Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

[Doctor of Autism]

Honestly Viv really had the same issue the Simpsons writers did for the Simpsons movie with Fizz and Asmodeus. For context, a james bond parody villain, Hank Scorpio, was planned to be the villain of the Simpsons movie but the writers replaced him with a generic movie villain due to Scorpio's likeability.

I feel the same thing is applying here that due to Fizz and Asmodeus being gay and very likeable, Viv basically took away all of their likeable qualities to make them into heroic characters.

I feel like if anyone else is going to get this treatment, probably Verosika will given her huge fanbase, though given how most female characters in Viv's shows are mostly shallow or evil, she'll probably become worse for some reason or become a good guy because of some more cartoonishly evil character.

Like it says a lot about Viv's writing that a lot of children's cartoons, even in the modern day could write more compelling characters/villains or even romances than any of her shows.

The only cope is that she's more wrangled on Hazbin and has more focus compared to Helluva which are her more unhinged ideas that couldn't go through to Amazon, but that's being too optimistic and I can only go in Hazbin with very low expectations, it being even just mediocre would be a massive surprise.

 

[Vyse Inglebard]

Spoiler: A former concept artist from Helluva chimes in.

here's the really juicy bit:

 

[AnOminous]

Maybe the real Helluva Boss was the Vivzies we met along the way.

 

[NoReturn]

they always feel like they have a good or decent first impression (in reference to past comments I've made about Striker, how his introduction to the series in season 1 was really good and he left a good lasting impression) and then when they appear again; it feels like their character is bastardized. Striker is a prime example, and now I feel like Fizz is.

This is probably a weird comparison, but the same thing happened with Bumi from Avatar: Legend of Korra. The guy's intro was perfect. They set you up for this cool character who would be the only non-bender child born to not only a family of benders, but the avatar himself. In less than 10 seconds they implied the existence of a character who was cool, confident, and crazy enough to overcome that hurdle.
Then they flushed it all away because the actual character was completely different.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Watching the episode itself, it probably could've worked if they gave a lot of build up for this. But Viv seems to rush into triumphant payoffs as though they had a lot of build up when Season 1 Fizz was a rival to Blitzo but now he's suddenly the estranged best friend. Like this stuff would be fine if Fizz was the main character, but this was still supposed to be a show about demon hitmen killing humans for profit.

Fizz and Asmodeus are still likeable despite it but it felt like their redeemable qualities were rushed out given they were scumbags to the main characters in season 1 but they're gay so it's instant redemption for them.

The weird fan strawmen also felt weird. The way he acted resembled a fujo who didn't have their ship validated or someone like Helldeath who makes weird self insert fanfictions of the show than a hater.

Mammon is probably the only good thing about the episode since he feels like he'd fit in with season 1's humor and was actually funny, though that could also be attributed to the voice actor really selling on him.

Overall, the episode would've been fine if it was one that had actual build up to it, it feels like several episodes are missing that would've made watching this actually satisfying. It feels like Viv thinks she's writing the 3rd or 4th season of a show that won Emmy's and she writes triumphant character moments that have little build up to them or were rushed. It also really feeds into the complaints that Viv cares more about her side characters than the main characters or focus of the show.

 

[Gender: Xenomorph]

but this was still supposed to be a show about demon hitmen killing humans for profit.

Wrong thread, buddy

The class system of hell is only ever brought in when the plot demands it, and even then it still doesn't make sense. Imps are the lowest on the totem pole, but they can still run their own businesses, become celebrities, run the mafia. If it was only a few of them that would be okay, but it appears they have the same equal footing as the average hellborn. They're not even segregated against. There's no separate area for them to be in at Ozzie's places or at Mammon's concert. In fact, both times there seems to be a majority of imps.

The author has no idea how the caste system/discrimination works.

 

[The Fair Lady]

Fizz and Asmodeus are still likeable despite it but it felt like their redeemable qualities were rushed out given they were scumbags to the main characters in season 1 but they're gay so it's instant redemption for them.

Definitely. I would've liked at least a little bit more of the two acting antagonistic before the 180 if Viv was so insistent on turning them good, Fizz forgave Blitzo way too easily in the last episode. This is turning into a recurring problem and I don't see it going away.

Also yeah the class system and what is and isn't considered taboo is a hot mess, Viv is ass at consistency with her lore.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Definitely. I would've liked at least a little bit more of the two acting antagonistic before the 180 if Viv was so insistent on turning them good, Fizz forgave Blitzo way too easily in the last episode. This is turning into a recurring problem and I don't see it going away.

Yeah like I would've liked the last two episodes more if there was at least more time for Fizz and Ozzie to be antagonistic prior to them. It's like showing a villain's tragic backstory right after they burn a bunch of children or something.

Like Viv can do a decent beginning and ending, but the path to get there is nonexistent which makes these resolutions feel unearned and ruins any possible stakes that could be had.

 

[AnOminous]

Fizz and Asmodeus are still likeable despite it but it felt like their redeemable qualities were rushed out given they were scumbags to the main characters in season 1 but they're gay so it's instant redemption for them.

Really the worst they did was a musical number making fun of them. They were way meaner to Moxxie.

