UN Farmers rally over first lady’s comments on banning dog meat - I thought they might have stopped eating dogs after seeing the number of pet dogs on the streets over there

SEOUL, South Korea (AP) — Dozens of dog farmers in South Korea rallied Tuesday to criticize the country’s first lady over her reported comments that support a possible ban on dog meat consumption.

Eating dog is a centuries-old Korean practice. But there have been growing calls for outlawing it in South Korea as animal rights campaigns have influenced public perception and eating dog meat has fallen out of favor with most younger people.

In late 2021, a government-civilian committee was launched to reach a social consensus on ending dog meat consumption, but no breakthrough has been reported yet. Farmers demand authorities present more concrete compensation steps or allow them to maintain their businesses for about 15-20 years until older people, who are the main source of demand for the meat, die.

About 50 dog farmers gathered Tuesday near the office of President Yoon Suk Yeol to protest remarks made by his wife, Kim Keon Hee, during a private luncheon with animal rights activists earlier in April.

Some local media outlets reported Kim told the activists that she would effort an end to dog meat consumption for the duration of Yoon’s term, which ends in 2027. Dog farmers argued Kim isn’t entitled to make such a policy promise because she isn’t a government official. They also accused her of undermining their rights to their livelihoods and happiness.

Yoon’s office declined to confirm the contents of Kim’s conversation with the activists because their luncheon was organized as a closed-door meeting.

Attendee Jo Hee Kyung, who heads the Korean Animal Welfare Association, said Kim’s comments reported in the media were largely taken out of context. Jo said Kim did not discuss policies but rather expressed her personal hopes for the end of dog meat consumption during an informal meeting meant to cheer up animal rights activists. Jo said Kim told them that TV programs reporting animal abuses made her heart ache. She said they felt grateful to Kim for sharing her views backing a potential ban.

Kim and Yoon are known as pet lovers. They raise six dogs and five cats. Jo said Kim had long held interests in animal rights movements even before Yoon became president in 2022.

But Ju Yeongbong, an official at an association of dog farmers, said he believes that animals rights activists were trying to cover up Kim’s comments.

During the rally, farmers pumped their fists and chanted slogans demanding Kim withdraw her reported comments and the government formulate steps to support the farmers. “Guarantee our livelihoods! Guarantee!” they shouted.

They said they later visited a police station to file complaints against Kim for allegedly hurting their rights to maintain livelihoods, seek happiness and select jobs.

Chae IlTaek, an activist at the Korean Animal Welfare Association, called dog meat consumption “an anachronistic business” that should have been shut down.

About 1 million dogs are slaughtered for food annually in South Korea, a decrease from more than 3 million annually about 10-20 years ago, according to Ju.

Dog meat is neither legally protected nor explicitly banned in South Korea. During election campaigning, Yoon said he personally opposed dog meat consumption but formulating a policy on outlawing it would require a public consensus.

https://apnews.com/article/south-korea-dog-meat-farmers-c0f7cc77c9ece49d38b5ef30f1d6441d (Archive)

 

[Seafarer]

My guess would be that it's famine food that a few people got nostalgic about, much in the way some of us might feel about the cheap ramen we ate in college, and now pass off as a cuisine. There are small pockets of Europe where you can get dog meat, but this is Asia, where a mass starvation event is pretty much guaranteed more than once a century.

That’s also the reason why jellied eels are a thing in the U.K., because the river Thames was historically very polluted, eels were the most plentiful fish in the river, and were often the only meat poor Londoners were able to get.

 

[Agamemnon Busmalis]

It does not. You have a culturally-imbued aversion to eating dogs, which is fine by itself but comes off as ridiculous when you seriously try to draw the line at eating dogs despite being willing to eat other animals.

I'm still waiting for the "not muh heckin' doggerino!" shoe to drop in this thread.

Same with horse meat. There's no objective reason why it's acceptable to eat a pig but not a horse, it's just a cultural relic from times past.

Arguably from the perspective of the animal's intelligence and self-awareness, as well as from the potential health risks of parasites and other diseases, eating pigs is worse.

 

[Bionicle of War]

I wonder if dogs would make good food for other dogs?

 

[George Lucas]

I had a gator burger once, when I was 16.

It didn't taste much different from a regular burger, but my palate may just be unrefined-- despite my father's efforts, now that I'm thinking about it.


It does not. You have a culturally-imbued aversion to eating dogs, which is fine by itself but comes off as ridiculous when you seriously try to draw the line at eating dogs despite being willing to eat other animals.

