# The situation in East Asia cannot be sustained



## mindlessobserver (Nov 26, 2019)

I have increasingly begun to fear the outbreak of a Great Power War in the western Pacific is rapidly becoming inevitable. There are simply too many competing interests and nothing is being done to reduce the danger.

Where to even start. Let's look at all the crisis points.

North Korea
The South China Sea
The Sino-Indian border
Taiwan
Hong Kong
The Senkaku Islands

Just to name a few.

North Korea is constantly threatening to destabilize things and runs the risk of going too far

China claims the territory of other countries in the south china sea solely on the fever dream of Sun Yat Sens retarded 9 dash line he dumped at the Versaille conference in 1919. It was stupid then and it's stupid now.

China and India STILL cannot agree on their border, made all the worse by India protecting the exiled Tibetan Government and China trying to surround India with navy bases.

Taiwan remains protected by America and the Allied World War 2 government of China remains a force in being on the island. A constant thorn in the side of the commies. Whose one country two systems policy in Hong Kong that was designed to return Taiwan to the fold lies on ruins.

On the subject of Hong Kong,  the one country two systems idea is ending in spectacular failure as Xi Jinping begins to consider ending the charade and putting hong kong under direct rule. An act that would be a flagrant violation of the hand over agreement with the UK.

As if all of this was not enough China also is pressing claims against a series of uninhabited rocks currently administered by Japan. The Senkaku Islands. Because of course they are.

Combine all of this with ongoing trade disputes with America and the arrogant determination of the Chinese to put Australia into its sphere of influence. Now that one is the one thing guaranteed to make America go berserk. Messing with Japan and Taiwan are a stretch and commitments to both stem from world war 2 obligations. Australia though, is a former component of the British Empire and while America has not come out and said it officially, the British Empire never died. It simply moved its capital from London to Washington DC. The Chinese are already playing with fire with North Korea, Japan and Taiwan. Adding Australia to the mix is Chemical X.

It all points to a dismal picture. The west pacific is careening headlong towards war and nobody seems interested in stopping it. In fact the only effort being expended on all sides seems to be aimed at setting themselves up to win the war when it starts. I give it 20 years at the most


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## Marco Fucko (Nov 26, 2019)

Bro literally just nuke China lol


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## porkchops (Nov 26, 2019)

Sina delenda est


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## Shoggoth (Nov 26, 2019)

Compound with Chinese military bases in Afghanistan and Chinese owned ports on every country from Australia, up to China, and all the way to Africa, skipping India.
The fuck can be done at this point?


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## Pixy (Nov 26, 2019)

It's not just China, but that's the one everyone reports on. 

Pakistan and India are always rearing for a chance to have a go at each other (made worse by the fact Pakistan transports its nukes in vans), and Japan and Korea still have issues with each other regarding WWII and territorial claims.


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## ConfederateIrishman (Nov 26, 2019)

How can there be a war if the west instantly capitulates/has already imploded by the time China makes its move?


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## TwinkLover6969 (Nov 26, 2019)

Marco Fucko said:


> Bro literally just nuke China lol


Nixon really fucked up on that one.









						USSR planned nuclear attack on China in 1969
					

The Soviet Union was on the brink of launching a nuclear attack against China   in 1969 and only backed down after the US told Moscow such a move would   start World War Three, according to a Chinese historian.



					www.telegraph.co.uk


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## mindlessobserver (Nov 26, 2019)

Shoggoth said:


> Compound with Chinese military bases in Afghanistan and Chinese owned ports on every country from Australia, up to China, and all the way to Africa, skipping India.
> The fuck can be done at this point?



Which is the rub, isnt it. In the case of Africa you already can see the USA shifting gears. The formation of AFRICOM was in direct response to China's inroads. South Africa has also been demoted from multi racial rainbow propaganda friend by the American ruling elite to a forgotten hellscape. Partially because the rainbow nation has not suddenly discovered racial harmony and more because the ANC decided it wanted to get chummy with China. Another berserk point for America. If South Africa let's China build naval bases the PLAN can gain access to the Atlantic Ocean.

