# The Salon Reads: Book Sperging for the Fairer Sex



## StrawberryDouche (Jul 9, 2021)

Sure, there are other threads for books on the Farms, but why the hell would you ever venture out of The Salon? There could be men!

There's been a lot of lit sperging shitting up the fat lady threads, so put on your blue stockings and let's look down our noses at what others are reading.

Give your recs, your faves, your picks, your pans; organize book clubs and read alongs. What's the worst book you've ever read? Fiction, nonfiction, let's do it.

I guess I'll start



Spoiler: Good books you've likely never read but should.



_Spoon River Anthology_ by Edgar Lee Masters

_Compelled to Witness: Women's Memoirs of the French Revolution_ by Marilyn Yolam

_Letters From the Earth_ by Mark Twain

_Moses and Monotheism _by Sigmund Freud

_The Last Fine Time_ by Verlyn Klinkenborg

_Sexual Personae_  by Camille Paglia

_The Doors of Perception _by Aldous Huxley

_La Bas _by J. K. Huysmans

_The Hour of Our Death_ by Philippe Aries

_The Foxfire Series _by Eliot Wiggington and The Foxfire Fund

_Camera Lucida_ by Roland Barthes


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 9, 2021)

Death Grip said:


> More book sperging I know, but a book club would be most enticing.
> Rushdie's 'Midnight Children' and 'The Satanic Verses' are both well worth a read.
> And If 'Jonathan Strange and Mr Norell' were to your taste, I can't hesitate to recommend the short story selection set in the same world 'The Ladies of Grace Adieu'
> Back to topic, Amy is fat and I would not have sex with her.


I read this after Strange & Norell which I consider to be something close to a pop fiction masterpiece. I may have perhaps cared for it better had I read it first. I'm not much of a short story person because I like to linger in other worlds and ages and it ended up in a yard sale.

I have a first edition of _Satanic Verses_. Someone obtained it for me after it was released and bookstores were too afraid to carry it. It came from a hole in the wall vodou shop in New Orleans. I love that book.


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## FarmerKhourtney (Jul 9, 2021)

Love this thread! I’m always looking for new material. Currently reading a book about Osage Indians and the formation of the FBI


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## Death Grip (Jul 10, 2021)

I'm doing my sixth re-read of the Wheel of Time series. I love that series. 
Prior to that I read Confessions of a Sociopath, which was interesting and horrifying in equal measures.


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 10, 2021)

When not reading classified manuals for my job or books on molding parrot behavior because I should be at a point with my job in less than 6 months that I can reclaim my bird from his temporary caretaker and I know he’ll have behavioral issues , I have been reading the Watch series be Sergei Lukyanenko. Finished Night Watch last week. Now on Day Watch. Fun, mindless urban modern fantasy.

eta: Who’s the author of Confessions of a Sociopath? Sounds interesting!


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## In Memoriam (Jul 10, 2021)

Book club thread!!! Thank you Strorbry <3

let’s see, I love Gabriel Garcia Marquez, so cannot wait to dive in to some of the Rushdie recommendations. Favorite book of all time is probably Alice in Wonderland and Through the Looking Glass or The Chronicles of Narnia (the whole series).

currently I am reading The Doctrine and Ritual of High Magic by Eliphas Levi alongside the Bible (doesn’t sound interesting, I know) and The Cosmic Doctrine by Dion Fortune because Ive recently become increasingly interested in philosophy and the meaning of life. I’m also reading Plato’s Timaeus. This is all simultaneous and I’m going between them. Next I’m planning to tackle Carl Jung.

 But for book club, I would love to read something, fiction or non I don’t care, that we can read along together and really sink our teeth into. Book clubs have to be led, though, of course, so maybe we can take turns?

can we have a poll to vote on a book to read together?

do any of you read the blog Ecosophia? I found the author because of his last name being Greer (he was mentioned in the Russ thread as coming up sometimes on a Google, and feeling bad he got confused with the goblin) and got into his book club. It’s only once a month, though, and in between his writing can be very dry (lots of crap no one cares about interspersed with diamonds in the rough). He only does one chapter a month and I can’t stand the wait for the next installment. His comment section is also a gold mine, and frequently better than the blog itself.

i don’t know any people irl who like to read like I do. I’m very pleased to “meet” you all. I just had to go through and delete all my exclamation points. I also do technical writing for a living so, you know. Calm down.


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## Scolopendra Dramatica (Jul 10, 2021)

We're doing a book club now??? Let me know what we're reading and I'll grab a notebook. I haven't done this shit since school. 

I ain't got suggestions though unless you fancy diving into 2008 stock crisis or want to do Rowlings new murder book.


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## Free the Pedos (Jul 10, 2021)

I tried to read Cantor’s In the Wake of the Plague but it actually sucked ass. Going to do a retro read of Barbara Tuckman’s A Distant Mirror to satisfy my desire for the 14th century. Any read it before and want to chat about it?  I’d like to know how scholarship has moved on since she wrote it.


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## lightswitchdoll (Jul 10, 2021)

Thank you for the thread @StrawberryDouche! 

I seem to be doing that thing where I'm pretending my 'to read' list doesn't exist and I'm reading stuff I've read before. At least it's a good kind of procrastination.

So I'm reading The Room again. Unfortunately I think the farms has broken me - I keep thinking it's the kind of thing that goes through Russell Greer's head so I'm managing to ruin it for myself because I'm a dickhead 

I'm contemplating reading The Conspiracy Against the Human Race next. And I can't remember the worst book I've ever read, I just remember it being the book that cured me of my need to read to the end even if I hated what I was reading. I'll try to remember what it was called so you can all avoid it.


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## AbyssStarer (Jul 10, 2021)

I've been plucking at_ Great German Short Stories_, I got through the second one, _Flagman Thiel_, in one sitting and it made me  
'Bout to finish Murakami's _Hard Boiled Wonderland and the End of the World_, which drags on a bit at the end when it should have been amped up. Murakami can be really hit-or-miss largely depending on how many Murakami-isms are in a given book.

Next I was going to read The Divine Comedy starting with the inferno since that's the only one I got a hard copy of. I usually read two or three things at once so I have the 20th anniversary _Paradise Kiss_ manga omnibus to read too. I haven't read _Paradise Kiss_ before, but it's from the same great mangaka who made _Nana_ so I'm giving it a shot.


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## DoodleBerry (Jul 10, 2021)

I've been on a weird jag of reading re-imagined fairy tales/mythological tales after finding Christina Henry's "Alice". T Kingfisher's Raven and the Reindeer, the twisted "Food of the God's" by Cassandra Khaw (How could I pass on Robert Wong, Cannibal Chef?). 

"Memory Police" by Yoko Ogawa was more literary, and such a poignant metaphorical tale of Communism in the vein of Fahrenheit 451.   I also really got into "The Priory of the Orange Tree" by Samantha "Mime Order" Shannon. 

The last non-fiction book I read was "The Feather Thief" by Kirk Wallace Johnson which was so fascinating and well done, but with the most anti-climatic ending ever. 

Anyway, definitely interested to see what book might be picked for this!


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## Actually Christian Bale (Jul 10, 2021)

AbyssStarer said:


> I've been plucking at_ Great German Short Stories_, I got through the second one, _Flagman Thiel_, in one sitting and it made me
> 'Bout to finish Murakami's _Hard Boiled Wonderland and the End of the World_, which drags on a bit at the end when it should have been amped up. Murakami can be really hit-or-miss largely depending on how many Murakami-isms are in a given book.
> 
> Next I was going to read The Divine Comedy starting with the inferno since that's the only one I got a hard copy of. I usually read two or three things at once so I have the 20th anniversary _Paradise Kiss_ manga omnibus to read too. I haven't read _Paradise Kiss_ before, but it's from the same great mangaka who made _Nana_ so I'm giving it a shot.



God, I love Murakami, but Murakami in general is so hit-or-miss. 

I rate his books by how many weird sex scenes (bonus points if it's with underage girls) he builds in. At >5 I slowly start checking out mentally. Remind me to post my sliding Murakami scale from A* to _The Girl Was Really Underage And There Was A Lot Of Talk About Her Pubic Hair_ later


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 10, 2021)

DoodleBerry said:


> Fahrenheit 451


Ohhh, before I go on a books I've hated sperg, I want to put this here because it's the most cleverly designed book cover I've ever seen and the typeface is sublime.





I have a rule for fiction. If it's 300+ pages, I will give it 50 to grab me or I'm out. 

The worst book I ever read is going to cause pearls to be clutched, so I will preface with this: Terry Pratchett was one of the finer authorial wits of the late 20th century. Neil Gaiman is Neil Gaiman - not my bag but I really liked _American Gods_ and was glad to have read it.

_Good Omens_ was so atrocious it made me angry and I only finished it out of pure spite. I thought the first 100 pages were great! Witty dialogue, themes I find interesting, well paced- I was all in. Then, it turned into a morass of every unoriginal trope ever devised. The dialogue descended into sped level self published fanfic. It's as if they conspired to burn every syllable of good will they had earned, and with malice! The contrast in quality between the first third and the remainder was marked and shocking. It felt like a bait and switch betrayal. It now lives in the garage awaiting a future yard sale. I know this book is universally well regarded, and I swear I am not just being contrarian. I hated it and I didn't want to.

The worst edited nonfiction I ever read is a tight contest between two, but I will bitch about the mainstream, popular one. _The Cooking Gene_ by Michael Twitty. This just made me sad. The subject matter is both fascinating and culturally important - how the foodways of slaves endured in a foreign land throughout generations, how we find connection to our ancestors through food, and how it absorbed into the dominant culture. Great stuff! 

It.is.a.MESS. Structurally, narratively, grammatically; it's meandering, disjointed, and repetitive. It's as if there was no editor at all _because there wasn't._ What he did was, he gave each chapter to a friend to edit, and boy does it show. No idea how this got published by a major house other than he's black and was having a moment on Twitter.


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 10, 2021)

What's making me chortle is that I just bought Good Omens for my goblin. I should've hunted you down to steal it from your garage.


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## Actually Christian Bale (Jul 10, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> Ohhh, before I go on a books I've hated sperg, I want to put this here because it's the most cleverly designed book cover I've ever seen and the typeface is sublime.
> View attachment 2333876
> 
> I have a rule for fiction. If it's 300+ pages, I will give it 50 to grab me or I'm out.
> ...



I loved American Gods so much. Good Omens was definitely not on par with it, but I'm sort of amused you hated it so much! You're right in that it definitely got worse the more it dragged on. The epitome of "best laid plans".


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## krazy orange cat (Jul 10, 2021)

I am currently re-reading the Outlander series in anticipation of the next book being released before I die.  It's history mixed with fantasy and mystery.  Small and seemingly inconsequential things come back around full circle in later books.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 10, 2021)

krazy orange cat said:


> As for me, I am busy photographing my vintage cookbooks to share with the BP chat when the next book club convenes there.


I would like to know more about your collection.


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## krazy orange cat (Jul 10, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I would like to know more about your collection.


As the only one interested in old stuff, I have inherited all of the cookbooks that were passed along throughout the family.  I have multiple editions of the Better Homes and Gardens Cookbooks (the oldest printed in 1947, before they went binder style), some Betty Crocker cookbooks and one of some horrifying gelatin salads (jellied beef mold anyone?).   Then there are a bunch of random little cookbooks.  I really should go through them and make some sort of list of them all.

The prizes are a 1928 "New Cooking Suggestions" cookbook put out by Proctor and Gamble, and a booklet of wartime recipes to stretch rations along with a partial ration book from WWII.


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## eDove (Jul 10, 2021)

Don't even get me started. I'm anal as _fuck_ when it comes to literature. 

I've been dubbed "Trash Queen" because I hoard writing that's hilariously (or just erronously) bad. I love reading terrible stories and breaking down why they don't work. I'm a firm believer that you can learn from a lot from failure, just as much as from success. For example, a lot of amateur writers will try to emulate their favorite authors and make mistakes because they've never studied bad writing before or they've never had a "sense" for bad writing. 

I've been so maniacally obsessed with my own book that other stories just aren't interesting me, but I've been reading the work of Anna Mckittrick Ros—a lady who's work was so bad that both C.S. Lewis and Tolkein formed societies around making fun of it. I've also been reading Onision's garbage-ass books for the same reason. 

I'm planning on starting a book club where we exclusively read stuff that's so bad it's funny, whether it's some Wattpad story created by a thirteen-year-old girl or a New York Best Seller. I don't know where I'm gonna find a group of based shitlords to do it with, but it's a dream of mine. 

If anyone has a particularly bad story to show me, please send it my way. I am always growing my stash.


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## Ephemeris (Jul 10, 2021)

Okay I love  Ready Player One far more than I have any right to. It surprised me to hear there would be a sequel because I felt the first book wrapped with a finality that would make story-expansion an ambitious task, Still, I had planned to read the second until some reviewers I trust came back with the verdict that the second book is absolute garbage, and now RP Two has joined the RP One movie on the list of Cline-related media I will never consume at the risk of them completely ruining my fragile boner for the first book.

I just started Joe Abercrombie’s sci-fi fantasy series The Age of Madness. Hasn’t exactly sucked me in so far, but it’s too early to judge ether way.


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## Pizza Steve (Jul 11, 2021)

I was a much bigger reader when I was younger, but I've had a life long love for Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman.  I've been recently rereading Andrzej Sapkowski (the books are kinda dry in place and ho boy can you tell they're written by a man but the stories are good) and Gregory Maguire's reimangined Oz books. I'd love to find a female author who has much more meatier fantasy books. Unfortunately the best you get is Charmaine Harris and her ilk...


