Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

[Krokodil Overdose]

Also, the Emperor and Vader would have more than enough time to pass down Sith teachings to TRILLIONS of recruits, making the eradication of the Sith in ROTJ pointless as they'd be replaced in a jiffy.

Question: are we considering all Light Side users Jedi and all Dark Side users Sith for the purposes of this discussion? Because in the old EU there were other forms of Force praxis (the Luka Sene and the witches of Dathomir, before they got retconned into being actual witches) which ties into my earlier point about "Jedi" being a specific tradition, not just Good Guy force users. Even if the Force as as accessible as, say, Nen, any specific tradition could be made extinct by any of the usual means.

Also the only reason we're having this conversation is the who/how/when of Force use has become so muddled and contradictory since the Disney takeover that its basically incomprehensible as a rule set. You could never have this conversation about, say, Harry Potter, because the only rule for magic use is "it tends to run in families."

I didn't even think of this but really if everyone could just use the force Han is the logical choice. like obviously because of his parentage Obi Wan was going to train Luke and had been watching him for 20 years or whatever but if literally anyone could use the force he'd spend 15 minutes with Han Solo and be like yup this guy is the second coming of Anakin, great pilot, cocky jackass, with jedi training this guy would be unstoppable.

Of course, considering what happened the last time he did that....

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Also the only reason we're having this conversation is the who/how/when of Force use has become so muddled and contradictory since the Disney takeover that its basically incomprehensible as a rule set. You could never have this conversation about, say, Harry Potter, because the only rule for magic use is "it tends to run in families."

That rule has been in Star Wars since ANH. Hence why Ben trains Luke, and ONLY Luke, because his dad was a Force-user.

Question: are we considering all Light Side users Jedi and all Dark Side users Sith for the purposes of this discussion? Because in the old EU there were other forms of Force praxis (the Luka Sene and the witches of Dathomir, before they got retconned into being actual witches) which ties into my earlier point about "Jedi" being a specific tradition, not just Good Guy force users. Even if the Force as as accessible as, say, Nen, any specific tradition could be made extinct by any of the usual means.

Even in ANH, Vader was called a Sith in cut scenes of the film. So yes, all Dark Siders would be Sith, and since the only light-siders in the OT are Jedi, all light-siders would be Jedi, since they'd learn from the teachings of the Jedi. Also, so long as there's recordings, any ''extinct'' religion can come back by some practitioners coming across those recordings and dedicating their lives around what was taught in the past.

I didn't even think of this but really if everyone could just use the force Han is the logical choice. like obviously because of his parentage Obi Wan was going to train Luke and had been watching him for 20 years or whatever but if literally anyone could use the force he'd spend 15 minutes with Han Solo and be like yup this guy is the second coming of Anakin, great pilot, cocky jackass, with jedi training this guy would be unstoppable.

Exactly. Unlike Luke, Han has experienced the wider galaxy, already has pilot experience, and is already a good fighter. If everyone could use the Force, Han would make for better raw material than Luke would. Hell, Chewie would be even better; if he learns how to use the Force and the lightsaber, he'd be great. If you combine his strength and the Force, put some armor on him and you have Darth Vader's nemesis right there.

 

[el bandito loco]

Of course, considering what happened the last time he did that....

the only reason obi wan failed anakin is he gave him too much leeway. he KNEW he was fucking panda bear, and trusted him too much. I don't think going forward he would be so trusting. after anakin betrayed them he'd probably see a second coming of him as a miracle but would handle it radically different. you have to think obi wan was handed anakin as a padawan when he was like 19, he was a kid himself so instead of raising him he took him as a little brother

 

[Ghostse]

Lol at the abused wives watching Acolyte, a show they know they'll dislike and hitting up D+ to do it. If I don't eat that turd, I won't know just how bad it tastes.Never change, cucks. lol.


Anyway, before the Prequels sort of fucked it up, I had always pictured the Jedi place in the Republic as....

So in Thailand, its very common for men to enter Buddist monk training for a couple of years to reach base-level monk and then suspend their monkly vows and return to society get married, etc. Basically a dude being able to complete monastic training demonstrates they have a base level of self-control (so good candidates for marriage) and in the pre-modern times usually meant they had base level literacy.

