Pyramid Scheme Pariahs

[Surtur]

I recently had a run in on my Facebook about people advertising obvious scams. One of them being a distant family member.

Basically, she was an "independent sales rep" for a company called ACN (A company that resells services from AT&T, Verizon, ETC at noncompetitive prices), basically, she posted a link to her independent website telling people that if they signed up for ACN services they would get a free $300 dollar gift card or something. I personally have zero tolerance for people forwarding scams on Facebook and so I made a comment explaining how this service was a scam and that she should get herself out of it. My comment got deleted and she sent me a private message telling me not to do that because it's apparently how she supports herself. She claimed that she's been doing it for over a year and supposedly weighed the pros and cons of doing it, which indicates to me that if this work has actually helped her sustain her income, then she must be high up enough in the pyramid because everyone at the bottom almost always gets chewed up and spit out by these sorts of systems. I even told her that the top Google results for ACN associate it with being a scam (Veema and Amway came up in the results) and she brushed them off in an almost cultish fashion.

I don't know... maybe the work does help get her by, or maybe she's just too "brainwashed" by the false prospect of easy money. It's hard to tell.

My brother got involved with ACN, I seriously can't stand them.

 

[Papa Nier]

This is crazy.

I've been consistently following the blogger listed in the OP, http://yprpariah.wordpress.com/ since this thread was started. The guy has been writing posts rebuking every aspect of Vemma's business model, lambasting their leadership, and dedicating many posts to comparing Vemma to similar pyramid schemes. Recently he was beginning work on an ebook that he was going to sell satirizing the multi-level marketing industry. A couple of weeks ago, he made a post saying that he had said everything that there was to say about Vemma, revealing all the flaws in Vemma affiliates' arguments, and that he was quitting the blog but leaving it up for reference.

A few days ago, the blog was made private, so every post is gone. Just today, this was posted: http://yprpariah.wordpress.com/2014/08/28/attention-all-viewers/



Astonished, I started looking for other venues where people might be discussing this, and found this subreddit focused on Vemma, where a few people were discussing the blog's disappearance: http://www.reddit.com/r/Vemma/comments/2eet51/what_happened_to_ypr_pariah/

People think that he was either threatened with legal action and caved in (unlikely, since he was doing a good job at keeping himself anonymous, and there's nothing that they could do, really), or that they paid him off. I'm inclined to believe the latter, based on the reasoning in this post:



I tried to find archives of the blog's posts, but Wayback Machine and Google's cache don't have anything due to the site's "robots.txt," which has something to do with how webpages are scanned and sorted by the automated web crawlers that search engines use. Pretty floored by what's happened.

This is actually pretty unsettling.

 

[sparklemilhouse]

When I was in high school, there was a knife company (hell, might've been the same knife company that Chris "worked" for for all I know) that recruited very heavily from the student body. They even had ads in the school, which I'm pretty sure is illegal. .

Someone went around the community college I worked at posting posters for vector. I took them all down because I didn't want the gullable students falling for it (a lot of the adult students were crazy gullible). I got in trouble.

 

[AnchuentProphecy]

My brother got involved with ACN, I seriously can't stand them.

I know someone I was in the Navy with that is involved with them. All he uses his Facebook for is to try to suck others into the scam I got so fed up with it that I removed him.

 

[OBAMATRON]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/419_scams

 

[AnchuentProphecy]

I found something that someone else I was in the military with got involved with called passion parties it's basically a mlm that peddles sex toys

http://www.passionparties.com

It seems like people in the military easily fall victim to these mlm's as well. I was wondering if you guys could give me input on this passion parties thing

 

[Artard]

Yeah I have considered that but it would be a pain in the ass having to update everyone with the new number and I am not sure if my carrier will charge me for it or not.

Like I said, I want to record him but I am not sure if that is legal or not. I was thinking of downloading a recording app.

My guess is that you were initially polite or otherwise sounded receptive. You sound like you were polite when you told him you contacted Wal*Mart as well. No criticism -- you're probably a nice, polite person -- but he took that as proof that you were wavering and vulnerable. He's holding on to the 1% chance that you're good for $500 -- you're still marked as a potential mark in his book, one he could perhaps persuade to part with your money.

