# Is there a connection between religious belief and familial relationships?



## Exigent Circumcisions (May 24, 2019)

Until the age of seven or eight I believed in God; my grandparents strongly believed in God and my parents were agnostic about the whole issue (or rather, they were outwardly agnostic and just let us believe whatever we wanted). After reading the Bible for a while I became steadily disillusioned with God and stopped believing; I spent the subsequent 20-odd years as an atheist (non-fedorafag, though). Full disclosure; I am a Christian now but that's not the subject of this post.

I had a very strained relationship with both of my parents, which I won't get into details about. Suffice it to say that I never properly bonded with them and consequently was distrustful of their support, encouragement, or advice. These are not people to whom you'd trust your deepest thoughts to; you'd risk being misunderstood at best and utterly ignored at worst. So I did most of my growing up in spite of them, not because of them.

Part of what led me back to faith was picking up the pieces from all of that bullshit and realizing that my view of the world as a chaotic, dangerous, uncaring place was informed by the lack of trust I'd had in my parents; how could I trust God if my own mother and father hadn't sheltered me? Once I worked my way out from underneath trying to root myself in a life I had no faith in I fairly quickly made the trip back to belief.

None of this is a pity-play; I've dealt with this and I'm pretty damned happy with where I am in life, finally. Just simply putting the question out there: Does anybody else think that familial relationships have an effect on the basis of belief?

I know that trying to reduce the reasons to have faith to one singular reason is almost pointlessly reductive but it's something that I've wondered about for quite some time so there it is. Serious answers are appreciated but I don't mind shit-posting either.

P.S.: Try typing out the word 'religious' a dozen times and see if it doesn't start to look like the stupidest fucking word in existence.

ETA: This isn't a discussion about the merits of one belief system over another; we're just talking over whether or not there might be connection between a disconnect with family and a disconnect from religious belief. Let's try to stick to the topic and not lapse into white-knighting our personal philosophies.


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## Sprig of Parsley (May 24, 2019)

Family's always been a hot fucking mess though I suppose it really could have been worse (somehow).  Household was always basically agnostic-apatheist, though mother's side is full of evangelicals and father's side is whatever the fuck Alsatian Frenchies tend to be.


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## Exigent Circumcisions (May 24, 2019)

Sprig of Parsley said:


> Family's always been a hot fucking mess though I suppose it really could have been worse (somehow).  Household was always basically agnostic-apatheist, though mother's side is full of evangelicals and father's side is whatever the fuck Alsatian Frenchies tend to be.


Just going to add for clarity that you're an atheist. (Right?)


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## Sprig of Parsley (May 24, 2019)

Exigent Circumcisions said:


> Just going to add for clarity that you're an atheist. (Right?)


If it matters enough to be pinned down to that specific label, I suppose.  I'm more or less "don't know, don't care" about the matter for the most part, but I have yet to have any sort of personal experience that has ignited any spark of faith and I find evidence for existence about as uncompelling as I find YouTube atheists annoying.


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## The Pink Panther (May 24, 2019)

Non-religious/Religious/Good Relationship

Maybe it's because I haven't told them I'm non-religious. People disagree on ethics all the time, and it's best not to really discuss ethics, because people tie their ethics with their personal identity all the time and they feel really passionate about them...that they become too passionate. So passionate that whenever your form of ethics contradicts with yours, they'll pressure you into thinking that their moral perception of the world is the way that everyone should live, even though not all people might not agree with their conclusions or rather my conclusions either. Everyone's different, people choose their own ethical path.


The reason why I'm non-religious comes not from shitty upbringing, but through watching _The Seventh Sign_. I will not add anything further than that.


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## Rand /pol/ (May 24, 2019)

I'm an atheist because there isn't any proof of god existing. My upbringing is kind of irrelevant.


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## Marco Fucko (May 24, 2019)

My mom is generically spiritual and hates her christfag parents. Following that, I'm generically irreligious and she and I have a rocky (although not entirely negative) relationship.


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## Exigent Circumcisions (May 24, 2019)

Ron /pol/ said:


> I'm an atheist because there isn't any proof of god existing. My upbringing is kind of irrelevant.


You're the only guy who can shit post by giving a serious (if incomplete) answer. Fuck off, Ron.


