#Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!

[Mister Dongs]

Nothing on his Twitter either. $5 says he was full of shit. Just like his lawsuits.

I'm just going off this tweet Preston made. I mean he could have been lying but I don't see why he would.

I no longer care about Star Wars and feel only apathy. This wasn't caused by 'wokeness' on the part of the sequel trilogy, thought that was a cause, it was more the completely garbage story telling. This is something everyone in this 'sector' talk about constantly, and that is they want politics out of their media. The problem with this is, many of the best media of all time was almost explicitly political.

I have a mixed opinion on this subject

For the premise of certain stories to work, there are sometimes inherent political stances one has to accept. If you're going to write about Batman, you have to accept at the bare minimum the premise that criminals are responsible for their actions. The second you put on a writer who adheres to Marxist class theory and starts arguing that crime is the product of systemic inequality or mental illness, the very premise of Batman starts to fall apart (and it has). Batman constantly being faced with the question from authorial stand-ins of "why doesn't he do real change by redistributing his wealth" is political yes, but what a lot of people fail to appreciate is that not doing that is also expressing a political position.

A lot of the "I want my media to have no politics in it" crowd are as far as I can tell just people who assume that what they think and believe is the "normal", rational, apolitical correct stance they arrived at through the employ of their intellect, observation and personal experience, when in reality they've simply subconsciously taken up a lot of political positions without questioning them or even realizing they've done so at all (I think @Ike Aim touched on this a while ago). To them what they think is just the objective centrist correct stance, and everyone who thinks different than they do is a raging ideologue who's been swayed by books and pundits.

But if you are handed the reigns to Batman while thinking society as a whole is responsible for crime, or get put in the driver's seat of Star Wars with the intent of telling the message that fighting or resisting authority in any form is bad, odds are certain that the story is going to be incoherent or completely meaningless.

 

[Captain Manning]

I'm just going off this tweet Preston made in response to Fag-gate.

Nice catch, but I'm still inclined to go with "bullshit." That doesn't prove anything really, now does it? Pics or it didn't happen.

It would be hilarious if it turned out Anime Matsuri didn't let him in the door. As well they shouldn't.

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

I know you're a BASED CHAD but woke is not a synonym for garbage. So no, go woke go broke isn't real.

Can you point to some examples where this is not the case? Where explicit wokeness is written into the end product and the movie/book/comic/video game/etc. was considered a success?

 

[Newman's Lovechild]

everyone who thinks different than they do is a raging ideologue who's been swayed by books and pundits.

Where's the lie?

I might have heard this expressed by some CG or TFM figure, in a moment of lucidity, but I think the mantra 'we don't want politics in our comics' is a fairly inarticulate way to refer to the kind of overt leftist digs that we're all familiar with by now. Or am I giving them too much credit?

Either way, I do think there's something more universally agreeable about 'criminals must be stopped and sent to Arkham/Blackgate', and that it isn't an equally politicized, extremist, frothing right winger version of the marxist alternative. To take such a general, intrinsic part of Batmans character - and society - and present it as such doesn't sit well with me. It's like taking Supermans devotion to saving people from disasters and saying it's just the blinkered flipside of Jon Kents cover with a performative placard.

I'd argue that the closest politically opposite stance is really those who are mad that Bats and Supes have no-killing rules.

It would be hilarious if it turned out Anime Matsuri didn't let him in the door. As well they shouldn't.

CANCEL CULTURE CANCEL CULTURE

 

[Gar For Archer]

I know you're a BASED CHAD but woke is not a synonym for garbage. So no, go woke go broke isn't real.

View attachment 3572962

I'm just going off this tweet Preston made. I mean he could have been lying but I don't see why he would.




I have a mixed opinion on this subject

For the premise of certain stories to work, there are sometimes inherent political stances one has to accept. If you're going to write about Batman, you have to accept at the bare minimum the premise that criminals are responsible for their actions. The second you put on a writer who adheres to Marxist class theory and starts arguing that crime is the product of systemic inequality or mental illness, the very premise of Batman starts to fall apart (and it has). Batman constantly being faced with the question from authorial stand-ins of "why doesn't he do real change by redistributing his wealth" is political yes, but what a lot of people fail to appreciate is that not doing that is also expressing a political position.

