Fallout series

[Dr. Geronimo]

Man fuck this NCR shit, we should be talking about the important questions of this universe:

If Harold's heart was moved, where do you think his dick is? Do you think the hippies will jerk him off when they find it?

 

[CWCissey]

Man fuck this NCR shit, we should be talking about the important questions of this universe:

If Harold's heart was moved, where do you think his dick is? Do you think the hippies will jerk him off when they find it?

Harold's dick fell off years before while he was fucking prostitutes in the Mid-West.

 

[Imperial Citizen]

I have a question, what does everyone think about the fate of a post-New Vegas Legion? Let's assume that the Courier sides with anyone but the Legion. I am also assuming Caesar dies from a seizure at some point during or in the immediate aftermath of the second battle of Hoover Dam. Would Lanius have been able to be talked down or would he have been killed? Who would take charge of the Legion? Lucius, head of the Praetorian Guard, Vulpes, some other Legate? I had a suspicion that Caesar had an Octavian up his sleeve to take over in the event that he dies. Also because there is no way that Caesar did not take advantage of any of the tribal women he conquered. No cult of personality has its figurehead abstain from fucking their followers and especially not one with the arrogance of Caesar.

 

[CWCissey]

I have a question, what does everyone think about the fate of a post-New Vegas Legion? Let's assume that the Courier sides with anyone but the Legion. I am also assuming Caesar dies from a seizure at some point during or in the immediate aftermath of the second battle of Hoover Dam. Would Lanius have been able to be talked down or would he have been killed? Who would take charge of the Legion? Lucius, head of the Praetorian Guard, Vulpes, some other Legate? I had a suspicion that Caesar had an Octavian up his sleeve to take over in the event that he dies. Also because there is no way that Caesar did not take advantage of any of the tribal women he conquered. No cult of personality has its figurehead abstain from fucking their followers and especially not one with the arrogance of Caesar.

I imagine Lanius would take over because of might equals right and would more than likely be the downfall of the Legion as he kills off Vulpes and any other threats/dishonourable fighters. The frumentari are probably the Legion's biggest ace but Lanius hates them.

However if Lanius is killed, I could see either Vulpes or Lucius taking over, either one would likely reform the Legion to use more subterfuge when facing rivals.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

I think wait and see Oliver is mostly to blame for the situation stagnating as much as it did post first battle for the dam. It was clear after the first battle that there would be a second. Oliver wanted a massive concentration at the dam at all times. You talk to people like Ranger Jackson or Lt. Hayes and they tell you the problems they are dealing with could be solved with just a few extra bodies or rifles. Jackson also tells you all the soldiers passing through the Mojave outpost are sent straight to the dam or to McCarran before heading to the dam. Just about every NCR officer you talk to will tell you some version of how undermanned they are but we know the NCR is constantly trickling men into the Mojave. Oliver's strategy is what's killing the NCR in New Vegas. He hoards all the manpower he gets and has one hand wrapped around Hanlon and rangers to keep them from embarrassing him again. Left to his own devices he'll kill the NCR army as he stares down the Legion and ignores all the minor players taking bites out of his back. The Legion only stares back and laughs letting the NCR kill themselves and poke them when they can. The NCR winning the battle when it comes is less likely the longer the wait is.

However should all the chips fall into place and the battle results for a victory for the NCR I think a turnaround will be in order. That massive build up at the dam will no longer be required and the lion's share of troopers coming into the Mojave will be sent to the outposts in greater need. People like Jackson and Hayes will get that extra squad and rifles they've been praying for. The rangers will finally be no longer bound by Oliver's insecurities and free to start pacifying the frontier in earnest. All the tough hombres from Baja that were manning posts in places like Forlorn Hope are free to start spiting napalm at the threats around them. Oliver himself will be out from command to focus on his political ambitions and Colonel "kill them all" Moore will be in charge and won't be as willing to overlook threats like convict gangs shooting up whatever they please.

The Legion itself will be in a tenuous position. Caesar is on a limited time limit and Lanius either died in combat or was talked down and forced to return in failure to Caesar. Unless Caesar is playing favorites he'll make an example of him as he did the last time a legate failed him. I don't think Caesar will be around long enough especially with all the stresses this defeat will bring him to rebuild his losses, subjugate more tribes to get stronger, and come back for round 3. I don't know if Vulpes and Lucius will be characters capable of ultimately of rebuilding, strengthening and leading the Legion to continued glory. I'm also of the belief that the NCR victory in the second battle was more complete then the first time given the way the battle happens.

Most of the factions that were working for the Legion or just opposed to the NCR do make their final plays in the battle. If the NCR isn't routed at the dam they tend to hold off the threats like the fiends and cripple them in the process. Most of the groups picking on the NCR are only doing it because they feel confident they can get away with it because the Legion is camped right there drawing away their attention away from themselves. I don't think most of the minor players like the Khans or Kings won't feel like starting shit when they have a company or even a possible battalion looking right at them.

