other guy. He could have helped after he won. You don't have to throw the race is to be a good sport. Is it a race or a morality purity test?


RETURN TO MONKE

REJECT MODERNITY
EMBRACE TRADITION


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## Overcast (Jun 10, 2022)

InoperableForumCancer said:


> 2) The end of Cars, when lightning throws the race to help the other guy. He could have helped after he won. You don't have to throw the race is to be a good sport. Is it a race or a morality purity test?


For me, that scene was an important indicator of how much Lightning changed over the course of the film. At the beginning, he was absolutely full of himself and saw places like Radiator Springs as well as the people there to be beneath him. All he cared about was his career and being the "best".

By not crossing the finish line and instead helping Doc, he demonstrates that his priorities changed and that he values the friends he made over his ego.

I know Cars as a franchise doesn't have the greatest reputation and I won't say it's the best Pixar has to offer. But I do feel the first film hit all the general requirements needed for a decent kid's film.


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## sperginity (Jun 10, 2022)

> ... For myself, I absolutely can't stand "the importance of family" shit. Family is just the bunch of idiots you got thrown in with by random lottery, and IRL a lot of people who use this message are using it to abuse and emotionally manipulate kids.


you inherited most of your personality and intelligence from your family. Those two things together have good predictive power for what your life will be like. It is a situation where you can pick apart whatever is wrong with the system, but no one has found something that works better (this holds true for most important things- law, medicine, voting, etc). genetic family is the best shot anyone has. 

In fact, I would go as far as to say that the lesson that you can choose your family is way worse. The safety of being with your real family, for children, is that relatives will protect them from serious physical harm without a moment's hesitation. A chosen family or stranger is less likely to do that, and it isn't even on the level of conscious decision making, it happens in an instant without anyone having time to think. In the longer term having your dad around gives you a much greater chance of succeeding in life, but every show lies and tells kids that any situation labeled "family" is equal. It just isn't true. I understand that there probably isn't a way to communicate this to kids without them picking on children whose dads are not around, but it is better to shut the fuck up than propagandize them. This line of bullshit also enables horrible women to serially introduce new men into their homes without giving the kids any way to articulate why that makes them so upset. 


My entry is going to be the trope of children not belonging in their families at all. There are way too many popular stories out there where uniquely horrible people have one amazing virtuous child. IRL that is like seeing a fucking unicorn. People who don't have kids confuse innocence with being virtuous, they confuse potential with what you can expect to be achieved. Most shitty people come from a long line of shitty people, and most good people come from a long line of good people. Most people are in the middle somewhere, a mix of issues and virtues. It takes some luck (good or bad) and a ton of effort to buck the trend, and even then it might not continue to the next generation. It is important to give people the chance to do better than the family they came from, but it is retardedly naïve to expect that even half will do it when they get the chance.


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## The Gifted Kid (Jun 10, 2022)

Captain Planet... the whole series and its messages have aged like milk. It's actually funny how insane that show was in retrospect. I especially like the one episode that framed China's one child policy as a good thing and that other countries should follow suit. There were a few other cartoons from the 90s that had similar messages but I can't remember the names of them.


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## Return of the Freaker (Jun 10, 2022)

The Gifted Kid said:


> Captain Planet... the whole series and its messages have aged like milk. It's actually funny how insane that show was in retrospect. I especially like the one episode that framed China's one child policy as a good thing and that other countries should follow suit. There were a few other cartoons from the 90s that had similar messages but I can't remember the names of them.


Captain Planet literally had an episode where the Planeteers had to defend the Rio Conference from attack AKA the UN conference that drafted Agenda 21


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## Kiwi Lime Pie (Jun 10, 2022)

Ughubughughughughughghlug said:


> My parents raised me going to funerals (mostly it was people I didn't hardly know if at all, the first actual close relative that died I was about 20) and apparently there were lots of parents in that generation who wouldn't take kids to funerals because they thought it would traumatize them.


Can confirm. I don't remember the visitation at all, but I was around 5 years old when I was taken to my first funeral visitation. I think it was someone my parents knew whose kid died young from childhood cancer. Everyone was surprised my parents took me to a funeral home, let alone the visitation for a kid around my age, because of the whole idea death was too traumatizing. However my parents apparently talked to me beforehand and I wasn't bothered or upset one bit by the experience. 

I suppose it depends on how parents approach death. If they're in denial about it, they'll either avoid the topic or go out of their way to be overprotect to avoid traumatizing their kids. If they're realistic about it, they will find an age-appropriate way to handle it. I like the example someone up-thread used of a body that's broken and can't work any more.  There's also the example of how (classic) Sesame Street handled the actor thay played Mr. Hooper's death by including it in the show and using Big Bird as a way to explain to a young kid what happened and how to handle the ensuing questions.


----------



## mario if smoke weed (Jun 10, 2022)

The whole fucking idea that dogs are "man's best friend" and that every kid should adopt a dog, love dogs, let dogs lick your face.

Dogs aren't just gross and ugly, they're dangerous to small children. Not just bully breeds, but dogs in general. They can maul kids if they're pissed off enough, infect kids with diseases, and they cost way too damn much for what they're worth. Yet a bunch of crazies managed to convince families to go out and get them, even the fucked up little ones.

You know how many shows have dogs as the "lovable pet"? Too many to count. Some of those shows vilify cats too. Shit's fucked.

Edit: found the dog nut *points down*


----------



## The Curmudgeon (Jun 10, 2022)

Any shows that have one character suddenly doing better than their friends and peers, then those same friends/peers get jealous and guilt trip the successful character back into mediocrity. Usually this said character is shown to be good at something, or smart, or their standard of living improves. Before you know it, they're the bad guy simply because they stopped being a loser or a generic normie. Basically, the lesson is that you should never strive to be better because you might hurt people's feelings.


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## glass_houses (Jun 10, 2022)

mario if smoke weed said:


> The whole fucking idea that dogs are "man's best friend" and that every kid should adopt a dog, love dogs, let dogs lick your face.
> 
> Dogs aren't just gross and ugly, they're dangerous to small children. Not just bully breeds, but dogs in general. They can maul kids if they're pissed off enough, infect kids with diseases, and they cost way too damn much for what they're worth. Yet a bunch of crazies managed to convince families to go out and get them, even the fucked up little ones.
> 
> ...


Respectfully disagree, but I still love you.

Growing up my dog was my best mate. I had a pretty rough time for a number of reasons, and the only thing in this world that gave me unconditional love and acceptance was my dog. He protected myself and family members during bad situations several times, even though generally he was an overgrown pansy. My dog was the best mate I've ever had, irregardless of species. I've never had another dog since because nothing could replace him.

I've had bad experiences with untrained and aggressive dogs too, so I'm not going to downplay the fact that they can be dangerous when they're badly bred, untrained, or rottweilers, but having a good dog by your side is wonderful and a great thing for a kid.

EDIT: A word


----------



## Dwight Frye (Jun 11, 2022)

Be nice to the weirdos of the world because you don’t know what they’re going through. 

The one episode that stands out to me most is Pigeon Man from Hey Arnold. Nice little sentimental episode but for every one truly misunderstood weirdo like Pigeon Man there’s twenty nut jobs who would have robbed, beat the shit out of or done something worse to Arnold or a kid like him. Most people like Pigeon Man aren’t kindhearted loners with a heart of gold, they’re drug addicts, mentally ill, violent and wound up where they’re at because of their bad life decisions. Teach kids to avoid these people because they’re more often than not dangerous


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## thebananaonion (Jun 11, 2022)

mario if smoke weed said:


> The whole fucking idea that dogs are "man's best friend" and that every kid should adopt a dog, love dogs, let dogs lick your face.
> 
> Dogs aren't just gross and ugly, they're dangerous to small children. Not just bully breeds, but dogs in general. They can maul kids if they're pissed off enough, infect kids with diseases, and they cost way too damn much for what they're worth. Yet a bunch of crazies managed to convince families to go out and get them, even the fucked up little ones.
> 
> ...