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## Just A Butt (May 24, 2019)

Neither my parents or myself are religious, but we come from a fairly religious family.  I'd describe my relationship with them as pretty good, but that still doesn't mean they are the people I would trust to understand my deep thoughts / problems. I personally don't think religion vs secular makes that bond any stronger (or weaker) than it would be normally.  Parents and kids aren't supposed to be that close, in my opinion. 

Slightly off-topic: my uncle once told me I was going to hell simply because I don't go to church.  But he's kind of an asshole, so that might be an outlier kind of thing.


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## Sīn the Moon Daddy (May 24, 2019)

Nobody ever told me to believe in God. My best friend growing up was a very religious black kid but we mostly bonded over basketball and white girls.

Since I never went to church it just wasn't a part of my life.


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## The Pink Panther (May 24, 2019)

Sīn the Moon Daddy said:


> religious black kid



A common brand of _Nigger._


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## queue-anon (May 24, 2019)

My mother was religious in a typical Scandinavian way of never talking about God or attending church. I had a good relationship with her. My father was an atheist in a typical "religious people are morons" way. I had a crappy relationship with him.

I'm an atheist because I wasn't indoctrinated into that belief system by either parent, and both my parents, but especially my father, instilled critical thinking and skepticism in me at an early age. I won't lie to myself to make myself feel better, but I understand why other people do it (I don't agree with my father that religious people are stupid), and I feel a little twinge of envy regarding people who have it comparatively easier when considering death -- their own and their loved ones'.


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## Exigent Circumcisions (May 24, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> My mother was religious in a typical Scandinavian way of never talking about God or attending church. I had a good relationship with her. My father was an atheist in a typical "religious people are morons" way. I had a crappy relationship with him.
> 
> I'm an atheist because I wasn't indoctrinated into that belief system by either parent, and both my parents, but especially my father, instilled critical thinking and skepticism in me at an early age. I won't lie to myself to make myself feel better, but I understand why other people do it (I don't agree with my father that religious people are stupid), and I feel a little twinge of envy regarding people who have it comparatively easier when considering death -- their own and their loved ones'.


I generally avoid condescending to atheists because I get it, I've been there but lol calm down fag. If you think that critical thinking and skepticism will automatically yield atheism you're just smelling your own farts. History would tend to disagree with your assessment. As for indoctrination; I definitely was not indoctrinated and I don't consider indoctrination to be a moral way to induct members to any faith. Believe it or not, I think a healthy dose of critical thinking and skepticism is imperative. 

Anyways, let's try to stick to the topic instead of christ or fedora-fagging, shall we? This thread doesn't exist for proselytizing because that shit's gay as hell.


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## ToroidalBoat (May 24, 2019)

I think it's more of a matter of tradition. For example, East Asia is fairly secular, but family is pretty important.


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## queue-anon (May 24, 2019)

Exigent Circumcisions said:


> I generally avoid condescending to atheists because I get it, I've been there but lol calm down fag. If you think that critical thinking and skepticism will automatically yield atheism you're just smelling your own farts. History would tend to disagree with your assessment. As for indoctrination; I definitely was not indoctrinated and I don't consider indoctrination to be a moral way to induct members to any faith. Believe it or not, I think a healthy dose of critical thinking and skepticism is imperative.
> 
> Anyways, let's try to stick to the topic instead of christ or fedora-fagging, shall we? This thread doesn't exist for proselytizing because that shit's gay as hell.



If you don't think that the vast majority of people who are religious got there through indoctrination, I don't know what to tell you. Most people accept what they were told as they were growing up and don't second guess it. If that weren't the case, there would be a lot more lateral conversions to other faiths, but the vast majority stick to whatever their parents believe. Hell, that's even true for politics.

I usually don't attack the tenets of religious people's faiths because it's none of my business, but do go on about how your belief in the trinity and the virgin birth came about through critical thinking and skepticism.

All religious belief requires _faith_, which is diametrically opposed to rational thinking, as it should be.


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## Exigent Circumcisions (May 24, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> -snip-


I said we wouldn't be proselytizing, here. So no, I won't explain to you. You could pick up a Bible if you wanted, or talk to a pastor, I don't care. But this isn't the thread for that.


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## RG 448 (May 24, 2019)

As a kid I believed in God because I was told He was real.  Relationship with the folks was often strained but they tried their best and I wasn’t an easy kid to deal with.  Anyone who knows me here can see I’ve definitely got a few screws loose.  I think we all start to question the faith as we get older, or maybe only some of us do, I don’t really know.  Critical thinking skills develope, we understand the world around us better, etc.  As an adult when I started going through serious stuff I found Him for real.


