Ukrainian Defensive War against the Russian Invasion - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[mindlessobserver]

Everything that has ever existed. Nothing has been as objectively evil as US/NATO. The rot it wishes to extend to the entire world is deplorable.

Yes, but the situation we are faced with here is exchanging Lung Cancer with Throat Cancer. Its not a binary choice. Russia offers absolutely nothing to the west, or Ukraine that is desirable. If Russia wins and overthrows Zelensky, what happens? Yeah, Homosex will probably be illegal again and all the insufferable "human rights" NGO's will be turfed out. Yay.

Then what? Yanukovych comes back in, and the Russian oligarchs will proceed to figuratively and literally rape Ukraine for all its worth. Wagner will get its salt mines around Bakhmut full of cheap and or unpaid native labor and anyone who complains gets disappeared in the night by the GRU.

The enemy of my enemy is NOT my friend. We just happen to share the same enemy. Russia is a mafia state run by a weak ruler who is too busy trying to pay off his power structure so they don't murder him to actually come to resemble any sort of functional state, let alone a State with a creative vision that could be compelling counterpoint the western hegemony. Its a nation with a few show cities and a vast underpopulated wasteland declared without irony to be "the prison of nations".

At least Globohomo gives me running water and the ability to shitpost online. If Russia for whatever reason took over, not only would not be able to shitpost online anymore, I also wouldn't have running water. Objectively worse outcome.

 

[Null]

I can think of something far more evil than the US and NATO could ever hope to be.

I'd say maybe Pol Pot was worse, but you're talking about about a small shithole country killing its own people. The Soviet Union was bad, but it was limited to Eastern Europe. The worst thing the Soviet Union accomplished was with the direct help and assistance of the US and UK, or the Allies (led by the US) which became the UN (led by the US) and NATO (led by the US). I will refer to the United States and her property (which includes all members of NATO) as just the US, because the other countries are irrelevant and conquered vassals. However, when I refer to the US, know that I refer to its owners, not its residents.

What the US envisions for the entire world is an economy that is centrally controlled by an oligarchy of bankers and business men that they permit to exist and be a part of their club. They will form a monopoly on currency by extinguishing alternatives (PMs) and criminalizing other viable alternatives (Crypto). They will use their monopoly on currency to punish and reward individuals and control foreign policy.

The US promotes democracy, not because liberal democracy is the most goodest form of government, but because people vote with their wallets. As long as basic needs are met and people are able to sit in complacency, they will elect parties that undermine their long-term interests. Since all money is pegged to the USD, that means that the US can use sanctions and other economic powers to persuade voters to oust certain parties and bend the democracy to a form more subservient to the US. Liberal democracy and capitalism are effectively a pipeline of submission to the US power structure. The average person is not a champion for ideology or principles, but their own self-interest.

Governments sometimes don't play nice, and, very rarely, people are willing to put pride before money. These governments are subverted by the CIA in their well documented color revolutions. The budget of the CIA is $65.7 BILLION dollars a year, and its budget is effectively confidential. This money goes to bribes and terrorism. Any state that goes against the wishes of the US is ousted. The exceptions are to nuclear backed states, notably including Iran, the DPRK, and Russia.

The US is the only superpower to ever exist in the history of the world. It contains two continents and almost all of the world's industry. What does it use this power for? It

• Obliterates and demonizes your identity: You are now 'white' and therefore bad. You speak English. You have no religion.
• Deprives you of your personal rights. You will behave a certain way. You will not own self-defense tools. You will not say certain things.
• Deprives you of your family rights. Your children will go to state schools. They will be educated a specific way. If you resist, you will lose your children.
• Deprives you of privacy. Every transaction you make is recorded and reported to the government. You will be cataloged into a digital database by ID number, fingerprints, DNA, and facial recognition.

If you try to fight these tenants of its power structure, you will lose money. People who follow them are rewarded with money. Money is good, and most people will comply. They already do. Moreover, entities with money gained through compliance are more powerful, capable, and influential thanks to that funding.

The end goal of this apparatus is to form a one-world government that can never be destroyed. With currency controlled, firearms regulated, and a state surveillance apparatus that can track people (unprecedented in human history), there is no resistance, violent or otherwise. Violent resistance will be obliterated by unmanned drones. Non-violent offenders will be allowed to protest, but your face will be recorded and they will deduct a fine straight from your bank account without rewarding you with an arrest and martyring anyone. Don't, want to be homeless? Stop protesting.

