# Unpopular opinions about electronics



## SU 390 (Jun 16, 2015)

This will probably be one and only quality thread on this forum since being here for a year now. If this has been done before, let me know. Anyway, electronics. We all own one or more. What's your unpopular opinion about certain electronics? For me is this

- I think Dell is a mediocre manufacturer.

- Beats is overrated.

- Laptop tablets and Chromebooks shouldn't be the only buying option anymore, I think we should have regular laptops remain on the market and netbooks should make a return.

- The PS3 should be at $129.99 now that PS4 is on the market.


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## Yawning Asperchu (Jun 16, 2015)

*Old man voice*:  They don't make video game consoles like they used to!

No, seriously.  I've had three PS2s crap out on me, as well as a Game Cube and a PSP.  Meanwhile, my Super Nintendo still runs perfectly fine after years of constant use.


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## Picklechu (Jun 17, 2015)

Yawning Asperchu said:


> *Old man voice*:  They don't make video game consoles like they used to!
> 
> No, seriously.  I've had three PS2s crap out on me, as well as a Game Cube and a PSP.  Meanwhile, my Super Nintendo still runs perfectly fine after years of constant use.


The only two systems I've had give out on me are my N64 (in all fairness, only the adapter broke, and they no longer made them at the time) and my first PS2 (which my sister destroyed by hitting repeatedly when she couldn't do a mission in GTA).


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## Yawning Asperchu (Jun 17, 2015)

@Picklechu
Yeah I've been there before.  I'm more of a controller thrower though, or used to be.  Replacing controllers adds up pretty quickly.


Edit:
@WanderingVagabond 
I would do that whenever I'd get so many bad breaks in a game that I'd say or think "This game is CHEATING!".  I don't get so butthurt about games anymore though.


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## SU 390 (Jun 17, 2015)

Yawning Asperchu said:


> *Old man voice*:  They don't make video game consoles like they used to!
> 
> No, seriously.  I've had three PS2s crap out on me, as well as a Game Cube and a PSP.  Meanwhile, my Super Nintendo still runs perfectly fine after years of constant use.



Fortunately, my Gamecube never crapped out on me when I had it(sold it a couple of years ago because I needed money in my account). It did have some slow start ups at times but that was it. My N64 worked perfectly when I had it. I left it back at my old home because it didn't fit with anything else in the boxes(I deeply regret leaving it there, I doubt it's there anymore because new people have been moved there by now, this was 10 years ago by the way). My Xbox 360 still works thankfully.

My GBA's battery dies quickly and I need to recharge it every hour. 



Yawning Asperchu said:


> @Picklechu
> Yeah I've been there before.  I'm more of a controller thrower though, or used to be.  Replacing controllers adds up pretty quickly.



It's understandable to be mad at a game every once in a while. Why throw it? Controllers are getting expensive nowadays. There have been times when I wanted to throw my 360 controller because of NG II and Mass Effect 3. Thankfully I had the composure not to do it.


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## nad7155 (Jun 17, 2015)

I feel that high $ capacitors and megabux wire/cable is pure snake oil.


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## John Titor (Jun 17, 2015)

Macs stopped being special about a decade ago.


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## Bronchitis that Lingers (Jun 17, 2015)

Yawning Asperchu said:


> @Picklechu
> Yeah I've been there before.  I'm more of a controller thrower though, or used to be.  Replacing controllers adds up pretty quickly.


I see nerf controllers in your future, my friend.

In all seriousness: mobile gaming. God fucking damn, mobile gaming.
Buddy texts me yesterday:
"Hey Bronchitis that Lingers, have you downloaded the Fallout app?"
"NO WHAT THE HELL DID THEY PORT THE ORIGINALS OVER TO IOS OH I AM SO HAPPY"
-checks app
-it's a fucking freemium tower defense game
-starts crying and crashing into slumber
-is now posting from beyond the grave

Remember the good ole days, when we paid one time for a game? Now it's the in app purchases and the DLC and the pokemon and the puddin' pops...


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## TrippinKahlua (Jun 18, 2015)

I hate modern cell phones such as iPhones and Galaxy's.

I just hate how technology has combined everything into "one" device. Then there's all the shit, hidden rules, hidden fees always associated with cell phone service (what the FUCK does "roaming" even mean? Its been 10 years since I first heard that term) that cell phones just are not worth my time and money.


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## Mourning Dove (Jun 19, 2015)

My cell phone does not have a data plan, so it cannot access the internet. That means I don't spend all the time ever looking at my phone, texting and ignoring people around me in social situations. This is probably for the better.


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## ZehnBoat (Jun 19, 2015)

Yawning Asperchu said:


> *Old man voice*:  They don't make video game consoles like they used to!
> 
> No, seriously.  I've had three PS2s crap out on me, as well as a Game Cube and a PSP.  Meanwhile, my Super Nintendo still runs perfectly fine after years of constant use.


i've had the opposite, with exception to the SNES
PSX would die all the time, PS2 died once
XBOX360 hasn't died yet.
snes is dying though... noooo

EDIT: oh yeah opinion.
hmm...
making music with a computer is just as good as spending a shit ton of money on the actual hardware you want your VSTi's to sound like.
for the most part, the hardware isn't special, and not worth your time looking for.


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## SU 390 (Jun 19, 2015)

TrippinKahlua said:


> I hate modern cell phones such as iPhones and Galaxy's.
> 
> I just hate how technology has combined everything into "one" device. Then there's all the shit, hidden rules, hidden fees always associated with cell phone service (what the FUCK does "roaming" even mean? Its been 10 years since I first heard that term) that cell phones just are not worth my time and money.



