Weightlifting for Kiwis - Discussion and support regarding the art of swole

[Flavius Claudius Julianus]

would these suggestions be the same for deadlifts too? When do you think you're getting into the weight ranges where lifting specific shoes are really helpful?

You'd never really choose to pull in lifters unless you were a weightlifter, doing snatch/clean pulls. The technique is different, and the heel on the shoe turns it something of a deficit. My best pull in heels is 30kg lower than without.

For strongman/powerlifting style deads, I'd always recommend a minimalist shoe like Notorious Lift, A7, Avancus, etc. Even a Walmart flat shoe with the soles taken out will work.

Better yet, barefoot. I do all my heavy pulls barefoot, not even socks. The connection with the ground is unbeatable.

 

[74164978231]

It's embarrassing to watch.

Also, I keep hearing that he gets kicked out of every gym he's going, since -of course- no owner would put up with his bullshit and also, he's fucking around with the equipment. The last thing you need is a broken Smith machine because of a Mexican schizo ego lifter.

What the fuck? Its like someone watched watched all the broscience videos and didnt understand it was satire.

 

[CowPox]

I've been dealing with strains to both of my brachialradialous from doing zottman curls too heavy. Ugh.

 

[David Brown]

My wrists are hurting from years of manual labor, anybody have any tips on how to protect them? They don't hurt passively but when I'm picking up anything even slightly heavy and I flex, extend, and during lateral motion it gives some pain in my wrist. Especially on extension on my left wrist.

 

[CowPox]

My wrists are hurting from years of manual labor, anybody have any tips on how to protect them? They don't hurt passively but when I'm picking up anything even slightly heavy and I flex, extend, and during lateral motion it gives some pain in my wrist. Especially on extension on my left wrist.

Turning a doorknob hurts or lifting a mug of coffee?

 

[David Brown]

Turning a doorknob hurts or a mug 9f coffee?

Shoveling dirt and lifting a Christy box off the ground to drop in a hole hurts. Trying to keep control of the shovel while it's loaded with dirt can be painful. My lunch is almost over, I'll probe exactly what motions under what loads cause the pain. It doesn't hurt doing light stuff.

... Okay I just pretended to do the door knob and the mug motions and the door knob motions definitely cause more pain even with an empty hand.

Edit: yeah it's definitely the door knob style motions that are the worst, though front to back and lateral motion kinda hurts too.

 

[VeteranOfTheRetardWars]

My wrists are hurting from years of manual labor, anybody have any tips on how to protect them? They don't hurt passively but when I'm picking up anything even slightly heavy and I flex, extend, and during lateral motion it gives some pain in my wrist. Especially on extension on my left wrist.

Get a rubber band and put it around your fingers and open them like pictured.

Just absentmindedly do that through the day, especially after you work with your hands.
This helps balance out the extensor muscles of the forearm and could be some help.
We’re talking higher reps, you want it to be real easy but give a good burn.

 

[Flavius Claudius Julianus]

Shoveling dirt and lifting a Christy box off the ground to drop in a hole hurts. Trying to keep control of the shovel while it's loaded with dirt can be painful. My lunch is almost over, I'll probe exactly what motions under what loads cause the pain. It doesn't hurt doing light stuff.

... Okay I just pretended to do the door knob and the mug motions and the door knob motions definitely cause more pain even with an empty hand.

Any pressing movement will slowly turn your wrists into hardened steel. When I first started lifting I'd get aching Wrists after doing bench/any kind of shoulders.

I can strict press 100kg+ from a true front rack any day of the week now, zero pain or discomfort whatsoever.

The only exception is when I randomly do dumb shit in the gym lol

 

[Overly Serious]

I'm trying to lose fat right now and one thing I've never fully got my head around is the statement that you can't gain muscle and lose weight (fat) at the same time. I've always been told I must be eating excess calories to gain muscle.

I know that in calorie deficit the body can break down muscle for energy but if I am eating just a few hundred calories below maintenance (exercise included) and there is sufficient protein for muscle building, can't I make up the energy deficit from burning fat? Is this a hard fact of life that you can't burn fat and build muscle at the same time or is it just one of those myths that gets repeated. Genuine question.

