Off-Topic Losing people to transgenderism support thread - Support group for trans widows and other people who lost loved ones to troonism

[Mayor Cody Travers]

Yet another first time poster.

In a fairly online and tight-knit community that thankfully doesn't usually have idpol going around I became the 'everyone's friend' kind of guy that everyone could speak to in confidence. A particularly young but friendly guy told me he was thinking of transitioning one day, but I figuratively sat him down and told him flatly he would be part of a 'minority' that would be seen as infringing upon another group's (women, natch) spaces and if he felt good 'colonizing' them as such, his dating life would become all but dead unless he liked dudes (which he pretty clearly did not), and various examples of troon buffoonery and fuckery both from here and some other haunts on the internet I experienced both MTF and FTM trannies in force in, noting in particular the vast majority of them were white middle to upper middle class college kids still dependent on their parents - hardly a persecuted group in real life. He insisted it was his true self though, and eventually and not surprisingly his mental health dropped further as he dug deeper into it, eventually accusing me of transphobia simply for not validating his every feeling and cutting off contact with me.

This isn't nearly as long or interesting as most other kiwis' stories for sure. Why do I tell it then? Mostly I feel bad - that as an older man I failed a younger one trying to keep him on the straight and narrow, especially in today's world where socially being a guy definitely is a raw deal in some aspects. I'm just old enough to remember better times and to see more people in my generation wake up to how insane transgenderism is, but it's the youngin's I worry for as this social contagion still plagues them and they've never really known a world where it was seen as an aberration.

 

[Big Bobs Beepers]

Your neutered friend doesn't exist anymore, you are a better man than I am for being there for his family.

The hardest part of this entire thing was having to accept that fact, and knowing that he's out there in some toxic poly relationship and making life hell for a small business instead of being there for his family in times like these just makes it worse. With how many years it's been, I know there is no way he's ever gonna come around from this like we all hoped five years ago. And I can't say I'm a better man than you, because based on how you seem to see this whole thing, I know you'd probably do what you could for them if you were in my shoes. I hope your next tough time isn't anything like this, but being there for your family and friends in the tough times like these is what a man does, and getting that puts you ahead of every single Troon who ever ditched their friends and loved ones for their 'Chosen Family' Groomers

There have been similar stories in the thread. You're a good person and those other kiwis were too. It's sad when a friend becomes a better son/relative than a blood relative, but it really do be like that sometimes.

Yeah, I've read most of them, it's kinda why I decided to come here and share my own story. Even before I knew this site existed, I knew the feeling had to be mutual somewhere, I just didn't really know where at the time yet. Trannies act like they have the moral high ground on fucking everything, and the media just kinda sits by and enables this mindset, but when you look into all the pain that they're causing people just so they can dive headfirst into the most degenerate shit that's come out of the 21st century, you realize that all this was never and will never be right. To them, tranny feelings come first every time, everyone else is transphobic and deserves to have their lives ruined for not engaging in their hivemind

 

[Ham Hole]

Lost myself and my boobs to this. Luckily I still pass as a woman even with testosterone, so all I need to do is stop taking it and change my name to a female one. (Ive always hated the one given to me at birth.)

I feel this. I think bullying and subsequent distain for my given name contributed greatly to feeling trans. I misattributed the cause of that distain.
Best of luck to you.

 

[Fapcop]

Yet another first time poster.

In a fairly online and tight-knit community that thankfully doesn't usually have idpol going around I became the 'everyone's friend' kind of guy that everyone could speak to in confidence. A particularly young but friendly guy told me he was thinking of transitioning one day, but I figuratively sat him down and told him flatly he would be part of a 'minority' that would be seen as infringing upon another group's (women, natch) spaces and if he felt good 'colonizing' them as such, his dating life would become all but dead unless he liked dudes (which he pretty clearly did not), and various examples of troon buffoonery and fuckery both from here and some other haunts on the internet I experienced both MTF and FTM trannies in force in, noting in particular the vast majority of them were white middle to upper middle class college kids still dependent on their parents - hardly a persecuted group in real life. He insisted it was his true self though, and eventually and not surprisingly his mental health dropped further as he dug deeper into it, eventually accusing me of transphobia simply for not validating his every feeling and cutting off contact with me.