I especially hate the iPhone/Android phone wallets. That just screams, 'please rob me of all of my bank, social, insurance and bus cards along with my phone please!".


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## AnOminous (Jun 19, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I especially hate the iPhone/Android phone wallets. That just screams, 'please rob me of all of my bank, social, insurance and bus cards along with my phone please!".



I'm always amused to see people flashing around smartphones in public places where they might as well be wearing a "Mug Me Please" sign.


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## SU 390 (Jun 19, 2015)

AnOminous said:


> I'm always amused to see people flashing around smartphones in public places where they might as well be wearing a "Mug Me Please" sign.



I just can't help but cringe at that. I'm saying this as an owner of a smartphone.


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## John Titor (Jun 19, 2015)

Yawning Asperchu said:


> *Old man voice*:  They don't make video game consoles like they used to!
> 
> No, seriously.  I've had three PS2s crap out on me, as well as a Game Cube and a PSP.  Meanwhile, my Super Nintendo still runs perfectly fine after years of constant use.


I must have extraordinary good luck or my PS2 is invincible.


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## sparklemilhouse (Jun 20, 2015)

I just don't understand android OS phones.


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## Bronchitis that Lingers (Jun 20, 2015)

sparklemilhouse said:


> I just don't understand android OS phones.


I had a droid since they came out up until about a year ago when I switched to iPhone. I'm convinced the only people that still use android are those who have never used iOS. There is nothing good about android.


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## Jewelsmakerguy (Jun 20, 2015)

Faceist Analchest said:


> Capacitors can make a difference; it's certainly possible to introduce undesirable effects by using the wrong kinds of capacitors (some kinds of ceramic capacitors can contribute significant distortion, for example). Good choices (film capacitors, high grade electrolytics) can be little more expensive, but not dramatically so. The really big power supply filter capacitors are often overkill too. The same is true of op amps; there are some terrible choices for audio (LM324), but there are also excellent ones that aren't very expensive. The really high end pricey stuff is generally unnecessary, and many of the things that audiophiles claim to be superior are actually significantly worse (discrete op amps, topologies with low or no negative feedback).


ceramic disk capacitors (the saucer-looking ones) look like they could hold little to no charge. Plus they just look like gum that's been stepped on, especially the larger ones. That said...



> Through-hole electronics are superior to surface mount! Integrated circuits belong in DIP packages, SOIC and SSOP are GARBAGE!! Bring back 60/40 Sn/Pb solder!!! RoHS SUCKS!!!!!!!!


I personally think it should be more of a mix. Like how some computers and other devices do it. Both do have their uses alone (surface mounted for the higher powered stuff, Integrated for the stuff that needs lesser amounts). 'Sides, there's also the whole capacitor plague thing going on too.

And for another unpopular opinion, I hate satellite TV. Granted, it mostly has to do with the signal and how it constantly cuts in and out whenever it feels like it. But growing up, I also noticed how big the damn things are and frankly. If they were still being used as often as they were, I would have just opted for cable.


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## sparklemilhouse (Jun 20, 2015)

One of my pet peeves is when people take pictures of special events with their cell phone cameras. You know its going to look crappy!


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## SU 390 (Jun 20, 2015)

sparklemilhouse said:


> One of my pet peeves is when people take pictures of special events with their cell phone cameras. You know its going to look crappy!



I don't know if it's universal but when you take photos nowadays they're always in an opposite angle. For example, I keep my phone straight and whenever I take a picture the picture is always upside down or sideways.


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## John Titor (Jun 21, 2015)

sparklemilhouse said:


> One of my pet peeves is when people take pictures of special events with their cell phone cameras. You know its going to look crappy!


Still a step above tablet photography.


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## Ravenor (Jun 21, 2015)

Mourning Dove said:


> My cell phone does not have a data plan, so it cannot access the internet. That means I don't spend all the time ever looking at my phone, texting and ignoring people around me in social situations. This is probably for the better.



That's only my real gripe about mobile phones, when your trying to be social an some one spends half there time on the phone. It's one thing to check a text or email send a quick yes or no etc but it's another when 5 or six of you are in the pub or restaurant chilling out and you get some of them spending half the time looking at those little tiny screens.


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## SU 390 (Jun 22, 2015)

Ravenor said:


> That's only my real gripe about mobile phones, when your trying to be social an some one spends half there time on the phone. It's one thing to check a text or email send a quick yes or no etc but it's another when 5 or six of you are in the pub or restaurant chilling out and you get some of them spending half the time looking at those little tiny screens.



The LED lights on smartphones causes addiction. 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...s-smartphones-disrupt-good-sleep-study-finds/


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## DirkBloodStormKing (Jun 27, 2015)

I actually want to see more consoles with the PC besides Steam, as I found that even though I love hard-console games, I enjoy PC gaming even more. 

Apple/Mac OSX is better than Dell/Windows in my experience.
Android is absolutely garbage compared to the iPhone, once again, in my experience.


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## AnOminous (Jun 27, 2015)

OS X is a beautifully designed operating system in its fundamentals, although recent iterations have been somewhat prone to featuritis and bloat, especially in the user interface area.  That is, it's really pretty, but at the cost of performance. 

On the good side, you can turn off a lot of that shit and recover performance.


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## DirkBloodStormKing (Jun 27, 2015)

AnOminous said:


> OS X is a beautifully designed operating system in its fundamentals, although recent iterations have been somewhat prone to featuritis and bloat, especially in the user interface area.  That is, it's really pretty, but at the cost of performance.
> 
> On the good side, you can turn off a lot of that shit and recover performance.


