[Resolved] Domain Registrar & Epik's Seizure

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Should we sue Epik LLC?

  • Yes, I'll chip in.

    Votes: 1,709 55.2%
  • Yes, but I'm broke.

    Votes: 1,220 39.4%
  • No.

    Votes: 79 2.6%
  • No, but I'll chip in regardless.

    Votes: 86 2.8%

  • Total voters
    3,094
I'm not talking about how the court is setup, I'm talking about the actual suits themselves. I've been involved in a few lawsuits on either side (and won), and every single time, the demand section included "Plaintiff's costs herein expended" along with "any and all further relief this Court deems just and proper."
You can demand that all you like. You're usually not getting it in an American court. Never mind collecting it when you'd be at the absolute back in the line behind all the creditors this shitbox of a company already has, if you actually somehow do get it.
 
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Even if he doesn't get the attourney's fees covered, who cares? The point of this lawsuit is to get a court ruling that the Farms doesn't host CP.
Funnily enough I absolutely disagree:
The claim here is that Epik received a court order to remove us, which they admit they lied about. The other claim is about CSAM which they also lied about.
This is a two pronged approach. While CSAM is obviously a more serious accusation on the face of it and will be part of the lawsuit, it's like a blunt ugly hammer you use to smash your enemies. Claiming they received official government approval whilst in reality exercising their own power is insidious. Instead of a hammer this is a knife that their politically motivated executives use to stab you in the back and rip out your fucking organs with a gleeful smile on their face. It pushes (intentionally and cerebrally) the false narrative that we were removed for legally ordered legitimate reasons. It's impersonating a judge's authority.
The CSAM claim doesn't provoke such disgust in me because it's almost self evidently not true; it can be dismissed out of hand and in Internet forum hosting is sadly a common false accusation.

In my opinion, the lie about being compelled "by US authorities" should be the main thrust of the argument and what the lawsuit is "for". No one compelled them. THEY are laying claim to be judge, jury and executioner for the Internet. This is unacceptable.

Still fuck them for false CP claims tho.
 
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Funnily enough I absolutely disagree:

This is a two pronged approach. While CSAM is obviously a more serious accusation on the face of it and will be part of the lawsuit, it's like a blunt ugly hammer you use to smash your enemies. Claiming they received official government approval whilst in reality exercising their own power is insidious. Instead of a hammer this is a knife that their politically motivated executives use to stab you in the back and rip out your fucking organs with a gleeful smile on their face. It pushes (intentionally and cerebrally) the false narrative that we were removed for legally ordered legitimate reasons. It's impersonating a judge's authority.
The CSAM claim doesn't provoke such disgust in me because it's almost self evidently not true; it can be dismissed out of hand and in Internet forum hosting is sadly a common false accusation.

In my opinion, the lie about being compelled "by US authorities" should be the main thrust of the argument and what the lawsuit is "for". No one compelled them. THEY are laying claim to be judge, jury and executioner for the Internet. This is unacceptable.

Still fuck them for false CP claims tho.
I was going to say that the CP claim was worse, since people could use that by telling other people that Josh tries to do business with, "Oh, didn't you hear? The Kiwi Farms got kicked off of Epik for hosting CP. Do you really want anything to do with them?" Then I realized that they could also do that with the other claim. I still say that hosting CSEM is the worse of the two, though.
 
Just as a thought exercise: Would josh still have grounds to sue if Epik retracted all their statements and explicitly disavowed their claims?
Yes, because it can still cause tons of damage to the plaintiff for the time that it was up publicly. For example, someone could have lost a job or contract for defamatory statements that were up for a week which could have cost them $100,000. In this case, theres tons of screenshots that are being reshared and spread all over the place; genie can't be put back in the bottle. Archiving people still parroting their false statements could be used to show the extent of damages regardless of what damage control the company tried to do.
If Epik was some nobody it would not matter too much but no, this was a medium-sized domain registrar. The argument being, your company should be responsible and not retarded enough to let someone post false information that exposes them to liability like this.
 
I was going to say that the CP claim was worse, since people could use that by telling other people that Josh tries to do business with, "Oh, didn't you hear? The Kiwi Farms got kicked off of Epik for hosting CP. Do you really want anything to do with them?" Then I realized that they could also do that with the other claim. I still say that hosting CSEM is the worse of the two, though.
Vordrak used to bully providers into dropping KF all the time and then claim they'd dropped KF over hosting CP. It's a tactic which has been used successfully often enough that it would be useful for there to be enough of a consequence to make providers think twice in the future.
 
Just as a thought exercise: Would josh still have grounds to sue if Epik retracted all their statements and explicitly disavowed their claims?
Yes, but they would have a better position to argue about damages and whatnot than if they just refused to admit fault at all.
 
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can a smart jew tell me if donations to dear feeder's escrow are tax deductible, and if $100 donated to charity is even worth declaring? I tried searching the thread but came up short
 
can a smart jew tell me if donations to dear feeder's escrow are tax deductible, and if $100 donated to charity is even worth declaring? I tried searching the thread but came up short
No, only donations to qualified organizations (like 501(c)(3) organizations) are deductible, not donations to individuals.
 
Literally every second post of Null's in this thread is him pointing that out. Which, tbf, is an important thing to consider.


Couldn't you bankrupt someone in America by just financing a bunch of frivolous lawsuits against them from different plaintiff plants if the defendant has to pay their own costs every time it happens as @AnOminous says

Sounds really scarry, I wonder if its ever happened. One looney suing the same person over and over again can be blocked but how do you block a dozen people or more who are financed by dark money.
 
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It won't be wasted regardless
What really matters is the perception that if the donations get to $74,000 it won't fund the lawsuit. I don't think a post on page #132 in this thread will do much to help in that regard.

I won't bother you with this again but a counter is generally just a good idea, including:
People feel more inclined to participate when they can see the ball is already rolling.
If you won't have one for whatever reason, at least consider adding a disclaimer of what happens with the money in case of a partial run. I'm willing to donate to sue Epik. much less so to help your retarded friend.
 
Couldn't you bankrupt someone in America by just financing a bunch of frivolous lawsuits against them from different plaintiff plants if the defendant has to pay their own costs every time it happens as @AnOminous says
That's not what I said you fucking retard. But yes, spending defendants into bankruptcy has been a hobby of rich people for a long time.
 
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