It's not tht we're dog nuts it's just you're being dumb.
i will agree with the villanising cats thing though. 
this whole cats vs dogs/ dogs good cats bad or vise versa thing does help to no animals. Showing off that dogs are these perfect pets that do no wrong and cats as these mischievous little shit bags constantly is what leads to peopl being bad dog/ cat owners.
'well i cant say no the little  Rover look how cute he is. it was only a plushie anyway...'
'well cats are just assholses so no need to correct bad behavior'


Spoiler: dogs



Tiny powerlevel but ive owned both cats and dogs. Dogs are harder to train in my experience because most breeds were made for working. Also dont get a husky unless you have a big garden- many people buy dogs for the aesthetics and not the ethicality of the breed their buying. Make sure you have one that aligns with your lifestyle. You run frequently? then a husky or a wippet is fine for you (if you can put up with huskies backtalking and screaming at fuck all). More into a quieter lifestyle/ Westies and Shi-zus are your pick. Each breed is its own puzzle to solve, do research and ensure the breed's fit for your life otherwise you get behavioral issues, a mess of a dog and if left to go to bad, a dangerous one. Just do your own research ffs and yeah, adopt over shop. Who cares if a dog is a pure-inbreed pedigree? yes many adopted dogs may be harder to train than a newly born puppy because dogs can experience past trauma too, but its very rewarding, and many old dogs need a good last few years of life in a loving home rather than in a pen. Puppy mills lead to old dogs and unwanted dogs in adoptive centres.






Spoiler: cats



When it comes to cats, the issue is- people try to treat them like dogs. no, seriously. People think basic things like heavy panting or tail flicking is normal behaviour because theyre projecting dog trates onto cats. This is why cats are seen as assholes- they do things you wouldnt expect a dog to do, so people get pissy. Cats need more beds around the house, a high place to relax,  more space and alone compared to a dog, and especially, do not mistake tail flicking for a wagging tail- the cat's becoming pissed, back up. and yes catbreeds exist, and each breed is their own deal too like how a Ragdolls are calmer or a Main Coon are a beast and are very protective of their owner. emphasis on the singluar- because they will pick favourites and if you have a partner it will take a lot of training and time for the cat to be fine with their favourite human's attention not constantly being on them/trust other people is hard.
And yes, cats can be lovable creatures you just have to wait for them to come to you. you can easily go up to your dog and pet them no issue because they were bred to unconditionally love their humans. cats were bred to kill mice on farms and occasionally fed as a thank you. if you dont keep their chasing-catching behaviour in tack or feed them consistently at the same time, theyre going to act out by annoying you because that's how they insured farmers fed them.





Spoiler: both can get along too



oh and the myth cats and dogs can't get along is only partially true. dogs may mistake tail flicking from cats as a sign of negaguement, vise versa cats mistake it for a sign of agression but if you slowly introduce the animals to eachother, led them feed beside eachother with a barricade between just to get use to sent, make sure the animals have their own seporate beds away from eachothe r(especially  a high placed one for the cat), then things should be a lot better


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## PipTheAlchemist (Jun 11, 2022)

mario if smoke weed said:


> The whole fucking idea that dogs are "man's best friend" and that every kid should adopt a dog, love dogs, let dogs lick your face.
> 
> Dogs aren't just gross and ugly, they're dangerous to small children. Not just bully breeds, but dogs in general. They can maul kids if they're pissed off enough, infect kids with diseases, and they cost way too damn much for what they're worth. Yet a bunch of crazies managed to convince families to go out and get them, even the fucked up little ones.
> 
> ...


Agreed. Adopt foxes, instead. They're way cooler


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## Xarpho (Jun 20, 2022)

Kiwi Lime Pie said:


> Can confirm. I don't remember the visitation at all, but I was around 5 years old when I was taken to my first funeral visitation. I think it was someone my parents knew whose kid died young from childhood cancer. Everyone was surprised my parents took me to a funeral home, let alone the visitation for a kid around my age, because of the whole idea death was too traumatizing. However my parents apparently talked to me beforehand and I wasn't bothered or upset one bit by the experience.
> 
> I suppose it depends on how parents approach death. If they're in denial about it, they'll either avoid the topic or go out of their way to be overprotect to avoid traumatizing their kids. If they're realistic about it, they will find an age-appropriate way to handle it. I like the example someone up-thread used of a body that's broken and can't work any more.  There's also the example of how (classic) Sesame Street handled the actor thay played Mr. Hooper's death by including it in the show and using Big Bird as a way to explain to a young kid what happened and how to handle the ensuing questions.


I never had any pets as a really young kid but parents that tell their kids that Fido and/or Whiskers "went to a farm" or something pisses me off, and I'm glad my parents would never do that.


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## supremeautismo (Jun 20, 2022)

A lot of 90’s movies had the theme of “Dad needs to _spend more time _with his kids and he’s *bad* if he doesn’t!”  It just feels really reductive when a lot of parents have to work constantly just to make ends meet, and quitting their job and putting their family in jeopardy isn’t really the smart move. 

Also, movies where the divorced parents get back together.  Encouraging this is so damaging to a child’s psyche.  Hollywood really didn’t handle divorce well 25+ years ago.


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## LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] (Jun 20, 2022)

The hyperfocus on the power of friendship. 

Lets be real, most people shed their group of friends every few years as they grow up and later in life friendships are formed more from mutual benefit and self interest. Kids media doesn't teach self reliance and dealing with change enough, but waiting until some friends pick you up who will be there forever because friendship is magic. 

I like media that acknowledges that childhood friendship is nice but people move on and thats ok. Like the girl who leap through time, i think Digimon did something like that, were the chosen kids just kinda go their own way and each has their own lives by the end.


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## Xarpho (Jun 23, 2022)

supremeautismo said:


> A lot of 90’s movies had the theme of “Dad needs to _spend more time _with his kids and he’s *bad* if he doesn’t!”  It just feels really reductive when a lot of parents have to work constantly just to make ends meet, and quitting their job and putting their family in jeopardy isn’t really the smart move.
> 
> Also, movies where the divorced parents get back together.  Encouraging this is so damaging to a child’s psyche.  Hollywood really didn’t handle divorce well 25+ years ago.


I can only think of The Parent Trap that did such a thing. Most of the Spielberg movies didn't have a full family resolution because he had a hang-up about his own family. In The Santa Clause the ex-wife gets a new husband and he gets an Oscar Meyer Weenie Whistle at the end.


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## cream pie (Jun 23, 2022)

That you should listen to your feelings instead of your superiors. I look forward to bulldozing their neighborhoods in 2032 to create subsidized housing projects that I can extort rent and pimp them out from


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## Freshly Baked Socks (Jun 23, 2022)

You can trust a nigger. What, are you racist?

[to self: Why does my bike keep getting stolen?]


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## skykiii (Jun 24, 2022)

The Gifted Kid said:


> Captain Planet... the whole series and its messages have aged like milk. It's actually funny how insane that show was in retrospect. I especially like the one episode that framed China's one child policy as a good thing and that other countries should follow suit. There were a few other cartoons from the 90s that had similar messages but I can't remember the names of them.


God, Captain Planet is a show I can't tell if I like it ironically or not.  It's basically proto-Woke culture in the sense that it starts from premises that make some sort of sense, and to be fair most episodes are fine.... but then there's the batshit.