 

[Just Hamsters]

I'm trying to lose fat right now and one thing I've never fully got my head around is the statement that you can't gain muscle and lose weight (fat) at the same time. I've always been told I must be eating excess calories to gain muscle.

I know that in calorie deficit the body can break down muscle for energy but if I am eating just a few hundred calories below maintenance (exercise included) and there is sufficient protein for muscle building, can't I make up the energy deficit from burning fat? Is this a hard fact of life that you can't burn fat and build muscle at the same time or is it just one of those myths that gets repeated. Genuine question.

My understanding is that it's a half truth. While it's absolutely true that a deficit is required to lose fat, your body still wants to repair and reinforce damaged skeletal muscle from lifting. Your gains will be smaller in deficit, but high protein intake will make sure the muscle gets what it needs. There's a bunch of hormone signaling involved that I can't remember right now.

Keeping muscle activity and protein intake high is the trick. Since I started working out, my weight has stayed fairly constant, but my body composition has shifted dramatically, implying there was fat loss with muscle gain.

 

[Dean Pentel]

I'm trying to lose fat right now and one thing I've never fully got my head around is the statement that you can't gain muscle and lose weight (fat) at the same time. I've always been told I must be eating excess calories to gain muscle.

I know that in calorie deficit the body can break down muscle for energy but if I am eating just a few hundred calories below maintenance (exercise included) and there is sufficient protein for muscle building, can't I make up the energy deficit from burning fat? Is this a hard fact of life that you can't burn fat and build muscle at the same time or is it just one of those myths that gets repeated. Genuine question.

A few years back I cut from 125 kg to 95 kg over the course of 9 months. I found high volume and sufficient protein intake (aim for 2g per kg of BW) was excellent for muscle sparing and I was able to put a little bit of muscle on some areas that had lagged. If you're not on an aggressive anabolic stack of some sort expect that you will lose top end strength and you're not going to be gaining much muscle while on a cut. For that reason I'd recommend you focus on your cut first. Get down to your goal body comp and once you're there for a bit then you start changing things to put on muscle.

If you're doing this naturally remember to be patient; body comp changes take time and sufficient attention. You'll get there.

 

[anustart76]

I noticed that I have defined shoulders now. It's a small thing, not really even noticeable under a shirt, but still, it feels good to see some real visual signs of progress.

 

[Overly Serious]

My understanding is that it's a half truth. While it's absolutely true that a deficit is required to lose fat, your body still wants to repair and reinforce damaged skeletal muscle from lifting. Your gains will be smaller in deficit, but high protein intake will make sure the muscle gets what it needs. There's a bunch of hormone signaling involved that I can't remember right now.

Keeping muscle activity and protein intake high is the trick. Since I started working out, my weight has stayed fairly constant, but my body composition has shifted dramatically, implying there was fat loss with muscle gain.

A few years back I cut from 125 kg to 95 kg over the course of 9 months. I found high volume and sufficient protein intake (aim for 2g per kg of BW) was excellent for muscle sparing and I was able to put a little bit of muscle on some areas that had lagged. If you're not on an aggressive anabolic stack of some sort expect that you will lose top end strength and you're not going to be gaining much muscle while on a cut. For that reason I'd recommend you focus on your cut first. Get down to your goal body comp and once you're there for a bit then you start changing things to put on muscle.

If you're doing this naturally remember to be patient; body comp changes take time and sufficient attention. You'll get there.

Thank you both. It's never wholly sat right with me but I've seen it stated so often. Still, I know how often myths get passed around as facts. Half-truth sounds right.

So I use to weight train far more seriously and want to get back to some of that. I'm not interested in competition or anything like that, just want to recover some of my fitness and heatlh so the advice about cutting first and then rebuilding muscle is sound but I just want to move towards a consistently improving lifestyle in the coming years. I still have passable muscle from my training days so I don't feel my primary goal is to put on much. More just improving body composition. So I'll do as you both suggest of having a high protein diet with training and a modest defecit and I'll just keep at that for the forseeable.

