Warhammer 40k

[Humble Architect]

In my DH game our DM would occasionally do the “disarm the whole crew” for a meeting or force us into a stealth investigation system which generally meant our psyker would absolutely be the powerhouse until he was farted out of existence on a bad roll. There’s also frequent splitting of the party and sending us to different objectives. Of course there’s also sending us against a high level boss and many goons and then yanking us narratively out when it was obvious we were getting overwhelmed.

In my Black Crusade campaign, I nudged everyone to different gods/paths of worship so they were all scheming, paranoid and more concerned about each other than the dungeons.

They were, a SoH Raptor who was still mourning Horus, a Psyker whose pet daemon was remarkably chill, a disgraced Warsmith who was bitter even by his legion’s standards, a Death Guard who was not one of the “jolly” ones and of course, a World Eater who enjoyed making offerings to Khorne with his beloved chainaxe………. that hosted a fucking Slaanesh daemon who hated him and he hated it but refused to give up such a storied weapon.

Each one thought they were gonna get Among Us’d in every turn. The Death Guard and the World Eater knew each other from the Siege and became battle-brothers, the Warsmith got Daemonhood, the Raptor got over his father issues by logically and sanely acknowledging that Horus was a concept and could be embodied by any True Son and renamed himself Horus, he also started calling the others by the names of the appropriate Primarchs and the Psyker ruined the Mechanicus’s day by getting a finding a new home for her daemon……. in a derelict Ark Mechanicus, giving everyone a cool ride and earning more “gifts” than everyone else by defaming such a monument to the Machine God.

 

[Gorilla Milk]

What lawsuit?

https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/ChapterHouse_Studios

But even before that, GW had been attempting to insist that they owned the word "Space Marine" and had been harassing people who used that term, way back to 2013. They also tried claiming that they owned the term 'Eldar' - Despite Tolkien inventing it, ect. Basically GW was a bunch of litigious, lazy fuckwads who stole terms from other people and then tried to claim they owned it, they lost, and switched over to their "Super Special" terms like Astra Militarium, Adeptus Astartes, ect ect.

 

[p1138]

https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/ChapterHouse_Studios

But even before that, GW had been attempting to insist that they owned the word "Space Marine" and had been harassing people who used that term, way back to 2013. They also tried claiming that they owned the term 'Eldar' - Despite Tolkien inventing it, ect. Basically GW was a bunch of litigious, lazy fuckwads who stole terms from other people and then tried to claim they owned it, they lost, and switched over to their "Super Special" terms like Astra Militarium, Adeptus Astartes, ect ect.

archive.org where a bunch of the PDFs are readily available is currently down, but just to reinforce how fucking ridiculous GWs lawsuit was, they tried to trademark "pauldron". It wasn't a complete loss for GW as they did win a dozen or so terms like "tyranid" and shit like that, but yes... pauldron.

 

[Atypical Dog]

In my Black Crusade campaign, I nudged everyone to different gods/paths of worship so they were all scheming, paranoid and more concerned about each other than the dungeons.

They were, a SoH Raptor who was still mourning Horus, a Psyker whose pet daemon was remarkably chill, a disgraced Warsmith who was bitter even by his legion’s standards, a Death Guard who was not one of the “jolly” ones and of course, a World Eater who enjoyed making offerings to Khorne with his beloved chainaxe………. that hosted a fucking Slaanesh daemon who hated him and he hated it but refused to give up such a storied weapon.

Each one thought they were gonna get Among Us’d in every turn. The Death Guard and the World Eater knew each other from the Siege and became battle-brothers, the Warsmith got Daemonhood, the Raptor got over his father issues by logically and sanely acknowledging that Horus was a concept and could be embodied by any True Son and renamed himself Horus, he also started calling the others by the names of the appropriate Primarchs and the Psyker ruined the Mechanicus’s day by getting a finding a new home for her daemon……. in a derelict Ark Mechanicus, giving everyone a cool ride and earning more “gifts” than everyone else by defaming such a monument to the Machine God.

And somehow they never actually stabbed each other's back it looks like... yet.

