# Love-shy-esque in need of help



## Have a Pepsi (May 25, 2014)

See that? I put "love-shy-esque" instead of the regular thing. Because in terms of depression and sorrows, I really think I'm like them; in terms of dealing with said feelings, their faces make me want to punch a hole in the wall. A brick wall. The missing things I sort of fulfill in my dreamland aren't entirely satisfying... So I basically just have to live with awful feelings, but there has to be SOME kind of answer. :/

As you've probably read from me before, I feel like the very worst part of my live is having never had a girlfriend. I really do not give a damn about sex - in fact, the thought of intercourse repulses me - all I want is someone I love to love me. So my problem is not "I'm only looking to lose my virginity".

My self image is... Complicated. I think I'm a nice, friendly person. I think I have talents and things I'm good at. I believe I have value, I guess would be the point I'm trying to make here. In terms of what I'm like on the outside, I don't think I'm _terribly_ ugly - my only elements of ugliness, in my opinion, are acne, which I just started medication for, and slightly odd fat distribution, but it's not much of a problem. But because my feelings for anyone have never been reciprocated, nor have I had so much as anyone take a liking to me, it's like I told one of my friends: if I truly believe the sky is green, would we say that the sky is green only to me? Or would we say that I'm colorblind? So my problem should not be "I don't have enough confidence".

Ladies I simply pal around with for an hour or so then ask out always say "no" (usually something worse, though). Females that I'm friends with for a while _before_ asking out always say "no", and about half the time, end the friendship because of it. And, long story short, I'm never all creepy about it. So my problem is not "I approach them stupidly".

Aside from meeting people at school or at my part-time job, I also attend a local annual convention and bi-weekly game night. So my problem is not "I don't get out enough".

Aside from the internet and video games, I produce my own music, write stories, photograph, draw/write up video game concepts, and take care of a very sweet monitor lizard. I've also taken the time to become fluent in Hawaiian, and am now studying the Japanese language. So my problem is not "I need to get a life" or "I need to take up a hobby or something to make myself feel better".

I really don't know what my problem is... Shouldn't I be worth _something_ in the world of romance? I may be only 19, but I really don't care; after 7 years, I'm not saying "I should have met my soulmate by now" (which is a popular little strawman), but if I could have any kind of relationship at all, even a crappy one, shouldn't someone have at least liked me by now? Even if I didn't like them back? I seriously hope I'm not being a dillweed for talking to you guys about this... But with all my IRL friends, they eventually get frustrated with me because after they give me one of those answers I quoted uptop, I tell them why that can't be my problem, and they eventually get frustrated, too, because they can't figure it out. And you talked with silentprincess about similar topics in a very friendly manner, but, if this is bastardly of me... Delete this, I guess. :/


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## KatsuKitty (May 25, 2014)

You're nineteen. I did jack squat until I was twenty-two and I loved her so much that I like to think that it was all worth the wait.

The advice you're looking for is the same advice we all should take when we look for dates. Identify what you are interested in and get involved in that circle of people. Sooner or later, there is an overwhelming possibility that it just happens, despite what your strongest feelings may suggest.


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## Silver (May 25, 2014)

You say you're not creepy when you ask women out, but, if you are not, it doesn't seem like they should be willing to end the friendship because of it. If anything, for me it was the opposite - twice - two male friends expressed interest and at the time I was not into either of them yet their telling me they liked me made me _more_ willing to hang around them. What do you do when you ask women out, and what do your interactions with women - friends and strangers - look like? Be honest in all details. You may be completely right that you don't come across as creepy, in which case there wouldn't seem to be a problem and my only advice would be what Katsu suggested. But I'd like to know more, first.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 25, 2014)

Altissimo said:


> You say you're not creepy when you ask women out, but, if you are not, it doesn't seem like they should be willing to end the friendship because of it. If anything, for me it was the opposite - twice - two male friends expressed interest and at the time I was not into either of them yet their telling me they liked me made me _more_ willing to hang around them. What do you do when you ask women out, and what do your interactions with women - friends and strangers - look like? Be honest in all details. You may be completely right that you don't come across as creepy, in which case there wouldn't seem to be a problem and my only advice would be what Katsu suggested. But I'd like to know more, first.


That's a bit of a tall order. I don't interact with everyone the exact same way... So a generalization would be impossible. I'm sorry, that sounds like a cop-out, but, it truly isn't meant to be. :/


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## Silver (May 25, 2014)

No, I understand completely, haha. If anything that's a positive indicator.


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## Glaive (May 25, 2014)

I think sometimes a lot of people confuse the desire for an intimate relationship with simply needing a close friend.  You mention you go to a sort of game-night and have some acquaintances and and the like, but do you have anyone you talk to on a frequent basis?  Someone that knows you really well and can talk to on a personal level?  

I think that is something even more important to have, and without a good buddy, feelings of nogf seem to dramatically increase.  I have someone I message online literally every day, keeps me grounded to a degree.  I'm not saying that a close friend is a substitute for a gf, but if you aren't meeting your basic needs of socialization at that level then worrying about a gf is pretty trivial.  Plus to top it off if you are valuing relationships THAT much, you might drive away those people that you actually need the most in your life.  Don't be obsessive and reevaluate what you really want.

Good luck.


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## Niachu (May 26, 2014)

Why do you want a girlfriend so much? I'm a girl who doesn't place much value on romance so it's hard for me to understand this complaint.


