Mass Effect 5...or 4...? - Are we all pretending Andromeda is canon, or not?

Will it be good?

  • Yes

    Votes: 7 3.5%
  • No

    Votes: 47 23.7%
  • I don't care

    Votes: 33 16.7%
  • Red

    Votes: 13 6.6%
  • Blue

    Votes: 4 2.0%
  • Green

    Votes: 6 3.0%
  • I wanna fuck everyone and everything with a hole, this time.

    Votes: 29 14.6%
  • "My face is tired!"

    Votes: 59 29.8%

  • Total voters
    198
I think I've said it before, but this is the perfect example of BioWare's world building. It's not just that lazy about Tali, it's the whole Quarian race. The Quarians interacted with the Council races before the Geth, if I remember right part of the reason why they tried to shut the Geth down was because of the Council's anti-AI laws. Despite there, no one knows what they look like under their suits. Which means the Galactic internet has no pictures of Quarians, no one has ever done an autopsy on Quarians, no one has ever paid a down on their luck Quarian to star in Space Porn, there's no Quarian selfies, there's no Quarian portraits, there's no Quarian art involving the physical form. If you go to Haestrom, there's no pictures of Quarian families on work stations. Quarian women have birth giving hips and pleasing hip-to-waist ratios and no Asari is actively getting into their suits. No human either, other than maybe Shepard, even though Quarians make sense as fellow traveler with Humans, given both races were screw in varying ways by the Council, one by the Council shrugging after the Geth revolt and the other by the First Contact War.

There, I just put more thought into the Quarians than BioWare. Probably because of Casey Hudson's hard-on for his Blueberry Waifu.
I always got the feeling that all those thing existed, just Shepard/the player just never looked at any of it, to turn "what do Quarians look like" into a meme.

I remember in one of the books the human main character ends up on the migrant fleet for some reason, and sees Quarians outside of their suit and is surprised, having never seen them in person, but certainly doesn't have her mind blown by the experience.
 
PLOT LEAK:
YOUR MAJESTY, FURFAG AND HIS MINIONS HAVE SEIZED THE PRECINCT OF THE SPACE TIME CONTINUUM

IT IS WRITTEN: ONLY COMMANDER SHEPARD CAN DEFEAT FURFAGS
shepard.png
 
Fuck me the Andromeda initiative was a privately funded venture that built multiple dreadnought sized vessels and a functional city in space.
Did they ever explain why some Arks arrived before the others and how they somehow got enough time to build colonies and organize a coup against the leaders of the Andromeda Initiative?
Perhaps I didn't pay attention but there was also that weird thing about the arks being built for each race of the Council but once you get unfrozen, there are humans, salarians, asari, turians and krogans everywhere?
 
It really is one of the weird things Andromeda got right. One of the few things. Tuchanka makes no sense either. The feeling is the Krogan were cavemen given hand grenades, but then they turn out to be an industrial race that have nuked themselves repeatedly. It's just stupid.
Eh, gonna stop you there. The ME1 codex has as its opening paragraph about the Krogan: "Prior to the invention of gunpowder, 'death by predator' was the number one cause of death among Krogan. Afterwards, it was 'death by gunshot'." They did advance far enough on their own at minimum to understand basic firearms as indicated by that statement, however, when you consider that when the Salarians showed up the Krogan were basically living in the wonderful environment of Fallout: Tuchanka and had advanced only to what, ICBM's as their most advanced weapons prior? Yeah, handing people like that mass effect technologies might as well be like handing cavemen hand grenades.
 
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I always got the feeling that all those thing existed, just Shepard/the player just never looked at any of it, to turn "what do Quarians look like" into a meme.

I remember in one of the books the human main character ends up on the migrant fleet for some reason, and sees Quarians outside of their suit and is surprised, having never seen them in person, but certainly doesn't have her mind blown by the experience.
Not being surprised by it would make sense, but they always implied they people didn't know, or no one talked about it. I think it's more that BioWare hadn't actually thought about it until ME3 forced their hand. So they whiffed.

Eh, gonna stop you there. The ME1 codex has as its opening paragraph about the Krogan: "Prior to the invention of gunpowder, 'death by predator' was the number one cause of death among Krogan. Afterwards, it was 'death by gunshot'." They did advance far enough on their own at minimum to understand basic firearms as indicated by that statement, however, when you consider that when the Salarians showed up the Krogan were basically living in the wonderful environment of Fallout: Tuchanka and had advanced only to what, ICBM's as their most advanced weapons prior? Yeah, handing people like that mass effect technologies might as well be like handing cavemen hand grenades.
True, it just seems weird that a race so destructive towards each other with guns would ever sit down and figure out nukes. That said, ME1 seems to imply they're just super aggressive and violent, but their later behavior was motivated by genophage related fatalism and nihilism. I remember Wrex talking about it. Of course, maybe it's the ME2 and later split, where they're portrayed as a race that headbutts as greetings and lives in literal ruins without improving anything. Then came Krogan Girl Power.