I don't think the pacification of the Mojave will be quick and decisive with the NCR depleted from the battle as they were but I do think the victory that is powerful enough to keep Kimball and possibly get Oliver into office will also be enough to keep public opinion on the Mojave annexation placated long enough for it to actually happen. It was a severe case of tunnel vision that led to the stagnation and decay of the NCR in the Mojave with the first battle of the dam being the entrance and the second battle its exit. Once the NCR is free to look around and see everything else shit will get done.

Now whether or not you want to discuss if it was a fluke that the NCR wins at I'm willing to believe it is and ultimately it will set a dangerous precedent by justifying Kimball and Oliver's actions and possibly do more harm to the NCR then the prosperity of having Vegas will do good for them in the long run.

The problem is, if the NCR wins at Hoover Dam, Kimball and Oliver will believe their strategies are working and will double down on it. Especially since the Legion is still out there, and whether or not Caesar or Lanius die, if the Courier didn't go the extra mile of eradicating the Legion high command at the Fort, there would still be Vulpes Inculta and Lucius, both of whom are far more sensible than Lanius. So if Lanius died fighting the Courier in Hoover Dam, those two will take command of the Legion, and they'll conduct the same hit-and-run tactics that have devastated NCR forces east of the Mojave. They'll coordinate strikes with the Fiends and Powder Gangers, and what's left of the Khans and the Brotherhood of Steel in the Mojave would also likely join in, provided that the Courier went for the "destroy" option against both of them, which is the easiest option.

Peace would end up being just as bloody as war as these groups bleed the NCR's numbers while the Legion masses for another attack at Hoover Dam to "avenge" the deaths of Lanius and Caesar. And since the Legion is a dictatorship, they can do that, and simply execute anyone who protests. Whereas the NCR, being a democracy, can't just keep sending bodies because the top brass told them to-they're a democracy, which means that since the people of the NCR are getting sick to death of the Mojave campaign, the politicians will have to listen when the people make their displeasure known. Oliver and Kimball can try pushing for things as much as they can, but unless the Courier does everything for them and sets the stage for a total NCR victory in the Mojave by doing all the sidequests and ensuring that the Enclave, Boomers, and Brotherhood join the NCR, NCR ownership of the Mojave will just have the same repeated tragedy as what happened after their first victory against Joshua Graham.

I have a question, what does everyone think about the fate of a post-New Vegas Legion? Let's assume that the Courier sides with anyone but the Legion. I am also assuming Caesar dies from a seizure at some point during or in the immediate aftermath of the second battle of Hoover Dam. Would Lanius have been able to be talked down or would he have been killed? Who would take charge of the Legion? Lucius, head of the Praetorian Guard, Vulpes, some other Legate? I had a suspicion that Caesar had an Octavian up his sleeve to take over in the event that he dies. Also because there is no way that Caesar did not take advantage of any of the tribal women he conquered. No cult of personality has its figurehead abstain from fucking their followers and especially not one with the arrogance of Caesar.

Depends on them winning or not.

Caesar dying is a given, unless the Courier heals him. So either Lanius takes over, or Vulpes Inculta and Lucius take over. If Lanius takes over, and the Legion lost at Hoover Dam, he withdraws from the Mojave entirely, because to him, occupying the Mojave is a logistical nightmare, and he'd probably focus on building up more strength in the east before expanding westward ever again. If Lanius dies, then Vulpes and Lucius take over as some kind of Roman-esque two-consul system, and they use subterfuge and other tactics to weaken NCR holdings in the Mojave before massing for another attack.

If the Courier helped them win at Hoover Dam, then it's more likely that the Courier will be the next Caesar. All the steps are there: the Courier was educated by Caesar on how he created the Legion and how its inner workings function. The Courier killed the NCR president Aaron Kimball and defeated his most trusted general, Lee Oliver. The Courier also killed Mr. House and eradicated the Brotherhood of Steel in the Mojave. Their deeds would be well-known by the Legion troops, and even Lanius would have to respect a person who single-handedly eradicated an entire platoon of power-armored paladins with powerful energy weapons. Plus, Caesar put the Courier's face on the money. It's the old Roman way of signaling that the Courier is next in line to inherit the throne once he passes away. The Courier, who broke the back of the NCR, eradicated the Brotherhood of Steel, killed the mysterious Mr. House, saved Caesar from his brain tumor, and led the Legion forces to victory at Hoover Dam, avenging the loss suffered by Joshua Graham and the Legion five years before. That's one hell of a resume, which basically means that the Legion ending is just a more brutal Yes Man ending where instead of Securitrons, your goons will be Lanius, Vulpes, Lucius, and the Legion as a whole, once Caesar passes away.

