Overwatch

[Haramburger]

Can someone confirm that Six-Shooter from Puppetmaster is referenced in Overwatch? This is a huge deal.

There's a Capture Point/then Payload map from launch called Hollywood, and the attacking team starts in a movie theater; amongst the fake movie posters on the wall, you can find this one.

 

[Y2K Baby]

There's a Capture Point/then Payload map from launch called Hollywood, and the attacking team starts in a movie theater; amongst the fake movie posters on the wall, you can find this one.
View attachment 783639

Overwatch is now a 2/10.

 

[Haramburger]

Overwatch is now a 2/10.

It's a Blizzard game, always assume the pop culture reference is there, and you have to prove it wasn't made. BAH RAM YOU

 

[Y2K Baby]

It's a Blizzard game, always assume the pop culture reference is there, and you have to prove it wasn't made. BAH RAM YOU

Puppetmaster isn't really popculture. Surprised they didn't take it out after the last movie was about the puppets committing hate crimes.

 

[Tanner Glass]

Puppetmaster isn't really popculture. Surprised they didn't take it out after the last movie was about the puppets committing hate crimes.

You could make an argument that "Six Gun Killer" is a pop culture reference to a line from "Boondock Saints" - "What if it was one guy with six guns?".

 

[Y2K Baby]

You could make an argument that "Six Gun Killer" is a pop culture reference to a line from "Boondock Saints" - "What if it was one guy with six guns?".

But it's a cowboy with 6 arms.

 

[Snake of Diamond]

OW characters are bland because none of the character designers have talent. This is primarily because none of the OW characters have flaws that would be fun to play off of (they're all super talented, hyper powerful, one in a generation unique, good guys). The few bad guys they have are mainly former good guys (Reaper, Moira, Widowmaker) who are all also super talented geniuses. There's nothing in the setting that would be considered fun, either. They have few links between each other and rarely interact through voice lines in a way that acknowledges one another. Even adding small details like having any of the "Overwatch" affiliated characters say a small throwaway line like "What's he doing here?" when a round starts with Reaper/Doomfist on your team would go a long way.

It isn't the lack of talent it's more of the unwillingness to just stick with a healthy cast of characters instead of the gameplay playing around the characters the characters play around the gameplay. A new character would fuck the dynamic of the classes in TF2 you already have the feel of each character, their personalities and they play their roles good. They each play off each other their personalities bounce about but not aggressively it's why people enjoy the dynamic of the Scout and Spy. With out "Dragon" the animated short of Hanzo and Genji you wouldn't get that these characters are related as Overwatch despite like I said on how they hyped this world of the gameplay and lore are so disconnected they're on different planets in different star systems. Of course with a game like this that's kind of blizzard's fault as these characters can't have entire conversations in game.

It's a lot easier to enjoy a setting when you understand the characters easily which is a simple thing in TF2. It's something that's expressed often and cleanly, during every action that you take and is taken against you. In Overwatch it's so far in the background and rarely seen in the game, you could play the game for hours and not realize that Reaper isn't part of the OW team, that Genji and Hanzo are related, etc, etc because these links exist in comics/the wiki page/the youtube channel, etc.

Overwatch had the Destiny problem of hyping up this grand story that was far off in the distance and needed to be gained from another source entirely. The reason why Team Fortress does this is that they didn't start off trying to make you care about these characters they didn't hype up some crap and dangle keys in your face so that you would wait for the next animated short that doesn't explain much or a one shot comic that negates or retcons something. They built the game then the world around them.

Overwatch often cites TF2 as a resource/inspiration - but the more I play the two games I wonder where they took inspiration from because I can't find any of what I would consider "TF2's essence" in Overwatch outside of they're both class-based team shooters.

That's part of the issue with citing TF2 as Paladins also claims to be based on TF2 but to that game's credit it has a way more interesting direction that Overwatch as the more urban/high fantasyish setting allows for a more expansive palette.

 

[Smug Chuckler]

Rumor is that Overwatch 2 is going to be announced this year stealing shit from another Valve game. Get ready for the franchise to be CoD'd.

Sources: Blizzard Cancels StarCraft First-Person Shooter To Focus On …

archived 6 Jun 2019 21:11:26 UTC

archive.fo

 

[Tanner Glass]

Rumor is that Overwatch 2 is going to be announced this year stealing shit from another Valve game. Get ready for the franchise to be CoD'd.

Sources: Blizzard Cancels StarCraft First-Person Shooter To Focus On …

archived 6 Jun 2019 21:11:26 UTC

archive.fo

For those who won't want to read the article, OW2 is compared by (alleged) Blizzard employees as "Similar to Left 4 Dead".

Why can't they do that in the existing OW engine and why on earth would they need to release a entirely new game? Does Overwatch feel "complete" to anyone over at Blizzard - because this idea sounds like an expansion pack at absolute best.

 

[Tookie]

Why can't they do that in the existing OW engine and why on earth would they need to release a entirely new game? Does Overwatch feel "complete" to anyone over at Blizzard - because this idea sounds like an expansion pack at absolute best.

My guess is the existing game will go F2P and this "sequel" with single-player and PvE content will be the new paid version.