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## Duke Nukem (May 26, 2014)

Niachu said:


> Why do you want a girlfriend so much? I'm a girl who doesn't place much value on romance so it's hard for me to understand this complaint.



Perhaps he just wishes he was more sociable than he really is, but doesn't know how to do it. Seeing a girlfriend as an indicator of social status could be a symptom of this belief.


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## CatParty (May 26, 2014)

You are so young! You are still learning all this complicated adult socialization. Heck I'm 36 and still don't get half of it. Believe me, things will click. Don't be so hard on yourself. Remember you are the most important part of your life.


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## Marvin (May 26, 2014)

Glaive said:


> I think sometimes a lot of people confuse the desire for an intimate relationship with simply needing a close friend.  You mention you go to a sort of game-night and have some acquaintances and and the like, but do you have anyone you talk to on a frequent basis?  Someone that knows you really well and can talk to on a personal level?
> 
> I think that is something even more important to have, and without a good buddy, feelings of nogf seem to dramatically increase.  I have someone I message online literally every day, keeps me grounded to a degree.  *I'm not saying that a close friend is a substitute for a gf*, but if you aren't meeting your basic needs of socialization at that level then worrying about a gf is pretty trivial.  Plus to top it off if you are valuing relationships THAT much, you might drive away those people that you actually need the most in your life.  Don't be obsessive and reevaluate what you really want.
> 
> Good luck.


I _absolutely_ would say that. I mean, aside from that you're not fucking your good friends. (Or maybe you are? I don't know!)

I think I agree with Niachu. To me, there are friends, and then there are people I fuck. (And smaller categories, like family or business associates, but they don't impact my day-to-day life that much) An overlap in those groups would be nice, but I'm perfectly happy otherwise.


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## Pine Tar (May 26, 2014)

I know how you feel. You feel you're not worth it or you feel that no matter what you do, you can't do anything right. Because one year ago, I felt exactly as you did. Then, I took a road trip halfway across the North American continent and it was successful. And things just started getting better from there as a sort of confidence multiplier.

I'm not saying taking a giant road trip will cure everything, but taking some time to go out and see what the rest of the country has to offer really put things in perspective.


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## Christ-Chan (May 26, 2014)

I didn't have my first girlfriend until I was 19 either and somehow that part of my life worked out with due time (the rest of my life, not so much).
Having romantic partners shouldn't be a defining part of your personality though.

EDIT: And unlike Marvin, my romantic partners have been very much like friends - my best friends in fact. It's not something I'm proud of but I've also had my share of "quick flings", let's call it, and they never did very much for me to be honest, but your mileage may vary. Finding a girl is often harder than finding a boy, in my opinion, but girls tend do work out better so there's always that.


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## pickleniggo (May 26, 2014)

I don't know where people get the idea that relationships are a missing puzzle piece to life. They aren't. If fact, relationships are pretty difficult until you figure out what each of you actually want and at that point it might not even be each other. Anyway. My advice would be to simply keep socializing, and don't be so quick about trying to get a date. Think to yourself why you would want to go out with that particular girl. A lot of people around me jump into relationships that make no sense because they're lonely, even I've done it and that ended horribly when I realized that it wasn't what I wanted. If you have friends that know girls, ask about them (not in like a creepy stalker way, but just get a feel for what kind of person they're like).


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## Alec Benson Leary (May 26, 2014)

Altissimo said:


> You say you're not creepy when you ask women out, but, if you are not, it doesn't seem like they should be willing to end the friendship because of it. If anything, for me it was the opposite - twice - two male friends expressed interest and at the time I was not into either of them yet their telling me they liked me made me _more_ willing to hang around them.


It makes things work out a lot better if you present yourself as being perfectly okay with hearing "no".

I've asked out multiple girls who, as it turned out, weren't interested at all. I actually managed to develop friendships with them anyway. (And later on, one of them decided she _was_ interested.)


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## Varis (May 27, 2014)

Alec Benson Leary said:


> I've asked out multiple girls who, as it turned out, weren't interested at all. I actually managed to develop friendships with them anyway. (And later on, one of them decided she _was_ interested.)


^ This so much. 

I didn't get my first boyfriend until I was 19, and we essentially started off as friends. I had a crush on him for nine months before that, but I wanted to learn to know him first and be sure that he wasn't a douchebag who only saw me as a walking pair of tits.


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## hellbound (May 27, 2014)

Here's a couple issues I can see right off the bat.

You're 19 and talking about serious relationships. Okay, that's not unique by any means but a lot of people your age are thinking a lot more about hooking up. Not all, but it's a lot more common than going into things expecting a long-term relationship. 

You're talking about girls you "pal around with" for a while or are friends with for a while. While it's not uncommon at all for people to move from friendship to dating (my crazy ex and I started that way), try an environment where you are immediately setting up expectations of dating rather than friendship. Don't think in terms of being "friendzoned" or stupid bullshit like that, but instead of "palling around," you know, flirt and shit. It's not easy if you're kind of a shy person, I'll admit, but if you're not even subtly expressing that you want to take her out, it can seem predatory when you DO ask her out, like you were trying to hide it for some reason. Try a dating site maybe. I met my current GF on OKCupid. It can be easier to start the conversation with messages than in person.