Haven't had much experience with Black Crusade but what I hear from other people is that it's hard to assemble a group - having a good group kind of requires the players to work together, but the characters often repel each other because Chaos gonna Chaos. What sacrifices to the Dark Gods did you make to get a good group for Black Crusade together?

 

[geckogoy]

WELCOME TO ESTALIA, GENTLEMEN!

Here you go

 

[Male Idiot]

Yeah WHF was a cool setting with serious autism to the extreme rules.

AoS is the other, it is a cookie cutter warcraft copypaste fantasy but the rules are good and fun from what I heard.

That and Total War and Vermintide made fantasy bigger, I wonder if the stooges at GW ever realised that they should have just changed the rules.

 

[Judge Dredd]

Tbf, sport games aren't dependent on everyone showing up and you can come even if you don't feel 100%. Gaming sessions, especially games like DnD can fall apart with one person missing, and if you don't feel good enough to actively participate then it can raise tensions.

As a spectator, maybe. Though they still don't seem to flake as often as nerd hobbies. As @p1138 said, even as a player it doesn't happen with bowling, or pool, or rugby. Those require arguably more effort, as well as greater numbers, but they still happen often.

One of the biggest issues Fantasy had was that it rules made 40k look simple and easy to understand. You even had rules on how many archers would be allowed to fire at a unit due to formation depth and spacing mechanics. When AoS made everything 40k-like, the rules also got rationalized and made less autistic and dumb.

How was 6th edition? That seems to be one people remember.

It wasn't a complete loss for GW as they did win a dozen or so terms like "tyranid" and shit like that, but yes... pauldron.

Was Tyranid a unique term or was it also grabbed from generic words?

 

[NerdShamer]

Was Tyranid a unique term or was it also grabbed from generic words?

Sounds like an corruption of an fancy word than anything else. But as far as I can tell, it's somewhat unique in comparison to half the shit that already exists

 

[Snekposter]

a World Eater who enjoyed making offerings to Khorne with his beloved chainaxe………. that hosted a fucking Slaanesh daemon who hated him and he hated it but refused to give up such a storied weapon.

That sounds like the plot to the start of a really fucked up sitcom.

Here you go
View attachment 6513036

Not posting the animated one?

One of the best parts of the Immortal Empires Expanded mod is that not only does it add Indocathay, that place is filled with the next best thing to undead for Gelt to incinerate with magic and artillery: a band of Savage Orcs known as the Speaking Trees.

How was 6th edition? That seems to be one people remember.

I honestly do not know how the actual rules are, only that I have heard secondhand about the pain and agony of dealing with the formations, both in terms of rules and actual maneuvers on the battlefield. No blobs that pass through blobs like in 40k. Your own formations are solid blockers to your own dues. Autistic fuckery about combat order in melee and ranked combat. There is a /tg/ wiki page though that does get into some of the basics, though.

 

[Humble Architect]

And somehow they never actually stabbed each other's back it looks like... yet.

Haven't had much experience with Black Crusade but what I hear from other people is that it's hard to assemble a group - having a good group kind of requires the players to work together, but the characters often repel each other because Chaos gonna Chaos. What sacrifices to the Dark Gods did you make to get a good group for Black Crusade together?

They aren’t Chaos fans, they wanted a 40k DnD-like and all I had was Black Crusade, I’m the Chaosfag in my group, so the “Chaos way” had to be learned, also have I have a “support staff” member who can’t consistently make games but wanted in and I used him to string the plot along as a guest party member, playing a character we designed to go against every trope and cliche of characters he traditionally played.

That being said they all have Survivor-esque scheme sessions outside of play when their ship is “in the warp” and I get asked seemingly random questions at weird hours, like “Can a Daemon Prince be sealed in a Tesseract?” I know for a fact the DG is involved in everyone’s scheme and everyone thinks he’s their guy.

 

[Kier Starmer]

@Snekposter You are bang on about this with TCG refugees, my group and even I am one of them. The AOS groups I go to are pretty big, I wish some content creators would chase down why so many people are quitting TCGs because I would actually like to know why. Mine was work life, I'm a nurse so my hours are pretty chaotic and TCGs are too expensive.

