Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

[Grand Duke Snowfall]

Guess that was only a matter of time.

 

[FK009]

Guess that was only a matter of time.
View attachment 7547968

Wasn’t this known for months at this point?

 

[FK009]

I finally watched a few episodes of HB after reading this thread forever and now I feel qualified enough to share weird fanart with everyone else
View attachment 7547388
Yes, that's a head scar and broken horn. Yes, it means exactly what you think it does.

I hate that I instantly understood the reference

I won't lie, I still like that Jojo comic where it takes the piss on this premise.

Whats the comic referencing? I am legitimately curious at this point.

 

[Friendly Primarina]

Whats the comic referencing? I am legitimately curious at this point.

You can find the fan comic it's referencing here (NSFW)

 

[InJailOutSoon]

You know what I find to be really funny? When not only defenders but Viv herself say that you can only truly appreciate and enjoy Helluva Boss when the story is completely finished. Not only is that a weak way to deflect criticism (a bad episode is still a bad episode), but it actually works against Helluva Boss. The show is much worse and the flaws become way more noticeable when you watch the episodes all together. For example, the whole "love" that Stolas and Blitzø feel for each other just come out of complete nowhere all of sudden, and essentially the build up to it is happening in between the break of the first season's episode 6 and episode 7; not in the actual show itself.

 

[The tired cat]

You can find the fan comic it's referencing here (NSFW)

Yap thats the one, again dig the Jojo that was made as a response to this comic more.

 

[Niggerphobe]

Yap thats the one, again dig the Jojo that was made as a response to this comic more.

May I ask is it as bad as that comic

 

[The tired cat]

May I ask is it as bad as that comic

Nah, basically Blitzo runs into Josuke and mocks his hair, gets the shit kicked out of him and then Josuke heals Moxxies wound, while Blitzo is left in a body cast.

 

[Castoreum]

My husband and I were watching a new anime. A few episodes in, we discovered we got tricked into watching fujo bait. My husband just blurts out, "Man, you can just feel the fujo reluctance to world build." I laughed so hard cuz I thought of HB/HH.

You know what I find to be really funny? When not only defenders but Viv herself say that you can only truly appreciate and enjoy Helluva Boss when the story is completely finished. Not only is that a weak way to deflect criticism (a bad episode is still a bad episode), but it actually works against Helluva Boss. The show is much worse and the flaws become way more noticeable when you watch the episodes all together. For example, the whole "love" that Stolas and Blitzø feel for each other just come out of complete nowhere all of sudden, and essentially the build up to it is happening in between the break of the first season's episode 6 and episode 7; not in the actual show itself.

Ngl, that just sounds like a desperate attempt at retaining an audience that is hemorrhaging viewers.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

Ngl, that just sounds like a desperate attempt at retaining an audience that is hemorrhaging viewers.

If anything, it was the catalyst that started losing viewers. That, and episode 8 being stuck in production Hell.

 

[FK009]

You can find the fan comic it's referencing here (NSFW)

Thanks but I was more thinking of a TLDR of the premise. I would rather not read a comic that would make Lovecraft himself think the writer had issues.

 

[Friendly Primarina]

Thanks but I was more thinking of a TLDR of the premise. I would rather not read a comic that would make Lovecraft himself think the writer had issues.

Sorry, I handled it poorly.

Too late, now, but here's a TL:DR:
Artist Dracreloaded created a troll r34 comic in which Moxxie gets brain damage and Millie has to cope with caring for her now vulnerable husband. A different artist (lizards0ck) wanted to do "a gentler take on the Moxxie brain damage concept" (his words).

 

[GoodWinSon]

"a gentler take on the Moxxie brain damage concept"

Ah yes the classic "My spouse was reduced to a babbling, diaper wearing mess" trope. Perfect for wholesome family-friendly stories about killing Epstein and murder suicides.

 

[ssaneenah]

Whats the comic referencing? I am legitimately curious at this point.

Comic dump and Drac discussion start roughly pars this post.

 

[ChiliChumper]

Something that frustrates me about Vizzie, and creators like her, is how it just feels like they have all this talent and motivation, but seem to half ass everything.

Visually, I like her style. There are aspects of the show where I will give her her flowers and say she has creative ideas. I like her palettes. Some of her designs are unique and fun. She has a good grasp on her style and I'd be lying if, at the very least, it didn't draw me in. The show stands out.

What I can't fucking stand is her writing. It's damn near the exact same problem I had with stuff like the MCU; creative directors who don't know if they want to make something heavy and serious, or full of stupid quips and fart jokes. It's absolutely infuriating and all you get is a shitty jumbled mess that steps on it's own toes every 10 minutes, falling flat on it's face and breaking it's nose.

It's also so unbelievably obvious she panders to her fanbase of retarded, lonely Hot Topic womanchildren in the worst way possible, stuffing relationships and petty little romance drama and tragic backstories into characters who don't need them. Why does Fizzaroli, some gay little tertiary jester, feel like he has more development and relevance to the story than Millie? Why has it become the Blitzo and Stolas Ass Eating power hour? Woman what the fuck are you doing?