I know you say you have hobbies, but the thing is your hobbies sound like solitary ones, and you're not really going to meet too many people (friends or girlfriends) taking care of a monitor lizard or writing or self-studying languages. If you're learning Japanese, maybe try and find a Meetup group or college club that gets together to practice Japanese. Or a writing group where people get together to share their stories and critique, or a gaming club, or *something* that gets you interacting with other people on a regular basis. My brother loves board gaming has met many of his friends and most of his girlfriends at board gaming groups. It lets you deal with people with whom you have a common interest. Super easy way to get friends while doing something you enjoy.

And most importantly, let go of your desire to get a girlfriend. I know this seems contrary, but you are quite plainly desperate from the way you're talking about this, and desperation is a HUGE turnoff to most people. As ABL says, it's much better to present yourself as OK with hearing "no" and this is practically impossible if you aren't truly OK with hearing "no." You must find fulfillment without a relationship, because requiring fulfillment in another is a sure path to suffering. This is not to say stop trying, because it won't fall in your lap, and it's not to say be prepared to live your whole life alone, because most people wouldn't be capable of that, but realize that you are you and must be able to find fulfillment in yourself or at *best* you'll be a clingy, needy pain-in-the-ass if you can find somebody willing to date you. 

A bonus part to being able to find fulfillment in yourself without another is you become able to deal with it when it doesn't work out, and able to let go if you really should. I mentioned about my crazy ex earlier, and I should have let that relationship go much earlier than I did, but we had become dependent on one another for fulfillment and so continued a toxic and painful cycle of abuse, neglect, breakup, and running back to one another too many times. Now, it absolutely still WILL be painful if you grow to love somebody and it ends, no matter what, but too many people force themselves to remain with somebody they shouldn't because they require fulfillment in somebody else and removing themselves from that is too much to bear, no matter how miserable being with that person makes them.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 27, 2014)

Oh, man... I'm getting so much conflicting information, not just taking into account this thread... "Never give up" and "Stop trying", "Make them your friends first" and "Try asking them flat-out"... But I guess I wasn't expecting any definitive answers either. 

It would take me all night to reply to each and every comment here - I mean, they were all really well-thought out and all that - so I guess I'll be writing in response to all of y'all in saying I'm going to try to change my behavior a bit. I'll try to be less enthusiastic about love. Or at least, I _want_ to be less enthusiastic about love, to the degree of which you guys are talking about. But how can I even do that? I really feel like my personality is hard-coded. 

(P.S. The herpetology community is actually a very nice one; I have met a good deal of people through it, among other hobbies I've listed)


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## Pine Tar (May 28, 2014)

If all else fails, just ask a woman out the caveman way. 

Or not if you'd like to avoid a ton of legal/moral trouble.


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## Lefty's Revenge (May 28, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Oh, man... I'm getting so much conflicting information, not just taking into account this thread... "Never give up" and "Stop trying", "Make them your friends first" and "Try asking them flat-out"... But I guess I wasn't expecting any definitive answers either.
> 
> It would take me all night to reply to each and every comment here - I mean, they were all really well-thought out and all that - so I guess I'll be writing in response to all of y'all in saying I'm going to try to change my behavior a bit. I'll try to be less enthusiastic about love. Or at least, I _want_ to be less enthusiastic about love, to the degree of which you guys are talking about. But how can I even do that? I really feel like my personality is hard-coded.
> 
> (P.S. The herpetology community is actually a very nice one; I have met a good deal of people through it, among other hobbies I've listed)



Never fear, Uncle Lefty is here. Lets talk. 

 - I'm gonna start off by saying this. You say that no one has ever had a crush on you and thats probably false. I don't want you to think Im saying you two are in the same league but the exigence is here: Fuckface Rodgers said the same thing. That no girl liked him and he was forced to be lonely and as a result he had to shoot up the motherfucker. Fact is, Rodgers was good-looking and rich so the reality is if he wanted a girlfriend he could have gotten one. Theres someone out there with low enough self esteem to be willing to put up with his narcissism. 

Now back to you. Im gonna assume you're actually a decent person and not a fuck face. The chances of no girl _ever_ having feelings for you are pretty low even in your short adult life. You may not have realized she did. You may not have even met the chick but there has to be at worst one girl but more likely a couple who have had some sort of feelings for you. 

So in that sense you do in fact don't have enough confidence, which is actually pretty common at 19. You barely know yourself. 

- I respect that you're putting yourself out here and I don't want you to be offended by what I'm going to say but the fact that you said you "pal around for a few hours" with a girl you're trying to ask out leads me to believe that your approach is lacking. Going up to girls cold and talking them into giving you their number or something is pretty challenging for someone in your position and I wouldn't recommend it until your confidence is much higher and you can handle rejection well.

 What Satan and a couple of others were saying is not to be less _enthusiastic_ but don't appear _desperate_.  Which could be why your approach is failing. Enthusiasm, when  utilized properly is actually a turn on for some women. But thats a topic for another day. 

 I don't want this shit to start to sound like a PUA forum but theres an art to asking a girl out on a date. Whether she be a friend or stranger. If I knew more about how you go about it, I could help but in general it doesnt sound like your approach is as strong as it could be. If you're a decent guy and your approach is strong you'll get a date eventually. So for the simple reason that you haven't gotten one yet I'm gonna say you're approach isnt as strong as you might think it is. 