It is no accident then that the United States has begun aggressively courting Kenya and staging more forces in East Africa and Central Africa. All that fighting against Islamists is a fig leaf. The actual reason America is building up its African forces is to deter Chinese expansion and put itself in a position to overthrow south africa the moment shit hits the fan.


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## Marco Fucko (Nov 26, 2019)

TwinkLover6969 said:


> Nixon really fucked up on that one.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



As did Truman earlier.

Realistically speaking it's a touchy situation, MAD and all that. Still, a guy can dream.


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## Arctic Fox (Nov 26, 2019)

Any war between the US and China would end in hellfire consuming Beijing.

China is a paper tiger, and does not have the capacity for sustained conflict. The American Empire would dismantle it within a year. Bombs would block out the sun for days before any ground war is even considered.

China's economoy is fragile, and it's already begun outsourcing manufacturing to Africa. It's collapsing far faster than people realize.


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## Marissa Moira (Nov 26, 2019)

How soon until Japan kills communists again IRL?


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## TV's Adam West (Nov 26, 2019)

Why contain it? Let it spill over into the schools and churches. Let the bodies pile up in the streets. In the end, they'll beg us to save them.


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## Krokodil Overdose (Nov 26, 2019)

Marissa Moira said:


> How soon until Japan kills communists again IRL?


God, I keep forgetting how good the soundtrack in those games is.


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## Smug Chuckler (Nov 26, 2019)

Should have let the japs conquered everything, oh well


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## MrTickles (Nov 26, 2019)

The only thing thats unsustainable is Us presence in east asia. Your decline will continue and do so rapidly, learn to accept that fact. China will own you soon. Learn your new secondary place amerimutts.


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## Syaoran Li (Nov 26, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> The only thing thats unsustainable is Us presence in east asia. Your decline will continue and do so rapidly, learn to accept that fact. China will own you soon. Learn your new secondary place amerimutts.



Xi Jinping is a son of a bitch!
He's got the blue balls crabs and the seven-year itch!


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## Suburban Bastard (Nov 26, 2019)

Preach to me, mr internet intellectual.


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## LazyLizard (Nov 26, 2019)

let them, honestly don't see why foreign nations always have to stick their fingers in other countries business and try to decide what they should do. just let them do their own shit whether it's war or peace it's not our problem.


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## HeyYou (Nov 26, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> The only thing thats unsustainable is Us presence in east asia. Your decline will continue and do so rapidly, learn to accept that fact. China will own you soon. Learn your new secondary place amerimutts.


I can respect nationalists who shill for their own country. I don't respect Benedicts who shill for another country and hope that they get some of the scraps when push comes to shove.


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## ZeCommissar (Nov 26, 2019)

China is not going to openly provoke the US anytime soon. China knows that it cannot win in a conventional war against the US since the US navy would have a field day with the Chinese Navy, and the fact we have so many allies so close to them. China is being smart in the way it's slowly building up it's sphere of influence while hoping the US gets noticeably weaker.

I would urge caution for those that say China will collapse on itself. People have been saying that about the PRC ever since it's foundation, and yet they are the most thriving socialist country on the planet....partially because they aren't economically socialist.

However they will push their limits in the mean time like they have been doing, but as soon as the US gets actually pissed off and starts showing teeth they will actually back off.




LazyLizard said:


> let them, honestly don't see why foreign nations always have to stick their fingers in other countries business and try to decide what they should do. just let them do their own shit whether it's war or peace it's not our problem.



Well speaking from an american perspective we do need to protect our allies in the region....well by allies I just mean Japan and Australia since Korea is useless beyond military presence. But we still need to defend S Korea since geopolitics, alliances, and all that. But if China and the street shitters ever go to war (again) I really don't see how that's anyones problem. Hell even if Pakistan and India fling nukes at each other everyone else will probably crap themselves that we have nations in the modern era retarded enough to use nuclear weapons, and then shake their heads at it.


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## Haramburger (Nov 26, 2019)

Marco Fucko said:


> Bro literally just nuke China lol


a pinprick on an elephant. Which part of China? How many?


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## Freddy Freaker (Nov 26, 2019)

Haramburger said:


> a pinprick on an elephant. Which part of China? How many?