These exact same issues dragged down shows like Rick and Morty and Adventure Time. Shows that should've been stupid little romps to laugh at for teens and preteens respectively suddenly got torpedoed by this insistence to shoehorn in "mature topics" like a dysfunctional family, sexual consent, and "the complexities of relationship." What the fuck? Shut the fuck up, put the fries in the bag, and stop trying to be something you're not.

Equally hilarious when I think back to my childhood and consider all the media, MADE FOR KIDS, that handled heavy topics with tons of class. Land Before Time, Fox and the Hound, Bridge to Terabithia. And as far as adult animation, I don't even think South Park was this needlessly crass.

Her work, and the fanbase that cultivated it, just reek of people who want to be perceived as mature adults that discuss nuanced topics, but they just remind me of tumblr teens and kids on xbox who think topics like rape and running around screaming cock and faggot make them seem "grown -up."

I really hope, in her merger with Amazon, somebody will whoop her/her teams ass and right the ship, but I heavily doubt it.

 

[cryptidfuck]

you can only truly appreciate and enjoy Helluva Boss when the story is completely finished. Not only is that a weak way to deflect criticism (a bad episode is still a bad episode)

Counterexample: Avatar: The Last Airbender.

Remember Avatar Day?
Everyone hates Avatar Day. Second most-skipped episode after The Great Divide.
But you know? Even the FILLER EPISODES of Avatar do more legwork than any one episode of a Vivziepop IP.

At the very least, Avatar Day sets up that people can, and will, hate the Avatar for reasons beyond Aang's control. There's nothing he can do about it. It's life. Not everyone is going to love you right off the bat, especially if they're wary of past actions from you or your ancestors.

The Great Divide gives us insight into Aang's problem solving skills. Even if he's pulling shit out of his ass he makes it sound just believible enough to get by. He's smart with his words when he has to be, and can make up shit on the fly.

Vivziepop crumbles where Avatar shines: concrete worldbuilding that draws you into the world, solid character motivations that leave room for further development and (gasp) fun side adventures! Which I can assume, is what Viv wanted from her world. Something beloved and easily remembered. Characters doing wacky shit because "they're muh characters". Maybe set up the FUCKING WORLD FIRST?

My point is, even a beloved show has shit. But at least the shit is fun and makes attempts at giving people a reason to watch.
Vivziepop fails at basic storytelling and it's so disappointing to see play out at this scale. What are people getting attached to? What fictional world do you want to live in? Why? Flimsy writing destroys good stories .. not that Hazbin was ever good in the first place.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

What I can't fucking stand is her writing. It's damn near the exact same problem I had with stuff like the MCU; creative directors who don't know if they want to make something heavy and serious, or full of stupid quips and fart jokes. It's absolutely infuriating and all you get is a shitty jumbled mess that steps on it's own toes every 10 minutes, falling flat on it's face and breaking it's nose.

It's also so unbelievably obvious she panders to her fanbase of retarded, lonely Hot Topic womanchildren in the worst way possible, stuffing relationships and petty little romance drama and tragic backstories into characters who don't need them. Why does Fizzaroli, some gay little tertiary jester, feel like he has more development and relevance to the story than Millie? Why has it become the Blitzo and Stolas Ass Eating power hour? Woman what the fuck are you doing?

Vivziepop crumbles where Avatar shines: concrete worldbuilding that draws you into the world, solid character motivations that leave room for further development and (gasp) fun side adventures! Which I can assume, is what Viv wanted from her world. Something beloved and easily remembered. Characters doing wacky shit because "they're muh characters". Maybe set up the FUCKING WORLD FIRST?

My point is, even a beloved show has shit. But at least the shit is fun and makes attempts at giving people a reason to watch.
Vivziepop fails at basic storytelling and it's so disappointing to see play out at this scale. What are people getting attached to? What fictional world do you want to live in? Why? Flimsy writing destroys good stories .. not that Hazbin was ever good in the first place.

I am reminded by something my scriptwriting teacher once told a class: because a lot of people know how to write, many try to be writers; only a few are actually good at it.

 

[FK009]

I am reminded by something my scriptwriting teacher once told a class: because a lot of people know how to write, many try to be writers; only a few are actually good at it.

The worst part is when the people that aren’t good at it still go all in and flounder trying to make it. It’s depressing to hear and read about on blogs. Doesn’t help that thanks to fanfiction, some people actually think that because some bozos liked their work online, that they can pursue a writing career, and then they wonder why their shit manuscript isn’t getting picked up.