 

[The Nothingness]

it felt like their redeemable qualities were rushed out given they were scumbags to the main characters in season 1 but they're gay so it's instant redemption for them.

They were way meaner to Moxxie.

Having Asmodeus and Fizz no longer hide their relationship from the public just makes their mockery of Moxxie and Millie being faithful to one another pointless, especially since Asmodeus business centering around lust. It has been mentioned earlier that Mammon is the only Sin who is not the opposite of the vice associated with him. Lucifer will most likely be another terrible dad so I don't expect him to show much pride.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Having Asmodeus and Fizz no longer hide their relationship from the public just makes their mockery of Moxxie and Millie being faithful to one another pointless, especially since Asmodeus business centering around lust. It has been mentioned earlier that Mammon is the only Sin who is not the opposite of the vice associated with him. Lucifer will most likely be another terrible dad so I don't expect him to show much pride.

With the leaks, Lucifer is probably some loser who gets bullied by his wife who is the real bad guy and has no self respect.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

This reminds me of S1 Ep2 where the episode would have been fine if it had more build up to it. It's more of a season 2 episode.

I mean, now there's other problems with it due to other episodes but you get what I mean.

 

[AnOminous]

Lucifer will most likely be another terrible dad so I don't expect him to show much pride.

Among all the other issues, we really haven't seen daddy issues being a thing with Vivz, even with Charlie's issues. She's generally been favorable to dads, including really fucked-up ones like Blitzo and Stolas.

One of my favorites from personal feels perspective was Loona actually talking to Octavia honestly, for a rare moment from a character who is usually just an absolute lunatic, telling her to cut her dad some slack because while he wasn't perfect, he was actually trying.

I just wish the show wasn't every character learning every lesson over and over again. You know that kind of shit. It's like this show is reiterating MLP but with more massively gay shit.

 

[LucasSomething]

The class system of hell is only ever brought in when the plot demands it, and even then it still doesn't make sense. Imps are the lowest on the totem pole, but they can still run their own businesses, become celebrities, run the mafia. If it was only a few of them that would be okay, but it appears they have the same equal footing as the average hellborn. They're not even segregated against. There's no separate area for them to be in at Ozzie's places or at Mammon's concert. In fact, both times there seems to be a majority of imps.

Like you said, majority of Mammon's crowd were casually dressed imps AND hounds meaning they actually, Mammon was picking multiple money bags from them as if they could all afford to spend so much on one single circus show. It all goes against the times they implied imps have job/money struggles and are rare outside Wrath ring.

There is also the irony that for as evil as he's portrayed, Mammon isnt actually racist or classissit. He said the winner gets to be "The new face of his brand" and he chose a crippled imp. He didnt insult Ozzy for loving an imp either. He obviously likes exploiting his fans but seems more like general greed than seeing them as lower beings.

This whole thing reminds me of Rwby's schrodinger racism where it only exists at random contrived dramatic moments. Like i said with season 2, world building will be shattered whenever it's convenient for the joke or plot they want to make at the time.

One other thing i have to wonder is why Mammon gets THAT triggered about fizz quit anyway. Like yeah, he was popular but so what, he was just ONE actor. If mammon depended on fizz to make money then he's pathetic. You'd think Mammon controlled his employees but nope, he never had fizz sign a contract or anything.

 

[A Grey Cat]

When bluey introduced a deaf kid who talked in sign language most people didn't give a shit cause bleuy is a kids show and characters like that have popped on kids shows since the 90s on public access tv.

Helluva boss git flack for it cause this is or was meant to be an adult cartoon, and one that's place in literally hell. It's funny how vivzie once responded to the criticism of her show being "offensive" with it takes in hell its supposed to be offensive yet she's gone out of her way to defang the setting g of hell for years at this point.

 

[Prince Vegeta]

This whole 'adult cartoon' bit irritates me. Irrationally so. Vivz' stuff comes across so juvenile and childish. And that includes the sex and sexual stuff. Hell, even absolutely shit cartoons (that I love) like Harvey Birdman that are 99% sexjokes are more grown up than this stuff. Mostly because they don't pretend to be more than they are.

 

[Weppers]

When bluey introduced a deaf kid who talked in sign language most people didn't give a shit cause bleuy is a kids show and characters like that have popped on kids shows since the 90s on public access tv.

Helluva boss git flack for it cause this is or was meant to be an adult cartoon, and one that's place in literally hell. It's funny how vivzie once responded to the criticism of her show being "offensive" with it takes in hell its supposed to be offensive yet she's gone out of her way to defang the setting g of hell for years at this point.

The deaf go to Hell.

 

[Vyse Inglebard]

"OK. FUCK YOU MOM, FOR CUTTING MY DICK OFF BECAUSE I PLAYED WITH A BARBIE DOLL ONCE!"



....."what? I took your advice!"

 

[lobo de la muerte]

Holy shit I didn't realized Viv even had a thread on here


After like watching her being a bitch about people not liking her and her ass kisser stans keep praising her

I was like "damn, wonder if there was a thread on her."

 

[AnOminous]

"OK. FUCK YOU MOM, FOR CUTTING MY DICK OFF BECAUSE I PLAYED WITH A BARBIE DOLL ONCE!"

What exactly is she vaguing about? Is it so she can't be called out?