Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

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Do you believe that this series will turn to shit?


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Finally seriously watched all of 7 and 8. If the prior eps were worse, holy fucking shit, that might explain why these seem good. Admittedly, I only skimmed those.

The pacing, total lack of breathing space, and the Cocoamelon level rushing sucked all weight out of most of both episodes. Alastor cursing is ridiculous to me. Deus Ex Lucifer (lol) is "Huh? Why wasn't he there in the first place?" If there's a good reason, or even a retarded one with rubber ducks, that warrants being shown since Hell was invaded but resisted.

Lucifer is Jerry, and Alastor is Rick. There, I said it.

Vaggie being trained to fight by a damned overlord who seems more like a sagely teacher than a damned overlord (WHO HAS KIDS?!) was odd. If you want to go with uwu misunderstood overlords then it needs to be leaned into and shown, not just told with a single dance number. Carmine sings well at least, and her deep female voice is jarringly better than Vaggie's. I'm also a sucker for Spanish music so hey. I never saw Vaggie train the other people in the hotel how to fight the way Carmine trained her, but then again, I doubt anyone involved has ever taken a fist that wasn't twisted up their ass after huffing poppers.

Juxtaposing "you have an X over your eye and an angel spear, it's not rocket science" with "I HAD NO IDEA ROSIE WAHH!" was jarring. The pinkie joke being done, but not making a pun about actual food like ladyfingers was missing an obvious joke, and of course neither Vaggie nor Angel were there to take the layup. Charlie singing to make Susan not be a bitch was also weird. Why does Susan matter so much, again?

Charlie seems to be a childish ditz, like she's a kid, not a sheltered young adult noble, or even a sheltered young adult woman who isn't Hell's nobility. She's a worse case of the problem that Piper had in Orange Is The New Black, and even looks and sounds a bit like her to boot. Fucking Hell. [Angeldust oneliner goes here]

Charlie toting a shield and sprinkling glitter in the eyes of those that have killed her people is jaw dropping. "Sorry!" was grating, not funny. It took her so long to actually get serious, like she never had to really fight anyone in Hell. Her forgotten? razzle and dazzle finally show up, only for Vaggie's mount [Angeldust oneliner goes here] to get smacked down instantly. Also, she was dressed in something one would expect to be worn for her partner, not a battlefield. Nobody seemed afraid. Adam oneshotting Pent like a trash mob would have made me mad had I paid to watch this.

Lucifer turning into a MLP to clown on Adam was actually funny but it is probably self aware shit to get more fandumbz. All the forgiveness shown is a "wtf". I'd expect some decisiveness given the weight of what was going on, but there never was any weight to it.
Everything is terribly light and zany and paced like Viv'z idea of high comedy is The Room.

A decently competent mid level DnD party does fantasy fights much better, but most viewers will not care, and that would be over their heads anyway. The composition and animation was fun, but nobody making the show seems to have any real concept of how a fight flows, never mind organized violence with extremely high stakes in a pitched battle. Everyone in the open, no layered defenses, no cover, no fortification, just Hell's fucking princess throwing glitter, wearing lingerie in a fight to save her people, forgetting she has her magic goat monsters. On top of that, for some reason, the exterminators didn't come for all of Pride, they just had a few dozen girlscouts in dressup with masks on, instead of the wanton destruction the pilot implied.

I don't think Vivz is out of her depth, I think this is kiddie-pool stuff for kiddie-pool viewers, made by someone who wears water wings in ankle depe water, which is fine. I was hoping the setting would make this "adult animation" and not "CN but no censors exist, but somehow not Adult Swim tier" but this is Vivz we're talking about. She's so impeceptive she still has that pedophile villain OC donut steel out on the internet that looks like a less scene version of her own self insert which is just hispter Charlie. Oh yeah, kiddie pools.


It's very obvious Vivz has vanishingly little experience doing adult things as an adult, and I don't mean sex. I mean living and having intimate friendships and bonding with other people and venting and sharing one's feelings. Given the weight of all of this, there should be plenty to go around. You don't see weighty scenes in HH with room to breathe and people sharing emotions and worries over drinks in a bar, or walking around the wasteland of hell, or their rooms; you just see these cartoonish, childish leaps from scene to scene to push the plot while the characters are suffocated by the pacing and lack of space.

tl;dr, it's red-tinted store brand gravity falls with cursing, rape, and rape jokes. There's potential, but my fucking god, stop letting Vivz write her character designs. Stuff that would lend itself for skullduggery, backgroom things, sneaky backstabbing, intrigue, etc, at least in my mind, is instead very out in the open and is so cartoonish everything has the weight of a helium balloon. Oh hi Mark.

