OGL aka Open Game License - Wizard Cash in On DND - Give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar,

[Gar For Archer]

Because it's going to be selectively enforced.

Play nice, be woke, don't ruffle feathers, pay your tribute, know your fucking place.

You'll get to make money.

Same as with youtube, patreon, paypal, twitch what have you.

As long as all you're doing is pushing corporate approved consumerism companies will be happy to wait fucking you over.

Look at critical role. They're not extremely woke, but they're not extremely anything. They bend over to be as inoffensive and harmless as possible. They do a lot of other things to, but Patreon isn't going to ban them and youtube isn't going to strangle their channel and companies won't pull sponsorship from them. So they get to make millions.

And people absolutely will go along with it. Games Workshop fucked up a bunch of content creators when launching their streaming service. That streaming service is making them a river of money because warhammer fans were happy to sign up for it.

If a major market place like DriveThruRpg doesn't ban or restrict the old license I could see this not working. But it'll absolutely be the case for their DnDOne platform, and I could easily see players signing up to it just because 'it's what you're supposed to do now'.

The key difference is the part where they own anything and everything you create. A lot of people would be more than happy to play nice but that one line is a bridge few would be willing to cross. This is why it’s not directly comparable you YouTube/Patreon/etc: if you get kicked off YouTube, you can still post your videos on other sites. This new OGL would be like if you got banned from YouTube, and then when you tried to post your old videos to Odysee or Rumble, Google will copyright strike them because they own all of the videos you hosted on YouTube.

 

[Flan Handler]

Dungeons and Dragons has almost as much lore around legal and IP fights over the last 45 years as it does about adventuring.

TSR stands for “They Sue Regularly” and this often went hilariously. In 1997 they sent a cease and desist letter to “the internet”, posting it on all the newsgroups. They said net books were derivative and illegal, and threatened to sue everyone (lol).

When WOTC bought TSR they realized that suing excited, loyal fans would be bad for business, so they brought out the original OGL as a peace offering, a laying-down of arms.

Side note: TSR wasn’t making money from D&D when WOTC took over, their most valuable revenue generator at the time was Dragonlance novels.

This is not (just) a cash grab. They have a D&D movie coming out this March so they want to bring all their IP in house, Disney-style. It’s meant to be punitive and unreasonable so all D&D content is centralized at Hasbro.

They want to make sure every D&D branded toy, bedspread, book, and cartoon (and good lord those are about to hit like a tsunami) is under the control of Hasbro. They do not want anyone else to make a nickel off their IP.

I can business-sperg all day, read Game Wizards if you want to learn more.

 

[mindlessobserver]

This is not (just) a cash grab. They have a D&D movie coming out this March so they want to bring all their IP in house, Disney-style. It’s meant to be punitive and unreasonable so all D&D content is centralized at Hasbro.

This D&D movie? Because if Hasbro thinks it's going to make any money they are seriously deluded.

 

[Flan Handler]

This D&D movie? Because if Hasbro thinks it's going to make any money they are seriously deluded.

View attachment 4248924

Agreed, this looks like crap.

Hasbro has a long-term problem though. Most of their their toys are licensed, they don’t own the IPs, meaning they have the same problem as the OGL ecosystem. So they think they can make money by just co-opting the ecosystem.

Sadly, trannies don’t research their own body mangling, let alone history; this is doomed to fail.

It turns out, as TSR learned through many, many court cases in the 80s and 90s, you can’t actually copyright game rules. You can copyright the words you use to describe them, but you can’t stop other people from performing those actions.

The OGL was implemented to stop a lot of what happened during the ‘80s: “Are you using Hit Points ?” “No, no, these are Points of Smiting, totally different”. The OGL stopped a lot of competing systems from developing by allowing them to use the “TSR words” and thus strengthen the D&D brand.

If you have some time, and want to put yourself some knowledge, here’s an interview with Ryan Dancey, an architect of the old OGL:

 

[mindlessobserver]

Agreed, this looks like crap.

Hasbro has a long-term problem though. Most of their their toys are licensed, they don’t own the IPs, meaning they have the same problem as the OGL ecosystem. So they think they can make money by just co-opting the ecosystem.

Sadly, trannies don’t research their own body mangling, let alone history; this is doomed to fail.

It turns out, as TSR learned through many, many court cases in the 80s and 90s, you can’t actually copyright game rules. You can copyright the words you use to describe them, but you can’t stop other people from performing those actions.

The OGL was implemented to stop a lot of what happened during the ‘80s: “Are you using Hit Points ?” “No, no, these are Points of Smiting, totally different”. The OGL stopped a lot of competing systems from developing by allowing them to use the “TSR words” and thus strengthen the D&D brand.

