I respect transpeople - Change my mind

"I'm merely PRETENDING to be retarded in order to provoke intelligent conversation!"
That's not an appropriate place to use that meme. I didn't walk back any of my views or imply they're bait, I said you guys are all on massive cope if you have to pretend current-year mainstream opinions are 'bait' because they disrupt your gay little hugbox.
 
I was saying that it's cringe when you make up your own version of the English language in which widely accepted parts of the vocabulary do not exist or are deemed not valid because their existence upsets you. I never once said there was no such thing as a eunuch.

Can't we agree at least to abide by the rules of standard, accepted English?
The thing you are discussing at the most fundamental level is what words mean.

He can't simultaneously disagree with you and agree with you on what language accurately reflects reality.

>8 pages later
Spud has posted once in this thread. And I guess he gave you a heart as well.
 
Gotta be honest, while this is a very reasonable sentiment, I have a hard time believing the sincerity of a notorious rape apologist and meat pie enthusiast.
 
Nice, OP. As a trans-black trans-woman I do appreciate your efforts to end transphobia.
Now suck my cock, bigot.
 
Let me make one thing abundantly clear: I have zero issues with people dressing unconventionally, or basically being themselves in any environment, provided they're not hurting anyone else. We live in a world built atop faulty logic which everyone refers to as "normal" simply because everyone else puts up with it, and the world needs people who can challenge this; trans people included. I personally will always support people's individual right to free expression and freedom of speech, wherever that may take them in life (that includes expressing ones sexuality, sexual orientation and their gender... regardless of that means to them).

However, OP's post really does need unpacking piece by piece, with a bit of historical reference, because freedoms work both ways:


for the most part they're conducting really valuable work in bringing visibility and acceptance for a very vulnerable and marginalised community.

I'm sure in the United States (especially in the Bible Belt) that some of these groups have done a lot of good. But their approach to politics was exported elsewhere and as a result, has harmed far many more than it has helped.

Over here, these groups have done nothing but create division by reviving harmful stereotypes around the relationship between sex and gender. In the UK, we were on the cusp of living in a country where a person's biological sex was considered by most people to be nothing more than a set of basic biological/physiological differences, with the overwhelming majority of people rejecting radical feminism in favour of a very progressive, modern approach of not reducing people down to a bunch of labels. These groups have ruined all that and made batshit crazy radical feminists appear incredibly sane to the common majority; something previously thought to be impossible.

I think everybody deserves to be treated with a baseline level of dignity and respect

That was and still is the default choice most people will make. However, the keyword is choice. There is no law saying you have to try and help someone in distress, but many people will. Likewise, there are no laws saying you need to respect anyone, only that you do not go out of your way to disrespect them in specific (almost universally considered to be unacceptable) ways. Free will, or at the very least, giving the illusion of it, is a basic principle of good governance in almost every situation.

Back in the early 2000s, people who suffered with the psychologically crippling effects of gender dysphoria were already very much accepted, at least in the UK. The philosophy of the day (which followed on from the 90s) encouraged the abolition of stereotypical gender roles and the elimination of any unnecessary segregation of the sexes. If someone wanted to be one of the boys/girls growing up, with very few notable exceptions (e.g. sex-segregated changing rooms, where folks could opt to change on their own) people could very much do so and be automatically accepted by their peer group based on the merits of their overall character. For those who found the natural state of their body really didn't fit the natural state of their mind, free mental health services would spend (100+ hours cumulative) time with young people to help them understand and cope with growing up, saving any psychiatric and/or surgical interventions as an absolute last resort. In the rare case someone did need to transition using said interventions, people would change their name by deed poll, their peers would refer to them by their new name (in most cases automatically using the correct pronouns relative to their new name) and life would carry on. People wouldn't merely tolerate those in need of compassion, they'd for the most part, accept them for who they are.

and I don't understand why it's so hard for the people here to not lose their minds and act like screeching, unsocialised apes when confronted with a transwoman who simply wants to live her best life without being subjected to a constant torrent of abuse and hatred.

This is super easy to explain. The way I see it, almost nobody here cares about someone living their best life, whether or not they claim to be a man or a woman, and whether or not such a claim lines up with their biological sex. Most people fundamentally agree with "live and let live" as well as the fundamental right for people to live the lives they wish to live, as long as their doing so neither harms nor impacts the fundamental freedoms of others to live the lives they wish to live. However, when people start throwing out political symbols (e.g. 🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍⚧️) in militant ways, some people are going to have a deep, visceral reaction to it. In countries where people have lost personal freedoms as a result of militant LGBT campaigning, many people will see such flags as reminders of the freedoms they've lost.

Everything was going well for people of all persuasions until the 2010s, when campaigners tried to turn peoples natural choices into a mandatory set of requirements. In countries where these campaigns had already seen any level of success, people were now expected to deny the reality they saw before them, otherwise they'd be punished. Where many people made a positive choice to accept trans people before, they now tolerate them to the extent the law requires, hoping things won't get any worse in terms of their personal freedoms. In the UK, this has resulted in the resurgence of radical feminism, supports of which have successfully lobbied both mainstream political parties to ensure that a set of standards are created to prevent anyone from self-asserting that they're a given gender to get into the very few remaining sex-segregated facilities still in common use. As mainstream politicians are now heavily involved in creating legislation to restrict the rights of everyone (including trans people) it's very likely everything will become a confusing hellscape for all. We're already seeing building codes being updated right now by the party in power to enforce the creation of unwanted sex-segregated toilets instead of extremely private unisex cubicles. That might sound like a small thing at first but changes like these won't stop there (e.g. sex-segregated public transport and gym facilities have actually been discussed) because radical feminists are now being taken extremely seriously. Let's not even get started on "non hate crime incidents" where police will record details of non-crimes for potential re-use when an actual crime occurs based upon accusations alone. This mess has all come about because a bunch of stupid idiots couldn't stop spraying their 🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍⚧️🏳️‍⚧️ everywhere like a bunch of rabid feral cats.

Perhaps now OP will understand a little about why people mock, belittle and in some cases hate trans activists.
 
IMO - society will reach trans acceptance when medical technology reaches the level that Medical Industrial Complex enablers currently pretend it has. When SRS is actually as good as waiving a magic wand and people genuinely have a hard time telling the difference, then trans folk won’t have a issue with misgendering.

This will also help eliminate the primary concern on the right of a woman with a penis being a sex pest/masturbating in a natal woman’s safe space.
 
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I agree with giving everyone at least a baseline level of respect; however, respect should go both ways.

Discrediting and branding me a bigot for (what I consider) mildly challenging their philosophy isn't respect.
 
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