Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

Do you believe that this series will turn to shit?


  • Total voters
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Alot of these kids and 20-30somethigns masquerading as adults wouldn't know good writing if it bit them right in the ass. They engage with slop like A Court of Thorns and Roses and think that's the pinnacle of literature. Fuck these simpletons.
Want to know how my Prof knew some of us weren’t going to make is as writers? Most girls in the class fucking LOVED Harry Potter, thought it was amazing. He all but said ‘Y’all need to read better books’. I tried reading HP for the first time recently, and cringed at the opening, the prose was so bad. It is almost criminal that JKR has made billions off of HP, but I can’t blame a woman for cashing in on an idea. I can’t help but feel like it’s Lord of the Rings a bit, as the movies did bring in a much wider audience than the books alone.

But it’s not only that they think it’s easy, they truly think that they are good at it. And from limited attempts I’ve made, I can’t think of anything harder, you need to constantly be asking why X is the way X is or why would Y do Z in moment W. Writing can be easier when you’re in a group, but still damn hard. In my school days, I’ve seen teammates get swelled heads because they added something good, to someone else’s idea, and thought they were the gift to the team. No, Person A gave us the base, you just added a wall, you were able to improve what was there, you did not come up with the entire idea.

It’s why I tacitly respect Viv and people like Thomas Austruc, they may be shitty writers, BUT they can come up with a good base. If they got someone more detailed oriented to iron out the finer details, and weren’t such huge ideologues that needed spread their shit ideas, likely these threads wouldn’t exist.
 
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If there is one toxic thing that needs to be tempered in today’s age, its the follow your dreams message. Too often, there are people that do so and end up in a dark place. For every Viv, Glitch, and Lackadaisy, there’s 1000000 Johns and Janes that weren’t so lucky
It's definitely a mix of luck, talent, luck, money, and luck. You got to be in the right place at the right time with the right thing. And it will usually take multiple tries to achive that. It's just that most people don't have the luxury to spend the time and money to even get such a chance. Especially nowadays, since the market is oversaturated with everyone trying to be the next big thing.
 
It's definitely a mix of luck, talent, luck, money, and luck. You got to be in the right place at the right time with the right thing. And it will usually take multiple tries to achive that. It's just that most people don't have the luxury to spend the time and money to even get such a chance. Especially nowadays, since the market is oversaturated with everyone trying to be the next big thing.
Exactly this, especially with the Luck and Money aspect. Someone talented can easily be overlooked, or will need to turn to something else, because well, life is life, and people to need to actually survive and produce something that people will buy. And publishers don’t care about talent, because like JKR showed, hell like, 50 Shades showed, you apparently don’t need to be talented be successful, you just need the right idea.
 
Part of the problem is that people like Viv see characters as dolls and stories as playing pretend with extra steps. They don't care about who their characters are as people, they just want to act out the same drama over and over again. To them, that's fun, even when it's not. Worldbuilding can be boring and tedious, especially to anyone uninterested in how worlds evolve. It's the story behind the story (which is why I can see why people like deepest lore to some extent). Researching Ars Goetia and voodoo doesn't mean a whole lot when you can't tie that information together, or you just ignore it once it gets inconvenient. So why not just make it LA and call it a day? That way, you have a perfectly functional doll house.

They don't really think or care about writing because, ultimately, they don't have anything to say. There are plenty of artists who respect writing as a craft (Genndy Tartakovsky, Brad Bird, etc), but they understand that ideas aren't just visual. They know that a subtle glance can communicate intent, like a highlight communicates light direction, or that foils can communicate ideas like values communicate space and form. Some people have a harder time with this transition, or vice versa, because that's just how people are wired. Others don't care, and they don't have to. Some think they never will, until they find that no one wants to play with them anymore because they made their stories too empty.
 
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I tried reading HP for the first time recently, and cringed at the opening, the prose was so bad. It is almost criminal that JKR has made billions off of HP, but I can’t blame a woman for cashing in on an idea.
The one point I'll say is that it IS a series for children and preteens. I think on that front it's perfectly serviceable. The problem more stems from people usually women, cough cough who never progress past Harry Potter. You can see it in my aforementioned disdain for A Court of Thorns and Roses by Sarah Maas. You dislike Harry Potter? Try Harry Potter written by a white horny wine aunt. And people women eat this shit up. It was flying off the shelves at my local bookstore.

