# Bankruptcy and shutdowns among Bitcoin mining operators following price crash



## 419 (Nov 23, 2018)

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-...upt-china-bitmain-giga-watt-a8646821.html?amp


> Bitcoin mining operations in the US and China are facing closures after the plummeting price of bitcoin means they may no longer be profitable.
> 
> The world's most valuable cryptocurrency is currently trading at around $4,500, having lost almost a third of its value in the space of a week.
> 
> ...


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## Tranhuviya (Nov 23, 2018)

Imagine seriously investing in funny money.


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## repentance (Nov 23, 2018)

Giga Watt owes more than that.





https://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-mining-firm-giga-watt-declares-bankruptcy-owing-millions

The Chinese are dumping their mining hardware.





https://cointelegraph.com/news/chin...-mining-devices-by-kilo-amidst-market-decline


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## Sexy Potoo (Nov 23, 2018)

Damp Eit


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## frozenrunner (Nov 23, 2018)

I know someone who is going to be miserable at this news, and I couldn't be happier


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## SwanDive (Nov 23, 2018)

Oh man, thank god I didn't do anything absurd like sell my car or take out a second mortgage on my house in order to buy cryptocurrencies heh... heh... heh...




(help)


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## Al Gulud (Nov 23, 2018)

Brb gotta go make fun of fags on /biz/


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## Hatoful Dandy (Nov 23, 2018)




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## usernames can change now! (Nov 23, 2018)

So what you're saying is buy buttcoins


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## break these cuffs (Nov 23, 2018)

Does this mean I'll be able to buy a new graphics card from a legitimate retailr without having to take out a second mortgage?


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## PoisonedBun (Nov 23, 2018)

How do you even determine the worth of cryptocurrency?


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## repentance (Nov 23, 2018)

Cho Chan said:


> How do you even determine the worth of cryptocurrency?



They have no intrinsic value so they'll always be "worth" what the market is willing to pay at any given point in time.


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## Cinderblock (Nov 23, 2018)

SwanDive said:


> Oh man, thank god I didn't do anything absurd like sell my car or take out a second mortgage on my house in order to buy cryptocurrencies heh... heh... heh...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hey man, don't sweat it, Bitconnect can still make a comeback. (HA!)

Also, when are the suicide hotlines going to appear on forums?


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## Glad I couldn't help (Nov 23, 2018)

Al Gulud said:


> Brb gotta go make fun of fags on /biz/


Also remember to visit /v/ and /g/ for the victory celebrations.


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## Iwasamwillbe (Nov 23, 2018)

Bitcoin is a pyramid scheme.


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## Sable (Nov 23, 2018)

Maybe this might slow the ridiculous inflation of computer part prices.


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## repentance (Nov 23, 2018)

Sable said:


> Maybe this might slow the ridiculous inflation of computer part prices.



The majority of Bitcoin mining is done by machines which are purpose built and unable to do anything other than mine Bitcoin (which is why they only have junk value when they become obsolete after a few months).


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## TowinKarz (Nov 23, 2018)

So, anyone want to cash out and invest in tulip bulbs?


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## neverendingmidi (Nov 23, 2018)

What, they couldn't use the bitcoins they mined to pay their utilities?


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## thx1138 (Nov 23, 2018)

Suck my dick, people who caused video card prices to skyrocket!


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## 419 (Nov 23, 2018)

should i feel bad for the people still posting on the cryptoshekels kiwi board

e: this got moved onto crypto board sup bietches


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## CrunkLord420 (Nov 23, 2018)

spvcxghxztpvrrp said:


> should i feel bad for the people still posting on the cryptoshekels kiwi board
> 
> e: this got moved onto crypto board sup bietches


based mods


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## Cinderblock (Nov 23, 2018)

spvcxghxztpvrrp said:


> should i feel bad for the people still posting on the cryptoshekels kiwi board



I know Boogie lost a ton of money. It would be nice to know the situation for us who are not in the biz. I mean, news articles are going crazy but when weren't they? Perhaps the situation isn't as bad as advertised. (According to regular news, there is going to be a crypto apocalypse)


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## Clop (Nov 23, 2018)

Thank god, maybe now it's possible to buy a graphics card to do actual graphics.

I'll express sympathy for the people who're hemorrhaging money, but it'll be through gritted teeth and a shit-eating smirk.


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## AnOminous (Nov 23, 2018)

Cinderblock said:


> I know Boogie lost a ton of money. It would be nice to know the situation for us who are not in the biz. I mean, news articles are going crazy but when weren't they? Perhaps the situation isn't as bad as advertised. (According to regular news, there is going to be a crypto apocalypse)



What's going to happen is it will hit bottom and people are going to buy these hugely expensive crypto rigs in liquidation for practically nothing.  With nobody mining, the supply will collapse and BTC will be scarce again.  As usual with speculation, the morons who bought high and sold low will go broke and the people who scooped up a bunch of big iron for nothing will make out like bandits.

