[26-Mar-2020] Philip's 341 Creditor Meeting - When what should be 5 minutes becomes an eternity.

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So uh, I don't wanna be that guy. But I'm gonna be that guy.

What if this all falls apart on him. The bankruptcy, Kat leaves, takes jasper, both condos and car gone.

Uh, what if he goes off the deep end and kills himself?

If you don't believe that he's too prideful to do himself in like most do you can rest easy knowing even if he tried like everything else he'd probably screw it up and massively extend his lifespan or become immortal.
 
So uh, I don't wanna be that guy. But I'm gonna be that guy.

What if this all falls apart on him. The bankruptcy, Kat leaves, takes jasper, both condos and car gone.

Uh, what if he goes off the deep end and kills himself?
He won't off himself because he's a spiteful little turd. If he does we should commission a gravestone for him and hold a funeral. The gravestone should say something like this: "Here lies Phil with oddly shaped head. He did nothing wrong, he did everything correct." At his funeral tractors should be T-posing, swaying and snorting in unison to show respect before tipping his casket into the grave.
 
He won't off himself because he's a spiteful little turd. If he does we should commission a gravestone for him and hold a funeral. The gravestone should say something like this: "Here lies Phil with oddly shaped head. He did nothing wrong, he did everything correct." At his funeral tractors should be T-posing, swaying and snorting in unison to show respect before tipping his casket into the grave.
imagine being in a graveyard, when you stumble on a funeral
everyone is wearing sonic hats and shitty vests
as the casket is lowered, some shitty music plays with a guy yelling ALL EMPLOYEES over and over
and everyone t-poses and wobbles in place
then after the music cuts off everyone leans forward and ACK ACK ACKs
 
Then why did he go on the whole rant about "per my tax attorney they are gifts, willingly and voluntarily" etc? Was he just having some kind of episode (or PTSD flashback) back in time to when his other tax guy "screwed up" his taxes?
Because he's a windbag who loves to just string words together to make himself feel like a big boy. The call cut out slightly so what he said when asked about tips was "to my understanding, as per MY TAX ATTORNEY, they are not exempt" but the call cut out so what's on the recording is "to my understanding, as per MY TAX ATTORNEY, they are n- -xempt", he then went on to illustrate that his tips are considered regular income like what a waiter earns, he just added a bunch of pre-stream nonsense because he was sweating bullets at that point from all the questions.

Like whan Nancy asked him "What is YOUR (<- active word here is 'your') Paypal?" and instead of telling her what financial activities he uses it for and where it fits into the shit-pile on his finances he described what he thinks the concept of Paypal is, answering with "Paypal? Umm, Paypal is an online currency system."
 
Ugh....this maybe creditor had his shit wrong. Phil listed his income after business expenses as around $5000. In the "income and expenses" filing, he listed his income correctly. Man, missed opportunity here.

This. I didn’t realize it until last night but this page is a smoking gun that no one brought up during the call.

1CA2D9FF-2523-4526-9C62-D6E48D527A73.png

He lists his real income right here but makes no mention of it anywhere else and contradicts almost the entire filing because of it. This shows he’s hiding $4-6k monthly that just vanishes.
 
This. I didn’t realize it until last night but this page is a smoking gun that no one brought up during the call.
This is what the gay ops "citibank" guy was trying to get at, but he failed to cite the right form. So Phil and Rochelle just derailed his interjection towards the "expenses" section of the other form (his personal expenses, groceries, mortgage, etc).
 
The other problem is that the "main form" only has net income listed, so everyone is getting confused because they are taking DSP and Kat's combined net income (which is $5K) and double dipping his business expenses from that verbally, which is incorrect and what the trustee thought the guy was doing. The main form doesn't have business expenses on it. Even Nick was getting confused because the Pigroach's business expenses and personal expenses are within a couple hundred dollars of each other, which is more pigroach luck.

I have no idea why the forms are set up this way.
 
This. I didn’t realize it until last night but this page is a smoking gun that no one brought up during the call.

View attachment 1207328

He lists his real income right here but makes no mention of it anywhere else and contradicts almost the entire filing because of it. This shows he’s hiding $4-6k monthly that just vanishes.

He's not hiding anything. That firm lists the gross income. The other form asks for the income after the "ordinary and necessary expenses" of the business. He makes around $8-10k a month. Kat makes $1700ish. He's trying to claim that he averages $5k a month in business expenses AND $5k a month in personal expenses, leaving them with no money to pay their credit cards.
 