Vizzie's feels like she's in a similar boat. She never grew from the standpoint of literary knowledge.

Part of the problem is that people like Viv see characters as dolls and stories as playing pretend with extra steps.
You put this perfectly. You know what really cheeses me off about Helluva Boss? How genuinely schizophrenic and distracted the writing feels.

It's like you make a character or some little group, so you say okay I'll write a story about them. And then smack dab in the middle of the story you go "nah, I'm bored with this now, I want to play with this new toy now." It really feels like that's what she did with characters like Stolas and Fizz. She noticed the positive attention they were getting so she made them the focus. Or oops ya know what, I want to play with Millie now so let's just randomly make her pregnant, because that's new and exciting. It's like of halfway through Lord of the Rings, Tolkien said "nah fuck Frodo, fuck the Fellowship, let's talk about Galadriel's sex life for the rest of the book."

What's even lamer is that you absolutely can hop perspectives/focus among your characters. Lots of books and shows do it. It makes the world feel bigger and more alive, and that your main characters don't exist in a narrative vacuum.

Not with Vizzie. As you said it's all just dolls to her. She picks them up and puts them down not to flesh out the world or her grander ideas.

No she just get's fucking bored.
 
people usually women, cough cough who never progress past Harry Potter
Yeah, there’s a reason the Prof wasn’t putting bets on any in his class making it. Fun guy though. The girls thought it had great world building, so I asked them to explain the magic system, the exact world building, anything, and I became the most hated guy in the class. What is it with chicks and Hogwarts?

A Court of Thorns and Roses, is it bad in the sense that you literally can’t read it, or bad in the sense of HB/HH and it’s a slow motion train wreck you can’t look away from?
Not with Vizzie. As you said it's all just dolls to her. She picks them up and puts them down not to flesh out the world or her grander ideas.

No she just get's fucking bored.
Honestly, if this wasn’t backed by an actual company, I wonder if these would have ended up like Zoophobia.
 
Well, this ought to be interesting. I'll admit that the hatedom for this show can be just as unhinged as the fandom, but I'm also curious to know if Sai actually thinks that Helluva Boss is a good show or not.

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I'm already not liking this video and it hasn't even premiered yet. How many dollars you bet her "homophobic" takes are her reasonable criticisms, or better yet, her daring to question that Stolitz is an unforgivably toxic relationship that became one of the major reasons behind the show's decline in popularity and relevancy that even the most dedicated, strongest Stolitz soldiers are starting to agree upon? Criticizing the ship that made many people leave the show is not "homophobic". Is she homophobic because she's not glazing Stolitz to the high seas? Is she homophobic because she dare to say anything mean about poor, dindu-nuffin wrong Stolas? Is she homophobic because of her complaints about him prioritizing an imp he only sees through a sexual and then manipulative lense over his daughter numerous times? Heck if I know.

I've watched through Artiece's HB videos. They weren't just blatant hatred for the show (at least, at first) but slowly did become such a thing by the time Seaosn 2 ended. Yeah, the hatedom for the show is as ridiculous and filled with easily sensitive genderspecials like with the defenders, but at least over here in KF, we can all express our anger and straight up exhaustion with the show without being dogpiled for it. The hatedom outside of KF is the opposite of that, really.

And we all know that "Unhinged queen" just translates to "She crashed out about the show prioritizing an unnecessary ship over an actual, engaging story and world.". Assuming here, though. We'll see in six hours on what her opinions are in the rant. I have a strong feeling she's either gonna defend the show till no end or don't like the show but
 
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Well, this ought to be interesting. I'll admit that the hatedom for this show can be just as unhinged as the fandom, but I'm also curious to know if Sai actually thinks that Helluva Boss is a good show or not.
I'm subbed to this lady (not Sai, the tiger furry*) on YT, and she released a vid about Juneteenth recently where she bitched in the comments that other people aren't allowed to criticize the video because it's a space for BLACK people and BLACK people NEED representation in media blah blah blah.
 