 

[Buckaroo]

@Snekposter You are bang on about this with TCG refugees, my group and even I am one of them. The AOS groups I go to are pretty big, I wish some content creators would chase down why so many people are quitting TCGs because I would actually like to know why. Mine was work life, I'm a nurse so my hours are pretty chaotic and TCGs are too expensive.

Why? People already talk about why they quit. It's almost always a combination of power creep, the game losing its identity, and just a general downgrade in flavor for the cards and what they're supposed to represent.

Edit: To clarify, my reasons for losing interest in MTG was card design had gotten lazy and the lore was discount MCU shit and I used to play UFS (which later rebranded to Universus) because it was a fighting game crossover card game. Now it's the My Hero Academia card game and every now and then they do something like Attack on Titan, Star Trek Lower Decks, and Critical Role. Neither are the games I used to play so I have no interest in them now.

 

[p1138]

@Snekposter You are bang on about this with TCG refugees, my group and even I am one of them. The AOS groups I go to are pretty big, I wish some content creators would chase down why so many people are quitting TCGs because I would actually like to know why. Mine was work life, I'm a nurse so my hours are pretty chaotic and TCGs are too expensive.

Most of the MTG content creators aren't quitting MTG, same as most of the D&D content creators aren't switching to anything else as much as they bitch about WotC. Unless Hasbro has done something within the past 48 hours to stir up a bunch of negative opinion, if they post a video about a different game, the views tank so they go back to the same well. Hell, it happens with wargaming and mini painting channels with 40k as well. But you see people explaining all the time talking about why they quit. The main culprit though is summed up on the first couple of graphs here

https://www.channelfireball.com/article/20-Interesting-MTG-Facts-and-Stats-from-2023/2499680d-ea2a-4bfd-9e07-feac37485949/

In recent years, the number of releases has been ramping up. According to Scryfall's definitions, which are clarified at the end of this article, a whopping 10,811 card objects were released in 2023, split among 92 sets. However, this was less than in 2022!

Last year, 12,274 card objects were released, split among 101 sets. This means that 2023 did NOT set a new record, for the first time in eight years. Finally, the streak of accelerating releases was broken!

Of course, these numbers are still absurdly high. If you add it all up, 12 percent of all card objects in Magic's history were released in 2023, which is wild for a game that has lasted 30 years. But the tide may be turning, and hopefully in 2024 the overwhelming feelings of product fatigue may subside a little bit. Phew.

In 2023, a record-setting 415 new commanders were released. On average, for the second year in a row, more than one new commander was released per day. Even if you played game with a new commander every day, you still wouldn't have been able to try them all.

In total, 20.2 percent of the legendary creatures that can act as a commander were introduced last year. To put that into perspective, suppose that you missed the entirety of 2023 and were to hop into a Commander game where everyone picks a commander at random from Magic's history. Then it's likely that one of the four commanders at the table would be one that you've never seen before.

And the charts on the page show the historical release counts for previous years, so you can see where the ramp up of releases started to get idiotic, and it has nothing to do with players, it's when more speculators started jumping on board. So you've got a company producing cards, with artificial scarcity, and they know that they can encourage people to buy a fucking palette of cards due to that artificial scarcity and power creep, because a bunch of people are trying to hit it rich instead of playing. As much as people bitch about GW doing things too fast(mostly people who only ever get in a couple games a year) how the hell is anyone supposed to keep up with what wotc has been doing? And remember, while that page is from 2023, it was 2022 that had the peak of releases so they actually toned shit down significantly this year, but it's still way out of hand. 101 sets released in 2022? That's an average of twice a week, so it also means stores get to encourage a nonstop string of release events to go along with normal FNM.

 

[Judge Dredd]

@Snekposter You are bang on about this with TCG refugees, my group and even I am one of them. The AOS groups I go to are pretty big, I wish some content creators would chase down why so many people are quitting TCGs because I would actually like to know why. Mine was work life, I'm a nurse so my hours are pretty chaotic and TCGs are too expensive.

