Chris - The Legal Issues - A Prosecutor's Perspective

Apologies if this has been asked before, but I’m still not clear about this one issue. Hypothetically, if Chris was actually insane or proven to be, at what level would it need to be at so that he could officially be diagnosed as being unaccountable of his actions and declared functionally illiterate as he was impermissible to truly understand what he was doing or how his behaviour affected his victims. Would it have to be literally Charles Manson/shit on the floor screaming wreck mad? So many criminals wil obviously be vouching for the bullshit ‘Insanity get of jail free card’ before any official conviction is made. So at what level does the American law system actually gauge at when someone is too mentally deficient or insane enough to stand fit for trial or held accountable for their crimes? It’s complex but is their some kind of litmus test for the varying levels?
 
Apologies if this has been asked before, but I’m still not clear about this one issue. Hypothetically, if Chris was actually insane or proven to be, at what level would it need to be at so that he could officially be diagnosed as being unaccountable of his actions and declared functionally illiterate as he was impermissible to truly understand what he was doing or how his behaviour affected his victims. Would it have to be literally Charles Manson/shit on the floor screaming wreck mad? So many criminals wil obviously be vouching for the bullshit ‘Insanity get of jail free card’ before any official conviction is made. So at what level does the American law system actually gauge at when someone is too mentally deficient or insane enough to stand fit for trial or held accountable for their crimes? It’s complex but is their some kind of litmus test for the varying levels?
In the situation we have with Chris and the incest charge, there's absolutely no way for an NGRI. Too much premeditation and clear showings of him knowing it was wrong.

Generally for NGRI it has to be apparent that you, at the time of the crime and during your examination by a forensic psychiatrist, were affected by a severe mental illness. AND that you have a complete indifference to the fact you broke the law and whatever consequences it would hold for you.

So in other words, untreated schizophrenics can still go to prison for a ton of things even though they'd have been much better off in criminal asylums.

Wrt Manson: He's the layman's poster boy for "insane criminals" but he was absolutely not so in neither a legal nor medical sense. He knew very well what he was doing
 
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Generally for NGRI it has to be apparent that you, at the time of the crime and during your examination by a forensic psychiatrist, were affected by a severe mental illness. AND that you have a complete indifference to the fact you broke the law and whatever consequences it would hold for you.

So in other words, untreated schizophrenics can still go to prison for a ton of things even though they'd have been much better off in criminal asylums.
For example, Richard Chase was a schizophrenic, but he was still found guilty of first degree and sentenced to death. Joseph Kallinger had vivid hallucinations directing him to mutilate and kill, but he was also declared Sane. It is a very high bar to clear.

(Kallinger probably should have been institutionalized, and eventually was. But my point is, call me when Chris sees the kind of shit Kallinger did. That is insane)
 
sorry of this has been asked before, but how many continuances can Chris' case get? Could in theory his lawyer keep asking for continuances until 2023 or even beyond?
 
sorry of this has been asked before, but how many continuances can Chris' case get? Could in theory his lawyer keep asking for continuances until 2023 or even beyond?
No, according to @Pointless Sperg and @AnOminous said continuances will only continue to a maximum of about maybe the middle of this year, it’s a complicated process but it’s not like it’s the crime of the year. There’s no need at all to drag it for years on end, Chris’s fate will probably be decided before this summer at the very latest probably. Although don’t hold me to that exact date, it’s just a rough estimate.
 
Phil is a different kind of idiot and I believe he may have had help from people who wanted to mooch off of him?

It is possible, though, yes.

He did have help, he also has experience through his mum about gaming the system, Chris hasn't got that or the people willing to help him.

Apologies if this has been asked before, but I’m still not clear about this one issue. Hypothetically, if Chris was actually insane or proven to be, at what level would it need to be at so that he could officially be diagnosed as being unaccountable of his actions and declared functionally illiterate as he was impermissible to truly understand what he was doing or how his behaviour affected his victims. Would it have to be literally Charles Manson/shit on the floor screaming wreck mad? So many criminals wil obviously be vouching for the bullshit ‘Insanity get of jail free card’ before any official conviction is made. So at what level does the American law system actually gauge at when someone is too mentally deficient or insane enough to stand fit for trial or held accountable for their crimes? It’s complex but is their some kind of litmus test for the varying levels?

Chris is best summed up as -

Socially and Functionally nuts, but not enough to not know the difference between right and wrong - and for the legal system that's all that matters. Chris should have had a wrangler and lived in some form of facility a long time ago but he has fell through the cracks of a already underfunded system he just stands out as he's well CWC.

But he knows the difference between right and wrong, he might not know why but he knows that Rape, Murder, theft etc are wrong but that doesn't stop him from doing it, especially if he can find a self justification no matter how bonkers it is to a normal person he still finds a "Yea But..."

It's why he's gone from bragging about it, to calling it Soul Bonding and then Sould Bonding is not nessisarlly sex - even though he bragged about sex in the first instance, and that's only because he's been feeling just enough discomfort that it's slowly dawning on him that it might be a nono thing he's done, he can't understand why but he's not playing with his toys and games and it's been long enough to start pressing in on him he bay have done bad, but intellectually, emotionally and temporally he can't put the answer that's painfully obvious together, especially after it's been filtered through his brain and mental gymnastics.
 
