Forked-off Xlibre tells Wayland display protocol to DEI in a fire - "If you don't like it, fork it." "No not like that!"

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Forked-off Xlibre tells Wayland display protocol to DEI in a fire​

Project to modernize the X.org X11 server seems to actively court controversy​

Liam Proven
Tue 10 Jun 2025 7:00 UTC

The recently released Xlibre server aims to modernize the X.org X11 server and improve both its security and performance.

The XLibre Xserver is a fork of the X.org X server, started by long-term X.org maintainer Enrico Weigelt. The project aims to develop and improve the X.org display server, as an alternative to the newer and more fashionable Wayland display protocol.

We last mentioned Weigelt's work on improving X.org multimonitor support about a year ago. However, this was not his first appearance in the pages of The Register – back in 2021, Linus Torvalds rebuked him for spreading pseudo-scientific, anti-vaccination claims.

We suspect that such views will in fact appeal to some people, even if they are on the fringe of the FOSS world.

It is fair to say that Weigelt is no stranger to controversy, and this announcement is no different. The Reg FOSS desk has witnessed some remarkable levels of anti-X11 sentiment from Wayland proponents since the announcement… especially given that the subject under discussion is something as superficially trivial as the protocols that handle displaying Unix computers' graphical user interfaces. But, as we noted last month, ferociously passionate advocacy is a sad but inevitable aspect of software development.

We are confident this won't bother Weigelt a bit. In fact, the README file for X11Libre positively invites it, as it contains this:

"
It's explicitly free of any "DEI" [diversity, equity, and inclusion] or similar discriminatory policies.
"

Oh dear.

That statement, though, has received praise and approval in some places.

The same README states that the fork is a result of systematic attempts to suppress further development and improvement of the default FOSS X11 server:

"
That fork was necessary since toxic elements within Xorg projects, moles from BigTech, are boycotting any substantial work on Xorg, in order to destroy the project, to elimitate [sic] competition of their own products. Classic "embrace, extend, extinguish" tactics.

Right after first journalists began covering the planned fork Xlibre, on June 6th 2025, Redhat [sic] employees started a purge on the Xlibre founder's gitlab account on freedesktop.org: deleted the git repo, tickets, merge requests, etc, and so fired the shot that the whole world heared [sic].

"

Weigelt amplified these claims in an email to the xorg-devel mailing list. As far as we are able to see, the statement that his GitLab accounts have been deleted is true – for instance, this merge request says: "The source project of this merge request has been removed." His Freedesktop GitLab account now just says "This user is blocked" and most of his long list of merge requests have been summarily marked "closed."

His direct code contributions have faced pushback before as well. For instance, some of the comments on this change.

This vulture is conflicted. We deplore anti-vaxxer and other anti-science disinformation. Vaccines don't cause autism; they cause adults. Climate change is real, social justice is a good thing, and we are enthusiastically in favor of diversity, equity, and inclusion.

Thus we find it deeply ironic that at present, X11 is considerably better from an accessibility point of view than Wayland, which has a markedly poor track record here. As we have said recently, accessibility matters. Even if you're not disabled yet, you will be one day. Today, the desktops and apps that are most controllable by stodgy old-fashioned keyboard-centric user interfaces are ones like MATE and Xfce – which also means that it is the less-cool, older-style desktops that are more accessible. The environments driving Wayland adoption, such as GNOME and KDE Plasma, are still relatively weak in this area.

Wayland and the environments that natively support it boast some snazzy features such as adaptive sync and variable refresh rate support and High Dynamic Range displays, which we are sure are wonderful if you're a keen-eyed gamer in your 20s or 30s. This author is not, and despite 20:20 vision with glasses, is physically unable to perceive this sort of thing. That is one reason why we strongly prefer older desktops such as Xfce and Ubuntu's Unity, which also respects and follows the industry-standard user interface shunned by recent versions of GNOME and KDE.

As we have said before, we suspect this disconnect between younger, keener developers who don't know or care about late 20th century user interface standards or accessibility concerns, but who strongly want to junk what they perceive as legacy baggage, are behind the moves to deprecate and remove X11 – which is very much still going ahead.

