# How to convince someone out of trooning out?



## JokahBaybee (Nov 13, 2020)

Trashcan me if you want, I'm expecting it, but let's say someone I know and care about is already well on their way to trooning out, and I want to talk them out of it. What do I tell them? Are they too far gone, or is there still hope?
Any articles or papers that might convince them that what they're doing is a bad idea?


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## DeadFish (Nov 13, 2020)

Get the book changing minds.



			https://changingminds.org/
		


Start here


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## NOT Sword Fighter Super (Nov 13, 2020)

You can't make somebody else's mind up for them, but good luck.


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## Crazedking (Nov 13, 2020)

Give them a gun and tell them it doesnt get any better.


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## Chongqing (Nov 13, 2020)

A friend of my friend is trooning out and it makes my friend sad because he feels hopeless to stop it. 

Honestly, I don't know. I feel like I've never seen anyone try hard-edged transphobia as a response, so I'm stupidly optimistic that maybe that would work. It's very rarely tried by a friend or acquaintance. Usually only their family members are close enough to care to be honest with them. 

Maybe if you yell at them for being autistic men who are trying to basically rape away female identity for themselves like a bunch predatory autistic men, maybe your words would never fall out of their head and they wouldn't be able to proceed. 

I mean, seriously, maybe if you emphasize that it's undiagnosed autism that they've been ignoring their whole lives, maybe that would click for them. Troons are big into the dogma of discovering they were little bean women all along, uwu, and they just discovered their identity later in life. Maybe if you could show them their latent autist tendencies, their way sense of self-discovery will take over for the better. 

I feel like maybe it's worth a shot if they're just going to troon out anyway.


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## 5t3n0g0ph3r (Nov 13, 2020)

Show them Metokur's video:








						Transtastic Tales Episode 1: How The Sausage Is Made
					

GENDER REVEAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




					www.bitchute.com
				



If they don't have second thoughts after seeing this, they're lost.


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## L50LasPak (Nov 13, 2020)

If you can't have a rational discussion with them on the topic and at least convince them to take it slow, then you probably don't have the strongest relationship in the world with this person. If this is the case, just walk away and focus on the other people in your life.


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## Kosher Dill (Nov 13, 2020)

How old is the person in question? Are they male or female? Are they gay? Did they "fail out" of their gender or is there fetishism involved?

EDIT: and for the sake of completeness - what makes you think they're not one of the rare sincere transgender people?


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## R00T (Nov 13, 2020)

ask them if they've explored every avenue and option.  Maybe they're just jumping that this is what they want.  Maybe finding someone outside of friends and family to talk to about it might get them to open up and explore more options?


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## SmugAutist (Nov 13, 2020)

Make them realize that trooning out is not going to make them a happier or more stable person.

Gender dysphoria is pretty much just a very specific type of body dysphoria. It's what happens with anorexics, ultra-fitness addicts, or in the worst cases, Body Integrity Identity Disorder. In all of these cases, the discomfort with their own body is merely a symptom of deep psychological issues that have to be worked with therapy and medication. Mutilating your body a dozen different ways is not going to help anything. I have yet to see a troon both online and irl that ends up better for it in the end. Most of the time, they end up worse than before.

That is, of course, if these are actual psychological problem and they're not just attention whores, which is more than likely the case nowadays.


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## Frances Kiwi Farmer (Nov 13, 2020)

Solidarity, my friend. I'm in the same boat twice over; it feels like watching someone drown while everyone else talks about how much fun they look like they're having in that pool over there. And also you're a paraplegic or something? The metaphor worked better in my head.


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## The Fool (Nov 13, 2020)

Eh, I'm pessimistic because my best friend trooned out. None of us could do anything, he alienated everyone in his life and went totally insane. He did calm down and reconciled with everyone, so it worked out in the end, but yeah, I'm really pessimistic about anyone trooning out, it never works out.

I'd just try to get them to come to terms with, just because they _want_ to feel like a woman, doesn't mean they should mutilate their body for the sake of it. Tell them, hell, show them that most troons look really fucking ugly, and the "good looking ones" trannies use to lure people in with are a very slim minority who probably started HRT when they were very young. Try to get them to see, without belittling their feelings, that trying to become a woman is just as promising as trying to turn into a dog. Try to get him to find other avenues of fulfilling his desires, like, catfishing and roleplaying.
At the end of the day, reality sucks, we're never our ideal persons, and this is why we have escapist media like video games and anime. Tell him not to conflate wanting to have a different body with wanting to ruin it for the sake of social brownie points or a vain attempt at feeling better.
Most importantly you can't try to tell them they're wrong or that you disapprove of it, merely that you're worried they might make a mistake they'll regret. Even if it's just for attention, you gotta let them know you're on their side and you sympathize with them, but that what they're considering is not going to make them happy. The 41% is proof of that, and that number is not from social stigma.
Of course, if they don't listen, be prepared to cut them out of your life. You don't need that kind of person in your life, basically trying to force you to roleplay their fetish with them. Don't threaten to leave them if they do consider it, just be prepared to do it if they do.