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I'm subbed to this lady on YT, and she released a vid about Juneteenth recently where she bitched in the comments that other people aren't allowed to criticize the video because it's a space for BLACK people and BLACK people NEED representation in media blah blah blah.
Okay, so this makes
>her
opinion automatically discarded.
 

Well, this ought to be interesting. I'll admit that the hatedom for this show can be just as unhinged as the fandom, but I'm also curious to know if Sai actually thinks that Helluva Boss is a good show or not.
I watched this youtuber sometimes and they're really good at shitting on lily orchard but i've seen random glimpses of them defending vivzie midway and spouting top quotes like "Lucifer is an amazing depiction of realistic autism" and it felt like they're just a retard looking smart by punching an easy target.

I expect a lot of "ahem, media literacy???", "stolas is too deep for you" and "the haters are homophobic acshually".

Also, i searched that name and apparently i already watched ArtieceTB videos.


I don't remember the exact video but i think she actually liked the show until full moon and stolas for being a hypocrite and remember her criticisms being reasonable.

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Saying stella was wasted? YIKES! That is not allowed in this fandom sweetie. You're getting the premium homophobic card and the trump voter accusations for this one.

Okay, so this makes
>her
opinion automatically discarded.

It's a """Her""" too oh no...
 
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I'm already not liking this video and it hasn't even premiered yet. How many dollars you bet her "homophobic" takes are her reasonable criticisms, or better yet, her daring to question that Stolitz is an unforgivably toxic relationship that became one of the major reasons behind the show's decline in popularity and relevancy that even the most dedicated, strongest Stolitz soldiers are starting to agree upon? Criticizing the ship that made many people leave the show is not "homophobic". Is she homophobic because she's not glazing Stolitz to the high seas? Is she homophobic because she dare to say anything mean about poor, dindu-nuffin wrong Stolas? Is she homophobic because of her complaints about him prioritizing an imp he only sees through a sexual and then manipulative lense over his daughter numerous times? Heck if I know.

I've watched through Artiece's HB videos. They weren't just blatant hatred for the show (at least, at first) but slowly did become such a thing by the time Seaosn 2 ended. Yeah, the hatedom for the show is as ridiculous and filled with easily sensitive genderspecials like with the defenders, but at least over here in KF, we can all express our anger and straight up exhaustion with the show without being dogpiled for it. The hatedom outside of KF is the opposite of that, really.

And we all know that "Unhinged queen" just translates to "She crashed out about the show prioritizing an unnecessary ship over an actual, engaging story and world.". Assuming here, though. We'll see in six hours on what her opinions are in the rant. I have a strong feeling she's either gonna defend the show till no end or don't like the show but
I watched this youtuber sometimes and they're really good at shitting on lily orchard but i've seen random glimpses of them defending vivzie midway and spouting top quotes like "Lucifer is an amazing depiction of realistic autism" and it felt like they're just a retard looking smart by punching an easy target.

I expect a lot of "ahem, media literacy???", "stolas is too deep for you" and "the haters are homophobic acshually".
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This doesn't look promising. Come on Sai. You have to admit that in season 1 "mincing predatory gay man" was what Stolas was.
 
I've heard about Sai, and after doing a bit of browsing, she seems to lump anyone who despises and/or critiques the show(s) into the "hatedom" category. Some of the people I've seen her talk about actually aren't that bad and bring up very valid points discussed here on the farms. They do like the show, but they have gripes with the weird sudden shift to gay drama and disjointed storyline that many rightfully have reason to criticize or comment on. You can argue some of these people are just regular fans or average viewers that wanna throw their two cents in. Some are notably different in comparison to the rabid Vivzie glazers and rabid hate crowd. Sai is just some bitter 40+ woman child that's honestly just as retarded as the hatedom at times.
 
A Court of Thorns and Roses, is it bad in the sense that you literally can’t read it, or bad in the sense of HB/HH and it’s a slow motion train wreck you can’t look away from?
Bad in the sense of everyone and their mother was telling me, as a fantasy/fiction enjoyer that it was a "Must Read" and it's just horny fujoslop wish fulfillment by a white woman in her 40s.

