Most cost-effective gun for self-defense (2022 edition) - Pew-pew for me and you-you

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Most cost effective means what one can afford and going from there.
Guy asked for most cost effective gun.
You are now discussing your fucking finger size.
Awful.
 
Inspired by this thread, I have some related questions:
1. I have heard it said that a beginner should start with a rifle (usually a.22, I guess). Would you agree? Is it really a big deal to learn to shoot with a handgun?
2. Those with Berettas (or who do/don't like them), care to share what you do/don't like about them?
3. I see some handguns referred to as long rifle, some luger, some pistol. I assume that refers to how the internal mechanisms work? (Yes, I could Google, but this is potentially more efficient...)
4. What do you think of compact or short frame handguns? Pretend the person with it is a pretty small woman, if that is relevant.
1: Rifles are easier to shoot and harder to accidentally flag (point the gun at) someone with. .22 is a good choice, it's what my dad started me with when I was five or so. Cheap, both in the rifle and the ammo, so you can get a ton of practice in for little investment, and no recoil so you're not going to lose control of it or develop a flinch. 10/22s are good if you want a semi-automatic (stick with the little box mags, not the big banana clips), or you can probably find a used bolt action for $100-150

2: I have a pair of M9s, the classic 92FS from 85 and the M9A3 from 2015. Kind of an old design but nothing wrong with them at all. Very fun/pleasant to shoot. Kind of a long trigger on them but you can get used to it. Not something I'd carry personally as they're just kind of big (and the only safety I want on a carry pistol is the trigger safety) but if you don't mind a full sized pistol you could do worse. Not personally familiar with their other stuff but they're a very reputable manufacturer

3: A long rifle handgun is going to be .22 long rifle most likely, same caliber I recommended in a rifle in #1. Still basically no recoil even out of a pistol so that's still a good choice for practice for a beginner. There's three flavors of .22 rimfire that I'm aware of, .22 short, .22 long (rifle), and .22 magnum, .22 LR being the most common. Rimfire means that there's no primer on the cartridge, instead the rim of the cartridge is struck which ignites the powder and causes the round to fire.

Luger is going to be 9mm luger/parabellum, or just 9mm. That's the caliber of the Berettas I mentioned. These are centerfire rather than rimfire, meaning that there's a primer in the center of the cartridge that's struck instead of the rim. Aside from their size/power that's the main difference between them, rimfire casings are disposable, (some) centerfire casings can be reloaded.

4: I carry a sub-compact. If you pick the right ammo you don't lose much if any power. I wouldn't let a small lady who's never shot just pick up a compact pistol and go to town with it, they will kick much harder than full size pistols, even in a smaller caliber. I'd start them off with a single round in the chamber. Same thing for guys (including myself) with high powered revolvers, and really just any pistol that you're not familiar with. I've seen too many videos of people nearly shooting themselves in the head after the first shot when they nearly smack themselves in the head with the pistol from the recoil and then tighten their grip to try and get control back only to fire off a second shot. It's not so much that the recoil is bad, but there's definitely some level of 'Oh, that gun is tiny, the recoil won't be bad at all' that goes on in your brain when it's actually the opposite that's true. With the same bullet the smaller gun is going to kick harder, and even in a smaller caliber you'll be surprised when something like a Ruger LCP in .380 kicks harder than a full size 1911 in .45
 
I edc a LCP2. I'd prefer to carry a full frame anything in .45acp. Glock, 1911, Xp, anything, but I can't fit it into my life. I have big hands so the LCP2 is awkward for me to shoot, but I can carry it comfortably and it is better than no gun or some shitty .22 or .25.

Edit: and oh yeah, it's only a couple hundred bucks for a damn good .380. About the same price as super underpowered .22 or .25 pistols.
 
Pump action shotsguns aren't exactly conceal carry, however emptying .38 special into a rampaging meth head stop them after multiple organs are punctured at close range.
If you happen to live near and absolutely have to walk through slums discreet self defense is needed.
Old reliable 9mm or .45 for their stopping power are viable if you want to shell out more money.

Take your time picking up a gun shop even more so if you live around not towns, you are likely to get a unmaintained nog tier gun that might explode due to lack of maintenance.
Don't buy your shit off pawn shops, they're there to fleece you and get you to buy with zero interest or knowledge about how to maintain guns.
 