No, according to @Pointless Sperg and @AnOminous said continuances will only continue to a maximum of about maybe the middle of this year, it’s a complicated process but it’s not like it’s the crime of the year. There’s no need at all to drag it for years on end, Chris’s fate will probably be decided before this summer at the very latest probably. Although don’t hold me to that exact date, it’s just a rough estimate.

I imagine there's also a hard stop based on the charges. You couldn't keep continuing and hold someone in jail for a year if the crime they're accused of committing only has a 180 day maximum sentence, for example.
 
So what I've been hearing from everyone in this thread and elsewhere is more or less Chris is going to get away scott free with little to no consequences whatsoever.

He won't have to register as a sex offender.

He won't have a felony on his record.

He might not even have to spend time in jail after sentencing due to the constant continuances. Nope- it's right back to 14 Branchland court for him to rape or screw his mother again and again- except without the protection of certain whiteknights to save him from the next Bella.

Spending 6 months minimum in jail is not "scot-free" (one T, by the way). Even if the best-case scenario where he just gets time served on February 3rd, that's still 1%-2% of his life spent behind bars. Time is the one thing we can't get back, no matter what we do.

What's more, even if he suffers no more legal repercussions, his life is never going to be the same. There are definitely going to be consequences in his living situation, ones which I definitely would not be looking forward to.

It's why he's gone from bragging about it, to calling it Soul Bonding and then Sould Bonding is not nessisarlly sex - even though he bragged about sex in the first instance, and that's only because he's been feeling just enough discomfort that it's slowly dawning on him that it might be a nono thing he's done, he can't understand why but he's not playing with his toys and games and it's been long enough to start pressing in on him he bay have done bad, but intellectually, emotionally and temporally he can't put the answer that's painfully obvious together, especially after it's been filtered through his brain and mental gymnastics.

This pretty much. Chris' life can be pretty much defined as "It seemed like the right idea at the time.", only form someone working from incredibly bad situational awareness.

Chris doesn't actively wish suffering on the world, he believes that suffering comes from evil decisions. Good decisions are ones that make people happy. Good vs. evil is a very simple and straightforward concept to him. Except Chris is the protagonist of his story, and he can't fathom the concept of other protagonists except in the context of his own story, so stuff that causes happiness for him is good, stuff that causes sadness is evil.

Chris doesn't want to hurt you, he just wants to do good in the world. And good in the world is stuff that creates happiness. For him. Because that's the only way he can understand happiness. He literally cannot understand it in any other way. Chris cannot envision any concept of the world except from his own personal experiences.

I imagine there's also a hard stop based on the charges. You couldn't keep continuing and hold someone in jail for a year if the crime they're accused of committing only has a 180 day maximum sentence, for example.

Pretty much. The statute Chris is charged under has a maximum sentence of ten years, but only if charged as a felony. As a misdemeanor, it carries a maximum sentence of one year. Therefore, unless they charge him with a felony (which requires transferring the case to circuit court), they cannot hold him against his will longer than one year.

He can probably *voluntarily* stay in jail a little longer, but eventually the judge is going to ask wtf is happening and why are we holding someone so long on a charge with a maximum sentence of a year, and tell the prosecution to either put up or shut up.

The defense, knowing they have nowhere to house Chris, and not wanting to up the charge to a felony, will be under extreme pressure to take the best deal they can by this point.

Basically the one year cutoff encourages both sides to shit or get off the pot. They can choose to work together and find a solution that's okay for everyone, or turn it into a staring contest trying to get the other side to blink. Personally I don't think Chris is worth such a contest, and they're probably working together.

Consolvo and Heilberg are probably banging shots of whiskey together going wtf do we do.
 
Chris doesn't want to hurt you, he just wants to do good in the world. And good in the world is stuff that creates happiness. For him. Because that's the only way he can understand happiness. He literally cannot understand it in any other way. Chris cannot envision any concept of the world except from his own personal experiences.
I seriously doubt he's given it that much thought. All he wants is to meet his own selfish needs and everyone be damned. He describes himself as a good and moral person the way AOC does.
 
Apologies if this has been asked before, but I’m still not clear about this one issue. Hypothetically, if Chris was actually insane or proven to be, at what level would it need to be at so that he could officially be diagnosed as being unaccountable of his actions and declared functionally illiterate as he was impermissible to truly understand what he was doing or how his behaviour affected his victims. Would it have to be literally Charles Manson/shit on the floor screaming wreck mad? So many criminals wil obviously be vouching for the bullshit ‘Insanity get of jail free card’ before any official conviction is made. So at what level does the American law system actually gauge at when someone is too mentally deficient or insane enough to stand fit for trial or held accountable for their crimes? It’s complex but is their some kind of litmus test for the varying levels?
Insanity is incredibly difficult to plead. You basically have to be so totally out of it that you have no understanding of right and wrong. Chandler is on the borderline, but I'd be willing to be that prosecution will be able to get him to admit that he knew what he was doing was, on some level, wrong/improper. Even if you get off on insanity, you're basically committed until they decide to let you go, which could be never.