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 11, 2021)

Pizza Steve said:


> I was a much bigger reader when I was younger, but I've had a life long love for Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman.  I've been recently rereading Andrzej Sapkowski (the books are kinda dry in place and ho boy can you tell they're written by a man but the stories are good) and Gregory Maguire's reimangined Oz books. I'd love to find a female author who has much more meatier fantasy books. Unfortunately the best you get is Charmaine Harris and her ilk...


I’ve always liked Margaret Weis when it comes to high fantasy. She and Tracy Hickman make friggin’ magic. My personal favorite is the Deathgate Cycle. A relation of mine prefers the Darksword Trilogy, which I will acknowledge is also damned good.


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## GenociderSyo (Jul 11, 2021)

I'm more of a medical non-fiction reader. Read quite a few foster carer series, abnormal psychology and pretty much every damn book on medical disorders I can. 

Also have quite a few older medical texts and mortuary texts such as post mortem photography.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 11, 2021)

GenociderSyo said:


> I'm more of a medical non-fiction reader. Read quite a few foster carer series, abnormal psychology and pretty much every damn book on medical disorders I can.
> 
> Also have quite a few older medical texts and mortuary texts such as post mortem photography.


I'm a huge fan of PM photography. One of the books I covet but cannot afford is _Sleeping Beauty_ by Stanley Burns. The Burns Archive is a good resource, but I prefer The Thanatos Archive and am a lifetime member over there. He's doing great work. His book _Beyond the Dark Veil_ is *beautiful.*


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## GenociderSyo (Jul 11, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I'm a huge fan of PM photography. One of the books I covet but cannot afford is _Sleeping Beauty_ by Stanley Burns. The Burns Archive is a good resource, but I prefer The Thanatos Archive and am a lifetime member over there. He's doing great work. His book _Beyond the Dark Veil_ is *beautiful.*


Yes "Beyond the Dark veil" is one i have and what introduced me to it.


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## Miss Misery (Jul 11, 2021)

krazy orange cat said:


> As the only one interested in old stuff, I have inherited all of the cookbooks that were passed along throughout the family.  I have multiple editions of the Better Homes and Gardens Cookbooks (the oldest printed in 1947, before they went binder style), some Betty Crocker cookbooks and one of some horrifying gelatin salads (jellied beef mold anyone?).   Then there are a bunch of random little cookbooks.  I really should go through them and make some sort of list of them all.
> 
> The prizes are a 1928 "New Cooking Suggestions" cookbook put out by Proctor and Gamble, and a booklet of wartime recipes to stretch rations along with a partial ration book from WWII.


Oh man, I have got to get my vintage cookbooks out of storage so we can share and compare. 

I also collect novelty cookbooks like Len Deighton's Action Cook Book and No Man Knows My Pastries: The Secret (Not Sacred) Recipes of Sister Enid Christensen, a Mormon themed cookbook written by a drag queen.

Speaking of Mormons, the most recent book I read was Dream House on Golan Drive, by David G. Pace. It was pretty good, especially for Mormon fiction, but Brady Udall is better.

Before that I read Foster and Laurie, which made me cry like a little bitch through the whole thing. (This is an excellent article about what happened to NYPD officers Greg Foster and Rocco Laurie.)

I think I'm going to read The Disaster Artist next because my bf keeps telling me I need to.


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## Death Grip (Jul 11, 2021)

Diet Coke 4 Life said:


> When not reading classified manuals for my job or books on molding parrot behavior because I should be at a point with my job in less than 6 months that I can reclaim my bird from his temporary caretaker and I know he’ll have behavioral issues , I have been reading the Watch series be Sergei Lukyanenko. Finished Night Watch last week. Now on Day Watch. Fun, mindless urban modern fantasy.
> 
> eta: Who’s the author of Confessions of a Sociopath? Sounds interesting!


Love the Day Watch/Night Watch series, if you have not seen the original Russian films, they are well worth watching though not entirely accurate to the books.
M E Thomas is the Author of Confessions.


Actually Christian Bale said:


> God, I love Murakami, but Murakami in general is so hit-or-miss.
> 
> I rate his books by how many weird sex scenes (bonus points if it's with underage girls) he builds in. At >5 I slowly start checking out mentally. Remind me to post my sliding Murakami scale from A* to _The Girl Was Really Underage And There Was A Lot Of Talk About Her Pubic Hair_ later


Norwegian Wood can't be your go to favourite then I am guessing?
In the Miso Soup is by another Japanese author whose surname is Murakami, first name Ryu. Well worth a read.


krazy orange cat said:


> I am currently re-reading the Outlander series in anticipation of the next book being released before I die.  It's history mixed with fantasy and mystery.  Small and seemingly inconsequential things come back around full circle in later books.


Have watched the series but not yet plucked up the courage to read the books, I've read stuff that suggests the author can be very inconsistent and also has a hate boner for a lot of her characters.


GenociderSyo said:


> I'm more of a medical non-fiction reader. Read quite a few foster carer series, abnormal psychology and pretty much every damn book on medical disorders I can.
> 
> Also have quite a few older medical texts and mortuary texts such as post mortem photography.


I can highly recommend this book which takes a really good look at how modern technology will give us a lot more insight into the physiology of mental disorders. 
The Disordered Mind by Eric R. Kandel​Edit typo


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 11, 2021)

For insight into the future of Omar Ramurderdan, see ‘Kids Who Kill’ by Charles Patrick Ewing. It’s a quick read not for simplicity, but due to being utterly fascinating.


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## krazy orange cat (Jul 11, 2021)

Death Grip said:


> Have watched the series but not yet plucked up the courage to read the books, I've read stuff that suggests the author can be very inconsistent and also has a hate boner for a lot of her characters.


There are definitely characters that Claire hates and much of the story is told from her point of view.  I do dislike the shifting between 1st and 3rd person narrator that starts in the third (I think) book, and that narration shift is where I think the inconsistency lies.  The point of view starts to blur.  I still enjoy the books though, but the last one was published in 2014 and she hasn't finished writing the next one so you almost have to re-read the previous books to refresh yourself for the new ones.


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## Rasputin's Side Piece (Jul 11, 2021)

I am no scholar, but I do love Russian literature.  I am currently reading an anthology : _Subtly Worded_ by Teffi, a popular Russian turn-of-the-century (19th to 20th) author.

 I had never heard of her before, but I am enjoying her stories.

eta: being a fan of short stories due to attention-span issues, I have been reading John O'Hara and William Trevor. 

Of course, my all-time favorite short-story writers are basic: Chekhov and de Maupassant.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 11, 2021)

Rasputin's Side Piece said:


> I am no scholar, but I do love Russian literature.  I am currently reading an anthology : _Subtly Worded_ by Teffi, a popular Russian turn-of-the-century (19th to 20th) author.


I've not heard of that before, and I will look into it.

_Dead Souls_ by Nikolai Gogol is a very interesting read from the mid 19th century. It's peppered with dark Russian humor and has a surreal tone. It's an enlightening glimpse into Russian culture, and the social, political, and class structure of that time in much the same way Dickens is informative about those subjects in Victorian England. (btw, I think Dickens was a terrible writer in the technical sense and needed waaaay better editors.)

_The Brothers Karamazov_ is one of my favorite works of literature, Russian or otherwise, and again, I implore anyone to read The Master and Margarita, the Burgin and O' Connor translation.


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## Thomas Eugene Paris (Jul 11, 2021)

Thanks for making this, Strobs! Looking at your list, I'm wondering if you've ever read any Borges. It seems like you might enjoy his work. I recommend _Labyrinths_, although his short stories are amazing, as well. I also saw you mention _The Master and Margarita_, and I wondered if you like Chekhov at all. He's one of my favorites, and I recommend all of his stuff to everyone.

I'm currently working my way through Saul Friedlander's _Nazi Germany and the Jews_, which is a two volume history of the Nazi regime. It's (obviously) really heavy and slow going, but it's important and very well written.

I try to keep at least one fiction and one nonfiction book going at a time, but lately all of the fiction I've tried to get into has just not done it for me. I went to the library yesterday and got some books that have been lingering on my To Be Read list for awhile; hopefully one of them gets me out of my slump.



StrawberryDouche said:


> I've not heard of that before, and I will look into it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Love Gogol. Have you read _The Nose_? 

If we're talking lesser known Russians,I have two recommendations: _A Double Life_, by Karolina Pavlova, and _Oblomov_ by Ivan Goncharov. I haven't read anything quite like A Double Life; I think it belongs alongside Yevgeny Onegin as a glimpse into a particular sunset of Russian society in the mid-19th century.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 12, 2021)

Thomas Eugene Paris said:


> Thanks for making this, Strobs! Looking at your list, I'm wondering if you've ever read any Borges. It seems like you might enjoy his work. I recommend _Labyrinths_, although his short stories are amazing, as well. I also saw you mention _The Master and Margarita_, and I wondered if you like Chekhov at all. He's one of my favorites, and I recommend all of his stuff to everyone.
> 
> I'm currently working my way through Saul Friedlander's _Nazi Germany and the Jews_, which is a two volume history of the Nazi regime. It's (obviously) really heavy and slow going, but it's important and very well written.
> 
> ...


I've only ever read Borges' poetry but none of his novels. I haven't read as much Chekhov as I should, but I love every word I have read.

I would like to talk about poetry and the ones I love best, but those I connect with are so deeply personal and intimate, I almost feel like it would be revealing to the point of self doxing. Poetry is your deepest secrets, the sorrows and longings and joys between the shadow and the soul. There is a person in this world with whom I speak of poetry often - one who is so close, that his eyes close as I fall asleep.

Speaking of poetry,_ Break, Blow, Burn: Camille Paglia Reads Forty-three of the World's Best Poems _is outstanding and a lively, engaging read. Highly recommend.

It is my habit to have many books cooking at once.  Then, my mind gets overly subdivided and I get irritated with myself and will focus on two until they're completed. Currently, I am finishing up the Lewis trilogy and a book on the death and mourning practices of a particular ethnic group.

Oh, lol. And Pepys' unabridged diary. I read it when I go places I need to wait, and I hope to get through it before I die.


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## Barbarella (Jul 12, 2021)

When Richard Brautigan was brought up, I knew this was the thread for me.  Read all his books.  Thank God, a thread that isn’t going to talk about Steven King. (I hope). Or anything Harry Potter.

Suggestions: I’ll have to go though some notes. I like memoir, so I did find Anne Lamott a wonderful writer although her having taken a religious tone as she aged turned me off a bit but maybe not all feel that way.

Oh, and @krazy orange cat, I have 1940s books too, although mine are decorating. I may have a few cooking too but I love the early decor. The books are amazing, encyclopedia of decorating I think, 3 hole punched.

I have an entire library in my home-organized by color. Take that!  I can find anything I need, I know colors but not names.


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## Death Grip (Jul 12, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I've only ever read Borges' poetry but none of his novels. I haven't read as much Chekhov as I should, but I love every word I have read.
> 
> I would like to talk about poetry and the ones I love best, but those I connect with are so deeply personal and intimate, I almost feel like it would be revealing to the point of self doxing. Poetry is your deepest secrets, the sorrows and longings and joys between the shadow and the soul. There is a person in this world with whom I speak of poetry often - one who is so close, that his eyes close as I fall asleep.
> 
> ...


Pepys Diary (not sure if abridged or unabridged) was something I used to read a lot as a child. 
Have not picked it up since I've been a grown up though. 
The recording of deaths used to fascinate me and also his description of being there when the great fire of London happened. 

Could I propose we give The Secret History by Donna Tartt a go? 
Sounds like the kind of book we would all enjoy.


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## Thomas Eugene Paris (Jul 12, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I've only ever read Borges' poetry but none of his novels. I haven't read as much Chekhov as I should, but I love every word I have read.
> 
> I would like to talk about poetry and the ones I love best, but those I connect with are so deeply personal and intimate, I almost feel like it would be revealing to the point of self doxing. Poetry is your deepest secrets, the sorrows and longings and joys between the shadow and the soul. There is a person in this world with whom I speak of poetry often - one who is so close, that his eyes close as I fall asleep.
> 
> ...


You put this so beautifully. Admittedly, I have not read much of Borges's poetry. Perhaps I should start. I didn't remember _A Double Life_ being quite so overtly poetic; I remember it more as a novel in verse, like _Onegin_. 

Pepys' diary is a great "read before I die" book. Boswell's _Life of Samuel Johnson_ would be good for this, too.


Death Grip said:


> Pepys Diary (not sure if abridged or unabridged) was something I used to read a lot as a child.
> Have not picked it up since I've been a grown up though.
> The recording of deaths used to fascinate me and also his description of being there when the great fire of London happened.
> 
> ...


I'm down!

So happy to have this thread! What a great idea, Strobry!


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## Rasputin's Side Piece (Jul 12, 2021)

Yes, Strawbs, I love_ Dead Souls.  _I think perhaps my favorites would be_ Crime and Punishment_ and _The_ _Idiot._  And the short story "The Overcoat"  sticks with me for all time. I know I am mixing authors but I get confused.

I have read _The Master and Margarita.   _I did like it, but I fear I am not well-informed enough on Russian politics/history to full appreciate it.

I haven't been so anxious to read any newer books.  

Five years ago I was forced to sell my home and downsize dramatically.  I was forced to give up all my books, and it was the most wrenching thing about moving.  