My advice for you based off of everything I've read thus far, and feel free to respond and disagree as discussion is the goal here: 

 1. You've got to love, not just like, not just tolerate, not just not hate, but love yourself. Confidence stems from loving the person you are and being completely comfortable in your own skin. Its infectious and people in general are attracted to it. But its especially imperative for females when looking for a partner. Generally speaking, women want a partner who is going to make them feel safe. You can't do that if you're not secure in yourself. 
   I'm 23 and I just started applying self confidence and a healthy disregard of rejection to my love life a few years ago and its made a HUGE difference.  I had it in other parts of my life but I had to translate it to my love life. You might have to do that as you sound like you're involved in a lot of things that probably take some confidence to do like being fluent in another language. 
   How to get confidence is tricky as some of what I used ties back into my religious beliefs but I'll give you this one tip. I'm a huge wrestling fan, right? And a big part of wrestling is the entrance. Music hits guy comes out to a roaring audience while lights and pyro go off all that jazz. I've always been kind of obsessed with entrances so I have an entire play list on my ipod phone and computer of different music I would use as an entrance. I play it all the time but I play it alot right before its "game time" if you get my drift. Right before a big test, a difficult gig, a busy day at work, etc. It's more than just hype music for me when "The Man" by Aloe Blacc hits I believe every word of that shit, "Beast" By Nico Vega is suddenly about me, etc etc. And it makes a difference for me. I walk in a room feeling I can handle whatever the fuck is coming down the tube and it translates to the rest of my life. 

 Its a strange strategy but I encourage you to give it a shot. Make a playlist with some songs that should play when you enter a room and internalize that shit. Love who you are because you're the man. 

2. Work on your approach. But heres what I want you to do. Take babysteps. Next time you go to the supermarket get in the cute cashier girl's line and chat her up when you check out. Dont ask her out, don't stand there and sweat, don't ask her to sit on your dick, just chat. Try to make her laugh if you can. But just focus on having a conversation. 99% of guys problems with girls stems from the fact that we either view girls as less than or more than human beings. And by just chatting up some cute girls you're gonna start to view girls in a different light and its gonna help your approach. Continue to talk to cute girls who are complete strangers. Once again simply chat be charming be funny if possible and have a good time. Talk to hotter and hotter girls and just get comfortable in the notion that they're people just like you with fears and insecurities just like you. They worry about being alone just like you and all that. 

 Once you're confident in your ability to chat up a girl it really isnt that huge of a leap to ask her out and do so successfully. Say "Hi" or "How you doing?" or make up a reason to talk to her as long as its not retarded. Make her at least chuckle, a sense of humor is very attractive for both sexes. If you're not terribly funny share a funny story because everyone's got at least one of those. And ask the girl out for coffee or a bite to eat or something. Avoid the word "hang out" because that shit could mean anything from "fuck you while my roomates play video games in the other room." to "Sit awkwardly and say nothing while because you invited your gay friend to come along."

Yes, I've seen both of those things happen. 

Put it on the line, don't mumble it, don't follow it up with "or nah" or none of that shit. You have to find your own way of wording it but I usually say something to the effect of "Aye, listen lemme take you out one of these days and lets get something to eat/get some coffee/ see a movie/whatever."

I think coffee dates are a good way to start especially with a stranger because they're very non-committal, they're in a usually populated public area so shes less likely to feel sketched out, and who the fuck don't like starbucks? People who don't even drink coffee go to that shit. 

Whatever you ask her out to just internalize this *the worst she can do is say "no."* Thats fucking it! Just "no." Thats it. And when she says "no." Because someone will say it as you already know don't get pissy. Don't get upset. Laugh it off, smile, and tell her to have a good one anyways. And like ABL said she might even come back later on down the line. 

If you get your approach down pat the shit just becomes a numbers game really. Ask 10 girls out with a strong approach and I doubt you'll make it past 4 without a date. Even if you make it past all 10 without a date just remember "numbers game." Just keep asking and some girl probably a cute one will say "yeah."

Thats all I got for you, right now. Also don't call yourself "loveshy esque" That term is dumb and youre not one of those guys. You're just an average guy whos still learning about himself and the world around him. 

Any questions hit me up.


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## Flowers For Sonichu (May 28, 2014)

I'm a few years older than you so I can show you my wisdom.  I did not lose my virginity until a week before my 21st birthday and in college I manged to sleep with someone from every inhabited continent other than Australia.  Between the ages of 19-21 I lost 50 pounds.  It gets better.

My job involves public speaking, you can put me on stage at Madison Square Garden no problem.  Approaching a stranger at a party?  HELL NAW.  My strategy is to do something to attract them to you.

Here's a tried and true method: buy a box of Franzia, remove the bag from the box, and carry it around with you at all times.  Don't like box wine?  Tough, this isn't for you to get drunk with, this is for you to share.  You immediately become the most popular person at the party and women will approach you instead of the other way around.  Perfect opportunity to exchange numbers.  People will barter with you things of a dubious nature, etc.  Keg party?  Keep it hidden until the keg runs out.  At that time, you become the single most influential person at the party because you're the only source of booze.  I do this whenever I go to a party where I only know a couple people and wind up meeting awesome people all night.  Think I'm over-exaggerating?  I started doing this after the most attractive woman at a halloween party went home with a very mediocre looking dude dressed up as a functional box of Franzia.

Have a talent?  Show it off.  Make sure it's an attractive talent.  I can put matches out on my tongue, belch on command, and crush beer cans on my head. I do not consider those attractive talents.

Got a crazy story.  Tell it loud so people can hear you, take up a lot of space in the room.  It gets people engaged and draws them in.