Also, @Dean Pentel , well done on dropping from 125kg down to 95kg. Big respect!

 

[Major]

What are good, easy exercises for back, side and shoulder muscles? I slouch too much.

 

[Lords Greatsword]

What are good, easy exercises for back, side and shoulder muscles? I slouch too much.

Pullups - Classic back movement, especially good for drilling scapular retraction; dead hang is another good movement where you simply hold the bar without going for the actual pull, and is good for freeing the shoulders and back up

Overhead press - All around good movement for shoulders and upper back, a bit technical to master but it'll do you very well over time

Pullovers - Good for working side muscles, it's a movement that's been lauded on this thread recently as well

Shoulder dislocation stretch - Despite the name, the actual stretch itself is a very good mobility drill for the shoulders, and it can be performed with a scarf, towel, bar, or whatever else you can stretch and pull behind your head; try it with a wide grip to ease into it before going narrower

 

[Bassomatic]

Pulls ups are all around bad ass just do them do lots.

 

[JoseRaulChupacabra]

Are any of you guys experienced with amino acid supplements? I know Creatine is well researched and is true and honest, with the Amino Acid stuff, I'm not so sure. I know those are basically protein components.

 

[Just Hamsters]

Are any of you guys experienced with amino acid supplements? I know Creatine is well researched and is true and honest, with the Amino Acid stuff, I'm not so sure. I know those are basically protein components.

Never tried them out because I'm pretty sure you have to track your diet pretty well to get any use from them and my current diet philosophy is just "moar proteen".

I do know it depends on specific amino acids, like L-Arginine is required to make Nitric Oxide for vasodilation and promotes creatine synthesis and other stuff, but it also promotes oxidative stress which can be bad.

Branched chain amino acids are supposed to be good for supporting muscle formation and I think is what the liver likes to use.

All the others seem to be nice antioxidants or get broken down into arginine anyway.

Here's a nice review for ya:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35043647/

 

[latinlover]

Are any of you guys experienced with amino acid supplements? I know Creatine is well researched and is true and honest, with the Amino Acid stuff, I'm not so sure. I know those are basically protein components.

Creatine works. It has been researched for decades, it has an extremely marginal but still certainly positive effect and no real downsides with proper hydration.

The same can't be said for shit like BCAA, Glutamine, et al. . There are some studies claiming that these compounds have positive effects but usually just as many or more studies claiming that they are nothing but snake oil.

If you have the means, they certainly won't hurt you and who knows, they might be good for you, it's just extremely underresearched and inconclusive, I wouldn't go out of my way to get them.

 

[oldTireWater]

What's a good weight for a kettlebell noob as a man? For hip swings especially. Been thinking of getting one to get some neat bonus exercise for my lower back. I'm not in good shape but I'm trying to get there and I don't want to go too light. I imagine somewhere around 60lbs or 30kg would give me some bang for the buck for quite some time? Or have you guys found 40lbs/20kg to be enough?

I'd appreciate answers from anyone with some kettlebell experience.

Super late response.

If you're not in great shape then a 16kg kettlebell is probably where you want to start. It will be kinda light for swings but you can make up for it with volume. It will also be light enough to start learning the more skill intensive moves like cleans and snatches. 16kgs will last you a long time, and will still be useful when you turn into a beast. A 24kg would be the next step and is probably all you would ever need for swings and snatches. When it gets light you just do more. Kettlebell exercises are all about high volume, and build muscular and cardiovascular endurance. Don't even think about moving up to 32kg or 36kg until your technique is absolutely locked into muscle memory.

Kettlebells have been my gimmick for 20 years now. There's nothing special about them but they do fit some exercises better than dumbbells (swings, snatches, figure-8's). It took me years to feel comfortable with a 32kg snatch, and it's only in the last few that the 36kg snatch has become my mainstay. Honestly, I could still achieve everything I want to with a 24kg. I still can't do 1000 unbroken 16kg snatches (I always max out around 600).

Check out Jeff Martone for ideas.