Neutron bombs on all their megalopolises


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## Slap47 (Nov 26, 2019)

China has all of the problems of a developed country but 10x worse without any benefits. It is isolated by geography and has a dogshit navy.

The US could easily destroy China without firing a shot. However, China is likely to destroy itself within the century.


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## MrJokerRager (Nov 26, 2019)

Slap47 said:


> China has all of the problems of a developed country but 10x worse without any benefits. It is isolated by geography and has a dogshit navy.
> 
> The US could easily destroy China without firing a shot. However, China is likely to destroy itself within the century.


They wrote the art of war, they will figure out a way to win.


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## Syaoran Li (Nov 26, 2019)

MrJokerRager said:


> They wrote the art of war, they will figure out a way to win.



China might figure out a way to win, but the PRC itself is one major recession away from a bloody civil war, if not outright counter-revolution and the collapse of the Chinese Communist Party.

The Chinese people are mostly compliant and willingly go along with the totalitarian abuses of the Communist Party only because of the economic prosperity that has been going on for the past thirty years. Once the bubble bursts, the people will be pissed and chaos will take over.

They managed to skate by during the late 2000's global meltdown, so a lot of people are convinced of China being an invincible superpower in the making.

The problem with China is that it's a weird mishmash of a paper tiger and a potential superpower. But it's hard to tell where the superpower ends and the paper tiger begins, precisely because the Chinese government is so secretive about it.


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## Slap47 (Nov 26, 2019)

MrJokerRager said:


> They wrote the art of war, they will figure out a way to win.



China's ace in the hole has always been in its near-infinite manpower from the rural countryside.

They're destroying their main weapon. Forced urbanization, demographic experiment fuckups and social isolation due to a general breakdown in the culture...


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## MrTickles (Nov 27, 2019)

I'm a realist and this is coming from the situation on the ground. Perspective is objective in this case. I've been in and around Shanghai, Nanjing, Wuxi, Suzhou for the past 3 weeks. Currently posting from a shanghai hotel room.

No homeless, no beggars, no crime, no grafitti, no bullshit.

Even the street sweepers and trash collectors are smiling and happy and doing their jobs with a spring in their step. This is an indicator of ya'll about to get fucked. A nation at its core is comprised of individual people, and these here individuals are pumped up and ready to be numbah won. _The streets are being paved with fucking gold. Let's rebel goys. Let's go back to killing and poverty lol._

Talk of civil war or rebellion against the regime in this atmosphere is fucking hilariously off-mark. You have no idea. Imagine you've just won the lottery. Are you going to contemplate suicide? Nope. Even Chinese maids with their $2 hour salaries know they've won the lottery.

Have some pics coz ya'll need some perspective.


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## TFT-A9 (Nov 27, 2019)

>launch nukes at China
>China retaliates
>MojaveWasteland.jpg

Finally I can be the Courier IRL.


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## Calooby (Nov 27, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> stuff


So what would be your opinion on the Hong Kong protests and stuff?


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## MrTickles (Nov 27, 2019)

Calooby said:


> So what would be your opinion on the Hong Kong protests and stuff?



I think the protest are comically overplayed and over dramatized. More people have died in french and spanish protests, directly at the hands of police. i.e they're being used by jewish media as a tool to stir propaganda against China. The 2 million protestor lie is just one of many such propaganda avenues. (actual figure was ~250,000 according to all legitimate western and local sources.)

According to the latest election stats, 42% of hong kongers support beijing candidates, the rest don't. However, since Beijing doesn't run hong kong policy-wise, the protests are a result of hong kong government mismanagement when it comes to costs of living. In reality proests are nothing new, even these are being directed at the left over British system, not that of Beijing. Hong Kong is a billionaire playground that is tailored to make the rich richer and the poor poorer. China didn't make it that way. Britain did. British also had to quash many protests in their time. Left on its own hong kong police are being very hands off compared to britain.

In that respect the protests are legitimate; if a government can't provide its populace with adequate financial stability and future prospects-as the students see it, it should be raged against. But beyond that, the protests are hijacked by anti-mainland ngo's acting on the behalf of Washington. The so called spark of the protests is not a legitimate one. A guy committing murder should have his ass put in jail, the prick is still free and being protected by the Washington rats.