As an alternative: I have a friend who was your stereotypical obese D&D nerd who decorated his apartment with toys much like Chris Chan's room.  He was very frustrated much like you and he said to me one day, "You know what?  My right hand can do for me what any woman can so what use are they to me?"  Next time I met him, he introduced to me his new boyfriend, another sterotypically obese D&D nerd.  There's always that route.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 30, 2014)

Just a couple things to clear up:
•I'm not looking for sex. I know what y'all are trying to say, but... Bleh. XP
•I've experienced much worse than being told "no". Trust me on that one.

Alright, thank you all. I'll be trying some of these things - but I can't really take everyone's advice. Some of it is conflicting, you know. lol
I'll probably report back on this at a later point.
Thanks again, everyone!


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## CatParty (May 30, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Just a couple things to clear up:
> •I'm not looking for sex. I know what y'all are trying to say, but... Bleh. XP
> •I've experienced much worse than being told "no". Trust me on that one.
> 
> ...




stay positive!


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## Lefty's Revenge (May 30, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Just a couple things to clear up:
> •I'm not looking for sex. I know what y'all are trying to say, but... Bleh. XP
> •I've experienced much worse than being told "no". Trust me on that one.
> 
> ...


Remember "Go fuck yourself you gigantic piece of dead dog shit." Is still "No." Its just "No." with style.


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## Chikinballs (May 30, 2014)

Some girl has had a crush on you, promise. Not saying she was something youd be into, but its so unlikely that nobody has ever been interested in you, i would call it impossible.

Women are funny creatures. Something youre doing or saying is creeping them out. Im not gonna try to guess what, i dont know shit about you and cant say. Women dont see things the same as us at all. One little tick the wrong way, boom. Youre a creeper. I will say this, dont tell them....hell, dont tell ANYONE that sex repulses you. It raises a million red flags. In fact, you might wanna get to the bottom of that before you try dating.


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## Marvin (May 30, 2014)

hurrhurrhurr said:


> My job involves public speaking, you can put me on stage at Madison Square Garden no problem.  Approaching a stranger at a party?  HELL NAW.  My strategy is to do something to attract them to you.
> 
> Here's a tried and true method: buy a box of Franzia, remove the bag from the box, and carry it around with you at all times.  Don't like box wine?  Tough, this isn't for you to get drunk with, this is for you to share.  You immediately become the most popular person at the party and women will approach you instead of the other way around.  Perfect opportunity to exchange numbers.  People will barter with you things of a dubious nature, etc.  Keg party?  Keep it hidden until the keg runs out.  At that time, you become the single most influential person at the party because you're the only source of booze.  I do this whenever I go to a party where I only know a couple people and wind up meeting awesome people all night.  Think I'm over-exaggerating?  I started doing this after the most attractive woman at a halloween party went home with a very mediocre looking dude dressed up as a functional box of Franzia.


That's fucking brilliant. Though I don't go to parties too often.



Chikinballs said:


> I will say this, dont tell them....hell, dont tell ANYONE that sex repulses you. It raises a million red flags. In fact, you might wanna get to the bottom of that before you try dating.


Yeah... I was thinking the same thing. I think you'd really be rolling the dice trying to find a girl who wants no sex life.

But still, you should be trying to make new friends. Just overall. Personally, I need to improve my social skills, so I'm reading How to Win Friends and Influence People*. Just on their own, I think self help books are kinda dumb, because they're not telling me anything I didn't already know. But a great idea in this book, is that you should keep notes on your social interactions, day by day. Like, that's an amazing idea to me. Being able to see tangible progress is really great.

*Apparently recent versions of this book have been changed to suit modern tastes. If you want to get this book, older versions might be preferrable.


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## Chikinballs (May 30, 2014)

Being repulsed by sex puts you in ed gein territory. Not even creepy or douchey or whatever. Serial killer.


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## hellbound (May 31, 2014)

Chikinballs said:


> I will say this, dont tell them....hell, dont tell ANYONE that sex repulses you. It raises a million red flags. In fact, you might wanna get to the bottom of that before you try dating.



Oh yeah, I wanted to address this in my previous post but I forgot.

This is going to be a big hurdle. Women generally like sex about as much as men do. It can be in a different way, and their turn-ons can be a lot different, and the stereotype is that it fades a lot faster than in men*, but still, most women do wanna bang. This actually makes me feel like a dating site would be even better for you in terms of finding a relationship, because there ARE some women who, like you, don't want sex, and in my experience they'll tend to list that in their profile.

And while being repulsed by sex is certainly abnormal, it can be totally benign. But it can also be a sign of deep-seated psychological issues. It's definitely the kind of thing you may want to talk to a therapist about, or at least do some deep introspection to consider why.

I would still say find ways to make your hobbies more social, but also make an OKCupid account (POF is full of buttertrolls with babies, OKC is better until you start getting into pay-site territory).

*Really this is probably due to the differing causes of arousal in men vs. women. Plenty of times a guy I hear talking about how his wife won't have sex with him anymore, later it comes out either she had someone else on the side or there was a serious relationship problem they weren't communicating about. Lots of different causes, beyond the scope of this discussion.


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## Chikinballs (May 31, 2014)

Even just saying a person has no desire for sex is more acceptable than saying it specifically repulses you. Its ok to let a girl know you have put sex on a backburner. Give almost any reason you want besides finding it gross. Women will run from that every time. Most women wont date a guy who is skiddish about sex, they want to fuck, and even if the couple is waiting to have sex, they wanna know its on the table at some point and it will be good.


