Press release: “Incels” need mental health support rather than a counter terrorism intervention, the world’s largest study of Incels finds (accessible

Link: https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...rlds-largest-study-of-incels-finds-accessible

A ground-breaking study has discovered the complex relationship between mental health, a shared worldview and the social networking of involuntary celibate (incel) communities.

The Commission for Countering Extremism (CCE) commissioned the Swansea University Research on the Incel Community (SURIC) to produce this report. This is the largest global study of incels to date.

Key findings:​

• The answer to the incel phenomenon is more closely aligned to mental health support than counter terrorism interventions.
• Mental Health: Incels typically display extremely poor mental health, with high incidences of depression and suicidal thoughts (one in three incels contemplated suicide every day for the past two weeks). They are also more likely to be neurodivergent, with a higher likelihood of diagnosis for autism spectrum disorder.
• Attitudes and Beliefs: Participants perceived high levels of victimhood, anger, and misogyny. They acknowledged a shared worldview among incels which includes identifying feminists as a primary enemy. They also identified the political (far) left, wider society and women as enemies.
• Approval of violence: There exists a small cohort (5%) who ‘endorse the use of violence to defend their community. When asked if they justify violence against people that incels perceive as causing harm to them, 5% of respondents said ‘Often’. Around 20% said “Sometimes”.
• Political beliefs: Many commentators have suggested a link between incels and the far right. However, this survey found that incels were politically centre-left on average. The exception was the 5% who agreed that violence against individuals that that cause incels harm is often justified; these individuals were politically centre-right.
• Predicting harm: Mental Health and adoption of incel Ideology were significantly more likely to predict the development of harmful views than Social Networking (time spent on social network sites, amount of interaction with others, content generation, and exposure to radical people and content).

Commissioner for Countering Extremism, Robin Simcox said:

What incels truly think and believe has been the source of consistent speculation and conjecture. However, all of us – including those who work in counter extremism – should be led by the evidence.
This study is the most exhaustive research into incels yet and provides a major challenge to conventional wisdoms on the topic. It is no surprise to see the authors uncovered alarming and unacceptable attitudes of misogyny and hatred towards women from incels.
However, the report’s findings suggest that adopting a security or counter-terrorism lens towards incels is not often going to be the most appropriate response. Neither is scaremongering about them forming part of a global Extreme Right Wing threat.
Where there is a risk of violence, the appropriate authorities must always be informed. However, finding ways to ensure this desperate, depressed cohort of men, often with poor mental health, are integrated into society and given appropriate support should also be a key part of any response.

Notes to editors​

• Predicting Harm Among Incels (Involuntary Celibates): The Roles of Mental Health, Ideological Belief and Social Networking will be published on the CCE website at 9am on Thursday 15 February.
• This research was published as part of the CCE’s ‘Rethinking Extremism’ series, to present innovative and thought-provoking research to government, counter-extremism professionals, and the wider public. It forms part of a wider CCE approach to providing advice and scrutiny to government on the approaches needed to counter extremism.
• The research was undertaken by Dr Joe Whittaker, Dr Andrew G. Thomas and William Costello from the Swansea University Research on the Incel Community (SURIC).
• For further information, please contact info@counteringextremism.gov.uk

 

[Not A Bunny]

And honestly how does a woman fuck up to the point of being over 25 and having zero experience barring being a femcel?

Not so much "fuck up" but "be fucked up".

Spoiler: Minor PL

Domestic abuse, fun for the whole family!

 

[Celestial Peace]

Not so much "fuck up" but "be fucked up".

Spoiler: Minor PL

Domestic abuse, fun for the whole family!

In your POV what makes men reach that age without GF XP?

Would abuse be one of the reasons?

 

[KittyGremlin]

I dunno guys, judging by how much Beuty Parlor women talk and think about you, I think you underestimate your chances with women. Maybe it's time to drop that defeatist attitude for a minute?

 

[Audit]

And honestly how does a woman fuck up to the point of being over 25 and having zero experience barring being a femcel?

This is surprisingly normal for religious girls who go to college, don't date in college, and wait for "God to provide" them with a husband. Add in a few grad degrees, and they're in their 30's and STILL not seeking a man.

In other words, feeling entitled to a relationship magically appearing and avoiding social situations that might cause relationships. Most women aren't sluts, regardless of what OF stats might suggest. A woman who spends her 20's "finding herself" can easily isolate herself from men by sticking to women-dominated social environments. And really, what woman can be blamed for staying away from men who seek humanities degrees. They want a provider, not a therapist.

 

[Wendell X]

And really, what woman can be blamed for staying away from men who seek humanities degrees. They want a provider, not a therapist.