No, according to @Pointless Sperg and @AnOminous said continuances will only continue to a maximum of about maybe the middle of this year, it’s a complicated process but it’s not like it’s the crime of the year. There’s no need at all to drag it for years on end, Chris’s fate will probably be decided before this summer at the very latest probably. Although don’t hold me to that exact date, it’s just a rough estimate.
If that. Continuances need a good reason and a judge willing to grant them. Greene County isn't exactly the most bumping of places and they're probably not happy with this big, crazy case taking up a lot of time when they got divorces, child abuse cases and juvenile delinquent cases to hear. Summer would be a bit of a stretch, but Spring is likely trial start date.
 
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I grew up with watching Chris Chan, he's provided me endless hours of entertainment, but that doesn't make him my hero.

One day, probably not February the 3rd though, Chris will be tried and I hope we get to see him one more time cuz I'm definitely curious about what it looks like now.
 
The way I see it I think being in jail is better for Chris Chan than being homeless however, the ironic thing is that Chris Chan is going to become homeless now faster BECAUSE he went to jail. If Chris Chan didn’t go to jail he could have just kept living at his home until his mom finally died and then he would have become homeless after she died. But now he is going to be homeless when he is released even if Barb is still alive. I wonder, could chris Chan actually tell his lawyer that he wants to be charged with a felony so that he can spend the next ten years in prison? The max sentence for this as a misdemeanor is 1 year so he is quickly running out of time for his solitary confinement vacation. Right now with Chris Chan being in jail he is not being punished. The punishment starts if he is released and realizes he is now homeless. The idiot probably really thinks he is going back home after he if released but I wonder if sometimes at night he sometimes has a very brief lucid moment where he thinks maybe he can’t really go home again but then shrugs it off and goes back into fantasy land again. Chris Chan spending the next ten years of his life in prison might be better than being released after time served of 1 year in jail because, Chris Chan could die within just a year of a few months of being homeless. It’s too dangerous for a retarded man to understand how to live safely as a homeless man. Probably would get killed. Either by accident or murdered. Maybe a plea deal for a 10 year sentence is the best outcome here for Chris Chan. And yeah I know that Chris Chan is scared of the other inmates and would be terrified of going to prison because then he wouldn’t be in his comfortable solitaire confinement anymore but, being homeless is not something that is not scary. Yeah I mean I guess Chris chan could get attacked in prison by other inmates because of his autism and low intelligence but at least he would have guards to try and break up the fight but being homeless he would have zero protection at all from attacks. I wonder if there is a way to have someone sentenced to life in prison without them actually being convicted of a former crime because the person is too dumb to figure out how to be not homeless? Maybe they could start a new program in California where the police arrest every homeless person and sentence them to life in prison to keep them off the streets. You would be helping the homeless but also helping the general public too by keeping homeless off the streets so that they wouldn’t be bothering ordinary non criminal citizens. It’s just so complicated trying to figure out what to do with Chris Chan.
 
Maybe they could start a new program in California where the police arrest every homeless person and sentence them to life in prison to keep them off the streets.
Sooo, how long does one have to be homeless before you get dragged into prison and your life ended? What's the window?

I mean, a life sentence is just that; your life is over. No job. No prospects. No nothing. Not keen on doing that to someone who hasn't committed a capital offense.
 
Sooo, how long does one have to be homeless before you get dragged into prison and your life ended? What's the window?

I mean, a life sentence is just that; your life is over. No job. No prospects. No nothing. Not keen on doing that to someone who hasn't committed a capital offense.

How about first they get a free apartment. They don't get to pick where it is, but they get one for free. Like maybe in the desert or something where land is cheap. Now you are no longer "homeless", you are just a vagrant. You have a choice of going home to the free home you received, yet you still are insane on the street. At that point there should be grounds for institutionalizing everyone on the street.
 
At least Barb got her moving violation ticket dealt with before the big trial.
BarbChan.jpg
 
I imagine there's also a hard stop based on the charges. You couldn't keep continuing and hold someone in jail for a year if the crime they're accused of committing only has a 180 day maximum sentence, for example.
Maybe that's the goal of the defense. Have Chris lame it out in holding so he gets slapped with probation and time served. Not the most solid plan but its probably the best one the lawyer could think of.
 
Maybe that's the goal of the defense. Have Chris lame it out in holding so he gets slapped with probation and time served. Not the most solid plan but its probably the best one the lawyer could think of.

That's absolutely the goal. This gives Chris the assistance of an attorney through this time, whereas he loses his attorney on conviction. It keeps his tugboat from getting suspended (or at least still claimable for back payments if they suspended it by mistake). It gives him a few more rights since he's still technically innocent on paper.

Meanwhile it keeps Chris contained, just as well as if he had been convicted up front, so it's not really any skin off of the prosecutor's back. The prosecutor has other stuff to do with his time so as long as Chris is cooling in jail it's not a problem.
 
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