So my thought had always been that important people - business leaders, planetary leaders, high-ranking officers, etc - as part of their grooming for their intended role would be put through force training under a Jedi master - either at a temple or you were important enough you'd have a Jedi master at your court to train the princelings and act as an advisor. Even if you don't end up becoming a Jedi Knight, the training would make you more in-tune with The Force to help guide your decisions, and you'd also learn some practical lessons about not being a complete selfish chode.
And while they were trying these people, some of them the teachings would resonate with and they'd sign up for the order. Not a high rate of success to be sure, but as said, when you have quadrillions to quintillions of sentient beings....

This would necessitate the Jedi being largely itinerant monks, traveling alone or at most with a padwan, and would have rendered them extremely vulnerable to Vader hunting them. And given their ties to the "Republic Elite" it would be fairly easy for the Emperor to use his Sith propaganda to turn the masses against the Jedi by portraying them as part of the elite as the Empire displaced the aristocracy.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Lol at the abused wives watching Acolyte, a show they know they'll dislike and hitting up D+ to do it. If I don't eat that turd, I won't know just how bad it tastes.Never change, cucks. lol.


Anyway, before the Prequels sort of fucked it up, I had always pictured the Jedi place in the Republic as....

So in Thailand, its very common for men to enter Buddist monk training for a couple of years to reach base-level monk and then suspend their monkly vows and return to society get married, etc. Basically a dude being able to complete monastic training demonstrates they have a base level of self-control (so good candidates for marriage) and in the pre-modern times usually meant they had base level literacy.

So my thought had always been that important people - business leaders, planetary leaders, high-ranking officers, etc - as part of their grooming for their intended role would be put through force training under a Jedi master - either at a temple or you were important enough you'd have a Jedi master at your court to train the princelings and act as an advisor. Even if you don't end up becoming a Jedi Knight, the training would make you more in-tune with The Force to help guide your decisions, and you'd also learn some practical lessons about not being a complete selfish chode.
And while they were trying these people, some of them the teachings would resonate with and they'd sign up for the order. Not a high rate of success to be sure, but as said, when you have quadrillions to quintillions of sentient beings....

This would necessitate the Jedi being largely itinerant monks, traveling alone or at most with a padwan, and would have rendered them extremely vulnerable to Vader hunting them. And given their ties to the "Republic Elite" it would be fairly easy for the Emperor to use his Sith propaganda to turn the masses against the Jedi by portraying them as part of the elite as the Empire displaced the aristocracy.

To be fair, Buddhist monks and Jedi Knights don't sound like they'd mix. After all, Buddhist monks do not have KNIGHTS to begin with. That is a western concept. In fact, outside of a few philosophical nods to Buddhism, there's not much that could relate the two, especially since the Jedi are supposed to be knights, taking order from the senatorial aristocracy. That shit's got more in common with feudalism in the west than Buddhist monks, especially since any person can follow the latter's teachings and keep the faith alive, whereas you can't say the same for knights. Not only do you need someone to teach you their ways of combat, but you'd have to be anointed as a knight by someone special.

Also, what the Prequels did was similar to what happened in real life with the Knights Templar; except this time the government had legitimate grounds to strike against them given that four of their leaders tried to off the Chancellor. The Templars were too busy with their banking business or trying to retake the Holy Land to focus and realize the fact that the French King wanted their heads on a spike, just as the Jedi Order were too busy trying to win the Clone Wars to realize that Palpatine was about to write them off permanently.

So if anything, the Prequels did the idea justice, since they drew upon real-world history for an example.

 

[Midwit]

That could easily be undone if some Jedi master passed down his teachings in some recordings and some dorks listened to it.

Tales of the Jedi had a pair of villains who were just a pair of rich teenagers who found some old Sith teachings and learnt the Force from those, so it's not without precedent.

Yes. And for every 100 people, you have at least 1 who's got the time and money to willingly devote their life to a religion in order to gain power. Given that the SW galaxy has 100 quadrillion people, that translates out to 1 quadrillion Jedi/Sith. Or at the very least, several hundred trillions of them. That is, if the Force is available to everyone.

I'd argue that, if the Force is truly omnipresent, most people already do use the Force on a subconcious level and that people who are good enough at what they do to take on a Jedi and potentially win have a fairly substantial level of power in the Force but they just don't know how to use it the way a Jedi can. I attribute the differences to the fact that the Jedi, at least by the time of the prequels, exclusively recruit from children who were born with the ability to consciously use the Force so they can bypass actually having to teach the kids how to actually do shit and instead concentrate on more important things like learning how to fit ever larger sticks up their collective arse.

The moment I croak along with Vader, there's already someone on Coruscant ready to take the title of Emperor and Dark Lord.

Palpatine never wanted a successor, the Empire was born with him and it was going to end with him.