A lot of the "I want my media to have no politics in it" crowd are as far as I can tell just people who assume that what they think and believe is the "normal", rational, apolitical correct stance they arrived at through the employ of their intellect, observation and personal experience, when in reality they've simply subconsciously taken up a lot of political positions without questioning them or even realizing they've done so at all (I think @Ike Aim touched on this a while ago). To them what they think is just the objective centrist correct stance, and everyone who thinks different than they do is a raging ideologue who's been swayed by books and pundits.

But if you are handed the reigns to Batman while thinking society as a whole is responsible for crime, or get put in the driver's seat of Star Wars with the intent of telling the message that fighting or resisting authority in any form is bad, odds are certain that the story is going to be incoherent or completely meaningless.

Woke != Political. People who say that they “don’t want politics” in their media are misspeaking - what they actually don’t want is political pandering and virtue-signaling, which has very little to do with the political positions themselves and very much to do with exhorting the creator as a good and virtuous person who tows the party line. And this goes both ways - I have equally little patience for the Eric Rippa Julys of the world who are selling a product off his identity of “based black man” and little else.

You can usually tell the difference by how the work is advertised: a good story with political themes will be pitched on the good story elements (characters, worldbuilding, whatever) whereas a woke story will be pitched on how black and gay all the characters are, because there isn’t actually anything else good that CAN be said about it.

If a story with politics that you generally disagree with is really good, it might even get you to re-think your own positions. Maybe not change your mind necessarily, but to reconsider some of your basic assumptions about the issue.

 

[chalkyresidue]

A well written piece of fiction with an ideological agenda can actually manage to transcend its author’s preoccupations, woke or not.

Spoiler: Best example I can give is Watchmen and the Rorschach controversy.

Alan Moore being a writer who respects his readers’ intelligence, he lets the events unfold without overt authorial commentary to beat you over the head with his point.
This leaves the door open for you to argue that Rorschach was the real hero of the story, apparently to the chagrin of Alan Moore. Though he didn’t glamorize Rorschach at all, he did write a crackerjack portrait of a certain kind of ideologue who tolerates no moral compromises. You won’t find any events in the narrative that contradict what one logically expects to happen to a guy like him. And in the end you aren’t forced to cast judgment on him, but to reflect on his actions. Some people have done this and said damn it all he was still in the right.

They used to consider this a feature but today it’s a bit of a bug. Nobody wants G&G types latching on to their property and rallying around it around like Joaquin Phoenix at the end of the Joker. (Ironically not even Zach Snyder.)

It’s not worth it to be remembered as a great talent by future generations if it gets you canceled, apparently.

 

[A nameless trool]

For the premise of certain stories to work, there are sometimes inherent political stances one has to accept. If you're going to write about Batman, you have to accept at the bare minimum the premise that criminals are responsible for their actions. The second you put on a writer who adheres to Marxist class theory and starts arguing that crime is the product of systemic inequality or mental illness, the very premise of Batman starts to fall apart (and it has). Batman constantly being faced with the question from authorial stand-ins of "why doesn't he do real change by redistributing his wealth" is political yes, but what a lot of people fail to appreciate is that not doing that is also expressing a political position.

Batman is super smart. He is quite aware that it is not lack of money that creates poverty, but inequality of the means of production and the opportunity to cause violence. By keeping his wealth consolidated he is able to retain both influence as Bruce Wayne to affect change on a political level as well as be able to create jobs and institutions for the weaker classes and to rehabilitate criminals.
By being Batman he is able to excert violence over those willing to cause violence.
If he gave his money away all he would manage is to have the other wealthy people of Gotham eventually become richer.

A Marxist author who could rub three braincells together (so too smart to work for DC) would have a story where Bruce Wayne buys every business in Gotham, amasses all the wealth and builds a socialist state under Wayne Enterprises or a story about how former convicts are being hired to make the next Batplane so they have a job and don't get back into crime (and as a way for Batman to keep tabs on them).

The biggest mistake DC made (esp Scott Snyder) is writing the Bat God instead of ethical capitalist caped crusader Bruce Wayne.

PS: And this rant comes from a Socialist who has an idea on how money works.

 

[chalkyresidue]

A Marxist author who could rub three braincells together (so too smart to work for DC) would have a story where Bruce Wayne buys every business in Gotham, amasses all the wealth and builds a socialist state under Wayne Enterprises or a story about how former convicts are being hired to make the next Batplane so they have a job and don't get back into crime (and as a way for Batman to keep tabs on them).

