Attack on Titan Griefing Thread - >tfw even your VA thinks that you're a loser

How will Eren be stopped?


  • Total voters
    146
  • Poll closed .
To date and till the day I die, I'll refuse to believe usagi drop was anything but an exceptionally elaborate troll - as the only other explanation is that God has bestowed onto one of the most disgusting perverts on this fucking planet actual writing skills, that he uses to express his vile "should be stoned in front of parents" as shit incest fetish.
Usage Drop's creator is Yumi Unita a woman not a male creator being another trolling shitlord. Otherwise nobody would've gave much of a fuck as it would've been another day that ends in y. Yumi Unita's prior body of work didn't have anything similar to the Usagi Drop post time skip so nobody saw that coming. Hence even for the Japanese manga readers it creep them out bad.
 
I am just reading the manga after all of this and I have to really impeach a lot of the points made ITT, In this essay I will expose what I think are some flaws and strength so far and keeping in mind the overall work.

As per the first volumes this manga had a lot of heart, it had comedy relief, it had action, it had drama and it had mystery.

It is noticeable that, yes, there is a lot of foreshadowing and you can see that a lot of what is yet to come is mentioned: Maria, Sheena and Rose, for instance, with their respective faces referring to the daughters of the Eldian King are there from the beginning, subjects of Ymir are brought up quite early and so on.

I am really falling in love with this story even though I know what is coming my way, and I think it really is a shame.

These chapters are not chapters a sociopath or an autistic man would have written, even if corny at times, they are full of soul, genuinely funny and heartwarming at times.

The Sasha-Connie duo, Jean as The Rival or Levi as the jerkass, cold-hearted captain (Byakuya Kuchiki coming to mind) were working just fine and they all would have been very useful on a properly executed Hero's Journey, even if the Hero's Journey turned out being a Villain's Journey.

It is very clear to me that, while the story was meant to be on the darker side, it was always meant to be very much not far off from the Jump gold standard. At times it does read like Bleach, and I imagine a prospective reader twelve years ago would have been expecting just that sort of story, if a bit darker.

And I think, in hindsight, Isayama should have embraced these expectations. Shall the story go unabashedly crazy, as all shonen end up being, it would have been fun crazy though.

But I think this series was, unfortunately, a product of its time. Its time being that the Big 3 bar One Piece had collapsed (Bleach) and the other had barely managed to reach a dignified conclusion (Naruto), and everything Jump had tried to fill the gaps later with had been a failure. At the time, AoT had gotten exposure to western turbonormies through Netflix, and, at the time, western turbonormies were enthralled by Game of Thrones.

And, at the time, all of us thought Game of Thrones, and A Song of Ice and Fire, was top quality. That is me, and also you. All of us, there's no point in denying. At the time, we were all into the whole grimdark deconstruction fleet shit, and you can deny it all you want but that was the sign of times, and that was one of the reason AoT was touted as 'not like all the other shonen (therefore 'shonen' as a slur)

And I can perfectly see Isayama somehow being aware of these new expectations and believe he was above the tried and tested shonen formula, especially given the 'revolutionary' writing coming from the west, the 'failure' of traditional shonen trends, and himself being paraded as the new face of shonen.

Very few people prior to 2015 were able to predict that GRRM was a big hack and that the showrunners were even bigger hacks, and very few people were yet to have learned to beware of JJ Abrams Mystery Boxes. In 2014, there were still people vindicating Lost and JJ Abrams as a genius! Emulating his mystery boxes was something aspiring writers at the time were combining with GRRM kill'em all strategy, and all of it, all of them who managed to bring out some form of media with these (terrible) examples had similar, now-predictable outcomes.

In fact, only people who had read Game of Thrones back in the 90s had been able to somewhat predict how all of this was going to end, because they had been already acquainted with the fatman (and his friends)., they had already experienced years after years of waiting for increasingly disappointing installments while newcomers were all bingeing on the show and the books and some of them were starting to suspect it was never going to amount to anyhing.