I'm still waiting for the "not muh heckin' doggerino!" shoe to drop in this thread.

How does it come off as ridiculous? Dogs were domesticated to be our companions. The kinds of animals I eat are domesticated for food or from the sea. I do not eat bushmeat. You can absolutely draw a line on eating certain types of animals just like you can draw a line on eating people, and those lines can be based on some logical argument (eating bushmeat spreads diseases) or some moral one (dogs are a friend). The reasoning doesn’t matter. You are inductive reasoning by class which is utterly insane because it is based off of some arbitrary definition (e.g. turtles eat fish, fish are animals, therefore turtles can also eat dogs).

Find me evidence of early man eating dogs. You will not find it. It is against human nature. The eating of dogs is what is culturally imbued, not the aversion to it.

 

[kcbbq]

Eh, alligator is pretty chewy and I think they're closer to birds than mammals* which means they should be delicious since birds often are. I guess I should have clarified that mammalian predators tend to taste awful or at least I always read that.

*Not a biologist.

With birds it comes down to what they eat. For wild ducks and geese, the more plants they eat the better they taste, the more animals, the worse. Most Canada goose subspecies are fantastic, while nothing can be done to make a snow goose taste any good outside of potent marinades and shit tons of spices and desperate prayers.

Alligator supposedly tastes good. Always forget to try it when I have the chance, unfortunately. Almost got to go to a place that served rattlesnake as a kid. My mom was outraged, so no rattlesnake for me.

Reptiles tend to be the one exception where predator species have a chance go taste pretty good. Rattlesnake is really good, but you'll probably only want it once because it's annoying to eat because the parts you usually eat are all ribcage. So many bones, so little payoff.

I've never found anything better than kangaroo. Beefalo (American bison/beef cattle hybrid) comes close. All the flavor of bison, but more tender and not as dry. Red kangaroo loin is just heaven, though.

 

[Zero Day Defense]

How does it come off as ridiculous? Dogs were domesticated to be our companions. The kinds of animals I eat are domesticated for food or from the sea. I do not eat bushmeat.

None of that makes the act of eating dogs or bushmeat any more immoral than eating any other edible animal. If the issue is health, then the solution is to process the meat into being safe for consumption.

You can absolutely draw a line on eating certain types of animals just like you can draw a line on eating people,

I draw a line at eating people because that's cannibalism and murder.

You can absolutely draw a line on eating certain types of animals just like you can draw a line on eating people, and those lines can be based on some logical argument (eating bushmeat spreads diseases) or some moral one (dogs are a friend)

Putting aside that dogs are clearly no friends any of the people they maul, Koreans are clearly no friends of dogs, and dog farmers presumably raise them with the mindset of them being livestock rather than friends-- so it must be fine for them from a moral standpoint, according to either of our arguments.

Dogs don't come out their mother's womb docile-- they're just easier to domesticate compared to wolves.

You are inductive reasoning by class which is utterly insane because it is based off of some arbitrary definition (e.g. turtles eat fish, fish are animals, therefore turtles can also eat dogs).

Wait, what are you going on about? The difference between man and other animals is as simple as man not being other animals. That's not arbitrary at all, and it's not "inductive reasoning".

 

[George Lucas]

None of that makes the act of eating dogs or bushmeat any more immoral than eating any other edible animal. If the issue is health, then the solution is to process the meat into being safe for consumption.


I draw a line at eating people because that's cannibalism and murder.


Putting aside that dogs are clearly no friends any of the people they maul, Koreans are clearly no friends of dogs, and dog farmers presumably raise them with the mindset of them being livestock rather than friends-- so it must be fine for them from a moral standpoint, according to either of our arguments.


Wait, what are you going on about? The difference between man and other animals is as simple as man not being other animals. That's not arbitrary at all, and it's not "inductive reasoning".

I believe in objective morality, not a subjective one. Eating dogs is evil. Koreans who eat dogs are evil, even if they don’t think they are. To say that’s ridiculous is to play the role of the devil’s mouth.

 

[Zero Day Defense]

I believe in objective morality, not a subjective one. Eating dogs is evil. Koreans who eat dogs are evil, even if they don’t think they are. To say that’s ridiculous is to play the role of the devil’s mouth.

I wasn't expecting "muh heckin' doggerinos!" this quickly.

I mean, evil? That's just hysterical. "Playing the role of the devil's mouth"? I must have forgot the part of the Council of Jerusalem where they maintained the restriction of eating dogs.

