Scarthew
kiwifarms.net
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- Jun 7, 2021
The Gamecube controller was unfairly criticized and is actually one of the most ergonomic and well-designed controllers ever made
- Thread starter George Lucas
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- Mar 1, 2020
It felt okay when games were designed around it. Metroid Prime and Wind Waker played great on it. I always preferred the pivoting triggers on Xbox controllers to the straight-pull triggers on GameCube and PlayStation, though; they felt better for analog inputs like throttle and brake in racing games, and as gun triggers in shooters.
- Joined
- Jul 3, 2021
With all this talk about N64 controllers I decided to grab one and mess around with it.
It’s a lot more ergonomic than I remember. It didn’t feel awkard at all. I noticed that I hold it (joystick position) at an angle, so that it’s rotated to about the one o’clock position. This actually gives the thumb a relative position closer to the Dualshock than the Gamecube controller.
The stick is in really good shape still (I lubricated all my sticks one time). The response feels linear.
So I think when you see pictures of it you think it’s an awkward mess, but when you actually hold it it works out pretty well. The biggest flaw IMO is that the C-buttons are a little too small.
It’s a lot more ergonomic than I remember. It didn’t feel awkard at all. I noticed that I hold it (joystick position) at an angle, so that it’s rotated to about the one o’clock position. This actually gives the thumb a relative position closer to the Dualshock than the Gamecube controller.
The stick is in really good shape still (I lubricated all my sticks one time). The response feels linear.
So I think when you see pictures of it you think it’s an awkward mess, but when you actually hold it it works out pretty well. The biggest flaw IMO is that the C-buttons are a little too small.
Scarthew
kiwifarms.net
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- Jun 7, 2021
It also sits really well on one hand because of the arch design and top heavy weight. If you take one hand off you can easily lazy cradle it without any real grip. Its a perfectly good controller especially for the games made for it. The stick comes loose or can outright snap easily though.
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- Jun 18, 2019
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- Sep 28, 2022
The Dual Analog released in August-September of 1997.
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- Aug 5, 2022
joycons are very smol. i have swallowed larger fish oil capsules. they hurt my normal-sized man hands if I play for too long.
I like the HD vibration a lot though, it's a shame the third-party controllers I had to swap them out for so I wouldn't accidentally inhale em don't support it
Scarthew
kiwifarms.net
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- Jun 7, 2021
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- Feb 3, 2013
The cube shoulders feel like they'd be fucking amazing for later MGS games since it can combine the inputs for drawing/aiming and firing onto a single button due to the combined analog slider and click button
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- Sep 7, 2019
come on, I know you're smarter than this. for one the touchpad was always a gimmick because everything that's not in the xinput spec needs extra work to implement no matter how useful or "forward-thinking", and we all know how much publishers pay extra for that. case in point: gyro.
also since I stumbled upon it again here a picture what he's talking about:
a dance dance revolution mat?
speaking of...
I swear there was a post talking about stuff getting trapped under the sticks which made me look for this, but now I can't find it anymore..
- Joined
- Jul 3, 2021
It seems the Xinput spec was specifically designed to hamstring anything that isn’t an Xbox controller. I wonder what flight sim enthusiasts think of Xinput vs Dinput because they always seem to have setups with a gorillion knobs and buttons and other gizmos.come on, I know you're smarter than this. for one the touchpad was always a gimmick because everything that's not in the xinput spec needs extra work to implement no matter how useful or "forward-thinking", and we all know how much publishers pay extra for that. case in point: gyro.
also since I stumbled upon it again here a picture what he's talking about:
View attachment 5950475
a dance dance revolution mat?
speaking of...
View attachment 5950496
I swear there was a post talking about stuff getting trapped under the sticks which made me look for this, but now I can't find it anymore..
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2019
Oh look it's one of these again:
Now, to try and have an actual discussion instead of a /v/ tier shit flinging competition, tell me, how many games designed for the DS3/X360 controller were designed in a way where you used the D-pad as much as you do the left analog stick or action buttons that you have to use both of them simultaneously at the same time that the X360 controller is completely unusable because of that?
Let's clear up the main fact: video games, as well as console controllers, were, are, and will be designed with the average consumer in mind. Both the DualShock 3 and the Xbox 360 controller were designed so that when your average Joe comes back home from work, he can power up the console, grab a controller and have a good time. Keep this fact in mind.
