US US Politics General - Discussion of President Biden and other politicians

 

[namelesstacotruck]

The number of experienced pilots who die because their instruments are technically correct, but not factually correct, is high. You are correct about reaction time, but that's about all AI has over the human mind.

Also, you are correct that a computer does well when dealing with a fixed system (a computerized catalogue of all prior known solutions in a game of chess, which has fixed rules). Combat is not a fixed system.

Isnt the number 1 threat to a pilot the ai controlled aerial vehicle that either rams them or gets near them and explodes? Missiles with target lock have been around forever and are for all intents and purposes just suicide drones.

Isnt the consensus that stealth is so super duper important because getting seen on long range radar easily and having some of these suicide drones is a death sentence?

This sounds very much like the chess talk 30 years ago.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

No, actually, they were invented in Denmark

Pssst: Denmark is a capitalist country. Novo Nordisk didn't invent Ozempic for charity.

 

[Hey Johnny Bravo]

Isnt the number 1 threat to a pilot the ai controlled aerial vehicle that either rams them or gets near them and explodes? Missiles with target lock have been around forever and are for all intents and purposes just suicide drones.

Isnt the consensus that stealth is so super duper important because getting seen on long range radar easily and having some of these suicide drones is a death sentence?

This sounds very much like the chess talk 30 years ago.

Chess is a far more fixed and predictable system than combat.

Pssst: Denmark is a capitalist country. Novo Nordisk didn't invent Ozempic for charity.

I was about to post this, but you beat me to it. Denmark has some serious biotech companies and they're all profit-driven.

 

[SpergioLeonne]

Combat is not manufacturing.

Yeah, in combat you have to refine what you bother to consider to a very short priority list. For modern air combat, it’s identify, radar lock and fire. The human is a very slow middleman

The amount of variables are endless.

A computer can hold more variables in its RAM than you can, and it won’t stutter when asked to read them back

Humans are better at it than AI because we don't need a fuckton of inputs and data to make a gut-level decision that makes sense and works.

Yea we do, we just do most of it subconsciously. It’s not magic. If you ever played sports, you probably caught a ball you weren’t directly looking at at some point. What you’re calling a magical instinct was your brain plotting a course and predicting where the ball was going. Computers can do that better than us.

We are not matter and motion according to physical law. It's not all meat. All materialistic theories of mind fail.

So you’re saying god will give humans magic so we can win against a hyper refined set of principles that we programmed and actuated?

As for the "AI dogfight," it was a simulation. It says right there in the article that it was a staged safety demonstration.

Ai won the simulation, then they moved to applying it to an f-16, and they didn’t discuss that outcome, but the humans on board never had to interfere and take the wheel

 

[Thomas Talus]

Being forever reliant on expensive pills, injections, and surgeries from the gigacorps of the medical industry and advice of the wealthy elite is like the direct opposite of marxist. Troons constantly claim to be marxist but like they're the most bougie fuckers around.

C-suites are the new sites of resistance to capitalism.

 

[REGENDarySumanai]

If you want to kneecap H1B visas permanently, just make it that they get equal pay as if it was an American born citizen applying for the job.

 

[Hey Johnny Bravo]

Yea we do, we just do most of it subconsciously. It’s not magic. If you ever played sports, you probably caught a ball you weren’t directly looking at at some point. What you’re calling a magical instinct was your brain plotting a course and predicting where the ball was going. Computers can do that better than us.

Then why aren't we watching AI sports leagues?

So you’re saying god will give humans magic so we can win against a hyper refined set of principles that we programmed and actuated?

Yes. I do not believe that human beings are machines and I do not believe in determinism. I'm not a religious fanatic, so don't bother with that tack, but there is obviously more to humans than "we're just super complicated widgets that we can replicate as machines" or else we would have an algorithm for human intelligence instead of overcomplicated chatbots peddled as "artificial intelligence."

This gets into theory of mind stuff, though, and is not relevant to this thread.

Ai won the simulation, then they moved to applying it to an f-16, and they didn’t discuss that outcome, but the humans on board never had to interfere and take the wheel

The article states outright that the simulation was a safety demonstration.

“The purpose of the test was to demonstrate we can safely test these AI agents in a safety-critical air combat environment,” Hefron said.

I think you have a point about how quickly the AI can act. There's a competing theory about air power which is that speed is better for air space penetration than stealth, so throwing a jet-drone-thing at the enemy that's going too fast for the enemy to react (so long as they don't have some AI-assisted air defense) might work better.