Speaking in terms of snub nosed revolvers and .38 Special, both are under-rated, and I'm glad to hear that they were at least seriously considered for your CCW. .38 Special can approach the power of 9mm while being able to fit in a slimline revolver without moon clips. Budget wise 9mm is cheaper, but 38 Special is nowhere near the most expensive round in the world, even when bought locally. As for a snubbie, they're great pocket guns, small, light weight, reliable, as I can attest.
A little late to the party on this one, but I will attest that a .38 Special is a way better choice for an arm's length encounter than anything like .380, .32, .25 and under. 38 is stable, has more ass behind it than a .380 (or even 9mm if you get the right +P ammo... 158gr going 1200fps is a chest cracker), and is pretty much dummy proof for fast action if you get a hammerless snubbie. Though I will caution that snubbies tend to not like lighter bullet weights under 148 gr in my experience. I once loaded up 125gr hollow points with a spicy powder charge and watched them dance around a target at 10 yd like I was shooting at Fortune from MGS2. Going further down the wheelgun fudd rabbithole, .38 is nice because in a pinch (if you're into reloading) you can substitute smokeless powder with black powder, and you can hard cast/flip a hollow back wad cutter and load it backwards for some cool and interesting terminal ballistic effects. You can also use them in any gun chambered for 357 Mag, including lever guns.
 
I picked up a Lorcin L380 for $50 a couple of months back. Despite everything I have heard about it being one of the worst guns ever made, I have shot almost 100 rounds through it and it only jammed once and I cant say there was much to complain about with the accuracy either. But even though I have had little to no problems with it, idk if it is good to recommend it because it seems like I apparently have the best Lorcin L380 considering its reputation.
 
A little late to the party on this one, but I will attest that a .38 Special is a way better choice for an arm's length encounter than anything like .380, .32, .25 and under. 38 is stable, has more ass behind it than a .380 (or even 9mm if you get the right +P ammo... 158gr going 1200fps is a chest cracker), and is pretty much dummy proof for fast action if you get a hammerless snubbie. Though I will caution that snubbies tend to not like lighter bullet weights under 148 gr in my experience. I once loaded up 125gr hollow points with a spicy powder charge and watched them dance around a target at 10 yd like I was shooting at Fortune from MGS2. Going further down the wheelgun fudd rabbithole, .38 is nice because in a pinch (if you're into reloading) you can substitute smokeless powder with black powder, and you can hard cast/flip a hollow back wad cutter and load it backwards for some cool and interesting terminal ballistic effects. You can also use them in any gun chambered for 357 Mag, including lever guns.
That's rather informative on the lighter loads; I carry both the heavy lead 158 grain FBI load and a 120 grain load. I'll have to do some testing in my snubbie, but that's good to know. On cost, I would say snubbies, especially brands considered "lesser" in the used bin at your LGS, are pretty cheap, and a good starter if you're low on cash and want something that "just works", as was the situation I was in. If you can get a Smith like I did, more power to you, but I wouldn't turn my nose to a good condition used Taruas either.
 
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Late to the thread, but I'll nevertheless give my 2 cents.

For home self-defense, I concur with the many posters above who recommended a shotgun. Two things:
  • Don't get a "fowling piece" (one with a very long barrel, mostly used for bird and clay pigeon shooting). The long barrel is easier for an attacker to grab and push out of the way during an altercation. (You generally don't see these at the lower price range but they sometimes go cheap at estate clearance auctions.)
  • I'd suggest not loading lighter than LG (SSG if overpenetration is a concern). Avoid birdshot (and never load shit like rock salt, it fucks up your barrel) I have worked in both state mortuaries and A&E departments (USA: Casualty), and saw many more people hit by birdshot who were alive than dead. Both the fatalities took a full load to the torso at point blank range.

For a handgun, this really depends on what works best for you. I use a CZ 75 (9mm parabellum) which hasn't given me any trouble for 15 years (and worked well for my father for the 20 before that). Some people find them too heavy and the safety isn't ambidextrous. Stripping the gun for cleaning needs some dexterity, but not very much(IMO). I also don't know about US prices.

The only handgun I'd unequivocally warn against getting is the Denel Vektor 9mm pistol (South African manufacturer, I've heard that they are turning up for sale elsewhere now).

Picture:

vektor-sp1-pistol.jpg

The manufacturer stopped supporting the gun the year they ceased manufacture. Apparently a Chinese company was going to start making replacement parts, but I don't know if this is still happening.

Almost 75% of new Vektors were defective, needing modification to work (firing pin not moving when struck).

Second hand examples are mostly police surplus, and whether this was done depends on whether the cop who had the gun got it fixed with his own money (most just brought their own private gun to work).

Just keep away from these pieces of shit, unless you're willing to pay a gunsmith for inspection and repair of faults, which can easily cost you more than the gun itself.
 
I use a CZ 75 (9mm parabellum) which hasn't given me any trouble for 15 years (and worked well for my father for the 20 before that). Some people find them too heavy and the safety isn't ambidextrous.
You son of a bitch it better be a pre-B where you can throw it into a compactor and survive.
 