I assume it's more lack of proper world building and not outlining things that cause it. ME was being worked on around the time of the tail end of Nu-Battlestar Galactica and I remember a lot of "You don't need outlines." back then. You'd think the mess the series was after the first season and a half would have ended that.
 
ME1 actually did a pretty decent job of making the Krogan interesting. Remember, they were able to maintain AM plants, orbital space docks, and all sorts of other stuff on their own prior to the Krogan Rebellions (since that's infrastructure the Salarians all hit to start it off), so they aren't stupid. Just impulsive. They even had warships, given they were engaged in naval combat with the Turians during that. Its horrifying to look back at the Cold War and think about how many times we came this close we came to actually doing it before people actually stopped and thought about things. Now add in Krogan impulsiveness and that button is getting hit. Again. Not stupid. Just impulsive and easily frustrated, not really any different from humans in that regard. ME1 with Wrex points out that the Krogan race is overcome by nihilistic, fatalistic despair, and that they all head off world to go fight for credits as soon as they can. They've all given up on Tuchanka on account of it being an irradiated wasteland shithole, unlike what ME2 and ME3 would have you think. Fuck, there's an elevator news report in ME1 that even has them settling a lawsuit with the research firm they hired to look into the genophage, so there's plenty of them smart enough to listen to their attorneys and not turn a lawsuit into a lolsuit, unlike humans apparently if the Farms are any indication.
 
ME1 actually did a pretty decent job of making the Krogan interesting. Remember, they were able to maintain AM plants, orbital space docks, and all sorts of other stuff on their own prior to the Krogan Rebellions (since that's infrastructure the Salarians all hit to start it off), so they aren't stupid. Just impulsive. They even had warships, given they were engaged in naval combat with the Turians during that. Its horrifying to look back at the Cold War and think about how many times we came this close we came to actually doing it before people actually stopped and thought about things. Now add in Krogan impulsiveness and that button is getting hit. Again. Not stupid. Just impulsive and easily frustrated, not really any different from humans in that regard. ME1 with Wrex points out that the Krogan race is overcome by nihilistic, fatalistic despair, and that they all head off world to go fight for credits as soon as they can. They've all given up on Tuchanka on account of it being an irradiated wasteland shithole, unlike what ME2 and ME3 would have you think. Fuck, there's an elevator news report in ME1 that even has them settling a lawsuit with the research firm they hired to look into the genophage, so there's plenty of them smart enough to listen to their attorneys and not turn a lawsuit into a lolsuit, unlike humans apparently if the Farms are any indication.
True. I guess it's easy to forget, given all the shit they buried the series under in ME2 and ME3. Wrex's musing on the state of the Krogan and being inspired to try and change it was one of the nice things in ME1. Like he'd finally grown up enough to realize the real problem was that the Krogan themselves needed to. But can't build on that because there's no good writers left after Drew K and Chris left. There's a lot of interesting ground work in the series, but no one good enough to build on it.
 
Wrex actually tried to change it right after the Krogan Rebellions. Its heavily implied he actually fought in them given how he talks about the meeting with his father. The way he speaks about it its as if he was all for them going back for round 2... after one or two generations of stable breeding to replenish their numbers. But the Krogan would rather fight against each other following their defeat, and after killing his old man who spat on the sacred laws of the Crush because he was so intent on fighting he just left Tuchanka and the Krogan and let them kill themselves. He's got a lot of old, deep scars after all, both inside and out. He's definitely not young, not from his looks and not from the way he acts and speaks. What I really liked was that the way he acted on Tuchanka in ME2 was that it was Shepard believing him and helping him as an ally and friend (either the armor or the Paragon/Renegade choice) even when he had no real reason to is what convinced him to go back and start kicking Krogan ass to make something of his species. Shepard could have done it the easy way, just had Ashley blast him and save everyone the effort, but no. He actually reached out, talked to Wrex, convinced him to not throw his life and the life of the Krogan away by acting as Sovereign's disposable soldiers.
 
You’re ignoring the world building they did in the codices and even ME2. Remember the hospital complex where Mordin’s protégée was working? They included either dialogue or datapads that discussed how hospitals had to be designed to deal with critically injured krogan berserking as their bodies switched over to redundant organ systems, and how that process sometimes left their higher thinking behind. I believe they even specifically were trying to figure out ways to mitigate that because it was seen as maladaptive.

As you’ve pointed out, we’re looking at Fallout: Tuchanka. We have no idea what the krogan were like before they nearly annihilated themselves. Whatever enlightened sensibilities their culture might have possessed before the nukes got obliterated as hard as their cities. As the genophage only filtered krogan for the ability to survive it, the nukes filtered krogan for the ability to survive a post-apocalypse.

Between the cultural damage of the nukes and the nihilism brought about by the combination of the genophage AND the Council’s eternal interdiction of Aralakh, is it really any wonder the krogan became Klingons dialed up to 11?