 

[Get_your_kicks_with_30-06]

I have a question, what does everyone think about the fate of a post-New Vegas Legion? Let's assume that the Courier sides with anyone but the Legion. I am also assuming Caesar dies from a seizure at some point during or in the immediate aftermath of the second battle of Hoover Dam. Would Lanius have been able to be talked down or would he have been killed? Who would take charge of the Legion? Lucius, head of the Praetorian Guard, Vulpes, some other Legate? I had a suspicion that Caesar had an Octavian up his sleeve to take over in the event that he dies. Also because there is no way that Caesar did not take advantage of any of the tribal women he conquered. No cult of personality has its figurehead abstain from fucking their followers and especially not one with the arrogance of Caesar.

If Lanius is talked downed from the attack by the Courier, I think it's safe to assume Lanius would become the new leader of the Legion after Caesar dies. I disagree with the notion that without Caesar their is no more Legion, the Legion will only dissolve if there is no clear strong leader to take his place. Lanius would be an obvious candidate that I think the men of the Legion would be fine with serving. In the aftermath of Caesar's death, I think Lanius would heed the Courier's advice and go back to their holdings in the East and consolidate his forces. I could see Lanius just being a brutish general instead of an actual ruler and crushing more tribes to assimilate into a bigger army that could then comeback to challenge the NCR at the Dam again. However, Lanius is a surprisingly intelligent guy, as is shown when talking to him at the final battle, so a case could also be made that he may try to establish an actual functioning state and economy, not just some nomadic army. Creating an established nation state would really help the Legion compete with the NCR.

If Lanius goes along with the attack, then the Legion is done for. With the Courier's intervention always resulting in a Legion loss, there would be no way for them to recover from it. Caesar would die, Lanius would die in battle and the Legion ranks would be severely diminished. I don't think Lucius, Vulpes, or any other Legate would be able to hold the Legion together in the aftermath of a defeat like that. What would then happen would probably be a repeat of the Western Roman Empire (cuz war never changes), the Legion would break apart. They would form their original tribes or some amalgamation of orignal tribe and Legion.

Damn now I really want New Vegas 2 where we could see this sort of stuff happen. Feelsfuckingbadman that this will never happen and if it does the writing will be so shit and gay.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Damn now I really want New Vegas 2 where we could see this sort of stuff happen. Feelsfuckingbadman that this will never happen and if it does the writing will be so shit and gay.

That's the problem. Obsidian, like most companies, decided to go for wokeness over quality. Bioware and Blizzard fell to the same disease. The same company that gave us Robert Edwin House, also known as one of the most nuanced takes on corporate overlords in video game history, decided to go with the whole "CAPITALISM IS BAD" message with Outer Worlds, which is kinda funny considering that Obsidian sold its soul to Microsoft recently. If they made a New Vegas 2, you can bet your ass every faction would get slagged for not being woke enough. The NCR are neo-cons, the Legion are fascists, and New Vegas is a corporate state. You can bet your ass modern Obsidian would drag all three into the mud just for not being the kind of woke socialist utopia that modern millennial youth fantasize about.

 

[Imperial Citizen]

If Lanius is talked downed from the attack by the Courier, I think it's safe to assume Lanius would become the new leader of the Legion after Caesar dies. I disagree with the notion that without Caesar their is no more Legion, the Legion will only dissolve if there is no clear strong leader to take his place. Lanius would be an obvious candidate that I think the men of the Legion would be fine with serving. In the aftermath of Caesar's death, I think Lanius would heed the Courier's advice and go back to their holdings in the East and consolidate his forces. I could see Lanius just being a brutish general instead of an actual ruler and crushing more tribes to assimilate into a bigger army that could then comeback to challenge the NCR at the Dam again. However, Lanius is a surprisingly intelligent guy, as is shown when talking to him at the final battle, so a case could also be made that he may try to establish an actual functioning state and economy, not just some nomadic army. Creating an established nation state would really help the Legion compete with the NCR.

If Lanius goes along with the attack, then the Legion is done for. With the Courier's intervention always resulting in a Legion loss, there would be no way for them to recover from it. Caesar would die, Lanius would die in battle and the Legion ranks would be severely diminished. I don't think Lucius, Vulpes, or any other Legate would be able to hold the Legion together in the aftermath of a defeat like that. What would then happen would probably be a repeat of the Western Roman Empire (cuz war never changes), the Legion would break apart. They would form their original tribes or some amalgamation of orignal tribe and Legion.

Damn now I really want New Vegas 2 where we could see this sort of stuff happen. Feelsfuckingbadman that this will never happen and if it does the writing will be so shit and gay.

I don't see Lanius gaining control of the entire Legion if he is talked down to. He would have not only failed to conquer the 88th tribe, but was talked out of it. The more bloodthirsty legionaries would see it as weakness, not mention that they believe it was Caesar's Malpas Legate that lead to their failure in the first battle of Hoover Dam. Vulpes would no doubt disseminate such comments as Lanius would crucify him and the rest of the frumentarii.