Plus you are far less likely to get a virus with OS X compared to Windows. I've been using OS X for a year and I yet to catch a virus on it. Windows, sometimes it would take as fast as six months for me to get a virus and the performance was often terrible.


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## AveraDiane (Jun 27, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I especially hate the iPhone/Android phone wallets. That just screams, 'please rob me of all of my bank, social, insurance and bus cards along with my phone please!".



I agree. I can understand that it can be pretty convenient, but I am SO uncomfortable with the idea of whipping your phone to pay for something.



John Titor said:


> Still a step above tablet photography.



I can vouch for this.

I'm for placing phones aside for social situations, but as someone who pulls her phone out when nobody doesn't show off attention to me, I HATE when I have someone wave in my face or yank my phone away when I concentrate on reading an article that interests me. I understand if I am being rude (but it's not on purpose), but I rather have someone tap my shoulder. Then again, this is more of a general pet peeve.


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## SU 390 (Jun 27, 2015)

DirkBloodStormKing said:


> Plus you are far less likely to get a virus with OS X compared to Windows. I've been using OS X for a year and I yet to catch a virus on it. Windows, sometimes it would take as fast as six months for me to get a virus and the performance was often terrible.



What's the whole deal with iOS can't get viruses? It can get viruses. Sure it rarely happens, but the whole superiority shtick with Apple over Windows is ridiculous. At least with Windows you're not paying an arm and leg to get the same shit some other OS and manufacturer has but at twice the price.


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## AnOminous (Jun 27, 2015)

DirkBloodStormKing said:


> Plus you are far less likely to get a virus with OS X compared to Windows.



OS X is good but it isn't immune to viruses.  Anything but.  In fact, it can be infected with viruses from other Unix-based OSes if they have a shared vulnerability, which isn't all that unlikely.

It's just that less virus writers target it because Windows is so ubiquitous.

OS X is probably marginally more secure than Windows because of how purely awful Windows is, but security is really not a strong point of any Unix-based OS.


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## SU 390 (Jun 28, 2015)

AnOminous said:


> OS X is good but it isn't immune to viruses.  Anything but.  In fact, it can be infected with viruses from other Unix-based OSes if they have a shared vulnerability, which isn't all that unlikely.
> 
> It's just that less virus writers target it because Windows is so ubiquitous.
> 
> OS X is probably marginally more secure than Windows because of how purely awful Windows is, but security is really not a strong point of any Unix-based OS.



Plus Windows is more popular and on the market the most. So it's natural that more viruses are written for Windows as opposed to OS X/iOS.


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## trip2themoon (Jun 30, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I don't know if it's universal but when you take photos nowadays they're always in an opposite angle. For example, I keep my phone straight and whenever I take a picture the picture is always upside down or sideways.



Even worse are the people at concerts who instead of enjoying the gig they stand there recording the whole thing on their video camera phone. Then they have the cheek to growl at you if you walk past them blocking the camera for like 2 seconds.


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## AnOminous (Jun 30, 2015)

trip2themoon said:


> Even worse are the people at concerts who instead of enjoying the gig they stand there recording the whole thing on their video camera phone. Then they have the cheek to growl at you if you walk past them blocking the camera for like 2 seconds.



Also that's blatant copyright infringement unless they have permission.  Some bands have the Dead type attitude of not minding, but if someone pulled that shit on me I'd be tempted to rat them out to security.  There are some venues that prohibit even taking pictures, though I've never personally seen that.


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## trip2themoon (Jun 30, 2015)

AnOminous said:


> Also that's blatant copyright infringement unless they have permission.  Some bands have the Dead type attitude of not minding, but if someone pulled that shit on me I'd be tempted to rat them out to security.  There are some venues that prohibit even taking pictures, though I've never personally seen that.



Yeah, I remember back in the day hearing of people getting their cameras taken off them on the way in and they had to chase up security on the way out to get it back. Nowadays though it would be a nightmare for the security team if they had to take every camera phone from everyone. Seems like a waste of a concert to just stand there with your phone in the air instead of enjoying the concert experience.


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## SpessCaptain (Jun 30, 2015)

I just don't give a shit about 3D illusions, they're gimmicky in anything they touch.


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## chimpburgers (Jun 30, 2015)

I liked the iPhone 5c a lot better than the iPhone 6, which turned out to be quite a disappointment for me.


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## SU 390 (Jun 30, 2015)

Valiant said:


> I just don't give a shit about 3D illusions, they're gimmicky in anything they touch.



I sometimes question the ability and authenticity of 3D printing. It makes me wonder does it actually work or are the modifications. For example, say you're too broke for a new laptop or tablet, can the 3D printing actually make you that laptop or tablet you wanted? Maybe because I haven't read much about 3D printing, I'm just curious if it's magic or a parlor trick.


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## AnOminous (Jun 30, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I sometimes question the ability and authenticity of 3D printing. It makes me wonder does it actually work or are the modifications. For example, say you're too broke for a new laptop or tablet, can the 3D printing actually make you that laptop or tablet you wanted? Maybe because I haven't read much about 3D printing, I'm just curious if it's magic or a parlor trick.



You can "print" any 3D object within the parameters of the device, though the mechanics of it limits the shape and what it can be made of pretty drastically.  Still, someone has made a do-it-yourself gun and other things like the bottom receiver (main regulated part) of an AR-10.

I don't know enough about the tech to say whether either of those are recommended or good implementations, but they show it's entirely possible to print functional mechanical parts.

We're a long way off from home printing printed circuit boards and microprocessors, of course.


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## ASoulMan (Jul 2, 2015)

Large smartphones aren't smartphones.

They're just glorified mini-tablets.


