MRA debate

[chimpburgers]

They're very fucking lame. They don't even trend that much on Google anyway.

 

[SU 390]

why hate feminists when you can just hate furries

I prefer to hate bronies.

 

[Yawning Bulbasaur]

If a woman has the right to an abortion, why shouldn’t a man be free to use his superior strength to force himself on a woman? At least the rapist’s pursuit of sexual freedom doesn’t in most cases result in anyone’s death.

Not by an MRA, but it does sound a lot like the rhetoric of the more extreme adherents. Although personally, (I'm not sure what the religious and political leanings of most MRAs are, probably atheist and conservative/libertarian) I still find a lot of Republican politicians (one of which made that exact quote) and especially Christian/Muslim fundamentalists to be even worse misogynists than most MRAs.

And on the issue of abortion, although I am completely pro-choice, I personally think that (controversial opinion ahead) if the mother can get an abortion against the father's will, then it's fair enough that in cases where the mother wants to keep and raise the child and the father doesn't, he should be given the option to legally opt out of paying for child support (at least as long as they aren't married and before the child is born).

 

[HG 400]

I just want to beat women in public, guys

 

[AP 297]

I just want to beat women in public, guys

I think you may actually be a woman who likes to be dominated by men. You are claiming to be a man, because you lament the lack of strong male figures in society these days.

Tell me, why do you want to be beaten in public by men?

 

[c-no]

I prefer to hate bronies.

Why not both? They are both the same since they would jack it to animals.

I just want to beat women in public, guys

Would that be internalized misogyny you display?

 

[HG 400]

Shower thought ; If you rape a prostitute why isn't it just considered 'theft'?

 

[observer]

MRAs even have their own ED article

Unlike most ED articles it is actually funny and informative

 

[Hummingbird]

When you think about it, even a chunk of men from fundamentalist religions have better views on women than the MRAs. There's usually a virgin whore mentality while it's whore-whore for MRAs, even fundamentalists can still see value in an older woman (when it's 25 to 30 for most MRAs), motherhood and children are good things (to an MRA, children are disgusting burdens they don't want to raise but will sire) and at best women are helpmates (for MRAs the best thing a woman can be is a living sex doll to be tossed aside.)

 

[HG 400]

When you think about it, even a chunk of men from fundamentalist religions have better views on women than the MRAs. There's usually a virgin whore mentality while it's whore-whore for MRAs, even fundamentalists can still see value in an older woman (when it's 25 to 30 for most MRAs), motherhood and children are good things (to an MRA, children are disgusting burdens they don't want to raise but will sire) and at best women are helpmates (for MRAs the best thing a woman can be is a living sex doll to be tossed aside.)

Depends on the flavour of MRA, to be honest. You're mainly describing the incel circles there, like loveshy, americanwomensuck, sluthate, etc. I think Redpill is more along the lines of the traditionalist 'virgin-whore' flavour you see in fundamentalist thought, with a heaping of angry anti-feminism and game theory on top of it. FEMRA and related 'feminist MRA' circles more or less respect women but can't stop whining about the very minor disadvantages men get, or the outrages radfems commit.

They're not all rampant misogynists, but they're definitely all whiny turds.

 

[DrChristianTroy]

Couldn't vote for wack as fuck. Settled for "Complete and utter losers with no redeeming qualities" and lolcow worthy.

 

[Dudeofteenage]

Basically total crap. Some MRA grievances are legitimate, but the movement is incapable of addressing them in any meaningful way for a variety of reasons, notably its focus on feminism. The worst you could say about feminism is that it is a minor contributing factor to some of these problems, but feminists did not write the laws that discriminate against men.

MRAs can't even be credited with raising awareness because - despite what they often claim - MRAs are not the only people talking about issues like the invisibility of male rape victims. Anybody who never heard about this kind of thing until they heard about it from MRAs is likely living in a very small, weird and quite probably toxic bubble.

I admit I don't have a clear roadmap for how to solve these issues, but I think ignoring the MRA movement is a necessary prerequisite.

 

[MACH-IV]

I don't think the virgin/whore complex is something exclusively perpetuated by MRA. I think that problem that has actually been somewhat enforced by feminism. I don't mean a bunch of feminists deliberately intended for it to happen, but it ties into what I was talking about in a different thread:

The typical bitter incel type guy will say "all women are sluts" which is stupid, and obviously wrong, but nobody ever responds "yea, a lot of women like to sleep around because they have sex drives, just like men." Instead they respond "don't judge women."
Another example is that infidelity rates are almost equal between genders, yet most articles written about the subject have interesting ways of excusing women's behavior:
"Women cheat because their men aren't able to satisfy their needs; men cheat because they're dishonest."
lol what's the difference?

Feminists say they don't want women held on a pedestal but then have a spazz fit every time someone suggests that women are just as fucked up as men. It's easy to understand why so many guys get butthurt about feminism when you consider things like that.