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## 1864897514651 (May 24, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> [redacted]



Are you seriously claiming faith is opposed to logic? You must have had one rough childhood. You need to deal with that better than totally repudiating faith in humanity. Even God has faith in us.


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## wellthathappened (May 24, 2019)

Grew up Catholic, never believed in god, and the entire concept seemed incidental to a culture I was a part of. I'm not an atheist because I hate religion, in fact there's a great deal of value in it. I don't believe in god because that is how shit is.


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## Zeke Von Genbu (May 25, 2019)

My parents weren't really zealous religious people, they believed in god I think, but they never really went to church or cared too hard about the Bible's teachings beyond the most surface level stuff you can think of. My grandmother though was a huge bible thumper who would cry about how I'm going to hell because I didn't go to church enough and nothing else. So I can't say I was raised to want to believe religion in any way.

I'm personally an atheist, I just can't see the proof of god and I don't see any reason to believe in a book like the Bible because, in theory, anyone can write a book like the Bible. So I am personally vehemently unreligious on a personal level, but I don't care too much what other people do, I just can't believe in religion on a personal level. So I suppose in my case, my relationship with my family did shape my beliefs as my parents didn't care overall and my grandmother was an annoying whiny bitch when it came to the Bible.


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## Basil II (May 25, 2019)

My Parents are both Fedoras (Formerly barely religious, went full Fedora in the Bush era when I was little) but they never really talked about it, my Mother dislikes organized religion as she sees it as a scam to control people, which I agree it can be, but I think there are genuine religious people.

My Paternal Grandfather is a somewhat devout Christian, but he's into weird "Non denominational" shit and goes to Free Mason meetings, he's referred to by the rest of my family as "The Wizard"
I went full Fedora when I was like 10 and started watching Atheist youtube (Yes) literally getting into retarded youtube section arguments about stuff I had no idea about.

As I grow older I feel more drawn to Eastern Orthodox Christianity, I very much like how it doesn't pretend to know everything about God and the Universe like Western Christianity, Western Christianity is also ruined by the 10 Billion batshit insane Protestant denominations and the Pedophiles in Rome.

I think part of the problem is teaching Religion to Children that don't really understand it, I never experienced this but I do notice it and even in this thread there are people mentioning it.
Get along great with both my parents.


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## queue-anon (May 25, 2019)

1864897514651 said:


> Are you seriously claiming faith is opposed to logic? You must have had one rough childhood. You need to deal with that better than totally repudiating faith in humanity. Even God has faith in us.



Well, the end result of picking apart religion logically is for religious leaders to tell questioners to go on faith. So, yes, I do, because that’s what _you_ guys do. It’s just when an atheist makes the distinction, suddenly religious people sperg out.

Religious people have made a decision to believe things that cannot be proven. I respect that that makes religious people feel right with the world and their place in it, but it’s not logical. Sorry you’re uncomfortable with that.


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## Basil II (May 25, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> Well, the end result of picking apart religion logically is for religious leaders to tell questioners to go on faith. So, yes, I do, because that’s what _you_ guys do. It’s just when an atheist makes the distinction, suddenly religious people sperg out.
> 
> Religious people have made a decision to believe things that cannot be proven. I respect that that makes religious people feel right with the world and their place in it, but it’s not logical. Sorry you’re uncomfortable with that.


tl:dr "I'm smarter and more logical than thousands of years of philosophers"
come on man, I used to be a Fedora too.


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## Otis Boi (May 25, 2019)

I will start off by saying that I'm in the camp that doesn't care if there is a god or not and won't change how they live their if proof either way happens to pop up.  My mother grew up in a family where she was tough a person had to find religion and not have it be forced about them. They did have to attended church until they where old enough to stay home alone then it was their choice.  My mother never made me go to church she did take me a few times but she was to bored to ever go again. We did have a Sunday ritual where should would make hot coco and read these sappy articles about people saving puppies from wells and shit. I think it was her was of trying to instill some sort of moral compass. One thing my mother told me when I got older was that religion is a lot like imaginary friend. It is the comfort comes from knowing that you are never alone and some people just need that. 

As for my father he wasn't in my childhood much,he was in the millitary, so are relationship was a bit strained until recently. He is more of an atheist not the fedora type he just seems very disillusioned with the world. Honestly I think I would have turned out to become a Eurphoric type if I was around him when i was younger.