By the end of it, the US will rule the world directly. You will exist to serve the oligarchy that owns the US. You are property of the US. Everything you do is known to the US, and you may only worship it. You cannot leave the US for a freer country, because there is no country besides the US. You cannot escape to Mars, because the US will colonize Mars too.

I hate the US.

 

[74164978231]

Everything that has ever existed. Nothing has been as objectively evil as US/NATO. The rot it wishes to extend to the entire world is deplorable.

Worse than Stalin/Mao killing between 30-50 million of their own people?
Worse than pol pot doing his best to exterminate most of his own people?
Worse than the death cult empire known as the Aztecs?

I perfectly understand someone in your situation detesting the west in general, but to say the US/NATO is the most evil thing ever is a tad over exaggerating.

 

[Pork Packer]

Everything that has ever existed. Nothing has been as objectively evil as US/NATO. The rot it wishes to extend to the entire world is deplorable.

Gonna be honest hoss, twitter trannies and inclusivity editors policing books and comics nobody fucking reads anymore are probably not quite as bad as the great leap forwards, stalin's purges, pol pot's happy cambodian fun time, the totally fake and gay holocaust, and the preceding several centu....millennia of mass slavery, famine, untreatable disease, and no toilet paper

in underestimating these forces you are making a grave mistake.
they have already inflicted massive and permanent damage to the wests demographics, you simply cannot dismiss them as inconsequential like that and expect to be taken seriously.

Pretty sure the nbiggest change to western demographics happened before they had any kind of power, and given the backpedaling already taking place regarding muhimmigration (which in and of itself was largely motivated by a desire to ship in low pay serfs to work the proverbial fields) which is unlikely to be reversed any time soon I am somewhat doubtful of the latest iteration of white genocide. Besides, europe withstood multiple forcy-fun-time romps from the east via the huns, magyars, mongols, and soviets without being cursed to demographic death so I doubt this weakazz shit will go far

Rot is natural, if harmful. To use an analogy of nature, natural forces can build intricate, self-sustaining processes that produce life, and the same natural process will reduce that life into a pile of rot. Likewise, human nature can build intricate and just aristocracies (in the philosophical sense of the word), and the same human nature will reduce those aristocracies into tyranny.

Also the idea that troonery, virtue signalling, and the star wars sequel trilogy will not be subject to the same rot is just straight up myopic

I can't imagine changing my opinion based solely on what other people align with it. That's an absolutely miserable way to live.

There are retards in media who are opposed to Russia's constant incursions into territorial waters and airspace of Nordic and Baltic countries. That won't make me in favor of incursions.
There are trannies on twitter who are opposed to the invasions in the Middle East. That won't make me in favor of the invasions.
There are even vultures in boardrooms who oppose Russia's invasion of Ukraine. But it won't make me favor Russia's invasion. I opposed invasions in 2003, and still do in 2023.

When it comes down to it, there's one actor in all of this that has the power to end the loss of life right now: Russia.
All they have to do is walk away. Just walk away.

But they won't. Because they imagine themselves as splendorous and magnificent, and functional countries as lesser. Mistakes to subvert.
Then they cry foul when they think those countries are responding in kind with subversion of their own.

Truth is - the west didn't even need to subvert Russia's interests. Russia did that itself by being a shithole. Nobody was paid to protest, to align with the west.
They just looked at Russia and dismayed.

Personally I look at it like this.

Is there some reddit bitchfag so obnoxious, so pathetic, so hypocritical, so degenerate, so fucking annoying that him declaring his hatred of a pedophile makes me consider siding with the pedophile?

Nah. The answer will always be Nah.

 

[GoPro]

I listen quite regularly to people like Greenwald, which I should probably stop doing, but it's pretty OK content for my runs. Jimmy Dore, even Secular Talk, the Grayzone and everyone associated, Michael Tracey, there are quite a few of these that would immediately stop helping Ukraine and let it collapse without a care in the world.

People like Dore and Grenwald took an easy way of catering to contrarians even though they probably could do better.

People need to understand that maintaining support from the West is more vital that 100 Leopards. And the West is full of contradictions and inner struggles, and quite unreliable, which should be fixed, without assuming that it will just last forever as a hegemonic force.

