Positive Camellia Thoughts and a Small Romance Mod. Heavy spoilers for Camellia.
Righteous : Story
Bro wrote a book on a videogame character.
Edit: I'll eventually respond to every top-level comment although it might take a few days. Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
Spoiler warning: pretty much the entirety of Camellia's story. This is a Camellia appreciation post. Minor spoiler in [5] for Sosiel's Companion Quest. Minor spoilers in [5] for a handful of NPCs (Nurah). Maybe small thematic spoilers for Arueshalae and Regill in [4]. Tiny thematic spoiler for the main story in [2]. Small spoiler for Nenio in the next paragraph.
Over the past several weeks, I have noticed a lot of vitriol directed at Camellia in the subreddit and Discord. That's understandable because Camellia is bad news. There's also a lot of misinformation about her past out there. That's also understandable because her backstory is buried deeply in her Companion Quest. (Nenio seems to catch a lot of flak for a similar reason.) However, that vitriol/misinformation combo is a lot of meh. Sure, it's cool that some people don't like Camellia, but the vitriol is unnecessary: Camellia's not real.
The internet is icky, so that's life. I think a lot of people are unintentionally mean sometimes. Strangely (and, maybe amusingly), even the Owlcat Games Community team gets in on it. On both the Owlcat Twitter and in Discord, Owlcat mods/folk dunk on Camellia. Like, they know that Camellia's not real, right? Don't some of them work with the designers and writers for her?
Well, whatever. I can't change that. However, I do want to talk about how fantastic Camellia is. If you're thinking about romancing her, I think it's well worth it. Easily the best in the game.
To start, some housekeeping. I am a big proponent of letting people enjoy what they enjoy. I use superlatives ("Easily the best in the game.") to express a subjective joy. I don't think there's a correct or objective way to enjoy a game. My goal isn't to tear down people who appreciate other things; instead, I want to celebrate what I enjoy.
This is not a defense of Camellia's morality. Again, she's bad news. Instead, this is a defense of appreciating Camellia and what she is in WotR.
I love Camellia. I love her for a lot of reasons, but I will focus on the below six.
- Romance.
- Camellia Teases Lore.
- Past.
- Presentation of Evil.
- Camellia's Victims.
- Endings.
[1] Romance.
Romancing Camellia is watching an unstoppable force meet an immovable object. It's evident from the off that her "destructive tendencies" would conflict with her love of the Commander. Seeing how that plays out was the most interesting part of the game for me. (I've been around the save-the-world block a few hundred times: yeah, yeah, yeah, Big Bad, you're threatening the world for some bullshit; join the club.)
It's strange to say it about a serial killer, but it's cute to watch Camellia slowly fall in love with the Commander despite herself. Camellia, obviously driven primarily by thrill-seeking, suddenly has something that she's afraid to lose.
For me, falling in love feels like shifting perspective on what you want. It isn't that the other things aren't important anymore: it's just that where they fall on the scale has changed.
This video reminds me of it. (Warning: it's a nontechnical math video.)
Camellia's reluctant realization that her priorities are shifting and her consequent fear of that shift felt like the most genuine part of the game to me. The fragility of her relationship with the Commander and her struggles with relapsing into self-destruction are touchingly, surprisingly sympathetic. Even if not romanced, in her Act 4 quest, her relationship with the Commander and its interaction with her "destructive tendencies" begin to tie her to the Commander irreversibly. There are moments where it seems Camellia doesn't fully understand herself or her feelings, and that's not terribly surprising for a person with her past.
I've seen people argue that Camellia doesn't deserve redemption or can't be redeemed. I get where they're coming from and think that opinion is fair, but I disagree with it. There's a difference between "can't be redeemed" and "isn't redeemed in the game." Camellia can genuinely love someone, and she does experience fear, shame, and regret. Having her ascend reveals another dimension of her that I still haven't fully wrapped my mind around, but it seems positive.
Anyway, I like it a lot. Thanks, Owlcat.
[2] Camellia Teases Lore.
Death is not the end in the Pathfinder Universe. That seems like such a hard concept for writers to keep straight.
When my Commander first discovered Camellia's crimes, I was waiting for the obvious choice of attempting to resurrect her victims. Yeah, they're dead, I'm somewhat responsible, I'll bring them back. And I just never got the option?