Fixed it for you

 

[Celestial Peace]

This is surprisingly normal for religious girls who go to college, don't date in college, and wait for "God to provide" them with a husband. Add in a few grad degrees, and they're in their 30's and STILL not seeking a man.

I was referring to women who were seeking out relationships and couldn't find one.

Most women aren't sluts, regardless of what OF stats might suggest.

This is where I step in and say: It depends on where you're from.

Societal reactions to slutiness and casual sex can vary from culture to culture.

For example, Latin Americans might have a different perception about that compared to Americans.

I dunno guys, judging by how much Beuty Parlor women talk and think about you, I think you underestimate your chances with women. Maybe it's time to drop that defeatist attitude for a minute?

Perhaps dealing with BPD women isn't something that anyone here would feel like.

 

[Not A Bunny]

In your POV what makes men reach that age without GF XP?

Would abuse be one of the reasons?

Possibly, and it depends. My specific case is way different than, say, the men I've encountered that were raped as adolescents.

One was excruciatingly shy about sex. The other fucked everything that moved. Both situations were wildly different.

Abuse would be a huge reason. Domestic abuse could cause someone to shy away from human contact to hide bruises or shame. Alternately, you could be that kid that everyone picks on because you happened to become an acceptable target; if that happens young enough, you start carrying around the idea that nobody would like you anyway, so you perpetuate your own cycle of not understanding socially acceptable behavior, and then not reaching milestones others are because nobody will associate with you.

Or they could have a toxic dynamic with Mom that produces something like an Ed Gein, just without the murder and body parts.

An ex-boyfriend would tell me that his son entirely eschewed girlfriends (the son was 19 at the time I was seeing the ex), for very red-pill reasons. Basically: he could get a girl pregnant and it would ruin his life. Knowing the ex, I suspect it had a lot to do with his mother (who was neglectful to not only her kids but apparently to herself as well). So, shitty modeling from parents could also be a factor.

Basically, mentally healthy children feel okay with seeking out relationships, because they've been modeled properly. I honestly think the "incel" problem does start at home, because there really is something fundamental about being able to understand what makes one attractive, relatable, and personable that starts in childhood.

 

[Odd Opossum]

Being MATI over incels as if they're really being that much of a threat when you have way bigger threats in society is worthy of a lolcow take.

I never said they were a threat outside of a few, just losers who aren't worth the wasted effort trying to "help".

 

[Celestial Peace]

Abuse would be a huge reason. Domestic abuse could cause someone to shy away from human contact to hide bruises or shame. Alternately, you could be that kid that everyone picks on because you happened to become an acceptable target; if that happens young enough, you start carrying around the idea that nobody would like you anyway, so you perpetuate your own cycle of not understanding socially acceptable behavior, and then not reaching milestones others are because nobody will associate with you.

Given that bullying is something not unheard of among incels that likely is the case. It's funny because I suppose people like Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold are the posterboys for the more batshit incels that have wet dreams on being NBK but both Harris and Klebold were far away from being the social outcasts media alternatives painted them out to be (specially after Klebold's mother started to seek media clout).

Both were fucked up kids who wanted to mimic the Oklahoma bombings or Waco siege incident and wanted to use school grounds for that but they had their own social groups there and both had manipulative and narcissistic traits. Also, it is unknown if their actions had sexist motives and maybe they wouldn't fit into the incel definition for that reason.

Standard Incels for the most part aside from being unable to find a romantic partner barely have any IRL friends. The only group they have is exactly internet forums where they gather to interact with each other in their own twisted style. Some of them may display narcissistic tendencies for thinking they deserve 10/10 women but I like to think this is just L'Homme Supreme's legacy which like it or not left a huge influence on incels that still lingers on to this day.

Or they could have a toxic dynamic with Mom that produces something like an Ed Gein, just without the murder and body parts.

Which begs the question: What would tell mother and child apart? Social skills? Becuase if genetics are something to be considered both end up sharing the same psychological tendencies.

Momcels can be a case of reverse Oedipus complex because it wouldn't be uncommon to see incels holding grudges towards their own mothers. But, as with most crazy and overbearing mothers, said grudges aren't uncalled for.

But given that a typical standard incel is unable to find a partner it's unlikely they'll have opportunities to spread their genes further. That's what perhaps tells them apart from their mothers.

shitty modeling from parents could also be a factor.

Indeed. We often talk about mothers because there is a huge chance an incel is product of single parent upbringing but Dadcels are also a thing. Like I said before "incel" always was a broad category (same for Redpill) because a divorced father of three that had a shitty marriage and got fucked by alimony might've became an incel mid-wedlock.