You can't go to jail for recording the commission of a crime. Not sure what you would do with the recording, though.

 

[Ouija Board]

I just talked to Surtur and he gave me the ok to post the numbers of the guy from Jamaica that is calling me so that if it pops up on your phones you can avoid him like the plaque.

The two numbers are:

1-876-332-9635 and

1-876-304-2535

I Googled these numbers and they are indexed and as far as I know they are outgoing phone numbers so I don't think you could get a hold of him anyways. It also seems to be that these numbers are cataloged as scam numbers.

I found something that someone else I was in the military with got involved with called passion parties it's basically a mlm that peddles sex toys

http://www.passionparties.com

It seems like people in the military easily fall victim to these mlm's as well. I was wondering if you guys could give me input on this passion parties thing

I'm not watching that 20 minute video but I went to one of those all girl sex toy parties about 10 years ago. I don't remember if it's this particular company though.

 

[OR 345]

I know of two that show up at my college. One is the Work For Students site. I saw it scribbled on the sidewalk in chalk, advertising something like $14/hr pay. It's everywhere. I didn't even know it was Vector until curiosity got me and I looked it up to see just what this miracle company was.
The second is a bit more...unique? A rep comes to a lecture, passes out a slip of paper soliciting contact info, and then claims it's to gauge interest in some STEM internship as they collect said paper. Okay, that's sketchy, because there are significantly more legitimate-looking internship offers everywhere (this looks more like a general interest study, and I've filled out my share of surveys for classmates' projects before), but it was already out of my hands. I forget about it for a while until I get a call at stupid late at night, I want to say around ten? In any case, it was past generally acceptable calling hours. I pick up to get this kid telling me about some info session taking place the next morning. I realize this is from that thing we filled out earlier in the year. Yeah, sure, I have nothing better going on and, like with Work For Students, I'm curious, so let's see just what you're offering. It's only when I sit down with two other students and the guy from last night that I learn what this "internship" is.
It's house painting.
I shit you not, it's managing a painting crew under a company called College Paint Works, which promises lots of work, damn near a years' pay for summer work, and even conference trips for the top managers. You buy your own supplies, you hire your own employees, you scope out your own jobs, and the company takes a massive chunk out of your payment as "overhead." I tell the kid that I live out in bumfuck nowhere, not even remotely close to the prospective locations he was talking about. One I remember is Edina, which is a wealthy suburb. Actually, I think they were all middle to upper class suburbs he mentioned. Anyway, he says to not worry about it, because I was guaranteed to get jobs. Wow, this whole pitch isn't full of red flags, not at all. Now that I have a name for the scam, I decide to look it up. People say they were struggling to keep their team together and make profits before the company swoops in and takes, what was it, I want to say I saw up to 30-40% of the earnings BEFORE accounting for supply/transport/employee payment. There was one lone review that said they made a lot of money and that everyone else was just lazy and didn't put any effort into it. There was also at least one from a homeowner complaining about the quality of the work. I've seen more reps this year, and I wonder how long it'll take before I end up outright asking if it's about fucking house painting while they're pitching.


tl;dr Not only does my college have sidewalk chalk ads for Work For Students/Vector, a house painting-focused scam runs around trying to recruit kids under the guise of a STEM internship. Classy.

 

[Arkangel]

I found something that someone else I was in the military with got involved with called passion parties it's basically a mlm that peddles sex toys

http://www.passionparties.com

It seems like people in the military easily fall victim to these mlm's as well. I was wondering if you guys could give me input on this passion parties thing

Amusingly enough, I actually did have an encounter with a passion party sales rep (scam victim).

Spoiler: possibly NSFW

A few years ago when I was in Community College, me and some friends went to a Halloween costume party at another friend's house. Another friend of the host asked her if she could do a passion party during the festivities. She gave the go-ahead because many of my male friends brought their GFs with them. Most of the presentation was just her showing off various dildos, lubricants and other things that supposedly enhanced sexual pleasure for both partners. The presentation pretty much consisted of everyone making lewd jokes and playing dildo light-sabers, so everyone pretty much had fun that night.