Not for nothing, I get it. I've read plenty of corny fanfiction.

But those people are amateurs, so how much hate can I really throw?

But once you reach the level of someone like Vizzie or Sarah Maas, dammit you should want to do better. Not just for your audience but for yourself.

They don't care. Because fujoslop sells.
 
Then you have those missing the forest through the trees like in the chicken flu episode of Boondocks. You got comments saying, "This is just like COVID!" only to miss the important detail of how the government and media will whip people up into a panic over something that is not as deadly as it's made to be.
This even happened in the 90s with an episode of Babylon 5.
You mean, two-to-three years ago after Trump already had his four-year presidential run and was still relevant in the media, because the democrats allowed him to?
It's relevant the same way RWBY doing a 2016 election allegory in late 2019 was revenant.
Good point. Worldbuilding is necessary and I would risk saying it is something you got to have done before you even have your story ready. At the very least, where the story takes place.

I will give an ounce of credit on the team: I believe Vivianne did write about Hell and Heaven. She needed to flesh it, and how it would affect our world. Furthermore, does it work as a "Alice In Wonderland"/Narnia setpiece? Meaning, parallel world to ours, where there's interactibility? Of course. But what about humans who want to access Hell and do things in it? Take a concept from Doom, where Argent D' Nur, where you have a hellish landscape. Using "demonic" energy to solve an energy crisis on Earth. There is potential.

Even if it seems "boring", the writing has to be developed. I'm sure on GRRM's case, he didn't have Essos done by the time A Game of Thrones was published - just Westeros and the Free Cities of the Narrow Sea. "Essos" got its name only after A Feast of Crows was released, by 2008. So there is some leeway here and there. Yet you must absolutely need to have cultures, ideas and certain things laid down, even if you want to do "L.A. but gayer and written by a fujoshi".
It's why I believe that of all shows, Thomas the Tank Engine has better worldbuilding then the Hellaverse because its creator gave a shit about the world.

The stories started when Wilbert Awdry needed to entertain his sick son, but because he knew so much about trains, he applied his knowledge to the stories. When an illustrator for his books drew one engine inconsistently, he worked that into a story by having that design lead to said engine have trouble functioning. Real-life engines like the Flying Scotsman were turned into characters and were treated like celebrities. When real-life railways started to use diesel engines in the 50s, he worked that into the worldbuilding by establishing Sodor as a safe haven for steam engines.

Awdry didn't have to acknowledge the drawing error or real-world events, but he chose to because he cared about fleshing out his world. He wanted the Island of Sodor to feel like a real place that operates like any other railway... even if said railway only had talking engines, coaches, freight cars, and breakvans.

With Viv, she clearly doesn't know a lot about Christianity or the dichotomy between Heaven and Hell other than how pop culture depicts them, which is why the worldbuilding falls so flat in her show.
Lucifer is an amazing depiction of realistic autism
Oh yeah, I'm sure autistic people feel super represented by the literal devil being like them.
 
I've heard about Sai, and after doing a bit of browsing, she seems to lump anyone who despises and/or critiques the show(s) into the "hatedom" category. Some of the people I've seen her talk about actually aren't that bad and bring up very valid points discussed here on the farms. They do like the show, but they have gripes with the weird sudden shift to gay drama and disjointed storyline that many rightfully have reason to criticize or comment on. You can argue some of these people are just regular fans or average viewers that wanna throw their two cents in. Some are notably different in comparison to the rabid Vivzie glazers and rabid hate crowd. Sai is just some bitter 40+ woman child that's honestly just as retarded as the hatedom at times.
"Woman"child indeed, there has to be a joke somewher about creators who mock lilty orchard or mr enterman manage to be even worse or more autistic about a different cartoon for children.

It's not like Artiece is someone who deserves mockery like lily too, it's a random small youtuber with reasonable takes so attacking their content live people your fans asked is a low blow. Her content seems politically progressive sure it seems positive while the majority of Sai's content is shitting on Lily orchard or drama.

If anything Sai is the cringy obcessed hater here.

If the hatedom is so cringe, why is it so fun to shitpost in this thread?
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