OTOH Chris-chan him/her/itself wasn't raised by a single mother but Barb might had more of a say in the house than Bob. A passive or neutral father might be another contributive factor in an incel's becoming.

I honestly think the "incel" problem does start at home, because there really is something fundamental about being able to understand what makes one attractive, relatable, and personable that starts in childhood.

And that becomes harder to learn the older you get. "Old habits die hard" as the saying goes. Perhaps there's salvation when you have teenagers acting like this but that requires them to be in an detoxicated environment which is unlikely.

Not only home but school/work can also be a toxic place where an incel is stuck at and has to deal with. It's interesting to see how a toxic upbringing leads to someone always finding oneself in a toxic environment with equally toxic people. Sometimes unconsciously.

 

[isalaide]

@Celestial Peace So, is your conclusion that inceldom is unavoidable, determined in childhood, and there is no way for an incel to ever find a girlfriend or indeed a meaningful friendship?

 

[Celestial Peace]

@Celestial Peace So, is your conclusion that inceldom is unavoidable, determined in childhood

It is avoidable if you have minimally competent parents who can raise a child without fucking with them regarding social skills teaching them basic confidence, social etiquette, avoid gaslighting and try not to pressure them into meeting deluded and sometimes twisted expectations. Let them be themselves at least at home.

That is, supposing the child isn't born with some psychological issue (e.g.: BPD, NPD or Autism) likely inherited from some distant or close relative. If that's the case then the parents and the child are fucked.

Children and teenagers get a relative pass for being dicks because they're immature and people don't expect much from them. Adults OTOH do not and are expected to be productive and functional.

You're supposed to be in sort of an ideal shape for society when you reach adulthood. If not pretty much FYAD.

and there is no way for an incel to ever find a girlfriend or indeed a meaningful friendship?

If an incel has the opportunity to avoid being raised in a toxic household early in life then the rest just comes naturally save for mental cases. If not then yes an adult incel who spent his whole life being abused at home or elsewhere being taught that no matter what he does he'll end up alone because he's too broken and fucked up to suddenly adapt and learn social and flirting skills because at this rate he pretty much trusts no one will decay in loneliness.

And why would he? To him people have second thoughts every fucking time and acting naive near them might put him in trouble. That'll only worsen with time if the few friendships he had (supposing he had one) were as toxic as everybody else.

It's like raising a dog by beating him up and yelling at him. He'll grown afraid of human contact and perhaps become hostile. The difference is that a dog could easily learn to trust humans if he can be raised by better owners. A human does not work the same way. Mental scars and thought patterns are a thing.

And no sane woman would feel attracted to an incel because the red flags are alarming from the very start.

"Oh, but you see women dating bad guys, chumps, toxic dudes, etc." - Yeah, because most of them are manipulative and can hide their skeletons in the closet at first. An incel can't.

Not even toxic women would feel attracted because these kind of gals tend to be impulsive and are after men who knows how to psychologically mess around with them. Incels are too much of a social reject and awkward to be able to do that.

 

[The Punished Mitch]

Yeah, because most of them are manipulative and can hide their skeletons in the closet at first.

That's a figment of femoid imagination. The meme is that men think with their cock but the reality is 9/10 times a dude "turns out" to be some kind of psycho everyone else could see it coming a mile away - except the femoid in heat.

Same is true for men and dating insane women, by the way, but men and society don't larp about men being shrewd detectives socially.

 

[Hepativore]

Another thing to consider, is that many "incels" are in areas or societies where there might not be a lot of single people available as potential partners, and that they were simply unlucky as being the perpetual "third wheel" in their friend group, job, or school due to most people around them having paired off or having been already married. As "online dating" is usually a shitshow, this has basically led a lot of these sorts of people not having the good fortune to be in the right place at the right time, and asking random people about their current relationship status usually comes off as creepy or weird so it would probably backfire.

I suppose the term "incel" can be an overly broad term as well, since a lot of these people in this category are not just after sex, but stable romantic as well as platonic relationships and both are in short supply for a lot of people for many reasons.

I mean, yes, the "classic" portrayal of an "incel" in popular culture is that of an obese, fedora-wearing, neckbeard who is a narcissistic misogynist, but there are also many individuals who got fucked over in either their environment or their innate physical or mental traits that do not deserve the rather unfair scorn that society has for them.

These unlucky individuals have always existed but there is less of a social taboo about acknowledging their existence than in the past. I do not know what can be done to help them for the long-term, but I think that for the sake of reducing overall cultural dysfunction society should at least try and look at what could be done to improve their lot in life.