This isn't nearly as long or interesting as most other kiwis' stories for sure. Why do I tell it then? Mostly I feel bad - that as an older man I failed a younger one trying to keep him on the straight and narrow,

Big ups my man!

If more men took their responsibility as men as seriously as you do, we wouldn’t be in this mess.

That sense of responsibility for a younger man in your community is a beautiful thing to behold, and far too rare.

Lost myself and my boobs to this. Luckily I still pass as a woman even with testosterone, so all I need to do is stop taking it and change my name to a female one. (Ive always hated the one given to me at birth.)

Obligatory F for your titties.

Hopefully you widened uo before doing something REALLY irreversible like yeeting your uterus.

You’re a woman regardless, but it’s gotta suck to be dependent on big pharma for your hormones for the rest of your life.

 

[NerdShamer]

I feel bad - that as an older man I failed a younger one trying to keep him on the straight and narrow

It's not exactly an failure if you warned him exactly what happened and he's too obsessed to consider it

 

[Whetherwon]

Sorry if I rambled like the newfag I am, but this is the only place I really feel like I can get it off my chest online

ima fucking boomer who only joined this forum, after lurking kf since about 2014, to have a place to discuss presisely this problem before the internet completely removes a place for rational folk to discuss these things without a clear and total bias one way or another.

I posted back in August about my ex feeling the same way: like this was literally the only place that I could be 100% honest about how I felt about all of the gender bullshit that I was having to deal with. I think it's hilarious that Kiwi Farms, supposedly the worst place on the internet, has somehow managed to provide a "safe place" that nowhere else can. Thanks to @AMHOLIO for starting this thread, I'm sure that it's helped a ton of people, even those who are just lurking.

 

[TheHashslinging]

Question for those in this thread whose loved ones became ftms: Did any of them ever get a "masculine" job that women tend to stay away from because of the strain it puts on the average woman's body? E.g. packer, welder, construction, mechanic, warehouse-worker, or anything that involves lots of lifting and energy? Im curious if ftms ever take advantage of the strength boost testosterone gives them.

So the the jannies don't get mad at me for going off topic, I have a baby sis who went enby. It's hard bc she's the type where being completely honest will just drive her away and deeper into the cult. Thankfully, we can be semi-truthful with her though so she knows the horrible effects of hrt and is uninterested in it. She told me why she thinks she's an enby though and the reason is heartbreaking. It's because she was perved on by strange men at ages 12-16 which made her feel uncomfortable in her own body. All the females in our family developed early.*

(*read: around the average age but people think it's early bc they watch too much Nickelodeon and perverts want to defend themselves when they gawk at 13 year olds). Not to soapbox but I don't know how it's NOT obvious that just because a teenaged kid (13, 14, 15 doesn't matter) has breasts, doesn't mean she wants an old man leering at them. Most are obviously going to feel extremely disturbed and uncomfortable. These kids don't want to be creeped on. They want to nerd out about Bleach. People leered at me too at that age, which led to trying to bind when I was young, but it seems like things have genuinely gotten worse on that front. We really had to scream and yell to get men to fuck off when it came to my little sisters who are ten years younger. Creeps are definitely a lot bolder now which is terrifying.

 

[Aunt Carol]

Question for those in this thread whose loved ones became ftms: Did any of them ever get a "masculine" job that women tend to stay away from because of the strain it puts on the average woman's body? E.g. packer, welder, construction, mechanic, warehouse-worker, or anything that involves lots of lifting and energy? Im curious if ftms ever take advantage of the strength boost testosterone gives them.

Nope. NEETs and shopgirls, a nanny and an enby receptionist.

And most of the "women in construction and maintenance" training programs, the ones to give women a new start in a nontraditional industry, are proud to take troons and enbies. (It's like a tacit understanding that women with unstable lives and problems in their upbringing would take those identities.)

Not a Boomer, but man, you'd think being able to provide for yourself and a family with honest labor would be validating in your identity as a man.

 

[Fapcop]

Question for those in this thread whose loved ones became ftms: Did any of them ever get a "masculine" job that women tend to stay away from because of the strain it puts on the average woman's body? E.g. packer, welder, construction, mechanic, warehouse-worker, or anything that involves lots of lifting and energy? Im curious if ftms ever take advantage of the strength boost testosterone gives them.