Zen moment: I think Brandon's Katie line at the end of ep 8 was entirely actual spite.
 
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The pilot actors were mid in both aspects.
You can say that and be right.
But they were good enough than professionally trained, legit musical performers are trying and largely failing to replicate those performances. It's like that meme of SpongeBob beating Neptune with one krabby patty because he actually knows how to do it. Pay attention to how you didn't say the current VAs were good or even mentioned them outside of being misused. It's appropriate that this show is based in hell because it not only sold its indie lustre, it sold its soul. Could've used the money it took to hire Broadway people to pay the animators tho.
 
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Another thing, Sir Pentious didn't do anything special to deserve Heaven other than being in the line of fire at the wrong time and it wasn't even a sacrifice, he contributed as much or less than the other residents meaning that anyone who died there in battle could have gone to Heaven.

even the cannibals who went into battle to fight for others they don't even know, agreeing to die for a cause they have no reason to believe in and if Cahrlie's speech is any indication it's possible that some of them have tried to redeem themselves in the 1 month they were training.

I imagine there should be more demons going to Heaven, but what do I know?
 
And all that sass and bravado Velvette showed on RESPECTLESS song was entirely non existant, when at the time of truth, she was another expectator cuddling on pajamas glued to her phone as usual.
She didnt do shit with the knowledge she found out after being her the one pushing to ignite conflict with the angels during the overlords meeting.
LMFAO what a nothingburger of a character.
Also, in regards why sir Pentious still a snek in heaven, recall Angel Dust's sister still a spider up there smh
 
Posting this here because I think it's an extremely gemmy idea.
A soyteen from /mtv/ suggested making an "Abridged" version of all of the episodes with the faggotry being downplayed to make it bearable.
View attachment 5683890
The last time an abridged series tried to improve upon the original show it was Sword Art Online abridged and it was somehow worse than the original.
 
You can say that and be right.
But they were good enough than professionally trained, legit musical performers are trying and largely failing to replicate those performances. It's like that meme of SpongBob beating Neptune with one krabby patty because he actually knows how to do it. Pay attention to how you didn't say the current VAs were good or even mentioned them outside of being misused. It's appropriate that this show is based in hell because it not only sold its indie lustre, it sold its soul. Could've used the money it took to hire Broadway people to pay the animators tho.
Once again VAs have a role in an animated musical, and musical talent has another role. The musical talent did great as musical talent. Attempting to cast musical talent as VAs doesn't always work out especially when the VA has a distinct voice. The thing I still don't understand was why they replaced Charlie and Alaster, as they were average in both departments, but charming in a way the fans really enjoyed.

Another thing, Sir Pentious didn't do anything special to deserve Heaven other than being in the line of fire at the wrong time and it wasn't even a sacrifice, he contributed as much or less than the other residents meaning that anyone who died there in battle could have gone to Heaven.

even the cannibals who went into battle to fight for others they don't even know, agreeing to die for a cause they have no reason to believe in and if Cahrlie's speech is any indication it's possible that some of them have tried to redeem themselves in the 1 month they were training.

I imagine there should be more demons going to Heaven, but what do I know?
Sir Pentious was certain he would be sacrificing himself but did so anyway out of love for both the people he cared about and his lifelong enemy who he forgave in his last moments. It was that decision which got him into heaven. Not the outcome from that choice.
 
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The thing I still don't understand was why they replaced Charlie and Alaster, as they were average in both departments, but charming in a way the fans really enjoyed.
Because Viv wanted Broadway performers and each passing day it becomes more obvious that the OG cast were just placeholders until she could skip to something better. Is literally that simple. The current cast can sing but some of them either don't care or can't perform the music, ergo the thing that makes a musical a musical, but I'm more willing to blame the lyricists for that.
 
Well...that was shit.