I generally headcanon this discrepancy as a gameplay/story split, but that's inconsistent in WotR. Resurrection comes up in the main story (and some Companion Quests) as a reasonable solution. Why doesn't Camellia's story acknowledge this?
If Camellia wants to kill the Commander, so what? Let her. Camellia's Shaman class gets "Raise Dead," and she can just bring the Commander back. Even if the Commander doesn't trust Camellia to do it, there's still Daeran, Sosiel, and the Commander's fortune. If your Commander's a Chaotic Evil Trickster, weird sex things are pretty low on the concern-meter.
[3] Past.
Camellia's tragic backstory is second-to-none in this game. (Admittedly, tragedy is common in WotR.)
Camellia isn't a noble. Her father is a servant who stole the name of a noble and became obsessed with that name's stature. Camellia's mother, Iris, was an elven servant. Horgus never acknowledged her as his daughter (barring maybe the will in Act 5) in the household. With a father whose only apparent concern is his stolen name, it's not clear to me that he loves Camellia. Camellia doubts it too. With the possible exception of the Commander, I don't think anyone's ever loved Camellia. (Maybe Iris, but.)
Camellia's shaman powers are real: she does hear the spirits' voices. Since she was raised in Kenabres, toddler-Camellia probably had cruel spirits whispering bile in her ears. Her killing of her dog (which was her first) is horrifying, but her description of the event sounds somewhat accidental. And, she must be, like, two or three years old at the time. Horgus's description of the following animal deaths mentions Camellia talking about spirits whispering to her, which seems pretty legit to me.
Iris, understandably freaked out about the animal-killing, attempts to correct this by having doctors, psychics, and exorcists help Camellia; but they're unqualified and probably hurt more than help. Even modern mental health care is often pretty dicey. What hope is there for functional mental health care in Kenabres? (Mental health care probably isn't the solution: instead, they need a shaman to teach Camellia to control her powers. It's not apparent that she's mentally ill at that point.) Also, keep in mind that Hulrun's around. When none of that works, Iris seems inclined to kill Camellia, but Horgus stops her, apparently unintentionally killing Iris. Camellia's maybe 4-years-old at that point?
Horgus then indefinitely locks up Camellia in her room. Horgus eventually finds a competent Varisian shaman to teach Camellia. However, that mentor tortures her. The torture equipment throughout the mansion is the mentor's. The mentor abuses her for three months before Camellia kills her. Camellia is six years old.
Honestly, good on Camellia. Wow.
Camellia stays locked up for the rest of her time in the mansion, only let out for lessons and supervised trips. Imagine being in lockdown without the internet for over ten years. At some point, bandits break into the Gwerm mansion. Guards subdue them, and Camellia tortures and kills them in the basement. Horrifying but sounds like a typical Saturday for avenging-angelbros. Her amulet and Mireya are part of a cover story to hide her alignment and give her some leeway with her father.
The mentor was Camellia's first victim. The bandits are two through five. Then, you start the game.
Source 1, Spoiler:
https://imgur.com/KD9qaux
Source 2, Spoiler:
https://imgur.com/a/mGyOEys
Most of the above comes out in Camellia's Companion Quest in Act 5, but you have to dig around for it. I have more screenshots and lines but didn't feel like creating 10 Imgur links. Also, I was pretty sympathetic to Horgus in the early game. However, after getting his "Survive" ending (Owlcat patched it in after release, I think.) and the quest mentioned above, I kind of 180'd on him.
[4] Presentation of Evil.
For the vast majority of evil companions, their evil is somewhat off-to-the-side. I think this is to make it easier for players to be sympathetic to them. Even if the companions commit evil acts in-game, they don't happen directly in your face, or they're given some compelling excuse. I think of this as "giving grace." This happens quite a bit in WotR.
Camellia is interesting because she's intentionally not given grace, and Owlcat very much forces the Commander into facing her crimes. The things that could make her more sympathetic are buried deeply in her Companion Questline. Her revelation in Act 3 still causes my stomach to turn. (Wenduag, I think, similarly doesn't get much grace.)
However, there are characters in WotR who get grace. Nocticula and Socothbenoth are on another plane of evil; but, a player might not think much about their morality since the game doesn't focus on their cruelty. And, you can quasi-romance them without seeing that cruelty firsthand!