I have hundreds of books on Kindle, but we all know it just isn't the same.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 12, 2021)

Barbarella said:


> When Richard Brautigan was brought up, I knew this was the thread for me. Read all his books.


I want to know your opinion of _In Watermelon Sugar._


Death Grip said:


> The recording of deaths used to fascinate me and also his description of being there when the great fire of London happened.


Yes! Also fascinating to me is the daily minutia of ordinary people from ages past. Pepys was far from ordinary, but his daily existence was not.

_A Journal of the Plague Year_ by Defoe gives a similar snapshot. Thought for a century to be nonfiction, it is now classified as historical fiction. In there he records the weekly bills of mortality, precautions people took, the panic, superstition, and snake oil, the fire. It's believed he used his uncle's diary as his primary (possibly pilfered) source. Defoe was a really interesting guy.


Rasputin's Side Piece said:


> Five years ago I was forced to sell my home and downsize dramatically. I was forced to give up all my books, and it was the most wrenching thing about moving.
> 
> I have hundreds of books on Kindle, but we all know it just isn't the same.


That's so heartbreaking. Many years ago when I was younger and broke, I was forced to sell my books just to eat that week. It still pains me.  In the box was a signed copy of _The Vampire Lestat _I had stood in line for many hours on a hot summer night to obtain. 

I use my e-reader exclusively for works in the public domain. I have thousands of things on it from the late medieval age on - all of it nonfiction. That's where Pepys and his 2300 page unabridged diary lives - on a device he could never have possibly conceived. Everything else is a hardcopy, and with rare exceptions, I only buy used books.


----------



## Rasputin's Side Piece (Jul 12, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I use my e-reader exclusively for works in the public domain. I have thousands of things on it from the late medieval age on - all of it nonfiction. That's where Pepys and his 2300 page unabridged diary lives - on a device he could never have possibly conceived. Everything else is a hardcopy, and with rare exceptions, I only buy used books.


Yes!  When I discovered the Gutenberg Project, I was in heaven.  So many treasures for free!

Just an aside:  Are you familiar with David Graham Phillips?  _Susan Phillips: Her Fall and Rise _is one of my favorite bodice-rippers from the early 1900's. I discovered it on the Gutenberg website.

Man, I suppose we could all go on forever about the pleasures of books _*(*_*s*_*o I won't*)_.  I pity people who don't enjoy reading.

ETA: Will download Pepys immediately.


----------



## Death Grip (Jul 12, 2021)

I have also suffered the tragic loss of a book collection. The person responsible has my deepest loathing and will do so for as long as I draw breathe.


----------



## Blop (Jul 12, 2021)

My go-to book for re-reading a million times is Slammerkin by Emma Donoghue. 18th century London prostitutes! Sex! Fashion! Murder! love this book so freaking much.

Slammerkin 

The same author wrote Room, which was mentioned above. Room is a huge departure from her normal historical fiction.


----------



## sperginity (Jul 13, 2021)

I am pretty sure I am less serious of a reader than most of you, I read non-fiction for most of my life. Lots of my shelves have graphic novels, too.

Reading right now:
sandman series (gaiman) I'm on book 7 or 8 can't remember, awesome so far
mysterious stranger (twain), great so far

attempting to read:
the message (plain english version of the bible)-could never finish the regular bible so I'm trying this one. I'm bored as shit so far though. I knew more about the basic story of the bible than I thought I did! I must have absorbed it through osmosis. 

some book about sensory processing disorders, its fucking boring as shit and the author never gets to the point. 



Spoiler: extended cut of my hatred for the book 



The first entire chapter is about how her kid was universally seen as being a shitty disobedient child, but _really_ his sensory problems were preventing him from obeying any adult asking him to do anything. See how I summed that up in one paragraph? The author of the book could have done that, too, and then given the reader the information for which they bought the book. She is really deceptive about making it seem like she is going to tell you about the disorders and how they work but veers into endless personal anecdotes.  fuck her.



adventures of huckleberry finn- I think I'm not going to pick this back up, got through most of it but I'm done.

Letters from the earth- literally bought this after seeing strawberry douche recommend it, funny so far. like george carlin for the 1800s.

recently finished:
In order to live (yeonmi park, its nonfiction about escaping north korea)- very good book. It is about a woman whose sister escaped and disappeared, so she escaped NK with her mom into china. The sex selective abortions in china during the one child policy has created a society short on women, and that seems to be the only real reason why north koreans were able to escape via china in appreciable numbers during the famine in NK. Couldn't stop reading it.

Books I read over and over:
Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? Phillip K. Dick- blade runner is based off of this, but they took the least interesting part of the story for the movie and left the most thought provoking stuff in the book. This is the best book of his I have read, though I still have a few books of his left to read.

1984- I'm a fag for science fiction because of this book

book of the unnamed midwife- story about a virus wiping out 95% of men and 99% of women, pregnant women have a mortality rate that is even closer to 100%. A nurse who survives the virus pretends to be a man to try and distribute birth control to the other women she encounters. A good story, you can tell the author is fat because of the care she puts into describing food and drink. excellent story telling, the characters feel real and the thought experiment is well conducted. This book has a sequel that I have never read because it features a FTM troon as the main character in a post apocalyptic world, the premise that people would bother with identifying as different genders in such a world is too insulting for me to sit through. 

Junji Ito- basically anything by him. Some of it is fucking silly, some of it is genuinely disturbing, I enjoy either type of story, the art is excellent too of course. Smashed and Uzumaki are the best disturbing ones, and dissolving classroom is hilarious. Gyo is unintentionally funny because the premise is a plague of machines powered by gases from corpses, so there are spider robots with tubes shoved up the asses of random dead animals & people overtaking earth. The other plotline is a totally dysfunctional relationship between two equally horrible people, so you don't really give a shit about any of the bad things happening to them. Highly recommend.

worst books I have read:

dietland- themes of this book are fat positivity and radical feminism. I wanted to see where the author was going with the story so I finished this. main character is a fat woman who has always been fat and puts her life on hold until she loses weight, which she never does. A mysterious new friend challenges her to try living life now despite being fat and seeing where it goes. A weird part of the story is that the mysterious friend instructs the main character to stop taking her psychiatric medication as a part of the experiment. The drug is lazily named "dabsitaf", or "fatisbad" spelled backwards. the main character suffers significant withdrawal symptoms for the next couple of chapters as an annoying interjection into whatever else is happening, and at no point does she ask a doctor if this is kosher. it wants to be a woman's version of fight club so badly, but the message is that you can't lose weight and shouldn't try (and also don't take medication for your mental illness) instead of something genuinely transcendent or counter cultural. 

diary by chuck palahnuik. He is the dude that wrote fight club. I have read more than one of his books. He suffers from a problem where he self inserts as the narrator and honestly it isn't that bad in some books (survivor is probably the best one, I could read that again, other people seem to like choke more), but in Diary he challenges himself with a female main character, and its just fucking appalling. He throws in stuff about thinking she is fat every so often and that's about all he can muster to try and portray a female character's mental state, the rest is the same old shit as every other book he had written with a male protagonist. I know dudes can do better because stephen king nailed it a couple times like with delores claiborne. I haven't read any of the guys newer work, maybe he sucks less now? Not betting on it.


Death Grip said:


> I have also suffered the tragic loss of a book collection. The person responsible has my deepest loathing and will do so for as long as I draw breathe.


I give away about half the books I ever buy. I buy used a lot too though, so maybe I have a different perception of the scarcity of any specific book.


----------



## AMHOLIO (Jul 13, 2021)

I'm extremely behind on books but I'm taling all these down for later since most sound like a great time from the way you guys describe them.  Every YA book as a teen made me wish for a plague of locus on the writer, glad to see a woman's circle here on the farms who isn't stuck only reading YA novels until hell freezes (why do some of us get that way?  ).  Godspeed.


----------



## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 13, 2021)

@sperginity If you appreciate graphic novels, please, oh please, do ensure that you read the complete collection of Watchmen. There's reasons I loathe the movie, and the comic is a compilation of said reasons.


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## Fareal (Jul 13, 2021)

notes on previous comments:

Ryu Murakami also wrote the novel Audition, which became the legendary film. I love the film but the book is substantially better. Absolutely do read it if you think it might be up your alley. It is a surprisingly thoughtful meditation on loneliness and why we ignore red flags in relationships. 

Pretty much everyone seems to enjoy Donna Tartt’s The Secret History, at least the first time. And it’s back in fashion again. #darkacademia

If you were interested in the premise of Never Let Me Go, but the schmaltz overwhelmed you, Spares by Michael Marshall Smith covers much the same territory but at a much more enjoyable clip.

Dostoyevsky’s The Gambler is the greatest, most honest book about compulsive gambling ever written. 

If you enjoy Gabriel Garcia Marquez, try Mario Vargas Llosa‘s The War At The End Of The World. I enjoy all his work but that one is his modern historical novel with magical realism elements.

People think Margaret Atwood started and ended with The Handmaid’s Tale, but early Atwood is sly and funny. Try The Robber Bride and The Edible Woman. Plus, the savagely underrated Alias Grace.


----------



## Bibbity Bobbity (Jul 13, 2021)

I like non-fiction better than fiction, because life is so very, very strange. Dreamland by Sam Quinones is one book I love.

But as far as fiction goes, I love short stories because you have to pack all the elements in a short time. John Updike's The Music School and the Maples stories are fantastic. Also Joyce Carol Oates' Marriage and Infidelities. I love Margaret Atwood's short stories as well as Cats Eye. Nathan Englander, Julie Orringer come to mind. Ted Chiang's novellas, especially Story of Your Life.


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## Fareal (Jul 14, 2021)

Re short stories: this one is broadly relevant to our Salon interests






						In the Ruins — Greg Egan
					

In the Ruins by Greg Egan




					www.gregegan.net


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## Death Grip (Jul 15, 2021)

Fareal said:


> notes on previous comments:
> 
> Ryu Murakami also wrote the novel Audition, which became the legendary film. I love the film but the book is substantially better. Absolutely do read it if you think it might be up your alley. It is a surprisingly thoughtful meditation on loneliness and why we ignore red flags in relationships.
> 
> ...


I read Never Let Me Go and even thinking about the book now makes me shivery. One of the darkest books I have ever read I think. 
Will go and buy The Audition now but not sure when I will get to fit it in, life is so busy right now. 
Never managed to get into Atwoods earlier stuff apart from Bodily Harm. But I have read the MaddAdam series at least three times and also The Blind Assasin, tried a re-read didn't enjoy it so much the second time. 
No fellow Wheel of Time freaks on this thread? 
I've never met anyone else in real life who has read it which makes me sad because Robert Jordan and then Brandon Sanderson, after Jordans death, created a world of intrigue and depth that I will continue to re-read for the rest of my life.


----------



## Rasputin's Side Piece (Jul 15, 2021)

A lot of the stuff referenced has escaped my notice...I think we are all very particular about how we spend our precious reading time, and while a lot of it sounds so good...

I will  name only  one  two more of my favorites, just to see if I am alone here:

P.G. Wodehouse and Somerset Maugham.


----------



## StrawberryDouche (Jul 15, 2021)

Rasputin's Side Piece said:


> P.G. Wodehouse


Oh my lord, I love the Jeeves and Wooster books.


----------



## Death Grip (Jul 15, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> Oh my lord, I love the Jeeves and Wooster books.


Has been on my list of must read those before I die, for a looooong time...


----------



## Fareal (Jul 16, 2021)

Death Grip said:


> I read Never Let Me Go and even thinking about the book now makes me shivery. One of the darkest books I have ever read I think.
> Will go and buy The Audition now but not sure when I will get to fit it in, life is so busy right now.
> Never managed to get into Atwoods earlier stuff apart from Bodily Harm. But I have read the MaddAdam series at least three times and also The Blind Assasin, tried a re-read didn't enjoy it so much the second time.
> No fellow Wheel of Time freaks on this thread?
> I've never met anyone else in real life who has read it which makes me sad because Robert Jordan and then Brandon Sanderson, after Jordans death, created a world of intrigue and depth that I will continue to re-read for the rest of my life.


I love and cherish The Blind Assassin, although hands down Cat’s Eye is a better book. Iris is a really morally grey character and that becomes much more apparent on a third and later reading. Every time she has to make a choice, she always chooses whatever makes her path easiest, regardless of how shit that is for other people, and she is very gifted in justifying herself to herself. She doesn’t actually have much capacity to love other people. 

The Testaments unaccountably left me in floods of tears. It’s a very different book to The Handmaid’s Tale. Not so airless. I think it hits different because I‘m older now than when I first read Handmaid and different aspects of the women’s predicament feel nearer the surface. When I was young, the worst thing imaginable was that June was kept as a rape slave. Now the thing that seems worst is that they stole her child and June doesn’t know what happened to her.

My mum is mid-Wheel of Time. I have vacillated about it for a long time but I think I will do the series once she finishes.


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## Death Grip (Jul 16, 2021)

Fareal said:


> I love and cherish The Blind Assassin, although hands down Cat’s Eye is a better book. Iris is a really morally grey character and that becomes much more apparent on a third and later reading. Every time she has to make a choice, she always chooses whatever makes her path easiest, regardless of how shit that is for other people, and she is very gifted in justifying herself to herself. She doesn’t actually have much capacity to love other people.
> 
> The Testaments unaccountably left me in floods of tears. It’s a very different book to The Handmaid’s Tale. Not so airless. I think it hits different because I‘m older now than when I first read Handmaid and different aspects of the women’s predicament feel nearer the surface. When I was young, the worst thing imaginable was that June was kept as a rape slave. Now the thing that seems worst is that they stole her child and June doesn’t know what happened to her.
> 
> My mum is mid-Wheel of Time. I have vacillated about it for a long time but I think I will do the series once she finishes.