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## Kari Kamiya (May 25, 2019)

Losing connection with your family over religious/non-religious beliefs is sad to me because it goes against the very foundation of what makes family _family_: unconditional love. Parents do want what's best for their children but forget children need to have the ability to be able to make their own choices and judgments. At the same time, children may not be aware of/understand what their parents are trying to do because some subjects are just a bit too complex to comprehend or they're not observant enough of their parents to know of their own personal struggles (though if the parent(s) isn't around much, it's much more difficult and straining). Communication is ultimately the key to coming to an understanding with one-another, but it should always be approached with love and a desire to understand each other. But we're all human, and we want to feel like we're in control or have some purpose in our life, and opinions that "go against the narrative" frighten us.

I mean, that's the question you're asking, right? Everyone's giving their life-stories, so... Well, to throw my hat into the ring, my family and I are religious so we're church-going people, and the majority of our conversations relate/make its way to religion in some form or another. I don't care about the discussions too much and most of that's because I tend to just listen and not participate, and even then I'm doing other things and am trying to focus on one or the other, but no matter the topic, at some point religious principles/doctrine makes its way in. But I think it's natural when you have questions about something going on in life and you need to draw parallels to something like a story, and being raised on Bible stories, those tend to come to mind. So yeah, we don't have a strained relationship, though I consider religion to be more like a guidebook than a super glue or a magnet or blood ties.

Though I do find it an interesting comparison between my family and my cousins who have become agnostic/atheist and have a very rocky relationship with their parents (might as well point out they're pretty much in a loveless marriage, they're too stubborn/Aunt's too deeply rooted in her Mexican ways to seek divorce), significant others, and each other, and they're just not happy people. Not that my relationship with my family is the most perfect relationship in the world, my brothers and I get irritated/snippy/peeved at each other a lot and I don't hug my parents, but at least we're talking to each other and have quality time while also staying out of trouble.

Really makes you think.


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## RetardedCat (May 25, 2019)

Religious in a mostly non-religious family. It's never been an issue, I've always had a pretty good relationship with my parents in general. I guess my parents understand what it means to have kids and love me unconditionally as they should. 



Spoiler



unless I were to marry a nigger, then I'd fully understand if they wanted to disavow my ass


To the surprise of all the atheists fedora tippers, I went towards science-oriented studies and love learning about all that stuff, yet never renounced my faith. Speaking of said fedora tippers, every single one I've met had a terrible relationship with their religious family members probably cause they just can't stop arguing about faith when they're around someone who isn't another avid sword collector. 

I feel like faith/religion is kinda like politics, you can argue about it all day but for fuck's sake keep it to yourself when it comes to family. No one wants to spend a shitty holiday where everyone's yelling at each other over dumb shit that won't matter once everyone returns home.


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## Drunk and Pour (May 25, 2019)

I went non-religious/religious/good relations.  I wish relations were better, but that's on me because I'm the recluse.  Other than that, we all love each other.  I was raised basically culturally religious.  My dad was raised Irish Catholic, my mom was Irish Protestant (American Irish, not living in Ireland).  Early in my life they tried to get me and my siblings to go to church on sundays.  I remember when I refused, I was told I'd go to hell, and I was like, I don't care I want to sleep.  They were nice enough to respect my wishes in that regard, but I'd still have to go to church for Christmas and Easter.

Fast forward to adult life.  My dad being a lapsed Catholic has gotten back into it.  My mom who was barely Protestant likes to talk about God being extraterrestrial and angles being aliens.  I'm agnostic that leans more towards belief in Jesus.  I've always had a dislike of supposed intellectual atheists.  They puff out their chests at the shear notion that there is an old man in the sky that knows everything.  They are much too smart to believe that silliness.  Yet how much do we now know that humans haven't known decades or centuries ago.  How much are we uncapable of knowing just because of our biological limits?  I guess we could just be a crazy coincidence that will last for a few hundreds of thousands of years, but maybe there is something beyond us.


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## Clop (May 25, 2019)

I was never even baptized, born to two atheists. I don't consider it a big deal that I don't believe in any religious deity, but neither do I have a relationship with my parents because I don't think they're people worth my time. Parents are like any circle of friends, I can't take seriously any people who talk about blood being thicker than water. If someone's a shitty person or just not the kind of person you enjoy spending an afternoon with, you don't owe them your time.