All in all, the stuff she was selling was pretty trite as far as sex toys go. Stuff you could probably buy for cheaper in a regular adult shop if you really wanted it. I felt bad for the poor girl because no one bought anything from her that night.

 

[sparklemilhouse]

I wonder why more students don't speak up about these ripoff companies coming on campus.

Oh. My community college would also let ripoff for profit schools like strayer set up tables. Way to scam your transfer credit graduates.

 

[GRANDnumberofMULTIPLES]

sadness

I think the you-only-have-yourself-to-blame-and-you-are-responsible-for-all-your-problems mindset really appeals to the people who fall for MLMs. Because the whole system sets up this great (and extremely unattainable) vision of success, riches, your own company-leased super luxury car (available at black double-dildo-diamond level), and beachfront property in Montana and shows you all those slick videos of the top 1% earners doing just that, it gets distilled into working hard = success.

And if working hard =/= success, then you're just not trying hard enough.

@Radi Ashun, I wish I had advice to offer--not sure if you have caller ID but anything that shows up as 876 I wouldn't pick up. It is really unusual that he keeps calling. I have never heard of one who kept calling back (at least with the Green Dot Money Pak scams) and I used to work with my city's PD. Unless they've already got some dough from you usually you're not worth the air to talk to and they try their next mark.

@sparklemilhouse I still can't believe Vector still sends out garbage in this day and age. I graduated from high school in 2009 and like fucking clockwork I got my Vector Marketing letter. It was like some kind of really shitty induction into Hogwarts, if Hogwarts dropped you off in 90 degree weather to shill knives or something. I made more money at my GOOD and HONEST office job until the market crashed in 2008 and through reselling vintage items from thrift stores the next summer.

 

[Arkangel]

I wonder why more students don't speak up about these ripoff companies coming on campus.

Oh. My community college would also let ripoff for profit schools like strayer set up tables. Way to scam your transfer credit graduates.

Eh. It's dumb, but students are responsible for what they do with themselves. Not the schools. Also, for better or worse, people have the right to advertise themselves on school campuses as a freedom of speech thing, even if what they're advertising is completely shitty and worthless.

I suppose if people wanted to counter these sorts of people, they should set up their own table giving out free info about how MLMs screw people over.

 

[Picklechu]

I think I've mentioned it in another thread over in Discussion, but I did the Cutco/Vector thing for about a month back in 2011. A friend had signed up for it, and had given them my number. I knew it was a ripoff when I went in, but I was pretty desperate for money, as it was the summer, I couldn't stay in the city I attended college and worked a student job in because I had lived in a dorm and my apartment lease didn't start until August, and I figured I could at least make some beer money.

Fortunately, they waived the kit purchase thing, so I merely "borrowed" it. During training, I only gave them the numbers of random burnouts I knew in high school, as I didn't want them bothering anyone I actually liked with this bullshit. I did a few sales meetings at peoples' houses (which got you $10-$30; I forget the amount) and sold a handful of things. A lot of the meetings were kind of half-assed, as all parties were aware of what a ripoff it was.

We were called into "meetings" (i.e. late night brainwashing sessions, essentially, where we needed to write down more contacts) at least three or four times a week. As the office was about thirty miles from my house, I only made a net profit of $80 over the month I worked there. The manager and "team leaders" were incredibly belittling ("Why won't your mom, who is a single teacher who doesn't cook, buy a $200 knife? Doesn't she love you?"), and I was sick of putting miles on my car to earn next to nothing, so I told them I was done. I returned the kit, and asked my manager whether or not I needed to sign anything saying I returned it, to which he replied I did not. Of course, a few weeks later, some corporate office called me, threatening me with a fine for "stealing" my kit. I told them what the manager told me, told them I had evidence that I returned the kit, and threatened to call my lawyer if they tried to bill me. After a few days, they called me back to let me know that it was a "mistake" on their part.