The X.org X11 server itself began as a fork of XFree86, as The Register reported in 2004. Perhaps it's time it happened again. ®
 
But the desktop is well defended, and I bet the wayland shit could be roughly coincidental with chromebooks and android, and someone somewhere is defending existing desktops (or trying to make sure they could control it).
I'm really tired of FOSSfags blaming everyone else for the failure of desktop Linux when catastrophic internal dysfunction is the defining feature of the entire community. Microsoft or IBM don't have to lift a finger for autistic trannies to get into endless slapfights with each other over esoteric nonsense - they'll do that entirely on their own.
 
I'm really tired of FOSSfags blaming everyone else for the failure of desktop Linux when catastrophic internal dysfunction is the defining feature of the entire community. Microsoft or IBM don't have to lift a finger for autistic trannies to get into endless slapfights with each other over esoteric nonsense - they'll do that entirely on their own.
It is suspicious how the bigger nonsense has ties to Microsoft though
 
It is suspicious how the bigger nonsense has ties to Microsoft though
I once asked on the Farms for a good distro suggestion and got like three or four different responses. If the Linux fans can't put their heads together and just pick one to get behind for normie use here on the Farms its not Microsoft that's the problem.
 
Linux people love talking like that nigga who went "you like *cultural thing completely unrelated to niggerdom*? that is us", except Android is somehow not Linux-derived for them. But UNIX-type systems are, cause duuuuuh.
I literally saw one admit to having "linux-defending instinct". Cult-ass behavior.
 
Many years ago The Register was an excellent source of tech news written by passionate, knowledgeable journalists with the rarest of attributes amongst that group: integrity. Now it's pozzed bullshit pumped out unashamedly by shills like Proven.

El Reg really isn't what it used to be, and hasn't for a long time now. Friendly reminder they fell for the made-up Sneedacity assassination attempt, or rather, they didn't mind spreading obvious lies to get clicks.

It was excellent and my go to site (GoTo is unfairly maligned). It got bought out by some transatlantic group iirc and the change in coverage was notable. They got rid of Lewis Page who'd been the editor for sometime and was also a very good writer for the site. Especially on military matters as I think he had some background in the military of defence industry, I forget. Anyway, they legally gagged him from saying why he was let go but it wasn't hard to guess that I wasn't on board with some of the new political direction. They kept the look and feel and some of the other staff because they were smart enough to know that the British red-top tone was a selling point. But the angle they took on things notably gained more of an Atlantic Council view.

I stopped reading it years ago. It lost my trust. It used to be great.

Sorry I'm a dinosaur and just us debian so i dont follow the drama. Are redhats and ubuntus Wayland implementions semi closed, closed, or open source? I would assume discerning 3rd party autists would comb the git to find vulnerabilities nullifying the backdoor theory, unless they have their closed retard license rendition of wayland?

Everything feels like a gay initiative to track me, force prosumer computing to saas cloud abomination os thin client hell, or lock everything down/throttle.
Wayland is actually a protocol and architecture. So I think technically you could make closed source implementations. I don't know if there are any. The reference architecture is open source https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland

I've not followed the technical innards of the debate any more than is necessary to follow the politics of it. All I really know of Wayland is that on a Kubuntu system of mine I endlessly got little pop-up notifications about Wayland needing some weird reconfiguration that I eventually got rid of somehow.

Over the years what I saw was the sheer arrogance of Developers who had that "holier then Thou" mentality as they looked down @ window users.
There really ought to be some kind of archive of Linux zealots overreaching and making idiots of themselves. We had someone on this forum boldly claim how they couldn't do things they could do on Linux because Windows "didn't have a shell". The funniest thing is when a bunch of young Linux zealots get into an argument about it with an old UNIX/Linux user like me who also knows Windows fairly well and can actually debate them on it. I had someone trying to show me how Bash was better and I was having to correct their own Bash code.

I like Linux. I've used it longer than some posters on here have been alive. But the attitude is insufferable. Case in point, updates and privileges. If it's managed by a proper in-house team, then okay. But the general Linux distro attitude is to keep throwing updates at you all the fucking time. And they think this is good because "Linux gets patches faster than Windows". Lovely, meanwhile I'm stuck typing in my password to prompts every time I fucking power up because they think it's insecure to just have a permissions prompt or to wait five seconds before throwing a non-critical, non-security related package update at me. My Windows system bundles up everything for the second Tuesday of the month and learns when is a good out-of-hours time to apply the updates. More urgent security fixes are download out of band but their rare - most security stuff are just updated definition files and they happen in the background without reboots.