As to living in ruins, when the elements are no threat, you’re dirt-poor, and nobody is going to believe you want to rebuild when you try to place an order for a thousand kilotons of unobtanium that can be used to reinforce buildings OR build warships, why wouldn’t you be living in ruins? Especially when it’s a world of all against all, as demonstrated by Wrex’s allies purging anyone who won’t play his game?
 
Krogan+Quarian=ALL DAY ERRRY DAY

Nothing stands in my way with that team, nothing. That's all I want is to play in that time between 2 and 3 where the galaxy was in flux but not gone to shit yet. The other option is we jump 2-300 years into the future which is also ok.
My first playthrough of ME1 was using Wrex and Tali as my team, went Paragon but also blew off the Council. The cast-out species band together against Blue Supremacists.
The thing that kills me is her finding a part of an N7 helmet on some iceball of a world, but if she's looking for Shepard, why wouldn't he be on earth? Why would destroy have him on some random ice planet?
The Normandy 1.0 crash site was an iceball world. Maybe they're trying to re-do what Cerberus did in ME2?
 
The Normandy 1.0 crash site was an iceball world. Maybe they're trying to re-do what Cerberus did in ME2?
Maybe, I actually thought that they might be trying to recall ME2. Which is a mistake, I think. There was never any real reason to kill and resurrect Shepard, other than hamfistedly making him work for Cerberus. Which they could have done without that, but that would have required someone who passed Creative Writing 101.
 
You’re ignoring the world building they did in the codices and even ME2. Remember the hospital complex where Mordin’s protégée was working? They included either dialogue or datapads that discussed how hospitals had to be designed to deal with critically injured krogan berserking as their bodies switched over to redundant organ systems, and how that process sometimes left their higher thinking behind. I believe they even specifically were trying to figure out ways to mitigate that because it was seen as maladaptive.

As you’ve pointed out, we’re looking at Fallout: Tuchanka. We have no idea what the krogan were like before they nearly annihilated themselves. Whatever enlightened sensibilities their culture might have possessed before the nukes got obliterated as hard as their cities. As the genophage only filtered krogan for the ability to survive it, the nukes filtered krogan for the ability to survive a post-apocalypse.

Between the cultural damage of the nukes and the nihilism brought about by the combination of the genophage AND the Council’s eternal interdiction of Aralakh, is it really any wonder the krogan became Klingons dialed up to 11?

As to living in ruins, when the elements are no threat, you’re dirt-poor, and nobody is going to believe you want to rebuild when you try to place an order for a thousand kilotons of unobtanium that can be used to reinforce buildings OR build warships, why wouldn’t you be living in ruins? Especially when it’s a world of all against all, as demonstrated by Wrex’s allies purging anyone who won’t play his game?
Actually, I believe most krogan didn't blood rage before the nukes (and it was indeed considered a serious disability among them for obvious reasons), but after the utter devastation of the nukes... well, the natural environment there selected for that sort of unreasonable brutality. Its a disaster when there's a bunch of krogan around, but when there's just the natural environment and your enemies for the most part... much less of a detriment to survival. It also appears that older, more disciplined krogan can maintain some sort of control during it to at least direct themselves at their enemies if ME3 is any indication, so they've ended up adapting to it somewhat.
 
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All I can say is bringing Shepard back would be a huge mistake what with the way Bioware likes to shoehorn woke faggotry into their "RPGs" nowadays. I don't want to be forced into a random debate with some NPC about the ethics of dangerhair acceptance. My guesses:

  • They won't bring Shepard back. It's probably at least 300 years since the McGuffin ordeal. The teaser is just trying to bait nostalgic redditors into getting hype and preordering. Any reference to Shepard will likely just be old recordings or some shit like in ME:A.
  • They're gonna bring back the lead with suspiciously autistic mannerisms from ME:A - or you will play as the opposite twin. Teaser art shows what looks like a ship with the Mass Relay core built in. Going from that, the game will likely follow Ryder in his/her/xyr mission to take this "prototype" ship back to the Milky Way since everyone was wondering why the fuck everything went radio silent suddenly in the last game.
  • Liara won't have a substantial role either. Shit-tier nostalgia bait once again. Plus, fuck Bioware for making her such a big part of the trilogy. She was forced upon my Shepard so often that I actively went out of my way to avoid romancing her with her weird "~oOoOoH~ I'm a barely-legal blue babe and a virgin and for some reason I'm so horny for you, Shepard!!!". Ashley had more depth than that in the first game.
  • Hopefully they drop the fucking "Remnant" shit and just focus on space politics and rebuilding the Milky Way - but likely Bioware is gonna fuck up again and try to contrive another threat that's on the same level as the Reapers. They can't recreate that magic again.
In conclusion - if I can't be a space racist it's a no-buy for me. Based Shepard was actively suspicious of Turians in the first game if you wanted him/her to be.
 
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