There's one episode in season one that bothers me though, and its not insane or anything, just.... okay, the plot is Sly Sludge has claimed to invent a pollution-free way of getting rid of garbage via a shrink ray.  The twist is the ray is actually just a light show and the trash is being sent to a volcano to be incinerated.  The show acts like this is terrible (even though Sludge is actually not being villainous for once and seems to genuinely think this is a good solution), but....

....Like, why wouldn't this work?  Is there a real reason?  The best the episode itself gives us is that the volcano erupts... but it never says the trash set it off.  For all we know, it was going to erupt anyway.

It's an autistic thing to get hung up on, I know, but like.... why isn't this a solution?


----------



## Safir (Jun 24, 2022)

thegooddoctor said:


> The entire storybook of the The Ugly Duckling


> What's the most absolutely wrong "lesson" you've seen taught in media aimed at kids?
That baby swans are ugly.
They're adorable!


(And if ducks were hating on a cygnet just because he doesn't look like a duckling, why would they find a swan beautiful?)



Archie_Kimkicker said:


> Crime doesn't pay." Is probably the most dangerously spread lessons in our society.


Crime pays but for a certain type of person. Stories in which a sympathetic normie turns to crime out of desperation have it right: he _will_ get fucked, probably by career criminals too.



Overcast said:


> All he cared about was his career and being the "best".
> 
> By not crossing the finish line and instead helping Doc, he demonstrates that his priorities changed and that he values the friends he made over his ego.


All he cared about was being the best at racing, now all he cares about is being the best at virtue signalling.



The Curmudgeon said:


> Any shows that have one character suddenly doing better than their friends and peers, then those same friends/peers get jealous and guilt trip the successful character back into mediocrity.


I haven't seen it irl to work even as a cautionary tale as long as we're talking normies and not a crab bucket of complete degenerates. The real danger is almost always is that if you become successful, your friends/peers will want you to make them successful too.


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## LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] (Jun 24, 2022)

Safir said:


> The real danger is almost always is that if you become successful, your friends/peers will want you to make them successful too.


Kids media has some weird takes about rich families. Tropes were the rich kid has divorced parents, the one rich kid is really sickly and overprotected or is lonely and gets no attention from his parents who are never around or are too materialistic and work obssesed to notice them. If a kid from the main cast becomes rich the plot of the episode becomes how he suddenly feels alienated by his new upper class lifestyle and misses his former friends so much he is happy to be back in the poorhouse

I know it sucks but many rich kids irl are well adjusted and have lovely nuclear families who love them,  life can really be unfair like that.


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## TheGoodNamesHaveBeenTaken (Jun 25, 2022)

Others have hit on this but the whole "The bully is just crying out for help becase he has problems at home" trope.

Guess what?  Everyone has problems at home.  Most people don't seek out smaller/ weaker people to beat up to make us feel better.


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## Overcast (Jun 25, 2022)

I remember watching The Lego Movie 2 a few years back and there was this sub-plot where the queen of the alien things emotionally manipulates Batman into marrying her by saying that if he won't marry her that she's sure Superman would. I thought at first that this was just a goofy scene that would lead into another scene where Batman breaks things off. Later on however, they both realize that they actually did love each other all along.

This is the same movie that not so subtly talks about how bad toxic masculinity is while also saying to "be yourself".

Like, I know these movies don't take themselves that seriously, but that's still kind of a fucked up message to be sending to kids.


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## Homicide (Jun 25, 2022)

"Always tell the truth to avoid getting in trouble," or How To Grow Up And Lie Compulsively Because Now You Have Trust Issues

I haven't seen it portrayed specifically in the media but my mom had to get that dumbass idea some place.


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## skykiii (Jun 25, 2022)

Overcast said:


> I remember watching The Lego Movie 2 a few years back and there was this sub-plot where the queen of the alien things emotionally manipulates Batman into marrying her by saying that if he won't marry her that she's sure Superman would. I thought at first that this was just a goofy scene that would lead into another scene where Batman breaks things off. Later on however, they both realize that they actually did love each other all along.
> 
> This is the same movie that not so subtly talks about how bad toxic masculinity is while also saying to "be yourself".
> 
> Like, I know these movies don't take themselves that seriously, but that's still kind of a fucked up message to be sending to kids.


"Be yourself... except when it offends our values."


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## Bass (Jun 25, 2022)

Return of the Freaker said:


> Captain Planet literally had an episode where the Planeteers had to defend the Rio Conference from attack AKA the UN conference that drafted Agenda 21


You could make a whole thread like this about questionable lessons about Captain Planet.  First and foremost nuclear power is always bad, although I could see a case for Linka or whatever the Russian girl's name is being a bit apprehensive about it.


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## Red Hood (Jun 25, 2022)

mario if smoke weed said:


> The whole fucking idea that dogs are "man's best friend" and that every kid should adopt a dog, love dogs, let dogs lick your face.
> 
> Dogs aren't just gross and ugly, they're dangerous to small children. Not just bully breeds, but dogs in general. They can maul kids if they're pissed off enough, infect kids with diseases, and they cost way too damn much for what they're worth. Yet a bunch of crazies managed to convince families to go out and get them, even the fucked up little ones.
> 
> ...


Found the redditor.


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## The Lawgiver (Jun 25, 2022)

The Gifted Kid said:


> Captain Planet... the whole series and its messages have aged like milk. It's actually funny how insane that show was in retrospect. I especially like the one episode that framed China's one child policy as a good thing and that other countries should follow suit. There were a few other cartoons from the 90s that had similar messages but I can't remember the names of them.


The funniest one is the one wherethe villains plot is literally to spread AIDS by making the other kids aware the kidhas AIDS and then they get scared about possibly getting AIDS which will somehow make them get AIDS. That kind of logic is so ass-broken because you get AIDS from HIV which spreads via bodily fluids, which IIRC was already a known thing at the time the episode got made, making it even more fucking deranged.


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## Dwight Frye (Jun 25, 2022)

The Lawgiver said:


> The funniest one is the one wherethe villains plot is literally to spread AIDS by making the other kids aware the kidhas AIDS and then they get scared about possibly getting AIDS which will somehow make them get AIDS. That kind of logic is so ass-broken because you get AIDS from HIV which spreads via bodily fluids, which IIRC was already a known thing at the time the episode got made, making it even more fucking deranged.


Nah the best one is where they encounter Hitler (somehow) and his stare is so evil it depowers all of them and essentially starts killing Captain Planet. It’s like the nazi version of the Care Bear Stare


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## The Lawgiver (Jun 25, 2022)

Dwight Frye said:


> Nah the best one is where they encounter Hitler (somehow) and his stare is so evil it depowers all of them and essentially starts killing Captain Planet. It’s like the nazi version of the Care Bear Stare


that one's fucking great too lmao. For some reason they also gave hitler a fucking handlebar anime mustache.


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## mario if smoke weed (Jun 25, 2022)

Red Hood said:


> Found the redditor.


Shit ive been expoised


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## Biggusstickus (Jun 25, 2022)

Going through 5 years in college and being in debt will guarantee you success in life. And nowadays going to STEM will put you in success when spots in these technical fields are being filled quickly and by foreign students.


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## LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] (Jun 25, 2022)

Biggusstickus said:


> And nowadays going to STEM will put you in success when spots in these technical fields are being filled quickly and by foreign students.


there's just so many engineers now, its crazy and things will only get worse.


----------



## Muttnik (Jun 25, 2022)

"Depression can be solved with the power of love and friendship!"

Fuck off. Most people are depressed because they have no one. They're isolated and lonely. There's no support and if you don't fit the right woke criteria these days, you're unlikely to ever break the mold in terms of sympathy from your peers.