I would actually not be surprised if the very people who manufactured a lot of these miners literally bought them back for less than it cost them to build them in the first place and then eke out some additional profit mining with them at the end of their life cycle.


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## Cinderblock (Nov 23, 2018)

Thanks AnOminous, I'm also reading Cryptocurrency lolcows thread. It's really informative too. You basically predicted this in the first post when you said hardware is already getting too expensive and complex to be profitable (If I'm not mistaken).

Edit: Boy, this bitcoin stuff is way more complicated than I thought when I posted. It's almost like a second language but for Tech + dumb people + Criminal people. Jesus


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## repentance (Nov 23, 2018)

Cinderblock said:


> Thanks AnOminous, I'm also reading Cryptocurrency lolcows thread. It's really informative too. You basically predicted this in the first post when you said hardware is already getting too expensive and complex to be profitable (If I'm not mistaken).
> 
> Edit: Boy, this bitcoin stuff is way more complicated than I thought when I posted. It's almost like a second language but for Tech + dumb people + Criminal people. Jesus



In theory it should be self-adjusting.  As miners withdraw from the network because mining isn't profitable, difficulty should drop for the remaining miners.

For Bitcoin proper, it's been energy costs which have been making mining unprofitable - which is why Giga Watt planned to have its own substation - not hardware.  

Hardware is a problem, too, though as it becomes obsolete so quickly.  People who have been mining alt coins can at least use their GPUs for other purposes or sell them to people who want them for another purpose.  Bitcoin specific obsolete hardware offers less hope of any substantial sale price so people really need to make a profit from mining before their gear becomes obsolete.  The days when they could just not mine for a few months and then start mining again when the price rose have pretty much gone.


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## Cinderblock (Nov 23, 2018)

Though I haven't read that much on the topic, one thing you said comes to mind. Weren't the days of mining with like 20 GPU's in your house over by early 2016? And after that you needed specific Bitcoin hardware? Also, I don't know what kind of "other purpose" would you have for like 15+ graphic cards.


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## AnOminous (Nov 23, 2018)

repentance said:


> Hardware is a problem, too, though as it becomes obsolete so quickly.



The issue with it is also really, really simple.

Suppose you know how to build a machine that can literally directly make money.

You have two choices.  You can sell it now to someone else, who is probably dumber than you or they would have done this themselves, or you can just turn on your money making machine and turn electricity into money.  Presumably you already know how to do this, too.

So why would you sell it for less than what you could make yourself?  The simple answer is you wouldn't.  So anyone selling this kind of gear is overcharging for it or a fool.  The kind of people who can build high quality mining gear are not stupid because it is not all that easy to do for dumb people.

What do dumb people do?  They buy in at the top of markets because the price has been going up.

In the case of Bitcoin, when a bunch of miners suddenly enter the market, the difficulty of mining goes up.  That completely obliterates marginal shit like most of these garbage GPU miners, assuming those were even marginally profitable ever any time after 2010 or so.  

The result is dummies take a bath and pull out of the market and the price plummets.  It's an old story and it has happened before and will happen again.


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## Cinderblock (Nov 23, 2018)

AnOminous said:


> I would actually not be surprised if the very people who manufactured a lot of these miners literally bought them back for less than it cost them to build them in the first place and then eke out some additional profit mining with them at the end of their life cycle.



LOL, you are right there. The people who make the miners are some smart bandits. First they sell chumps "money making machines" in overprice (that they'll know will cost nothing when the markets crash from flodding of miners) and make a killing. When the markets crash and they are worthless, they rebuy them cheap to make double the killing. It's... brilliant


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## QT 219 (Nov 24, 2018)

Cho Chan said:


> How do you even determine the worth of cryptocurrency?





AnOminous said:


> What's going to happen is it will hit bottom and people are going to buy these hugely expensive crypto rigs in liquidation for practically nothing.  With nobody mining, the supply will collapse and BTC will be scarce again.  As usual with speculation, the morons who bought high and sold low will go broke and the people who scooped up a bunch of big iron for nothing will make out like bandits.
> 
> I would actually not be surprised if the very people who manufactured a lot of these miners literally bought them back for less than it cost them to build them in the first place and then eke out some additional profit mining with them at the end of their life cycle.