I remember taking a few writing classes in college(One based professor said that most of us would not be writers, but we were more than welcomed to send him our published books if we decided to prove him wrong), because I was in STEM they required us to take some form of other classes. I was adequate, enjoyed it, and my family, the liberal members at least, said that I should give it a try if I had the passion. (My conservative aunt said that if I did pursue the written word, to have a day job to pay the bills because many of the greats did not make it big until after they were cold in the ground) I said to them that I had the heart of a writer, the soul of a writer, the issue was I didn’t have the talent of one (that and I’m a straight white christian male, no publisher would touch me) Instead I went the corporate STEM route, and I impart my knowledge to others: know yourself, and know how good you really are, then act accordingly.

If there is one toxic thing that needs to be tempered in today’s age, its the follow your dreams message. Too often, there are people that do so and end up in a dark place. For every Viv, Glitch, and Lackadaisy, there’s 1000000 Johns and Janes that weren’t so lucky

 

[ChiliChumper]

The worst part is when the people that aren’t good at it still go all in and flounder trying to make it. It’s depressing to hear and read about on blogs. Doesn’t help that thanks to fanfiction, some people actually think that because some bozos liked their work online, that they can pursue a writing career, and then they wonder why their shit manuscript isn’t getting picked up.

I remember taking a few writing classes in college(One based professor said that most of us would not be writers, but we were more than welcomed to send him our published books if we decided to prove him wrong), because I was in STEM they required us to take some form of other classes. I was adequate, enjoyed it, and my family, the liberal members at least, said that I should give it a try if I had the passion. (My conservative aunt said that if I did pursue the written word, to have a day job to pay the bills because many of the greats did not make it big until after they were cold in the ground) I said to them that I had the heart of a writer, the soul of a writer, the issue was I didn’t have the talent of one (that and I’m a straight white christian male, no publisher would touch me) Instead I went the corporate STEM route, and I impart my knowledge to others: know yourself, and know how good you really are, then act accordingly.

If there is one toxic thing that needs to be tempered in today’s age, its the follow your dreams message. Too often, there are people that do so and end up in a dark place. For every Viv, Glitch, and Lackadaisy, there’s 1000000 Johns and Janes that weren’t so lucky

I don't want to get too metaphysical, but I've always felt that part of this stems from the fact that alot of modern audiences, but specifically artists, do not respect writing.
Art is just sooooo hard. You have to learn so much. You have to draw so many sketches and have to slave away countless hours on shitty doodles to improve your craft. Do you know how much time I've put into this?
Writing? Any monkey could write. "It's just words." "How hard could it be." There's this really serious and frustrating sense of smugness and condescension I see from alot of people who are good at art/drawing/etc. Because, at least to some degree, the words are already there. You aren't making anything new you're just rearranging them in a different way. Fuck prose. Fuck style. Fuck subtle literary symbolism, motifs, and nuance narratives and dialogues. I'll just get ChatGPT to do it! It's just letters and words!

And I feel that sort of thinking have created these fart-sniffing dipshits like Vizzie who DO have some level of talent with art, but think that that automatically makes them able to know how to write a good, solid story and characters.

What's worse is that alot of the audience of these types of people absolutely validate that sort of thinking. Who cares if the writing sucks! Look at the pretty pictures move! Look at the colors!

Alot of these kids and 20-30somethigns masquerading as adults wouldn't know good writing if it bit them right in the ass. They engage with slop like A Court of Thorns and Roses and think that's the pinnacle of literature. Fuck these simpletons.

 

[Outer Space Traveller]

And I feel that sort of thinking have created these fart-sniffing dipshits like Vizzie who DO have some level of talent with art, but think that that automatically makes them able to know how to write a good, solid story and characters.

What's worse is that alot of the audience of these types of people absolutely validate that sort of thinking. Who cares if the writing sucks! Look at the pretty pictures move! Look at the colors!

Alot of these kids and 20-30somethigns masquerading as adults wouldn't know good writing if it bit them right in the ass. They engage with slop like A Court of Thorns and Roses and think that's the pinnacle of literature. Fuck these simpletons.

Good point. Worldbuilding is necessary and I would risk saying it is something you got to have done before you even have your story ready. At the very least, where the story takes place.

I will give an ounce of credit on the team: I believe Vivianne did write about Hell and Heaven. She needed to flesh it, and how it would affect our world. Furthermore, does it work as a "Alice In Wonderland"/Narnia setpiece? Meaning, parallel world to ours, where there's interactibility? Of course. But what about humans who want to access Hell and do things in it? Take a concept from Doom, where Argent D' Nur, where you have a hellish landscape. Using "demonic" energy to solve an energy crisis on Earth. There is potential.

Even if it seems "boring", the writing has to be developed. I'm sure on GRRM's case, he didn't have Essos done by the time A Game of Thrones was published - just Westeros and the Free Cities of the Narrow Sea. "Essos" got its name only after A Feast of Crows was released, by 2008. So there is some leeway here and there. Yet you must absolutely need to have cultures, ideas and certain things laid down, even if you want to do "L.A. but gayer and written by a fujoshi".