After all, Buddhist monks do not have KNIGHTS to begin with. In fact, outside of a few philosophical nods to Buddhism, there's not much that could relate the two, especially since the Jedi are supposed to be knights, taking order from the senatorial aristocracy. That shit's got more in common with feudalism in the west than Buddhist monks

Japan rather famously had warrior monks, and the Samurai are themselves analagous to medieval knights with a code derived from Buddhist teachings. Considering how much inspiration Lucas took from Jidaigeki films when making Star Wars you can't say that the Jedi are completely devoid from Buddhism when that couldn't be further from the truth.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Tales of the Jedi had a pair of villains who were just a pair of rich teenagers who found some old Sith teachings and learnt the Force from those, so it's not without precedent.

Exactly. They didn't need a live Sith master, they just unearthed some dusty old Sith teachings and the Sith's ghost started leading them down the Dark Path.

If that can work for them, it can work for the Jedi. Kenobi's ghost was haunting and teaching Luke for three years straight before telling him to go to Yoda.

I'd argue that, if the Force is truly omnipresent, most people already do use the Force on a subconcious level and that people who are good enough at what they do to take on a Jedi and potentially win have a fairly substantial level of power in the Force but they just don't know how to use it the way a Jedi can. I attribute the differences to the fact that the Jedi, at least by the time of the prequels, exclusively recruit from children who were born with the ability to consciously use the Force so they can bypass actually having to teach the kids how to actually do shit and instead concentrate on more important things like learning how to fit ever larger sticks up their collective arse.

I interpret the Force as something similar to an Istari's power, especially since Gandalf was the inspiration for Kenobi, and Kenobi only ever trained Luke and nobody else. And Luke only told Leia that she has his power. If everyone could use the Force, then Luke would've been talking to Han, Chewie, and Lando as well, not just Leia.

Palpatine never wanted a successor, the Empire was born with him and it was going to end with him.

That was according to the SWEU, which came in later. In the Prequels, it seemed like he wanted Anakin as his successor. In the OT, we don't know for sure.

Japan rather famously had warrior monks, and the Samurai are themselves analagous to medieval knights with a code derived from Buddhist teachings. Considering how much inspiration Lucas took from Jidaigeki films when making Star Wars you can't say that the Jedi are completely devoid from Buddhism when that couldn't be further from the truth.

The Buddhists and other eastern faiths would be laughing at the Jedi's insistence that dark equals evil. In fact, Yin and Yang are equally good in the eastern mindset, and having too much of one or the other is imbalance. I'm not saying they were devoid of Buddhist thoughts, but the influence is minimal at best. Especially since the Buddhists believe in a cycle of reincarnation, whereas the Jedi do not.

 

[Übertroon]

Yeah, very lolworthy. If I were to steelMAN Smilo Ren, he says that the Jedi live in a fantasy world where they believe they can't be killed. So figuring out how to kill Jedi should be more like an Atton Rand kind of thing where muggles figure out Hitman scenarios to get Jedi to kill themselves instead of walking up and threatening them.

Even then, this concept was better done twenty years ago in every way.

Both Atton Rand and Hk-47 give their own takes on how ti deal with jedi.
Atton talks about being taught to cloud your intentions by filling your head with mind junk and doing a lot of improvising.
HK tells you to ditch blasters and instead rely on explosives, minefields, and other traps.

 

[Get the rope Macaulay!]

"Rich Dykes" has been the mission statement at Disney for almost a decade.

you're joking but the reason the other Bob got fired and Iger ended back in charge was because the other Bob didn't defend rich dykes hard enough when Florida was whining about gay people a few years back, and even in the CNBC article about his firing they straight up admit thats the prime reason for it too.

y, Osha was also the name of the wilding servant

the one who despite being a wildling still shaved all her body hair? fun joke about that is that even the actress brought up how it didn't make sense but the guys in charge were like, "no that pussy can stay shaved"

 

[Commander X]

The fantagonism/culture wars stuff is a blatant attempt to get people watching this show, and it isn't working. Even "hit" Star Wars shows on Disney+ have a tough time getting live+5 days viewership around 2 million when over 150 million people have Disney+. Some have gone below 1 million by their reported numbers, numbers clearly in Disney's best interest to spin as high as possible. Disney+ is in the dumper and began shedding subscribers this year. More people would be mad if the season finale of "Crime Drama: Spinoff Still Going Seasons After the Original Went Off The Air" wasn't to their liking, than care one way or the other about The Acolyte.