The loss of one's children is something that women will never be able to recover from. 
In the Series, I totally understand June not leaving Gilead. I think the book version makes that decision way too easy for June.


----------



## Coelacanth (Jul 16, 2021)

I was a book nerd back as a teen and spent most of my time devouring as many books as possible - but nowadays I don't really read books partially because a lot of things I liked as a teen don't hold up as an adult, and partially because Horror is pozzed by Social Justice and Stephen King won't fuck off (Joe Hill is decent enough though he can stay).

If manga's going to be allowed in the book club then I'm still an active reader. Of course Junji Ito's been brought up but as much as I like him he's basically like weed - the gateway drug to more heavy-handed weird shit that only Japan and Italy are capable of. I finished rereading Franken Fran and it's still as fucked up as I remember it being but at the same time seeing some people get what's coming to them is pretty satisfying too.


----------



## Fareal (Jul 16, 2021)

@Death Grip I think we all believe in that June’s situation, we would refuse to leave without Hannah. I suspect Atwood’s characterisation that actually, many women in extreme circumstances saved themselves and/or children they still had rather than died trying to save children lost to them is substantially more historically accurate. I think this is why it knifes us; it cuts through as a little too real. But my own reading is that June refers to Hannah and her plight so rarely in the text because it’s almost too bad to think about, if that makes sense? She can think about Luke, and the likelihood he’s dead, and Moira, but she can hardly even mention Hannah. She doesn‘t even name her in the text.

I’m broadly familiar with the plot lines of the series, and I do have an uncomfortable feeling that TV!June does things that book!June didn’t and wouldn’t because… in 2021, we expect our female leads to be boss bitches. We expect Katniss and Black Widow and suchlike and not leads like book!June, who survive by any means necessary, including those that are inglorious and morally grey. And that dilutes the sharpest point of the text, which is that when future historians in the epilogue drily comment on June’s likely survival, they erase the horror and loss that June has to go through to just survive Gilead.

The point of the epilogue is that we do that to past generations all the time. Like, we read books that talk in dry scholarly terms about mothers who survived Auschwitz when their children didn’t, or the Holodomor, or the Great Famine in China, or the capture of Berlin, but we have the privilege of making dry scholarship out of life shattering traumas. The whole point of the epilogue is that by the time the story of you and your peers’ desperate survival is something for scholarly discussion, your human suffering has kind of been discarded as not the important data. Pieixoto is fixated on which of Gilead’s “Fred’s” is keeping June as a slave. We don’t give a fuck, because to us this is June’s story but to him, history is a story about leaders and not of anonymous rape slaves. It’s a massively audacious reframing of the whole novel at the end.


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## Itspinklava (Jul 16, 2021)

Thank you, thank you, thank YOU @StrawberryDouche for this thread! All of my favorite cows have been so fucking depressing lately, it’s been hard to want to bother keeping up with them lately.

My favorite pick-me-up book that I reserve for the most depressing funks in my life is A Confederacy Of Dunces by John Kennedy Toole. It’s one of the few books that has ever made me laugh out loud. Every character is great.

Another book that makes me laugh is the Re/Search anthology called Pranks!, specifically the chapter on Boyd Rice. His stint working for Taco Bell will never not be funny to me.

If you like science fiction and being immersed in other worlds, I can’t recommend Jack Vance’s The Eyes Of The Overworld enough. It’s set in the future when the sun is almost burned out, and the hero Cugel is sent on a quest by a magician to find a violet glass eye to match one the magician already has.

@Death Grip A Secret History has been on my to-read list for awhile! I’d be down to read that one.


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## Fareal (Jul 16, 2021)

So, Jack Womack’s Random Acts of Senseless Violence is pretty much one of the only books ever where a guy writer produced a believable teenage girl protagonist, and it’s also kind of a masterpiece despite no one having read it, so think about reading it.

If you like more teenage violence, Wonderful Wonderful Times by Elfriede Jelinek is amazing. Jelinek can be a tough read, but this is a fantastic if unflinching book.


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## Death Grip (Jul 17, 2021)

Itspinklava said:


> Thank you, thank you, thank YOU @StrawberryDouche for this thread! All of my favorite cows have been so fucking depressing lately, it’s been hard to want to bother keeping up with them lately.
> 
> My favorite pick-me-up book that I reserve for the most depressing funks in my life is A Confederacy Of Dunces by John Kennedy Toole. It’s one of the few books that has ever made me laugh out loud. Every character is great.
> 
> ...


Another Laugh Out Loud author is Christopher Moore. Lamb-The Gospel According to Biff, Jesus Christ's Childhood Friend made me laugh heartily in the middle of a crowded cafe. His other books are good too.


Itspinklava said:


> Thank you, thank you, thank YOU @StrawberryDouche for this thread! All of my favorite cows have been so fucking depressing lately, it’s been hard to want to bother keeping up with them lately.
> 
> My favorite pick-me-up book that I reserve for the most depressing funks in my life is A Confederacy Of Dunces by John Kennedy Toole. It’s one of the few books that has ever made me laugh out loud. Every character is great.
> 
> ...


Another fantastic Sci-fi series is the Culture Books by Iain M Banks, truly fascinating stuff, not that the whole series is a good read, but if I had to pick one it would be Player of Games. My brain is struggling to remember other titles but they are well worth a read and each one is it's own story so there's no commitment to the whole series.


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 17, 2021)

Sci-fi? Did someone mention sci-fi? Pardon me whilst I curl up with all things Issac Asimov (but most especially the Foundation series, which yanked me back into reading after a long self-imposed drought with Foundation and Empire and the most unpredictable ending ever thanks to a solitary character). Seriously, if reading seems dull because all fiction is starting to seem repetitive and predictable, read the Foundation series. I will get off my ‘whore for Asimov’ box now.


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## knightlautrec (Jul 19, 2021)

sperginity said:


> diary by chuck palahnuik. He is the dude that wrote fight club. I have read more than one of his books. He suffers from a problem where he self inserts as the narrator and honestly it isn't that bad in some books (survivor is probably the best one, I could read that again, other people seem to like choke more), but in Diary he challenges himself with a female main character, and its just fucking appalling. He throws in stuff about thinking she is fat every so often and that's about all he can muster to try and portray a female character's mental state, the rest is the same old shit as every other book he had written with a male protagonist. I know dudes can do better because stephen king nailed it a couple times like with delores claiborne. I haven't read any of the guys newer work, maybe he sucks less now? Not betting on it.



The only time he's kinda got women was in his anthology Haunted though unintentionally. There's a story from this aggressive 2nd wave feminist about how she was all female rape support group and a tranny joins them - which ticks off the women in the group because, surprise, the people who raped them were men and no they don't want to share a counsel group with a dude in a dress who has a dick.

It should be noted that clearly Chuck hasn't met many trannies because the troon is framed as being soft, having a pretty voice and being more outwardly feminine than those rough hewn rape victims (damn rape victims not doing performative femininity and dressing nice for a counselling session!) but those of us who have met troons in the wild know this is clear wank fantasy.

At any rate, the women in the group don't believe then tranny's story that he was raped by his boss and get aggressively more angry that he's there to the point they assault the poor troon and beat him up. Its supposed to be a 'Oh no women are just as shitty as men' moment but it kinda falls flat when I kinda understand why a rape victim would get irrationally angry with a dude in a dress trying to elbow his way into meeting with other women in a belly shirt and hotpants showing off a bunch of cleavage.

But yeah. Palahnuik is gay though and I'm gonna say his lack of attraction to women kinda colours his view of then and understanding them. They're not well written.


Anyway -  currently I'm re-reading Fear Street with the original covers cuz I raided my parents house for them. The Netflix show re-sparked my love of them despite the fact that Part Two of the Netflix show was the only good part. First one and third part had too many lesbos. I'm just not into it. I don't really give a shit about girls kissing, sorry. Especially when it's two straight actors who clearly have zero chemistry and zero backstory for why they 'love' each other.


----------



## deadeggbeard (Jul 21, 2021)

knightlautrec said:


> At any rate, the women in the group don't believe then tranny's story that he was raped by his boss and get aggressively more angry that he's there to the point they assault the poor troon and beat him up. Its supposed to be a 'Oh no women are just as shitty as men' moment but it kinda falls flat when I kinda understand why a rape victim would get irrationally angry with a dude in a dress trying to elbow his way into meeting with other women in a belly shirt and hotpants showing off a bunch of cleavage.



When I first read that I thought the insinuation was that it wasn't a troon after all, just a really obnoxious woman? But it was a long time ago.

Either way, I like some of Chuck's books but he really really sucks at writing women.

Right now I am re-reading The Secret History for the Nth time and dining out on what a terrible effing person Richard Papen is.


----------



## knightlautrec (Jul 21, 2021)

vageen haver said:


> When I first read that I thought the insinuation was that it wasn't a troon after all, just a really obnoxious woman? But it was a long time ago.
> 
> Either way, I like some of Chuck's books but he really really sucks at writing women.
> 
> Right now I am re-reading The Secret History for the Nth time and dining out on what a terrible effing person Richard Papen is.


Oh shit you might be right. Because same - it's been ten years if not longer since I read Haunted. And yeah - you might be right that she might have been an actual woman but didn't say one way or the other. 

And yeah, I agree. I like the visceral way he writes most of the time. But he really is male focused. Clive Barker is another who is very visceral (and oddly gay as well) but writes women decently with some depth. 

That reminds me. Clive Barker doesn't get enough recognition - I think King has overshadowed him which is a shame because Barker has some truly gut wrenching stories. I still get creeped out by his short story about the weird village that moulds into a giant man gundam thing. It's very unsettling the description.


----------



## Thomas Eugene Paris (Jul 21, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I use my e-reader exclusively for works in the public domain. I have thousands of things on it from the late medieval age on - all of it nonfiction. That's where Pepys and his 2300 page unabridged diary lives - on a device he could never have possibly conceived. Everything else is a hardcopy, and with rare exceptions, I only buy used books.


As an avid used book shopper (I don't even remember the last time I bought a new book), I feel compelled to recommend Alibris, should you not be aware of it already. Their prices and selection are great; almost all of my books come from there. It's nice to support local shops even from afar. 

For me, nothing will ever compare to the now defunct used bookstore that I loved to browse when I was a kid. They had a little bit of everything, with stacks and stacks and stacks of books, all in no apparent order. The place was a total firetrap, but the owner could dive into the stacks and emerge with a copy of anything you wanted. One time, I picked up a 25 cent paperback copy of _Utilitarianism_ by J.S. Mill. When I got home, I was shocked to find that my dad had written his name and childhood address on the flyleaf. He died a few years ago and I wish I still had that book.

Do you have a recommended source
 for public domain eBooks? I feel like everywhere I've tried to get them has serious formatting issues. I was actually just bitching about this last night while attempting to find a decent public domain copy of _The Forsyte Saga_.


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## Death Grip (Jul 21, 2021)

Blop said:


> My go-to book for re-reading a million times is Slammerkin by Emma Donoghue. 18th century London prostitutes! Sex! Fashion! Murder! love this book so freaking much.
> 
> Slammerkin
> 
> The same author wrote Room, which was mentioned above. Room is a huge departure from her normal historical fiction.


Another fabulous book featuring a prostitute in Victorian London is The Crimson Petal and the White' by Michael Faber. Its a very twisted story but the ending is fantastic and makes me physically crave to know what happened to the main character after the ending. It was also made into a fantastic drama series by the BBC I do believe 


Thomas Eugene Paris said:


> As an avid used book shopper (I don't even remember the last time I bought a new book), I feel compelled to recommend Alibris, should you not be aware of it already. Their prices and selection are great; almost all of my books come from there. It's nice to support local shops even from afar.
> 
> For me, nothing will ever compare to the now defunct used bookstore that I loved to browse when I was a kid. They had a little bit of everything, with stacks and stacks and stacks of books, all in no apparent order. The place was a total firetrap, but the owner could dive into the stacks and emerge with a copy of anything you wanted. One time, I picked up a 25 cent paperback copy of _Utilitarianism_ by J.S. Mill. When I got home, I was shocked to find that my dad had written his name and childhood address on the flyleaf. He died a few years ago and I wish I still had that book.
> 
> ...


I've never managed to find a good website for PDF's of books. 
An alternative app to Kindle books that does a lot of free books is Kobo books.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jul 21, 2021)

Thomas Eugene Paris said:


> As an avid used book shopper (I don't even remember the last time I bought a new book), I feel compelled to recommend Alibris, should you not be aware of it already. Their prices and selection are great; almost all of my books come from there. It's nice to support local shops even from afar.
> 
> For me, nothing will ever compare to the now defunct used bookstore that I loved to browse when I was a kid. They had a little bit of everything, with stacks and stacks and stacks of books, all in no apparent order. The place was a total firetrap, but the owner could dive into the stacks and emerge with a copy of anything you wanted. One time, I picked up a 25 cent paperback copy of _Utilitarianism_ by J.S. Mill. When I got home, I was shocked to find that my dad had written his name and childhood address on the flyleaf. He died a few years ago and I wish I still had that book.
> 
> ...