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## Thiletonomics (Jun 26, 2022)

The lesson of "Never giving up". While it's a reasonable lesson to teach in theory, there are sometimes where you have to let go of something, if it is a lost cause.


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## TheGoodNamesHaveBeenTaken (Jun 26, 2022)

Thiletonomics said:


> The lesson of "Never giving up". While it's a reasonable lesson to teach in theory, there are sometimes where you have to let go of something, if it is a lost cause.


A harder to teach but much more practical lesson would be "Sometimes your best just isn't good enough and that thing you really, really want to happen isn't going to happen.  No amount of hard work will change that.  The sooner you put your energy towards somthing you can actually accomplish, the happier you will be."


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## LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] (Jun 26, 2022)

Thiletonomics said:


> The lesson of "Never giving up". While it's a reasonable lesson to teach in theory, there are sometimes where you have to let go of something, if it is a lost cause.


thats true, with smaller kids is tricky because they haven't stuck to something long enough yet to know how good they can become if they keep trying, they are barely going to be getting their first experiences with failure so its probably best to encourage them with mostly positive feedback. For a teenager definitely would be useful if there was more stuff conveying that sometimes the best move is lateral and that sometimes you fail and thats it, there's no comeback, no underdog story, no zero to hero, you just fail but that doesn't mean you can't still succed at something else. "being bad at one thing doesn't mean you are bad at everything" is a good message i'd like to see often, a middle ground between "everyone's special just for trying" from american cartoons and the uber competitive japanese cartoon "failure is not an option"


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## Damien Thorne (Jun 26, 2022)

Finding Nemo led to sn epidemic of kids flushing the fish in the family aquarium down the toilet to free them.


----------



## Caesare (Jun 27, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> That every thing modern was brought through them and everyone else is just stone aged monkeys.


That's true though, you creep.


----------



## Astro Loafo (Jun 27, 2022)

Caesare said:


> That's true though, you creep.


The only thing whites ever brought to other races is disease.


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## Xarpho (Jun 27, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> The only thing whites ever brought to other races is disease.



Where in kids’ media talks about what have whites brought to the world, you race-baiting sperg?


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## Astro Loafo (Jun 27, 2022)

Xarpho said:


> Where in kids’ media talks about what have whites brought to the world, you race-baiting sperg?


Have you never been to school and get ragged on? Especially now that there's alt right rejects going full fedora on campus now.


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## Michael_Jordan_Peterson (Jun 27, 2022)

Muttnik said:


> "Depression can be solved with the power of love and friendship!"
> 
> Fuck off. Most people are depressed because they have no one. They're isolated and lonely. There's no support and if you don't fit the right woke criteria these days, you're unlikely to ever break the mold in terms of sympathy from your peers.


I think depression is mostly based on vitamin d and test levels. Why most gays and women are so depressed.


----------



## Bunny Tracks (Jun 27, 2022)

That you should forgive everyone even if they're irredeemable, unrepentant monsters.


----------



## raspberry mocha (Jun 27, 2022)

Big walls bad. Don't fortify your city to keep the citizens safe. The people on the other side are totally not invaders. Safety is just pretense for bigotry.


----------



## ICametoLurk (Jun 27, 2022)

In the new Disney Star Wars for those that don't know,

Palpatine basically created Anakin Skywalker
Used him as a tool for eons via manipulating his emotions
Whose saved via Luke his son who said "NO" to people that said to kill him.
Palpatine was killed but comes back
Palpatine has Luke's nephew turned to a tool
 Luke's nephew kills everyone that stopped Palpatine
Palpatine's Granddaughter who was created by Palpatine has everything Luke and his Sister had.


----------



## stupid orc (Jun 27, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> But punk originates from Peru. Synth and new wave.... Chile. And even I find it baffling that I can't process this.


genuinely curious where you got this from i’ve never heard this.


----------



## Uberpenguin (Jun 27, 2022)

As a kid people were always taught "Don't be so self conscious, people don't look at you or pay attention to you at all" and as I've gotten older the idea's annoyed me, because that's not true. People absolutely will look at you and think about you, it's just that they usually think much more charitable thoughts than you'd expect.



Michael_Jordan_Peterson said:


> I think depression is mostly based on vitamin d and test levels. Why most gays and women are so depressed.





Spoiler: Ranty



That's crazy. There's a whole thread about depression in health and fitness, in which I made a long post about depression and inflammation levels/immune response/sickness behaviors, including citation and clinical agreement that depression, OCD like behaviors, and inflammation are linked, to the point that if they shoot a person up with inflammation factors they will virtually always develop symptoms of severe depression.
Vitamin D shows variable benefit. Shit like omega 3s, B-12 complex supplementation, turmeric, saffron, NAC, etc? They show very consistent benefit.

And besides, what the hell do people think testosterone is going to do besides drive you insane at how out of your hands everything feels? Being masculine is fucking miserable nowadays because of how castrated everything is, if you aren't tactful about acting like a toxic male you get slapped on the fucking nose. women aren't more depressed, they're just more likely to admit it, dudes are the ones actually blowing their brains out.


----------



## R00T (Jun 27, 2022)

InoperableForumCancer said:


> Not the absolute worst, but there have been endings that I have questioned.
> 
> 1) The end of the new jungle book where the boy doesn't rejoin society and instead lives as a permavirgin with the retarded talking animals. Seem like a rejection of 'Adulting'
> 
> 2) The end of Cars, when lightning throws the race to help the other guy. He could have helped after he won. You don't have to throw the race is to be a good sport. Is it a race or a morality purity test?


The point was that Lightning didn’t want to put people before winning. Not that its wrong to, but rather that he had found the place he wanted to be. The third movie has a better story highlighting that it’s okay to move on and let someone else take over.


----------



## Pee Cola (Jun 27, 2022)

Any cartoon with anthropomorphic animals combined with the "you can be anything you want if you put your mind to it" messages. Some especially impressionable youngsters probably became furries as a direct result of being exposed to that shit.

On a semi-related note, fuck The Smurfs. It's thinly veiled commie propaganda.


----------



## Begemot (Jun 28, 2022)

The Last Stand said:


> That you're at a disadvantage because of your race.


White subhumans sure are!!!


----------



## Lumdarling (Jun 28, 2022)

Pee Cola said:


> Any cartoon with anthropomorphic animals combined with the "you can be anything you want if you put your mind to it" messages. Some especially impressionable youngsters probably became furries as a direct result of being exposed to that shit.
> 
> On a semi-related note, fuck The Smurfs. It's thinly veiled commie propaganda.


I'm actually surprised Smurfs did a villain who was a stereotyped middle ages Jew who wanted to eat children, was obsessed with gold, practiced witchcraft, and both he and his cat had Hebrew-sounding names.  Iirc the cat was even named something that sounded like a Hebrew name for satan (Azrael? Azel?)  

Guess this was back during the antisemetic phase of Russian communism.


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## PipTheAlchemist (Jun 28, 2022)

Lumdarling said:


> Guess this was back during the antisemetic phase of Russian communism.


The Smurfs was made in Belgium, retard


----------



## Android raptor (Jun 28, 2022)

Evolution isn't real.


----------



## The Ugly One (Jun 28, 2022)

that drag queens are safe for kids to be around


----------



## Smaug's Smokey Hole (Jun 28, 2022)

That if there is a fire they should run away from it. No. The right thing to do is stop drop and roll. And if you use curse words Satan won't ever mess with you out of respect.


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## skykiii (Jun 28, 2022)

Lumdarling said:


> Iirc the cat was even named something that sounded like a Hebrew name for satan (Azrael? Azel?)


Azrael, yes.