This makes a large section of protestors impostors, working directly against their own welfare and against justice as pawns. These are the kids that are running around hurting people, setting them on fire, breaking public tax payer funded property, etc.

As for the mainland, Beijing doesn't really care about hong kong's internal affairs beyond keeping it from total sabotage by western ngo's. Microeconomics aren't important. Mainland doesn't get a cent from hong kong taxation wise-beyond that every dollar its ports lose is an extra dollar shenzhen and shanghai ports make, and the investment firms that are important macroeconomically are not touchable by the protests. As you recently saw tencents recent imposition on the hong kong stock exchange saw it raise over $11 billion in investor capital and its shares rise. Similarly hong kong's housing market is still growing, all good for the billionaires that reinvest back into their mainland companies.


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## Syaoran Li (Nov 27, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> I'm a realist and this is coming from the situation on the ground. Perspective is objective in this case. I've been in and around Shanghai, Nanjing, Wuxi, Suzhou for the past 3 weeks. Currently posting from a shanghai hotel room.
> 
> No homeless, no beggars, no crime, no grafitti, no bullshit.
> 
> ...



How much is the CCP paying you to spew this bullshit, you little prick?


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## A Welsh Cake (Nov 27, 2019)

Nanking didn't happen but I can't wait for the sequel. :^)


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## Syaoran Li (Nov 27, 2019)

@MrTickles 

I thought I should let you in on an important secret...

Xi Jinping is a fat faggot and I would not have sex with him. 

Also, the Tienanmen Square Massacre in 1989 was one of many black marks upon the Chinese Communist Party and yes, it did actually happen. Fuck the CCP.


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## TwinkLover6969 (Nov 28, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> I'm a realist and this is coming from the situation on the ground. Perspective is objective in this case. I've been in and around Shanghai, Nanjing, Wuxi, Suzhou for the past 3 weeks. Currently posting from a shanghai hotel room.
> 
> No homeless, no beggars, no crime, no grafitti, no bullshit.
> 
> ...


now go out to the rural areas where the majority of their population is and take photos


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## snailslime (Nov 28, 2019)

why do japs always cause trouble for all their neighbors


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## Coffee Anon (Nov 28, 2019)

There isn't going to be any east asian WW3 you autistic goofs. China will remain a totalitarian state as its people desire since they've evolved under such a system, both socially and genetically, over thousands of years. The west will continue to decay and degenerate from within and you will all delusionally tell yourselves everything is fine while you post on an internet gossip forum.


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## MrTickles (Nov 28, 2019)

TwinkLover6969 said:


> now go out to the rural areas where the majority of their population is and take photos



Majority (60%) is in cities. And I have been there, will share some pics soon. Countryside is actually cleaner and more pleasant than the bustling cities.


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## Webby's Boyfriend (Nov 28, 2019)

Like I say all the time, we need World War 3 desperately. World wars are great, they're like epic adventures of good vs evil where heroic forces of valour save the world from the powers of darkness to change the world forever.


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## L50LasPak (Nov 28, 2019)

You missed a spot, technically there's a small chunk of Kashmir claimed by China that dates back to the days of the Qing Empire. Considering how much China despises India over the whole Tibet thing, I wouldn't be surprised if they help Pakistan make India glow in the dark if conflict breaks out.

There's another thing though. China is on a ticking clock. Their population is getting older, and they didn't have enough kids to replace them. As a Communist country, they have a very exstensive set of public and social welfare programs to care for the elderly (debate the effectiveness of them if you want, point is they're there)  so once the bulk of the population passes into senescence there will be an apocalyptically huge strain on the economy that, frankly, might fucking cause China to implode altogether. And they can't just arbitrarily take those welfare programs away either, otherwise we'd see some serious, bloody rioting that would make Tianamen Square look like an LGBT Pride march.  