For the longest time, the D-pad was the main way to control the game. But with the advent of analog sticks, it became clear that the analog stick will become the main way of controlling the game, but the D-pad was left in as a legacy control. With this change, the game design also changed, and the D-pad got delegated to the lesser actions.
Example 1: Need for Speed: Most Wanted. The D-pad was only used to interact with map markers for the garage, car dealer, tuning shop or races and to access your inbox. All the important actions were realized with the left stick and the action buttons.
Example 2: Red Dead Redemption. The D-pad was dedicated only for calling your horse, camera adjustments and minimap zoom. Arguably the least important actions in the game.
The only case I can think of where the D-pad is so important that you have to use it simultaneously with the left stick is people trying to be the best in difficult games like Dark Souls. Those people are a fringe minority and controller design doesn't use them as the priority.
However, when we look at controller design alongside the gameplay design from the perspective of the average consumer, asymmetrical sticks make sense, because your hands are symmetrical, and the moment you grab a controller your thumbs land on the same height. Therefore it is logical to move the left stick to the same height as the action buttons, as you'll be using these more than the D-pad and the right stick.
As far as I've seen, people swearing by PlayStation's layout are either people who are loyal to PlayStation/got used to it, or people that are trying too hard to get a competitive edge out of a piece of hardware designed for the average consumer. If you're from the latter group, and I believe you are, instead of complaining about controllers designed for the general population, you should look into whether or not people like you came up with a better product to fill your niche. That's how the Smash board controllers were born, because people started competitively playing a game designed to be played on a controller meant for the general population to just sit back and relax.
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- Jul 3, 2021
@Slav Power your argument is all about what ‘casual gamers’ prefer, but aren’t the most popular casual games in the west FPSs and other first-person games like Minecraft? In those games, you use both sticks constantly, so the DualShock layout becomes the symmetrical.
Even the flagship series of Xbox is Halo, an FPS.
Not saying I disagree with you, but I’m someone who is no lover of the DualShock, being the OP of this thread, and even I prefer DualShock layout for shooters if I can’t use mouse+keyboard. Never tried the Wii U Pro Controller’s layout though. Maybe that’s even better?
Even the flagship series of Xbox is Halo, an FPS.
Not saying I disagree with you, but I’m someone who is no lover of the DualShock, being the OP of this thread, and even I prefer DualShock layout for shooters if I can’t use mouse+keyboard. Never tried the Wii U Pro Controller’s layout though. Maybe that’s even better?
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2019
I'm hopeful that Valve will make a Steam Controller 2 that'll apply what they learned with the Steam Deck to a controller, and that includes having the controls in line, plus the touchpads and the gyroscope with all of Steam Input's goodness. Obviously tryhards will despise it as they won't be able to hold a claw grip on every single control, but for everyone else it seems like the best option.
As for the right stick, the issue with FPS games on a controller is how you need to use your right thumb for both the action buttons and camera controls, because bumpers and triggers can only do so much. That's the main shortcoming of controllers that I've experienced and both camps suffer from it. With a mouse and keyboard you dedicate your left hand to a massive amount of buttons, and your right hand to the camera controls and triggers. You never get confused or run out of fingers when playing FPS games here and that's why PC's excel in this genre, not to mention that the mouse is a more precise analog control for the camera than the right stick.
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- Oct 3, 2022
iirc Twin Snakes was okay, but really not particularly better than the PS2 was for MGS2, controllerwise
Grub
kiwifarms.net
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- Jul 2, 2021
All these people talking about N64 controllers forgetting the worst thing about them wasn't the stupid 3 prong design, it was the horrendous quality of the control stick and the games that forced you to spin the control stick really fast, Mario 64, Mario Party 1, those games, and other ones like it were the controller killers. Play enough of those and the stick's fucked. Between me and my siblings and our cousins that lived nearby, we had 6 controllers, out of all those, 2 had properly working control sticks, one of them had a mostly passable but still not great stick and player 4 was fucked, good luck none of the rest of them worked for shit. Even if you didn't play controller killer games, they still wore out over time.
