US US Politics General 2 - Discussion of President Trump and other politicians

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Should be a wild four years.

Helpful links for those who need them:

Current members of the House of Representatives
https://www.house.gov/representatives

Current members of the Senate
https://www.senate.gov/senators/

Current members of the US Supreme Court
https://www.supremecourt.gov/about/biographies.aspx

Members of the Trump Administration
https://www.whitehouse.gov/administration/
 
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FILTH Tourist said:
But if the pardons were issued without Biden's knowing or approval then they are pretty much a forgery. The President has the power of pardon, not random staffers with an autopen.
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Sure, but, devil's advocate; how do you prove without a doubt he didn't know? As hilarious as this is, it's a question I've been having to ask since the whole autopen debacle came up.
 
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All Biden has to do is say he pardoned them in sound mind and in perfect health, can he prove that he was of sound mind when he pardoned them? Can he prove that it's him and not some staffer? Did we essentially elect a dementia patient with a horde of bureaucrats governing his decisions or did we elect a incompetent president? That's all we need to know.
 
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DickMain said:
Sure, but, devil's advocate; how do you prove without a doubt he didn't know? As hilarious as this is, it's a question I've been having to ask since the whole autopen debacle came up.
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Two examples I can think of is the DOJ finding Biden incompetent to stand trial for his handling of classified data and the Wallstreet Journal publishing an article stating that his staffers were effectively making most of the decisions in the Administration.

It could very well be argued that Biden didn't know what he was signing on account of him being a senile child sniffing pedophile. The question is, how do you prove which aide/crack addicted son put those pardons in front of him?
 
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Smashed & Slamed said:
If it's so forgone then it can withstand this scrutiny and Trump can use it to pardon his administration as well.
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Legality is the question.
As you open this pandora box of question it only gets worst.
Best way stop this question is rule the pardon absolute & ignore everything else.
If Trump gets digital pen access welp hold your ass .(technology meme for saying it's ok( leads to ai))
 
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DickMain said:
Sure, but, devil's advocate; how do you prove without a doubt he didn't know? As hilarious as this is, it's a question I've been having to ask since the whole autopen debacle came up.
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There are Biden staffers who are saying that other staffers were autopenning without even contacting Biden. It's a combination of that and Biden's brain being mush.
In any case "prove without a doubt" isn't a legal standard. This will either get to the Supreme Court or it won't, but they won't decide it on the basis of absolute proof if it does.

Trump has been very clear about autopen use policy (only for cases that don't involve presidential powers or for signing multiple copies of something he already signed) and signing everything in front of witnesses. Presumably this is both to contrast with what Biden staffers did and to make his own actions safe from similar objections.
 
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Prediction: It will come out that Ketanji Brown was autopenned into the Supreme Court and when her case gets brought before the court (and she’s forced to recuse) all of the other justices will be so tired of listening to her say “DAS RITE” that they will vote to kick her out. The ensuing chimp out will be better than any Burger King video.

Edit: Trump is a master marketer. He announced this on Sunday night so it would blow up the headlines Monday morning. Pure Genius.
 
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DickMain said:
Sure, but, devil's advocate; how do you prove without a doubt he didn't know? As hilarious as this is, it's a question I've been having to ask since the whole autopen debacle came up.
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I'd assume they have witnesses on that. Trump must feel pretty confident if he's making such a bold move.
They could further subpoena Biden on that. I don't think his mental faculties would hold up all that well on the witness stand.
Present him with every single pardon he supposedly signed, and mix in a bunch of fakes that he definitely did not sign.
If he claims to have signed them all, he's lying. If he can't recall, that also speaks against him.
 
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The absolute funniest part of all this shit is how none of you are even questioning why Trump isn't prosecuting Biden for supposedly rigging the 2020 election. The guy is still alive and kicking, unpardoned, he's at Trump's every legal whim, yet Trump doesn't seem to want to dole out any punishment towards him.

Weird, huh? He's had access to the government's backend since January 20th, you'd think he'd somehow find evidence of all the fraud, right? Hell, back in 2020 he had access to the government's backend both before and after the election, you'd think he'd have already done it, right?

It's almost like Trump knows he lost fair and square, and there'd be no case to actually fight in court. It's almost like this is bullshit smoke and mirrors to keep Fox News fed and their viewers entertained with news about Trump doing things, doesn't matter if they aren't actually improving material conditions for them in the slightest, as long as he's taking culture war victories, that's all that matters.
 
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Neil said:
The absolute funniest part of all this shit is how none of you are even questioning why Trump isn't prosecuting Biden for supposedly rigging the 2020 election. The guy is still alive and kicking, unpardoned, he's at Trump's every legal whim, yet Trump doesn't seem to want to dole out any punishment towards him.

Weird, huh? He's had access to the government's backend since January 20th, you'd think he'd somehow find evidence of all the fraud, right? Hell, back in 2020 he had access to the government's backend both before and after the election, you'd think he'd have already done it, right?

It's almost like Trump knows he lost fair and square, and there'd be no case to actually fight in court. It's almost like this is bullshit smoke and mirrors to keep Fox News fed and their viewers entertained with news about Trump doing things, doesn't matter if they aren't actually improving material conditions for them in the slightest, as long as he's taking culture war victories, that's all that matters.
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Nothing short of a SCOTUS ruling would make Donald Trump back down from this, and even then, an unfavourable SCOTUS verdict would probably lead to Trump invoking the precedent set by Andrew Jackson flouting the SCOTUS verdict on Worcester v. Georgia. I'd say that we're in a similar bind that Turkey was in when Erdogan consolidated considerable power in the presidency while deliberately weakening the courts, but honestly? I think we crossed that threshold a long time ago under a previous administration; it's just that Trump was the first madman to be so brazen about it.

I too want to see Fauci, Hunter Biden, et al proverbially guillotined by the DOJ, but holy shit, turnabout is fair play if the Democrats ever get hold of power again. Might not happen any time soon, like within the next 4-8, maybe 12 years, but I'm mildly concerned about the precedent this sets.
 
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I've been really surprised by how seemingly prepared the second Trump admin has been thus far.

They have been very subtly threatening the Supreme Court that if they don't reign in these off the reservation judges, such as Boasberg, that they will challenge the legitimacy of the court. The judicial branch is meant to be the weakest of the three, they're not elected after all, so this is a welcome development.

The skeptic in me believed this admin is a clean up job/limited hang out and so everything substantial would quietly disappear, such as the blackmail generated by Epstein and confiscated by the FBI, but I'm secretly hopeful these things have been held back for leverage until the time is right.

It's certainly obvious that things have changed in the ruling class. Maybe finally some noblesse oblige?
 
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