Can any true and honest fans here tell me if Neil Adams or Denny O’Neil ever tried anything along these lines?
(I would totally read that.)

 

[Rupin]

View attachment 3572962

I'm just going off this tweet Preston made. I mean he could have been lying but I don't see why he would.




I have a mixed opinion on this subject

For the premise of certain stories to work, there are sometimes inherent political stances one has to accept. If you're going to write about Batman, you have to accept at the bare minimum the premise that criminals are responsible for their actions. The second you put on a writer who adheres to Marxist class theory and starts arguing that crime is the product of systemic inequality or mental illness, the very premise of Batman starts to fall apart (and it has). Batman constantly being faced with the question from authorial stand-ins of "why doesn't he do real change by redistributing his wealth" is political yes, but what a lot of people fail to appreciate is that not doing that is also expressing a political position.

A lot of the "I want my media to have no politics in it" crowd are as far as I can tell just people who assume that what they think and believe is the "normal", rational, apolitical correct stance they arrived at through the employ of their intellect, observation and personal experience, when in reality they've simply subconsciously taken up a lot of political positions without questioning them or even realizing they've done so at all (I think @Ike Aim touched on this a while ago). To them what they think is just the objective centrist correct stance, and everyone who thinks different than they do is a raging ideologue who's been swayed by books and pundits.

But if you are handed the reigns to Batman while thinking society as a whole is responsible for crime, or get put in the driver's seat of Star Wars with the intent of telling the message that fighting or resisting authority in any form is bad, odds are certain that the story is going to be incoherent or completely meaningless.

Who is the fag? Cecil without his mask?

 

[COMMI3 MARK]

Can you point to some examples where this is not the case? Where explicit wokeness is written into the end product and the movie/book/comic/video game/etc. was considered a success?

Roots?

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Roots?

Wakanda Forever!

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

Roots?

Hmm, maybe? But can you consider something made before 1980 truly "Woke?" Besides, they cut off Kunta Kinte's foot. No way would that fly nowadays.

Funny, because the other day I was thinking of another 1970s production that I guess might be considered "Woke" nowadays, Silent Running...Noah's Ark in space escaping Earth's environmental decay, three little adorable robots,etc. Soundtrack by Joan Baez warbling away. Had a sad ending though. I don't think the bad guys get to win in a Woke movie.

 

[Dong-Liquor]

Roots?

BLOODY ROOTS!

 

[Rupin]

Hmm, maybe? But can you consider something made before 1980 truly "Woke?" Besides, they cut off Kunta Kinte's foot. No way would that fly nowadays.

Funny, because the other day I was thinking of another 1970s production that I guess might be considered "Woke" nowadays, Silent Running...Noah's Ark in space escaping Earth's environmental decay, three little adorable robots,etc. Soundtrack by Joan Baez warbling away. Had a sad ending though. I don't think the bad guys get to win in a Woke movie.

Space is the Place by Sun Ra made in 1972 was pretty woke. But the difference between that and what we get today is that in the old days, when they put a message in the movie it didn’t take over the whole movie and beat you over the head at the expense of it not being fun to watch.

Like you could still enjoy feature and not feel like you had to agree with the underlying message.

 

[FluffyJackal]

Can you point to some examples where this is not the case? Where explicit wokeness is written into the end product and the movie/book/comic/video game/etc. was considered a success?

Animal House, perhaps?

 

[jspit2.0]

Those are all done by one person that goes by "Pierry Chan". Gary is a retard and read his name as "Perry" because he's a retard. When the chat started pointed out that it's probably "pee-AIR-ee" like the French name "Pierre", he and Jeremy decided it was a Twitter conspiracy and forced everyone else on FNT to call him "Perry" too or else the trolls win. This had the effect of utterly confusing his audience and Mr. Chan, who I inquired to at one point regarding the matter. He seemed to take it in stride. People will put up with a lot to stay hitched to the griftwagon.

It's an interesting mix of cringe and autism. How does it feel to sit through boring ass streams and find the memeable
moment out of the five or six hours?

They'll either ignore it or be wrong and then ignore that they were wrong. They are already proudly proclaiming that they're going to ride Amazon's LoTR show until the wheels come off and failing that there's the Game of Thrones spinoff coming soon, too. Plenty to hate.

Which is all they have, because the real fans of this stuff fucked off to something less retarded. Now its the people who just want to angry.