There would be a civil war, with the Legion divided between Lanius, Vulpes, and a third faction, the Cult of Mars, which would want a third battle of Hoover Dam, desperate to establish Caesar's Rome. If the third faction wins, the Legion will kill itself upon the wall of Hoover Dam. With Lanius, he will avoid going West. Instead he could take the Native American tribes in Oklahoma, the Mexicans to the South, or whatever communities exist up in Wyoming. I see Vulpes going after the NCR but through subtlety. His frumentarii launch terrorist attacks across the NCR, blow up Hoover Dam, any tactic to make the NCR believe "the Vengeance of Caesar" upon them. He might not even conquer the NCR, just leave it a smoldering ruin, so that generations will know that anyone who goes against the Legion will fall.

 

[Snekposter]

First, Lanius continues his assault even if Caesar is dead, saying the will of Caesar is absolute, and second, he can be talked into leaving still. Assuming Lucius is also still alive, the most likely result is you have an old Roman triumvirate of him, Vulpes, and Lanius, with the other two placing the blame for the loss at Hoover on Lanius, setting the stage for an old Roman civil war. I would imagine Lucius, as the oldest and most well-respected of Caesar's praetorians (old, graying, and thirteen years of service but still no challenge!), served as a confidante and would almost certainly know either from the mouth of Caesar himself or simply figure out on his own that there's more to Caesar than what he claims, especially since he's around that Auto-Doc all day in the tent. So he'd be a lot more comfortable with tech, especially since if the opening quote on the Wiki is anything to go by, only dislikes an over-reliance on firearms, not firearms themselves. I always saw him as the one who would be most likely to establish a true New Rome after Caesar died, simply because of proximity and familiarity with technology.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

First, Lanius continues his assault even if Caesar is dead, saying the will of Caesar is absolute, and second, he can be talked into leaving still. Assuming Lucius is also still alive, the most likely result is you have an old Roman triumvirate of him, Vulpes, and Lanius, with the other two placing the blame for the loss at Hoover on Lanius, setting the stage for an old Roman civil war. I would imagine Lucius, as the oldest and most well-respected of Caesar's praetorians (old, graying, and thirteen years of service but still no challenge!), served as a confidante and would almost certainly know either from the mouth of Caesar himself or simply figure out on his own that there's more to Caesar than what he claims, especially since he's around that Auto-Doc all day in the tent. So he'd be a lot more comfortable with tech, especially since if the opening quote on the Wiki is anything to go by, only dislikes an over-reliance on firearms, not firearms themselves. I always saw him as the one who would be most likely to establish a true New Rome after Caesar died, simply because of proximity and familiarity with technology.

It also depends on who wins the civil war. If Lanius wins, he'll be more conservative and retain a lot of the anti-drug, anti-tech ways of the Legion, but he'd conserve his manpower and not go on foreign adventures until the east is primarily secured. Whereas if Lucius and Vulpes win, they'll abandon the more restrictive ways of the Legion, allow for say, more technology and subterfuge, but they'll continue the attack on the Mojave, especially if the Courier did the bare minimum to win for the NCR and the Mojave would still have plenty of chaos for Vulpes to manipulate.

But of course, if the Legion wins, as I said, it's going to be just a more brutal version of the Yes Man ending, where the Courier would be next in line to inherit due to all their great deeds, from saving Caesar's life to crushing the NCR and the Brotherhood of Steel. Caesar even educated the Courier on the history and working methods of the Legion, not to mention he placed the Courier's face on the coin, which is the old Roman way of declaring who's next in line once the Emperor dies. The Courier can prove to be an even more dangerous Caesar than the original one, especially since if it's a LVL 50 Courier, then they can be as smart as Caesar and Vulpes while being as strong as Lanius.

I know my Courier is stronger than Lanius. She can send him flying in a sword duel for Pete's sake, and she's smart enough to properly use energy weapons and give Caesar a full-on brain surgery with just some medical tools, not to mention she sweet-talked the Think Tank, the Boomers, and the Enclave to be her personal allies. She also has the upgraded Securitron army on standby (she didn't tell Caesar that she upgraded them instead of destroying them-she needed insurance in the odd case the Legion decides to make her a sex slave instead of a valued ally). That kind of person taking control of the Legion once Caesar eventually flatlines will lead to the NCR falling in a year, and in 10-20 years, the Legion will retake most of the continental US.

 

[Snekposter]

Sure, but if you want to play things like that, Ogg from Arroyo should be declaring himself President of the NCR after all he's accomplished.

 

[Burned Man]

The problem is, if the NCR wins at Hoover Dam, Kimball and Oliver will believe their strategies are working and will double down on it. Especially since the Legion is still out there, and whether or not Caesar or Lanius die, if the Courier didn't go the extra mile of eradicating the Legion high command at the Fort, there would still be Vulpes Inculta and Lucius, both of whom are far more sensible than Lanius. So if Lanius died fighting the Courier in Hoover Dam, those two will take command of the Legion, and they'll conduct the same hit-and-run tactics that have devastated NCR forces east of the Mojave. They'll coordinate strikes with the Fiends and Powder Gangers, and what's left of the Khans and the Brotherhood of Steel in the Mojave would also likely join in, provided that the Courier went for the "destroy" option against both of them, which is the easiest option.