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## The Knife's Husbando (Jul 2, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I sometimes question the ability and authenticity of 3D printing. It makes me wonder does it actually work or are the modifications. For example, say you're too broke for a new laptop or tablet, can the 3D printing actually make you that laptop or tablet you wanted? Maybe because I haven't read much about 3D printing, I'm just curious if it's magic or a parlor trick.





AnOminous said:


> You can "print" any 3D object within the parameters of the device, though the mechanics of it limits the shape and what it can be made of pretty drastically.  Still, someone has made a do-it-yourself gun and other things like the bottom receiver (main regulated part) of an AR-10.
> 
> I don't know enough about the tech to say whether either of those are recommended or good implementations, but they show it's entirely possible to print functional mechanical parts.
> 
> We're a long way off from home printing printed circuit boards and microprocessors, of course.



3-D printers are amazing things. They're great for prototyping & small-batch fabrication in plastics. Also, in a feat akin to dividing by zero, you can 3-d print parts easily for another 3d printer. Much less work than using a milling machine/lathe/whatever to fabricate another mill or lathe for your workshop.

Here's the working bits:






The only downsides I've heard about them is unless you use a high quality thermoplastic, the printed parts tend to act almost like hardwood & will split/fail along the linear "grain" of the printed piece, and you have to be pretty computer-savvy to even get started in the first place.


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## AlephOne2Many (Jul 4, 2015)

ASoulMan said:


> Large smartphones aren't smartphones.
> 
> They're just glorified mini-tablets.



I can sperg all day about how Phablets are only there to appeal to boring wannabe fourteen year old techsters. Our market is getting worse because children at the age of 3 were blessed with an iPhone or Galaxy Tablet, therefor want OCTOCORE or FIFTY INTERNAL GIGS at a "reasonable price". Oh lord how math failed my generation.

"Phablet"... Oh, make me walk through the temple of Set, I fucking HATE that word play. It sucks that Samsung are not making anything good other than Mid-Ranged and Entry-Level phones these days, I remember when both Sammy and Motorola still produced QWERTY Droids. I hate OPPO for releasing average ten inch "Phones" with razor thin profiles, come on take a note from Motorola who produced quality 'thin phones' back when they lasted more than two years. Samsung and LG still make great basic phones, though you have to go out of your way to even get an old Nokia brick.

Point being; I like 3.5'' devices and about 4'' display devices. That's it. One handed use is only really safe with anything below 5''. Add to that, I wish the Modular Revolution started years ago with Smartphones considering some of their motherboards are barely half the size of the screen. I look forward to ARA given it might actually reintroduce western Flip Phone influence, only we won't have to order a non-functioning ten grand device from Japan.

Apple can go eat a dick, so can that sellout Dre. I'm actually glad the Beat's Speakers are fire hazards, a successful person such as Dr. Dre should realize how Apple designs everything against their previous year rather than build up from it.


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## Vitriol (Jul 4, 2015)

I feel we do not properly venerate the machine spirits of our modern devices and most of the 'inventions' of the modern age are lacking in mysterious blinking lights, levers, elabourite dials and brass casing which are all essential to proper functioning of any device. 

There is also not nearly enough superfulous cabling and clockwork. 

Case in point is my phone- it doesn't have any pistons or cogs or exposed wires. It is a most sad state of affairs.


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## introman (Jul 4, 2015)

It irks me that you can't buy a new 1.8 inch hard drive MP3/MP4 player anymore and that dumbphones are relegated to super niche/expensive markets(construction). Why hasn't anybody made a modern dumb phone to sell to geriatrics/luddites? The only new engineering needed are things like E-GPS and maybe the phone network. You could have a phone that could last like 2 weeks without being charged, due to not needing a power hungry screen and processor.


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## Vitriol (Jul 4, 2015)

Tesla coils and van de graaf generators aswell- i've no idea what those things are but i vaguely remember them from a physics class 10years ago and can think of no good reason why macbooks shouldn't have a few attached.


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## Ravenor (Jul 4, 2015)

introman said:


> It irks me that you can't buy a new 1.8 inch hard drive MP3/MP4 player anymore and that dumbphones are relegated to super niche/expensive markets(construction). Why hasn't anybody made a modern dumb phone to sell to geriatrics/luddites? The only new engineering needed are things like E-GPS and maybe the phone network. You could have a phone that could last like 2 weeks without being charged, due to not needing a power hungry screen and processor.



Lot's of industrial PC's use them I have a 10ft x 10ft storage locker full of stuff from when I wound up my old IT company the end of last year if I have any in stock I'll send you a PM. 

As for dumb phones, look at Doro they make them for older people they are a little big to accommodate the keys but they fit the bill and Nokia still make a few and are OK not like the old Nokia 3310's but still very usable.


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## SU 390 (Jul 5, 2015)

NumberingYourState said:


> I can sperg all day about how Phablets are only there to appeal to boring wannabe fourteen year old techsters. Our market is getting worse because children at the age of 3 were blessed with an iPhone or Galaxy Tablet, therefor want OCTOCORE or FIFTY INTERNAL GIGS at a "reasonable price". Oh lord how math failed my generation.
> 
> "Phablet"... Oh, make me walk through the temple of Set, I fucking HATE that word play. It sucks that Samsung are not making anything good other than Mid-Ranged and Entry-Level phones these days, I remember when both Sammy and Motorola still produced QWERTY Droids. I hate OPPO for releasing average ten inch "Phones" with razor thin profiles, come on take a note from Motorola who produced quality 'thin phones' back when they lasted more than two years. Samsung and LG still make great basic phones, though you have to go out of your way to even get an old Nokia brick.
> 
> ...