The gamecube controller's kinda shitty, but one thing it did right was its control stick, at least compared to the n64. That shit was beefy and I've never come across a gamecube controller with a control stick that's fucked the way n64 ones got. It would be a better controller if the A button was smaller, the b button was bigger and the d-pad wasn't such a piece of shit. I like the placement and shape of the x and y buttons. The top and right buttons usually end up being used as utility buttons on controllers anyway even with the dualshock/Xbox layout, might as well make that apparent in the design. I don't like the R and L buttons and I didn't even realize they were analog triggers until I read it on the internet long after I stopped playing my gamecube.
The gamecube controller's not bad overall. It's not my favourite but I don't mind using them. I think they're an improvement over the n64 controller for the most part but I never really had a problem with the n64 controller apart from the shitty sticks. But that's a really big fuckup to the point where they stopped making games that had you spin the controller really fast because it was killing controllers. But I don't fuck around with any of those controllers any more, because fuck that shit, and whenever I emulate n64 or gamecube games or pretty much any game I just use one of those 8bitdo controllers that's pretty much a snes controller with joysticks and extra R and L buttons added and it works just fine for pretty much any of those games I play.
The gamecube controller's kinda shitty, but one thing it did right was its control stick, at least compared to the n64. That shit was beefy and I've never come across a gamecube controller with a control stick that's fucked the way n64 ones got. It would be a better controller if the A button was smaller, the b button was bigger and the d-pad wasn't such a piece of shit. I like the placement and shape of the x and y buttons. The top and right buttons usually end up being used as utility buttons on controllers anyway even with the dualshock/Xbox layout, might as well make that apparent in the design. I don't like the R and L buttons and I didn't even realize they were analog triggers until I read it on the internet long after I stopped playing my gamecube.
The gamecube controller's not bad overall. It's not my favourite but I don't mind using them. I think they're an improvement over the n64 controller for the most part but I never really had a problem with the n64 controller apart from the shitty sticks. But that's a really big fuckup to the point where they stopped making games that had you spin the controller really fast because it was killing controllers. But I don't fuck around with any of those controllers any more, because fuck that shit, and whenever I emulate n64 or gamecube games or pretty much any game I just use one of those 8bitdo controllers that's pretty much a snes controller with joysticks and extra R and L buttons added and it works just fine for pretty much any of those games I play.
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- Aug 5, 2022
That was an issue with later-run and US production using shitty/no lubricant rather than the actual stick quality. My 3 original (non-US) controllers lasted forever despite plenty of mario partying. Like 15 years later I dug the console up to put in the break room at work and bought a 4th (official) controller, which turned to gritty shit in a couple of weeks while the original 3 held up just fine.
Grub
kiwifarms.net
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- Jul 2, 2021
That would make sense with my experience. The grey one that came with the console held up. The clear purple one we got went to shit. My cousin's grey one was good, they had a blue one that wasn't bad but kind of shitty, they didn't play many of the spinny games though and they had another two controllers, I think they had one of those transparent coloured one and one that came with Donkey Kong or something like that and they were both shit.
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- Jul 3, 2021
The Jungle Green is supposed to be good, but there may be different batches. If you have any good controllers left I recommend lubricating them with a silicone oil or grease (nothing petroleum-based). It’s easy. Another awesome thing about the N64 controller is that the stick is modular, so you can replace the entire stick assembly without needing a whole new controller.
I’ve also seen DualShocks basically lose all ability to center, but you can’t fix those easily. You have to get a new controller or swap out the whole board.
Only heard of GC controllers failing because of Melee fags.
Grub
kiwifarms.net
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- Jul 2, 2021
I'm not sure what controllers I have. I know I somehow ended up with 3 n64s. I only know where two of them came from. I might have some good controllers tucked in there with them. Doesn't really matter. All that shit's been sitting in a box in storage for almost 10 years and before that it was tucked away in a cabinet where it also hadn't been used in probably more than 10 years. That is cool though. I didn't realize the sticks could be replaced.
I don't really like ps1 controllers either kind. I don't mind the ps2 and ps3 controllers but the ps1 controllers always seemed cheap and janky. I haven't used enough dualshocks to see any dead ones but I've used a few dualshock 2 and 3's where the sticks died and when those go they just seem to go, that's it too bad.
The only one I've seen fail was one of the triggers in one because it had something spilled on it. Otherwise they always seemed pretty solid.