But this is not an ASOIAF/GoT thread, so I won't go into the fall of that franchise.

The thing is that, I think, should Isayama have written AoT in 2001, it would have played out very different, because the zeitgeist was different. As he developed his series in Current Year, they are impregnated by Current Year shit, in this case deconstructivist, nihilist, grimdark shit.

But I honestly think some people in this thread has gone deranged over Isayama's supposed autism/sociopathy or his supposed political ideology, I quite honestly can't see any of this for the reasons explained above.

For me, this is just the story of a man trying to get a piece of the big cake by hopping on what he perceives is being popular (and that he, at the times, perceives as quality work as much of us did) while increasingly started to wrestle with both editorial pressures and the inevitable collapse of the world/characters/story (which is something that happens easily just by trying to write straightforward, tried and tested stories and becomes and inevitable catastrophe as one gets into GRRM/HBO trademark deconstructivist grimdark fuckery, as history shows time and time again)

Also, to all of you who have been pointing up how much of a sociopathic, absurdly violent, pointlessly aggressive Levi is (@Secret Asshole @Bunny Tracks ) , I don't know if it's been mentioned in this thread, but Levi is based in Rorschach from Watchmen, so it's pretty much in-character.

The problem lies in that Isayama seems to have seen Rorschach as a cool, badass hero when he was at best a chaotic anti-villain. Again, he's far from the only one to have this take on Rorschach, but Levi's character, if he's not going to be softened like Byakuya was in Bleach (And no, the hilariously shitty childhood doesn't count, as it didn't for Rorschach), if he's playing straight the sort of character Rorschach is, then he should have been played as a villain or, at best, a very flawed anti-hero, not an out-and-out hero, lest it causes (one of the many) cognitive dissonance.
 
Last edited:
  • Thunk-Provoking
Reactions: Trombonista
It is noticeable that, yes, there is a lot of foreshadowing and you can see that a lot of what is yet to come is mentioned: Maria, Sheena and Rose, for instance, with their respective faces referring to the daughters of the Eldian King are there from the beginning, subjects of Ymir are brought up quite early and so on.
There is a lot of foreshadowing. But there is also a lot of retconning and horrible plotting. Like Eren telling the titan to eat his mother was ridiculous. Or Eren knowing that the titans would breach the walls and eat his entire town and not stopping it. Or things like sending elementary school aged children to infiltrate the walls and not hardened adult warriors. And their best plan being to disrupt life inside the walls in such an extreme way that it becomes obvious that people exist outside of the walls. And those people are attacking them and creating titans. Because if they don't start exploring where the titans are coming from the next attack might breach all of the walls and kill everyone.

Everyone calls it an infiltration mission but they literally reveal their titan powers to the entire island and cause a war. If not for plot armor all of the 'warrior' children would be dead as well. Them not immediately killing Ymir for eating Marcel was poor writing. If they were so weak and couldn't fight Ymir then why would Ymir not just eat all of them right there anyways? And in Ymir's flashback she is naked and defenseless during the day with no idea what is going on after she eats Marcel.

But the lamest things are the titan powers being so inconsistent. They just happen to have titan serum inside the walls sitting there to be conveniently used. Eren's getting injured constantly in training yet his wounds never steam which would reveal to everyone that he is a titan. His titan powers activate when he pricks his finger yet his legs and arms get chewed off and nothing happens. Annie has killed thousands of people yet they don't bury her underground in 50ft of dirt so that if her diamond shell breaks she just gets buried alive. They instead decide to not even guard her and leave her walking distance to the surface.
 
I hate the ending, obviously. Every single one of those shitty traitors deserved to die. Flurk or whatshisname is the only honorable character.
No, Erwin was too.