Russians are not without their disagreements and issues either. Difference is that the west, especially the U.S., brings these issues to attention and airs out dirty laundry in public. This makes west look less united and creates tension. At the same time, it makes it more difficult to ignore these issues. At best they are fixed and at worst people are at least aware and can try to work around them.
That's not the case in Russia and look how it worked out. Corruption and lackluster standards were ignored for decades. That led to world's 2nd military force getting stalled in Eastern Ukraine. When western sources report issues in Russian military, Russian side denies them as a knee-jerk reaction. They sometimes end up acknowledging them later on and if Russian government reacts it is often too late. Mobilization is a perfect example of that. In the spring of 2022 western-side was saying that Russia will lose initiative unless they mobilize and predicted that Putin will do so in the Spring or early summer like any sensible leader would. Instead, Putin promised no mobilization. He walked that back in fall in response to Ukraine gaining the initiative and executing successful counteroffensives.

From what I understand conservative opinion has shifted away. Went from 6% against at the start to now it's 46%. I believe DeSantis and Trump have both also talked about wanting to cut aid. Either way, Russian influence ops are probably going to go hard on the "we're giving Ukraine too much" meme come the primaries and election and there's a good chance it'll be effective enough to make it a partisan issue.

DeSantis recently made a U-turn on his anti-Ukraine stance. His team probably realized that he might need to appeal to establishment Republicans and donors to win the nomination. Upsetting Catholic and Mormon orgs that are largely pro-Ukraine is another risk. Same goes for swing demographics like young people and certain minorities in swing states.

Having watched the narrative shift over the last year or so, my prediction is retconning the whole invasion as a "punitive raid which utterly broke Ukraine and crippled the west into inevitable downfall" and then smugging over Ukraine not invading russia back as proof of victory, and spinning any and all geopolitical or economic turbulence for the next decade or two as irrefutable proof russia won "The long game", even if russia straight up goes full warlord era in real time and winds up as a giant frigid central africa tier hellzone on krokadil, and the worst the west suffers is trade bickering and fears of a minor recession

How's that going to play with Ukraine holding about a third of territories annexed by Russia in 2022 and most of these region's capital cities? If Ukraine's next offensive will go like fall ones, Russia might lose even more ground.

I disagree and believe my opinion will be validated in the passage of time. They are not harmless silly people. They are rot. Tooth decay is causus belli for tooth extraction. "But 90% of the tooth is fine!". Doesn't matter, the nerve is exposed.

Fillings and root canals are a thing you know.

Everything that has ever existed. Nothing has been as objectively evil as US/NATO. The rot it wishes to extend to the entire world is deplorable.

What previous world order was better than Pax America and NATO? Soviet sphere was a mess and worked hard to spread out their totalitarian socialism and is one of the roots of western degeneracy. European empires were awful too with constant trade and conventional wars, resettlements, censorship, horrid social mobility, social engineering projects, and ugliness of industrial revolution. Before that you had frequent wars be it over religion or royal squabbles in Europe. Japan was fighting itself, and China was a bureaucratic, dystopian hellhole under Ming. Even earlier, Mongols were the big shakes and movers.

 

[Vince McMahon]

For some weird reason Jersh decided to be mad at us

He forgot his lithium and if the ziggers get another "kys" from him, then they'd stop calling him "based"

 

[draggs]

All this just because (((someone))) decided it's not cool to say NIGGER in public smdh

 

[Scalar wave Physicist]

Worse than Stalin/Mao killing between 30-50 million of their own people?
Worse than pol pot doing his best to exterminate most of his own people?
Worse than the death cult empire known as the Aztecs?

I perfectly understand someone in your situation detesting the west in general, but to say the US/NATO is the most evil thing ever is a tad over exaggerating.

I'd prefer a physical death (even a gruesome one) over a psychological one. THEY seek to eliminate everything you and your own people stood for, erasing centuries of history and tradtition of a culture while you get to watch and they won't stop until everyone is completely spiritually empty without a set of morals that aren't pre-approved by our neo-liberal elite. It leaves you with nothing higher to hold onto in life except the pursuit of "happiness" which tends to be the most hedonistic, degenerate form of physical pleasure under their definition. Just try asking your average resident in San Francisco, Los Angeles or Berlin what their purpose in life is and what they want to achieve. They'll just say that they want to find "happiness" whatever they mean by that. And they will be happy eventually. And own nothing.
That is worse than a physical death imo.


Anyways, excuse my derailing spertgy rant but I had to say this somewhere. To get back to the Ukraine war, yeah, the entire conflict is pointless because unlike the "Nazis" in Ukraine or the Imperialists in Russia there is a very visible actual enemy out there who is objectively evil and fighting anyone besides Globohomo is retarded.