The problem with single man operations is the overhead to invest is much too large. BitCoin should only be played with excess capital, not your primary assets. All these retards going full on broke are _complete dogshit with regular money *to begin with*._


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## repentance (Nov 24, 2018)

Cinderblock said:


> Though I haven't read that much on the topic, one thing you said comes to mind. Weren't the days of mining with like 20 GPU's in your house over by early 2016? And after that you needed specific Bitcoin hardware? Also, I don't know what kind of "other purpose" would you have for like 15+ graphic cards.



For Bitcoin, yes, but there are alt-coins which can be mined using GPUs and a ton of people who missed out on mining Bitcoin are willing to believe they'll get rich mining alt-coins.

Whenever it gets harder to mine a given coin using the current hardware, people with money will buy new hardware and sell the old hardware.  They'll either sell it to people wanting to mine an easier coin or they'll sell it to individuals wanting high end graphics cards for gaming (having been used for mining doesn't affect their performance for other things).

Where it does get a little more complicated is that some people who can't afford to mine Bitcoin mine alt-coins with the intention of trading them for Bitcoin, so Bitcoin taking a nosedive pricewise does affect alt-coins as well.


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## AnOminous (Nov 24, 2018)

I'm really glad to see the Chinese miners take it in the shorts.  Fuck those assholes.  They've been a cancer on the mining community since they arrived.  Hope they ended up owing the wrong people money and their organs get harvested.


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## MuuMuu Bunnylips (Nov 24, 2018)

That's like investing in Monopoly money and wondering why nobody will let you buy a car with it.


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## TowinKarz (Nov 24, 2018)

MuuMuu Bunnylips said:


> That's like investing in Monopoly money and wondering why nobody will let you buy a car with it.



Seriously, I still want to know, aside from BTC fans and people looking to fleece them, who even uses BTC like you're "supposed" to?    As currency?

All it seems to be from where I sit is virtual pyramid scheme that somehow still costs you real money at the end when it collapses.....


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## Splendid (Nov 24, 2018)

Cho Chan said:


> How do you even determine the worth of cryptocurrency?


The same way you determine the value of literally anything.


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## PoisonedBun (Nov 24, 2018)

Splendid Meat Sticks said:


> The same way you determine the value of literally anything.



Yeah, but the worth of currency fluctuates based on things like unemployment, people's spending habits, and the stability of the country right? What makes bitcoin's value go up and down when its basically funny money?


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## Splendid (Nov 24, 2018)

Scarcity.


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## TowinKarz (Nov 24, 2018)

Scarcity only has meaning when coupled with demand, there's only one OPL< but nobody wants him!  A hyuck!!!!

So, I'm in the same boat, wondering what's driving the demand except a large group of people trying to out-maneuver each other in the worlds biggest LARPing session for those who want to roleplay stockbrokers.


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## Splendid (Nov 25, 2018)

But there is a very real demand for people who are just using it as a currency to buy shit. People need to think of Bitcoin as less like a stock and more like a commodity. It actually has a use besides just investing.


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## joombo (Nov 27, 2018)

I thik crypto still will be n top in the next few years. Recently, there's been “stable coin invasion" in the crypto market. I read about new stable coins that have been announced in the past few months. Right now I'm interested in investing in MotoCoin. It offers an innovative proof-of-game scheme for mining to secure coin transactions.


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## Corbin Dallas Multipass (Nov 28, 2018)

I will watch laughing when crypto currency collapses overnight when someone finally realizes it's got less intrinsic worth than Dutch tulips.


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## Very Honest Content (Nov 29, 2018)

Splendid Meat Sticks said:


> But there is a very real demand for people who are just using it as a currency to buy shit. People need to think of Bitcoin as less like a stock and more like a commodity. It actually has a use besides just investing.



I look at this question's answer like this: bitcoin is the *people's* denomination of _trust_.

Your local fiat currency is the nation-you're-standing-in's denomination of trust.

Elemental gold is the universe's denomination of trust.

Three legs of a stool.

As for the thread OP, this is the speculative bubble of a speculative bubble and as such, represents the financial canary in the world economic coal mine.


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## 419 (Nov 29, 2018)

TowinKarz said:


> Scarcity only has meaning when coupled with demand, there's only one OPL< but nobody wants him!  A hyuck!!!!
> 
> So, I'm in the same boat, wondering what's driving the demand except a large group of people trying to out-maneuver each other in the worlds biggest LARPing session for those who want to roleplay stockbrokers.


it might partly be that but i'm personally not gonna reject that crypto can have its uses as an actual currency. at the moment though it just doesn't seem, idk, interesting(?) enough to suddenly favour any crypto over the money people already use in real life. still, bare props to the people using it as an actual commodity rather than just something they know dick-all about but still hang onto just so they can try bein some wannabe stockbroker.


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