(My unfortunate superpower is I have a stupidly eidetic memory for any cartoon I've ever seen more than once)


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## CansOfCant (Jun 29, 2022)

skykiii said:


> God, Captain Planet is a show I can't tell if I like it ironically or not.  It's basically proto-Woke culture in the sense that it starts from premises that make some sort of sense, and to be fair most episodes are fine.... but then there's the batshit.
> 
> There's one episode in season one that bothers me though, and its not insane or anything, just.... okay, the plot is Sly Sludge has claimed to invent a pollution-free way of getting rid of garbage via a shrink ray.  The twist is the ray is actually just a light show and the trash is being sent to a volcano to be incinerated.  The show acts like this is terrible (even though Sludge is actually not being villainous for once and seems to genuinely think this is a good solution), but....
> 
> ...


Because that would have allowed humans to continue living at their current level of consumption and comfort, and while what's acceptable may certainly be a debate to be had, watermelons like Turner can't have that.


----------



## Nick Obre (Jun 29, 2022)

Astro Loafo said:


> You would think someone white. But punk originates from Peru. Synth and new wave.... Chile. And even I find it baffling that I can't process this.


My lad Imma need you to explain that one because it sounds like pure bullshit to me.

I know there's claims that Los Saicos were the first punk band but come on, it's just shitty early rock and roll with a _terrible_ singer. And I'm thinking you're conflating New Wave with Nueva Ola, which is a completely different thing despite the name being a direct translation. It was just the local version of twist and rock and roll.
Now if you'd talked about prog/psychedelic rock pioneers, then you'd maybe have a point, with Los Jaivas and things like that.


----------



## Panama (Jun 30, 2022)

supremeautismo said:


> A lot of 90’s movies had the theme of “Dad needs to _spend more time _with his kids and he’s *bad* if he doesn’t!”  It just feels really reductive when a lot of parents have to work constantly just to make ends meet, and quitting their job and putting their family in jeopardy isn’t really the smart move.
> 
> Also, movies where the divorced parents get back together.  Encouraging this is so damaging to a child’s psyche.  Hollywood really didn’t handle divorce well 25+ years ago.


Back in the early 90s, most kid’s media didn’t do a good job of handling divorce, and introduced the concept to kids way too early.  It’s something that should be explained in person, not on Barney or whatever.  The idea of it scared the shit out of me when I was really little, because from what I was seeing on TV, my parents are hiding that they don’t love each other, and at the drop of a hat one will leave and I’d never see them again.  I can’t even imagine how it would have felt for the kid of a single parent being reminded all the time that their family isn’t whole.


----------



## Sergeant Major Buzzkill (Jun 30, 2022)

“It’s okay to be different” and “sharing is caring” lol no.


----------



## murph (Jun 30, 2022)

Ugly men doing sexual dances are downtrodden and need your love and support. Ugly men pretending to be women are actually women and you should never fear them. Insane women who want to talk to your kids about sex are not groomers getting the kids nice and relaxed for pedophiles to fuck them.

I hate the antichrist.


----------



## Sergeant Major Buzzkill (Jun 30, 2022)

murph said:


> Ugly men doing sexual dances are downtrodden and need your love and support. Ugly men pretending to be women are actually women and you should never fear them. Insane women who want to talk to your kids about sex are not groomers getting the kids nice and relaxed for pedophiles to fuck them.
> 
> I hate the antichrist.


Glad I’m not a little kid growing up in this day and age, holy shit


----------



## serious n00b (Jun 30, 2022)

mario if smoke weed said:


> The whole fucking idea that dogs are "man's best friend" and that every kid should adopt a dog, love dogs, let dogs lick your face.
> 
> Dogs aren't just gross and ugly, they're dangerous to small children. Not just bully breeds, but dogs in general. They can maul kids if they're pissed off enough, infect kids with diseases, and they cost way too damn much for what they're worth. Yet a bunch of crazies managed to convince families to go out and get them, even the fucked up little ones.
> 
> You know how many shows have dogs as the "lovable pet"? Too many to count. Some of those shows vilify cats too. Shit's fucked.


Sup, dawg?


----------



## mario if smoke weed (Jun 30, 2022)

serious n00b said:


> Sup, dawg?


Nothing much.

It's funny that one of the only times I get negrated is because I said I didn't like dogs. Not what I was expecting.


----------



## Dyn (Jun 30, 2022)

mario if smoke weed said:


> It's funny that one of the only times I get negrated is because I said I didn't like dogs. Not what I was expecting.


Dog's are called 'man's best friend' because they're the earliest domesticated animal and have been co-existing with literally every single culture of humanity for over 25,000 years. At this point we're practically hardwired as a species to value and appreciate dogs, and while it's fine that you might not personally like them, it's kind of amazing that you don't have the self-awareness to understand that almost everybody in the world will disagree with you.


----------



## PipTheAlchemist (Jun 30, 2022)

Android raptor said:


> Evolution isn't real.


It's not. Evolution was made-up by socialists, in an attempt to explain why the dragon fossils they found were totally not dragons and actually dinosaurs


----------



## Manul Otocolobus (Jun 30, 2022)

Coldgrip said:


> It's been decades, but I think that's how the book ended. Mowgli and the animals wind up slaughtering the village IIRC.



There's no guarantee he stays a virgin, he could have turned to bestiality.



Xarpho said:


> I never had any pets as a really young kid but parents that tell their kids that Fido and/or Whiskers "went to a farm" or something pisses me off, and I'm glad my parents would never do that.



My parents tried that. It didn't go well... I constantly asked my mother if I could go see the cat. Eventually she couldn't take it and just said "The cat is dead!" That was a couple of major childhood trauma's rolled into one. 1) Favorite pet was dead 2) Parents concealed the truth and  lied about it 3) Parent was cruel in how they handled letting you know the cat died. If I'm perfectly honest, I never forgave her for it.



onezero said:


> "Always tell the truth to avoid getting in trouble," or How To Grow Up And Lie Compulsively Because Now You Have Trust Issues
> 
> I haven't seen it portrayed specifically in the media but my mom had to get that dumbass idea some place.



That is a bad lesson. It should be "Generally, you should tell the truth. However, learning to lie convincingly is a valuable life skill. There is no need to tell the truth if it will help no one and actually harm people, or literally no one can know the truth except you and telling the truth will fuck you up the ass. In those instances, lie your fucking ass off"



The Lawgiver said:


> that one's fucking great too lmao. For some reason they also gave hitler a fucking handlebar anime mustache.



The neo-nazi's only wish they had that power.


----------



## Yamamura Video Rental (Jun 30, 2022)

Jack and the beanstalk.  What was the lesson to be learned?  Falling for something that seems like an obvious scam is okay because it will probably just work itself out in the end?  I looked up the moral of the story and apparently it's

"_The moral of this story would be *taking advantage of the opportunities that life provides you*. Jack is taking a huge risk when he exchanges the cow for the beans_."

I feel like this is encouraging children to follow some sort of gamblers/sunk costs fallacy by getting children to hedge their bets on extreme risks against the odds with basically no back up plan in mind.


----------



## glass_houses (Jul 1, 2022)

Chef Hanlon said:


> Jack and the beanstalk.  What was the lesson to be learned?  Falling for something that seems like an obvious scam is okay because it will probably just work itself out in the end?  I looked up the moral of the story and apparently it's
> 
> "_The moral of this story would be *taking advantage of the opportunities that life provides you*. Jack is taking a huge risk when he exchanges the cow for the beans_."
> 
> I feel like this is encouraging children to follow some sort of gamblers/sunk costs fallacy by getting children to hedge their bets on extreme risks against the odds with basically no back up plan in mind.


It also tells children that stealing from certain types of people, and even killing them, is perfectly okay, because those certain types of people are monsters and don't count as 'real people' and whatever you do to them is perfectly all right in the end.