Keeping in mind that I think familial relationships have more to do with the local culture. If I was Italian I'd be beaten senseless by mama for thinking such a thing. My culture simply puts independence forward as a huge milestone that everyone should aspire to as soon as possible.


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## 1864897514651 (May 25, 2019)

queue-anon said:


> [redacted]



Only a stupid man would have faith in something empty. We Christians know that Jesus was a real Man, and that He truly raised from the dead. Is your testimony superior to the testimony of the twelve apostles, eleven of which suffered martyrdom for Christ? Why would eleven men choose death over life if they did not see the risen Lord? And if you should deny even the very existence of Jesus, then why do you accept the existence of governor Pontius Pilate and emperor Tiberius? What about king Tutankhamun? To clarify, these comparisons are only made to jest. Of course Jesus was a real Person, and of course He rose from the dead.

Our faith is in the risen Lord because in the words of Saint Paul, "And if Christ be not risen again, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain." Christians do not blindly follow an event that is not proven. If you do not comprehend how eyewitness testimony functions in the court of law, let alone in the court of Divine Law, then you are wasting my time. And the eyewitness testimonies of the apostles and disciples is unanimous and awesome. Read the Bible.

If you should be able to comprehend what I just said, then let me address the next question you might have. You might ask what our faith in the risen Lord is for, and to that, I can only say Heaven.


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## shartshooter (May 25, 2019)

I think it would cut both ways. It's a meme to hear people complaining about their parents' religion so you know that's a thing (at least in younger years.) Later life converts are often addicts or felons or general losers who need a new start, and that type almost always had a rough relationship with their parents as part of what shaped them into who they are.

So to OP's question, I think the more stable the home the more likely the children will emulate their parents in all beliefs and practices, obligatory teenage rebellion years aside.


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## Recoil (May 25, 2019)

My parents are non religious, never took me to church. I came to God (not religion) on my own later in life & I'm sure my folks think it's a bit silly, but they also see how much more at peace I am.
My mom once told me that this self determination was the reason they raised me non-religious - that way any faith I do have is of my own making and not something I've been pushed into.


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## drtoboggan (May 25, 2019)

Religion is for idiots.


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## Exigent Circumcisions (May 25, 2019)

1864897514651 said:


> -snip-



Okay, everybody gets one I guess, good post and all but take it to PMs, please.


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## Lemmingwise (May 25, 2019)

1864897514651 said:


> Why would eleven men choose death over life if they did not see the risen Lord?



It wouldn't have been the first suicide cult. There are stronger way to argue for existance of god than depending on testimony of a gospel that we don't know the language of its first recording with certainty.

As to get back to the OP, did you start this thread because of E Michael Jones' observation that people without fathers or with poor fathers have difficulty finding/seeing a divine father?

As to your data point collection, I believed in god where my siblings and parents did not. I was told one of my grandparents was religious, but I never figured out which one with certainty, despite knowing them.

I stopped believing in god in early teens. I think as a result of Neale Donald Walsch's books. Looking back on it, I think it's impossible not to lose faith if you take those books in and have a poor understanding of christianity.

I've been wanting to refind religion for some time now, but every attempt has been thwarted because of lack of faith, or evidence, depending on your perspective.

Here's some of my unfiltered thinking on it. It is unlikely that people will have the same understanding of god. Just like many works of art are layered (think the muppets; some jokes are for adults, some for children). Understanding of a religion can be no different. Further IQ differences necessarily stratify this. I could never comprehend the way someone like Christopher Langan conceptualises god; someone of below average intelligence couldn't comprehend the way that I do. We are cognitively divided.

This is also why any attempts to build an atheistic moral system like Sam Harris tried fails, because it is only from being in an echo bubble with high IQ people that one could think it makes sense to the average man or woman. I don't think it is inherently doomed to failure, but creating a system which is multilayered so that each can understand it in their own way is no easy feat. You can look at how churches congregate to generally with their own ethnic groups to see that it isn't just cognitive, but also temperamental differences.

The reason I keep getting cajoled back is that the only thinkers that resist some of the modern madness, are thinkers that do embrace christianity. And not only that, I often depend on their research to understand the motives of the things I see as going wrong in the world, like E Michael Jones thoughts on Ramallah and sexual control.

Though with that said, it does seem like a faustian pact, to accept that knowledge and some of the pro-fertile and pro-virtue thinking, that I also have to accept some historic and supernatural facts that do not seem true to me at all and it feels like a betrayal to my self and inquisitive nature to accept or pretend to believe.

