Let's Sperg Did Spec Ops The Line Ruin Gaming?

[geckogoy]

You wrote this shit pile of a story where I bomb a bunch of civilians because of a mistake I'm RAILROADED into making.

I play the game to kill as many people as possible and then selfishly survive in the end, we are not the same

 

[Chunky Salsa]

I don't consider arabs people, so I didn't really take the same message from this game, as a lot of other people seemed to.

 

[David Brown]

If you're a brilliant auteur developer breaking with convention by creating a game designed not to be played

No one ever claims this lol. Only critics make up this idea that the devs were designing a game that people wouldn't want to play. Its much more simple than that. You're not special. Choosing not to play a game isn't making a statement.

Pay me my refund

Sorry you already played 2.1 hours :^) next time don't play a game you hated so bad you wanted your money back

 

[Local FloRida-man]

Sorry you already played 2.1 hours :^) next time don't play a game you hated so bad you wanted your money back

"Haha, next time just know you hate the game before you play it!"

Everyone, I present exhibit A that enjoying Spec Ops the Line causes 3rd degree retardation and grade AA faggotry. Remember kids: not even once.

 

[Fart Muncher]

No, this game did nothing in comparison to TLOU. TLOU is a shitty gay movie that requires a few buttons to press to keep the cutscenes coming and started the trend of "cinematic" games, which don't make games the thing they are supposed to be, videogames. SOTL actually contains a fucking game.

I liked Spec Ops the Line, it has flaws and I can understand why people don't like it, but it certainty didn't ruin gaming, that spot is reserved for TLOU.

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

"Haha, next time just know you hate the game before you play it!"

If you played Spec Ops: The Line at launch, you could never refund it.

If you played it afterwards, you should have had an idea what you were getting into, or you got it at a discount.

Edit: In the miniscule chance that you actually picked up Spec Ops: The Line just because, you should have figured out you hated the game within two hours. The game stays extremely consistent throughout.

 

[Local FloRida-man]

If you played Spec Ops: The Line at launch, you could never refund it.

If you played it afterwards, you should have had an idea what you were getting into, or you got it at a discount.

The point isn't the refund, the point is that fans of the game think telling people to buy the game and then not play it to get the good ending is an intelligent argument, instead of actual brainrot.

Edit: Was that the real point of spec ops all along? That becoming a fart huffing consoomer is the only way to true personal agency?

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

The point isn't the refund, the point is that fans of the game think telling people to buy the game and then not play it to get the good ending is an intelligent argument, instead of actual brainrot.

Well, I agree with you in principal.

But if someone buys a game on the recommendation of a video essayist, they are a fucking retard and faggot who deserves what they get.

(Especially now that Spec Ops is delisted and goes for inflated values on eBay)

 

[The Ugly One]

No. Games high on their own farts have always been around. What ruined gaming was Anita Sarkeesian's anti-fun jihad. That's when all the left-leaning nerds who make games got woke and decided it's bad to have attractive women, heroic men, beating the shit out of scary bad guys, and other cool things in games.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Spec Ops the Line was the peak of "le grey morality, le deconstruction, le subversion of expectations" craze that was really big back in that time. However, I would argue The Last of Us is far more guilty of this. That game and its sequel was far more pretentious with the presentation and execution, especially with the second game. The first game just punched you in the face with "GREY MORALITY, MORAL DILEMMA, DECONSTRUCTION, SUBVERSION OF EXPECTATIONS!" The second game just bludgeoned you to death with it and added a Jewish lesbian love interest, a tranny, and the director's self-insert.

Guess which game got a TV adaptation and an annoying fanbase of turbo coomers and guess which one was delisted from sale earlier this year and considered a commercial failure?

The original TLOU wasn't really subversive in any way, the genre of grey morality roadtrip is old as shit and TLOU never really called you out for your actions outside the universe like Spec Ops did, and people liked it mainly for its emotional core while game journos tried to argue it was deep to justify them liking what amount to B grade TV series. The second game came too late to really affect anything.