Jack repeatedly steals from the giant, and eventually kills him when the giant goes to take his shit back. But it's alright because the giant said, "I hate Englishmen," so yeah, go for it, do whatever you like. _Race waaaaaaar!_

It's a really fucked up story when you sit and think about it, and _all_ fairy tales are fucked up.


----------



## DeeDee Megadoodoo (Jul 1, 2022)

This mother of them all to me is the idea that everyone is different, but equal. Like we're all roleplay characters who were given an identical number of points to invest, and people just have different spreads. If a character in kid's media is physically weak, they're probably smart. If they're fat they're probably funny. If a kid has shitty home life, he's bound to get superpowers or find a golden ticket to a chocolate factory.

Nope.


----------



## skykiii (Jul 1, 2022)

Panama said:


> Back in the early 90s, most kid’s media didn’t do a good job of handling divorce, and introduced the concept to kids way too early.  It’s something that should be explained in person, not on Barney or whatever.  The idea of it scared the shit out of me when I was really little, because from what I was seeing on TV, my parents are hiding that they don’t love each other, and at the drop of a hat one will leave and I’d never see them again.  I can’t even imagine how it would have felt for the kid of a single parent being reminded all the time that their family isn’t whole.


I had an even worse experience with this:  the movie Problem Child 2 made one of my friends actually tried to convince me to go along with a plan he had (inspired by that movie) where he'd get his dad to marry my mom... after both divorce their spouses, of course.

I didn't go along with it because the proposition was uncomfortable and eventually he dropped the idea.  Ironically his parents later wound up divorcing for real and he found out the hard way it is NOT just a fun way to replace the one you don't like.


----------



## skykiii (Jul 1, 2022)

CansOfCant said:


> Because that would have allowed humans to continue living at their current level of consumption and comfort, and while what's acceptable may certainly be a debate to be had, watermelons like Turner can't have that.


What really gets me about that particular episode is that Sly Sludge is written as a pretty nice guy with a moral compass.  A worker gets caught in his machine and he busts his balls trying to save her.  That's like, way more humanity, nuance, and depth than you'd expect from *any* children's cartoon... and its from the one intentionally written as propoganda.

It also makes it weird when Sludge is getting arrested at the end, and he goes back to acting like a typical villain.

I wonder if a writer was trying to undermine Ted Turner there.


----------



## Quantum Diabetes (Jul 6, 2022)

I couldn’t save the community center through breakdancing, all they did was put in a sweet fuckin’ Circle K instead that didn’t card me


----------



## The Lawgiver (Jul 31, 2022)

glass_houses said:


> It also tells children that stealing from certain types of people, and even killing them, is perfectly okay, because those certain types of people are monsters and don't count as 'real people' and whatever you do to them is perfectly all right in the end.
> 
> Jack repeatedly steals from the giant, and eventually kills him when the giant goes to take his shit back. But it's alright because the giant said, "I hate Englishmen," so yeah, go for it, do whatever you like. _Race waaaaaaar!_
> 
> It's a really fucked up story when you sit and think about it, and _all_ fairy tales are fucked up.


I could be remembering this wrong but doesn't the giant just fucking die from his own hubris after underestimating a englishman who's like several times smaller than him? Like he just fucking falls off his own sky castle like a dumbfuck? The moral is "watch out on those stairs man". Also the giant actually eats people so he's a sky castle haver that kidnaps and eats shorter men, probably has a few folded prions going on in that fucking big head of his. Even if you take utthe sciencey shit reasons the giant might be so fucked the point is he's a degenerate man eating sky lord. How the fuck does he even get down from there in the first place before the beanstalk? does he have some way of normally getting down tot he surface? I mean he fucking EATS PEOPLE And hates the english so much he memorized what they smell like so he has to have been down on the surface at some point. Dude should have just used whatever he does to do that and cut jack off atthe bottom instead of trying to follow him down the fucking stalk., fucking moron."

I somehow never sent this reply and now I finally did when checking the thread again lmao.


----------



## Airbrushed Van Art (Jul 31, 2022)

That all conflicts between races, nations, tribes, clans (etc) started because “people are scared of differences / people who look different”.

Don’t get me wrong, that’s a great excuse or scapegoat to rouse a mob or army, but it always boils down to “we want their stuff” or “we don’t want to or cannot share our stuff”.


----------



## The Ugly One (Jul 31, 2022)

That homosexuals aren't dangerous and should be celebrated.



The Lawgiver said:


> I could be remembering this wrong but doesn't the giant just fucking die from his own hubris after underestimating a englishman who's like several times smaller than him? Like he just fucking falls off his own sky castle like a dumbfuck? The moral is "watch out on those stairs man". Also the giant actually eats people so he's a sky castle haver that kidnaps and eats shorter men, probably has a few folded prions going on in that fucking big head of his. Even if you take utthe sciencey shit reasons the giant might be so fucked the point is he's a degenerate man eating sky lord. How the fuck does he even get down from there in the first place before the beanstalk? does he have some way of normally getting down tot he surface? I mean he fucking EATS PEOPLE And hates the english so much he memorized what they smell like so he has to have been down on the surface at some point. Dude should have just used whatever he does to do that and cut jack off atthe bottom instead of trying to follow him down the fucking stalk., fucking moron."
> 
> I somehow never sent this reply and now I finally did when checking the thread again lmao.



Medieval fairy tales aren't supposed to teach lessons. They're supposed to get kids to shut up for a bit, either because they're entertained or terrified.


----------



## Malodorous Merkin (Jul 31, 2022)

> @skykiii
> 
> ... For myself, I absolutely can't stand "the importance of family" shit. Family is just the bunch of idiots you got thrown in with by random lottery, and IRL a lot of people who use this message are using it to abuse and emotionally manipulate kids.



Yeah, because the "It takes a village, and the "traditional family unit" isn't important." message is really going aces for the black community.

Broken homes/families are an absolute scourge that progressives have inflicted upon society.


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## afternoon_tea (Jul 31, 2022)

Airbrushed Van Art said:


> That all conflicts between races, nations, tribes, clans (etc) started because “people are scared of differences / people who look different”.
> 
> Don’t get me wrong, that’s a great excuse or scapegoat to rouse a mob or army, but it always boils down to “we want their stuff” or “we don’t want to or cannot share our stuff”.


I really hate this too! It's so trite and shallow. People of the same or very similar ethnicities and cultural backgrounds have fought with each other since the beginning of time, and like you said, it pretty much always boils down to resources. 

I'm not sure where this idea came from when it so clearly flies in the face of reality. I understand how the complexities of that are probably a little hard to explain to children, but "if we all understood each others differences better then there'd be no more war and we'd live in harmony UwU" is so unrealistic and way too many people go into adulthood believing it's really that simple.


----------



## Goyslop Muncher (Jul 31, 2022)

That everyone can get along and sing happy songs and not hate each other.
Fuck niggers fuck leftists fuck kikes fuck trannies fuck jannies


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## Troonologist PhD (Jul 31, 2022)

That someday we'll create a better world without *insert bad thing here.* Having faith that humanity will create a good world is like expecting monkeys to stop throwing poop.


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## Airbrushed Van Art (Jul 31, 2022)

Troonologist PhD said:


> That someday we'll create a better world without *insert bad thing here.* Having faith that humanity will create a good world is like expecting monkeys to stop throwing poop.


To me, humanity can be expressed quite simply by some behaviour I saw at the local playground.

Some small children made a very impressive sandcastle in their own little corner. It was a splendid collaboration without any grown-up interference. It represented creativity, cooperation (despite visible differences of race or gender) and the power of creation out of nothing. 