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## Duke Nukem (May 31, 2014)

It's okay to want to have sex, it's a normal, healthy thing. Don't feel ashamed about it. Of course, it helps to actually have someone you're attracted to for other reasons as well.


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## A-Stump (May 31, 2014)

Live your life and grow. Relationships aren't all what they're cracked up to be and you probably shouldn't sweat it right now.


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## Flowers For Sonichu (May 31, 2014)

DON'T
CRY
AFTER
SEX

that is all


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Just a couple things to clear up:
> •I'm not looking for sex. I know what y'all are trying to say, but... Bleh. XP
> •I've experienced much worse than being told "no". Trust me on that one.
> 
> ...



I think this might have been stated before but being grossed out by sex, whilst understandable, isn't normal. The vast majority of women have a sex drive. Some are a-sexual and there'll be some who are also squick'd by "doing the nasty" but the overwhelming majority want a physical element to their romantic relationships. I'm very sexually confident and I enjoy making my bf blush like crazy and teasing the bejesus out of him. I can't even imagine how someone who was disgusted by sex would flirt. When I look at my bf my pupils dilate and I get a little flushed because I desire him. I genuinely have trouble getting the idea of loving a person but hating a part of their anatomy... "You're beautiful... Except for that bit... Oh god that's gross! MY EYES!!!!"

Also, what about the woman's pleasure... Wouldn't you want to give her a full body orgasm?


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## Have a Pepsi (May 31, 2014)

hurrhurrhurr said:


> DON'T
> CRY
> AFTER
> SEX
> ...


Why in the world do some people cry after sex, anyway? Not even I can understand that. :/


teheviltwin said:


> I think this might have been stated before but being grossed out by sex, whilst understandable, isn't normal. The vast majority of women have a sex drive. Some are a-sexual and there'll be some who are also squick'd by "doing the nasty" but the overwhelming majority want a physical element to their romantic relationships. I'm very sexually confident and I enjoy making my bf blush like crazy and teasing the bejesus out of him. I can't even imagine how someone who was disgusted by sex would flirt. When I look at my bf my pupils dilate and I get a little flushed because I desire him. I genuinely have trouble getting the idea of loving a person but hating a part of their anatomy... "You're beautiful... Except for that bit... Oh god that's gross! MY EYES!!!!"
> 
> Also, what about the woman's pleasure... Wouldn't you want to give her a full body orgasm?


I'm not disgusted by girls' naughty bits. 

I would explain what my deal is, but, I really doubt anyone wants to read about my sexual ideals. >.<


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Why in the world do some people cry after sex, anyway? Not even I can understand that. :/
> 
> I'm not disgusted by girls' naughty bits.
> 
> I would explain what my deal is, but, I really doubt anyone wants to read about my sexual ideals. >.<



Afraid, disgusted, apathetic, whatever... If you are not interested in physical intimacy it's going to cause issues getting a relationship. It's also going to effect how you interact with people... I mean, the 'almost kiss' is one of the most intense sensations of anticipation, brain chemicals and hormones. It might seem more romantic than sexual but it's all about the anticipation of sexytiems.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> Afraid, disgusted, apathetic, whatever... If you are not interested in physical intimacy it's going to cause issues getting a relationship. It's also going to effect how you interact with people... I mean, the 'almost kiss' is one of the most intense sensations of anticipation, brain chemicals and hormones. It might seem more romantic than sexual but it's all about the anticipation of sexytiems.


I can be interested in sex - but I don't want sex with a relatively new girlfriend (as far as I know), neither do I want to get in bed with a regular hot piece of ass. I'm repulsed by sex in the way that most people seem to value it... Like, I'm not interested in it just so I can grab some boob. The idea sounds so much better to me if the situation is more like making myself and someone very special to me feel awesome, in that way. 

That's all I mean by being repulsed by sex. Just the common idea. Dirty stuff is gross to me. I just chose to speak generally about it because I doubt anyone's going to understand what I mean.


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> I can be interested in sex - but I don't want sex with a relatively new girlfriend (as far as I know), neither do I want to get in bed with a regular hot piece of ass. I'm repulsed by sex in the way that most people seem to value it... Like, I'm not interested in it just so I can grab some boob. The idea sounds so much better to me if the situation is more like making myself and someone very special to me feel awesome, in that way.
> 
> That's all I mean by being repulsed by sex. Just the common idea. Dirty stuff is gross to me. I just chose to speak generally about it because I doubt anyone's going to understand what I mean.



I have no idea what you mean by the 'common idea' of sex. Do you think that the majority of people are into casual crazy circus sex orgies? It is absolutely the most intimate thing two people can do. It's literally the closest you can be to another person. The better the chemical bond between two people the longer and more intense the high after sex.

The thing with sex is that it is dirty, sweaty, sometimes clumsy, sometimes funny and sometimes horrendously boring. It's like people watch those weird hollywood sex scenes where everything is in slow motion and people barely move and think it's real life. It just doesn't work like that.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> I have no idea what you mean by the 'common idea' of sex. Do you think that the majority of people are into casual crazy circus sex orgies? It is absolutely the most intimate thing two people can do. It's literally the closest you can be to another person. The better the chemical bond between two people the longer and more intense the high after sex.
> 
> The thing with sex is that it is dirty, sweaty, sometimes clumsy, sometimes funny and sometimes horrendously boring. It's like people watch those weird hollywood sex scenes where everything is in slow motion and people barely move and think it's real life. It just doesn't work like that.