You could say 'phone tablet'(although I'm sure you do). It's weird that Samsung is following Apple's trend in big ass phone and can't take the battery out. I want to be able to take the battery out, not send it to a fucking store! I don't see the appeal of Beats anyway. I'm not paying $150-200 for fucking headphones. At most I'll pay $9 for earphones. I haven't purchased any of the over the ears headphones that are at $20-$50. I like Sony and JVC more than any other brand. Aiwa is okay, haven't owned anything Aiwa in decades. It amazes me that Apple uses the same technology as Microsoft but charges arm and leg prices for their desktops and laptops. Ridiculous.


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## SU 390 (Jul 5, 2015)

Faceist Analchest said:


> There are advantages to expensive headphones (I'm wearing $300 Sennheiser HD600s as I write this), but the problem with Beats is that they sound like ass compared to other things in that price range. You can actually get pretty good headphones for about $60 if you're careful enough. It's sort of a game on forums like head-fi to look for unusually good sounding headphones for low prices.



I heard that pricey ones have better quality and 'last longer'. I only use head/earphones to listen to music and watch YT videos whenever I'm in a public place or at home with the AC blasting in the background. I can see why expensive headphones are a lot better, but I only use them often. I just see no reason to spend $60 to $300 for something I only use every now and then.


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## SU 390 (Jul 5, 2015)

Faceist Analchest said:


> The ear pads still need to be replaced on expensive headphones, and you can't necessarily count on those being available forever. They're frequently made of polyurethane foam; it eventually decomposes whether you're wearing them or not. So if you're not picky and only use them occasionally, cheaper ones are probably fine. But more expensive headphones are often a lot more comfortable, less prone to creaks and other annoyances, and just generally more pleasant to use.



I see. I haven't owned the ones with polyurethane foam yet. I've only had ones with the cotton like covers on them(the ones from the 90s in laymen's terms). I'll see which ones I want. I haven't been payed yet and I don't mind waiting for new headphones. I'm just a little bummed not having to listen to the podcasts I downloaded recently and blasting my laptop to full volume because of my AC. [sigh]


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## MACH-IV (Jul 5, 2015)

introman said:


> It irks me that you can't buy a new 1.8 inch hard drive MP3/MP4 player anymore and that dumbphones are relegated to super niche/expensive markets(construction). Why hasn't anybody made a modern dumb phone to sell to geriatrics/luddites? The only new engineering needed are things like E-GPS and maybe the phone network. You could have a phone that could last like 2 weeks without being charged, due to not needing a power hungry screen and processor.


My 2008 iPod classic died six months ago, and I'm still mourning its death. There isn't anything else like it. Now I play music in my car with my phone, but the lack of physical buttons is going to get me killed in a crash. If I want to do something as simple as skipping a track I have to pick it up, unlock and look at the screen to make sure I press the exact specific spot.


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## Space_Dandy (Jul 5, 2015)

I've noticed a lot of people here sharing similar feelings about Apple, but here's my perspective.

I really didn't have an opinion on them until I began working for AT&T.

For better part of 3 years I worked in a call center for AT&T, all but about 6 months as a manager. When I started in 2011 I was informed of Apple's relationship with AT&T. Until 2012 the Iphone was exclusively sold and used via AT&T, this brought AT&T a lot of customers but it came at a price. Unlike every other phone manufacturer ever, Apple dictated strict pricing guidelines and rules on how Iphone customers could be dealt with. Apple didn't like the idea of upgrades, offering discounted equipment for a 2 year contract. We could NEVER discount an Iphone below standard upgrade price, we could almost never waive an early termination fee (ETF) when a customer cancelled service, since that fee is what allowed that phone discount, and finally we could almost never offer early upgrades to/from an Iphone. People have been fired for waiving termination fees on Iphones, or promising to do so, in situations when doing so with any other device would have not been a big deal. That contract had to be strictly adhered to, even if AT&T wanted to do something special for a tenured customer who may have had a bad experience.

In the early years of AT&T's relationship with Apple it was even worse. Agents weren't even allowed to give courtesy credits or promotion plans to Iphone customers, since the bill is one way the loss on discounted equipment is covered, and discounting the bill sort of defeats the purpose of contract upgrades. People have been fired for offering courtesy credits for legitimate reasons, like a terrible store experience or defective equipment, just because the customer had an Iphone.

After 2012 things relaxed significantly, but it is still not totally even. AT&T reps still cannot offer discounts on Iphones and a few other limitations. Sometimes they work around this limitation by offering a credit on the bill to reimburse for paying full price on a phone they wish they could discount for the customer.

If Apple offered a superior product, then this would be understandable, but they offer a sub-par product as if it were premium.

The Iphone 4 had the worst cell reception of any phone offered in my time working for AT&T, with the possible exception of 2010/2011 Blackberry devices. It became a joke in the call center. Whenever a customer would call in complaining about call quality, if there were multiple lines on the account, we could be sure almost every time the Iphone line either had the worst reception or was the only line with issues. To be fair, this got significantly better since then. I still wouldn't bet on an Iphone getting better reception than any Samsung.

From a consumer perspective, I think smartphones are a waste of money in general, so I don't have one. But if I were to get one I would stay away from the Iphone for several reasons:
-No customizability compared to the options offered by Android.
-Apps selection is limited and almost never free. Android offers a wide variety of apps and they are almost always free. I don't need Apple telling me what products are good/safe. I'm a smart consumer who does my homework before I install anything.
-No/limited interface with Windows computers. Vast majority of Americans use Windows, why would I want to limit myself to exclusively Apple products?
-They make sure their products are not compatible with third party options, often not even backwards compatible. If you buy a new device, you buy new accessories. Charging ports for example.