10 years is a good scene. A terminally ill teenager can't be expected to be awesome every waking moment.
Good or not it was realistic and understandable given the circumstances. The only ( inferior imo) alternatives could be him continuing to suppress everything stoically unto the grave, or holding back and only partially grieving his circumstances. The latter would not be very compelling from a story-telling perspective, but the former could work.

Isayama is good at structuring the narrative. The anime butchered it for no reason and added "Han. Solo."-style gay fanservice. I dropped it on the fifth or so episode, it's terrible.
I disagree, he's pretty bad at it. The anime did make things worse with half-assed alterations to try to appease everyone, but even the manga just had a bad run after Eren gained the power to control Titans. It was still interesting but I can't say it was good at that point.

I'll say, the anime ending with Eren & Mikasa is still dumb, but it grew on me artistically, it just looks and sounds nice. It's cute but unnecessary.

I'm not a weeb, I can't stand most anime because of the gross pedophilic art. I've only seen a handful of series to the end (Spess train fluffy hat waifu, Fullmetal Alchemist 1 and 2, Gun Frontier, one other terrible Matsumoto thing, Nobunaga Concerto, I think that's it) and dropped maybe another six or so.
There's a lot of good anime that doesn't even feature kids much, let alone in a sketchy way, like Mobile Fighter: G Gundam and Yu Yu Hakusho, which are two of the best ever.

It backfires when the world wipes out their entire island in retaliation centuries later because they still fear the power of the titans.
I think he figured that would happen, and don't know why the suddenly retarded traitors couldn't see it coming, so I'm not sure it even backfired because Eren wasn't really counting on it working. He pretty much said he bought them time and it's up to them to make it work, he certainly didn't seem confident in Paradis' survival.

It's very stupid because he didn't just fight to survive, but for revenge, and not only for his family but his country as a whole. He was very driven & patriotic but by the end he only cared about his little circle surviving and doing what Ymir wanted because reasons. It's a major shift and isn't believable, nor was Mikasa's willingness to kill Eren under any circumstances.

Armin was always an idealistic pussy so I can believe him doing all that, the story would've been better if it was him leading some traitors against Eren, Floch, & Mikasa.
 
I have to wonder how much of the final arc was Isayama completely taking the piss out of everything at that point
I like to think he checked out and didn't care anymore. He'd been working on that story for a decade. Maybe he was just bored/tired of it?

Though I've heard from normal folks that they like the ending just fine. So, maybe those of us who take issue with it are the problem. But that ending was quite possibly the worst thing I'd ever seen in my life.
 
  • Thunk-Provoking
Reactions: Ewan McGregor
Though I've heard from normal folks that they like the ending just fine. So, maybe those of us who take issue with it are the problem. But that ending was quite possibly the worst thing I'd ever seen in my life.
The ratings on most websites of the finale and show overall are pretty much 10/10 across the board. It's not like Game of Thrones where people who watched adult shows The Wire or Sopranos were watching as well and had a critical eye to see how bad the ending was. With anime almost everyone watching is just a mindless anime consumer with zero thought or analysis on the writing, plots, stories, animation, or acting.

It's why anime almost never rise above being made for the lowest common denominator level of fan. The only people watching will tolerate the most putrid foul slop because it's new. It's a community and culture perpetual centered around teenagers and idiots.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Ewan McGregor
It's why anime almost never rise above being made for the lowest common denominator level of fan. The only people watching will tolerate the most putrid foul slop because it's new. It's a community and culture perpetual centered around teenagers and idiots.
And yet we get people talking highly about things like Legends Of The Galactic Heroes. And Berserk. Unless it’s in a Rick and Morty sort of way.
 
The ratings on most websites of the finale and show overall are pretty much 10/10 across the board. It's not like Game of Thrones where people who watched adult shows The Wire or Sopranos were watching as well and had a critical eye to see how bad the ending was. With anime almost everyone watching is just a mindless anime consumer with zero thought or analysis on the writing, plots, stories, animation, or acting.