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## Chongqing (Nov 13, 2020)

Kosher Dill said:


> what makes you think they're not one of the rare sincere transgender people?


That is just...lemayo.  



5t3n0g0ph3r said:


> Show them Metokur's video:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That was literally the worst thing I've ever seen, and I've seen a lot. Good God that was terrible.

Wasn't Phil's stinkditch (among many others) sliced and dug with taxpayer money via medicaid? 

Oigh vey. 

Those poor surgeons. Seriously.


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## Underestimated Nutria (Nov 13, 2020)

If they're male, give them a copy of the Man Who Would be Queen by J. Michael Bailey.  It's on libgen.io.  Troons can hate him as much as they like but the book is full of autobiographical accounts that ring very true to life.


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## Adolf Hitler (Nov 13, 2020)

Just show him pictures of the procedure and the results. Also: dilate faggot.


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## JokahBaybee (Nov 13, 2020)

Kosher Dill said:


> How old is the person in question? Are they male or female? Are they gay? Did they "fail out" of their gender or is there fetishism involved?
> 
> EDIT: and for the sake of completeness - what makes you think they're not one of the rare sincere transgender people?


They're a 18-year-old gay male, but they're also shut-in weeb, so maybe a bit of both. As for the edit, I never implied I thought they weren't, but this path never works out well in the long run, and that's what I'm worried about.


L50LasPak said:


> If you can't have a rational discussion with them on the topic and at least convince them to take it slow, then you probably don't have the strongest relationship in the world with this person. If this is the case, just walk away and focus on the other people in your life.


They aren't a good friend. I'm currently on shaky ground with them, and they've proven to be quite touchy about it. I intend to focus on my other friends and leave them, but I want to get closure on it knowing I at least tried to help them.


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## Wowcoolusername (Nov 13, 2020)

Tell them "No."

If that doesnt work, nothing will and you might as well walk away.


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## LinkinParkxNaruto[AMV] (Nov 13, 2020)

From Yaniv to Blaire White where does this person on the troon scale?

I wouldn't really care unless they are creeps and/or laughing stocks but there are those who i don't really mind, like if a super feminine gay guy who already everyone knows as an uber feminine fag suddenly wearing female clothes full time and actually passing well doesn´t raise any alarms tbh, it surprises no one,  those types are mostly harmless and are genuinely happy cosplaying and are actually good at it.   A neckbeard waifuist who is suddenly telling people he is a transbian and wants to lecture your kids on discord does trigger some alerts.


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## Coomer For Hire (Nov 13, 2020)

If you actually care to try this then go ahead, but best option is probably to leave it and walk away.

Be their friend. Ask them questions, and try to figure out what they think, what they feel, and why.

After you get that, use that knowledge and the "socratic method" to have them draw a similar conclusion to you about transitioning, about how it'll fuck them up in the long run (Because it will). At that point they'll either accept the conclusion, and stop that shit, or they'll reject the conclusion, with the catch being they have to have it sit around in the back of their head. If they're not an utter retard, it'll be the seed of doubt in their mind that will build up to them detransitioning, going insane, and/or 41'ing themself.

Either way, it's on them.
It's worked for other stuff, don't see why it wouldn't here.


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## GHTD (Nov 13, 2020)

Tell them John Money was a Jewish doctor and that David Reimer killed himself years after John Money studied him.

Hey, it's a Deep Thoughts post, gotta get the antisemitism in there somewhere.


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## Penis Drager (Nov 13, 2020)

At its core, this is an issue of someone not being happy with the body they are born with. Treat it like you would a friend considering breast implants or something like that. Because most of the same arguments apply.
Obviously, berating them for considering it isn't going to make them change their minds. Calling them mentally ill isn't going to change their minds. Making them feel bad about themselves isn't going to change their minds. A girl who feels insecure about her small breasts isn't going to respond well to criticism just as a person who's insecure about the sex they were born as. What I'm getting at is that this is less an issue of convincing them to not modify their body and more an issue of getting them to accept the body they have. 
A girl who wants a boob job generally thinks she'd be happier with larger boobs. The response is not to waste time on the logistics and negative effects of a boob job, but to address the underlying issues that made her so insecure in the first place.
A guy who wants to troon out generally thinks they'd be happier as a woman. While it may be tempting to go over how much that transition can utterly fuck them up, a better route to go is addressing what it is that makes him feel that way. Be a bit indirect because a direct approach will just lead them to shut out any discussion with "it's totally genetic; it's science, bro." Try to figure out why he doesn't feel fit to me a man without directly asking him. Then you address those concerns in isolation while avoiding any discussion of the transition itself.