Maybe I wasn't entirely clear... The idea of sex just to get my rocks off disgusts me. Wanting sex out of kinkiness, perversion, whatever - that also digusts me.


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Maybe I wasn't entirely clear... The idea of sex just to get my rocks off disgusts me. Wanting sex out of kinkiness, perversion, whatever - that also digusts me.



I do not understand how you separate kinkiness etc from loving intimacy. Or do you mean that sex is just for procreation... o.O


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## Have a Pepsi (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> I do not understand how you separate kinkiness etc from loving intimacy. Or do you mean that sex is just for procreation... o.O


Basically, I just feel like most people look forward to sex, just want it because it feels good on your body. Not for the emotional ties and symbolism it entails. I doubt that really helps you to understand, though... 

I'll just go stand in the corner now.


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## Lady Houligan (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> I do not understand how you separate kinkiness etc from loving intimacy. Or do you mean that sex is just for procreation... o.O



I think what Pepsi means (if I may jump in unannounced) is that the act of the hook-up isn't his cup of tea, but rather he wants a relationship that builds up into the sexual part of it so it's meaningful to both partners?

Personally I waited with the asshole ex since we started dating in high school, and as soon as we did the act he turned on the crazy, and then dumped me four months later to try and start dating a girl who was younger than us (I was 18 at the time, he was 19, so for those of you playing at home this puts her into the jailbait category) and he'd been apparently lusting after for a year and a half. (For the record, when we finally formed the beast with two backs we were a month and a half from our three year anniversary.) So Pepsi, just be aware that even if you wait it out and think you have the right person, they can still drag the whole thing south.


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Basically, I just feel like most people look forward to sex, just want it because it feels good on your body. Not for the emotional ties and symbolism it entails. I doubt that really helps you to understand, though...
> 
> I'll just go stand in the corner now.



No, no... I understand. You were just skirting around it a bit before.

I think that it is a little presumptuous to assume that you can tell most people's motivations based on a complete lack of personal experience and popular culture. The fact is that sex does feel amazing when done right but that isn't always the case. People also have the crazy hormonal drive to procreate which, particularly when you're young, can make you focus slightly more on the physical aspect of relationships. But the fact that it feels amazing and gives me a brain chemical high does not devalue the intimacy or deep affection involved. I only want to share that with my bf and being in love makes it feel more amazing. 

To fully enjoy something that requires you to be that vulnerable around another person you have to feel relaxed. You can't relax if you're constantly afraid of being too dirty/slutty etc. Women already have tons of shame associated with their sexuality so it's seriously going to put women on edge. Does it affect how you interact with women? The jokes you find funny or will make?



Lady Houligan said:


> I think what Pepsi means (if I may jump in unannounced) is that the act of the hook-up isn't his cup of tea, but rather he wants a relationship that builds up into the sexual part of it so it's meaningful to both partners?



I can see that now, but using phrases like "in fact, the thought of intercourse repulses me" isn't exactly normal for someone after that. Have you read back the different ways he's described it?


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## Lady Houligan (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> I can see that now, but using phrases like "in fact, the thought of intercourse repulses me" isn't exactly normal for someone after that. Have you read back the different ways he's described it?



Maybe not, but I can sort of understand where he's coming from? I was legitimately terrified of the idea of sex (even after having experienced it because my ex was absolute SHIT in the sack). I'm not sure if, for me, it was the sort of finality that a lot of teenagers are taught about sexual relationships (i.e., the whole "YOU CAN ONLY DO THIS WHEN YOU'RE MARRIED SO IF YOU HAVE SEX WITH SOMEONE YOU HAD BETTER MARRY THEM" sex-ed discussion that my school district was fond of) or if I was afraid of it being so literally intrusive.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> To fully enjoy something that requires you to be that vulnerable around another person you have to feel relaxed. You can't relax if you're constantly afraid of being too dirty/slutty etc. Women already have tons of shame associated with their sexuality so it's seriously going to put women on edge. Does it affect how you interact with women? The jokes you find funny or will make?


Can you be a little more specific? I want to make sure what I'm saying "yes" or "no" to.


teheviltwin said:


> I can see that now, but using phrases like "in fact, the thought of intercourse repulses me" isn't exactly normal for someone after that. Have you read back the different ways he's described it?


That's only because I've never had to actually explain it to anyone. I don't know about you, but I don't talk with my friends about my sex life, so, that's a concept I've kept in my head my whole life. I've never had to put it into words before, so, I ended up misspeaking until I could figure out what I really meant. :/


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Lady Houligan said:


> Maybe not, but I can sort of understand where he's coming from? I was legitimately terrified of the idea of sex (even after having experienced it because my ex was absolute SHIT in the sack). I'm not sure if, for me, it was the sort of finality that a lot of teenagers are taught about sexual relationships (i.e., the whole "YOU CAN ONLY DO THIS WHEN YOU'RE MARRIED SO IF YOU HAVE SEX WITH SOMEONE YOU HAD BETTER MARRY THEM" sex-ed discussion that my school district was fond of) or if I was afraid of it being so literally intrusive.