Several of the other evil companions get a significant amount of grace. I'll briefly speak on Arueshalae and Regill for two reasons: one, I genuinely believe both are more evil than Camellia; and, two, they're popular, so they'll be fine. Before I get into this, I know people will disagree on the relative evil of Arueshalae and Regill to Camellia, and that's cool. Those discussions are novels themselves. My point is that the game emphasizes some things that make some characters sympathetic and downplays other things that would make them unsympathetic. That is, it gives them grace.
Arueshalae's grace comes in the form of when the game's story takes place, how she's granted a chance at redemption, and the game somewhat jumping over her past. If the game's story occurred earlier or if Desna weren't impulsive, Arueshalae's presentation would be significantly different. Act 4 goes into her past a bit, but it's all colored by Arueshalae's currently ongoing redemption.
Regill's grace comes in how the game downplays his cruelty to his subordinates and the people beneath him and emphasizes his usefulness to the Commander. It's real easy to be Lawful when you create the Laws; and, oh yeah, all the Laws benefit you. (Cuts a little close to home.) The grace given to him is a little silly sometimes when it undermines his character: Regill, my man, you had to know things weren't going well on my Demon and Trickster runs. Why aren't you doing anything to stop me?
I like how Nocticula, Socothbenoth, Arueshalae, and Regill are portrayed. My point is that their portrayal colors our sympathies of them. I wonder if Camellia would be received more sympathetically by some parts of the fandom if Owlcat led her story with "was a young child with parents who didn't understand her powers, didn't get the help she needed, got tortured by her mentor, was locked up forever, had no friends, and no one ever loved her." I mean, yikes.
Anyway, I appreciate Wenduag and Camellia because their presentation feels honest to me. It's intense.
[5] Camellia's Victims.
This is somewhat related to [4] but is mostly just me making fun of Owlcat.
If you go along with Camellia's murdering, you have the option to give her victims. This gives you some flexibility in her final Companion Quest. Strangely, most of the people that you can give to her are evil?
The five people that I found were:
- Kaylessa.
- Shaman in Wintersun.
- Hulrun/Ramien. This depends on how you resolved their quest in Kenabres.
- The Trever imposter.
- Nurah.
Only Ramien is good, and even he triggers the aeon-warning-sense. My LG paladin would be comfortable smiting most people on that list. I don't think this means anything story-wise, but it's funny to consider.
[6] Endings.
Before I get into this, I want to say that I appreciate and respect Owlcat Games. I think WotR is fantastic, and I'm glad I spent the $200~ish bucks on the Beta/Alpha. I love Camellia, and I wouldn't change much about her (except maybe give her more content).
I've seen Camellia's Romance ending described as a bad ending. I don't think it's a bad ending, and I don't think it's a neutral or a good ending either. It's a nonending. It feels as if Owlcat put the climax where the resolution should have been and punted on the resolution. In their defense, there is a lot of story in this game, and an Owlcat designer's focus is probably on the overarching story-map rather than on the small area that I'm concerned with (Camellia).
I am okay with a nonending for Camellia's Romance ending. I prefer an unequivocally happy ending (with other variations), but I can work with a nonending. I honestly suspect that Camellia's romance endings weren't finished: even with the vague nonending, her romance ending wasn't coherent with my Commander or with the other ending slides. I can only hope that Owlcat revisits.
With that said, it's a bummer that Camellia seems to get the least amount of ending content for the companions. I've completed several runs now, and I got more ending variation for Regill than Camellia when I didn't even complete Regill's questline. It's strange to fully complete her questline (nonromanced) and get dumped into the Ignored tag, which seems to be the tag you get when you don't finish the questlines for the other companions. I don't expect perfect parity across the companions, but it feels pretty blatant. The other companions seem to get at least three variations on a normal ending. I am jealous.
Anyway, with all that said, I'm not a do-nothing guy, so I made a mod to slightly improve Camellia's Romance Ending. It's here:
https://www.nexusmods.com/pathfinderwrathoftherighteous/mods/170/
It's not much, but you got to start somewhere. My goal is to build on Owlcat's work, not to contradict it. I mean, there's no chance that my Chaotic Evil Trickster Commander didn't go after her.
Is this technically the first romance mod for an Owlcat Game?