Edit: Was that the real point of spec ops all along? That becoming a fart huffing consoomer is the only way to true personal agency?

Fart huffing "war is evil and games glorify war", of course it is done in the context of the second gulf war because trying to do it in WW2 would have gotten them cancelled.

 

[JohnnyG]

Fart huffing "war is evil and games glorify war", of course it is done in the context of the second gulf war because trying to do it in WW2 would have gotten them cancelled.

Now that would be a legitimately new and interesting premise: apply the "war is hell" trope, not to an unpopular war, but to one of the sacred noble conflicts that now make up the entirety of history.

Imagine playing as a Massachusetts Union soldier experiencing the horrors of the Civil War, and deciding he doesn't really care if South Carolina (which at the time was basically 6 countries away, like a Brit looking at Italy) goes its own way.

Or some Canadian 18yr old getting shelled in Malta or Libya in WWII and wondering why he's there watching his friends die.

 

[David Brown]

The point isn't the refund, the point is that fans of the game think telling people to buy the game and then not play it to get the good ending is an intelligent argument, instead of actual brainrot.

Edit: Was that the real point of spec ops all along? That becoming a fart huffing consoomer is the only way to true personal agency?

Its just a shitty video game from years ago. Everyone else moved on. You can too.

Or some Canadian 18yr old getting shelled in Malta or Libya in WWII and wondering why he's there watching his friends die.

A Storm of Steel video game would be pretty cool. Would have to be a VN though, the actual fighting was boring as fuck except for a few battles. Maybe like a management game where you play as Junger and have to keep as many men alive as possible. And nobody in America has heard of WWI so it wouldn't be as controversial as a similar WWII game.

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

Its just a shitty video game from years ago. Everyone else moved on. You can too.

I'm going to make the argument that nobody ever really cared.

Because, if there is one thing I've learned about gamers based on shit like TLOU2, Fallout and Elder Scrolls, they *never* fucking move on.

 

[Agamemnon Busmalis]

Imagine playing as a Massachusetts Union soldier experiencing the horrors of the Civil War, and deciding he doesn't really care if South Carolina (which at the time was basically 6 countries away, like a Brit looking at Italy) goes its own way.

That internal conflict on both sides was a hugely important part of the war so I think it's very appropriate to include it. Copperheads and Southern Unionists (on the opposite side) weren't small groups by any stretch of the imagination.

Entire families were ripped apart by the divisions between North and South, sometimes permanently. If you just make it a simplistic good vs. evil struggle, you miss the deeper nuances of the war and the decisions that motivated people to take sides.

 

[snort inquisition]

i think it has more to do with dipshit faggot indie devs like phil fish (faggot) and whoever the faggot was who made braid, maybe not their games, but their mentality for sure

 

[Local FloRida-man]

Fart huffing "war is evil and games glorify war", of course it is done in the context of the second gulf war because trying to do it in WW2 would have gotten them cancelled.

The only good subversive modern military shooter from that era was the bad company duology. If you're gonna fight a war for profit, steal some gold while you're at it. If EA were smart they would've went that route for Battlefield V instead of what we got.

Its just a shitty video game from years ago. Everyone else moved on. You can too.

Shitting on a game in the thread made to shit on the game is basically a warcrime.

 

[Rudy Coleman]

All the sperging about the White Phosphorus scene and how "it's the players fault" pretty much falls apart when you realise that the player is railroaded into it. I would understand the impact if it was a multiple choice scenario, where you could try to sneak through the camp or just go in guns blazing and hope you don't die, but no. You have no choice but to use White Phosphorus, and you have no choice but to listen to the game lecture you on how much of an evil selfish little fuck you are.