Just some of my thoughts. I wouldn't call my relationships to my parents good, but not bad either, it's somewhat lukewarm with some issues. I would call it an unstable home growing up.


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## Sprig of Parsley (May 25, 2019)

I've honestly seen a NEGATIVE correlation between crappy upbringing/home environment and atheistic tendency.  Some of the most religious people I ever encountered were from horrifically broken homes and they dove deep into religion mostly as a way to try and tell themselves that SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE would make things right eventually.


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## PL 001 (May 25, 2019)

Grew up Baptist, went through edgelord atheist phase in my teen years that was thankfully short, I consider myself agnostic now. Nobody knows for certain what happens after death. The religious can't prove an afterlife exists, and the atheists can't prove it doesn't. Like Mulder, I want to believe, but like Scully, I need some sort of proof. Kind of an autistic way of putting it, but there it is. 

My dad is a pretty hardcore evangelical Baptist. Aside from a few political points and morality issues we disagree on, we get along just fine. His faith and my skepticism never clash.


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## The best and greatest (May 25, 2019)

Difficult question to answer. I'd say the imposition of codified structure into the family home to model conduct off of probably has more to do with it, but thats just me hipfiring. Willing to bet you anything 100 years ago the fundies of the day were on average more biblically literate and not just a know-nothing-pew-sitter.

Overall there's no reason religious institutions can't be a positive force but that's really up to them and what they choose to make a priority. Choosing to uphold the appearance of moral propriety in lieu of holding fast to the true heart and spirit of those beliefs makes for a dead hollow tree which is what we see with organisations like the roman catholic church today.


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## Exigent Circumcisions (May 25, 2019)

Sprig of Parsley said:


> I've honestly seen a NEGATIVE correlation between crappy upbringing/home environment and atheistic tendency.  Some of the most religious people I ever encountered were from horrifically broken homes and they dove deep into religion mostly as a way to try and tell themselves that SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE would make things right eventually.


That's part of what I'm getting at, yeah. Although I don't entirely agree with your conclusion but that's all good.
 I couldn't decide whether to lay it out in the OP and start the argument or just ask my rambling, autistic question and see what happened so I went with leaving it out. So far I'm happy with the state of the discussion.


Lemmingwise said:


> As to get back to the OP, did you start this thread because of E Michael Jones' observation that people without fathers or with poor fathers have difficulty finding/seeing a divine father?


Never heard of him that I can recall. I'm sure I've been exposed to the idea but it's hard to tell if that was before or after it had already activated my almonds. I mean, JLP talks about it quite often, and maybe listening to him helped solidify the question in my mind, but I'm pretty sure it predates listening to any of his stuff. So, dunno?


The best and greatest said:


> which is what we see with organisations like the roman catholic church today.


Poor, benighted Catholics. Let's all pour a bottle of red out on the curb for their church.


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## Jan_Hus (May 25, 2019)

My parents and my grandparents were never big fans of organized religion, (on both sides funnily enough, my dad's dad had a crisis of faith in his younger years and my mom's dad saw organized faith as a way to rip off the working man) believing that personal faith was far more honest and helpful than an organized one. Now that we're all grown up, two of my brothers and my older sister go to church regularly while my younger brother and I don't really care.


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## Junkail (May 25, 2019)

My family is a mix of religious and nonreligious people. My father and I are nonreligious, whereas mom and my siblings (by their own volition) are religious.  Generally, I get along well with both of my parents, but they don't get along well with each other.


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## ProgKing of the North (May 25, 2019)

My close family isn't religious, although some of the more distant relatives are pretty hardcore Southern Baptists, but I did go to a religious school (which basically consisted of saying the Lord's Prayer every morning and going to a "be a good person" centered Chapel service once a week). I'm nonreligious just because I haven't personally seen any proof that any sort of God exists, and although I'm open to the idea of one existing I don't see how it necessarily follows that because one exists it's the God(s) of Christianity or Islam or Hinduism or whatever. I have my issues with most organized religion, but if I did see that proof I'd probably bite the bullet and join one.


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## Miss Misery (May 25, 2019)

I couldn't really vote because my answer is weird. 