 

[s0mbra]

I wouldn't really care if they didn't fucking torture them and treat them like shit before the deed.
Sounds disgusting, and I'd never eat it (and I'm pretty open to eating weird shit), and not only does carnivore meat taste like shit like others have said, but something tells me some backwater bugman isn't feeding the dogs locked up in cages a proper carnivore diet, meaning they probably taste even more like shit

But there is a part of me that agrees it's fucked up on a moral standpoint. Anyone who's interested should look into the evolution of dogs and how humans evolved along side them, and how dogs helped shape our history and possibly even the way we hunted. We probably owe our existence to dogs, tbh

You know what? Nah fuck these people fuck eating dog.

Ps: gator is only chewy if it's overcooked. It's also super tasty.

 

[Phalanges Mycologist]

Cultural biases aside... I've always read that predator meat tastes terrible to begin with so I've never understood why people would make an industry out of it.

It also carries over a lot of diseases that they might be able to manage so that's why Preditors very arely eat other preditors,

Alligator supposedly tastes good. Always forget to try it when I have the chance, unfortunately. Almost got to go to a place that served rattlesnake as a kid. My mom was outraged, so no rattlesnake for me.

I've tried it albiet frozen and didn't like it, then again I don't really like shark and I thought the two where almost exactly the same in texture but where both kinda flavorless.

I believe dog-eating goes against human instinct, as dogs are not traditional livestock. Some abominable event has to trigger it. Greater China (including Korea) is rather war-torn, so I imagine dog-eating came out of that. They don’t eat dogs in Japan because Japan never had the kind of terrible wars the mainland had.

The worst part about eating a dog would be eating an animal that thinks you're its friend.

Pets are really something that only (comparatively) rich people can have. For the vast majority of human history, animals have been domesticated to be useful. I mean, I love horses but I don't understand why people get upset about eating them. They're huge animals with a limited useful lifespan, and if one broke its leg back in the bad old days, that fucker got eaten, not buried or burned. Cows and steers can make for adorable, massive pets, but it doesn't stop them from being food.

That said, even if a domestic animal is destined for the pot, you still have an obligation to treat them humanely. And from what I've seen, most dog meat industries around the world are horrifically cruel. When an animal is domesticated, it's a mutual obligation.

We're evolved to like dogs, like dogs are evolved to like humans. We're a fascinating symbiotic species in that way.

Dog's (or well Wolves at first) complement humans really well and that's why we started co-operating so early on before any other animal Dog's and Wolves where our mate who had a nose and we had the endurance combine the two together and you get a super predatory duo that concqures the world unlike any other. It's sorta arguable we would be where we are without the assistance Dog's have given us.

Even if the concept of a pure companion animal is new, Dog's have a special place by our side.

Braver than me, the furthest I'm willing to go is alligator and raccoon, the latter due to me living in Illinois when I was young and finding them to be complete pests

I eat Rabbit fairly regularly (they are fucking pests in my Veg garden), Squirrel occasionally, Venison whenever I can get it but there are some animals I'd just rather not eat.

That’s also the reason why jellied eels are a thing in the U.K., because the river Thames was historically very polluted, eels were the most plentiful fish in the river, and were often the only meat poor Londoners were able to get.

Eel's are an amazing animal, but I am really pissed off with this thing that comes back every 10 or so years of Cheff's trying to make Jellied Eels a thing outside of london, it's not going to happen as it's possibly the worst way to eat them doesn't matter what you do to them they always end up like chunkey snot - Incidentally Elvers (Juvenile Eels) with smoked bacon, and a goose egg with some black pepper is my fave but I only have it once a year.

 

[VargReallyDidNothingWrong]

Dogs don't come out their mother's womb docile

Yes they do. They've been selectively bred for centuries to come out of the womb docile. That's sort of the whole point of domestication, and it was done supremely well with dogs.

If you get a puppy in a litter that ISN'T naturally docile with humans you usually cull it or don't let it breed because it's not demonstrating the right temperament for a domesticated dog. The only people who don't follow this concept are shitbull breeders and other people trying to make psychotic fighting dogs

 

[George Lucas]

I wasn't expecting "muh heckin' doggerinos!" this quickly.

I mean, evil? That's just hysterical. "Playing the role of the devil's mouth"? I must have forgot the part of the Council of Jerusalem where they maintained the restriction of eating dogs.

I already pointed that early man did not eat dogs. Your attempts to make my statements seem based on emotion is truly a work of deception and devilry. You’d do well to spend time with an exorcist.

 

[Zero Day Defense]

Yes they do. They've been selectively bred for centuries to come out of the womb docile. That's sort of the whole point of domestication.