Talking about (non-Rippa) shit they like is already "bad for the algorithm" or something and at least in Gary's case dude spent much time and effort hyping up The Orville and his personal relationship with the show's producer only to find out that Season 3 blew.

A mcfarlane show sucked! say it isn't so.

Can someone who follows Ethan list his "conservative" positions? Asking for a friend!

He doesn't like taxes and he was originally married to someone who was big on guns.

He'd be more of a lolbertarian if he wasn't raised by mormons. Hopefully he thanks his dad for that faith inheritance he threw away...

I don't know if Frog is politically conservative but he's definitely emotionally conservative.

View attachment 3571503

Is this an actual thing? I mean...I thought Frog was better than stewing over the farms? Absurdity is rent free in there.

Quick question:

Does anybody know if @PocketJacks showed up at Anime Matsuri? He seemed to suggest he was going, but he might have been full of shit and attempting to intimidate @FROG. I just figured I'd ask.

Preston strikes me as a truly degenerate motherfucker who's all about fetishizing IRL shit. He seems to like power dynamics and who cannot handle being dismissed.

I'm less interested in whether he goes or not and more interested in when he eventually gets truly triggered by someone who just outright denies him his fetishistic needs.

 

[Analog Devolved]

Anna tswg is a prostitute
Vic mig is a sex pest.
Cecel...you were warned.

 

[Mister Dongs]

Is this an actual thing? I mean...I thought Frog was better than stewing over the farms? Absurdity is rent free in there.

No it is just a perfect facsimile of a Frog thumbnail, indistinguishable from the genuine article.

Where's the lie?

I might have heard this expressed by some CG or TFM figure, in a moment of lucidity, but I think the mantra 'we don't want politics in our comics' is a fairly inarticulate way to refer to the kind of overt leftist digs that we're all familiar with by now. Or am I giving them too much credit?

No you're right, it's just that "I don't want rigid leftist ideologues having a stranglehold on this thing I'm a fan of" and "all comics should be apolitical so they can appeal to everyone" are two radically different concepts when taken to their logical conclusions. It doesn't help that both statements were often thrown around hand-in-hand by the same people back in early CG.

The entire concept of heroism, to me anyway, has to reflect on some level ideal values and qualities either championed or explored by the storyteller (or is a cipher while those issues are projected externally), and I just don't see how that can be done while being 100% void of something that could be interpreted as a political stance or sentiment without getting incredibly restrictive. Every heroic protagonist embodies some individual or social value; the only difference is that some like Spider-Man's humanism or Superman's sense of social responsibility are conventional and taken for granted whereas something like Ditko's Mr. A is not.

A good writer will create scenarios that test those values and arrive at some form of meaning or truth that meets the satisfaction of the reader. A great writer can take the original premise and find themselves exploring completely unpredicted territory as the thought experiment takes on a life of its own. The average Marvel/DC writer these days however will ignore the established character and scenario they were handed to either take the piss out of the premise completely with Whedonesque bathos or just yell their values at the reader while splashing around in the ideological kiddie pool of corporate approved tribalistic idpol, and if you say anything about it they'll use the platform they've been given to smear you as a Nazi.

What I'm trying to get at is that you can't really put someone who thinks Hitler didn't do anything wrong in charge of writing Captain America and expect the result to be something Captain America fans consider acceptable. Likewise, you can't really put someone in charge of writing a superhero story that believes criminals are just as much victims of society as the victims of the criminals, or that heroism itself doesn't exist instead of inevitable expressions of systemic historical forces, and expect the result to be not shit. And those are political stances.


Anyways, those were a lot of words so for those of you who don't give a fuck here is a short clip of Cecil getting rejected by a woman at Anime Matsuri:

 

[Sex Cannon Lupa]

Anyways, those were a lot of words so for those of you who don't give a fuck here is a short clip of Cecil getting rejected by a woman at Anime Matsuri:

Dat nigga short!

Shouldn't he be fulfilling orders or something? Dude seems to have an awful lot of free time for someone with financial obligations.

 

[BlueKnight]

Dat nigga short!

Shouldn't he be fulfilling orders or something? Dude seems to have an awful lot of free time for someone with financial obligations.

All I'm saying is that I wouldn't be going to fucking conventions if I had a quarter fucking million dollar book nearly two fucking years late. That's all I'm saying. I did not back this book because I saw this coming light years away.