 

[namelesstacotruck]

If you want to kneecap H1B visas permanently, just make it that they get equal pay as if it was an American born citizen applying for the job.

They would still do it because the control it gives them.

H1B should be equal pay and company should have to pay a tax equal to 100 percent of the salary. Also they have to open the role for an American applicant yearly. H1B should be jeets stepping in while training a replacement that is American.

 

[REGENDarySumanai]

They would still do it because the control it gives them.

H1B should be equal pay and company should have to pay a tax equal to 100 percent of the salary. Also they have to open the role for an American applicant yearly. H1B should be jeets stepping in while training a replacement that is American.

This too.

 

[Aidan]

A computer can hold more variables in its RAM than you can, and it won’t stutter when asked to read them back

The problem isn't storing variables it's calculating the results in a timely manner.

 

[XYZpdq Jr.]

live feed from C-SPAN
Speaker time is now

 

[SpergioLeonne]

Yes. I do not believe that human beings are machines and I do not believe in determinism. I'm not a religious fanatic, so don't bother with that tack, but there is obviously more to humans than "we're just super complicated widgets that we can replicate as machines" or else we would have an algorithm for human intelligence instead of overcomplicated chatbots peddled as "artificial intelligence."

I AM deterministic, utterly. Randomness doesn’t actually exist so there’s no substrate from which magic can arise. Whatever appears magical was set in motion when the universe began.

I don’t see a conflict with this belief and theology. God saves your soul, not your ass. He lets you sit in your mess.

The thing is, we don’t have unique thoughts very often. Mostly we remember shit and mischaracterize the transaction to ourselves, or synthesize a hybrid concept.

The chess computer wins 100% of the time, because it can remember what to do in every board position. There is a finite set of board positions. There’s likely a finite limits to all forces in the universe. The only thing that’s infinite is the void that hasn’t become space yet because it hasn’t been interacted with.

Every time a human has an advantage to exploit over a computer, it’s because the programmer hadn’t thought of it yet. Now you reminded them, and they’re going to update the software.

Virtually every video game post 16 bit cartridges, you couldn’t win without the programmers intentionally nerfing the game down to where humans can compete

 

[Dimension Sniper]

Then why aren't we watching AI sports leagues?

Because it would be boring. We know the computer can do it perfectly. When a human does it perfectly it’s interesting and exciting.

 

[Potatoherder]

My vote is Jefferies will give enough votes for Johnson to win. They have already put a down payment and don't want to lose the investment.

 

[Dan Abrams]

Jeffries is a barely sentient retard

 

[SpergioLeonne]

Because it would be boring. We know the computer can do it perfectly. When a human does it perfectly it’s interesting and exciting.

It wouldn’t come across as being in our language. Would Ai try to fake Ai out? That would be resolved one way or another probably in a manner that didn’t make sense to us to watch

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Would Ai try to fake Ai out? That would be resolved one way or another probably in a manner that didn’t make sense to us to watch

Already happened when they had the WOPR play itself in a game of chess.

 

[Hey Johnny Bravo]

I AM deterministic, utterly. Randomness doesn’t actually exist so there’s no substrate from which magic can arise. Whatever appears magical was set in motion when the universe began.

We are going to have to agree to disagree on this subject. I am opposed to determinism at a fundamental level. We can make a new thread if you want to discuss the metaphysics of determinism, but I do not see the point in continuing the discussion here since it will go off in an autistic direction that only you and I will enjoy.

 

[The Ugly One]

My medications would cost either $220 USD here (without insurance) or £20 in the UK (abt 25 bucks)
It took less than a week to meet a NHS practice

The cost of your NHS in the UK is the fact that you make about six cents for every dollar an American earns. Since median salary here is about $70k, and in UK it's about $40k, overall, all that shit costs you about $30k per year.

Or to put it another way, average home size in the UK is 800 sq ft, while in the USA, it's 2000 sq ft. You can think of those 1200 sq ft you don't get to live in as the price of your "free" health care.

 

[SpergioLeonne]

We are going to have to agree to disagree on this subject. I am opposed to determinism at a fundamental level. We can make a new thread if you want to discuss the metaphysics of determinism, but I do not see the point in continuing the discussion here since it will go off in an autistic direction that only you and I will enjoy.

Agree it would be a rabbit hole.

My final word on the whole thing is that every time a human thinks of something that the programming didn’t account for, the human experiences demoralization, wondering how many more times it can pull a rabbit out of the hat. The program adds another code cluster.