Every time I see a Cutco/Vector pitch, whether online or in real life, I troll the shit out of it and let people know that it's a major ripoff.

As for AmWay, I've recently done a decent bit of research on them, as a former governor of my state was well-known as being a salesperson for them. It seems less awful than a lot of the other schemes, but it's still pretty shady.

Yeah I have considered that but it would be a pain in the ass having to update everyone with the new number and I am not sure if my carrier will charge me for it or not.

Like I said, I want to record him but I am not sure if that is legal or not. I was thinking of downloading a recording app.

You are perfectly within your legal rights to file a police report (which is good for the purposes of documentation) if you so desire. Recording, depending on where you live, is a bit of a gray area though.

It seems like people in the military easily fall victim to these mlm's as well.

Dependopotami seem to fall for them with regularity, if my Facebook feed is to be believed.

I suppose if people wanted to counter these sorts of people, they should set up their own table giving out free info about how MLMs screw people over.

I totally want to do this. Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately?), I don't think any show up on campus at my university. Plus, I'm a graduate student, so I don't have time to sleep, much less do that.

 

[Beef Thunderpants]

Amusingly enough, I actually did have an encounter with a passion party sales rep (scam victim).

Spoiler: possibly NSFW

A few years ago when I was in Community College, me and some friends went to a Halloween costume party at another friend's house. Another friend of the host asked her if she could do a passion party during the festivities. She gave the go-ahead because many of my male friends brought their GFs with them. Most of the presentation was just her showing off various dildos, lubricants and other things that supposedly enhanced sexual pleasure for both partners. The presentation pretty much consisted of everyone making lewd jokes and playing dildo light-sabers, so everyone pretty much had fun that night.

All in all, the stuff she was selling was pretty trite as far as sex toys go. Stuff you could probably buy for cheaper in a regular adult shop if you really wanted it. I felt bad for the poor girl because no one bought anything from her that night.

I don't know anybody that has held those parties, but I know people that have gone to them and women late 20's-plus seem to spend an average of about $50 each. Don't want to go to a store, can't see exactly what it is online, caught up in the fun, etc. I guess by that age they realize an arsenal is good to have around.

 

[Mechanism Eight]

I don't think this belongs in the lolcows general board...

This belongs in the "Terrible things that need to be stopped somehow and are legitimate issues that seriously make the world worse" board.

The people who run this shit are scum. That's all that needs to be said.

 

[hm yeah]

while i've never had any sort of direct contact or anything with any of these groups, in my area from the 90's to the 00's, apparently pyramid schemes were a big thing. not only would the usual mlm victims be suckered in, but even people who should know better, like teachers and middle-aged people with decent jobs. i found it all annoying as hell, and i let them know that. i guess that's my immunity.

 

[AnchuentProphecy]

I don't think this belongs in the lolcows general board...

This belongs in the "Terrible things that need to be stopped somehow and are legitimate issues that seriously make the world worse" board.

The people who run this shit are scum. That's all that needs to be said.

I originally created this thread in the bluepillers sub forum when it existed. The blue pillars sub forum for those who don't know was a bored for groups who promoted an unfulfilling lifestyle and I felt it fit the description perfectly.

 

[Bork Laser]

Thanks to this thread I found out my energy drink I use to keep me up at work is from a pyramid scheme. My dad comes home with boxes of these things so I hope he's just buying alot for me and him to drink. I'm gonna let him know to stop buying this shit. I also found out XS Energy Drink is extremely unhealthy for you despite what it claims. It has synthetic vitamins and sweetner(apparently a nerutoxin). So thanks CWCiki. You helped me from becoming Tyce.

 

[drtoboggan]

XS is an AmWay product, isn't it? I got pulled into one of those with a friend. I hit them with too many tough questions and went back to work the next day. My bullshit detector is pretty strong.
My cousin is in one of them right now. It's one of the weight loss & nutrition BS things. I'm just going to say he's not the best person to sell anything related to either. I could since I gain & lose weight almost at will, but I hate people and I'm not a sap like him.