 

[Goofy Logic]

You sure eastern European sentiment isn't getting at you Null?

I'm telling you, there is something in the borscht.

 

[MG-34]

The worst thing the Soviet Union accomplished was with the direct help and assistance of the US and UK, or the Allies (led by the US) which became the UN (led by the US) and NATO (led by the US).

Null, those trannies and commie faggots you hate and that have constantly been fucking with you while being given voice in media were empowered and funded by the USSR.

Soviet funding and espionage​

From 1959 until 1989, when Gus Hall condemned the initiatives taken by Mikhail Gorbachev in the Soviet Union, the Communist Party received a substantial subsidy from the Soviets. There is at least one receipt signed by Gus Hall in the KGB archives.[68][69] Starting with $75,000 in 1959, this was increased gradually to $3 million in 1987. This substantial amount reflected the party's loyalty to the Moscow line, in contrast to the Italian and later Spanish and British Communist parties, whose Eurocommunism deviated from the orthodox line in the late 1970s. Releases from the Soviet archives show that all national Communist parties that conformed to the Soviet line were funded in the same fashion. From the Communist point of view, this international funding arose from the internationalist nature of communism itself as fraternal assistance was considered the duty of communists in any one country to give aid to their allies in other countries. From the anti-Communist point of view, this funding represented an unwarranted interference by one country in the affairs of another. The cutoff of funds in 1989 resulted in a financial crisis, which forced the party to cut back publication in 1990 of the party newspaper, the People's Daily World, to weekly publication, the People's Weekly World

Further reading:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_influence_on_the_peace_movement

Russia and Black Lives Matter - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

History of the Communist Party USA - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

Germany and Italy basically invented Fascism and now they cannot stop sucking dick.

Na-na-nazism is definition of sucking dicks all day around. Third Reich exterminated homosexuals because they was competitors, not because na-na-nazis didn't like buttsexing all day.

Russian imperial ambition is a rather larger, rather more immediately destructive problem.

And is also basicly a troonization of country, but without femboys, washed girls and so one. Something like having a choirs around house but without having a house.

Do you think the military leadership that tolerate Nazi Motifs and idolize Stephen Bandera are going to abstain from politics when this war concludes?

Funfact no 4: Azov is a definition of anti-nazi ideology. Yes, bunch of idiots have swastika on they skin because they was stupid enough to make such tatto, but when we read papers of Azov leaders we will see a new way for nationalism (or: how EE nationalism can look when we get ruzzkie influence away).

In short words: they mostly are calling for cooperation with every willing EE state with the aim to make sure that ruzzia will not return to that part of world.

 

[Pork Packer]

I'd say maybe Pol Pot was worse, but you're talking about about a small shithole country killing its own people. The Soviet Union was bad, but it was limited to Eastern Europe. The worst thing the Soviet Union accomplished was with the direct help and assistance of the US and UK, or the Allies (led by the US) which became the UN (led by the US) and NATO (led by the US). I will refer to the United States and her property (which includes all members of NATO) as just the US, because the other countries are irrelevant and conquered vassals. However, when I refer to the US, know that I refer to its owners, not its residents.

Shame its property has consistently refused to do what its fucking told with regards to paying its NATO dues, rallying against Chyna, and not slurping down russian gas for thirty fucking years.

What the US envisions for the entire world is an economy that is centrally controlled by an oligarchy of bankers and business men that they permit to exist and be a part of their club.

And then what? will they just scrooge mcduck into their infinite fucking money pits forever or will they do what the elite has done since chief unga bok bok conspired to steal shiny tusk from the next cave over and continue competing and plotting against eachother?

They will form a monopoly on currency by extinguishing alternatives (PMs) and criminalizing other viable alternatives (Crypto).

Im certain the slave girls getting a forcible train run on them in ottoman harems took comfort in the fact their right to dogecoin would never be impinged, as their owners were not that evil

They will use their monopoly on currency to punish and reward individuals and control foreign policy.

As opposed to what was happening beforehand which was using a monopoly of military might to punish individuals and control foreign policy.

The US promote democracy, not because liberal democracy is the most goodest form of government, but because people vote with their wallets. As long as basic needs are met and people are able to sit in complacency, they will elect parties that undermine their long-term interests.

So...at worst the same shit as before, but with somewhat more illusion of choice

Not quite sure how this beats out the cultural revolution in evilness....

Since all money is pegged to the USD, that means that the US can use sanctions and other economic powers to persuade voters to oust certain parties and bend the democracy to a form more subservient to the US. Liberal democracy and capitalism are effectively a pipeline of submission to the US power structure.