Late to the thread, but I'll nevertheless give my 2 cents.

For home self-defense, I concur with the many posters above who recommended a shotgun. Two things:
  • Don't get a "fowling piece" (one with a very long barrel, mostly used for bird and clay pigeon shooting). The long barrel is easier for an attacker to grab and push out of the way during an altercation. (You generally don't see these at the lower price range but they sometimes go cheap at estate clearance auctions.)
  • I'd suggest not loading lighter than LG (SSG if overpenetration is a concern). Avoid birdshot (and never load shit like rock salt, it fucks up your barrel) I have worked in both state mortuaries and A&E departments (USA: Casualty), and saw many more people hit by birdshot who were alive than dead. Both the fatalities took a full load to the torso at point blank range.

For a handgun, this really depends on what works best for you. I use a CZ 75 (9mm parabellum) which hasn't given me any trouble for 15 years (and worked well for my father for the 20 before that). Some people find them too heavy and the safety isn't ambidextrous. Stripping the gun for cleaning needs some dexterity, but not very much(IMO). I also don't know about US prices.

The only handgun I'd unequivocally warn against getting is the Denel Vektor 9mm pistol (South African manufacturer, I've heard that they are turning up for sale elsewhere now).

Picture:

View attachment 4149990

The manufacturer stopped supporting the gun the year they ceased manufacture. Apparently a Chinese company was going to start making replacement parts, but I don't know if this is still happening.

Almost 75% of new Vektors were defective, needing modification to work (firing pin not moving when struck).

Second hand examples are mostly police surplus, and whether this was done depends on whether the cop who had the gun got it fixed with his own money (most just brought their own private gun to work).

Just keep away from these pieces of shit, unless you're willing to pay a gunsmith for inspection and repair of faults, which can easily cost you more than the gun itself.
A shotgun is a good starter, especially if you're under 21, it'll teach you the basics, how to handle recoil, and no one will give you shit when you buy shells. That said, I'm a SKS fanboy. Its a easy to maintain, easy to fix rifle if shit really breaks, packs a solid punch, the cartridge while a bit more expensive, still has a shit ton of support from other manufactures, and it comes with a bayonet. Cant go wrong with a bayonet. And if you want a light but don't want to drill into the wood- duct tape my fren. I got mine for 399 at a Sportsman's warehouse sale two years ago, you can still find them cheap if you look.
 
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From the perspective of a woman with a small frame, if I am going to concealed-carry it clearly has to be something smaller. But generally if you are going to CC you are going to need more than one gun. The first one will not fit you in every circumstance, outfit, weather, etc.

My main carry is a Kimber Micro 9 (I got mine for $650.) It's basically a Mini 1911. It has a manual safety which I prefer and I think noobs should learn how to use, Carries 7+1 and I carry it locked and cocked. It's a sturdy, metal gun that has an attractive appearance. Also carried the Ruger LCP 380 ($300 or less) which is a fine option if you are OK with a somewhat weaker round, and a polymer/plastic gun that feels a bit dinkier, still it is a very fair option for a more affordable small CCW gun. .380 is marginal but it is about putting rounds on target. Sometimes have carried a S&W Featherweight .38 revolver which is also a good option.

But when my concern is bears and the like I am carrying at minimum a full size .45 which is a chore to conceal but I don't have to when I am walking in the woods. Mine is a Kimber 1911 which was about $1,200. You can get an adequate one for half that or a really fancy one for twice that or more.

For home defense I agree with many who have said a shotgun is a good choice. Either a Remington or a Mossberg will do you pretty well but I prefer a Mossberg because of sturdier extractors and I prefer the position of the safety on it as a smaller concern. You can get one for about $500-600.

You should also grab a rifle, an AR is the best option if it is available to you, minimal recoil, easy to stay on target, fun to shoot. If you are looking for affordability brand is not so important IMO although people have their preferences. You can get an adequate one between $500-700. You can spend way more for something premium but if you are thinking plinking, home defense, coyotes, etc. a budget model will do you fine.

A .22 rifle is good to have for plinking, small animals, and general practice. You can get anything for this role IMO and easily find one around $200 or less.

There are good red dot sights for just about everything these days but I would strongly recommend learning to shoot on iron sights first and getting good at it, then a red dot might be a good addition to your rifle or even pistol if it isn't an impediment to carrying.

Regardless of what you use, practice, practice, practice or you not only are carrying uselessly but you pose a danger to yourself or others.
 