Peace would end up being just as bloody as war as these groups bleed the NCR's numbers while the Legion masses for another attack at Hoover Dam to "avenge" the deaths of Lanius and Caesar. And since the Legion is a dictatorship, they can do that, and simply execute anyone who protests. Whereas the NCR, being a democracy, can't just keep sending bodies because the top brass told them to-they're a democracy, which means that since the people of the NCR are getting sick to death of the Mojave campaign, the politicians will have to listen when the people make their displeasure known. Oliver and Kimball can try pushing for things as much as they can, but unless the Courier does everything for them and sets the stage for a total NCR victory in the Mojave by doing all the sidequests and ensuring that the Enclave, Boomers, and Brotherhood join the NCR, NCR ownership of the Mojave will just have the same repeated tragedy as what happened after their first victory against Joshua Graham.



Depends on them winning or not.

Caesar dying is a given, unless the Courier heals him. So either Lanius takes over, or Vulpes Inculta and Lucius take over. If Lanius takes over, and the Legion lost at Hoover Dam, he withdraws from the Mojave entirely, because to him, occupying the Mojave is a logistical nightmare, and he'd probably focus on building up more strength in the east before expanding westward ever again. If Lanius dies, then Vulpes and Lucius take over as some kind of Roman-esque two-consul system, and they use subterfuge and other tactics to weaken NCR holdings in the Mojave before massing for another attack.

I was only speaking of the aftermath of an NCR victory and my belief they can ultimately hold it.

Once the major war is over I see there being a major overhaul to NCR operations in the area. With the Legion as whipped as they are it will take a long time for them to come back assuming their succession isn't going to be a massive problem. Caesar will die. Lanius is either dead or will be after his punishment for failure. Vulpes and Lucius are the major players here. Lanius has no respect for Vulpes in his trickery so I imagine a lot his commanders would share the sentiment and not bow to his rule. I don't think there is enough evidence to support the idea of Lucius being solely capable of filling the void left by legends like Caesar and Lanius. With their attention turned eastward and possible civil strife I don't think they will take the time to seed agents onto the Mojave for a while and when they can finally get back to doing the NCR will be more established and their tricks more known to the NCR.

The Khans are already a waning power before the battle and they commit forces to hit the NCR lines from behind. In a NCR victory all those warriors die leaving the Khans even worse off then before and not much of a threat. The Powder gangers in the NCRCF are able to be wiped by Lt. Hayes sending a single squad so once the war is over and the NCR is able to turn its entire might on the convicts they won't be as cocky and will disperse with only a few holdouts. The only powder gangers that remain a problem are Cooke's bunch which do become a nuisance. The Brotherhood aren't a problem either assuming destruction was taken. Most of the Brotherhood that evac seem to be the noncombatants considering you have to fight your way out when you trigger the self destruction. With all their resources gone and plenty of mouths to feed and no reliable way to keep their arms and armor maintained I'd assume the the survivors would leave the Mojave for greener pastures and other Brotherhood chapters rather then stick around to wage guerilla warfare. The Fiends mount a massive attack on McCarran during the battle and inflict casualties but are killed in the process so they are a crippled threat too. All the factions that had problems with the NCR get just as bloodied if not more so in the Battle for the dam or before it. They are in no position to serve as an immediate threat to the NCR in its aftermath and will take time to get strong enough to do so and I doubt they will match the rate of the NCR's recovery after the battle. They are a myriad of different groups with no common ground that weren't working together before the NCR became the sole superpower in the region and I don't think that will change after either.

NCR public sentiment was on the decline before the battle happened but after victory they are back on board. They keep Kimball in power and Oliver is able to run a political campaign based on it. I believe they are willing to support the continued expansion into the Mojave and keep at least the same amount of manpower and resources coming into it which is why the NCR will recover faster from the war then all the smaller factions will.

Kimball won't be as hands on with the pacification because it won't be as hot an issue as the war was and Oliver will leave to peruse his own political ambitions leaving Moore and Hsu and Crocker in charge. Hsu is the reasonable commander with a head for logistics, Moore is the warhawk that will absolutely deal with rogue elements rather then ignore them, and Crocker's diplomacy will be from a position of strength as the only super power left in the region. The NCR doesn't need to turn the Mojave into a peaceful oasis in the wasteland they just need to turn it into a state on par with the rest of them, full of strife and problems but ultimately under NCR rule.

The Boomers are the sole faction left in the Mojave that are problem for the NCR and that's only if the NCR decides to aggressively mess with them. I think the NCR wouldn't have to fight them either. With companies like the Gun Runners and Crimson Caravan to reach out to I think the NCR could make diplomatic relations with the Boomers.