If you have some time, and want to put yourself some knowledge, here’s an interview with Ryan Dancey, an architect of the old OGL:

There is also a ton of case law over this due to video games as well. Scummy Game Devs have tried to copyright and trademarks best practices in video game design. Things like a Mini Maps, guiding arrows to quest locations and so on. All of it had to be litigated and every single time the courts told the scum sucking game companies to get fucked. They can copyright their intellectual property, but they can't copyright a fucking RPG leveling system or lock on target assist.

 

[Jaimas]

So this leaked earlier:



TL;DR: They don't see the offline customerbase (read: the overpowering majority of their customers) as their primary market, but rather an obstacle to be dealt with, and want to eventually migrate everything into D&D Beyond as an infinite revenue stream via live service model. This will not work for reasons that are patently obvious to anyone with functioning brain cells and a sense of pattern recognition, but it does expose a critical vulnerability if you want to give WOTC and Hasbro both barrels: They care only about Subs for D&D Beyond.

If you have one for some reason, Cancel yours, it will send an unmistakable message.
It's not like you can't find better systems or just wait for smarter people to put up SRDs for 5th for free.

 

[Terrifik]

So this leaked earlier:

View attachment 4249648

TL;DR: They don't see the offline customerbase (read: the overpowering majority of their customers) as their primary market, but rather an obstacle to be dealt with, and want to eventually migrate everything into D&D Beyond as an infinite revenue stream via live service model. This will not work for reasons that are patently obvious to anyone with functioning brain cells and a sense of pattern recognition, but it does expose a critical vulnerability if you want to give WOTC and Hasbro both barrels: They care only about Subs for D&D Beyond.

If you have one for some reason, Cancel yours, it will send an unmistakable message.
It's not like you can't find better systems or just wait for smarter people to put up SRDs for 5th for free.

Can't have that now

https://twitter.com/CHofferCBus/status/1613590902840201218

Edit: Now they're letting them enter their accounts because of illegal stop cancelation.
..............
Might be pulling their 2:00pm stream for DND beyond

DnDBeyond - Twitch

D&D Beyond is the official digital toolset for the world's greatest roleplaying game!

www.twitch.tv

panic mode
follower-only mode & 1month follower

GG

Copium is going to stream 4pm Central.
ran to Tuesday 4pm


...........
Edit: Info Reddit DND & OneDND is under Tranny lockdown.

 

[Shroom King]

I was wondering why this was in the Happenings section. Then I realized these are people who have spent decades arguing if a sword that does 2d4 damage is better than one that does 1d10.

Someone's gonna fail their constitution saving throw over this.

 

[I-chi]

THEY CANCELLED

THEY BITCHED THE FUCK OUT

AAAHHHAHAHAHAHA

 

[Tactical Wizard]

Do you think that their worst case scenario envisioned their entire customer base going into open revolt after immediately declaring a unilateral truce after years of ceaseless online slap fights?

 

[Terrifik]

Wizards of the Coast Cancels OGL Announcement After Online Ire

The new Dungeons & Dragons Open Game License was expected on Thursday afternoon, but a fan campaign against changes has caused the company to hesitate.

gizmodo.com

Dungeons & Dragons publisher Wizards of the Coast has apparently cancelled an announcement about its updated Open Gaming License for a second time this week. Inside sources at Wizards of the Coast tell io9 that the company is scrambling to formulate a response to backlash against the new OGL that has occurred over the past week, following io9's story about a leaked draft of the document.
The result of these cancellations and their impact on the bottom line of Wizards of the Coast is not negligible, according to io9's sources at the company, and has caused upper management to scramble to adjust their messaging around the situation, leading to the delays in the OGL release.

Wizards of the Coast also cancelled a pre-scheduled D&D Beyond live stream on Twitch, which had been set for 3:00 pm on Thursday, although the company stated on its Discord that this was done to update a previously agreed-upon schedule, rather than as a response to the purported announcement.

It remains unclear when Wizards of the Coast will release the hotly anticipated new OGL, and what its final contents will include.

 

[Quindarius]

I can't wait for wizards to take someone to court over the d20 system and get BTFO. It'll be like when Geedubs took that publisher to court over the term "space marine." Expect a sharp downward spiral afterwards. That failed lolsuit is what inspired Geedubs to kill off Fantasy for the more copyrightable Age of Sigmar™

 

[Tactical Wizard]

wtf? I love Paizo now.

Is it just me or did Paizo just activate their trap card? Apparently PF2 uses no SRD content and they're going to make an irrevocable version of the OGL.

 

[Kane Lives]

wtf? I love Paizo now.

Is it just me or did Paizo just activate their trap card? Apparently PF2 uses no SRD content and they're going to make an irrevocable version of the OGL.

They probably anticipated that WOTC will eventually get too greedy and try to make a powerplay like that.

To be fair, anyone who had been watching WOTC recent output could tell you that.