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You son of a bitch it better be a pre-B where you can throw it into a compactor and survive.
It's of 1978 manufacture. Still has the smooth(not knurled) hammer grip, the original logo (C with ž inside) and doesn't have an extruding guide rod for the slide (I have no idea what else to call that thing that comes out of the front of the newer ones). Looks a lot like this one:

3618_1.jpg

I take it "pre-B" means "made before CZ started making a variety of CZ75s which all have a 'b' as part of their suffix".
 
It's of 1978 manufacture. Still has the smooth(not knurled) hammer grip, the original logo (C with ž inside) and doesn't have an extruding guide rod for the slide (I have no idea what else to call that thing that comes out of the front of the newer ones). Looks a lot like this one:

View attachment 4152261

I take it "pre-B" means "made before CZ started making a variety of CZ75s which all have a 'b' as part of their suffix".
Yeah that's a pre B for sure, you've got a second gen one. The first and second gen were made of some sort of literal stalinium (especially the first gen). I knew a guy who needed the slide remachined for some reason and the gunsmith actual broke his standard lathe bits on it.
I've got a CZ 52 and a P-01, been trying to find a RAMI, steel framed P-01, CZ 83 (in 9x18) and an 85 but those former three are hard to find and the last one is no since 2016.
Those are my collector dream items, I guess I'll have to stick with an 83.
 
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From the perspective of a woman with a small frame, if I am going to concealed-carry it clearly has to be something smaller. But generally if you are going to CC you are going to need more than one gun. The first one will not fit you in every circumstance, outfit, weather, etc.
One of my tiny female friends CCs a Taurus Judge. I'm 90% sure it's the 2.0 inch barrel. She's pretty comfy with it.
 
One of my tiny female friends CCs a Taurus Judge. I'm 90% sure it's the 2.0 inch barrel. She's pretty comfy with it.
Ok wut? Actually CCW'ing a Judge? In her purse or something? It's not the worst in terms of cost effectiveness but it's still big.
 
Ok wut? Actually CCW'ing a Judge? In her purse or something? It's not the worst in terms of cost effectiveness but it's still big.
Yeah the Judge is kind of a meme gun.

Those recommending an LCP are on track. I actually really like the trigger on my LCP II, and it isn't as painful to shoot as some say.
 
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Yeah the Judge is kind of a meme gun.

Those recommending an LCP are on track. I actually really like the trigger on my LCP II, and it isn't as painful to shoot as some say.
I've shot a LCP once, gun was completely fine in my hands, though that said I find 40 pleasant, albeit in bigger framed guns that I've fired 40 in. Only place I would consider keeping a Taruas Judge is my car, in that i can keep it in the center console. Even then, while i do carry a revolver for my CCW, a .38, i either want a big 357 magnum for my car, or more appropriately, a high capacity 9mm to 45, leaning more towards 40, like with the SD40VE, as a cheaper alternative to more expensive 40 cals while still packing 14 rounds of auto glass piercing punch. I would want to upgrade the trigger, but all in due time.
 
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Inspired by this thread, I have some related questions:

2. Those with Berettas (or who do/don't like them), care to share what you do/don't like about them?
I love my M92, but it has issues:

1) It's BIG. If you've got small hands, make sure you can grip it comfortably, so rent one if you're thinking about buying one, but I'd say that about all handguns. It's also heavy, but big is the main roadblock to most people.

2) The trigger return spring is fiddly, and even if it doesn't break on you, these are a much better option than the standard since they're basically impossible to install wrong (a reduced power version is available if needed). https://shopwilsoncombat.com/TRIGGER-CONVERSION-UNIT-BERETTA-92_96-STANDARD-POWER/productinfo/644/
I've been happy with mine which I got years ago now, but I do see reviews on the standard power one of late are less positive so be aware if it feels worse after installation the part may be defective.

3) Replace the hammer spring. The trigger is long and heavy by default and I want to say it was the 12lb or 12.5lb hammer spring I went with which improved things quite a bit, but basically anything lighter than factory is a big improvement. Not a light pull after, but also not a pull you fight with in Double Action mode. Easily the biggest improvement I made to mine. This will require tapping the roll pin out of the bottom of the grip with a punch, and if you can craft a drift pin (slightly undersized pin) from a smooth nail (I used bolt-cutters and a file to size and de-burr the pin) that will make maintaining the gun so much easier since the hammer spring and the grips will retain the pin just fine but make removal of the hammer spring much easier in the future.

Note also that you should make sure to test any hammer spring changes with the ammo you plan to use for a few magazines just to make sure you aren't getting light primer strikes, but for context, I never had any issues and I threw cheap shit at mine.

4) Older models are much harder to mount lights/lasers to, but newer models have a rail down there, just keep that in mind when considering the total package.
 
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