They're more capable of being domesticated because of that breeding, compared to wolves. Especially depending on the breed, that doesn't automatically make them docile-- they still need to be trained or they're going to bite a kid's face off despite being more dopey.

I already pointed that early man did not eat dogs.

They didn't eat a lot of things before they did. Doesn't have anything to do with morality.

You’re attempts to make my statements seem based on emotion is truly a work of deception and devilry. You’d do well to spend time with an exorcist.

Open question: do dogs have their own kind of brain parasite like cats have, that makes dog fanatics out of dog owners?

 

[VargReallyDidNothingWrong]

They're more capable of being domesticated because of that breeding, compared to wolves. Especially depending on the breed, that doesn't automatically make them docile-- they still need to be trained or they're going to bite a kid's face off despite being more dopey.

Nitpicky bullshit argument, sorry, not going to spend time engaging further on this topic.

Dogs are genetically predisposed through centuries of cohabitation with humans to be loyal and trusting towards humans. Using them as food does a disservice to this genetic predisposition and IMO is immoral and distasteful. You can have your own version of morality if you want but I'm still going to think you're an inhuman bug being if you advocate for eating dogs.

End of.

 

[Akashic Retard]

Animals should be used for the purpose the best fulfill. It just so happens that dogs make better friends than food.

 

[Agamemnon Busmalis]

Animals should be used for the purpose the best fulfill. It just so happens that dogs make better friends than food.

For that matter oxen and horses also make better draft animals than dinner, or at least they did until the tractor and truck came along. Beef was a pretty uncommon food until very recently, as is the concept of raising cattle solely to slaughter them for their meat.

 

[Zero Day Defense]

Dogs are genetically--

You can't will your sensibilities into being morality by hobbling together statements from a science that explicitly cannot dictate or support morality.

I'm astounded by the seemingly Western fervency over domestic animals as a category, sometimes above and beyond that for human children and/or humans of other races.

I wouldn't eat a dog, by the way. They probably taste terrible.

 

[George Lucas]

You can't will your sensibilities into being morality by hobbling together statements from a science that explicitly cannot dictate or support morality.

I'm astounded by the seemingly Western fervency over domestic animals as a category, sometimes above and beyond that for human children and/or humans of other races.

I wouldn't eat a dog, by the way. They probably taste terrible.

You are a city-dwelling faggot who knows nothing about animal husbandry. You have repeatedly been proven wrong about the subject of dog domestication, and yet you keep doubling down on this idea that dogs are ferocious beasts with an urge to maul humans.

Wolves do not even have an instinct to harm humans. Wolves are generally afraid of humans, and avoid confrontation with other wolves. They only get into serious fights when there is an opportunity to establish a new order in a pack. They are opportunistic hunters. They will not hunt anything that they feel will put up a fight.

The dogs that are most at risk to harm humans are of three types: terriers, who are small and overlooked, and bulls and mastiffs, who are large enough to do serious damage. All of these were bred to attack or guard things in a very un-wolfish way. Their aloof characteristics are very unnatural compared to wolves, and it actually takes generations to make a breed reliable at guarding or attacking things. Other breeds actually do come out of the womb docile. As said before, they were bred to be that way.

 

[VargReallyDidNothingWrong]

You can't will your sensibilities into being morality by hobbling together statements from a science

My morality doesn't come from science, it comes from what I intrinsically believe to be right. The factual justification for it is simply that, justification. If I didn't know genetics existed I would still be against eating dogs.

 

[Phalanges Mycologist]

For that matter oxen and horses also make better draft animals than dinner, or at least they did until the tractor and truck came along. Beef was a pretty uncommon food until very recently, as is the concept of raising cattle solely to slaughter them for their meat.

Funny you should mention that, Horses as a Draft animal is relatively new, before the 1600's they where rare and often just bad seeds from the "Destria" lines of horses that where nearly exclusively the domain of nobility, if you wanted to move mass historically you'd chose Ox, they where not as fast as a horse but they would keep on pulling (an still do) long after a horse is spent.

Through my Fiancee I know someone who has a dedicated Destria breeding Pair who are kept pure but are used to strengthen Shire Horse lines that start deviating and it's a really interesting history especially in familys who have been horse breeders for generations - Just so you have an idea of this kind of breeding I can't ride a standard horse today I am just too heavy, but a Destria or a Shire I am nothing to the weight it can carry, but a Shire doesn't like being ridden without training and getting to know the rider they would rather pull and they will pull anything - but a team of Ox will pull more mass just a lot slower.