Once the NCR takes the Mojave I really believe they are capable of holding it and won't lose it to any of the lesser factions and the only thing kicking them out is another super power rolling in.

 

[HeyYou]

A real NCR patriot would probably help House or Yes Man take over the Mojave so that New Vegas would be straddled with the responsibility to patrol the Mojave.

That's dumb as fuck.

 

[A Grey Cat]

The NCR in New Vegas sucks. I haven't played an NCR playthrough in years. I mean really what kind of republic is fraught with Bureaucratic red tape, on the brink of financial ruin, infective legislation, tied up in countless pointless wars that cost so many lives or lead to their ruination, mocks the very idea of a democracy and is run by a spineless jellyfish for a president...wow obsidian you really predicted the future with this game didn't you?

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

That's dumb as fuck.

No it ain't. Considering how crippled and weakened the NCR is throughout the game, getting someone else to patrol the Mojave for them while their citizens enjoy all Vegas has to offer, without having to pay in money OR blood to keep the area safe, is the best thing for the NCR at that point.

Sure, but if you want to play things like that, Ogg from Arroyo should be declaring himself President of the NCR after all he's accomplished.

Can't get any worse than Kimball and Oliver.

I was only speaking of the aftermath of an NCR victory and my belief they can ultimately hold it.

Once the major war is over I see there being a major overhaul to NCR operations in the area. With the Legion as whipped as they are it will take a long time for them to come back assuming their succession isn't going to be a massive problem. Caesar will die. Lanius is either dead or will be after his punishment for failure. Vulpes and Lucius are the major players here. Lanius has no respect for Vulpes in his trickery so I imagine a lot his commanders would share the sentiment and not bow to his rule. I don't think there is enough evidence to support the idea of Lucius being solely capable of filling the void left by legends like Caesar and Lanius. With their attention turned eastward and possible civil strife I don't think they will take the time to seed agents onto the Mojave for a while and when they can finally get back to doing the NCR will be more established and their tricks more known to the NCR.

The Khans are already a waning power before the battle and they commit forces to hit the NCR lines from behind. In a NCR victory all those warriors die leaving the Khans even worse off then before and not much of a threat. The Powder gangers in the NCRCF are able to be wiped by Lt. Hayes sending a single squad so once the war is over and the NCR is able to turn its entire might on the convicts they won't be as cocky and will disperse with only a few holdouts. The only powder gangers that remain a problem are Cooke's bunch which do become a nuisance. The Brotherhood aren't a problem either assuming destruction was taken. Most of the Brotherhood that evac seem to be the noncombatants considering you have to fight your way out when you trigger the self destruction. With all their resources gone and plenty of mouths to feed and no reliable way to keep their arms and armor maintained I'd assume the the survivors would leave the Mojave for greener pastures and other Brotherhood chapters rather then stick around to wage guerilla warfare. The Fiends mount a massive attack on McCarran during the battle and inflict casualties but are killed in the process so they are a crippled threat too. All the factions that had problems with the NCR get just as bloodied if not more so in the Battle for the dam or before it. They are in no position to serve as an immediate threat to the NCR in its aftermath and will take time to get strong enough to do so and I doubt they will match the rate of the NCR's recovery after the battle. They are a myriad of different groups with no common ground that weren't working together before the NCR became the sole superpower in the region and I don't think that will change after either.

NCR public sentiment was on the decline before the battle happened but after victory they are back on board. They keep Kimball in power and Oliver is able to run a political campaign based on it. I believe they are willing to support the continued expansion into the Mojave and keep at least the same amount of manpower and resources coming into it which is why the NCR will recover faster from the war then all the smaller factions will.

Kimball won't be as hands on with the pacification because it won't be as hot an issue as the war was and Oliver will leave to peruse his own political ambitions leaving Moore and Hsu and Crocker in charge. Hsu is the reasonable commander with a head for logistics, Moore is the warhawk that will absolutely deal with rogue elements rather then ignore them, and Crocker's diplomacy will be from a position of strength as the only super power left in the region. The NCR doesn't need to turn the Mojave into a peaceful oasis in the wasteland they just need to turn it into a state on par with the rest of them, full of strife and problems but ultimately under NCR rule.

The Boomers are the sole faction left in the Mojave that are problem for the NCR and that's only if the NCR decides to aggressively mess with them. I think the NCR wouldn't have to fight them either. With companies like the Gun Runners and Crimson Caravan to reach out to I think the NCR could make diplomatic relations with the Boomers.

Once the NCR takes the Mojave I really believe they are capable of holding it and won't lose it to any of the lesser factions and the only thing kicking them out is another super power rolling in.