I'd also add WotC/Hasbro has been shitting the bed with it's nerd IPs. People seem to think DnD 5e was killed off by the OGL debacle, but to me people were already growing tired of 5e and were looking for an excuse to quit, which OGL provided.

They are pandering to an audience that they think prints money. In MTG, it's speculators and tournament players. In 40k, it's tournament players. The elephant in the room is that pandering to these whales comes at the cost of the casuals, and the whales are only here to be king of the casuals. Oddly enough, DnD had the opposite problem. Pandering to twitter tourists who don't actually play the game.

I've never played AoS, or Kill Team. From what I gather from podcasts, AoS and Kill Team are popular in non-GW FLGS specifically because the games are optimised to play on a board that fits on a card table. If true, I can see both games eating WotC's lunch, and it makes sense why GW would move to a TCG business model.

Another, related thing killing TCG. I remember some high profile lawsuit where WotC/MTG claimed to own the concept of a TCG. I find that hard to believe, but I can see it spooking rivals into not wanting to try, and with no competition WotC has no reason to control quality.

 

[p1138]

Another, related thing killing TCG. I remember some high profile lawsuit where WotC/MTG claimed to own the concept of a TCG. I find that hard to believe, but I can see it spooking rivals into not wanting to try, and with no competition WotC has no reason to control quality.

I don't know if that holds up. There's been competition for MTG for ages, with TCGs coming and going constantly. At the big board game trade shows and stuff like gencon there's usually a half dozen new games that all disappear in the span of 6 months assuming they even make it to market. Just in the past few years alone(Pokemon and yugioh have been around for ages) You've had
Metazoo: That flopped after the creator shut everything down, but it had a run of a couple years before that happened. Why it ever gained any popularity I have no idea, because all of the art looked like shit
Keyforge: This was an interesting concept, but eliminated deckbuilding entirely, and wound up with people just going after the best decks on ebay since that was "solved" within about 2 weeks of launch. Died in a year.
Flesh And Blood: I think came out just this year? Seems to be marketed as the "edgy" TCG with blood and shit in the art. Probably won't last beyond another few months, but that won't really be WotC's fault
Lorcana: Disney is another 800 pound gorilla in the room for WotC to deal with. Initially it was disney weirdos hoarding cards, but I see people actually trying to play this now
Star Wars Unlimited: Dead in the water, but that's Disney's own fault with how they've handled the franchise
Marvel Champions: Also dead, same reason as SW Unlimited
Bandai/Konami: These are not small companies, and they constantly release a flood of TCGs based on weeb shit. There's a One Piece game that just launched not too long ago, a Gundam game coming out soon. They aren't afraid of WotC, but they have their own problems with post launch support.
Universus: I personally don't see the appeal of random franchise card battles, but it has an audience.

And that's just the recent stuff. White Wolf was trying TCGs for ages years ago. Eve Online had a TCG at one point. There's been at least 2 versions of netrunner in the past decade. Multiple Star Wars and Marvel games over the years. I don't see how WotC rivals have been spooked at all, if anything they're constantly flooding the market with shit. Hell, here's a video talking about a dozen TCGs being released in 2023, the only one of which I've even heard of was Lorcana.

It's just that MTG is the biggest thing in the market so people naturally gravitate to it because if you've got a local shop where you can play, FNM is a thing and you're guaranteed to be able to get some games in silently scowling at someone across the table.

 

[Judge Dredd]

Looking for suggestions and advice for guard paint schemes, both as an army paint scheme, and for one off units.

Spoiler: Austism, Ideas, and Images

Currently I'm using third party models for my guardsmen. Specifically this kit by Wargames Atlantic.

It's a squad of generic space colonial marine looking guys. Weapon options are pulse rifle, flamer, pistol, similar-to-but-legally-distinct smart gun, shotguns (for close encounters) and some "carbines" that look like SMGs to me. They also come with various head options, including helmet, full face helmet, ball cap, and boonie. I like Wargames Atlantic's sculpts, and was close to going with Pretorians with their Bulldog kit. I still can as they're a third of the price of GW kits.

