# Schopenhauer sucks



## AnOminous (Apr 6, 2017)

He does, though.

I'll go into this more especially if nobody even responds.


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## Bloody bunny (Apr 6, 2017)

AnOminous said:


> He does, though.
> 
> I'll go into this more especially if nobody even responds.


the floor is all yours, sir.


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## ShittyRecolor (Apr 6, 2017)

His philosophy did spawn a considerable number of pretentious cunts, that's for sure. Sigh... no wonder I used to gobble up all of his and Rousseau's stuff as a teen.


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## Bloody bunny (Apr 6, 2017)

ShittyRecolor said:


> His philosophy did spawn a considerable number of pretentious cunts, that's for sure. Sigh... no wonder I used to gobble up all of his and Rousseau's stuff as a teen.


admitting who you are is part of understanding the problem.


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## ShittyRecolor (Apr 6, 2017)

jack said:


> admitting who you are is part of understanding the problem.


I feel like a more relieved cunt already!


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## Positron (Apr 6, 2017)

Schopenhauer was just a rich spoiled twat who nursed a grudge-boner against Hegel.



ShittyRecolor said:


> His philosophy did spawn a considerable number of pretentious cunts, that's for sure.


And inspired the most laughably overblown and obnoxious opera of all time, Wagner's_ Tristan und Isolde_.  If there is a work deserving of the Eurotrash treatment, this is it.


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## DuskEngine (Apr 6, 2017)

Continental School pls go


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## xXRonPaul_42020Xx (Apr 7, 2017)

Schopenhauer's philosophy in two words: *Tips Fedora*


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## Fareal (Apr 7, 2017)

Positron said:


> Schopenhauer was just a rich spoiled twat who nursed a grudge-boner against Hegel.
> 
> 
> And inspired the most laughably overblown and obnoxious opera of all time, Wagner's_ Tristan und Isolde_.  If there is a work deserving of the Eurotrash treatment, this is it.



Come, tell me why you detest Tristan und Isolde so?


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## Positron (Apr 8, 2017)

Fareal said:


> Come, tell me why you detest Tristan und Isolde so?


Unsympathetic scenario (the immoral love is not even what disturbed me most; it is the notion that, since Isolde saved Tristan's life once, his life is automatically forfeit to her); unsympathetic protagonist (by which I mean Isolde; when we first take a good look at Tristan he's already doped and duped); goes on and on for no good reason.  In a mailing list I described this opera as a "four-hour coitus".   Of course I got a lot of flak for it, but that is what it basically is.

What are not bad about this opera is the music (it is revolutionary and rightfully deserving of the mountains of analysis done to it), or even Wagner's characterization.  From the very start, when Isolde overheard sailors singing a song about an "Irish maid", she immediately takes offense because she thinks they're singing about _her_ -- you know this woman is quite a piece of work.

But since it is Schopie we're talking about, _Der Ring_ is at its core even more Schopie -- Old World Order based on hierarchy and contract becomes corrupt and powerless, and must be destroyed through a fire of libidinous passion.  I don't have nearly as much issue with _Der Ring _because there is more drama to it, and its length is by and large justified.


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## Fareal (Apr 8, 2017)

Positron said:


> Unsympathetic scenario (the immoral love is not even what disturbed me most; it is the notion that, since Isolde saved Tristan's life once, his life is automatically forfeit to her); unsympathetic protagonist (by which I mean Isolde; when we first take a good look at Tristan he's already doped and duped); goes on and on for no good reason.  In a mailing list I described this opera as a "four-hour coitus".   Of course I got a lot of flak for it, but that is what it basically is.
> 
> What are not bad about this opera is the music (it is revolutionary and rightfully deserving of the mountains of analysis done to it), or even Wagner's characterization.  From the very start, when Isolde overheard sailors singing a song about an "Irish maid", she immediately takes offense because she thinks they're singing about _her_ -- you know this woman is quite a piece of work.
> 
> But since it is Schopie we're talking about, _Der Ring_ is at its core even more Schopie -- Old World Order based on hierarchy and contract becomes corrupt and powerless, and must be destroyed through a fire of libidinous passion.  I don't have nearly as much issue with _Der Ring _because there is more drama to it, and its length is by and large justified.



Ahhh, I misunderstood. I entirely agree, the plot is bollocks but the score is monumental. To be fair, we can probably say this about a number of other operas. I recently sat through Pelleas et Melisande and despite lovely performances, I was pissed off with every character by the end of the first act and glad they were dying by the end.

I do wonder if I would enjoy some operas more if the supertitle had never been invented. I would be less aware that the plot is frequently bollocks and the characters frequently hideous. (Special shout out to Pinkerton in Madama Butterfly here)


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## AnOminous (Apr 8, 2017)

My main gripe with Schopenhauer's anti-natalist philosophy is that no matter how he dressed it up in turgid prose, it basically amounted to the fact that Schopenhauer himself was personally unhappy with his own life so nobody else should be allowed to have fun, either.