I'm sorry, maybe it's because I'm tired of this nothing-burger show, but I don't have many positives to say. I feel like I would have liked episode 7 and 8 better if I felt like it was earned, but it wasn't. Everytime an emotional beat is hit, I feel barely anything because there was no buildup. I guess I can say that I'm glad Huskerdust didn't happen? I mean, it will probably happen in season 2, but at least it wasn't shoehorned in for this season. The songs are better, even if I'm jumpscared everytime they start. And the animation for the finale was the best out of all the episodes, but that's because of it being mostly done by Spindlehorse instead of outsourcing to Bento Box's usual animation studio. And I did let out a chuckle for a few jokes. So, there's that.

I may need to watch it again (or not, because I don't really want to) but did Lucifer say he not only fucked Adam's first wife (Lilith) but also his second wife (Eve) while they were fighting? Cause if that's true then...damn. No wonder Adam is salty. Also, the little smile he had towards Lute was cute when he took his final breath. Thanks for giving a bit of sympathy to Adam I guess. Better than most of the main characters.

Except Sir Pentious, but we probably won't see him a lot in season 2, unless we get more screentime in Heaven. I feel so sorry for people who have no prior knowledge of Hazbin Hotel, cause there's just so many things that never get explained. Like the whole fact that Cherri and Pentious were rivals. There established relationship was never shown, so the buildup to something romantic between them is just...not there.

Anyway, can't wait for season 2 with even more shit pacing since it will probably also only be 8 episodes long. I have...no idea what the plan is; except for the whole Lilith/Eve/Rosie plot that will be happening.
 
I liked cannibal town, Charlie finally got a group to go along with her musical numbers (even if their lyrics are a bit too violent for her tastes). Rosie feels like she needs a little more twang in her voice, but that's probably the closest voice actor they could afford. The fight/dance between Vaggie and Camilla was weird, but the music was nice.

The angels in the battle scene were wildly inconsistent. They had no reaction to the fact that they could be killed, and the number of angels seemed to wildly vary from scene to scene.

Niffty was hilarious as usual, and her sneak attack on Adam had my laughing out loud. I wonder what Sir Pentius will do in heaven? Will they let him visit Charlie or keep him a secret?

Not looking forward to another four years before season 2 tho
 
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Sir Pentious was certain he would be sacrificing himself but did so anyway out of love for both the people he cared about and his lifelong enemy who he forgave in his last moments. It was that decision which got him into heaven. Not the outcome from that choice.
"livelong enemy"? No, they met in the pilot for the first time and Cherri didn't show up at the hotel for 5 months, their relationship is based on fanwork and nothing else, his love is empty because there's no build up.
also "Forgave"? what exactly? She doesn't owe him anything, he invaded her territory and they fought and that's it.

If sacrificing your life for such a shallow reason guarantees a place in Heaven then the cannibals deserve it too, they are fighting for complete strangers in a fight that is not theirs which is much more noble than only fighting for people you care.

Edit:Egg bois also die, but they're not in heaven and you won't convince me that they didn't love Sir P enough to give their lives to him.
 
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So some thoughts
-Vaggie's VA cannot Voice Act at all. Holy fuck, bitch take some benzos or some shit to make you actually sound enthusiastic
-Absolute zero-room for any emotional beats to set in, literally just skip to the next scene, no time to let emotional moments sink in
-Rosie was the last likeable character in this entire show
Overall I thought this whole experience was just 'okay', albeit the more I sit down and really think about it, the more I end up hating the entire premise of it.
But I cannot fathom to think what a fan of HH would think if after 4 long years of this show's development, hype levels completely through the roof, only to be met with an end product riddled with pacing issues, mediocrity and more questions left than answers about the world building and characters.

My god, I cannot wait for the NDAs to expire in July, what an absolute trainwreck of a development this was.
 
But I cannot fathom to think what a fan of HH would think if after 4 long years of this show's development, hype levels completely through the roof, only to be met with an end product riddled with pacing issues, mediocrity and more questions left than answers about the world building and characters
It could be worse.

They could've hired Sweet Baby Inc to consult
 
HH is one of the biggest cases of a good premise ruined by so many missed opportunities I’ve seen. It’s sad because under all its huge flaws there were parts I really liked. Early 2000’s style edge and humor is a huge guilty pleasure of mine due to growing up in that era and it would have been neat to see a premise that was a throwback to it in a satirical parody kind of way. Too bad that wasn’t the case.
 