As the kids left to go home, another kid of about the same age walked over looked at it for a moment and, with a dumb, blank expression, stomped all over it. No glee or playing “Godzilla smashing a city rawr!” Just destruction for the sake of it. He didn’t remake the sandcastle in his own way, or do it to hurt anyone’s feelings (the kid artists/engineers were long gone). He just did it to destroy something without any apparent joy or contentment. He just walked away. Didn’t even play at the park.

Some humans really DO just exist with the desire to exert power for no apparent reason or logical target. They’re great agents for people with a cause or higher desire.


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## Malodorous Merkin (Jul 31, 2022)

Airbrushed Van Art said:


> To me, humanity can be expressed quite simply by some behaviour I saw at the local playground.
> 
> Some small children made a very impressive sandcastle in their own little corner. It was a splendid collaboration without any grown-up interference. It represented creativity, cooperation (despite visible differences of race or gender) and the power of creation out of nothing.
> 
> ...



Some kids just want to watch the world burn.


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## SSj_Ness (Jul 31, 2022)

The whole gay agenda thing.


----------



## Elbow Greased Strength (Jul 31, 2022)

I feel like the collectivist "sharing is caring" BS did a lot of damage.  You have no obligation to share anything that belongs to you with anyone else, period.  You can if you want to, or if you feel like doing something nice for someone, or because you have too much, but you are not obligated to do so nor does anyone else have a right to any of your property outside of what is legally required. 

Obviously if you're being a really selfish prick about it, it's a different situation, but this is a terrible lesson overall for avoiding leeches, fake friends and con artists.


----------



## Norbert the Tiger (Jul 31, 2022)

M3xus said:


> I may be dating myself, but fuck it.
> 
> The D&D cartoon (among others, but it was one of the few that had the writers spell it out after the fact) was saddled by the moral guardians of its time with the message of "the group is always right, so the one that complains or points out something is a bad idea is wrong".  To the writers' credit, they knew right away this wasn't a good message for kids, seeing as peer pressure was a thing as far back as they can remember, so they had the complainer be right most of the time.  In light of current-year peer pressure to troon out as just a recent example, I don't think I need to explain why "you must always be in lockstep with the group" isn't a good lesson for kids.


The Get Along Gang wikipedia entry had an interesting discussion on that.






						The Get Along Gang - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				








As someone who is seemingly relegated to the role of outcast in Amiland, I used to make jokes about not making the cut on the Get Along. Forgetting about going out with and banging a lingerie model or bench pressing 300 lbs five times, I want to make the cut on The Get Along Gang, but alas, I am just not cut from the right cloth to make that elite group.

Beyond just the pernicious message of things like The Get Along Gang:

- the princess sickness or princess syndrome exacerbated by Disney.  I do not believe in white privilege categorically, but there is a sort type of white suburban girl in America who is encouraged to make believe she is a princess, except she never really grows out of it. Mommy but especailly Daddy gie her everything she wants. Then her breasts start to develop and she starts menstruating as her school boy peers start to become men (of sorts) and any male within such a such radius is all too pander to her.

- also directed at girls. Hannah Montana and other direct to video releases seem like Mean Girls light. Miley Cyrus went off the rails but even as Hannah Montana I don't think that stuff is appropriate for young girls.

- Barney the Dinosaur type sugar coated fluff. I love you, you love m e is not the real world.  I cannot imagine liking anything like that even at four. I remember at four scoffing at silly stupid shit like that.

- kids show with a lot of bad music and singing.  I hated that as a child.  As a young Tiger cub I did appreciate this, back when Disney was actually Disney.






- looking back there is so much garbage I wish I was not exposed to as a child. If I had parents who gave a damn instead of watching Brady Bunch and Gomer Pyle reruns on sick days or during the summer or absolute garbage like Banana Splits (a failed variety show a decade prior) reruns as a small child in the 80s (the show failed a decade prior but was on in the early 80s), I could have been learning about Greek mythology or Goethe or something not indicative of how culturally bankrupt America is.


----------



## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Aug 1, 2022)

Norbert the Tiger said:


> - the princess sickness or princess syndrome exacerbated by Disney.  I do not believe in white privilege categorically, but there is a sort type of white suburban girl in America who is encouraged to make believe she is a princess, except she never really grows out of it. Mommy but especially Daddy give her everything she wants. Then her breasts start to develop and she starts menstruating as her school boy peers start to become men (of sorts) and any male within such a such radius is all too pander to her.


I complained about that on here once and got dogpiled. More specifically, about literal princess stuff aimed at adult women, like Cinderella brand wedding rings.

So, you've got a lot of infantilization in general. A willingness to like childish things is not necessarily bad (insert CS Lewis quote) but we all know that it can be and often is taken to an extent so far that it becomes really off-putting. It's like being a female version of the soyboy consoomer Star Wars cuck guy, except the physiognomy doesn't seem to apply to them. Everybody knows this with men and applies it to them, but women aren't held to the same standard to grow up because they generally  aren't held to much standards at all.

I think the best kind of woman is the sort that is feminine but also tough, which I call a pioneer woman mentality, and I think our culture has had a tendency both to discourage femininity AND to coddle women, giving a sort of worst of both worlds.

I never met her myself, but I did have a friend who had a college classmate that would wear Mickey Mouse ears to class.


----------



## Norbert the Tiger (Aug 1, 2022)

Ughubughughughughughghlug said:


> I complained about that on here once and got dogpiled. More specifically, about literal princess stuff aimed at adult women, like Cinderella brand wedding rings.
> 
> So, you've got a lot of infantilization in general. A willingness to like childish things is not necessarily bad (insert CS Lewis quote) but we all know that it can be and often is taken to an extent so far that it becomes really off-putting. It's like being a female version of the soyboy consoomer Star Wars cuck guy, except the physiognomy doesn't seem to apply to them. Everybody knows this with men and applies it to them, but women aren't held to the same standard to grow up because they generally  aren't held to much standards at all.
> 
> ...


That surprises me that you were dogpiled on here.
I dont think it is like the Star Wars losers at all though, because these women are enabled by the men in their lives. It starts with "daddy" from herearliest memory. Then it really starts when all the schoolboys in the yard come for her milkshake.
Not so fun fact, years ago I was on the TGV from Stuttgart to Paris.  In my coach. there was a blond American girl, maybe four years old dressed up as a Disney princess (Ilse I think, the very worst with its misandrist, quasi lesbian messaging) who played right in the aisle of the car, basically taking the whole pathway as her own domain, replete with a princess costume.


----------



## Hongourable Madisha (Aug 1, 2022)

I'm really bored of the "chosen one" trope. It's the opposite of character development. It's most obvious in the differences between the Disney Mulan cartoon and the live-action version: in the cartoon, she starts out as an average girl, trains hard and thinks hard to come up with solutions to tests and problems, and then she works with the rest of the army to save the day. In the new one she's just super great at everything from the start and doesn't have to work or grow to achieve anything.
It's the same with Rey or Harry Potter or any number of children's/young adult protagonists now, they don't learn anything because they don't _have _to.
And it's a horrible message for kids. Someone mentioned "never give up trying" was a bad message, and yeah, I agree, but this is too far in the other direction, this is saying "if you're not brilliant at something the first time you try it, then you're not dEsTiNeD to be good at it so don't bother". It just sets them up for failure and self-loathing because, of course they're going to suck at whatever they turn their hand to, and they need to learn to be okay with that in order to practise, learn and improve.

eta: oh god I just remembered Turning Red. The lass is an ordinary dorky girl and then she gets the red panda powers, which is clearly an allegory for puberty, and suddenly she's really popular and even makes money off it. Then she yells at her mum that "I like gyrating, I'M THIRTEEN, MOM, DEAL WITH IT!" and twerks at her(?). 
The message is apparently that if you're an awkward underage girl, you can become popular by sexualising yourself (for money) before you're even able to know wtf you're doing or consent to anything, and your parents are just stuffy old regressives if they don't agree with it, so don't listen to them. It's absolute groomer shit. I bet all the local paedo rings are big fans of it.