 

[Celestial Peace]

but the reality is 9/10 times a dude "turns out" to be some kind of psycho everyone else could see it coming a mile away - except the femoid in heat.

I didn't say they were complete masterminds. Most toxic dudes reek of Travis Bickle minus the social isolation and any girl who isn't naive or have self-esteem issues will avoid them.

The kind of girl who tends to (often repeatedly) hook up with such chumps are the type I mentioned before:

... toxic women... these kind of gals tend to be impulsive and are after men who knows how to psychologically mess around with them

@Hepativore, usually incels tend to find work at dead-end jobs thanks to their lack of soft skills and most dead-end jobs have older employees who are either married or divorced. This also don't help them at all in meeting new people. Aside from having the pre-existent issues I've already pointed out.

 

[anustart76]

boo hoo nigga who cares about incels

they aren't as big of an issue as liberals want to make them out to be, same as the neo nazis they also like to cry about. a vast majority of them don't bother anyone.

i'd be willing to bet my next paycheck a woman is more likely to experience violence at the hands of a guy who does have sex than an incel.

just leave the little weirdos alone.

It's a problem for governments, China is very scared of it right now. A society full of disillusioned young men is a breeding ground for rebellion. Not to mention that they're not having children, which means fewer tax chattel. This is why the CCP is pushing the military so hard, for example, but it's not going to work that well here since those young men have no faith in society and will refuse to join up. The CCP isn't doing so hot in that regard either admittedly, considering the "lying flat" movement over there.

 

[Alexander Thaut]

Another thing to consider, is that many "incels" are in areas or societies where there might not be a lot of single people available as potential partners, and that they were simply unlucky as being the perpetual "third wheel" in their friend group, job, or school due to most people around them having paired off or having been already married. As "online dating" is usually a shitshow, this has basically led a lot of these sorts of people not having the good fortune to be in the right place at the right time, and asking random people about their current relationship status usually comes off as creepy or weird so it would probably backfire.

I suppose the term "incel" can be an overly broad term as well, since a lot of these people in this category are not just after sex, but stable romantic as well as platonic relationships and both are in short supply for a lot of people for many reasons.

I mean, yes, the "classic" portrayal of an "incel" in popular culture is that of an obese, fedora-wearing, neckbeard who is a narcissistic misogynist, but there are also many individuals who got fucked over in either their environment or their innate physical or mental traits that do not deserve the rather unfair scorn that society has for them.

These unlucky individuals have always existed but there is less of a social taboo about acknowledging their existence than in the past. I do not know what can be done to help them for the long-term, but I think that for the sake of reducing overall cultural dysfunction society should at least try and look at what could be done to improve their lot in life.

I feel like everything's gone haywire compared to even a generation or two ago. It's just that the dissolution/decay of so many things that's led to the rise of all this.

The big push for colleges, the decay of the family unit, the focus on sex as a status symbol, etc. Sure, a lot of this has always existed in some form. Education's always been considered valuable. Sex has always been kinda a thing humans pursue.

We're stuck in a sorta vast wasteland. No incentive to get better.

I didn't say they were complete masterminds. Most toxic dudes reek of Travis Bickle minus the social isolation and any girl who isn't naive or have self-esteem issues will avoid them.

The kind of girl who tends to (often repeatedly) hook up with such chumps are the type I mentioned before:


@Hepativore, usually incels tend to find work at dead-end jobs thanks to their lack of soft skills and most dead-end jobs have older employees who are either married or divorced. This also don't help them at all in meeting new people. Aside from having the pre-existent issues I've already pointed out.

I feel like the issue with this is that a LOT of young men seem to wind up in dead end jobs these days. I don't think it's all because of "muh DEI".

 

[Celestial Peace]

Were Gen X the ones responsible for fertilizing the soil that sprouted the harvest of modern day depravity?

 

[Aljam]

Just buy the poor incels a hooker to pump and dump them. There, problem solved

 

[God of Nothing]

Were Gen X the ones responsible for fertilizing the soil that sprouted the harvest of modern day depravity?

I keep forgetting whether it was Gen X or Boomers that were hippies.
then again, i guess both can apply since there were boomer leader hippies and gen x follower hippies

 

[Celestial Peace]

I keep forgetting whether it was Gen X or Boomers that were hippies.

Likely Boomers 'cause some hippies were Vietnam veterans.

EDIT:

Something that I've been meaning to ask: What you guys think exactly a shrink would fail in helping an incel? Psychothreapy itself? Because I can't help but imagine a therapist telling an incel something like "Just touch some grass, son. Go hang out in some pub and meet new people.".

I'm thinking an incel patient aside from his lack of social skills would end up becoming an alcoholic. Another issue for him/her to deal with.