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## Sped Xing (Nov 13, 2020)

Egg them on and document it for our amusement.


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## Next Task (Nov 13, 2020)

Suggest therapy before they take any big steps, and then if possible see if you can suggest one that won't just cater to his delusions but instead reckon with them. I had a friend who was experiencing gender dysphoria, and he found a therapist who helped him resolve it without any form of medical intervention.

But it's all a long shot, because them trooning out is the same as losing a friend to a cult. Worse, even, because you're allowed to not like other cults.


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## Kosher Dill (Nov 13, 2020)

JokahBaybee said:


> They're a 18-year-old gay male, but they're also shut-in weeb


Has he ever had a boyfriend, gone out to gay clubs, or anything like that? You might want to suggest that he doesn't give up on being a gay man till he's actually given it a chance.



Next Task said:


> trooning out is the same as losing a friend to a cult


That's another question. Is there a social circle love-bombing him into this that you have to contend with? If he's already got a circle of enablers you're simply going to be outnumbered.


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## bluegenius8585 (Nov 13, 2020)

To be honest the best way (it worked for me) is to show them the realities of the situation, not the cleaned up SJW narrative.

Go onto /r/detrans on reddit there is a lot of people on there who regretted transitioning, It's not that I deny that Trans people exist, just I imagine a large number of people are manipulated into thinking they trans when in reality there is some other issue.

If you want to go nuclear show him some photos/ reports of neo-vaginas and get him to wonder if he really thinks that will improve his life

As others have said some more militant trans activists are basically like a cult, I have had to no-contact several of them in my life and even moved to another town (which made it easier)


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## Blake Chortles (Nov 14, 2020)

You can’t. Its a deep seated emotional disorder. The only thing you could do is help them address the causes of it, often past trauma, low self esteem, or sexual deviancy.


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## Standardized Profile (Nov 14, 2020)

CoomerForHire said:


> After you get that, use that knowledge and the "socratic method" to have them draw a similar conclusion to you about transitioning, about how it'll fuck them up in the long run (Because it will). At that point they'll either accept the conclusion, and stop that shit, or they'll reject the conclusion, with the catch being they have to have it sit around in the back of their head. If they're not an utter retard, it'll be the seed of doubt in their mind that will build up to them detransitioning, going insane, and/or 41'ing themself.


On the one hand, you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. On the other hand, a weeby shut-in probably would reason that they were actually trans, because they live in an echo chamber and don't hear evidence or arguments from the other side.

OP should probably tell this guy he's cute and it would be a real disappointment if he became a woman. Appeal to his vanity.


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## Canoodler (Nov 14, 2020)

Threaten to post pictures of them to kiwifarms if they troon out.


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## tuka (Nov 16, 2020)

Find em a better outlet to get (sexually?) validated. Trooning is seen by their Id as an easy road to intimacy and self-worth on assumption it's tied to gender one is trooning into. While these things are indeed implicitly present with each gender identity, most troons are deluded when it comes to viability of switching the lane, doubling down, and going full Don Quixote with their delusion.


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## Kosher Dill (Nov 16, 2020)

tuka said:


> Find em a better outlet to get (sexually?) validated.


I think the issue here is going to be peeling him away from whatever source of validation is encouraging this in the first place.

Depending on how rational he is, it might even be a good idea to point out that internet validation is inherently fleeting. Once his "egg" is hatched and he's gone through his stunning and brave transition, it'll be on to the next one for the love-bombers. After that, he'll have to farm likes on his uwu selfies from other dead-ender troons.

You might also ask what his long-term plan is - does he want a family of some sort? If he does, just tell him to take a look around for role models. Is La Zorra his idea of domestic bliss? Or in general, what troon is living the life that he wants to live?


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## Lemmingwise (Nov 16, 2020)

I've actually managed to do this once.

The only thing I did was pierce the illusion that nobody tells you about.

"People are cheering for you now, but they'll get bored about it in a month or two".

And

"The suicide rate for post op transexuals is much higher than pre-op. A good number regret it and can't go back."

The guy got really angry with me and I said I was hurt that he thought I would say it for any other reason thanthat I cared about him and that he should do what he wants, but I hoped he wouldn't just for his own sake.

A month later he went back on his plans to transition.

Of course this was a friend and I knew how to talk to him (and why he was really doing it). You can't save everyone, either.

But there is in the mainstream a bombardment of info about why it's so great to transition. And you get treated with extra respect and reverence in certain circles, including on tv. So just piercing the illusions and saying what things are like is doing god's work when it comes to transitioning.