Ironically, most woman I know who works in more masculine fields like carpentry, construction etc. are honest to god lesbians who don’t juice.

 

[Amber the Hedgehog]

Ironically, most woman I know who works in more masculine fields like carpentry, construction etc. are honest to god lesbians who don’t juice.

Another one I have noticed is tomboyish moms that like a job where they don't have act girly. At home they are mommy and do all the mommy things, often with other mommies who are naturally feminine. It's okey, they love their kids and are willing to do these sacrifices but it's so nice have brake where they can do shit with their hands and not to be the caretaker. Often they went for there fields from genuinely masculine intrests before kids but with kids there is a new reason for work.

 

[Disability Fat]

Nope. NEETs and shopgirls, a nanny and an enby receptionist.

And most of the "women in construction and maintenance" training programs, the ones to give women a new start in a nontraditional industry, are proud to take troons and enbies. (It's like a tacit understanding that women with unstable lives and problems in their upbringing would take those identities.)

Not a Boomer, but man, you'd think being able to provide for yourself and a family with honest labor would be validating in your identity as a man.

Would MTFs claim those more physical jobs give them dysphoria though, since traditionally they're viewed as masculine? I can see one pretending to be a delicate flower and asking a male coworker for assistance, then run to HR claiming transphobia for not responding with a sexualized response.

 

[Aunt Carol]

Would MTFs claim those more physical jobs give them dysphoria though, since traditionally they're viewed as masculine? I can see one pretending to be a delicate flower and asking a male coworker for assistance, then run to HR claiming transphobia for not responding with a sexualized response.

I think the programs are more for FtMs. Adults MtFs are more likely to already be in construction when they have their coom revelation; the young ones are going to become/remain programmers.

 

[Disability Fat]

I think the programs are more for FtMs. Adults MtFs are more likely to already be in construction when they have their coom revelation; the young ones are going to become/remain programmers.

I'll patiently wait for the news headline about a huge tittied MTF using a jack hammer during the 2023 road construction season.

 

[Anti-Social Social Club]

This whole thing feels like such a losing battle. There is no shielding someone from this shit once they start sliding into it if you're not affirming and supporting then you just don't get it. Social media is so influential it borders on scary and I'm sure no one expected American soft power to grow to that extent.

Spoiler: Tiktok addicted friend update

Well now she's going by all pronouns, it took her a while but I'm not surprised. She made a finsta/private account and a "normal"/public account. I haven't interacted with my girl friend group in a while but based on the dnd gc we have some of the unfamiliar names are enbie women so yeah I'm sure I'll be dealing with that for a while. A while ago she was sharing gender dysphoria memes. I was thinking of sharing terfy/gc memes but they're all so in your face and aggressive if I saw them in the past I would mentally block whoever shared it.

So the the jannies don't get mad at me for going off topic, I have a baby sis who went enby. It's hard bc she's the type where being completely honest will just drive her away and deeper into the cult. Thankfully, we can be semi-truthful with her though so she knows the horrible effects of hrt and is uninterested in it. She told me why she thinks she's an enby though and the reason is heartbreaking. It's because she was perved on by strange men at ages 12-16 which made her feel uncomfortable in her own body. All the females in our family developed early.*

I don't really get this line of reasoning, a lot of terfs say the same thing to explain enbie women but it doesn't make sense to me. Like I don't understand the connection between being creeped on and going "welp I'm neither a man nor a woman" because then what about 'cis'women? Their mothers?

I hope you break things off with your boyfriend @Anti-Social Social Club. He seems very abusive towards you, and you deserve better.

Why does he seem abusive to you?

Spoiler

I guess my friends were more open minded to me disagreeing because uh female socialisation, neither were ever political, and I wasn't very confrontational with them since I learned through my bf that that's probably the worst way to deal with this. My bf on the other hand is very political and his gf of how many years going "you're clearly being influenced by your friends" is never going to garner a good response. /SPOILER]

 

[Sperghetti]

I don't really get this line of reasoning, a lot of terfs say the same thing to explain enbie women but it doesn't make sense to me. Like I don't understand the connection between being creeped on and going "welp I'm neither a man nor a woman" because then what about 'cis'women? Their mothers?

