Hollow Knight - Dark Souls Metroidvania... with bugs!

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Safir said:
Before I even had the parachute, I got gud and pogoed off bugs to the left of the treetop village, got a mask piece there and found a locked door. I wasted 500 beads on the Simple Key and found there's Deepnest 2.0 behind it. I couldn't kill a single monster, had my face eaten, and noped out of there. Consequently, until the thorn monster, I often didn't have enough money for benches.
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You mean the Wormways?

HAHAHAHAHAHA

YOU THINK THAT'S DEEPNEST 2.0

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Safir said:
In the ant area, there's a long-ass pogo challenge, some fights and more pogos, and then an arena where Niggerbug shows up to "help". By "help" I mean the fight is "balanced" to account for its presence, meaning it's rapemurder, I just have to try to survive until niggerbug kills everything. I didn't manage to beat it, mostly because of how many times I had to reload on the jumping section. As soon as I got the parachute, I went back there to retry the arena (I found nothing to help on the arena itself but getting there should be safer). Guess what? NO NIGGERBUG, just rape. I noped out.
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Get better.
Safir said:
Still no sword upgrade. I hope I didn't miss it, I may soon be out of easily killable monsters. Deepnest 2.0 is impossible for now. Ants are fat, they don't feel like I'm supposed to fight them without the upgrade.
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You didn't miss it, I think, but the fact you call bosses by what they look like and not by what their names are makes it harder to figure you out [who is 'thorn monster' exactly?]. Anyway, if you really must know, you need to beat a boss you can only access after beating the Shellwood boss, which I think you said you did, and to do that you need the ability behind said boss, at which point you try to reenter Bellhart from the upper side of the Shellwood until you get there.

Someone has looked up the info, by the way. You can only get 6 mask shards in areas you can access up to this point. So at most you can only have 6 HP to deal with everything.
 
Another Random said:
YOU THINK THAT'S DEEPNEST 2.0

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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to be fair it is literally the exact same thing except the moving stuff goes vertically instead of sideways

unless perhaps you're a fucking pussy who got creeped out by what is actually the most boring area in hollow knight and really values that i guess
 
No, I get where the similarities can come from, I just think that there's another area that is more suitable for the Deepnest equivalent in Silksong if only because it's another place that sucks to traverse normally until you get how to cross it, is made relatively easier with a tool [but still sucks with it], and is way too big for its own good.
 
Lone MacReady II said:
Alright alright I downloaded silksong.... what should a complete newbie know before starting the game?
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1. Do not buy the Simple Key in the beginning until you have money to waste, it unlocks nothing helpful at this stage and you'll be perpetually money-starved until zone 8 or so.
2. There's a building in the background (not a normal sidescrolling door) place where you "need" to pay money to enter EVERY TIME. Plan accordingly.
3. There are several combat styles to switch between and you have to upgrade items slots separately for every style. Consider holding onto upgrade items until you pick a couple more styles and decide which you prefer. (I like the starting style best, but YMMV.)

---

Another Random said:
You mean the Wormways?

HAHAHAHAHAHA

YOU THINK THAT'S DEEPNEST 2.0

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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Stylistically, yes, it's gray and there's worms crawling out of walls. (I liked Deepnest in HK, it was only hard the first time when I didn't know about Sharp Shadow). On my first attempt, I unlocked Deep Docks, collected some items there, and broke through to Far Fields without fighting Lace (it was fun and I thought it was the intended way to reach Far Fields). I couldn't do anything fun in Wormways.

Gimmick Account said:
unless perhaps you're a fucking pussy who got creeped out by what is actually the most boring area in hollow knight and really values that i guess
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Nooooo it's fun! There are two trains, a hot spring, the giant centipede maze, the giant centipede pogo challenge, devouts, two cocoons, the dream tree, and lots of creeps with slow speed and good knockback to kill for mana.

Another Random said:
Get better.
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I'm trying! I just realized Hornet can heal in the air. Had there been a bench nearly, I'd have practiced until I beat that room, really I just hate the climb, I got worse the more I did it.

Another Random said:
You didn't miss it, I think, but the fact you call bosses by what they look like and not by what their names are makes it harder to figure you out [who is 'thorn monster' exactly?].
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Sister Splinter, the one in the rose garden where you get wall climbing afterward. (It just occurred to me that I could look up monster names in the pooner's journal.) Thank you for using the spoilerblock (I didn't click it).
 
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Another Random said:
No, I get where the similarities can come from, I just think that there's another area that is more suitable for the Deepnest equivalent in Silksong if only because it's another place that sucks to traverse normally until you get how to cross it, is made relatively easier with a tool [but still sucks with it], and is way too big for its own good.
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I would say the true essence of Deepnest is claustrophobic mazelike area that whittles at your health one by one as you get lost with almost no way to gain soul.

There's not really an area specifically like that in Silksong, Bilewater has maggots that just outright prevent you from healing but you're never really 'lost.' There are only two other areas that have the aesthetic but they're not big enough and they're not connected to anything.