Yes, I know Alibris. I use Abe Books a lot too, both the UK and US sites. I've found 19th century first editions of obscure shit I'm into like the_ Diary, reminiscences, and correspondence of Henry Crabb Robinson_, (which is considered a primary source) and a private print about another deeply important but forgotten central figure of that age. I even found a first ed. book on the survey taken of Byron's crypt and coffin from in 1930s, which was conducted under some pretty dubious pretenses. IT HAS PICTURES.

If you're using a Kindle, you're kind of fucked. The newer ones only allow things printed in their propriety format, and to try and get an epub on any Kindle is a pain in the ass. I also despise how they can reach into your device and delete works deemed inappropriate according to any political whim of the moment. I won't own one. I have an older Nook which I adore. I just search for what I am looking for. Sometimes it will be available on B&N, sometimes Gutenberg. 

There will always be degrees of formatting issues on public domain works unless you pay for a clean edition. But that's not always an available option. I am not often bothered by formatting issues, but in the rare case it's completely unreadable, I will pay for a clean download if it's available - like _Mrs. Beeton's Book of Household Management_ was a goddamn mess, so I paid a dollar for it.

In recent years, there have arisen print on demand services which are fucking awesome. I have been able to obtain hard copies of insanely obscure things printed in their original typeface for like 12 bucks, and there are no errors. Totally worth it.


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jul 21, 2021)

Speaking of print on demand, recently was able to get a comic I followed while it was web-exclusive in paper format. The artist himself reviewed the print and found only one small formatting error. Pretty stoked with it overall!


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## MerriedxReldnahc (Jul 25, 2021)

I'm currently reading 3001: The Final Odyssey by Arthur C. Clarke. I read all the books in the Rama series Rama Revealed made me cry like a fuckin bitch at the end, very few books do that to me!
I enjoy his writing style, I think because the hard science element is convincing and yet doesn't overwhelm you with the realization that you slept through all your science classes. 

I have a big stack of books by my bed that I want to get around to, I've been terrible at making time to read. I just got a nice hardcover copy of Dracula and I'm eager to give it a re-read since I've watched quite a few Dracula adaptations since the time I read it last.


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## AbyssStarer (Jul 31, 2021)

Recently I have been very tired and not up for reading more challenging books. I looked over my bookcase for something lighter and found I had none in particular.

I think most women have read some chick lit before, what are some good ones you could recommend? Only things I'm not down for are cheating (especially it being forgiven/glossed over) and gratuitous sex.

I myself have read and would recommend _The Province Cure for the Broken Hearted _by Bridget Asher, and I have read a book in the Chesepeake Shores series (I think it's a series) called _The Inn at Eagle Peak _but that one was kind of stiffly written and I didn't keep it.

I did read one called _Life After Yes_ that I liked when I was younger and later got rid of because it pissed me off too much that the main character cheated on her fiancé and nothing happened.


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## glass_houses (Aug 1, 2021)

AbyssStarer said:


> Recently I have been very tired and not up for reading more challenging books. I looked over my bookcase for something lighter and found I had none in particular.
> 
> I think most women have read some chick lit before, what are some good ones you could recommend? Only things I'm not down for are cheating (especially it being forgiven/glossed over) and gratuitous sex.
> 
> ...


Well, that depends, how do you define 'chick lit'? I mean, I have books where a woman is the main character and the focus is on exploring her relationships with the people around her... the problem is that those particular books generally have murders or something very like that in them as well.


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## Death Grip (Aug 1, 2021)

AbyssStarer said:


> Recently I have been very tired and not up for reading more challenging books. I looked over my bookcase for something lighter and found I had none in particular.
> 
> I think most women have read some chick lit before, what are some good ones you could recommend? Only things I'm not down for are cheating (especially it being forgiven/glossed over) and gratuitous sex.
> 
> ...


The Devil Wears Prada is one along those lines that I would recommend


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## CarbieDoll (Aug 1, 2021)

When I'm in a slup with reading, I turn to something easier to read like graphic novels. You can try the classics like Watchmen, V for Vendetta, The dark knight return etc.

As fr romance novels, not sure if it's your type, but I recently finished Daughter of the Reich, a romance set in 1930s Germany between the daughter of an SS officer and a Jewish boy. I have to warn you though, the book is written from her pov so it's full of Nazi speaches and the hate speach might make you really uncomfortable. It's meant to show how indoctrination works so it will be troubling but the story it's very compelling.


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## AbyssStarer (Aug 1, 2021)

CarbieDoll said:


> When I'm in a slup with reading, I turn to something easier to read like graphic novels. You can try the classics like Watchmen, V for Vendetta, The dark knight return etc.
> 
> As fr romance novels, not sure if it's your type, but I recently finished Daughter of the Reich, a romance set in 1930s Germany between the daughter of an SS officer and a Jewish boy. I have to warn you though, the book is written from her pov so it's full of Nazi speaches and the hate speach might make you really uncomfortable. It's meant to show how indoctrination works so it will be troubling but the story it's very compelling.


I'm gonna check it out, thanks. 



Death Grip said:


> The Devil Wears Prada is one along those lines that I would recommend


Oh I read this one in middle school but don't really remember it. I should reread it. I do remember reading the book and watching the movie after and disliking how much the movie changed.



glass_houses said:


> Well, that depends, how do you define 'chick lit'? I mean, I have books where a woman is the main character and the focus is on exploring her relationships with the people around her... the problem is that those particular books generally have murders or something very like that in them as well.


I was looking at the _totally not directed at women _shelf of mass market paperbacks in the grocery store today and saw some like what you're describing there too. I would personally prefer something more like what you'd find on the romance shelf in B&N. But I already got a few books in mind to read now so don't worry about making a rec to me in particular.

I am gonna complain that when I read the backs of the books at the grocery store today all but one had some line about the MC being independent/strong/obsessed with work/etc. in the first line on the back.  Made me remember why I usually stick to classics.


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## LurkNoMore (Aug 2, 2021)

All right, time to branch out and try something different! What romance novels do y'all recommend for a man.


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## Death Grip (Aug 2, 2021)

LurkNoMore said:


> All right, time to branch out and try something different! What romance novels do y'all recommend for a man.


Gone with the Wind is pretty engrossing.


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## LurkNoMore (Aug 7, 2021)

Well it appears my  inquiry for something outside my regular  has killed the thread. My apologies.

Back to Warhammer 40k and Conan for me!


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## Hankypanko (Aug 7, 2021)

LurkNoMore said:


> All right, time to branch out and try something different! What romance novels do y'all recommend for a man.


Most romance novels are too gay and retarded for even women to put up with. Go classical, honestly. Anna Karenina,  Rebecca, and Wuthering Heights are perhaps the most accessible for men. The Graduate is also a good one. The only reasonably current romance novel I'd say was even mildly worth the time is The Time Traveller's Wife. After that it's just an endless list of Nicholas Sparks books, clones, and poolside time wasters. 

On another note, has anyone else read the Jackson Lamb thrillers by Mick Herron? It got recommended to me by a book club member because she loves them and I can't decide if she's wrong or if I'm just missing something and it's actually a good series.


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## Rasputin's Side Piece (Aug 10, 2021)

LurkNoMore said:


> Well it appears my  inquiry for something outside my regular  has killed the thread. My apologies.
> 
> Back to Warhammer 40k and Conan for me!


I am not familiar with straight-up "romance" novels, however, as @Hankypanko says, there are lots of classics that weave romance in with a decent narrative.  Dostoyevsky and Tolstoy.., what springs to mind is_ War and Peace_, 

Also, anything by Jane Austen, Edith Wharton, or the Bronte sisters should contain a fair amount of romance.  Edith Warton's _House of Mirth_ is one of my favorites.


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## Death Grip (Aug 10, 2021)

An oft overlooked Bronte novel that happens to be my favourite is The Tenant of Wildfell Hall. For myself, it examines the plight of women at the time of the Bronte's in a way that Charlotte and Emily never did.
Its also a good read and a gripping story.


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## lady stoneheart (Aug 20, 2021)

this thread has really good taste, don’t want to necrobump all the people i wish i could reply to but i especially wanted to shout out the woman talking about Sapkowski. I just read the whole Witcher series in about a month and then i still wasn’t satiated (tv show blew ass as bad as GoT for me) so i borrowed my friend’s X-Box to play Witcher 3, which is only my second video game experience ever.

i also like the co-occurring discussion of Palahniuk and Barker, two writers who have a lot in common. they’re both gay men who write very modern campy lit, who either write full on horror or weave a lot of horror elements into the story, and liberally apply some very dark sexuality on top. Palahniuk makes a great foil for Barker because they are so similar yet Barker is better than him in every way, B’s work feels much more earnest and rich to me, while P’s feels very shallow and irony-poisoned. and most importantly (to me), while B can stumble once in a while, it’s clear that he actually thinks of women as unique people with rich inner worlds and not just as a series of sentient tropes that only exist in the world in relation to men, which is the impression that P gives me.

as for what i’m reading now, i just finished Stolen Beauty by Laurie Lico Albanese, and am tackling the 2nd book in the Expanse series while waiting for my copy of The Mushroom at the End of the World to come in the mail.

one last sperg, i would like to read the Wheel of Time series but i buy most of my books used and can never find them at the HPB in my area. alas


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## StrawberryDouche (Aug 20, 2021)

highly regarded said:


> one last sperg, i would like to read the Wheel of Time series but i buy most of my books used and can never find them at the HPB in my area. alas


I buy all my books used, as well. I know Amazon is the devil in many ways, but independent bookstores sell on Amazon, so when you buy from there, you are in fact still supporting an independent bookseller. They don't arrive in two days, of course, but books are something I don't mind waiting for.

I agree with you on B's treatment of women. P's writing might suggest he's never really encountered one in real life, though it would seem impossible that he hasn't.


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## lady stoneheart (Aug 21, 2021)

StrawberryDouche said:


> I buy all my books used, as well. I know Amazon is the devil in many ways, but independent bookstores sell on Amazon, so when you buy from there, you are in fact still supporting an independent bookseller. They don't arrive in two days, of course, but books are something I don't mind waiting for.


i often buy books on thriftbooks.com ! i’m sure if you’re a reader you’ve heard of it but if not i recommend it. 
i just hate buying books that are in a series online. you read the first book, you really love it and want to read more, then you have to wait a week for the 2nd book to be shipped and delivered  it destroys my momentum!


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## Death Grip (Aug 23, 2021)

highly regarded said:


> this thread has really good taste, don’t want to necrobump all the people i wish i could reply to but i especially wanted to shout out the woman talking about Sapkowski. I just read the whole Witcher series in about a month and then i still wasn’t satiated (tv show blew ass as bad as GoT for me) so i borrowed my friend’s X-Box to play Witcher 3, which is only my second video game experience ever.
> 
> i also like the co-occurring discussion of Palahniuk and Barker, two writers who have a lot in common. they’re both gay men who write very modern campy lit, who either write full on horror or weave a lot of horror elements into the story, and liberally apply some very dark sexuality on top. Palahniuk makes a great foil for Barker because they are so similar yet Barker is better than him in every way, B’s work feels much more earnest and rich to me, while P’s feels very shallow and irony-poisoned. and most importantly (to me), while B can stumble once in a while, it’s clear that he actually thinks of women as unique people with rich inner worlds and not just as a series of sentient tropes that only exist in the world in relation to men, which is the impression that P gives me.
> 
> ...


I re-acquired my collection of Wheel of Time using World of Books and local charity/2nd hand bookstores. 
World of Books is decent but UK based. They ship internationally but not sure how good an option that would be because I imagine shipping would up the price a lot.


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## MerriedxReldnahc (Aug 27, 2021)

I have a Girl Scout manual that I *think* is from around 1920, I was a Girl Scout for a good 8 years and loved it (though boy-oh-boy do I have a lot of drama to share about it) so seeing how scouting has changed over the years is interesting. I got the book out the other day to look up how to properly use gauze and got distracted by the cooking section. Reading a description of how to properly pluck, decapitate, and gut a chicken really makes me appreciate the modern world in all its convenience. And I have a hell a lot of respect for the old-timey Scouts who learned skills like first aid and nursing, I remember mostly cookie sales and catfights. The camping section includes a lot of useful knowledge about identifying plants and mushrooms, leaving trail signs through rock stacking, not setting yourself on fire, etc.


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## lady stoneheart (Aug 27, 2021)

MerriedxReldnahc said:


> I have a Girl Scout manual that I *think* is from around 1920, I was a Girl Scout for a good 8 years and loved it (though boy-oh-boy do I have a lot of drama to share about it) so seeing how scouting has changed over the years is interesting. I got the book out the other day to look up how to properly use gauze and got distracted by the cooking section. Reading a description of how to properly pluck, decapitate, and gut a chicken really makes me appreciate the modern world in all its convenience. And I have a hell a lot of respect for the old-timey Scouts who learned skills like first aid and nursing, I remember mostly cookie sales and catfights. The camping section includes a lot of useful knowledge about identifying plants and mushrooms, leaving trail signs through rock stacking, not setting yourself on fire, etc.


i am jealous! i have been on a mission to find a complete collection of the Foxfire books for years and that sounds right up my alley.


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## StrawberryDouche (Aug 28, 2021)

highly regarded said:


> i am jealous! i have been on a mission to find a complete collection of the Foxfire books for years and that sounds right up my alley.