The Legion still exists. Unless the Courier went the extra mile and killed Vulpes and Lucius along with Caesar, they're not going to stop until they take the Mojave, even if they send the Legion Lanius' head in a basket. More subversive attacks will follow, with Frumentarii rallying Fiends, Brotherhood remnants, and Powder Gangers against NCR forces, which are stretched thin enough as it is. Not to mention the NCR still has concerns in the west, with power-armored troops having to protect Brahmin Baron lands from raiders, as well as the California Brotherhood still being a threat. So no, reinforcements are not a viable option, and neither is continued occupation of the Mojave. Unless the Courier did everything to secure the Mojave for the NCR, like recruiting the Brotherhood and the Boomers, eradicating all gang activity like the Powder Gangers and the Fiends, AND destroying the Legion's high command by killing Caesar, Vulpes, and Lucius, the NCR's hold on the Mojave will always be tenuous, and with enemies back home, and rising popular discontent with increased taxes and manpower being wasted on the Mojave, it won't last.

This of course, presumes that the Courier did only the bare minimum. If the Courier annihilated the Legion's high command, got the Brotherhood and the Boomers to support the NCR, and eradicated all gang activity as well as eradicating Legion outposts in the Mojave, then the stage will be set for a total NCR victory at the dam as well as the NCR having an easy time holding the Mojave.

The NCR in New Vegas sucks. I haven't played an NCR playthrough in years. I mean really what kind of republic is fraught with Bureaucratic red tape, on the brink of financial ruin, infective legislation, tied up in countless pointless wars that cost so many lives or lead to their ruination, mocks the very idea of a democracy and is run by a spineless jellyfish for a president...wow obsidian you really predicted the future with this game didn't you?

My point exactly. The NCR is practically the crappiest faction in the Mojave. It's like playing the Western Roman Empire in Rome Total War: Barbarian Invasion-EVERYTHING is working against them. Local gangs are picking off their people, the Legion is making open moves and seizing land from them, all the while New Vegas' leaders plot against them and they're getting sabotaged from inside by both ally (Chief Hanlon) and enemy (Frumentari Picus) alike. It's basically the biggest challenge to get the best NCR ending in the game, because you'll be doing A LOT to ensure that total NCR victory by the end.

 

[Exceptionally Exceptional]

Honestly, I like that the NCR provides the most quests in the game. More shit to do, more shit to find and hoard, more enemies to kill. And at the end of the day that's what it's all about.

And for all the NCR's problems at least their people aren't insane violent drug addicts, amoral drug pushing barbarians, haughty isolationist religious zealot tech fetishists, or fascistic slaving rapists. I like NCR citizens, but their government is admittedly a shitshow.

The best ending would have been the one that was cut, where House signs the Mojave over to the NCR in return for ownership of the Strip and NCR citizenship.
Then expand on that lorewise, wherein House uses his citizenship to eventually run for and get elected President of the NCR.

 

[MightyBiteySnake]

I suppose it's for the players who don't have enough firepower to kill 20 paladins like I do, mostly stealth builds that aren't as heavily armed

Actually stealth builds, in my experience have a pretty easy time cleaning out the bunker, with some unique rewards for doing so post-BoS quests. Because the laser turrets do most of the work for you and most of the Paladins don't wear helmets in the bunker (iirc only the two guards in the Elder's Room do) it's pretty easy to make the clean sweep without being seen. This means you keep veronica, get the experience for massacring everyone yourself, and still get magically respawning crate of energy cells and MFCs near the entrance (since you'll still be Liked and that's the only factor the game checks).

A mailman can't run a nation-state effectively.

Tbf, as others have pointed out, you're hardly just a mailman by the time you reach the battle of hoover dam, doubly so if you've cleared all the DLC stories.

amoral drug pushing barbarians

Say what you will about the Khans but they're a hardy people, and you get more than a few chances to set them on the right track. Id love to see a northwest fallout that takes place in the tribal empire from their good new vegas ending.

I don't have the quote but I saw someone mention how the mojave is "fucked" because of the tunnelers. And I can't help but feel like theyre a little overblown as a threat. Yes I know ulysses think they're the worst things since the bombs and all, but ulysses is kind of a dumbass to begin with, and just because an enemy proves able to overwhelm a single powerful individual (mailman or deathclaw) doesn't mean they can defeat an equal number of smarter and armed enemy forces. Tunnelers are light sensitive and once one dumbie discovers that and survives, that's kind of it. A couple of guards in a settlement with flare guns and the villagers can sleep easy. I think that's the other factor people forget about: armed guards. Presumably, every ending (save securitronless independent) ends with patrols and guards defending major settlements; the mojave would not be the easy pickings it was before

 

[Exceptionally Exceptional]

Say what you will about the Khans but they're a hardy people, and you get more than a few chances to set them on the right track. Id love to see a northwest fallout that takes place in the tribal empire from their good new vegas ending.

I generally try to get the Khans and the NCR to ally or at least make up whenever I play through, and convince them to start making medical chems as well. They're not evil, just a bit amoral.