I think the underlying reasoning is that these women start to associate getting creeped on with the state of them being female, and feel like they're doomed to this being their life now. And then gender ideaology comes along and says "well, you don't have to be a woman, you can be something else..."

The problem, IMO, is that radical feminism doesn't offer any alternative perspective to this, they just double down on it: "Yeah, you're doomed to be treated like a walking fleshlight rest of your life because you're a woman and men rule everything and all men are scum." Well, shit, if that's the way things are, those people who tell me I can stop being a woman start sounding mighty appealing.

I feel bad for the kids this happens to, to be honest. I understand the feeling of wanting to change yourself in an attempt to get other people to treat you the way you want to be treated. But as I've gotten old, I've realized that often times there's nothing you can really do about that because, ultimately, that's a them problem not a you problem.

Having your innocence shattered shouldn't mean your sense of self has to go with it.

 

[Phenax]

Story below spoilers. This was cathartic. Even if you don't read, I'm wishing the best for you Kiwis and any relevant misguided, brainwashed loved ones of yours.

Spoiler: Long story sperg

First time posting here, I have been batting around the idea of doing so for a while now. A young (~20 yrs) member of my extended family is a TiF, more specifically a victim of the ongoing tomboy genocide (I mean this only half flippantly). She was a tomboy in middle school, and back then was long enough ago to where she was recognized as such by my family, and it wasn't even a question in anyone's mind to view her as an actual boy or man.
When high school rolled around, she dipped a toe into the freakshow and started identifying as 'gender fluid'. I still remember when an older member of my family asked what that even meant, and a frustrated younger me found the best way to explain it as such: "It's when people think they switch between genders but it's basically made up bullshit". That family member didn't take outward issue with my explanation, but for some reason also didn't see the 'transition' as another flavor of teen bullshit not to take seriously. This 'transition' came with a new name, which was just the name everyone already called her with one letter removed. Didn't even make it more 'androgynous'. Think 'Jenny' to 'Jenn'. I didn't hear much from her during this time due to family events on both sides that far outweighed these shenanigans in importance.
As soon as she hit 18, she 'came out' as a true and honest female-to-male, over Facebook. This was the height of the initial tranny craze and it was received with much applause in my family circle. It was something I heard second-hand from everyone, given I didn't have Faceberg then (or now). It was a long time until I saw her in person again, but by then she had 'transitioned' into a depressing caricature of a Musical.ly e-boy, you know, the kind that doesn't really exist anymore. Of course, does not pass physically, vocally, socially, dispositionally... Anything.
Various life struggles have made it so, in the present day, she has dropped out of high school, has never held a job, and is an complete stoner burnout before her brain is even fully developed. All the male role models in her life have failed her by being that exact same type of person, or even worse. That makes me all the more confused as to why she wants to emulate them. It's like my family recognizes her as a lost cause and is just sticking around for the show. Maybe I'm the same, just not voyeuristic about it.
Her family situation has relatively stabilized, and she rather regularly visits my family now. It disturbs me as a normal (aside from being autistic enough to post here), actual male, that she believes she can experience manhood at all, never mind the fact that the 'masculinity' she idealizes is that of useless jailbirds. It disturbs me that she looks at the men in my family and believes she can be that, and that many of them are saying, yes you can! I feel pity.
Of course, her priorities still lie firmly in furthering this transition charade. She recently got on testosterone. At this point even the older members of my family are switching to the new name and pronouns. Younger members of my family look at me with excitement as my confused elders call my equally confused, hopelessly maladapted female kin a 'he'. I'm at the end of my wits. I've gotten to where I straight out tell them I don't care about pronoun sperging or 'deadname' hand-wringing. I can never look this person in the eye and see another man. Nor will I ever trick anyone else into thinking I will try.
Thanks for reading, Kiwis. And thanks to Null, and Kiwi Farms as a whole, for providing a place where this years-long frustration of mine can be aired out freely. Lord knows what'd happen if my family learned my actual feelings. But it may only be a matter of time.

 

[Fapcop]

Story below spoilers. This was cathartic. Even if you don't read, I'm wishing the best for you Kiwis and any relevant misguided, brainwashed loved ones of yours.