Their leaders know all of this, which is why they are enacting all of this crazy shit right now. Off the top of my head, here's China's list of shit to do, in no particular order:

Take those stupid islands (presumably there's oil under there nobody is talking about, or something.)
Do something to get Taiwan back.
Get North Korea to calm down, shut up and stop fucking with their plans for the US.
Figure out how to fuckstomp India so they shut the fuck up about Tibet.
Gladhand Pakistan enough so they switch sides from us to China, presumably for leverage against India.
Get that insane Silk Road continental infrastructural plan off the ground so they can steal Central Asia out from under Russia.
Possibly look into building that gas pipeline across the Caspian Sea so they can stick their dick into Caucasus too.
Install friendly regimes in Africa for those sweet, sweet rare earth and radioactive resources.
Transition to some form of clean or atomic energy so it stops raining used motor oil in major cities and placing a further burden on their socialized healthcare system.
Figure out some way to get ASEAN to either break up or bow down to them. I presume this is why they keep fucking with Australia. 
Vietnam and Indonesia to my knowledge still despise China (odd couple, I know) and will work against any plan to dick with ASEAN, so they have to figure out how to neutralize them too.
Stop me if I left anything out. 

By the way, your estimated timeframe of about 20 years is on the money but not in the way you think. I'd say China has about 20 years _left_ before the sun sets. The senior members of China's hierarchy are already old fuckers and by 20 years from now much of their core population is gonna be either getting up there in age or gonna be old as fuck. So either the PLA is either gonna come down with a serious case of alzheimers or they're gonna need to transition to a heavily automated system using lots of drones and robots. So that giant list of crap above, something I'd wager would take a century done properly, has to all be crammed into a single generation's worth of operations.

It's all so tiresome.


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## Syaoran Li (Nov 28, 2019)

Coffee Anon said:


> There isn't going to be any east asian WW3 you autistic goofs. China will remain a totalitarian state as its people desire since they've evolved under such a system, both socially and genetically, over thousands of years. The west will continue to decay and degenerate from within and you will all delusionally tell yourselves everything is fine while you post on an internet gossip forum.




Agreed on there not being a World War III in East Asia (although India and Pakistan are a different story) but I do think we are due for a Second Chinese Civil War. The PRC is one recession away from massive internal strife, both the Chinese people against the CCP and within the ranks of the CCP itself.

China will probably be under authoritarian rule for all of our lives, but it remains to be seen whether or not it will be under the authoritarian rule of the PRC.


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## COMMI3 MARK (Nov 28, 2019)

Syaoran Li said:


> How much is the CCP paying you to spew this bullshit, you little prick?



Not enough it would seem.


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## mindlessobserver (Nov 28, 2019)

L50LasPak said:


> You missed a spot, technically there's a small chunk of Kashmir claimed by China that dates back to the days of the Qing Empire. Considering how much China despises India over the whole Tibet thing, I wouldn't be surprised if they help Pakistan make India glow in the dark if conflict breaks out.
> 
> There's another thing though. China is on a ticking clock. Their population is getting older, and they didn't have enough kids to replace them. As a Communist country, they have a very exstensive set of public and social welfare programs to care for the elderly (debate the effectiveness of them if you want, point is they're there)  so once the bulk of the population passes into senescence there will be an apocalyptically huge strain on the economy that, frankly, might fucking cause China to implode altogether. And they can't just arbitrarily take those welfare programs away either, otherwise we'd see some serious, bloody rioting that would make Tianamen Square look like an LGBT Pride march.
> 
> ...



Cant argue with this. The big issue I see with East Asia is that there are simply too many failure points. Even at the worst of the cold war the o ly real failure point the US had with the Soviets was over who was in charge in Europe. But even there the US and Russia didnt have actual disputes over where the borders were, let alone have them be exasperated by centuries of historical grievances. What historical grievances were present were studiously sat on by both sides. By America who didnt give a shit about what the Europeans thought and the Russians by achieving all their historical ambitions and then some when they captured and held Berlin. 