Actually I don't even know if Deepnest is mazelike but due to the way it's designed it sure feels mazelike.
 
Alex Yiik said:
I realized way after it mattered that you can break the door mechanism from the inside and keep it open permanently.
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In the same vein, I loved how "Honeysweet" stabbed the coomer in the face and the bath is free afterward.

Public announcement:
PIMP PILLOW

---
Today sucked.
The good:
  • I found the pimp pillow. The game gave me Hornet sitting on a pillow, Hornet in a poofy dress, Ninja Hornet, and now this. :heart-full:
  • I take back what I said about crests. The Crest of Reaper is useful, too:
    • it has better knockback which helps to clear ants and other scum;
    • there are pogo challenges designed for the vertical HK style pogo.
  • Remember when the game just came out and everyone said not to sit on that one bench? I beat the ant arena with the pimp pillow and sat on that one bench. As soon as I sat, I remembered.
    • Then I beat the Savage Fly for the Crest of the Beast. (The reward is ass but at least the fight is done.)
    • Also found a secondary weapon against crows.
The bad:
  • I explored "everything" in Shellwood but didn't find the final purple flower.
    • Might give it another pass now that I'm low on shells (almost nothing there drops beads) but it's a chore.
  • I have 5 mask fragments and haven't killed Widow. By achievements, most people killed her before getting 4. I think she's in Belltown (webs everywhere = spider = widow, the NPC talking how getting webbed removes sadness) but I've no idea how to get to her. Hornet says she's going to free the trapped insects out of the webs but I didn't find a place to do it, all the webs I see are decorations. (I assume what will happen is Hornet starts cutting and Widow shows up and says, "noooo! life is saaaaad and full of paaaaain, they're better off trapped" etc. and then it turns out she was right and the whole town hates Hornet for releasing them. But I don't know where to start.)
    • I knocked on every wall in Belltown and found the shortcut in the maze. No Widow.
  • Found two (three) new areas:
    • Blasted Steps: the visuals are epic but I'd hate to actually be there.
    • Sinner's Path: the visuals are depressing and I'd hate to be there.
    • (something) of Fay. This one is pretty and frozen. There are rings in it.
      • The boring design is I will find something against cold and go there.
      • The epic design is I will find an item to shoot web for fast movement The Messenger style (maybe after killing the Widow, because Belltown is a mainline quest), then beat the level by moving between safe areas very fast, THEN get something against cold.
        • I hope it's a fluffy coat. I'd murder for Hornet in a fluffy coat.
      • The bad is I can't explore it yet.
  • In the city, there's an area at the top that looks like it requires pogoing on monsters. I can't do it, but as far as I remember there's no place whatsoever in HK except the Path of Pain (which I couldn't reach) that requires pogoing on monsters to progress. I will trust Silksong to be good.
  • Next up on the achievement list is "The Last Judge". Text in Blasted Steps says something like "ascend and be judged", so I assume he's there.
  • Went to the crow area. There's nothing except an arena battle in it and I can barely beat single big crows.
  • There's another huge ant miniboss fight in Hunter's March but this one has a spear chucker add. It looks hopeless.
    • I might have tried secondary weapons but I'm down to 200 shells after beating the Savage Fly.
      • I didn't even use secondary weapons on my winning run against the fly. Pimp pillows were epic for finishing the final ant arena wave but there are only five of them and I get unspooled by the very first wave of crows.
So I'm looking at a pick of
  • two depressing areas (plus Wormways),
  • two extremely hard battles that sound optional
    • the map bug told me crows are hard and I might want to look for another way
  • and two unfinished quests.
 
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So how much help do you want?

Informal tip regarding Widow: Bellhart is clearly a vertical area, so there should be some way to get inside from higher up, even if that means going to a different area entirely.

Formal tip regarding Widow [as in, actually telling you]: have you tried exploring that side of Shellwood?

On one hand, fighting the birds will give you something good long term. On the other hand, they suck and you may want to do that later.

On how Beast Crest works: trigger its Bind to enter a rage mode where you can heal up to 3 masks for 5-7 seconds by hitting opponents, if you can do a second Bind you can heal 3 more masks and the timer resets, every mask you heal adds more time at a rate of 1/.5/.25, taking damage reduces how long you can stay in this state.
 
Another Random said:
So how much help do you want?
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Thank you! Yes I've been there for the Sister Splinter boss but somehow completely missed that passage on the map. I swear I hadn't clicked the spoiler but the presence of the informal tip encouraged me to give the place a final try before I'd give up and click it, went to Shellwood to look for the final flower and immediately spotted the second arrow.

A QUESTION:
An event happened, I died in it, reloaded from a save, went there to trigger it and hopefully do better and it didn't happen. When does the (second) Skull Tyrant attack Bone Bottom?