Even the 51st state could not be prevented from brexiting despite High Pharaoh Obunga himself declaring he would punish them for it

Governments sometimes don't play nice, and, very rarely, people are willing to put pride before money. These governments are subverted by the CIA in their well documented color revolutions. The budget of the CIA is $65.7 BILLION dollars a year, and its budget is effectively confidential. This money goes to bribes and terrorism. Any state that goes against the wishes of the US is ousted. The exceptions are to nuclear backed states, notably including Iran, the DPRK, and Russia.

Theres a currentyear Latin America/Africa sized elephant in the room here

The US is the only superpower to ever exist in the history of the world. It contains two continents and almost all of the world's industry. What does it use this power for? It

• Obliterates and demonizes your identity: You are now 'white' and therefore bad. You speak English. You have no religion.

Wait when was religion illegalised?!

• Deprives you of your personal rights. You will behave a certain way. You will not own self-defense tools. You will not say certain things.

Wait when were guns illegalised?!

• Deprives you of your family rights. Your children will go to state schools. They will be educated a specific way. If you resist, you will lose your children.

Wait when was homeschooling illegalised?!

• Deprives you of privacy. Every transaction you make is recorded and reported to the government. You will be cataloged into a digital database by ID number, fingerprints, DNA, and facial recognition.

Ok and then what?

Like if this is all building up to some super-duper dictatorship it will require zero dissent and zero incompetence from an elite which has never not fucking hated eachother and never not been full of incompetent shitheads willing to misuse the proverbial god machine to screw their rivals over

The end goal of this apparatus is to form a one-world government that can never be destroyed. With currency controlled, firearms regulated, and a state surveillance apparatus that can track people, there is no resistance, violent or otherwise. Violent resistance will be obliterated by unmanned drones. Non-violent offenders will be allowed to protest, but your face will be recorded and they will deduct a fine straight from your bank account without rewarding you with an arrest and martyring anyone.

Ok so the final answer as to why the US/NATO is the most super-duper-wuper evilest entity in the history of history is.......futurist fanfiction from the mid twentieth century

By the end of it, the US will rule the world directly. You will exist to serve the oligarchy that owns the US. You are property of the US. Everything you do is known to the US, and you may only worship it. You cannot leave the US for a freer country, because there is no country besides the US. You cannot escape to Mars, because the US will colonize Mars too.

And naturally, there will be absolutely zero factions within the oligarchy that will try to get a leg up on the rest by offering better bugs and comfier pods to the proles, zero populists using the hypocrisy and bullshit of the system to rally supporters, and zero fuckywuckys and oopsydaisies giving the proles an opening as has happened literally every other fucking time in human history where a centralised establishment arises

Your nightmare vision of the future is an assumption that those in power will suddenly become infinitely competent, infinitely selflessly dedicated to a common cause, and infinitely invested in mindlessly screwing over normies without profit or payoff for shits and giggles after ten thousand years of the contrary

I mean....technically its possible, but then technically ethan ralph could seduce AOC with his roguish charm and impressive stretch marks, and I would not exactly bet on either

 

[Null]

Null, those trannies and commie faggots you hate and that have constantly been fucking with you while being given voice in media were empowered and funded by the USSR.

Absolute cope. If you want to say that the wave of prog comes from Soviet Union era espionage that is a deliberate attempt to destabilize the US, go for it. But the reality of our situation now is that the USSR has been dead for longer than I've fucking been alive, and these policies are from the top-down in the US. If prog is meant to destabilize the US, it's doing a bad job. For all the woke bullshit in the armed forces, we are still the only superpower, and even trying to bring up China as a threat solicits uproarious laughter from everyone.

You can spin this to be about the soviet boogieman if you really want to cling to your post-war boomer philosophy and pretend we're still fighting the good fight. However, that's for your peace of mind, not for addressing the realities of the modern day.

 

[Blatant hypocrite]

I know I probably shouldn't be telling Null of all people, but isn't this all off-topic? Both Ukraine and Russia are irrelevant in this debate.

 

[Pork Packer]

I know I probably shouldn't be telling Null of all people, but isn't this all off-topic? Both Ukraine and Russia are irrelevant in this debate.