Spoiler: Long story sperg

First time posting here, I have been batting around the idea of doing so for a while now. A young (~20 yrs) member of my extended family is a TiF, more specifically a victim of the ongoing tomboy genocide (I mean this only half flippantly). She was a tomboy in middle school, and back then was long enough ago to where she was recognized as such by my family, and it wasn't even a question in anyone's mind to view her as an actual boy or man.
When high school rolled around, she dipped a toe into the freakshow and started identifying as 'gender fluid'. I still remember when an older member of my family asked what that even meant, and a frustrated younger me found the best way to explain it as such: "It's when people think they switch between genders but it's basically made up bullshit". That family member didn't take outward issue with my explanation, but for some reason also didn't see the 'transition' as another flavor of teen bullshit not to take seriously. This 'transition' came with a new name, which was just the name everyone already called her with one letter removed. Didn't even make it more 'androgynous'. Think 'Jenny' to 'Jenn'. I didn't hear much from her during this time due to family events on both sides that far outweighed these shenanigans in importance.
As soon as she hit 18, she 'came out' as a true and honest female-to-male, over Facebook. This was the height of the initial tranny craze and it was received with much applause in my family circle. It was something I heard second-hand from everyone, given I didn't have Faceberg then (or now). It was a long time until I saw her in person again, but by then she had 'transitioned' into a depressing caricature of a Musical.ly e-boy, you know, the kind that doesn't really exist anymore. Of course, does not pass physically, vocally, socially, dispositionally... Anything.
Various life struggles have made it so, in the present day, she has dropped out of high school, has never held a job, and is an complete stoner burnout before her brain is even fully developed. All the male role models in her life have failed her by being that exact same type of person, or even worse. That makes me all the more confused as to why she wants to emulate them. It's like my family recognizes her as a lost cause and is just sticking around for the show. Maybe I'm the same, just not voyeuristic about it.
Her family situation has relatively stabilized, and she rather regularly visits my family now. It disturbs me as a normal (aside from being autistic enough to post here), actual male, that she believes she can experience manhood at all, never mind the fact that the 'masculinity' she idealizes is that of useless jailbirds. It disturbs me that she looks at the men in my family and believes she can be that, and that many of them are saying, yes you can! I feel pity.
Of course, her priorities still lie firmly in furthering this transition charade. She recently got on testosterone. At this point even the older members of my family are switching to the new name and pronouns. Younger members of my family look at me with excitement as my confused elders call my equally confused, hopelessly maladapted female kin a 'he'. I'm at the end of my wits. I've gotten to where I straight out tell them I don't care about pronoun sperging or 'deadname' hand-wringing. I can never look this person in the eye and see another man. Nor will I ever trick anyone else into thinking I will try.
Thanks for reading, Kiwis. And thanks to Null, and Kiwi Farms as a whole, for providing a place where this years-long frustration of mine can be aired out freely. Lord knows what'd happen if my family learned my actual feelings. But it may only be a matter of time.

Fren, I’m not going to pretend that I know what you’re going through, but I think it’s time you introduce your family member to what should be a quintessential male quality. Honesty and straight shooting.

Explain to her that you love her and are worried about her, but that she deserves to know the truth: She will never be a man, nobody will ever think of her as a man but are merely humoring her to be polite. And that she will likely wreck her life with testosterone and surgeries.

She likely has a little voice in the back of her head that tells her the same. Many of these women do and wonder if everyone is just humoring them. Maybe you will plant a seed in her mind, maybe not.

But at least you will feel better about having actually done something, unlike the other people in her life.

 

[Tard Whisperer]

Question for those in this thread whose loved ones became ftms: Did any of them ever get a "masculine" job that women tend to stay away from because of the strain it puts on the average woman's body? E.g. packer, welder, construction, mechanic, warehouse-worker, or anything that involves lots of lifting and energy? Im curious if ftms ever take advantage of the strength boost testosterone gives them.

I've never known an FTM with this kind of job. FTMs I know all are in shitty retail jobs or customer service or a job they don't need to leave the house for, thanks to crippling anxiety.

I don't really get this line of reasoning, a lot of terfs say the same thing to explain enbie women but it doesn't make sense to me. Like I don't understand the connection between being creeped on and going "welp I'm neither a man nor a woman" because then what about 'cis'women? Their mothers?