Apple sucks.

They are arrogant and overrated. I know very few people that I worked with in the callcenter who used Apple. Many converted away because of what they saw, and took pride in converting others to anything but Iphones.


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## Superior Watermelon (Jul 5, 2015)

Why the fuck don't the make chargers with AWG lower than 24? Why the fuck do they have to make shit impossible to fix?


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## Marvin (Jul 5, 2015)

IronJustice said:


> Apple sucks.


Eh, most apple users I know are content. Probably all of them, actually.


IronJustice said:


> They are arrogant and overrated. I know very few people that I worked with in the callcenter who used Apple.


But you're just talking about call center employees.

Edit: I'm high as shit. Also, I use android


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## The Knife's Husbando (Jul 6, 2015)

My biggest bitch about smartphones is they aren't totally liquid-proof. Yeah, I know you can buy an Otter case or whatever, but for my job even that isn't much help. I spend a good portion of the work day wet and covered in blood, fat & animal grease and that isn't very electronics-friendly.

I also agree with MACH-IV, the lack of buttons on modern electronics is_* annoying as fuck.*_ If I get a call at work, I have to stop what I'm doing, quickly remove three sets of gloves, fish out my phone from whatever pocket/pouch I've got it in-because there is _no_ belt clip that will keep one safe and dry in my line of work- then try to swipe the screen with wet hands. I've actually seen my co-workers just yank out their phone & swipe the screen _with their nose._ It works most of the time.

I currently carry an el-cheapo button flip-phone in the hood of my Hoodie I wear under my butcher's coat. It's the only thing I've found that works.


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## sparklemilhouse (Jul 6, 2015)

I also mourn the loss of a real iPod. 

--

At my work, we have iMacs...that run Windows. The library has done this for *years* and it makes NO sense.


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## AnOminous (Jul 6, 2015)

sparklemilhouse said:


> I also mourn the loss of a real iPod.
> 
> --
> 
> At my work, we have iMacs...that run Windows. The library has done this for *years* and it makes NO sense.



That not only doesn't make sense, it makes whatever the opposite of sense is.  That's about the worst possible thing you could do, overpaying for underperforming hardware to run an OS it isn't intended do, and foregoing the one genuinely good thing about Apple computers, or at least the one thing that comes close to justifying their excessive prices.


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## AlephOne2Many (Jul 6, 2015)

I feel like the race to making a *private online device* is a lost cause. I see a variant of a 'black phone' smart device being nothing more than a six hundred dollar nerdwank that'll be exploited in a week if not a day. Yes, backdoors are scoped out in even seconds. Biggest scam of the phone market to date.


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## sparklemilhouse (Jul 6, 2015)

AnOminous said:


> That not only doesn't make sense, it makes whatever the opposite of sense is.



And there is no option for the patrons to choose to use OSX or Windows 7 when they're using the computer. The library staff only uses 2 programs, they can't find a Mac version? Our IT person was recently hired, and she's just some air force dropout that just knows how to install software and turn the router on and off. 

/edit/
 just looked up to see if the company that makes the library software makes OSX software. 'Guess not.


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## AlephOne2Many (Jul 8, 2015)

I use Lumia in High Contrast Mode *regularly*, without having the sensory difficulties to make it necessary in the first place.

It looks cool. Bite me.


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## sparklemilhouse (Jul 14, 2015)

sparklemilhouse said:


> Our IT person was recently hired, and she's just some air force dropout that just knows how to install software and turn the router on and off.



Chick got fired the other day. Someone had to come in and fix all the stuff she slowed down.


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## LazarusOwenhart (Jul 16, 2015)

Slightly off topic but: Facebook should be banned for the same reason that Heroin is banned. 98% of people who use heroin don't have the sense of self control to stop themselves being consumed and neither do Facebook users.


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## AlephOne2Many (Jul 16, 2015)

I don't know if this constitutes as an unpopular opinion, but people working in general tech retail (Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Carrier Retail) need to keep their opinions about *insert brand* to themselves unless a customer asked. *That is if the customer openly gives a shit about a medial employees point of view, it hurts companies and its brands to either glorify or slander their product in supporting retailers AND online sellers*.

@LazarusOwenhart you'd be amazed (maybe, maybe not) what social things you can do online even without a Facebook.


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## AnOminous (Jul 16, 2015)

NumberingYourState said:


> I don't know if this constitutes as an unpopular opinion, but people working in general tech retail (Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Carrier Retail) need to keep their opinions about *insert brand* to themselves unless a customer asked. *That is if the customer openly gives a shit about a medial employees point of view, it hurts companies and its brands to either glorify or slander their product in supporting retailers AND online sellers*.



I might hold this opinion if I actually owned the store or were one of the producers selling some product, but if I were actually a customer and the employee knew what they were talking about, and for whatever reason I didn't, I would appreciate an honest opinion and wouldn't really give a shit about the employer's opinion on the matter (i.e. I would not rat them out).


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## LazarusOwenhart (Jul 17, 2015)

NumberingYourState said:


> @LazarusOwenhart you'd be amazed (maybe, maybe not) what social things you can do online even without a Facebook.


 I merely use Facebook as an example, basically all forms of social media are awful. Forums like this are fine because they're topic-led but social networking sites are just massive festering pits of awful where a single innocuous comment taken the wrong way can become a catastrophic, friendship ending disaster and entirely change the relationship somebody has with somebody else. All this before the person who made the comment has realized and all because there are no visual or vocal cues to help the offended person understand the true meaning of the comment. Long story short, social media is an Autism simulator.