Anyway. My initial plan was to have them based of Starship Troopers (the movie version) which themselves were based on nazi germany.

While I have no shortage of reference, my main concern here is that it's a lot of grey. Especially when it comes to vehicles.

The second obvious option is colonial marine colours from Aliens. ie. the default Cadian colours. It's the default, but it also works.

Another scheme I immediately thought of I'll call Cadia Black. This is the green fatigues with black armour plate. This is how most people remember the marines from Aliens due to the lighting from that movie.

I'd like a bit more colour, but not sure.


I'm considering painting a few figures in a unique colour scheme for shits and giggles. Maybe a KF colour scheme which would be ...green and grey. Shit.

If your prefer any of the options, or have ideas for how I can paint (or build) a guy for a silly reference, let me know.

 

[p1138]

I'm considering painting a few figures in a unique colour scheme for shits and giggles. Maybe a KF colour scheme which would be ...green and grey. Shit.

Honestly, it'd probably turn out easier than the green and black. Black is kind of a bitch to paint and have look right without having to go nuts with edge highlights or volumetric highlights. Before I got to this particular sentence of yours I was actually going to suggest a saturated green with a grey instead of black. Especially because of the armor stuff like sentinels, crewed guns, tanks, and so on.

Also, you've still got room for more color in the army, as you'll probably want a tertiary color to denote rank like a colored pauldron or stripe on the helmet or something for officers in addition or in place of decals. Plus plasma and power weapons, and of course commissars.

 

[Judge Dredd]

Black is kind of a bitch to paint and have look right without having to go nuts with edge highlights or volumetric highlights.

I haven't tried painting black in a serious manner. My understanding is that "black" is actually just dark grey. Kind of like the infamous checker shadow illusion, or how "space wolf grey" is just desaturated blue (though to me it always looked blue). You might be right tho, I'll get to that later.

Also, you've still got room for more color in the army

I didn't think of that. Cloth, armour, and skin were going to be my main 3, with a different colour helmet for special weapons so I can easily pick them out. Orange for flamer, blue for plasma. I don't know what other weapons would have but you get the idea. I could paint the pouches different and pick out some metal on the guns, but I'll get to that.

This is where the main army colour comes in. While I can (and likely will) play with colours for small units for Kill Team/OPR Skirmish, if I pick an army colour, I could end up having to paint 60-100 of these. I want to buy a spray can to spray the main colour, and then paint what's left. I've not decided which part I'll paint yet, it will depend on the sprays available locally, and if it's easier to paint armour or fatigues. I'm torn on pouches for a similar reason. "Real" armies don't have colour everywhere, any pouches should match fatuiges (see the Starship Troopers reference), but this isn't a real army, it's toy soldiers from space. There's also a lot of tacticool gear on these guys generally. Knee pads, pouches, goggles, holsters, pouches, gloves, pouches, and more. So there's a lot of options if I use that for an accent or tertiary colour.

I've also considered camo, but I don't know if I'm insane enough to try it.

Before I got to this particular sentence of yours I was actually going to suggest a saturated green with a grey instead of black.

In terms of a KF scheme, what would the third colour be? White for the text? Slobermutt tan? Or maybe some desert rats for BossManJack?

 

[p1138]

In terms of a KF scheme, what would the third colour be? White for the text? Slobermutt tan? Or maybe some desert rats for BossManJack?

lol, I don't know to be honest. Dark gray, light gray, green, and white? You're right about the black, but to me most people's idea of trying to paint black just looks gray, rather than looking black if you get what I'm saying especially when it comes to vehicles. Pouches, belts, etc you can do as a leather color, a dark leather would make sense without being ridiculously garish and that'll get you some more color. Wooden stocks on some guns too perhaps? Real world armies don't look like a rainbow, but there's still color on various objects especially if you start looking back to korea and ww2 as well as some african conflicts.

 

[Brubby The 2nd]

Killteam starter kit with both blindbox yapannese teams and MDF terrain, retvrn to the sovl of 2nd edition