I too, am envious! I believe in knowing how people used to do things. How they survived, found food, cooked it, preserved it, kept warm, built things by hand. It's interesting from both a sociological and personal perspective, and it is useful to know those things. I feel it's increasingly more important in these times.

I fucking _love_ the Foxfire books. I'm sure I read all of them from the library over the years. I recently looked into buying the complete set. You can find them for around 200 bucks.


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## Caramelized Squid (Aug 28, 2021)

I just finished Flowers in the Attic. It was so sad. Does anyone know if it's worth reading the rest of the series? 

I felt like the ending was pretty solid enough not to read the rest.


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## Fareal (Aug 29, 2021)

Caramelized Squid said:


> I just finished Flowers in the Attic. It was so sad. Does anyone know if it's worth reading the rest of the series?
> 
> I felt like the ending was pretty solid enough not to read the rest.


Oh GOD if you read the first of the Dollanganger saga you have to read the rest. It gets fucking wild. I think it's compulsory for girls to read Virginia Andrews "Incest Is Wincest" sagas once. IT GETS SO MUCH WILDER LOL


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## AbyssStarer (Oct 13, 2021)

I finished listening to the audiobooks of the Crazy Rich Asians series recently and I've roughly compiled my thoughts. Since I listened to the audio I'll probably spell some things wrong.

Rachel Chu is a Mary Sue and after the 1st book all the storylines about her are the worst in their respective books. There's a chapter in China Rich Girlfriend of Rachel's shopping diary in Paris that should have been entirely cut. Listening to it at work was tedious.
The storyline about Kitty Pong was interesting but her getting married to Jack Bing came out of nowhere and it was a weird excuse to keep Colette vaguely in the story.
The Carlton storyline in Rich People Problems was filler. It was like a chapter and a half and it should have been cut and reworked into an offhand mention in the epilogue.
Astrid's storyline was the highlight of the series, she should have been the main character from the beginning, but the ending kind of disappointed me.
Eleanor was one of my favorite characters and she get's sidelined suddenly after partway into the 2nd book. =(
The series has a lot of _old fashioned bad, new thing good _which was made even worse by the younger people's utter and complete lack of consideration for their elder's feelings.
That said the series isn't entirely anti-marriage and anti-parent, characters still get married and have children even after they fuss about not wanting to marry.
I read The Clique when I was in the age range for The Clique, I don't really care about describing what characters are wearing, but the author of The Clique did a way better job painting the picture of a scene. Kawn is okay at it, but most of what he does is name drop designers. I wouldn't recommend the books to somebody who thinks this sounds annoyingly filler-y.
There was too many side characters who more or less just served to be clothes hangars. It made the audiobook a little confusing to listen to when a lot of characters were present.
The narrator for the first audiobook was great and had a decent range of voices. Unfortunately, they swap her out for some washed up nobody for China Rich Girlfriend and Rich People Problems and she _cannot _voice act. She gets better in Rich People Problems, but she still used the wrong character voice and acted the wrong emotion at times.
All in all, I listened to them at work for something easy and fun and they filled the need. As far as quality goes it's 1 > 3 > 2 and worth it to listen to them all if you like the first enough. Kwan is a decent writer but not anything to write home about. He seems kinda gay but maybe that's the chinky-ness.


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## Fialovy (Oct 13, 2021)

I wasn't sure whether to post this in the Tabletop thread or here, but I chose here because I don't think those guys in the tabletop thread want to hear me sperg about these girly D&D choose your own adventure books that TSR made or really appreciate them. So back in the 80s, TSR made these D&D choose-your-own adventure novels called Heart Quest, but they aimed them at women to get them into D&D. It is about different girls who go on various adventures and there is a lot of romance options with different guys they can meet. I have the first four out of six (the fifth and sixth are really rare because of low print run). They are pretty fun, though I don't know if  I simply played D&D a lot of times so I have a lot of intuition from that, but I always managed to get the best ending the first time around, but that still makes me want to go back to see the other endings and there is usually another romance option to explore too. They are really nice books and I am glad I found them.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Nov 30, 2021)

I'm so happy I found this thread. I'm currently reading The Silent Service which is about WW2 submarines. 

My local library has been transitioning from physical books to ebooks so I bought a Kindle. It's not as satisfying but I can read way more books at once now.


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## AbyssStarer (Mar 6, 2022)

So l recently finished reading _China Dolls _by Lisa See and while a lot of the reviews I've seen on it were mixed I really enjoyed it. I found the dynamics and motivations of the heroines interesting, plus, it's a novel that takes place during WWII and it never talks about the Holocaust. It stays in America so it gives a perspective of WWII I've never experienced in media. (I usually avoid WWII media after all, lol.)

I'm reading Steinbeck now, but next Lisa See novel I want to read is _Snow Flower and the Secret Fan._


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Mar 7, 2022)

With the recent passing of a family member, I have suddenly found myself swimming in James Patterson books. Looks like I'll be reading that shit for a while.


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## CharcoalChkn (Mar 11, 2022)

Is it okay to ask for recs in here?

I quite like the thriller and murder mysteries but it is full of an ocean of shit. In recent years I read "The Silent Patient" which I really enjoyed 90 percent of but as most with in this genre I felt like it failed to execute the ending well. I heard it is getting a movie adaptation which I am quite fearful for, since I thought the twist reveal was done very well and I don't imagine it being as impactful/"oh shit" as a visual moment.

One book that I read as part of an old book club that I loathed was "Every Breath" by Nicholas Sparks. Had some laugh out loud worthy "women written by men moments" and was over all just embarrassing thinking that these adult characters would act like dramatic teenagers. But what do I know, I'm just a cynical bitch who hates love, everyone else in my group thought it was great.


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## lady stoneheart (Mar 16, 2022)

Diet Coke 4 Life said:


> With the recent passing of a family member, I have suddenly found myself swimming in James Patterson books. Looks like I'll be reading that shit for a while.


seething with jealousy. he’s not my cup of tea, but i volunteer to semi-regularly stock the bookshelves at a shelter in my area and James Patterson is always the #1 requested (followed by Dan Brown)



CharcoalChkn said:


> I quite like the thriller and murder mysteries but it is full of an ocean of shit.


i enthusiastically and aggressively recommend you try No One Will Miss Her by Kat Rosenfield. main cast is female, written by a female, intriguing murder mystery plot revolving around the relationship between an Instagram influencer and the woman who owns her Air BnB, written by a millennial so there’s no clunky boomer misunderstandings of internet culture or tech; reminded me a lot of Gone Girl. i won’t describe it more for fear of accidentally spoiling something, but i loved it. it’s not my preferred genre at all, i’m a sci-fi/fantasy girl myself, but i couldn’t put this book down and read it in two days.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Mar 16, 2022)

lady stoneheart said:


> seething with jealousy. he’s not my cup of tea, but i volunteer to semi-regularly stock the bookshelves at a shelter in my area and James Patterson is always the #1 requested (followed by Dan Brown)
> 
> 
> i enthusiastically and aggressively recommend you try No One Will Miss Her by Kat Rosenfield. main cast is female, written by a female, intriguing murder mystery plot revolving around the relationship between an Instagram influencer and the woman who owns her Air BnB, written by a millennial so there’s no clunky boomer misunderstandings of internet culture or tech; reminded me a lot of Gone Girl. i won’t describe it more for fear of accidentally spoiling something, but i loved it. it’s not my preferred genre at all, i’m a sci-fi/fantasy girl myself, but i couldn’t put this book down and read it in two days.


Thank you for this. Borrowing from the library now.


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## CharcoalChkn (Mar 17, 2022)

lady stoneheart said:


> seething with jealousy. he’s not my cup of tea, but i volunteer to semi-regularly stock the bookshelves at a shelter in my area and James Patterson is always the #1 requested (followed by Dan Brown)
> 
> 
> i enthusiastically and aggressively recommend you try No One Will Miss Her by Kat Rosenfield. main cast is female, written by a female, intriguing murder mystery plot revolving around the relationship between an Instagram influencer and the woman who owns her Air BnB, written by a millennial so there’s no clunky boomer misunderstandings of internet culture or tech; reminded me a lot of Gone Girl. i won’t describe it more for fear of accidentally spoiling something, but i loved it. it’s not my preferred genre at all, i’m a sci-fi/fantasy girl myself, but i couldn’t put this book down and read it in two days.


Definitely going to give this one a go! Have not visited the library since moving interstate, thinking I may pay a visit this weekend since it is impossible to find a copy of this in my city under 50 dollars!

Thank you for the suggestion, greatly appreciated.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Mar 17, 2022)

Has anyone here ever read a Dennis Cooper book? I'm reading his alledgely most accessible book and its tough going. Maybe I'm not the target demographic.


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## glass_houses (Mar 23, 2022)

I just finished Mrs March by Virginia Feito. It's a very swift read, only took me a few hours. A lot of people are talking about it and there's a movie in the works, so I'll give it a bit of a sperg.

People seem to be divided over this, they either love it or they hate it. Me, I'm firmly in the middle. Basically, it's about a mentally unstable woman going from barely hanging on within strict routines, to completely losing it, and being utterly ignored the whole time. It's meant to be a black comedy, but I didn't find humour in it; sometimes my grasp of American humour is a bit wonky. Also, mental health as a topic generally strikes a cord in me, and the fact that in the entire book only one- one single person- realises that the titular character, Mrs March, is very, very ill is heartbreaking. 

Mrs March is not a sympathetic character in a general sense. She's pathologically emotionally detached from _everything_ except an extreme obsession with appearances, and that includes her husband and eight year old son. She's spent all her life building up the image of the perfect woman that doesn't exist, and because the perfect woman doesn't exist, _she_ doesn't exist, instead there's just this shell of a creature, a brittle carapace filled with neurosis. 

It's meant to be a thriller, but it's really just kind of sad and melodramatic.

Still it was well written and an entertaining read. Three and a half stars.


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## Accept Only Substitutes (Apr 16, 2022)

I like brain candy fiction. So most of my recs will be not be high-brow. Almost all of them will be available through Kindle Unlimited because I'm a cheap bitch and I read _fast. _Having said that, while I'll read and enjoy just about anything that doesn’t have obvious issues, I'll only recommend books that I think are actually _good._ 

I highly recommend these three series by Rachel Aaron. All fantasy. I own all of these books because they are that good.

The Heartstrikers - Kindle Unlimited 
Funny in an understated way. Hard to describe without spoilers. Magic came back in 2035, including spirits of land and animals and dragons. Takes place 60 years after the return of magic in what was Detroit. Lots of fun, very cute, with high stakes and lots of tension. 
Book 1: Nice Dragons Finish Last

The DFZ - a sequel to Heartstrikers, contains spoilers - Kindle Unlimited 
Book 1: Minimum Wage Magic

Forever Fantasy Online - not Kindle Unlimited
Set in an MMO where the players find out it's not a game. Dark at times, but not super dark. Typical video game violence levels of dark.
Book 1: Forever Fantasy Online 

-----

These books by T. Kingfisher - not Kindle Unlimited 
Very very very funny. A little dark, sweet and wholesome, fantasy romance novels. 

These are all set in the same universe. Some genderspecial nonsense, but it's _very_ subtle and not obnoxious. 

Paladin's Grace
Paladin's Strength 
Paladin's Hope - this one is m/m but not explicit

Clockwork Boys
The Wonder Engine 

Swordheart

Different universe, still hilarious
Nine Goblins


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## Atomic Age Animal (Apr 19, 2022)

I recently finished Malinda Lo's YA novel _Last Night at the Telegraph Club_. Disclaimer: I almost never read YA fiction so I don't know how it compares to other books in the genre. The last YA novel I read was Mindy McGinnis' _Be Not Far From Me_ because Amberlynn Reid mentioned it (it was okay for a quick, light read but I'd probably never reread that one).

I fully expected _LNatTC _to be a hate read for various reasons (e.g., politics that are anathema to mine, my strong dislike-verging-on-loathing for idpol-centered art, etc.). I only bought it because it was on sale for a couple of bucks on Kindle and it had all the awards that suggested a hate read to me listed on the cover:



I was incredibly surprised to find that I enjoyed it. On paper, the plot could seem like an unimaginative paint-by-numbers oppreshuns-in-1950s-America-with-an-Asian-American twist clunker. In practice, Malinda approached the politics with a mostly light touch (and where it got heavier handed, she didn't dwell) and she focused nicely on her character development. To the degree that the exploration of oppreshuns is part of the story it feels more like a natural function of historical accuracy and less like the sort of bathetic didacticism I expect idpol-based novels to sledgehammer their readers with.  She doesn't reduce her characters to nothing more than two-dimensional victims at the hands of two-dimensional oppressors despite the setting of the novel.

It's a well-rounded, proper _bildungsroman_ too because it doesn't only focus on the two girls, Lily and Kath, who fall in love with each other but also develops Lily's increasingly frayed friendship with Sophie as they move into adulthood. I really appreciated that the unravelling of the friendship didn't entirely rely on cheap plot devices hinging on nothing more than Lily's then-taboo sexuality the way it would in a lot of didactic oppreshuns idpol stories. It's clear that Lily and Sophie's childhood friendship would have been challenging for them as they grew regardless of who either of them were in love with.

Anyway, I'm so surprised that she won me over on a novel I fully expected to hate that I'm wondering if Lo's _Ash_ and _Huntress_ are worth buying. Anyone read these? 