 

[Doctor Professor Timon]

Eh, this inspired me to make my own game, when it's finished, have an OGL. I'm loving the fact so many 3rd party publishers are coming out to make their own - competition in the market is great. WoTC had a stranglehold / monopoly for way too long.

WoTC is about to learn pissing off your customers and people giving you free advertisement is a bad idea.

Paizo is doing well well. I genuinely enjoy their games, systems, and so on. The difference is, Paizo knows who they're writing for, write for them, and just do their business without pissing anyone off.

Why anyone doesn't have one is beyond me. It means if people LIKE your game, they make content for it and advertise it FOR you. It's like advertising dollars, but in the form of slave labor (sure, they keep whatever profits they make, but whatever).

 

[DragoonSierra]

Homebrew publishers who made stuff under the old OGL would be absolutely insane to continue working under the new license because of the retroactive application clause. Hasbro won't just be able to take their shit going foreword, they can also take their old shit too.

If I was any of these guys, I would be going on the record formally with an attorney that they reject the new contract and view it as unilateral breach. At a minimum this will allow them to keep the copyright for their existing work.

Regarding this. Can publishers still publish their old stuff that was made under 1.0? Cause if they cant thats bullshit.

this exact same fucking change did for Blizzard,

refresh me on that.

The key difference is the part where they own anything and everything you create. A lot of people would be more than happy to play nice but that one line is a bridge few would be willing to cross. This is why it’s not directly comparable you YouTube/Patreon/etc: if you get kicked off YouTube, you can still post your videos on other sites. This new OGL would be like if you got banned from YouTube, and then when you tried to post your old videos to Odysee or Rumble, Google will copyright strike them because they own all of the videos you hosted on YouTube.

Its a real problem if they can retroactively modify shit you already made under 1.0 to be 1.1 and say its thiers now. Copyright doesnt work like that.

 

[Gender: Xenomorph]

It's bizzare that telling people what dice to throw in a game is covered under copyright.

If I make a game similar mechanically to DnD and publish the game online, will I get sued?

Is ut illegal to play that game privately?

 

[Doctor Professor Timon]

It's bizzare that telling people what dice to throw in a game is covered under copyright.

If I make a game similar mechanically to DnD and publish the game online, will I get sued?

Is ut illegal to play that game privately?

You can't copyright game mechanics or rules. Wizards will try to be litigious about it, probably. And they have -far- more money than anyone else does to drag on a case for years (until you're broke). They won't do it for everyone, but they're going to, likely, try to make examples out of people.

 

[TheRedChair]

Okay. YOU CAN NOT COPYWRITE GAME MECHANICS. This has been argued in court. I have paid money to my IP attorney years ago on this.

What Wizards can do is everything else. If you use their world, their actual way of writing things then they have claim.

However IMHO and I believe there is a class action lawsuit that is going to happen is that to claim artwork that WotC have not worked out a transaction in the past with said artist. Or trying to get into derivative works... well this again has been argued in court.

What this fucked up company is doing is a money grab throwing money in the courts knowing that the average 3rd party does not have the money (or common sese) to fight them in court. And 3rd parties, well the ones I know are pretty much spineless and lack the ability to do REAL work when the shit goes bad.

That is why Certain Companies like Games Workshop gets with the crap they do... Until they meet someone that calls their bluff.

MAKE NO MISTAKE THESE FUCKERS WILL TRY AGAIN. They will do another reach around the same way politicians try to pass strict gun control. Even by disobeying LAW.

Why do I know this??? Because I deal with these types of ASSHOLES IN MY LIFE.

Look at the fuck the CEO is??? Some god damned Micro$Shaft dickless wonder who thinks EVERYTHING CAN BE MONETIZED TO DEATH.

D&D is an Analog... A hard copy game. This does not do well in the Digital World. If it did we would not be seeing any hard copy books being made.

However you are having the shitheads trying real hard to make it completely digital.
And that will not work very well. As seen by current buyers of said product.

You can't copyright game mechanics or rules. Wizards will try to be litigious about it, probably. And they have -far- more money than anyone else does to drag on a case for years (until you're broke). They won't do it for everyone, but they're going to, likely, try to make examples out of people.

You know you can get help from an Attorney PRO BONO basis...
In the US, Attorneys are required to to do so.

 

[East_Clintwood]

Wasn't it already covered in the other thread that the baseline legal structure of this whole situation states that the original OGL cannot be revoked, only a new OGL can be created; and that it cannot re-contextualize its preceding license in order for anyone who isn't happy with the changes to just revert back to how things were?

Yes and no. The prevailing legal analysis online suggests it can't be revoked, and the original creators have stated they never intended for it to be able to be revoked, but there's enough theoretical ambiguity there that we won't know for sure unless and until someone challenges it legally and we get some sort of definitive ruling.