That just is not the case in East Asia. There is a definite multipolar great power dynamic establishing itself and the US is not going to be strong enough to sit on everyone involved indefinitely


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## TFT-A9 (Nov 28, 2019)

mindlessobserver said:


> Cant argue with this. The big issue I see with East Asia is that there are simply too many failure points. Even at the worst of the cold war the o ly real failure point the US had with the Soviets was over who was in charge in Europe. But even there the US and Russia didnt have actual disputes over where the borders were, let alone have them be exasperated by centuries of historical grievances. What historical grievances were present were studiously sat on by both sides. By America who didnt give a shit about what the Europeans thought and the Russians by achieving all their historical ambitions and then some when they captured and held Berlin.
> 
> That just is not the case in East Asia. There is a definite multipolar great power dynamic establishing itself and the US is not going to be strong enough to sit on everyone involved indefinitely



If the US is no longer the biggest swinging dick in the room does that mean we won't have to play World Police for every other "Western democracy" out there? Is that a good thing or a bad thing in the long run? I'm kind of sick of "nation-building" bullshit.


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## L50LasPak (Nov 28, 2019)

The sad truth is that other than Japan we never had a grip on East Asia, or really Asia in general. Its too big and complicated. As much as I'd love for the American Empire to dominate and sell the Chinese the fabled $1 TV like in The Grasshopper Lies Heavy its just not practical. Besides, East Asia has deep-seated hatreds far beyond what we understand as normal racism. They despise each other worse than any white, black or hispanic will ever despise the other; and they're all waiting for just that right moment for the string to break and everyone to rip each other to shreds. Their hatred goes back centuries before Europe even colonized the Americas. If we try to get in the way of that, there'll be hell to pay, on top of how much they hate the west for interfering in their affairs.


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## Syaoran Li (Nov 29, 2019)

The real problem in Asia is the People's Republic of China.

You take out or at least subjugate the PRC, and a lot of dominoes will fall. North Korea won't be able to keep itself together as easily without the People's Republic of China propping them up for border security reasons (The CCP doesn't really like the Kims anymore, but they don't want the ROK near their border nor do they want to be flooded with refugees) and then the biggest conflicts will be between South Korea and Japan (both countries are close American allies, which can help us) and the more important and high-stakes conflict between India and Pakistan.

Honestly, the United States should be backing our traditional allies of Japan and South Korea, and also take a wider stance that is more pro-India and anti-China


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## Coleslaw (Dec 19, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> I'm a realist and this is coming from the situation on the ground. Perspective is objective in this case. I've been in and around Shanghai, Nanjing, Wuxi, Suzhou for the past 3 weeks. Currently posting from a shanghai hotel room.
> 
> No homeless, no beggars, no crime, no grafitti, no bullshit.
> 
> ...


How'd you manage to see the science museum when it was empty? (Honest question, I like talking about my city.)


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## MrTickles (Dec 19, 2019)

Coleslaw said:


> How'd you manage to see the science museum when it was empty? (Honest question, I like talking about my city.)



It was not empty. There were at least a few hundred school kids in there. I hoped it would be empty but it was filled with little brats.


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## Coleslaw (Dec 19, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> It was not empty. There were at least a few hundred school kids in there. I hoped it would be empty but it was filled with little brats.


Haha yeah, everyone and his grandmother goes there for a school trip. Did you see Century Park?


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## MrTickles (Dec 19, 2019)

Coleslaw said:


> Haha yeah, everyone and his grandmother goes there for a school trip. Did you see Century Park?



Yup. Seen about 20+ galleries and museums and stuff in Shanghai. Here for another few weeks will see more stuff. The propaganda poster museum was weird. Just a bunch of old junk in some dudes basement.


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## Coleslaw (Dec 19, 2019)

MrTickles said:


> Yup. Seen about 20+ galleries and museums and stuff in Shanghai. Here for another few weeks will see more stuff. The propaganda poster museum was weird. Just a bunch of old junk in some dudes basement.


Make sure to head out west and see the subway museum. There's a place where you can pretend to drive a train.


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## Unyielding Stupidity (Dec 19, 2019)

Considering the general building quality of most modern Chinese buildings thanks to substandard materials being used to quickly inflate their GDP, pretty much anything that explodes with more power than a hand grenade would probably bring down such buildings with ease. China wouldn't really be able to fight for that long without all their new shiny ghost cities turning into a fine grey mist.


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## soy_king (Dec 24, 2019)

What I dont understand is why the US Decided to push for ASEAN to include notoriously pro Chinese states like Cambodia and Laos? All it does is render that organization essentially toothless, and reduce it from a unified front to a score of bickering nations that China can defeat piecemeal


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## Sweet and Savoury (Dec 24, 2019)

You want to worry about nuclear war in Asia?