@StrawberryDouche 



> _The Foxfire Series _by Eliot Wiggington and The Foxfire Fund



I own (but have never finished) the complete _Foxfire_ series and it's such a great series to slip into when you just want to get lost on a lazy Sunday afternoon. The series is like the book equivalent of good, simple, solid comfort food for me; I don't even talk about the series with any of the smartypantses I know because if they've even heard of it I wouldn't want them to ruin it by dissecting it through Žižek's Lacanian lens or some such odious blasphemy. 

Plus the series has lots of pi'tures. I love pi'tures.


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## The Only Fruit (Apr 24, 2022)

Good thread! Lots of interesting tastes and choices here.

Fiction wise I mostly read crime fiction and science fiction, both of which get sneered at more literary people, but fuck them.

With crime fiction I like the way that there’s already a basic form, and to see what writers do with that. Some are very much write by numbers/plot points and utter rubbish, some do the form very well, and their books are very enjoyable, but I wouldn’t read them again. A rare few transcend the form and linger in the mind. I particularly like reading long series published over time where in addition to the basic crime novel structure you also get development of the characters and a great deal of incidental/accidental social history.

A couple of years ago I set myself the task of reading all the Gollancz SF Masterworks (why?  Because I’m as autistic as fuck and like tasks and lists). I’m continually getting diverted because I’ll read a book by a writer, and then want to read other books by that writer, and then see recommendations for another writer altogether, so it might take me years to complete, but it’s still an overall aim.

Non fiction ‘special interests’ include electricity, Ice Age art, climbing/mountaineering, and the Donner party.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Apr 25, 2022)

This thread made me rediscover my love of reading. My kindle is on fire rn. I'm currency very impressed with JG Ballards High-Rise


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## The Only Fruit (Apr 26, 2022)

xXxHeDevilOnExXx said:


> This thread made me rediscover my love of reading. My kindle is on fire rn. I'm currency very impressed with JG Ballards High-Rise



That’s in my enormous pile of ‘books to be read’. Sounds like one to look forwards to. I definitely have a bit of a ‘problem’ with the compulsive buying of books. Basically when I feel bad I buy books (and socks), and I had a really difficult year last year for assorted reasons. So I’m now banned from buying books until at least 2023.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Apr 26, 2022)

Thats entirely too relatable. I definitely have a issue with socks too. Are you on goodreads?


The Only Fruit said:


> That’s in my enormous pile of ‘books to be read’. Sounds like one to look forwards to. I definitely have a bit of a ‘problem’ with the compulsive buying of books. Basically when I feel bad I buy books (and socks), and I had a really difficult year last year for assorted reasons. So I’m now banned from buying books until at least 2023.


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## The Only Fruit (Apr 26, 2022)

xXxHeDevilOnExXx said:


> Thats entirely too relatable. I definitely have a issue with socks too. Are you on goodreads?



I’m not, although I keep thinking maybe I should be. Is it a good experience, a good idea?


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Apr 26, 2022)

The Only Fruit said:


> I’m not, although I keep thinking maybe I should be. Is it a good experience, a good idea?


I really enjoy goodreads. Its a great organizational tool. I have a terrible memory and often use the shelving feature to track books I want to read. The review system is pretty good too. My kindle is set up to automatically add books I'm reading onto my read shelf on goodreads.


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## AbyssStarer (Apr 28, 2022)

I was jealous of my husband having a relatively easy selection of books to choose from from the fuckhuge world of Warhammer books, and started to seek out something similar for women and remebered that chick lit is a thing. I wound up on Nora Roberts Chesapeake Bay series. I'm a bit through Sea Swept now. I, uh, just skim through those steamy parts. Didn't realize that it would have them and when I got to the first it was an "oh, it's one of _these _books" moments.
Decent romance though, two people overcoming the degeneracy of casual relationships/living the fast life bundled with some mystery about an orphaned kid.

I did read a Chesapeake _Shores_ book forever ago by Sherryl Woods, would not recommend tbh.


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## Lol4loko (Apr 29, 2022)

I finished Pride And Prejudice and started reading Tom Sawyer. Which clears imo.


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## Atomic Age Animal (Apr 30, 2022)

The Only Fruit said:


> climbing/mountaineering



Not strictly about mountaineering but I enjoy classic adventure/exploration books — turn-of-the-century gentleman's adventurer club stuff. Nat Geo published some of these as National Geographic Adventure Classics. I think those books might be out of print but they turn up in used bookstores from time to time so I've collected a few.  I especially like old Arctic and desert exploration books but I keep meaning to read more books about the early exploration of and opening up of the American (i.e., Burgerlandian, not New World) West.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (May 1, 2022)

The Only Fruit said:


> Good thread! Lots of interesting tastes and choices here.
> 
> Fiction wise I mostly read crime fiction and science fiction, both of which get sneered at more literary people, but fuck them.
> 
> ...


do you have any Donner party book recommendations?


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## Scarlett Johansson (May 1, 2022)

Actually Christian Bale said:


> God, I love Murakami, but Murakami in general is so hit-or-miss.
> 
> I rate his books by how many weird sex scenes (bonus points if it's with underage girls) he builds in. At >5 I slowly start checking out mentally. Remind me to post my sliding Murakami scale from A* to _The Girl Was Really Underage And There Was A Lot Of Talk About Her Pubic Hair_ later


Sdghkfssh what? 
He did the intro to the Japanese Shirt Stories book by Penguin that I have.


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## The Only Fruit (May 2, 2022)

xXxHeDevilOnExXx said:


> do you have any Donner party book recommendations?



 ‘Ordeal by Hunger’ by George R. Stewart. Beautifully written and immensely readable.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (May 3, 2022)

I really enjoyed that YA thriller one of you ladies recommended. Sometimes its nice to read some fluff. So I went on a little YA binge. I'm ending it now because there's too much gender nonsense going on in contemporary lit. Its disappointing honestly. I read as an escape and I hear enough of that in my real life. 

Looks like its time to bust out the Joan Lowry Nixon.


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## StrawberryDouche (Jun 2, 2022)

Last year, Public Domain Review crowdfunded to create a book of images. There would only be 2500 copies made. I bought the $100 Collector's Edition as a gift for the person I love. It comes in a clothbound slipcase and a poster with every image in the book. It arrived today and it is _stunning._ The prints are saturated and dazzling, the composition and layout is expertly executed; it's thematic, dramatic, beautiful, and thought provoking. The paper is so heavy, it weighs about eight pounds.

They're about to release an edition to the public for only $60 if this is your sort of thing and you have some disposable cash. I could not recommend this more highly.


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## Corydoras (Jun 6, 2022)

Thank you all for so many great recommendations! I was just about to start my summer book shopping so this has been very helpful.

I have 3 very different nonfiction recommendations:

“Addiction By Design” is an amazing look at machine gambling addiction, particularly in Vegas. It touches on game design, architecture and includes loads of interviews with people suffering from addiction. Really amazing stuff. If anyone has read anything like it, let me know because it really blew me away. 

“Confederates In The Attic” Is a hilarious grand tour of Civil War sites. It covers some history but it is more about what the Civil War means for people today. It’s fun, fascinating and sometimes evocative.

“Expecting Better” is for the pregnant kiwis. My 2 friends who already have kids recommended it to me. It’s an easy read, but it’s well-researched and puts to rest a lot of old wives tales about pregnancy.


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## CaseyTatumm (Jun 8, 2022)

Just found out about this thread  I used to read constantly when I was a lot younger or even just had to rely on public transportation. Got into audiobooks over the last few years so have gotten back into books. I’ve pretty much been on the hunt for the most depressing, bleak or disturbing books I can find

I am currently listening to A Little Life by Hanya Yanagihara. I’m about 1/3 of the way through but take breaks because it gets kind of boring. 

This year I discovered Cormac McCarthy, I absolutely am hooked now! So far Outer Dark is my favorite, followed by The Road and Blood Meridian. I have Suttree in my audible library, just haven’t gotten to it yet,

Most recently I have finished Knockemstiff and Devil All The Time by Donald Ray Pollack (thanks to the recommendation of another KF’er). I highly recommend them if you haven’t read/listened!


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Jun 8, 2022)

CaseyTatumm said:


> Just found out about this thread  I used to read constantly when I was a lot younger or even just had to rely on public transportation. Got into audiobooks over the last few years so have gotten back into books. I’ve pretty much been on the hunt for the most depressing, bleak or disturbing books I can find
> 
> I am currently listening to A Little Life by Hanya Yanagihara. I’m about 1/3 of the way through but take breaks because it gets kind of boring.
> 
> ...


Devil All the Time has been on my shelf since a boy gave it to me  maybe I'll finally read it now.


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## CaseyTatumm (Jun 8, 2022)

xXxHeDevilOnExXx said:


> Devil All the Time has been on my shelf since a boy gave it to me  maybe I'll finally read it now.


Please do, it’s an entertaining read!


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## princess_toots (Jun 9, 2022)

xXxHeDevilOnExXx said:


> do you have any Donner party book recommendations?


The Indifferent Stars Above by Daniel James Brown


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## Rabid Weasels (Jun 10, 2022)

Anyone like westerns? I adored Lonseome Dove and The Virginian and would like to find more.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Jun 10, 2022)

Rabid Weasels said:


> Anyone like westerns? I adored Lonseome Dove and The Virginian and would like to find more.


I just placed holds on both of these at my library. I've definitely been going thru a western phase lately.


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## krazy orange cat (Jun 22, 2022)

I come bearing gifts, frends. A 1943 WWII cookbook put out by Lysol.

The Frankfurter Casserole is pretty amazing.


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## lightswitchdoll (Jun 27, 2022)

Before I start, just wanted to say thank you all for the book recommendations - the majority are currently sitting in my 'to read' pile 

I've recently been reading books about weird medical shit - I enjoyed Quackery and now I'm reading The Mystery of the Exploding Teeth which tbh I'm not enjoying that much but it's not bad enough for me to give up on - and I'm near the end so I'm just going to power through it today.

Somewhere in amongst all this, I found a mention of The Heart of a Dog by Mikhail Bulgakov and I'm thinking of adding that to the pile - did anyone here enjoy it? Is it like with The Master and Margarita where there's a particular translation I should look for?


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Jun 27, 2022)

Dunno why, but been on a mountaineering kick lately with videos about K2 and shit. So had to sit and reread 'Into Thin Air'... and just got 'The Climb', by Anatoli Boukreev, the guy demonized by Jon Krakauer (the author of Into Thin Air) but that I personally think was heroic as hell. It's really cool getting another perspective of the Everest disaster of 1996.

Haven't been able to bring myself back to fiction lately; getting too much fiction with movies as of late, because the household goblin's discovered the Marvel Cinematic Universe and we've been glutting ourselves on that shit these days (a movie as a reward for doing all of the goblinoid chores has been working wonders, amazingly enough - better motivation than money. Color me surprised).


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## krazy orange cat (Jul 20, 2022)

Alright gorls, time to head back to the kitchen and stretch those war rations.


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## LoudmouthLisa (Jul 21, 2022)

I just tore through a great and absolutely wrenching book about the Donner Party, The Indifferent Stars Above. Good companion for the organ meats section of the rations cookbook.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Jul 22, 2022)

Diet Coke 4 Life said:


> Dunno why, but been on a mountaineering kick lately with videos about K2 and shit. So had to sit and reread 'Into Thin Air'... and just got 'The Climb', by Anatoli Boukreev, the guy demonized by Jon Krakauer (the author of Into Thin Air) but that I personally think was heroic as hell. It's really cool getting another perspective of the Everest disaster of 1996.
> 
> Haven't been able to bring myself back to fiction lately; getting too much fiction with movies as of late, because the household goblin's discovered the Marvel Cinematic Universe and we've been glutting ourselves on that shit these days (a movie as a reward for doing all of the goblinoid chores has been working wonders, amazingly enough - better motivation than money. Color me surprised).


You should read touching the Void. Its about a pair of friends who summited Suila Grande, they were first to scale that particular side of the mountain. Mountaineering books are definitely in for me right now. 
Minor powerlevel, my dad actually climbed K2 but didn't summit because of weather. I also bought the VHS tape of the IMAX movie that they were filming when the 96 everest disaster happened.

This article was pretty interesting too. 



			https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2015/09/sandy-hill-pittman-mount-everest


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## AbyssStarer (Aug 12, 2022)

A couple recent audiobooks I listened to:

*Happiness for Beginners by Katherine Center:* Pretty much a beat-for-beat perfect chick lit romance. I thought the opening of the book was better than the end. Got me through a couple shifts in a good mood. Spoilering thoughts on the last chapter I thought the couple might not get together and I started angry skimming paragraphs until his name showed up again, woulda been pissed if they didn't. But the author still had to add a tweest and killed the MC's dog for no reason.
4/5

*What You Wish For by Katherine Center: *In chapter 2-ish I realized that this book is in the same universe as Happiness for Beginners as the leading man is from said book. I'm 17% done with the audiobook now, the narration is great but the MC is a little crazy and the writing is a little EHMAGAWD sometimes. For example: "...Duncan Carpenter. DUNCAN CARPENTER." and the narrator directly talking to the reader about being able to tell Duncan Carpenter by how he walks. Kind of odd but it's fine for chick-lit and it keeps me going at work even if I'm tired. 

*The Office B.F.F.s by the Office Ladies Podcast women: *Like a long podcast episode. Very little new stuff for podcast listeners but it's entertaining enough to get through a few shifts. Plus there was little to no soapboxing about feminist shit from Jenna. You will want to shoot yourself after hearing "in the moment" enough times if you listen to more than one chapter at a time. Apparently this book keep topping charts, I find that to be a testament to how little people read.
2/5

I listen to audiobooks from an app called Libby which connects to your library card to loan books. Sometimes you get waits to rent books but it's better than paying for them or some other service or going through the effort of pirating.