We get back on topic when russia takes bakhmut

So.....make yourseff a hot pocket or two, because its gonna be a while

 

[Astro Galactic Megalul]

Absolute cope. If you want to say that the wave of prog comes from Soviet Union era espionage that is a deliberate attempt to destabilize the US, go for it. But the reality of our situation now is that the USSR has been dead for longer than I've fucking been alive, and these policies are from the top-down in the US. If prog is meant to destabilize the US, it's doing a bad job. For all the woke bullshit in the armed forces, we are still the only superpower, and even trying to bring up China as a threat solicits uproarious laughter from everyone.

You can spin this to be about the soviet boogieman if you really want to cling to your post-war boomer philosophy and pretend we're still fighting the good fight. However, that's for your peace of mind, not for addressing the realities of the modern day.

At least we shouldn't pretend that Russia changed all that much in its mentality and methods since USSR, possessed by the same animus as back during Cold War, inherited by KGB glowies, plowing ahead on pure revanchism and hatred.
For all "Russia is not USSR", they sure want to be. You talk about post-war boomers, but that's exactly the driving force for all this shit in Russia, Putin's flock.

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

Both Ukraine and Russia are irrelevant in this debate.

They are relevant. This is all of war between new generation (Zelensky and Azov) and the old fuckers who was born just after second world war (Putin and local vatniggeros). EE is infestead by guys who long ago should go to old mens houses (or to tombs).

No, really - in this part of world we still have idiots who are stuck with their minds in second world war and previous periods.

So yes, a dispute if they are still USSRians who are trying to influence USA is very on-topic. Null maybye makes too much spergy about trannies, but investigating if the trannies are or aren't influenced by USSRians is vital no matter what you think about trannies.

 

[LillyTheBestGirl]

Every part of me wants to like Russia

Why? What ties to Russia do you have? I just can't shake the feeling you're like that weeaboo soyjack from the "Place - Place, Japan" meme. A Russiaboo, you could say.

I'm not trying to insult you. I'm just baffled at the amount of baseless Russophilia among Western right-wingers. And it is baseless - none of them would last a year in Russia. There was a funny story in 2016 - a German family with nine kids moved to Russia because of "degenerate German sex education lessons" their kids were forced to attend. They got themselves a house in the Siberian countryside and planned to open a farm. /pol/ loved this, dozens parroted how they would also move to "based, Christian, white Russia" soon. Two months passed, and the family returned back to Germany, never to be heard from again.

 

[cybertoaster]

View attachment 4889610
at this point I'm betting that if launched half are gonna crash in Russia and the other half are nonfunctional or barely work

We know those nukes work because the soviets were insane enough to detonate a bunch of them including a 50-megaton one.

However we do know that because their enrichment process was half-assed their bombs are dirtier than ours, but that works in their favor and against anyone who becomes a target and irradiated forever. Also their ICBMs are not as precise as ours but again that's rendered meaningless when each R-36 missile carries 10 MIRVs in the megaton range plus a combo of 40 dummies/chaf/jammers making it next to impossible to fully intercept.

And it makes no difference if it falls a few miles off target because the burn area its tens if not hundreds of miles big.

And like I said this tech is almost ancient now, very few nations can make a working supercruise-able jet engine but practically anybody with a nuclear reactor can make a nuke, just look at north korea. ICBMs aren't that far off either, its 1960's tech after all.

Anyone that matters in government understands this which is why we're not giving ukraine the weapons they demand to "strike inside russia" because we know that when that happens the nukes will be flying, and we don't want them flying in our direction.

Of course zelensky has already been told by our glowies that his "strike inside russia" idea will only get him vaporized and he kinds of knows that but he still pushes along with improvised loitering munitions to achieve this because the alternative is getting into a who-bleeds-out-faster competition with russia which is basically what happened between germany and france during WWI, and he wants to avoid (or can't afford to do) that.

Fun trivia: the og R-36 system was developed by yuzhnoye in dnipro. Its very ironic that they might become the first actual target of their own device.

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

Anyone that matters in government understands this which is why we're not giving ukraine the weapons they demand to "strike inside russia" because we know that when that happens the nukes will be flying, and we don't want them flying in our direction.

They are already striking inside ruzzia and I really don't know why Putin will make a more issue after shelling some town in ruzzia than shelling some town in annexed parts of Ukraine. Both Crimea and IDK Belgorod are in his narration ruzzian cities, so why he should make a affair because Belgorod is burning?

Also Ukraine probably have zero nuclear warheads, and also no interest in starting a nuclear exchenge. If they had one, they probably will use it in own test range to demonstrate that they have ability to make a big BOOM (and thrown their ability to join NATO into toilet...) and force a peace with ruzzia.