I was raised without religion but wasn't discouraged from investigating, my grandparents were all nominally Christian but didn't go to church. I find religion fascinating in an anthropological sense and was various levels of atheist, agnostic, and 'spiritual but not religious' for most of my life. Great relationship with my parents. And now we're all Christian, but we came to our conclusions on faith and religion independently.


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## Hellbound Hellhound (May 25, 2019)

There is obviously a strong link between religiosity and familial relationships, since family is the main means by which religion is transmitted. Just about every religious person belongs to the same religion as their parents, and this is true to the point where the ones that don't are considered rare statistical outliers.

I find it interesting how many people don't seem to give this fact much consideration, because it is perhaps the single biggest lesson we could learn about how a society's values are cultivated. It demonstrates to us that belief is considerably more communal than I think many of us would like to admit, and from my perspective, it is also arguably the strongest argument against faith, at least from an epistemological standpoint.


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## Nadeko (May 25, 2019)

I think this is funny because I have a good relationship with my one Christian parent and a horrible/nonexistent one with my nonreligious parent. I guess that my parent's divorce came in handy to answer this question.


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## Duncan Hills Coffee (May 26, 2019)

I'm very close to my parents but they're both religious. Not evangelical religious but they're people who take Christianity seriously. Which is why I feel uncomfortable discussing it with them because I'm not religious myself and I haven't told them I'm agnostic. I'm jealous of them being able to have such religious faith; I want to take Christianity seriously but it doesn't make a lot of logical sense to me, and I know that it's not about logic but I can't shut that part of my brain off.

In short I have a good relationship with them but my own hangups on wrapping my head around religion prevents me from sharing their faith.


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## Guts Gets Some (May 26, 2019)

My family are all very conservative and I bought into it as a child only from the fear mongering. Once I wised up with age, I wasn't afraid to state I was not part of their mindset.... and while they were generally displeased a bit, nothing else really changed. Unconditional family love and all that. 

Good enough.


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## Rice Is Ready (May 26, 2019)

I went to a Catholic school after regular school everyday in elementary. I started to think it was bunk when they began teaching us about Noah's Ark.


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## Varis (May 26, 2019)

Non-religious / Non-religious / Good Relationship

Aside from the occasional, tongue-in-cheek "our lord and saviour" quote from my mother, we really didn't talk about religion at home. I mostly learned about Christianity at school, where the boring religious morning assemblies and getting dragged to church every spring and Christmas caused me to resent both organized religions and the school system. I was upset with my mother for never pulling me out of the religious classes, even though there was an option for non-Christians.

Our relationship was never poor, but it has greatly improved in my adult years. Still don't talk about religion.


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## 1864897514651 (May 26, 2019)

Lemmingwise said:


> [redacted]



It was not a "suicide cult". You are ignoring the fact that Peter denied Jesus three times, and this is the man that we have been given the keys to Heaven through the Holy See. Why would Peter, of all the apostles, suffer martyrdom if he did not witness the resurrected Christ? You are playing with these ideas in your head as if they are fiction. All of the apostles were real people, and you are taking them for profoundly stupid ignoramuses. Even further, Peter had to be given a prophecy by the Lord Himself in order to comprehend the gravity of his rejection. This is the cocks crowing three times. Do you think that if Peter were not given this prophecy, that he would believe in the risen Lord? There is also zero benefit for eleven men to commit to a suicide pact to enrich the cause of a dead man. What is the benefit? Notoriety? How could these men predict whether they would attain notoriety or not for dying for such a cause? And what value does this have to dead men? I would not submit to martyrdom for notoriety. You have to be stupid to do this. These men did not want notoriety for such a cause, and this much is obvious. If they wanted notoriety, then at least one of them would deny the divinity of Christ to save his own life. The value of notoriety for the dead is zero. People do not work for nothing.

If you want to reject the historicity of the Bible, then fine. Do what you want. Go have faith in empty things and die an empty man.


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## Otterly (May 26, 2019)

“Give me the child for the first seven years and I will give you the man.”

(Possibly) ignatious of Loyola, who founded the jesuits, although also possible that Voltaire was making a point. 

Either way, there’s a lot of truth in it. Children are impressionable, and I would put money on the general trend to be for children to believe roughly what parents do.
 There’s also a wider community/cultural impression that is given to children as well. So I’m not particularly religious but we still do Christmas, because I suppose we are culturally Christian even if we don’t believe. 

Ne? Not religious, brought up by half atheist/half catholic family. Nobody particularly forced any views on me but neither was I taken to church except for weddings, baptisms, christenings and funerals. 