I think the underlying reasoning is that these women start to associate getting creeped on with the state of them being female, and feel like they're doomed to this being their life now. And then gender ideaology comes along and says "well, you don't have to be a woman, you can be something else..."

The problem, IMO, is that radical feminism doesn't offer any alternative perspective to this, they just double down on it: "Yeah, you're doomed to be treated like a walking fleshlight rest of your life because you're a woman and men rule everything and all men are scum." Well, shit, if that's the way things are, those people who tell me I can stop being a woman start sounding mighty appealing.

It's also because they are receiving the message that if you feel uncomfortable with that kind of attention there's something wrong with you as a woman. they are being told that hookup culture and OnlyFans are empowering and that women enjoy casual sex. then they feel like if they are uncomfortable with that lifestyle, something is wrong with them. no longer being a woman rids them of that expectation. so just a small distinction I see there, where it's not just the fact that they want to get away from that attention, but also that they feel they're wrong as women for being uncomfortable with it.

I feel like the impact of porn culture on this phenomenon is really underestimated. as girls are approaching sexual maturity they develop the understanding that men like porn and that porn is not to be criticized (as that is genocide of 'sex workers', and since 'trans women' are often 'sex workers' this is a pretty bad sin). if they're on social media and in online communities they also develop the understanding that men like porn of women being abused, and are being told that the women actually like this and it's mutual. they may even stumble across BDSM porn fairly easily. it's something we are often so used to if we're Online Adults that it's hard to think about how you would react to that the first time you saw it or heard of it, if you also saw it as a child. recently I was thinking back to being a middle school girl and the first porn I ever saw was Sasha Grey doing puppy play, wearing a leash, and drinking out of the toilet. this stuff can be traumatizing for young girls and really warp the way they view womanhood and intimacy and their own bodies. I think this creates lots of girls identifying as lesbians early on too because they don't see a possibility of authentic intimacy with men if that's what men like, and think they can have a safer impression of it with women. if you think there is something sacred about sexual intimacy and believe in sexual morality, it is no surprise that this is incredibly damaging and confusing.

I agree that this is also the issue with the radfem man haters, because although they recognize the harm of porn, they endorse this same view of intimacy between a man and a woman being dangerous, rather than helping women and girls develop a real understanding of intimacy and the value of womanhood in a heterosexual relationship and marriage to create a family. they agree that they want women to be able to have sex with no consequences and pretend this is something that would make us happy. they will support women refusing to participate in that kind of demeaning sexual behavior but won't support them pursuing a relationship with more traditional dynamics instead.

 

[Fapcop]

I agree that this is also the issue with the radfem man haters, because although they recognize the harm of porn, they endorse this same view of intimacy between a man and a woman being dangerous, rather than helping women and girls develop a real understanding of intimacy and the value of womanhood in a heterosexual relationship and marriage to create a family. they agree that they want women to be able to have sex with no consequences and pretend this is something that would make us happy. they will support women refusing to participate in that kind of demeaning sexual behavior but won't support them pursuing a relationship with more traditional dynamics instead.

TERFs are tards and fundamentally don’t understand men.

They seriously think dudes watch porn because they all hate women.

Going by that logic, I buy my Tshirts from Nike because I loathe Filipinos and nothing brings me more joy than the thought of them slaving 14 hours a day in a sweatshop.

Or you know, maybe I buy them because I need a T-shirt and like the style and price.

And maybe dudes watch porn because they want to jerk off?

 

[Procrastinhater]

As a parent with two daughters, the eldest just into her teens, I worry about the shit they're exposed to online, not just the troon shit but all kinds of degenerate shit seemingly being pushed everywhere now, even by "officials" like educators and doctors and such, and the easy access and sheer depravity of porn, etc, which is something my generation never really had when I was their ages.
It's a dilemma as a parent, you don't want to be too "coddling" because that just makes kids go the other way even more, and there's no way to completely shelter them from all that shit anyway, so we've just tried to make sure that the relationship we have with our kids is such that they know they can talk to us about anything that concerns them without being embarrassed, and they're smart kids, they know what's up and when somethings not right, but its certainly a fine line.
I used to look at my Dad when I was a kid and think he had it all figured out, it's only now at my age I realize that's not really the case, you just play it by ear, day by day, and hope you don't end up burning the kitchen down in the process.