The other problem is that the "main form" only has net income listed, so everyone is getting confused because they are taking DSP and Kat's combined net income (which is $5K)
Yeah up until now the trustee just seems to take this net income at face value and isn't questioning his business expenses at all (or maybe she missed it too that those are different but similar values in the 5k range?). I can't blame her, pigroach's attempt at filling these forms is extremely confusing, but I hope someone brings this to her attention. It's also strange that he has to justify all his personal expenses (itemized list) and in regards to the business expenses he just can throw a number into a field. Sure, this is his personal (not business) bankruptcy, but in the case of a sole proprietorship this seems like a giant loophole.
 
He's not hiding anything. That firm lists the gross income. The other form asks for the income after the "ordinary and necessary expenses" of the business. He makes around $8-10k a month. Kat makes $1700ish. He's trying to claim that he averages $5k a month in business expenses AND $5k a month in personal expenses, leaving them with no money to pay their credit cards.
I'm 100% certain that if DSP had to look at a case like this he'd call it a scam. It is such an idiotic thing to suggest he has $5,000 per month on business expenses, when his business is just sitting on a couch and streaming. Even a boomer who has no idea what streaming is would catch on to this. I don't know if he thought he was filing his documents for Sidella or superblindman to read, but this is straight up making fun of the system and Nancy should squeeze every last penny off of this dude.
 
I hope once the trustee sees the PayPal account. She will get suspicious and ask for another meeting or more info.

Also no Pigroach will not kill himself. Even if we end up with apartment or parents house streaming. Along with the divorce he'll continue to stream hardcore e-begging just to spite detractors. His spite is very tahxic.
 
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He lists his real income right here but makes no mention of it anywhere else and contradicts almost the entire filing because of it. This shows he’s hiding $4-6k monthly that just vanishes.

Don't worry, its only a matter of time before Nancy catches this. As far as we know, all of his deposits end up in the two PayPal accounts, and Nancy is going to see the full deposit history for both of them. She'll add up all the numbers and say WTF, then she'll realize what citibank guy was all worked up about. Its pretty clear that all his tips and all his WWE Champions spending is in that second PayPal account, which is why Rochelle never sent it. They literally hoped it wouldn't be asked for... "I wasn't sure you needed all of that" were Rochelle's exact words.

After listening to the call, I don't think Nancy spent a lot of time reviewing the filing before the 341 meeting. I imagine she had a paralegal review it and mark up some areas which didn't make sense, like the fact that he had a business but didn't have a business, that his condo is listed as a house, etc. But I doubt she actually did much accounting of the actual figures. My guess is its pretty standard to give the debtor a chance to fix any blatant mistakes during the 341, then go through and see how much is bullshit.
 
He's not hiding anything. That firm lists the gross income. The other form asks for the income after the "ordinary and necessary expenses" of the business. He makes around $8-10k a month. Kat makes $1700ish. He's trying to claim that he averages $5k a month in business expenses AND $5k a month in personal expenses, leaving them with no money to pay their credit cards.

I’m on very little sleep right now and have no energy to look through that autistic filing at the moment but does he itemize both expenses or just the one? Because trying to claim $10,000 in overall expenses is the most insane thing I’ve ever heard.
 
Potentially stupid question for @SoapQueen1, @Beetus Knuckles, @marlintan, and @AnOminous: the trustee asked for the transactions from both Paypal accounts for the last 6 months. Is that the 6 months prior to the bankruptcy filing (i.e., the 6 months he covered in the income and expenses report), or is it the 6 months prior to the 341 meeting? If it's the latter, what is she looking for? Hidden income? Frivolous spending like that of WWE Champions?
From what I gathered from the way the question was asked, she wants the last 6 months like february 2020 and the 5 preceding months to that. She is likely doing due diligence to make sure his income is what he says it is, and discretionary spending not going to his collatoralized debts (CT condo) or his credit cards, if he had the money to pay what he owes on those things, but wasted it on frivolous things, seems less likely to qualify for bankruptcy.
 
I’m on very little sleep right now and have no energy to look through that autistic filing at the moment but does he itemize both expenses or just the one? Because trying to claim $10,000 in overall expenses is the most insane thing I’ve ever heard.

The personal expenses are roughly broken down in the main bankruptcy filing. The business ones are not as the forms had no place for it, and only the monthly amounts are listed (on the separate "Income and Expenses" form). That's why I want to try and rally it up myself. His business expenses don't even remotely pass the smell test.