The white phosphorus scene is still subversive and shocking because up until this point in the game nothing like this has ever happened. Most fps games have rail road segments where you are forced into using a predator drone to bomb positions or destroy a bridge, In the newer mw2 you destroy an entire town with an ac130. The player thinks nothing of these because most games have set pieces like this and would preemptively justify it. the characters had no way of taking them all on by themselves AND its a great opportunity to kill hundreds of enemies.
It was a good idea to the characters and the player given the information they had. Like in a movie you cannot control what's happening but can still feel smart if the protagonist has a good idea because you think your would have done the same given the situation.
A scene like this never existed in a game before this so the player would never have considered it, Thats why i think its brilliant.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Now that would be a legitimately new and interesting premise: apply the "war is hell" trope, not to an unpopular war, but to one of the sacred noble conflicts that now make up the entirety of history.

Imagine playing as a Massachusetts Union soldier experiencing the horrors of the Civil War, and deciding he doesn't really care if South Carolina (which at the time was basically 6 countries away, like a Brit looking at Italy) goes its own way.

Or some Canadian 18yr old getting shelled in Malta or Libya in WWII and wondering why he's there watching his friends die.

In the end "war is hell" is a cowardly standpoint when it is done by people who never fought a war and talk about a war that was not popular (especially the years after the original zeal wore off). Media like to joke about people who glorify war yet never fought one, but people who demonize soldiers (which Spec Ops does) is just as hypocritical. Yeah I can stop playing at any moment but a soldier out for his life can't alt+F4.

The white phosphorus scene is still subversive and shocking because up until this point in the game nothing like this has ever happened. Most fps games have rail road segments where you are forced into using a predator drone to bomb positions or destroy a bridge, In the newer mw2 you destroy an entire town with an ac130. The player thinks nothing of these because most games have set pieces like this and would preemptively justify it. the characters had no way of taking them all on by themselves AND its a great opportunity to kill hundreds of enemies.
It was a good idea to the characters and the player given the information they had. Like in a movie you cannot control what's happening but can still feel smart if the protagonist has a good idea because you think your would have done the same given the situation.
A scene like this never existed in a game before this so the player would never have considered it, Thats why i think its brilliant.

Spec Ops only works if you didn't know about the twist, if you don't it will come as a shock especially if you did the civilian bombing of your own volition. If you did know though and especially if you tried to avoid doing it then it falls flat hard. But no matter what it all works on subverting expectations that those minigames never involve actually hurting civilians which is the usual case of "DEEP GAMES" that suddenly enforce "realistic" gameplay despite not having any hint it is a thing.

 

[Rudy Coleman]

Spec Ops only works if you didn't know about the twist, if you don't it will come as a shock especially if you did the civilian bombing of your own volition. If you did know though and especially if you tried to avoid doing it then it falls flat hard. But no matter what it all works on subverting expectations that those minigames never involve actually hurting civilians which is the usual case of "DEEP GAMES" that suddenly enforce "realistic" gameplay despite not having any hint it is a thing.

the irony is that you would never play this game unless you knew about the twist.
I only played it because someone on /v/ recommended it and said to go in blind. this was way before video youtubers found it. its well known now its impossible to not know about its subversive elements

 

[JohnnyG]

In the end "war is hell" is a cowardly standpoint when it is done by people who never fought a war and talk about a war that was not popular (especially the years after the original zeal wore off).

Agreed, I'm not arguing for the post-modern "everything is morally grey" viewpoint, I'm saying it would be new/unique/subversive to direct it at one of modernism's sacred cows.

A Civil War game where you're an idealistic Massachusetts Union recruit fighting the Confederacy (rub it in by tossing Republican slurs at the main character...inb4 muh heckin party switch), only to see your friends die of horrific infections and gangrene. Second act twist: you join northern anti-war Copperheads (@Agamemnon Busmalis) and evade military tribunals by your former countrymen, while the "good guys" hang anti-war dissidents.

WWII would be even easier. In addition to absurdities like Canadian snow people wandering around African deserts and wondering why, include injured/captured troop scenarios where Minnesota farm boys meet distant relatives on the other side, with both realizing they're 10,000 miles from home and don't have any reason to be there.