---
Today was great!
  • All purple flowers are in!
  • Hair Pick Widow is dead! Wasn't easy, the first phase is a boring test of endurance and the second phase was impossible until I discovered a winning tactic: hug a wall, watch the balls flying at it, climb up to escape the boss charge, rush out when it's safe (esp. when the balls are aimed away) and bash her in the face or throw a pimp pillow.
    • Pleasantly surprised that the citizens of Bellhart are happy and grateful.
    • Went to both secret places the new ability unlocked.
      • Atla:
        • upgraded Hunter's Crest
        • got a bonus slot
        • found a charm to increase healing at the cost of prolonging healing, could be useful considering Hornet can heal in the air
        • unlocked secrets to the left (boss battle) and right (lava room, sounds like there's a mask piece in there, noped out because it's no use for now). Decided to try other stuff first.
      • Cindril: found nothing except the speedrunner charm. Not useful to me, Hornet is fast enough as she is. This was a disappointment, because the unupgraded Reaper's Crest turned out to be better (but not good enough) for the boss battle in Atla and an upgrade could be truly OP. Seems like the NPC in Atla will be giving out crest upgrades, and other weaver places hold something else. (Which is great design, more surprises, better than in HK.)
    • Completed all the quests in Bellhart that unlocked after Hair Pick.
  • For the scarecrow quest, I decided to speed up rag collection and give the crow arena a try. Turns out crows are pussies! Got to the last wave at full hp + full silk, had a feeling it would be the last one, and spammed the boomerang. Got the 2nd tools upgrade (very good, I love pimp pillows) and the 2nd silk skill ("hegale") (ok I guess).
  • Ascended to the top of the city by pogoing on monsters. There was nothing there except text (I screenshotted it). Getting there was hard and I'm buttmad but I got gud.
5 mask shards, 6 spool halves, 1st sword upgrade, no quests on either board, nothing to buy. Going to try:
  • the fat ant in Hunter's March above the shop
    • edit: done, the trick was to not save silk on healing but instead spend it all on shooting the flier. No tools, just the Silk Spear, in fact I took the tools off so as not to accidentally waste a good opportunity to shoot a spear. The reward is about 400 beads.
  • boss battle in Atla
  • and then Blasted Steps.
The bad: encountered a (software) bug. Started the game (program), loaded my current save at the Bone Bottom bench, went to the Atla door to retry the lava room and discovered I couldn't play the instrument (anywhere). Took the bellway and the bug went away.

I still don't like having to murder possessed creatures (for beads or otherwise). The devs' case is bad and they're making it badly. At least now with Bellhart it's established that the baddies are killing bugs with or without out involvement and someone's got to put a stop to it, but "eh most of them won't wake up from possession" is a bad take, it's still murder.
I like how Bellhart is lively and welcoming without an undercurrent of sadness/wrongness the pilgrim camp had.

Going to take a break for now, my finger hurts.
 
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Lads....

Im so pissed off with act 3 doing nephilm or whatever that flower faggot is called after all that shit I been through, I had a silksong break, played all sorts of other shit...

Just fired up a new hollow knight save. Wtf. Why.
 
They/them has weird patterns and hit boxes and frankly I cant be fucked with, I just need a break although I love this game. Sad, that my break from silksong is re-running hollow knight. (Not steel soul, im not that autistic)
 
Silksong rightfully won the Steam game of the year. Crazy how it beat Expedition 33 when it's a democratic vote among people who actually like games and didn't when an oligarchic council on a long commercial that wishes they were the Oscars decided.
 
milesmathis is the goat said:
silksong is 2 times worse than the original game
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I disagree, it's an improvement in most ways. I love Hollow Knight and was expecting Silksong to fall short but was luckily proven wrong. Mainly I liked the charm system way more than I like the crests and I feel like Hollow Knight's more mysterious story you slowly pieced together worked better for me, but in most other ways I prefer Silksong. Music is a toss up, it'd come down to what percentage of the total music I like I suppose but I'm not interested in doing that - they are both just very good. Even without the free DLC Silksong is probably surpassing HK in content, and it will probably go way beyond once it comes. Up in the air if the super hard new bosses comparable to Pure Vessel or Nightmare King (not True Radiance though, she sucks) will be as good.
 
Professor G. Raff said:
I disagree, it's an improvement in most ways. I love Hollow Knight and was expecting Silksong to fall short but was luckily proven wrong. Mainly I liked the charm system way more than I like the crests and I feel like Hollow Knight's more mysterious story you slowly pieced together worked better for me, but in most other ways I prefer Silksong. Music is a toss up, it'd come down to what percentage of the total music I like I suppose but I'm not interested in doing that - they are both just very good. Even without the free DLC Silksong is probably surpassing HK in content, and it will probably go way beyond once it comes. Up in the air if the super hard new bosses comparable to Pure Vessel or Nightmare King (not True Radiance though, she sucks) will be as good.
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i said its worse in consideration to the previous game not because the game has less quality gameplay but rather the game is 4 times as tedious
 
The thing with vidja like anything in the arts, is that some people will like it and some won't. You should not expect someone to change his/her mind either way
 
it's surprising but it's probably a combination of e33 not running on potatoes and silksong's years of accumulating a redditor engine
 
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