It's why anime almost never rise above being made for the lowest common denominator level of fan. The only people watching will tolerate the most putrid foul slop because it's new. It's a community and culture perpetual centered around teenagers and idiots.
How depressing.

For a while it seemed like AOT was going to be different.
 
  • Feels
Reactions: Ewan McGregor
I disagree, he's pretty bad at it. The anime did make things worse with half-assed alterations to try to appease everyone, but even the manga just had a bad run after Eren gained the power to control Titans. It was still interesting but I can't say it was good at that point.

The manga does have storytelling problems at a graphical level from the very beginning, changing scenes and doing small time skips mid page. I have never seen anything like that before!

However, you could infer things because the characters, at least the main ones, didn't yet melt into character design globohomo. Once the art evolves to a point where Connie is pretty much the only character with an unique design, because at times there are just the slightest of differences between Eren, Mikasa and Levi (let us not get into the thousand million ancillary characters who all look like variations of Jean), the manga goes pretty much unreadable except when suddenly Isayama decides to buff up the quality, generally from one-page panels involving gore and/or Levi.

Also, pretty much all the characters that stood out and had a soul and a personality, characterization wise or design wise, end up obliterated. Either literally, like my potato girl, or spiritually, like Mikasa.

final arc was Isayama completely taking the piss out of everything at that point

This has been mentioned before, there is a non-zero chance that Isayama got disenfranchised with the industry and was, at best, on autopilot and, at worst, trying to purposefully shit over the series to own the libs publishers. This is something the japanese do when they are sick of their employers for some reason.

Also, Isayama was, by his own admission, not a professional. He just thought he had a decent enough art style to try comics and he just did so and managed a contract because his pilot had potential. This is something to admire about the man. Reading the public evolution of what he's declared and talked about, it is patently clear that he never intended for the series to run for so long.

While the whole of Ymir/King Cuck/Pigs/Subjects had been planned from the beginning, it is difficult to say to which extent he was intending to develop it in the manner that it did, as it is implied by many of his statements that he had originally envisioned a The Mist-esque end in which Eren and Co would find the sea (Whether if he'd go by something more akin to the movie or something more akin to the film is anyone's guess)

Then he was probably told they would squeeze the series to its bones so he better be thinking of ways to keep churning out pages (As was the case with Bleach) therefore the filler and the mystery boxes. Then he watched Game of Thrones, and (like everybody else) thought grimdark cynical shit was top notch writing and decided to incorporate it so that he could fill the schedule.

Then, by all accounts, he was told the series had gone down in popularity so it was starting to waste precious Jump pages and he better wrap it up asap (Like Bleach)

All this considered, Eren becoming an omnicidal ubersmench is the logical conclusion.

With anime almost everyone watching is just a mindless anime consumer with zero thought or analysis on the writing, plots, stories, animation, or acting.

Anime consumers are nigercattle and have always been, it's just worse now since it hit mainstream and therefore it is populated with literal niggers.

Exactly the same story as with Capeshit and 'American comics'. Generally people who read comics are like this. Anime fags are slightly worse because they don't read, they watch, and they are just turbonormies that stumbled upon the whole thing by scrolling Netflix or (god forbid) Crunchyroll. If your audience is the same as Netflix or Crunchyroll's, you have a shitty audience.

For a while it seemed like AOT was going to be different.

Happy days!
 
Last edited:
it's just worse now since it hit mainstream and therefore it is populated with literal niggers.
come on now. let's not act like every black guy in the 90's-2000's wasn't a DBZ superfan the same way the previous generation(s?) adored kung fu movies. whether or not it was a love of "anime" or specifically DBZ is a question for a more autistic thread.
 
I think the real reason crying Eren gets mocked is because he's expressing romantic feelings that he did not have for most of the series. There was only one scene prior to the final chapter that hinted at Eren now being in love with Mikasa, and that was only 20 chapters prior. Before that, Mikasa was the one in love with Eren, while Eren saw her as family.