 

[Tanner Glass]

My guess is the existing game will go F2P and this "sequel" with single-player and PvE content will be the new paid version.

It's a real shame that the only thing that Overwatch didn't steal from TF2 (besides the game being fun) was the DLC structure - as TF2 has added several different game modes over the years and none of them have ever been charged for. They've added (and basically invented) payload and payload race, added Mann v Machine, PASS Time, competive mode, end of the line mode, Mannpower mode, and Special Delivery as well as a number of new maps and all free.

The only slight exception to that is competitive mode (6v6) but that's primairly to stop people who are banned from rejoining matches and/or hacking.

 

[Stab You in the Back]

This reeks of the boy who cried wolf. Diablo 4 was totally happening last year. Overwatch has been going F2P for over a year now. Warcraft IV, World of Warcraft 2, etc, etc. NONE of the leaks have ever turned out to be true. ZERO.

You want to know what all this shit is? Its manufactured leaks meant to drive interest to Blizzcon. "This is the year we announce Diablo 4, so buy our $50 virtual blizzcon tickets to watch the announcement live you fat stupid fucks! Just kidding, its a mobile game. No refunds."

 

[Snake of Diamond]

Rumor is that Overwatch 2 is going to be announced this year stealing shit from another Valve game. Get ready for the franchise to be CoD'd.

Sources: Blizzard Cancels StarCraft First-Person Shooter To Focus On …

archived 6 Jun 2019 21:11:26 UTC

archive.fo

They might Destiny 2 the idea. The incentive is very low but the idea is to dangle features in your face and convince you that they couldn't just be implemented in the first game and force an excuse to push out a sequel.

 

[Mike Hunt]

It's a real shame that the only thing that Overwatch didn't steal from TF2 (besides the game being fun) was the DLC structure - as TF2 has added several different game modes over the years and none of them have ever been charged for. They've added (and basically invented) payload and payload race, added Mann v Machine, PASS Time, competive mode, end of the line mode, Mannpower mode, and Special Delivery as well as a number of new maps and all free.

The only slight exception to that is competitive mode (6v6) but that's primairly to stop people who are banned from rejoining matches and/or hacking.

To be fair, Blizzard does add maps and characters for free over time as long as you already paid for the base game. They've also added new game modes in the Arcade section, the only problem being that a number of modes are time-limited. You might see one game mode in Arcade this week, and then it's rotated out the next week. The addition of the workshop mode does drastically add a number of new modes, essentially, but you're relying on the community (or investing time in creating stuff yourself) for those modes, and there's no real one-stop shop so far where you could easily find codes to input to try other people's creations - and let's be honest, not all user-generated content are winners, so there's a whole lot of trial and error in which ones are good and which ones aren't.

 

[V0dka]

For those who won't want to read the article, OW2 is compared by (alleged) Blizzard employees as "Similar to Left 4 Dead".

Why can't they do that in the existing OW engine and why on earth would they need to release a entirely new game? Does Overwatch feel "complete" to anyone over at Blizzard - because this idea sounds like an expansion pack at absolute best.

Overwatch was a complete rush job after Titan was shuttered, they needed something. Anything. I'm honestly surprised the game runs as good as it does considering they just went "okay Titans fucked what can we do with some of these assets we have left?" And someone went, well....."TF2 doesn't really have a successor" and they went "okay GO GO GO"

The thing is probably barebones under the hood, it's probably why they haven't been able to expand the game properly, the thing held together with duct tape and copper wire.

 

[kadoink]

But it's a cowboy with 6 arms.

Ya mean one of these?

 

[Tanner Glass]

Overwatch was a complete rush job after Titan was shuttered, they needed something. Anything. I'm honestly surprised the game runs as good as it does considering they just went "okay Titans fucked what can we do with some of these assets we have left?" And someone went, well....."TF2 doesn't really have a successor" and they went "okay GO GO GO"

The thing is probably barebones under the hood, it's probably why they haven't been able to expand the game properly, the thing held together with duct tape and copper wire.

I think their inability to expand the game is tied to the design philosophy, instead of any programming issues. One of the main intentional differences between TF2 and OW is how long it takes to kill someone. In TF2 death is fast and very frequent - where as in OW it's a much longer, drawn out process (barring some exceptions).

The biggest, beefiest character in TF2 (a heavy, while being overhealed by a medic) has 450 HP - which means he will still be oneshot killed by 2 classes (Sniper, Spy) and killed very easily by other classes in under 3 seconds. Compared to a beefy OW character, Reinhardt, who has 300 health, 200 armor, and a rechargable 2000 HP shield - cannot be oneshot killed by anything in the game. He would need to be headshotted twice in a row, without ever deploying his shield or getting healed, to die. His shield with it's 2000 HP, represents more health than the entirety of your team, should you be the only tank on it (Average HP in OW is ~200-250 for DPS/Heals).