Yet, you keep hearing sneers from Linux zealots about "Windows keeps rebooting when you're trying to work" like it's the early 2000's.

The problem is they like being like this. Being a Windows user is rarely a part of someone's self-identity but for too many Linux users, it seems to be part of theirs.

Being "Windows friendly" in terms of look and feel really isn't that important. Look how quickly people adopted totally new computing paradigms in Android or iOS when there was a compelling reason to do so.

The much more pressing issue is that Windows runs all the software people want to use and Linux doesn't or at best does with much, much more hassle involved. The only compelling reason to change is some kind of philosophical convictions about your choice of operating system, which only faggy nerds have.
I agree it's not about the look and feel. But I don't think it's all about the software. There's a bunch that still wont run on Linux but for the most part you can do most mainstream things. Including game. I think what really holds Linux back from popular acceptance is the too many little niggles and stumbling blocks for ordinary users. Sometimes just quality of life things like the way I have to keep entering my password over and over I mentioned above which could easily take a Windows approach but which developers resist I think because it's seen as a Windows approach. Or things people just can't get past - like when I installed a Debian system earlier this year it didn't recognise the motherboard's networking hardware and couldn't progress. Okay, well I can go online on another system, download the driver and copy it onto the install media and direct it to the right file with the unintuitive name but to most people, perfectly intelligent people, they're just staring at a screen of random numbers and letters. There's just too much of that for adoption by people whose focus isn't on the actual computer but just using it as a tool. The old line is still true: Linux is only free if your time doesn't have a cost.

Phoronix has also launched this (Archive) banger of an article, truly great journalism...
Crap article by a person forced against their will to write it, but I'm getting a kick out of the comments. :D

It's free real estate.
Israeli hands typed this post!

I once asked on the Farms for a good distro suggestion and got like three or four different responses.
If you ask three different Linux users for the best distro, you'll get five different answers.
 
I miss the old El Reg.
*sigh*
We all do, mate. We all do. :(

A few doozies from the Phoronix "article". Some people dared to criticise it in the comments which has led to some, ah, rather strident replies... This Artim guy is posting angry replies all over the place. Wants the guy who forked X11 to be un-personed and mentally sectioned.

1750158796259.webp

This guy wants Weigelt's code contributions banned because he didn't agree with the Covid vaccinations.
1750158804342.webp

I can practically see the droplets of spittle collecting on the other side of my screen.
 
Where can I read on this?

This is a good timeline of events. There's more elsewhere on Daniel's blog but this is a good overview to start with. I whole heartedly believe that Debian may have been a nexus point (and maybe even the beginning of) Effective Altruism, the ideas the Zizian cult espoused and based their decisions on. I know it's just one viewpoint, but Daniel's blog is particularly enlightening, considering how many people have either disappeared or killed themselves after being the target of Debian leadership.


I had a pdf of some deep research done by chatgpt but I'll have to find and post it later.
 
Lovely, meanwhile I'm stuck typing in my password to prompts every time I fucking power up because they think it's insecure to just have a permissions prompt or to wait five seconds before throwing a non-critical, non-security related package update at me.
You know that Linux is nearly infinitely configurable, right?
You can turn off every password prompt, you can turn off every automatic update thing. Except for my one Raspberry Pi desktop nothing ever asks me for an update, and the only reason the Pi does is because I haven't yet clicked the button for that instead of whatever the black magic is to disable updates on Windows this week, which apparently gets ignored whenever Microsoft feels like pushing an "important" update. Oddly, the Pi's come out of the box configured for no password use,

But more important to this thread you can still use the superior X11 instead of Wayland.
 
  • Autistic
Reactions: George Lucas
here's a thing for the conspiritards - linux WON on the server, nothing even comes close, though Windows can be forced into it, nobody (even microsoft) really likes doing it. MacOS is a joke on the server. Big UNIX is dead.