There's also the issue that Eren's little meltdown over Mikasa happens after he just killed 80% of the world's population. So he's okay with murder, but too scared to confess his feelings to Mikasa? No wonder people were making Elliot Rodger comparisons.
 
Have you heard about the japanese work culture?

I would not blame him. Alas, AoT had to suffer...

I wouldn't want to imagine how much worse AoT's ending would have been, if it was a Chinese or South Korean-made title instead, given how work culture in those two countries are actually worse than Japan's.
 
  • Thunk-Provoking
Reactions: Horribadger
Have you heard about the japanese work culture?

I would not blame him. Alas, AoT had to suffer...

True, but you misquoted me. This is the correct quote:

This is something the japanese do when they are sick of their employers for some reason

As in: they won't confront their bosses about their shitty work conditions, they will shit up stuff covertly instead.

The reason being that, there, being fired seems to be a fate worse than death, but still...
 
As in: they won't confront their bosses about their shitty work conditions, they will shit up stuff covertly instead.

The reason being that, there, being fired seems to be a fate worse than death, but still...
That's part of their work culture. They're not confrontational and venerate the hierarchy like a god (ie boss means he's literally better than you).

If you stand up to your boss you're expected to kill yourself for the great shame you have brought onto your famiry. How dare you, a self-made artist with 3 novels under your belt stand up to your boss, someone who got where they are cause their father literally put them there?

I hate Japanese culture so much it's unreal. I could rant 307 pages worth of posts. Why do people live like that?
 
That's part of their work culture. They're not confrontational and venerate the hierarchy like a god (ie boss means he's literally better than you).

If you stand up to your boss you're expected to kill yourself for the great shame you have brought onto your famiry. How dare you, a self-made artist with 3 novels under your belt stand up to your boss, someone who got where they are cause their father literally put them there?

I hate Japanese culture so much it's unreal. I could rant 307 pages worth of posts. Why do people live like that?
Japan is just a few decades ahead of us on the road to the inevitable western Dystopian end point should we continue to give ever greater power to those who rule over us. Their society is entirely monopoloized by a handful of corporations and a draconic government who rule it not through ingenuity and good governance, but through massive government corporate gibs and corruption at every level. There is a reason they have one of the highest debt to GDP ratios in the world.

The one faint hope I have is that Asians of all shades are literal bugmen who would rather kill themselves than suffer the social stigma of having an independent thought and that has been the case for millennia. Something that was and to a lesser extent still is somewhat celebrated in the west rather than derided in the east.
 
As in: they won't confront their bosses about their shitty work conditions, they will shit up stuff covertly instead.

The reason being that, there, being fired seems to be a fate worse than death, but still...

And yet again, South Korea proves to be even worse regarding their work ethic. IIRC, if you were to confront your boss about the said shitty work conditions in South Korea, it's likely that will lead you to a quick dismissal, so the company can hire someone else to replace you, probably at even cheaper payrates. That also contributes to the slave labor-like state of K-Pop and Korean E-Sports player work environments today.

Japan is just a few decades ahead of us on the road to the inevitable western Dystopian end point should we continue to give ever greater power to those who rule over us. Their society is entirely monopoloized by a handful of corporations and a draconic government who rule it not through ingenuity and good governance, but through massive government corporate gibs and corruption at every level. There is a reason they have one of the highest debt to GDP ratios in the world.

The one faint hope I have is that Asians of all shades are literal bugmen who would rather kill themselves than suffer the social stigma of having an independent thought and that has been the case for millennia. Something that was and to a lesser extent still is somewhat celebrated in the west rather than derided in the east.

And if Japan is a few decades ahead, then China and South Korea are literally a century ahead in regards to totalitarianism. And it's even worse in SK, since it still gives off the impression of being a democratic state, because China and North Korea both exist.
 
Back