I don't have the quote but I saw someone mention how the mojave is "fucked" because of the tunnelers. And I can't help but feel like theyre a little overblown as a threat. Yes I know ulysses think they're the worst things since the bombs and all, but ulysses is kind of a dumbass to begin with, and just because an enemy proves able to overwhelm a single powerful individual (mailman or deathclaw) doesn't mean they can defeat an equal number of smarter and armed enemy forces. Tunnelers are light sensitive and once one dumbie discovers that and survives, that's kind of it. A couple of guards in a settlement with flare guns and the villagers can sleep easy. I think that's the other factor people forget about: armed guards. Presumably, every ending (save securitronless independent) ends with patrols and guards defending major settlements; the mojave would not be the easy pickings it was before

Yeah, I think Ulysses overestimates the Tunnelers. They're scary when it's 10 on 1, but a line of men with rifles would probably pick them off pretty quickly. And their light sensitivity is definitely an exploitable weakness.

 

[LORD IMPERATOR]

Honestly, I like that the NCR provides the most quests in the game. More shit to do, more shit to find and hoard, more enemies to kill. And at the end of the day that's what it's all about.

And for all the NCR's problems at least their people aren't insane violent drug addicts, amoral drug pushing barbarians, haughty isolationist religious zealot tech fetishists, or fascistic slaving rapists. I like NCR citizens, but their government is admittedly a shitshow.

The best ending would have been the one that was cut, where House signs the Mojave over to the NCR in return for ownership of the Strip and NCR citizenship.
Then expand on that lorewise, wherein House uses his citizenship to eventually run for and get elected President of the NCR.

NCR under House's control is the best scenario for the west. He'd likely expand the tech base of the NCR, continue turning tribes into civilized people, and finish the eradication of the Brotherhood of Steel, not to mention step up Securitron production so they can patrol the wastes and keep raiders to a minimum.

Actually stealth builds, in my experience have a pretty easy time cleaning out the bunker, with some unique rewards for doing so post-BoS quests. Because the laser turrets do most of the work for you and most of the Paladins don't wear helmets in the bunker (iirc only the two guards in the Elder's Room do) it's pretty easy to make the clean sweep without being seen. This means you keep veronica, get the experience for massacring everyone yourself, and still get magically respawning crate of energy cells and MFCs near the entrance (since you'll still be Liked and that's the only factor the game checks).

Tbf, as others have pointed out, you're hardly just a mailman by the time you reach the battle of hoover dam, doubly so if you've cleared all the DLC stories.

Say what you will about the Khans but they're a hardy people, and you get more than a few chances to set them on the right track. Id love to see a northwest fallout that takes place in the tribal empire from their good new vegas ending.

I don't have the quote but I saw someone mention how the mojave is "fucked" because of the tunnelers. And I can't help but feel like theyre a little overblown as a threat. Yes I know ulysses think they're the worst things since the bombs and all, but ulysses is kind of a dumbass to begin with, and just because an enemy proves able to overwhelm a single powerful individual (mailman or deathclaw) doesn't mean they can defeat an equal number of smarter and armed enemy forces. Tunnelers are light sensitive and once one dumbie discovers that and survives, that's kind of it. A couple of guards in a settlement with flare guns and the villagers can sleep easy. I think that's the other factor people forget about: armed guards. Presumably, every ending (save securitronless independent) ends with patrols and guards defending major settlements; the mojave would not be the easy pickings it was before

Usually I just massacre everyone myself. The joy of personally slaughtering 22 heavily-armored paladins is one of New Vegas' greatest joys.

A Courier that cleared all the DLC stories is a one-man (or one-woman) superpower.

I usually either slaughter them or get them to leave the Mojave and join up with the Followers. The former ends with them dead, the latter ends with them carving out a mighty empire in the North.

Heck, just have the NCR Rangers, Securitrons, or Legion troops form a firing line with stadium lights right behind them, and the Tunneler problem is over and done with.

 

[Exceptionally Exceptional]

NCR under House's control is the best scenario for the west. He'd likely expand the tech base of the NCR, continue turning tribes into civilized people, and finish the eradication of the Brotherhood of Steel, not to mention step up Securitron production so they can patrol the wastes and keep raiders to a minimum.

Why destroy the Brotherhood? They're a potentially useful tool. I'd say reform it, remind the Brotherhood WHY Roger Maxson founded it in the first place, which was to collect up tech and help humanity rebuild. Once House starts rebuilding and producing new tech anyway there's really no point to their tech collection mission.
Suddenly you have a fuckloads of dudes in power armor and training with energy weapons that have nothing to do and can now be either used to guard essential locations, hunt down raiders, or maintain technological institutions.

People like Veronica are the only hope for the Brotherhood. Because her and old man Lyons were right that the Brotherhood should be a force for good. Hell, Veronica would probably agree with House's statement about how the Brotherhood should be carting off armfuls of prosthetic organs from hospitals.
Shit, make Veronica the new Elder of the entire BoS.