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## SU 390 (Jul 18, 2015)

I've been busy lately so I've let the thread rot a bit. 



IronJustice said:


> I've noticed a lot of people here sharing similar feelings about Apple, but here's my perspective.
> 
> I really didn't have an opinion on them until I began working for AT&T.
> 
> ...



I saw a post on Tumblr recently about iPhone restarting and to paraphrase, "I don't care how many times my iPhone restarts. I'll never switch to Android because I was raised in a good home and have respect for myself" made me realize the arrogance of Apple users. This is the same shit with Apple better than Windows & Android. I chalk up to people who download a lot of shit and end up getting a virus at one point or another. If you know how to use Windows effectively you won't many problems, but no, keep downloading useless shit and add 2000 toolbars and say "Windows suckz!!!" It's the same thing with the Google Play Store. If an app seems bullshit or riddle with bad reviews, don't install it. It's common sense. I still have the Samsung Galaxy S 1 from 2011 and will upgrade when I change my carrier. At first I downloaded a few useful apps and ended up install useless ones too. Though my battery dies faster, I've learned not to download shit I don't need(same rules apply to spending money; don't buy useless shit you don't need in the long run).

Before this becomes a sperg essay, it annoys me that Apple charges so much for their desk/laptops. Their designs are always pleasing to the eye but fuck, I don't want to spend so much that has no backwards compatibility and doesn't run 3rd party software.



sparklemilhouse said:


> I also mourn the loss of a real iPod.
> 
> --
> 
> At my work, we have iMacs...that run Windows. The library has done this for *years* and it makes NO sense.



That's fucking stupid.



AnOminous said:


> That not only doesn't make sense, it makes whatever the opposite of sense is.  That's about the worst possible thing you could do, overpaying for underperforming hardware to run an OS it isn't intended do, and foregoing the one genuinely good thing about Apple computers, or at least the one thing that comes close to justifying their excessive prices.



Same thing I said before. 



sparklemilhouse said:


> Chick got fired the other day. Someone had to come in and fix all the stuff she slowed down.



[facepalm] That's incredible . 



LazarusOwenhart said:


> Slightly off topic but: Facebook should be banned for the same reason that Heroin is banned. 98% of people who use heroin don't have the sense of self control to stop themselves being consumed and neither do Facebook users.



Since Facebook runs on some electronics, it's not off topic. Facebook addiction is a serious thing.


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## LazarusOwenhart (Jul 18, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> Since Facebook runs on some electronics, it's not off topic. Facebook addiction is a serious thing.



Addiction is only half the problem. Ever hear the saying, "People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones,"? Facebook is a big glass house with a huge supply of free stones. I've frequently seen it reduce grown-ass human beings to squabbling toddlers over something as pathetic as a forgotten birthday.


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## AnOminous (Jul 18, 2015)

LazarusOwenhart said:


> I've frequently seen it reduce grown-ass human beings to squabbling toddlers over something as pathetic as a forgotten birthday.



I've seen it reduce my otherwise reasonable family to warring tribes over the most vanilla, boring partisan politics issues.  Once.  Everyone agreed never to do that again.


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## c-no (Jul 18, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I saw a post on Tumblr recently about iPhone restarting and to paraphrase, "I don't care how many times my iPhone restarts. I'll never switch to Android because I was raised in a good home and have respect for myself" made me realize the arrogance of Apple users. This is the same shit with Apple better than Windows & Android. I chalk up to people who download a lot of shit and end up getting a virus at one point or another. If you know how to use Windows effectively you won't many problems, but no, keep downloading useless shit and add 2000 toolbars and say "Windows suckz!!!" It's the same thing with the Google Play Store. If an app seems bullshit or riddle with bad reviews, don't install it. It's common sense. I still have the Samsung Galaxy S 1 from 2011 and will upgrade when I change my carrier. At first I downloaded a few useful apps and ended up install useless ones too. Though my battery dies faster, I've learned not to download shit I don't need(same rules apply to spending money; don't buy useless shit you don't need in the long run).


Yes, the whole Windows sucks thing because of viruses isn't really the fault of Microsoft as much as it is the user. One should be watching whatever they install. Even third party software they get will ask you if you want their crappy toolbar which you should keep an eye out for if you don't want to get junk programs that will only take up space and performance. While one can say a Mac can't get a virus, it's still a possibility when someone that knows how to make a virus decides to hit a Mac rather than a Windows computer.


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## AlephOne2Many (Aug 11, 2015)

Hey let's predict what basic features Apple will remove in their latest Macbook/iPhone/iPad/Netbook...


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## Bugaboo (Aug 13, 2015)

I think the original GBA was a stupid piece of hardware because you couldn't see the screen, then they brought out the SP and all was well


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## autism420 (Aug 13, 2015)

I'm a converted Apple fan even though I'm an IT guy and should know better. I especially like the watch and am happy I got one. What can I say, I like fancy toys.


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## Abethedemon (Aug 13, 2015)

I'm a fan of mac products, mainly cuz that's what I grew up with.


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## AlephOne2Many (Aug 13, 2015)

Don't get me wrong there used to be a time I could appreciate Apple, but those were back during the iPod and Powerbook G Series days.

I even liked the OG iPhone at some point, but the lack of battery interchange is what killed it for me. After that point I just shrugged at everything they threw at the chalkboard. Thin netbooks with one port to spare and nothing else? Meh...


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## SU 390 (Aug 13, 2015)

NumberingYourState said:


> Don't get me wrong there used to be a time I could appreciate Apple, but those were back during the iPod and Powerbook G Series days.
> 
> I even liked the OG iPhone at some point, but the lack of battery interchange is what killed it for me. After that point I just shrugged at everything they threw at the chalkboard. Thin netbooks with one port to spare and nothing else? Meh...