The virgin/whore complex is a problem, regardless of the source, but show me a practical example of feminism dispelling it. Seriously.
I think it's irrational to expect a woman to be a virgin past 18, but I don't think that makes her a whore. Yet, whenever I say I think it's normal for girls to sleep around I get hit with an abundance of https://kiwifarms.net/styles/dark/ratings/autistic.png .
Which is it?

And a major issue with the MRA folks is that the vast majority aren't bitter fathers who got screwed over in court, or falsely accused of rape.

So women shouldn't be able to complain about rape or abortion laws if they've never had to personally deal with them? I shouldn't worry about being robbed because I've never been robbed before? The surgeon general shouldn't tell people smoking is bad until after they start smoking? Don't offer people medical insurance until after they get injured?
Do you really want Kanye West to be the only guy talking about the risks of marriage? What exactly is so bad about that message? I agree that MRAs do a terrible job of communicating their message, but who else is doing it?

so many of these Men's Rights dudes don't know how the world works, don't really have a life and are pretty much socially handicapped. So with what authority do they speak of these things?

Let's be fair: most people think they know how the world works. I think it's funny when I meet a guy my age who think's he's an expert on relationships because he's married to the second girl he ever dated. I would never take relationship advice from that guy, but, people have their own ideas about who makes a good "authority." Even saying someone "doesn't have a life" is open to interpretation. Most of the guys I know in serious, long term relationships get the shit kicked out of them constantly, and then call me a misogynist because I would never put myself in their situation.

 

[Fareal]

Do you really want Kanye West to be the only guy talking about the risks of marriage?

he married kim fucking kardashian i don't think anyone should be taking his advice on the risks of marriage

 

[CatParty]

I don't think the virgin/whore complex is something exclusively perpetuated by MRA. I think that problem that has actually been somewhat enforced by feminism.

the problem is that feminists are more tolerable than mras

 

[HG 400]

Do you really want Kanye West to be the only guy talking about the risks of marriage? What exactly is so bad about that message? I agree that MRAs do a terrible job of communicating their message, but who else is doing it?

Every stand-up comedian ever.

 

[MACH-IV]

He got Kim Kardashian pregnant and then felt some sort of gay moral responsibility to marry her, but that really wasn't the point. And of course you shouldn't take his advice....
Personally I don't think male feminists or MRAs are tolerable in any capacity, I just happen to strongly agree with several MRA issues.

Yea, comedians talk about this stuff, and so do musicians. Is that it?

 

[HG 400]

Yea, comedians talk about this stuff, and so do musicians. Is that it?

"Yeah it's so widely-known that it's become a pop-culture cliche that hack comedians can use as easy material because literally everybody knows what they're talking about, but who else is spreading awareness of it?"

Wat exactly are you even complaining about? lol

 

[MACH-IV]

"Yeah it's so widely-known that it's become a pop-culture cliche that hack comedians can use as easy material because literally everybody knows what they're talking about, but who else is spreading awareness of it?"

Wat exactly are you even complaining about? lol

I'm not complaining about anything, it's just a discussion. I get what you're saying; these issues are laughable cliches, mostly talked about by comedians, and that is exactly the problem. Comedians get a pass because they're supposed to be provocative, but bring the topics up anywhere else and get hit with fedora pics and banned for misogyny. It's a cliche stand-up routine, and everyone is familiar with the material, yet nobody is able to solve the problems. I think a lot of men are actually scared to bring it up. They would rather be miserable than risk pissing off their special princess lol.

Everyone always says they want to see positive changes, and then link to an article on Jezebel about how to get it.
MRA may be a comical failure, but it provided a much needed platform to discuss the other side. I know that a lot of people find it offensive, but it's a necessary autism because it will lead to something good.

 

[SU 390]

I'm not complaining about anything, it's just a discussion. I get what you're saying; these issues are laughable cliches, mostly talked about by comedians, and that is exactly the problem. Comedians get a pass because they're supposed to be provocative, but bring the topics up anywhere else and get hit with fedora pics and banned for misogyny. It's a cliche stand-up routine, and everyone is familiar with the material, yet nobody is able to solve the problems. I think a lot of men are actually scared to bring it up. They would rather be miserable than risk pissing off their special princess lol.

Everyone always says they want to see positive changes, and then link to an article on Jezebel about how to get it.
MRA may be a comical failure, but it provided a much needed platform to discuss the other side. I know that a lot of people find it offensive, but it's a necessary autism because it will lead to something good.

Devil's Advocate for a moment, while some MRA ideals are great it has to be balanced with feminist ideals too. Anything radical from both sides should be avoided like the plague. The only reason why there's no change because the radicals of MRM and Feminism just ruin shit for everyone else. It's a tiring shame that some men have to overthink interactions with women they are interested. It's a tiring shame that some women believe that men are monsters because of the actions of Sodini, Rodgers and the Germanwings co-pilot but yet can't see that there are some women who done the same thing these three men did. Both genders are 'afraid' of one another nowadays. Communication in a mature fashion is dead.

Progress means nothing when one gender pushes for gender superiority over the other(radical feminists) while the other gender have to create their own space to combat this(radical MRA/MRM). You know shit is bad when both genders can't find a common ground.