 

[Male Idiot]

HKs also had the upside that they were robots and its harder to sense a robot's intentions, especially if it is just a general robot and not obviously a walking arsenal, HK was made to mimic a protocol droid. CPO-007

 

[HodgePodgeRogerDodger]

Isn’t the main inspiration of the Jedi Buddhist monks (who basically did abuse their power and had armies that rivaled famous warlords) and the minor inspiration being Christian monks? It’s Space Buddhists with orthodox Christian (small o) trappings.

The Republic was space Rome.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Isn’t the main inspiration of the Jedi Buddhist monks (who basically did abuse their power and had armies that rivaled famous warlords) and the minor inspiration being Christian monks? It’s Space Buddhists with orthodox Christian (small o) trappings.

The Republic was space Rome.

I think it's just monks in general. Both the Christians and the Buddhists would be weirded out by the Jedi trying to suppress emotion and the Dark Side. Buddhists believe in a balance between light and dark, and outside of avoiding wrath, Christianity won't begrudge you partaking in emotions or getting angry at something like injustice.

The Republic is Space Rome, France, Germany, every time a democracy or a Republic gets overthrown by a dictator. Oh, and the Coruscanti speak in posh British accents, so you can add the British in as well.

 

[Ghostse]

To be fair, Buddhist monks and Jedi Knights don't sound like they'd mix. After all, Buddhist monks do not have KNIGHTS to begin with.

I was referring more to the practice in a socialogical space vs. any practices. The Catholic Church served a similar role in Europe through the Renaissance of educating & advising royalty, but not to prevelance or level of commitment expected from those being sent through the system as the Thai system.

But, also: "Buddists do not have knights" are you retarded? What religion are Shaolin Monks?

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

I was referring more to the practice in a socialogical space vs. any practices. The Catholic Church served a similar role in Europe through the Renaissance of educating & advising royalty, but not to prevelance or level of commitment expected from those being sent through the system as the Thai system.

Then you don't know the Renaissance Church. Aside from owning their own fiefdoms, they made obscene amounts of money and in some cases, some bishops and cardinals would have prince-like authority. One cardinal even wound up becoming king of Portugal, though not by choice.

But, also: "Buddists do not have knights" are you retarded? What religion are Shaolin Monks?

Shaolin monks are not knights, dude. Not all fighting men are knights. That's like saying some dude who practices kung fu is a knight.

 

[Gondolindrim]

I just saw the first two episodes of The Acolyte. I feel like the actors are doing what they can with what they're given, directing could be worse, but it's the first time I've watched a Star Wars thing and thought 'fuck me this editing'. It's like they gave the official color grading and transition pack to some first year film student. It's astonishingly sloppy.

Every Disney show is like that now: The actors are struggling to do what they can with sloppy material, all the while the show itself looks like it was made by college kids and not a multibillion dollar company.

 

[Ghostse]

Shaolin monks are not knights, dude. Not all fighting men are knights. That's like saying some dude who practices kung fu is a knight.

.....Jedi never rode horses. Therefore they couldn't have been jedi knights. Check mate, theist.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

.....Jedi never rode horses. Therefore they couldn't have been jedi knights. Check mate, theist.

LOL Kenobi rode that iguana-dinosaur thing in ROTS. And back in ESB, Skywalker rode on a Tauntaun, which is the Hoth equivalent of a horse. So yes, they were knights.

Checkmate, you godless heathen.

 

[Fatsuit Shinji]

the only reason obi wan failed anakin is he gave him too much leeway. he KNEW he was fucking panda bear, and trusted him too much. I don't think going forward he would be so trusting. after anakin betrayed them he'd probably see a second coming of him as a miracle but would handle it radically different. you have to think obi wan was handed anakin as a padawan when he was like 19, he was a kid himself so instead of raising him he took him as a little brother

Tying into this was how Obi-Wan viewed his relationship with Anakin.
As Anakin really needed was a father not a brother, which Qui-Gon had understood and Obi-Wan didn't. Moreso when the Jedi didn't keep their word to free Anakin's mom and have her continue to be his tard wrangler since Qui-Gon happens to be dead to do the job himself.

 

[robobobo]

I always figured that force sensitivity was a matter of degrees and every living thing had some shred of it, at least until the yuuuzan vong showed up; the question's whether it has enough to do any useful space magic or not, and if you don't that's that. Sure, with a lifetime of hardcore training maybe you could levitate a grain of sand or some shit, but without any gas in the tank you'll never accomplish a useful act through the force.