Btw we need a update to the poll now that the show is out
Screenshot_20240202_021325_Samsung Internet.jpg
 
Okay, it was probably mentioned somewhere on this thread, but I’ll just ask right now:

When did Viv say she hated Christianity? And I don’t mean the show lol
Alright, I was probably talking out of my ass with that one,
I rerember seeing on her Twitter something along those lines "it's crazy how Christians complain about queer artists representing hell in their arts when this is where they told us we'll end up anyway"
Also, one of her crew members rambled about how important it was to her to work on a show set in hell with gay stuff in it as a queer woman with religious trauma and Viv responded with "we do be reclaiming hell 😎".
Also the show is clearly inclined towards "heaven and god are the real bad guys and hell is full of oppressed gay people".
I don't know how you can't see that Viv ressent Christianity.
 
I can't really add anything that hasn't already been said about episode 7 and 8. What I thought about it aligns with most of the points made. From the VA inconsistency, to the rushed pacing and kiddie glove handling of the climactic fight. Adam in particular has his moments but everyone's cracking jokes, swearing like children and generally the weight of the entire fight just didn't really hit. It's over way too quickly too. Alastor getting mirked by Adam only to reappear with the heroes at the end of the fight was a slap in the nuts and a complete waste of suspense. ESPECIALLY that we see Vox react and literally says he fled A SPLIT SECOND after. What a waste. SHOW DON'T TELL!

Alastor should have not just magically shown up to the hotel as if everything was okay again. It would have been a lot better if he was away healing his wounds or something. Keep in that reveal as part of the song, that would have been a fine last appearance for him in the season.

EVERYTHING gets resolved merely after it is established. Nothing is given time to chew on. Alastor could have also been the ONLY character not to swear and that would have at least been consistent with his more elegant and refined persona. But no, instead he has to be a Youtube top 5 creepypasta entry but ALSO SAYS FUCK HAHAHAA.
Every single one of these characters has the same sense of humour, because Vivzie is only capable of writing one joke... Crude sex jokes and dialogue that swears every few seconds. The novelty dies out VERY fucking quickly and the show really isn't that funny. It has its moments but throughout the whole thing I probably laughed like 3 times. Pentious being 2 of those times.

The writing is immature as fuck and I'm not just talking about the jokes.
My earlier post complained that it was never established what happens after people die in hell... THE ACTUAL ANSWER TO THIS WAS EVEN WORSE because it creates a huge plothole. Heaven itself doesn't know the criteria for entry but Sir Pentious gets to heaven for what I suppose is sacrifice for friends but does his egg boys get the same? Do the cannibals? What happens to the angels? And what about people in heaven that die? Do the angels remain dead forever? WHAT ABOUT MY NIGGA ADAM?! Does this show have the balls to actually kill off any character that's not just set up as a one season villain?
Is it capable having emotional moments that are deserved and last more than 5 minutes?
Vivzie is utterly incapable of cutting the fat (insert weight joke here). The show is riddled with way too much filler, from characters that don't matter (Cherry Bomb being the most egregious but there are others) and entire plots that were just left on the backburner and are most likely set ups for season 2. If that's so then that's fine, but it feels like they'll just keep adding for season 2 and have the same issues as season 1.
Horribly rushed pacing because they were trying to cram too much in, all because Vivzie doesn't understand that not every fucking OC she makes HAS to be in the show all at once. There should have been characters and more character if you get me.

IMO The ending wasn't as bad as I thought it'd be. I liked the hotel rebuilding sequence.
All in all they did stick the landing. It's not a great show, it certainly has flaws but it wasn't BAD.
I watched it with zero expectations so I'm not that surprised or disappointed really. But it leaves a LOT to be desired for fans waiting for like 7 years for this thing

TLDR: Everyone gets an :agree: sticker. People already nailed the analysis of the last two episodes very well.


Guys, is it just me or...?
Adam looks like a one of those Youtube react channels that have a 2D character that represents them. Think Turkey Tom but with wings. Just the way he is drawn I think, it looked really jarring to have "Face of human guy" next to a cast of whacky over-designed characters
 
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