One thing I don't know is if he was supposed to prepare some kind of expenses breakdown for the business ones.
 
To do that, she would have to completely ignore his likely bogus "business expenses" and potentially fraudulent tax filings while also challenging just his WA condo valuation so that he can just barely hit the Chapter 7 income requirements while also having his WA condo not be covered by the exemption. And then there's the question of which part of the money her percentage actually comes from: is it the entire sale price of the WA condo, or is it whatever remains after the WA mortgage (and CT condo deficiency?) is paid off and Phil gets his $125,000 from the WA exemption.

If it's the latter, there is no reason for her to even bother with it. I guess I'm not seeing why she would risk her career, given that a judge is going to look at this too, over maybe $20,000. She gets guaranteed money for however many tens or hundreds of bankruptcies roll through with an occasional bump from liquidations. I get your point about dismissing the bankruptcy completely not being her best financial decision, but check the role of a trustee here and when debt shouldn't be discharged in Section J (as Chapter 7 would allow): https://www.justice.gov/ust/handbook-chapter-7-trustees

Section 727(a) provides that the court shall grant a discharge unless the debtor:
2. conceals property with intent to defraud;
3. fails to preserve or conceals financial records;
4. makes a false oath or account; presents or uses a false claim; gives, offers, receives money, property, or advantage for acting or forbearing to act; or withholds books and records;
5. fails to explain satisfactorily the loss or deficiency of assets;

I'm not even sure where I'm going with this. We'll see what happens :lol:
Where you are going is he easily violated 3 through 5 so far.

This. I didn’t realize it until last night but this page is a smoking gun that no one brought up during the call.

View attachment 1207328

He lists his real income right here but makes no mention of it anywhere else and contradicts almost the entire filing because of it. This shows he’s hiding $4-6k monthly that just vanishes.
His biz expenses are absolute bullshit and why he kept avoiding answering.
The personal expenses are roughly broken down in the main bankruptcy filing. The business ones are not as the forms had no place for it, and only the monthly amounts are listed (on the separate "Income and Expenses" form). That's why I want to try and rally it up myself. His business expenses don't even remotely pass the smell test.

One thing I don't know is if he was supposed to prepare some kind of expenses breakdown for the business ones.
He was suppose to have his tax return available for this meeting. He's known about that for at least a month. Him not having it raises some flags.
 
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One thing I don't know is if he was supposed to prepare some kind of expenses breakdown for the business ones.

He apparently did something like this, and its something we haven't seen. It is a different document than what was attached to the means test. According to the testimony, it has the columns "Month", "Profit/Income Gross", "Expenses Total", and "Just Business Expenses".

Nancy brought it up during the call, but was confused because it was written in pigspeak.

The way Phil explains one column is "the gross profit minus the business expenses", and the other "all of my personal debts, y'know, including the payments that I was making on things like-like credit cards". So what it sounds like is Phil may have been including his credit card payments in one of the expense categories, which obviously is completely ridiculous, but I'm just going by what he said here.

J: You provided to me, um, looks like summaries, might be considered a profit and loss, um, it-it talks about net profit slash loss calculations, you have various columns here, I just want a little bit of explanation. Obviously the first one is self-explanatory, you have the month. The next column is profit slash income gross, what is that?

P: Profit/income gross? That would be before any kind of expenses were taken out of it, it's just the gross income for that month.

R: Do you mean where does the income come from? Like the different-

J: Uh, well I think you'll understand it as we go on so I understand--. Then you say expenses total, and then you say- and in a separate column you have Just Business Expenses. What's the difference between those two, and how do you calculate them?

P: Um, i'm trying to remember off the top of my head, I believe what you're referencing is that--

R: It's cor----

P: Oh, is it right in front of ya? I believe I broke it down, so that in one case it would be all the money that I make, y'know, the gross profit minus the business expenses, then the other case was showing in regards to all of my personal debts, y'know, including the payments that I was making on things like-like credit cards and things like that, I think, from the top of my head I think that's what you're speaking of.

R: So when I did the means test, I only used the business figures, and then the personal would be what's on the INJ, or the J, uh, like regular living expenses.
 
Phil may have been including his credit card payments in one of the expense categories, which obviously is completely ridiculous, but I'm just going by what he said here.
That makes a lot of sense, considering they don't show up anywhere else. As you said, it's completely ridiculous, to claim all of his credit lines as business expenses - if that's what he's been doing.

Also he hasn't been paying those for how long? He should have a bunch of cash on hand now.
 
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