I know that in the US it's a lot more of a big deal than it is here. You have crazy people and their purity rings and abstinence only edumacation. My first time was similar although we didn't wait quite as long (1 year) but I was 17 and the legal age in the UK is 16. I was anxious for a million different reasons like "what if it hurts too much", "what if there's something weird with my body I don't even know about", "what if he breaks up with me straight after" or "what if I do something wrong and he hates me". And it was awful and he was a dick about it afterwards. I get the whole anxiety thing. I've mentioned it before that my partner has chronic social anxiety to the point where he dry heaves when extremely nervous. He also had one particular that told him that getting head from a woman was always misogynistic and a number of other ridiculous things.



Have a Pepsi said:


> Can you be a little more specific? I want to make sure what I'm saying "yes" or "no" to.



How receptive are you to "that's what she said" or "as the actress said to the bishop"? Does coarse language put you on edge around women? 



Have a Pepsi said:


> That's only because I've never had to actually explain it to anyone. I don't know about you, but I don't talk with my friends about my sex life, so, that's a concept I've kept in my head my whole life. I've never had to put it into words before, so, I ended up misspeaking until I could figure out what I really meant. :/



Sorry if I come across as overly blunt it's because I'm from Northern England and I've had a couple of drinks. It's not an issue I was just explaining why I kept clarifying.


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## Have a Pepsi (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> How receptive are you to "that's what she said" or "as the actress said to the bishop"? Does coarse language put you on edge around women? QUOTE]
> Hehe, I've never heard that second one before! But to the first one, I'm usually cool with it, as long as it's actually clever/funny. However, I've never been told dirty jokes while being around women, so, I don't really know.


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## teheviltwin (May 31, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Hehe, I've never heard that second one before! But to the first one, I'm usually cool with it, as long as it's actually clever/funny. However, I've never been told dirty jokes while being around women, so, I don't really know.



It's the far superior and older British version.


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## Chikinballs (May 31, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> I know that in the US it's a lot more of a big deal than it is here. You have crazy people and their purity rings and abstinence only edumacation. My first time was similar although we didn't wait quite as long (1 year) but I was 17 and the legal age in the UK is 16. I was anxious for a million different reasons like "what if it hurts too much", "what if there's something weird with my body I don't even know about", "what if he breaks up with me straight after" or "what if I do something wrong and he hates me". And it was awful and he was a dick about it afterwards. I get the whole anxiety thing. I've mentioned it before that my partner has chronic social anxiety to the point where he dry heaves when extremely nervous. He also had one particular that told him that getting head from a woman was always misogynistic and a number of other ridiculous things.


No, man. Thats what you see on tv. Americans are hedonists anymore, really.


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## teheviltwin (Jun 1, 2014)

Chikinballs said:


> No, man. Thats what you see on tv. Americans are hedonists anymore, really.



I imagine it depends on the state.


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## Chikinballs (Jun 1, 2014)

teheviltwin said:


> I imagine it depends on the state.


Yeah, but i promise...those virginity rings and bible thumpers are in the deep minority, especially behind closed doors.


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## teheviltwin (Jun 1, 2014)

Chikinballs said:


> Yeah, but i promise...those virginity rings and bible thumpers are in the deep minority, especially behind closed doors.



Well yes, the more repressed the peeps are the more crazy they are when no-one is looking. See Victorian pornography... Although, what always gets me is how long they had to hold those poses for the camera... o.O But they're still bloody good at terrifying the shit out of their kids.


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## Silver (Jun 1, 2014)

Abstinence only education fails and results in much higher rates of teen pregnancy and STDs and shit like that _because_ it doesn't teach proper sex acts: only "don't do it". There are some kids who are serious about it but I think those are also the ones that grow up in extremely sheltered, religious households so it's not like abstinence only education helps _them_ anyway.
My roommate this year actually did have a purity ring (growing up in a crazy religious household... and we live in the South) but kind of gave up once she got a serious boyfriend a few months into the fall semester.


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## Marvin (Jun 1, 2014)

hellbound said:


> *Really this is probably due to the differing causes of arousal in men vs. women. Plenty of times a guy I hear talking about how his wife won't have sex with him anymore, later it comes out either she had someone else on the side or there was a serious relationship problem they weren't communicating about. Lots of different causes, beyond the scope of this discussion.






Really great talk. Explains exactly how I feel that my brain operates, when sex comes up, as a man. I bought the book too. Great stuff.

But yeah, nah, the US is a large, diverse country. There are tons of crazies, just number-wise, but compared to the population at large? Not really a big thing. Really, I'd just suggest people live in nice states. And hell, even when you are in a shittier state, at least they still have cities. Like Georgia, for example, might be shitty, (I'm just picking a southern state, maybe Georgia isn't that bad, I don't know either way.) but Atlanta is still supposed to be a pretty cool city.

Heh, you can find serious nutjobs in the US, but you gotta track them down. Gotta drive out to the sticks, fly a rainbow flag, and they'll come out of the woodwork.


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## Alec Benson Leary (Jun 1, 2014)

Have a Pepsi said:


> Why in the world do some people cry after sex, anyway? Not even I can understand that. :/


Well, in the case of all my partners at least, it's probably because they know they'll never experience a greater joy again in their lives.


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## Doctor Duke (Jun 3, 2014)

Oh, man but this hit home for me as well.

Man, when I was your age, all I wanted was companionship the way you're describing it. I didn't care much for the idea of sex for my own reasons at the time, and I was perpetually frustrated because while I was generally regarded as a funny, kind person, I was, to be blunt, a fat greaseball who had no idea how to take care of himself. TL;DR I know where you're coming from.


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