Worry about India and Pakistan. They hate each other with an undying passion and the Paki's have an inferiority complex about their bigger neighbors.  

If nukes are going to fly...it will be from there.


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## Still Anonymous For This (Dec 25, 2019)

EDIT: Holy shit, this was far longer than I intended.  TL;DR: China is a bit shit.



Syaoran Li said:


> China might figure out a way to win, but the PRC itself is one major recession away from a bloody civil war, if not outright counter-revolution and the collapse of the Chinese Communist Party.
> 
> The Chinese people are mostly compliant and willingly go along with the totalitarian abuses of the Communist Party only because of the economic prosperity that has been going on for the past thirty years. Once the bubble bursts, the people will be pissed and chaos will take over.
> 
> ...



I'm about a month late to this party, but whatever.

An overwhelming majority of Chinese do not give two actual fucks about their government.  I've never met anyone in China who wasn't patriotic about _China, _but I've never met one who earnestly gives two shits about the Party.  Almost everyone in the nation plays along in order to do business: I know of more than one businessman in China who belongs to the Party for the sole reason that it makes it much easier for them to run their own little stores.  Everyone knows the Chinese Communist Party is shit, but there's just not enough incentive to get shot in the face yet over it.

But this isn't 2003.  The CCP is losing their grip on the internet in the country.  Spend any amount of time in China as a foreigner and within a day of meeting someone, you're very likely going to be asked if you can help them get a VPN.  Chinese citizens _crave _Western media and social media.



MrTickles said:


> Majority (60%) is in cities. And I have been there, will share some pics soon. Countryside is actually cleaner and more pleasant than the bustling cities.



This is an absolute load of bullshit.  Areas in which foreigners might be seen are kept immaculately clean.  Cities in China are, to be fair, fairly clean.  Go to Shanghai or Hangzhou and you'll see a veritable army of elderly men and women shuffling around with trash-cans and brooms in orange jumpsuits sweeping the place up.  They absolutely do _not _hop around with a spring in their step: they're almost all over sixty and they're never smiling.

Outside of centers of commerce and outside of tourist attractions, there absolutely is abject poverty in China and it absolutely is not clean.  Taizhou comes to mind, where roads are not paved and tenement housing is stacked up on top of each other.  Houses are poorly built and poorly maintained.

What MrTickles has not explained in his photos is the distinct lack of people.  There is an exceptionally small amount of people in the locations he took pictures of, because nobody in China can either be fucked or can afford to go to those places.  Take a picture of either of Hangzhou's train stations and the lines at the ticket booths that go out the fucking door and wrap around the building and get back to me about cleanliness and efficiency.  And the tellers who close their fucking windows when there's still people waiting in line, because fuck them, she has to take a break and can't be fucked to wait for her replacement.

I welcome anyone to visit a hotel in China and try to get literally anything done.  The Chinese have a long and storied history during the CCP age, where if they don't know you, they will do anything and everything to pass off your quest onto someone else.  And if that person, who told another person, who told another person, who told _another _person, didn't do it?  Well, fuck you, they tried to help you, why are you upset?



MrJokerRager said:


> They wrote the art of war, they will figure out a way to win.



That was the 6th Century BC.  That's like saying the Greeks are the true military powerhouse of Europe, because Sparta.

China does not have a warrior culture, no matter how many shitty Russian knock-off tanks they parade through Tiananmen Square.  For the past few centuries _at least_, soldiering was considered a waste of a man's time.  Arts and commerce was considered the honorable trades for men.  You couldn't make your family a fortune if you got decapitated by Mongols on the steppe.  There's a reason why China during World War II was such a fuck-up: avoiding military service gets you props in that country not shame like it does in the United States.

I love ragging on how unprofessional and poorly equipped the Russian military is: it is a paper tiger.  With that said, the Russians could shit all over the Chinese military (which swears allegiance to the _party _and not to China) any day of the week.  It's actually kind of interesting when you look at Chinese military equipment.  If you're a nation who does already have a military industrial complex, nor do you have the inclination or the ability to develop one, you essentially have two options: you either buy from a NATO power and spend a pretty penny on American, French, German, British, etc equipment.  Whether that be a Leopard 2 or an F-16 Falcon.  If you _don't _want to spend a lot of money, and you just need shit that _works _and is _pretty okay_, you buy from Russia.  Whether that's a T-72 variant or a MiG-29.