The people I have encountered who have had  changes of views have done so in response to significant life events, including:

Converting upon marriage
Losing faith completely after serious loss
Losing faith after witnessing horror (holocaust survivor.) 
Illness (mental and physical.) 
All those  people had fairly dramatic changes of mind, and those who found religion tended to be fervent about it. Those who lost faith because very much atheists.

Personally I have no faith, but I don’t necessarily think I’m right nor I do I feel the need to attack anyone who does believe. Secular society - anyone can believe anything, but all obey the law and no one forces belief on others nor harms anyone for belief or lack of it, is my view.


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## Lemmingwise (May 26, 2019)

1864897514651 said:


> It was not a "suicide cult". You are ignoring the fact that Peter denied Jesus three times, and this is the man that we have been given the keys to Heaven through the Holy See. Why would Peter, of all the apostles, suffer martyrdom if he did not witness the resurrected Christ? You are playing with these ideas in your head as if they are fiction. All of the apostles were real people, and you are taking them for profoundly stupid ignoramuses. Even further, Peter had to be given a prophecy by the Lord Himself in order to comprehend the gravity of his rejection. This is the cocks crowing three times. Do you think that if Peter were not given this prophecy, that he would believe in the risen Lord? There is also zero benefit for eleven men to commit to a suicide pact to enrich the cause of a dead man. What is the benefit? Notoriety? How could these men predict whether they would attain notoriety or not for dying for such a cause? And what value does this have to dead men? I would not submit to martyrdom for notoriety. You have to be stupid to do this. These men did not want notoriety for such a cause, and this much is obvious. If they wanted notoriety, then at least one of them would deny the divinity of Christ to save his own life. The value of notoriety for the dead is zero. People do not work for nothing.
> 
> If you want to reject the historicity of the Bible, then fine. Do what you want. Go have faith in empty things and die an empty man.



I just gave an alternate answer to the question you posed. You may not like that there are alternate possible answers, but to dismiss them is begging the question.

You say there is zero benefit for these men to commit a suicide pact; why then do people ever engage in a suicide pact? For example Jonestown suicide.

My answer to your question is that people do things that aren't for their benefit all the time.

But the best part is that you say you would not submit to martyrdom and that one would be stupid to do so; you are calling jesus stupid for not resisting, then.

Your claim that people don't martyr their lives ever is a deeply ignorant view. I wasn't looking for you to rephrase scripture, I know it well enough.

I don't think you are genuinely curious or interested in talking about this subject. Why else give such a reaction when I answer your question? If you genuinely seek answers to your questions I'm willing to play, but if you are only interested in your answers and not anyone elses, why ask the questions publicly in the first place?



1864897514651 said:


> If you want to reject the historicity of the Bible, then fine.


Let's see who has a better understanding of the historicity of the bible. What language was the bible first written in and in what year, roughly?


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## 1864897514651 (May 27, 2019)

Lemmingwise said:


> [redacted]



I said, "I would not submit to martyrdom *FOR NOTORIETY*." Jesus also was not martyred, but sacrificed.


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## von Hapasbourg (May 27, 2019)

Both of my parents are boomer-tier religious. I'm not really that religious nor have the zeal to commit into up until I've read a tabloid from an ultraconservative Catholic advocacy group when I was in highschool. I'm still in a transition to fully commit to the faith again though.


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## Bum Driller (May 28, 2019)

I don't comment on my own background or familial relations, but what I've observed in people I know, almost all people who have strong faith in "strong" divine authority figure, whether it's the God of Christianity, Satan or Adolf Hitler, seem to have abysmal relations with their mortal fathers. They also seem to hate their own lives.


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## Ughubughughughughughghlug (May 28, 2019)

Parents were non-practicing Christians and familiar with other religions. I was raised with a children's Bible and went to a daily Bible camp one summer. I had a familiarity with the stories and concepts from the Bible but no great detail.

In college, I went through a religious phase. Started off with one group of interesting heretics that I already admired. I thought I felt the presence of God and converted, but in hindsight, it was a figment of my imagination. Later on I left them for social reasons, and fell in with a different bunch, who I didn't agree with but thought God wanted me with for other reasons. After I fell out with them, I tried a normal church in my parent's favored denomination, but it was boring and, by that point, my really weak faith had pretty much entirely worn off.

No real desire to go back to religion now, though I would rather be a fervent member of the first church.


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