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## KillMeNow (Apr 8, 2017)

omg, how dare you???? you just have shit taste. Schopenhauer is soooo much better than the crap today like Justin Bieber and Kim Kardashian.


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## Positron (Apr 8, 2017)

Fareal said:


> Ahhh, I misunderstood. I entirely agree, the plot is bollocks but the score is monumental. To be fair, we can probably say this about a number of other operas. I recently sat through Pelleas et Melisande and despite lovely performances, I was pissed off with every character by the end of the first act and glad they were dying by the end.
> 
> I do wonder if I would enjoy some operas more if the supertitle had never been invented. I would be less aware that the plot is frequently bollocks and the characters frequently hideous. (Special shout out to Pinkerton in Madama Butterfly here)



Oh _Pélleas_.  Let's move to the classical music thread shall we?


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## Dr. Voss (Apr 9, 2017)

Nah, I think his thoughts about _Wille zur Leben _kind of make sense. Life is miserable for most living creatures anyway, and still they cling onto it desperately. I find it interesting how his ideas influenced Nietzsche.


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## AnOminous (Apr 9, 2017)

Dr. Voss said:


> Nah, I think his thoughts about _Wille zur Leben _kind of make sense. Life is miserable for most living creatures anyway, and still they cling onto it desperately. I find it interesting how his ideas influenced Nietzsche.



Well, according to that, we should just exterminate all life.  Most humans would not agree with you if you tried to do this to them, though, and even animals would fight back.  I'm not exactly thrilled about every aspect of my existence or existence in general, but on the whole, it is better to be than not to be.


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## Dr. Voss (Apr 9, 2017)

AnOminous said:


> Well, according to that, we should just exterminate all life.  Most humans would not agree with you if you tried to do this to them, though, and even animals would fight back.  I'm not exactly thrilled about every aspect of my existence or existence in general, but on the whole, it is better to be than not to be.


I don't think that's what he means. Antinatalism sucks but I don't see Schopenhauer as antinatalist per se. The fact that I don't want to end my existence even though I can't enjoy it constantly is a result of "the will." He says that the way to alleviate suffering is to deny the will, however he doesn't mean suicide. By committing suicide one recognizes the will; suicide signifies a will for _a different kind of existence. _Instead, according to Schopenhauer, one should use asceticism, meditation, and art to eventually induce a state in which suffering is relieved (albeit temporarily).

I'm not saying I completely agree with Schopenhauer, but some of his thoughts make sense. I've always been a pessimistic person I guess, so it resonates well with me.


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## ShittyRecolor (Apr 9, 2017)

Positron said:


> Schopenhauer was just a rich spoiled twat who nursed a grudge-boner against Hegel.
> 
> 
> And inspired the most laughably overblown and obnoxious opera of all time, Wagner's_ Tristan und Isolde_.  If there is a work deserving of the Eurotrash treatment, this is it.



Credit where credit's due, the Tristan chord is pretty awesome. You can take an ordinary E phrygian chord progression of Am-G-F-E, put said Tristan chord between E and F as a filler\transistional chord and it will sound super interesting.


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## Save Goober (Apr 9, 2017)

He said a bunch of dumb shit about women
I don't know about his other views


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## DuskEngine (Apr 10, 2017)

melty said:


> He said a bunch of dumb shit about women


what philosopher hasn't


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## Jason Genova (Apr 11, 2017)

AnOminous said:


> My main gripe with Schopenhauer's anti-natalist philosophy is that no matter how he dressed it up in turgid prose, it basically amounted to the fact that Schopenhauer himself was personally unhappy with his own life so nobody else should be allowed to have fun, either.


Schopenhauer was too high-IQ for this world, he was bound to be miserable.

INTPs are destined to live a life full of LDARing while the low-sapience extroverts go around making choices purely by animalistic instinct.



Spoiler



but srs, I don't really know shit about the guy other than he was angry and fucking bald. Despite the other thread I made a few weeks ago I'm not really an anti-natalist, I just think most people would be if they used logic. It's just that giving birth causes suffering via the fact that it's almost certain you will experience suffering in your lifetime. This is also a choice that doesn't give the other party consent. If you agree that *A. Causing somebody to experience suffering when they didn't ask you to is immoral* and *B. Immoral actions should be avoided *then having children must be  something you shouldn't do. My only point is that most people would agree to A. and B., so logically most people should be against having children. I know that Sam Harris and his small-skulled utilitarian "philosophy" would go against this because happiness = morality and the more happiness there is in the universe the better. Of course a fucking fifth grader could point out that it must then be moral to let a bunch of sadists torture one man because the total amount of happiness being produced outweighs the total amount of suffering. I don't even know which ethical "school" I would belong to, but not Sam Harrisism


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## DoctorJimmyRay (Apr 13, 2017)

I suppose he's somewhat of an acquired taste. I found him to be delightfully melancholic. He's an excellent read, even if just to give Nietzsche a bit of context.


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## The Great Chandler (Jan 17, 2022)

At least the old bastard finally chilled tf out in his last days!


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