Outside of Pakistan and Myanmar, China cannot compete against NATO and Russia in the export market.  Their equipment is nowhere near as good as NATO equipment and unless China is trying to bully your shitty African nation into buying even more cheap Type 56 rifle knock-offs because they just built that shiny road for you, there's no reason not to buy from the Russians.  The Type 90 Chinese tank was supposed to be an export tank for China, since they didn't approve it for service in the PLA, but nobody outside the Pakistanis bought it.  Nobody except the Sudanese have bought the Type 96.  Why?  Because a T-72 with a bunch of shit plastered on it is still a better tank and that's not necessarily a high bar to meet.



Sweet and Savoury said:


> You want to worry about nuclear war in Asia?
> 
> Worry about India and Pakistan. They hate each other with an undying passion and the Paki's have an inferiority complex about their bigger neighbors.
> 
> If nukes are going to fly...it will be from there.



I used to worry about an Indian-Pakistani conflict going nuclear, but considering the performances of both militaries during their last spat, I sincerely doubt either of them are competent enough to even get their warheads into the air and on target.

That's not a joke.


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## MrJokerRager (Dec 25, 2019)

Still Anonymous For This said:


> That was the 6th Century BC.  That's like saying the Greeks are the true military powerhouse of Europe, because Sparta.
> 
> China does not have a warrior culture, no matter how many shitty Russian knock-off tanks they parade through Tiananmen Square.  For the past few centuries _at least_, soldiering was considered a waste of a man's time.  Arts and commerce was considered the honorable trades for men.  You couldn't make your family a fortune if you got decapitated by Mongols on the steppe.  There's a reason why China during World War II was such a fuck-up: avoiding military service gets you props in that country not shame like it does in the United States.
> 
> I love ragging on how unprofessional and poorly equipped the Russian military is: it is a paper tiger.  With that said, the Russians could shit all over the Chinese military (which swears allegiance to the _party _and not to China) any day of the week.  It's actually kind of interesting when you look at Chinese military equipment.  If you're a nation who does already have a military industrial complex, nor do you have the inclination or the ability to develop one, you essentially have two options: you either buy from a NATO power and spend a pretty penny on American, French, German, British, etc equipment.  Whether that be a Leopard 2 or an F-16 Falcon.  If you _don't _want to spend a lot of money, and you just need shit that _works _and is _pretty okay_, you buy from Russia.  Whether that's a T-72 variant or a MiG-29.



But Battlefield 4 told me China Stronk. I remember talking about the Chinese stuff is a copycat of American or Russian to a Chinese Mainlander once, he told me yeah that Chinese military hardware sucks. That was just a personal anecdote. I know this is unrelated but EA has proven that you can make great visual games, just abandon the story mode cause it sucked for all Battlefield games except maybe 1 cause that was somewhat unique then they fuck it up in 5.

Didn't China fail in World War 2 because before that conflict, it got colonized by literally all the major world powers during one of their opium rebellions and it took Uncle Sam to tell everyone to fuck off but the damage was done. And the Japanese definitely were stronger and more experienced by the time World War 2 happened. They were also in the middle of a civil war between Communists and Nationalists when Hirohito decided to join the party. Can't expect them to wage a war when the country was not unified till after the end of the war.

Also Russia tried to threaten China and made one of their classical errors when they tried to show off their T-62 tank, state of the art at the time, and it broke down in Chinese territory during a skirmish. They failed to destroy it and the Chinese took that thing and started their native tank development based off it. 

Edit: Also told them how to make the Atom Bomb, kind changes a lot of things when it comes to leverage.


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## Coleslaw (Jan 1, 2020)

Still Anonymous For This said:


> EDIT: Holy shit, this was far longer than I intended.  TL;DR: China is a bit shit.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Southern Jiangsu has been historically and currently a wealthy and fertile area, so even if he went to the country, it would not represent all of rural China.
Source: Family is from there.


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