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## Accept Only Substitutes (Aug 14, 2022)

If you like paranormal cozy mysteries I suggest checking out Annabel Chase. She's written a ton of books, so if you read everything by an author she'll keep you busy for a while, even at the rate of a book a day. She's a Kindle Unlimited author.

I've heard her Starry Hollow Witches (unfinished) and the Federal Bureau of Magic (unfinished) series and I'm working on her Spellbound (finished) series.

A cozy mystery is a mystery that doesn't have cursing or explicit sex scenes. The murder takes place off screen and the lead character is charming and good at getting people to talk. They're basically brain candy. Light and fluffy escapism. 

Annabel is very good at creating unique worlds that follow a basic theme: girl ends up in a small paranormal town, stumbles upon dead bodies, works to solve the mysteries, meets a hot guy (or two), falls in love. Sarcasm and humor abound, and it's full of little details that make a world feel well rounded and complete. 

The Starry Hollow Witches series features two hot guys that both want to date the heroine. Both guys are different in their attitudes and mannerisms. It was honestly a bit of a surprise where she went with the relationship drama at first. I was both dissatisfied and happy at how it worked out. There are 16 books in this series so far, it feels like it's getting close to wrapping up. There was a scene in book six (I think) that had me outright cackling for a good five minutes. 

The Federal Bureau of Magic series was particularly interesting to me. The heroine's family is evil, she was supposed to be evil but fights to be good. The family really is evil and chaotic beyond belief. The mom and grandmother often kill each other, her divorced parents antagonize each other, her mom and her good sister-in-law don't always get along. It's just a mess, but none of them are actually unlikable. It's a fine line to walk, but she does it well. This series is also unfinished and has the longest to go I think.

I've just started Spellbound but it's every bit as good as the other two. It's finished in ten books and there's a sequel of nine books that's finished. There's spoilers to the relationship status of the heroine from this series in the Starry Hollow Witches series. The Federal Bureau of Magic series also gets a mention in the Starry Hollow Witches series as well, but it's not actually spoiled.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Aug 24, 2022)

Anyone got any recommendations for a good thriller? Just finished The Ronoake Girls and I'm ready for something similar.


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## krazy orange cat (Aug 24, 2022)

xXxHeDevilOnExXx said:


> Anyone got any recommendations for a good thriller? Just finished The Ronoake Girls and I'm ready for something similar.


The Revolution of Ivy, also by Amy Engel, is good if you haven't read it.

The Girl on the Train by Paula Hawkins is also a very good thriller about a girl who sees something out the window while riding on a train (duh). The story is better than that summary sounds LOL.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Aug 24, 2022)

krazy orange cat said:


> The Revolution of Ivy, also by Amy Engel, is good if you haven't read it.
> 
> The Girl on the Train by Paula Hawkins is also a very good thriller about a girl who sees something out the window while riding on a train (duh). The story is better than that summary sounds LOL.


You are a blessing. I'm only semi embarrassed to say I've read those. 

When is Gillian Flynn going to drop another banger?


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## Sam's Tater Stew (Sep 1, 2022)

Is it cool to come to this thread seeking a particular type of recommendation?

I'm temporarily burnt out on books that have substance. I've been eyeballs deep in textbooks, nonfiction, and well-respected literature all year and I really want to just lose myself in some nonsense. 

I love books that are tense, suspense filled and all around stressful. The kind you can't put down because you have to know what happens next.  Some examples: Sharp Objects, Gone Girl, Girl on the Train, Room, etc

Anyone have anything like that I can disappear into?


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## Real Centaur (Sep 2, 2022)

Sam's Tater Stew said:


> Is it cool to come to this thread seeking a particular type of recommendation?
> 
> I'm temporarily burnt out on books that have substance. I've been eyeballs deep in textbooks, nonfiction, and well-respected literature all year and I really want to just lose myself in some nonsense.
> 
> ...


Jo Nesbo's Harry Hole series maybe?


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## Accept Only Substitutes (Sep 2, 2022)

Sam's Tater Stew said:


> Is it cool to come to this thread seeking a particular type of recommendation?
> 
> I'm temporarily burnt out on books that have substance. I've been eyeballs deep in textbooks, nonfiction, and well-respected literature all year and I really want to just lose myself in some nonsense.
> 
> ...


T Kingfisher. Specifically her book The Seventh Bride, but all of her books are good - although some are just darkish fantasy with romance but those are also cant-put-it-down and absolutely hilarious. 

I rarely buy books because I have Kindle Unlimited, but I'm buying every one she's ever published. She's worth it.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Oct 4, 2022)

I'm reading Peyton Place currently, anyone here have an opinion on it?


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## Hot Fuss (Oct 5, 2022)

Above my desk is a shelf of (mostly) classic literature I'm working through. I'm halfway through _One Hundred Years of Solitude_, and next up is _Middlemarch_, which I'm really excited for. 

I have a soft spot for 19th century Russian literature, and the superfluous man is my favorite archetype and should make a modern comeback.



Spoiler: My shelf, for those who are curious





I have many more books on my kindle.


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## lightswitchdoll (Oct 5, 2022)

I just read The Heart of a Dog by Bulgakov and... yeah that was weird. I think I'd like to try a different translation (this one was by Avril Pyman) because I feel like some of it was a bit off. Like a few of the jokes didn't quite land, if that makes any sense? (trying to avoid spoilers)

I also just read Girl in Pieces and I'm not really sure what I thought about that either. I spent the first part of the book complaining to myself that it was just a ripoff of Girl, Interrupted but then when the main story kicked in I just felt like there was too much going on and it was all a bit ridiculous. Saying that, I find a lot of books about mentally ill women to be quite obnoxious anyway (Prozac Nation being one of the worst books I've ever read) so maybe I'm being too critical.

Now I'm reading Milgram's Obedience to Authority. I feel like I've read so much about the experiment itself but I've never actually read what he wrote about it so hopefully I'll enjoy this one.


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## AbyssStarer (Nov 8, 2022)

I lost a big post draft for this thread, heck.
Ummm...I listened to audiobooks of 4 Katherine Center books and here's the most recent one.

Katherine Center's _The Bodyguard:_
2.5 stars after taking 1.5 off for heavy handed Feminist crap. Bitch, if your slinky dress had pockets it wouldn't drape right and your straps might fall down. Buy some fucking cargo pants. Stop writing unnecessary trash about gun control. I really don't think 20 different Texans are all anti-gun. 

I wouldn't even be so bothered if her little feminist cut-ins amounted to anything besides KC dumping it there for the sake of it being there. In my drafted post I had to downgrade 3 of Katherine Center's books down by at least a star for this shit. I like her as a writer but I *hate* this crap and I probably wouldn't have listened to The Bodyguard if there wasn't a line of 50+ people for it on Libby that I signed up for months ago.

So yeah, her books are decent but. There's always a self-help like theme which helps fill out the world. Overall like 3 stars as a writer. There's good and bad.


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## Dread First (Nov 19, 2022)

There was a manga I read in college called Watashitachi no Shiawase na Jikan, which itself is a manga adaptation of Our Happy Time by Ji-young Gong (2006 live-action movie adaptation also available). 

If you're the type of person who enjoys romantic melodrama, then this book (hell, the movie too) is right up your alley. I'd stay away from the manga though because it's unfulfilling and short. Plot synopsis is "suicidal ex-pop star (or some other type of performer) falls in love with seemingly unrepentant death row inmate." 

The first page or two of every chapter are excerpts from the death row inmate's diary, while the rest of the chapter is told from the woman's perspective. It's quite the interesting dynamic to see happen, and the "romance" actually _kinda_ feels organic (kinda like an even _more_ dysfunctional Blache/Mitch pairing from _A Streetcar Named Desire_).

I won't spoil anything for the book, but I will say this: the last time that I sincerely found myself thoroughly engrossed with what I was reading goes all the way back to high school when I used to read Ellen Hopkins' novels-in-verse like the Crank trilogy and the Impulse/Perfect duology. This book, for all its flaws (and there are plenty), still managed to make me forget that I'm a haggard old man in his late 20s and feel like a teenager reading books for fun again.

3.5/5 stars or a 7/10 - worth reading, but don't expect Ibsen.


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## Accept Only Substitutes (Nov 28, 2022)

Read _What Moves the Dead_ by T Kingfisher the other day. It's a retelling of Poe's short story _The Fall of the House of Usher._ Pretty good, but there's some made up pronoun sperging under the guise of a foreign language making up their own rules. It both adds to and detracts from the story, kinda odd. I'd knock off half a star for this. 

It's not as funny as some of her other works, but the prose is still light and airey for such a dark subject. There's some particularly good turns of phrases, a definite creepy (but not overly so) vibe, and the ending is satisfying. 

Overall 4.5 stars. I do recommend it if you like creepy stories. I have yet to read one of hers I didn't like and wouldn't recommend.


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## Madame Souza (Nov 28, 2022)

Any nerds who like well-researched historical fiction with romance subplots should check out Anya Seton (she called them “biographical novels”). She spent years researching settings before writing about them (pre-internet), so they’re fun AND educational! I rarely see her mentioned on lists of great historical fiction and I think it’s really too bad.  
My favorites of hers include, but are not limited to:
The Winthrop Woman, set in Puritan England and the New World

Devilwater, set during the Jacobite Rebellion in early 1700s England and the New World

Katherine, set in late 1300s England and featuring interesting medieval happenings like Black Death aftershocks and the peasant revolt that was quelled by Richard II (this is her most famous novel—I personally think Winthrop Woman is a better story with a more likable and dynamic MC, but Katherine is good, too, if only for the setting alone)

Green Darkness, wherein Anya gets weird and sets it in 1960s England and also Tudor England because of past lives lol

All of her books are just so fun and wildly readable, if you’re into that type of thing. I think her writing style is similar to Margaret Mitchell’s, but Seton was more of a stickler for historical accuracy.
 I also appreciate older historical fiction (Green Darkness, her last novel, was published in the early 70s) for the meta experience of separating the depiction of weird old things done intentionally and unintentionally weird old things that weren’t weird at the time of publication. 

If anyone has any recommendations for other good historical fiction works that aren’t just erotica in a corset and with a carriage, hit me with that shit. Double points if they’ve got a medieval European or East Asian setting.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Dec 29, 2022)

I read the most incredible true account of a failed Russian arctic expedition. Its called In the Land of White Death. 

I'm on a adventure kick right now.


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## Rasputin's Side Piece (Dec 29, 2022)

I had forgotten about this thread.  I have just about given up on modern fiction, because one has to wade through so much garbage to find good stuff.

 I wonder if anyone else has read Elizabeth Strout.  _Olive Kitteridge_ and _Olive, Again _are my favorites.  She also wrote a couple of others, and I read one of them as well.

Those of us in the latter portion of our lives will appreciate these lovely books.  I would love to know if anyone else has read them.


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## NoReturn (Dec 29, 2022)

I have finished all of the _Wayward Pines _trilogy and would like to read more things like it.


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Dec 29, 2022)

Man, I've just so divorced myself from reading fiction that I'm reading these book titles here going 'whaaa?'

My kick lately has been caving and mountaineering disasters. Just got off my Tom Clancy kick and my James Patterson kick (had a relative who was a major Clancy and Patterson fan - relative kicked the bucket and I inherited the entire collection in hard-back format, and spent a goodly amount of time happily buried in them).

But now, 'K-2: The Savage Mountain' is sitting on my night stand waiting for me to delve back into it.

Maybe once I'm done with this book, I might look at getting into fiction again. Anyone got anything gritty as fuck without any romance? I do love a good murder mystery or action fiasco (favorite series of all time is actually Sci-Fi, because Issac Asimov is my fucking inspiration and his Foundation Trilogy is my go-to for a good read). Male/female lead, doesn't matter. Also sex of the author doesn't matter. Just want something violent and not entirely intellectually vapid.


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## xXxHeDevilOnExXx (Dec 30, 2022)

Diet Coke 4 Life said:


> Man, I've just so divorced myself from reading fiction that I'm reading these book titles here going 'whaaa?'
> 
> My kick lately has been caving and mountaineering disasters. Just got off my Tom Clancy kick and my James Patterson kick (had a relative who was a major Clancy and Patterson fan - relative kicked the bucket and I inherited the entire collection in hard-back format, and spent a goodly amount of time happily buried in them).
> 
> ...


You're reading my mind right now! Please read Buried in the Sky. Its a mountaineering disaster book written about the Sherpa guides. I liked K2 the Savage mountain. I also read Beck Weathers account of almost dying in the 97 Everest storm. Reading between the lines he was a selfish husband who screams low value male. It was his wife who organized that dangerous helicopter rescue. Apparently she used every connection she had to get him off that mountain.


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## Diet Coke 4 Life (Dec 30, 2022)

'Buried in the Sky'? Alright! Gonna get that on order. Thank you!!


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## Carcinology (Saturday at 9:37 AM)

Just finished my third read of The Tournament by Matthew Riley. It's a fictional tale of Queen Elizabeth I as a teen going to a chess tournament in the Ottomans, such a great book I'd highly recommend it to anyone, I'm not even usually into these kinds of books but I borrowed it off my mum years ago and had to get my own copy it was so good.


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