The game is hard to expand because they've fundamentally put themselves in a corner with the game systems (HP pools, hard counters, armor + extra armor + shields + equippable shields) and you can't really expand the game to be anything other than what it is unless you fundamentally change a large number of the systems - drastically altering the game they've been pushing for years. They can't really make tank characters less "tanky" because that's the entire point of having a "tank". If people die too fast there isn't a point for "healers" either. If you remove "Tanks" and "Healers" you've got a much different game than what Overwatch currently is.

EDIT - Or if you don't like TF2, compare OW kill times to R6: Siege, CS:GO, or any other popular team-based shooter. OW's meta/classes line up more with an MMO (with Tank/DPS/Healer) than a class shooter.

 

[Snake of Diamond]

I think their inability to expand the game is tied to the design philosophy, instead of any programming issues. One of the main intentional differences between TF2 and OW is how long it takes to kill someone. In TF2 death is fast and very frequent - where as in OW it's a much longer, drawn out process (barring some exceptions).

The biggest, beefiest character in TF2 (a heavy, while being overhealed by a medic) has 450 HP - which means he will still be oneshot killed by 2 classes (Sniper, Spy) and killed very easily by other classes in under 3 seconds. Compared to a beefy OW character, Reinhardt, who has 300 health, 200 armor, and a rechargable 2000 HP shield - cannot be oneshot killed by anything in the game. He would need to be headshotted twice in a row, without ever deploying his shield or getting healed, to die. His shield with it's 2000 HP, represents more health than the entirety of your team, should you be the only tank on it (Average HP in OW is ~200-250 for DPS/Heals).

The game is hard to expand because they've fundamentally put themselves in a corner with the game systems (HP pools, hard counters, armor + extra armor + shields + equippable shields) and you can't really expand the game to be anything other than what it is unless you fundamentally change a large number of the systems - drastically altering the game they've been pushing for years. They can't really make tank characters less "tanky" because that's the entire point of having a "tank". If people die too fast there isn't a point for "healers" either.

EDIT - Or if you don't like TF2, compare OW kill times to R6: Siege, CS:GO, or any other popular team-based shooter. OW's meta/classes line up more with an MMO (with Tank/DPS/Healer) than a class shooter.

I think the reason why they're in the corner is because they have this "time to kill" idea from other FPS games where there's so many options on staying alive the only way to negate these options is through ultimate abilities. This sort of thinking is to prioritize the idea of fairness as because nobody in theory will be dying extremely quickly thus it's easier for more put together teams to withstand the attrition and end up in a stalemate where the only strategy will be hoping someone messes up. TF2 is more centered around understanding the team you're on so survivablity actually is a team based mechanic and loadout management rather than in OWs case of what character you picked.

 

[Tanner Glass]

I think the reason why they're in the corner is because they have this "time to kill" idea from other FPS games where there's so many options on staying alive the only way to negate these options is through ultimate abilities. This sort of thinking is to prioritize the idea of fairness as because nobody in theory will be dying extremely quickly thus it's easier for more put together teams to withstand the attrition and end up in a stalemate where the only strategy will be hoping someone messes up. TF2 is more centered around understanding the team you're on so survivablity actually is a team based mechanic and loadout management rather than in OWs case of what character you picked.

I would disagree with that, actually. Despite being Team Fortess 2 - I don't think there's a hard requirement on knowing your team all that well (unless you're in competitive, which then it is boiled down to knowing your med's status). There are loose guidelines, of course (no more than 3 of any class on a team, no more than 1 engy on the attacking team, etc) but I think Overwatch does a much better job in forcing you to know and care about where your team is (and who they are), where the enemy team is (and who they are), and does a better job (read : not a great job) at giving you the information.

I also think this is where a lot of the toxicity comes from is that very core gameplay design - when one of your teammates isn't doing what they're supposed to (ex - tanking, shielding, healing, or specifically killing counter DPS) it becomes immediately apparent when the situation falls apart. When your Reinhardt charges off a cliff by accident, it leaves you exposed and you will likely be killed and get mad about it - because your team is missing a key piece, you're likely going to get team wiped or pushed way back in your pursuit of the objective.

TF2 has it to some degree, but they're usually much smaller things. Teleporters/Dispensers and availability of Ubercharges come to mind, but even those are more "team oriented" things as opposed to a single player's responsibility. A medic being frequently killed could mean that they are playing badly, but it also could mean that the enemy is smart about targeting them, that the friendly team is bad about indemnifying spies, or the enemy team has a talented scout/soldier who is able to move around the map quickly.

 

[Snake of Diamond]

I also think this is where a lot of the toxicity comes from is that very core gameplay design - when one of your teammates isn't doing what they're supposed to (ex - tanking, shielding, healing, or specifically killing counter DPS) it becomes immediately apparent when the situation falls apart. When your Reinhardt charges off a cliff by accident, it leaves you exposed and you will likely be killed and get mad about it - because your team is missing a key piece, you're likely going to get team wiped or pushed way back in your pursuit of the objective.

Come to think of it it has the MOBA issue when it comes to how players treat each other or should treat each other. The dynamic of the team is really strict you pretty much have to play with everyone else as characters lean on each other like you mentioned with Reinhardt. Everything feels like flimsy glue that needs to be pressed together forcibly otherwise the whole structure will fragment and fall apart.