But the desktop is well defended, and I bet the wayland shit could be roughly coincidental with chromebooks and android, and someone somewhere is defending existing desktops (or trying to make sure they could control it).
Linux works for the server because servers are maintained by system administrators who get paid for it. No such level of care exists for the desktop. Chromebooks and Android hardware has to be so locked down that it’s hardly usable in comparison to Windows or even OS X.
 
three different Linux users for the best distro, you'll get five different answers
Gentoo: dev
Debian: server
Mint: newbies
Arch: gaming
Redhat: corporate
Slackware: elite oldfag
OpenBSD: elite server

I would hope that anyone who cares about Linux would recommend distroes according to their use cases. Zealots, naturally, think "use the one I do".
 
Gentoo: dev
Debian: server
Mint: newbies
Arch: gaming
Redhat: corporate
Slackware: elite oldfag
OpenBSD: elite server

I would hope that anyone who cares about Linux would recommend distroes according to their use cases. Zealots, naturally, think "use the one I do".
Rocky: cheap corporate
Amazon Linux; rich corporate
Oracle Linux: soon to be poor corporate
Ubuntu: "Just say no"
H.J. Lu: get off my lawn
RaspberryOS: rich IOT
Armbian: poor IOT
Flatcar: "special" people
CoreOS: "special" corporate people
Alpine: why does a container need a full OS again?
 
You can turn off every password prompt, you can turn off every automatic update thing.
Well sure, I can. But I don't really want that. For the endless password prompting I still want it to check with me for permission if some script is doing something fundamental like messing with the installed packages, I just want it to be more of a prompt "are you sure?" like Windows has. I'm not sure if I can switch that in most distros. Maybe it's there as an option and I just never noticed it. For automatic updates, I don't want to turn them off - I want them to be properly bundled. And sure, I could write some cron task that just does them once a month but it's more complex than that. If something comes along that's an urgent patch, I want that to come down out of band. But how do I detect that in the repos specifically and writing a script that now does so is more complex than just some cron job.

I don't mean to say it can't be done. But it's a great example of how many Linux users just don't think about what is desirable for most users who aren't them. I could do these things probably, but it's very much not an out of the box realisation. It's frustrating because I remember when Vista came out which introduced a new security model (a much better one), I remember Linux users mocking it for its endless interrupting permissions pop-ups. I remember it because callow youth that I was, I was one of them. Now the very same thing is something that annoys me on nearly every distro.

Anyway, this is getting off-topic, my fault.
 
Glad to finally see this happen. Once you understand how xorg works. It's a wonder why some of its functionality isn't used more often for thin clients. Why display THE WHOLE DESKTOP as a video stream. when you can simply forward a single application and have it act like a native application with resizeable windows and what not.
 
Glad to finally see this happen. Once you understand how xorg works. It's a wonder why some of its functionality isn't used more often for thin clients. Why display THE WHOLE DESKTOP as a video stream. when you can simply forward a single application and have it act like a native application with resizeable windows and what not.
Doesn't it also mean that Linux could have some form of VMware Fusion where you can have windows applications mixed with your regular Linux app windows?
 
Doesn't it also mean that Linux could have some form of VMware Fusion where you can have windows applications mixed with your regular Linux app windows?
Depends. You can have x11 forwarding on your windows machine. And access Linux applications on there. Even as far as to have the taskbar as well. This has been around since the early 90's for windows. I don't believe there's an implementation that works the other way around. However kernel vm's are the closest I can conceptualize to what your asking. But requires a secondary GPU dedicated to displaying a full windows OS in another monitor via GPU passthrough iirc. I haven't paid attention to that section so I'm not sure if it's progressed to the point of being able to act like a native application without having to be separate from your distro. Last I remember there was a shitty workaround that let you use one GPU to swap to windows like your changing what terminal your on with your function keys.
 
Depends. You can have x11 forwarding on your windows machine. And access Linux applications on there. Even as far as to have the taskbar as well. This has been around since the early 90's for windows. I don't believe there's an implementation that works the other way around.
Windows Remote App lets the opposite happen. I'm pretty sure it's much more of a pain in the ass than "ssh -X" or "export DISPLAY" and setting the needed keys.
https://github.com/kimmknight/remoteapptool
And, obviously the Linux side will need an RDP client.
 
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