I'm honestly sad that netbooks are defunct and are replaced with Chromebooks. Nothing wrong with Chromebooks since I've tried one out at Best Buy last year, but it would be hard to install another OS on it without problems plus no way to upgrade RAM as well. Then again I'm broke as fuck and can't do a payment plan on a new laptop without it killing whatever I have left over for bills, food and transportation. :-/


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## autism420 (Aug 13, 2015)

WanderingVagabond said:


> I'm honestly sad that netbooks are defunct and are replaced with Chromebooks. Nothing wrong with Chromebooks since I've tried one out at Best Buy last year, but it would be hard to install another OS on it without problems plus no way to upgrade RAM as well. Then again I'm broke as fuck and can't do a payment plan on a new laptop without it killing whatever I have left over for bills, food and transportation. :-/


Asus has some decent laptops under $500. Not speeddemons or gaming machines but decent and reliable. Honestly I don't really see the point of netbooks anymore with how powerful tablets have become. I think many have no use for a small, thin laptop nowadays.


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## SU 390 (Aug 14, 2015)

autism420 said:


> Asus has some decent laptops under $500. Not speeddemons or gaming machines but decent and reliable. Honestly I don't really see the point of netbooks anymore with how powerful tablets have become. I think many have no use for a small, thin laptop nowadays.



Good to know. Thank you!


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## The Knife's Husbando (Aug 14, 2015)

Contrary to popular belief, Apple products are really easy for the amateur to troubleshoot and fix at home with no tech support.

Regardless of how many extraneous BS you may installed on the OS. As long as they're not in a total lockdown "brick' state. You're good. Power down the device fully, then power it back up and reboot it. As soon as you're back up, open the first window you see, any window will do- and then chunk that POS out of it and go out and buy a real PC you can work on.


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## autism420 (Aug 14, 2015)

The Knife's Husbando said:


> buy a real PC you can work on.



I know people love this meme, but the reality is that they are "real PCs". You can run Windows on modern Apple computers. I do agree that non-replaceable hard drives are kind of lame though, and they are much more expensive than other brands. But you get a nice all aluminum design, great screen, amazing battery life. They are luxury devices. Having said that, I do not own any Apple computers because when I am in the market for one I know my money is better spent elsewhere.


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## AlephOne2Many (Aug 14, 2015)

I find it telling that a company such as Samsung can feel good about charging $700+ for a smartphone held together with glue (Galaxy S6).


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## Watcher (Aug 14, 2015)

The Knife's Husbando said:


> Contrary to popular belief, Apple products are really easy for the amateur to troubleshoot and fix at home with no tech support.
> 
> Regardless of how many extraneous BS you may installed on the OS. As long as they're not in a total lockdown "brick' state. You're good. Power down the device fully, then power it back up and reboot it. As soon as you're back up, open the first window you see, any window will do- and then chunk that POS out of it and go out and buy a real PC you can work on.


I remember when I had to do technical support on a Mac computer I had to create a new administrator account because I was locked out. So I had to boot into this command-line interface and do it from there


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## TheAmazingAxolotl (Aug 14, 2015)

Anyone who doesn't know how to write basic programs on a TI calculator is wasting their life and their time in math class. Forget the notion of "if you can't show your work, you don't understand the problem" because bitch if you didn't understand the problem you wouldn't be able to program the calculator to solve the problem for you.

Apple handheld devices are superior to Apple computers. Not in the sense that they're functionally superior, but mostly because they're highly portable and can be easily jailbroken or for the most part hacked to serve a better purpose. I still use my iTouch as a PDA at times. That and it has a better music player than my Windows Phone. Apple computers are still shit compared to PCs.

I do not know anyone who still uses a landline.

Electronic boardgames are ruining the spirit of traditional boardgames. Fuck them.

Also, probably off-topic in this thread, but my favourite thing to do when the person behind me in the queue at the grocery store is being an impatient little prick is to hold down the four corner buttons on the credit card scanner so that it'll reset. Not an unpopular opinion, it just makes me an asshole.


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## AlephOne2Many (Aug 14, 2015)

You can literally get a basic basic basic candybar and flip phone that does fifteen million times over what a landline can do, and even run a minor Binary Runtime embedded OS (BREW Mobile Platform, Java ME/MIDP 2.0). Landlines are to stiff people with highly insecure lines that promise you will deal with shady phone calls moreso than any other telephony format these days.


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## Mal0 (Oct 26, 2021)

I have a pretty decent laptop. Acer Nitro 5 with an RTX card and a Ryzen 7 5800H. A bit overkill but it's nice to be able to take it to LAN parties or when hanging with the boys. 

But I will admit... I am rather jealous of my girlfriend's Macbook due to how sleek it is, and the fast boot up time. Of course if I didn't buy a gaming laptop I could have gotten a slimmer and lighter laptop too, but I just like her laptop. Makes me consider if I made the right choice.


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## turdburger (Oct 27, 2021)

Smartphones. Here's a tiny keyboard on a screen to demonstrate how fat your fingers are. Here's a non-waterproof slippy thin and relatively heavy object with glass all on one side that you are guaranteed to drop either over water or over a hard surface.

Laptops, or at least laptops since they started making them all in widescreen. In 2003 or some shit that's ancient history, I had a nice 4:3 laptop that broke under warranty. The company had stopped making the model and they replaced it with a widescreen machine that had inferior specs. What idiots collectively decided a small screen would be better made wider?


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## celebrityskin (Oct 27, 2021)

Apple have been the epitome of shit since 2009-ish.


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