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## 💗Freddie Freaker💗 (Nov 16, 2020)

Point out that women defy gender norms all the time and that it should be okay for him to be a man who enjoys girly things. Then point out that titty skittles come with adverse health effects and SRS is a risky procedure. If it goes wrong, the patient can be left in chronic pain for the rest of their life.


Here's a woman wearing male attire taking part in a traditionally male activity:


She probably never questioned her womanhood.


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## Kosher Dill (Nov 16, 2020)

Lemmingwise said:


> "People are cheering for you now, but they'll get bored about it in a month or two".


Exactly. Remember that silly quote from Trans Lifeline where they talked about people "calling to share their gender euphoria"? Read between the lines: after the internet cheering section gets bored, troons get so lonely they consider suicide lines a form of socialization.


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## FatalTater (Nov 17, 2020)

Are they on tumblr? If so, get them away from tumblr.


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## Kiwi & Cow (Apr 17, 2022)

Bumping so I don't have to make another identical thread.

How do you convince someone not to troon out?

Some random guy on some forum said he considered trasitioning, so I tried to convince him not to do it, but first there were 2 other people who meddled with my comments by calling me a transphobe just to try and villainise me and that seemed to have worked because the dude I tried to convince not to transition is now asking around how he can report my comments.

I also included links to reliable medical sites that discussed the issue and all of that got dismissed probably.

Knowing is half the battle and that'd probably change things for the better. I don't want to see people transition because they were told that they had dysphoria on Discord or some shit like that.

Because I can't write long paragraphs on my own I just stole comments I found here and 1 copypasta on 4chan.

I'd have posted that in Q&A, but I know the discussion would have gone 2 pages at most and died down giving me no useful information.


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## Osmosis Jones (Apr 17, 2022)

Further confuse them. Inform them about autogynephilia, other approaches to gender/body dysphoria, personality disorders, OCD, munchausens or whatever else you can make up. Someone who is trooning out is unstable in their foundations as a person and you could shake it up pretty easily without coming across as bigoted, even appearing woke if you approach it right. It won't fix them but it might delay or stop the trooning.


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## Cyanide (Apr 21, 2022)

tell them not to cut off or make a dick out of their diced off parts, they don't work with current technology.  

... no wait, mtf post-op asian porn is kinda popular.


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## 90theguy (Apr 21, 2022)

Tell them that just because they aren't a muscular chad or a Feminine Nelly doesn't mean they have to cut their dicks or tits off. I believe a lot of these troons come from the idea that they're not "this way" enough, therefore you must remove that propaganda from their heads before they ruin their bodies


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## The-Patriarchy (Apr 21, 2022)

Rub his face in his mess and smack him lightly in the nose with a rolled up newspaper and firmly say "NO"

If that doesn't work, put him in the crate for the night until he calms down.

Oh wait, he's trooning out, I got it in my head he was going furry.


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## Astro Loafo (Apr 21, 2022)

With all seriousness, you got to understand why they want to transition and what's going through their head. If you don't tackle this from the root, you will not do any impact. 

It's not like someone just up and cuts off pp I a womb man nao cuz muh artisum. They're human beings with serious issues that probably struggled with this for longer than you'd care.

Like if you really want to stop a troon. Get to know one. Really get to know one and see what it was that broke them. Be a real friend. And be there for him/her.


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## Uberpenguin (Apr 21, 2022)

Kiwi & Cow said:


> Bumping so I don't have to make another identical thread.
> 
> How do you convince someone not to troon out?
> 
> ...


You aren't going to with words.

Get them to work with wood (using planers and chisels and files is very meditative) or repair tools or something, or something that takes advantage of having larger, stronger hands and more upper body strength. Hell, find some women who'll ask them to open jars for them. Anything to make them appreciate what they have.

Trooning is often done out of a sense of hopelessness and insecurity in one's role as a man, and being completely honest if you're a city dweller who has no opportunity to use your physical attributes to accomplish things other people wouldn't be able to it's sensible to conclude that being a man sucks. Trying to tell them they're wrong to think it does in that case would be a lie, unless you live in a real bad part of town.

You're going to have to give them a reason to feel some level of pride as an individual, and if you can't you're in no position to try to stop them. Long term health or outcomes isn't a compelling reason, and nobody has ever been convinced to change their life because of being talked at.


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## Astro Loafo (Apr 21, 2022)

Uberpenguin said:


> You aren't going to with words.
> 
> Get them to work with wood (using planers and chisels and files is very meditative) or repair tools or something, or something that takes advantage of having larger, stronger hands and more upper body strength. Hell, find some women who'll ask them to open jars for them. Anything to make them appreciate what they have.
> 
> ...


Not true at all.

No matter what activities you do that you believe give you worth as a man. None of that will take away the psychosis infecting the mind of a troon. 

It's a mental issue. You can't just cure schizophrenia with touch grass.


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