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## skykiii (Aug 1, 2022)

Hongourable Madisha said:


> I'm really bored of the "chosen one" trope. It's the opposite of character development. It's most obvious in the differences between the Disney Mulan cartoon and the live-action version: in the cartoon, she starts out as an average girl, trains hard and thinks hard to come up with solutions to tests and problems, and then she works with the rest of the army to save the day. In the new one she's just super great at everything from the start and doesn't have to work or grow to achieve anything.
> It's the same with Rey or Harry Potter or any number of children's/young adult protagonists now, they don't learn anything because they don't _have _to.
> And it's a horrible message for kids. Someone mentioned "never give up trying" was a bad message, and yeah, I agree, but this is too far in the other direction, this is saying "if you're not brilliant at something the first time you try it, then you're not dEsTiNeD to be good at it so don't bother". It just sets them up for failure and self-loathing because, of course they're going to suck at whatever they turn their hand to, and they need to learn to be okay with that in order to practise, learn and improve.


Part of me thinks the problem with cases like Mulan is the writers are going in expecting the audience to already know the earlier version.

It's something I think of with regards to the live-action Cat in the Hat (sorry if I triggered your PTSD there), at one point where the goldfish--who had not been introduced in this version of the story--says "Remember the fish?"

I recall Nostalgia Critic finding that line confusing.  My interpretation was that the writer expected people to already know the Cat in the Hat story and remember there was a fish in it, and that's what the line was referring to.

Which itself is something I find dumb and vacuous about modern writing--this nerdish expectation that anyone coming in already knows the story.  It's like they don't expect literal children (or people who just somehow completely missed the older material) to ever be audience members.   But the fact is, a large portion of your audience will be people who have no pre-existing familiarity with this story, so you can't just skip stuff.

That's what I think is going on with Mulan--they think people will have seen the version where she trains, and thus they can skip that detail this time.  And thus it winds up looking like she's just good at everything.

At least, that's my guess... I could be speaking out my ass though because I haven't seen the live-action Mulan (or any live-action remake of a Disney movie).  I haven't seen the Disney Star Wars either.


----------



## Haint (Aug 2, 2022)

Afinepickle said:


> That violence is never an acceptable response no matter what and that conflict resolution happens magically on its own so long as you just 'use your words' or whatever stupid platitude used to justify being a punching bag.
> 
> Sometimes you just have to pop a motherfucker in the mouth.


When kindness fails.


----------



## Spiny Rumples (Aug 3, 2022)

A lot of fantasy books I read had good people and bad people, and no matter what, the good people would achieve their goals.

In many nightmares I either made a mistake or had "original sin," and I knew that the story had branded me as a bad person. The rest of the dream was me being hunted down by the heroic people.

I suppose another way of saying that is "people who are consistently charming have plot armor."


----------



## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Aug 4, 2022)

This isn't the worst lesson by far, but I think that "be yourself" can go wrong if its implied that being yourself will bring acceptance, rather than being yourself for the sake of internal peace. Most people do prefer conformity to authenticity.


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## LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] (Aug 4, 2022)

Ughubughughughughughghlug said:


> This isn't the worst lesson by far, but I think that "be yourself" can go wrong if its implied that being yourself will bring acceptance, rather than being yourself for the sake of internal peace. Most people do prefer conformity to authenticity.


I prefer it as "Be your b_est_ self". 

Being true is not a bad lesson but its too common to see turbofats and coomers corrupting it into just reject self improving and giving in to every base instinct.


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## Mountain Gorilla (Aug 4, 2022)




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## Ughubughughughughughghlug (Aug 4, 2022)

LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] said:


> I prefer it as "Be your b_est_ self".
> 
> Being true is not a bad lesson but its too common to see turbofats and coomers corrupting it into just reject self improving and giving in to every base instinct.


Self, best self, either way what I mean is there are people who put on a persona and talk out both sides of their mouth but get much further than people who don't.


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## Kermit Jizz (Aug 5, 2022)

Zero tolerance on fighting is the worst. It teaches at least 3 incredibly retarded lessons.

Self defense is bad and general learned helplessness
All harm is equal. Punching the person back causes two people to be hurt, so it's better to just let yourself be the only one hurt
Violence is never the solution. Doesn't matter if some cunt pissed in your locker, stole your lunch, and told you your dead mother is sucking cocks in hell. Just put up with it because it's better to be harassed by an asshole for years than for that asshole to experience a single ass kicking.
I personally pin this one for a lot of the pussification of everyone 30 and under.


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## Norbert the Tiger (Aug 5, 2022)

Kermit Jizz said:


> Zero tolerance on fighting is the worst. It teaches at least 3 incredibly retarded lessons.
> 
> Self defense is bad and general learned helplessness
> All harm is equal. Punching the person back causes two people to be hurt, so it's better to just let yourself be the only one hurt
> ...


Can you specify examples where children's shows have had this message? Seems astonishing to me.


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## Kermit Jizz (Aug 5, 2022)

Norbert the Tiger said:


> Can you specify examples where children's shows have had this message? Seems astonishing to me.






Avatar the last airbender kind of did this with the whole "Aang is a pacifist he can't just kill the man who literally wants to genocide 2/3s of the world"

I can't recall too many specifics, but I remember seeing PSAs as a kid about bullying and how the proper response was to narc to your parents or teachers. They'd always emphasize  "violence is NEVER the answer". Usually those were done by the network and not in the cartoon itself, so it's hard to find clips. It's also a big trope in japanese media where the protagonist can't kill the big bad because then they'll be just as bad as super mecha ultra instinct hitler.


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## Norbert the Tiger (Aug 5, 2022)

Kermit Jizz said:


> Avatar the last airbender kind of did this with the whole "Aang is a pacifist he can't just kill the man who literally wants to genocide 2/3s of the world"
> 
> I can't recall too many specifics, but I remember seeing PSAs as a kid about bullying and how the proper response was to narc to your parents or teachers. They'd always emphasize  "violence is NEVER the answer". Usually those were done by the network and not in the cartoon itself, so it's hard to find clips. It's also a big trope in japanese media where the protagonist can't kill the big bad because then they'll be just as bad as super mecha ultra instinct hitler.


Thank you, FREN. I believe we are of different gernations. Arthur was before my time.  By all accounts it looks really awful.

Edit--I do have to say in thst instance may be hitting a girl not the right thing to do. Is there children's programming that tells kids, if someone is assaulting you (assault or even battery as well), don't bit back, don't defend itself, just take the beatibg?

Must be a difficult thing psre to these days. People get child protective services called on them for letting kids ride around the neighborhood on a bike.  If a boy is bullied it is incumbent on any father figure worth his alt to gethim boxing lessons or do something to equip him to fight back (only exception is for truly handicappedz crippled, or disabled). On this day and age I imagine apparent could get sued for getting his son boxing lessons (or the like).


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## The Emperor Skeksis (Aug 5, 2022)

That you should always include everyone in your group because excluding people is cruel. In the media the kid that is excluded is of course always shy and harmless, or sometimes poor or of a different skin colour. In real life some kids are fucking psychos, violent, or anti-social retards, and there is nothing wrong with excluding them from your activity. It's not up an eight-year-old to fix some broken kid, that's on the parents and adults.

That message sadly worked well though, because troons exploit the fuck out of it today.


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