"Smart" Cars

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Smart cars

  • Yay

    Votes: 9 13.6%
  • Nay

    Votes: 11 16.7%
  • Gay

    Votes: 46 69.7%

  • Total voters
    66
Honestly, I think you're safer on a motorcycle. You can bail from a motorcycle easily as long as you're reasonably fit and not riding a ridiculous chopper. Plus, most places require at least a helmet, and modern jackets are made to withstand both abrasion and impact...More than you're getting in the empty can of a smart car.
I've never driven a smart but I imagine a near-miss with a pheasant doesn't induce pants-shitting terror.

That said, just putting around town in either is pretty safe. It's on the 75 mph interstate where shit gets spooky. All it takes is one guy towing a camper not checking his mirrors when doing a lane change to cause you to have a very bad day.
 
Hate to contradict you here because I'd happily have a motorcycle myself but, my wife is an emergency nurse with 14 years of experience and she loves to tell horror stories about biker injuries. They either disintegrate entirely or they come in without any visible sign of injury and tremendous internal hemorrhaging.
You're not wrong, but a good portion of those injuries come from being an idiot- overriding your skill level (or your headlight), taking dumb risks, and not wearing safety gear or wearing it wrong. A guy that wears shorts and a tank top on a sport bike is more or less asking to be flayed if the bike slides. It is amazing how many people don't even go as far as to wear heavy-denim jeans (which themselves are marginal at best for safety) or gloves, which not only protect in the event of a crash, but provide a non-slip grip on the handlebars and controls. Mine even have a padded palm to reduce fatigue.

Other people on the road in cars and trucks (and FUCK SUVs) are a big hazard to motorcyclists and I assume to Smart Car drivers, too. Smart phones have probably caused more near misses while I've been riding than anything else.

But hey, bones heal, chicks dig scars, and the United States of America has the best doctor-to-daredevil ratio in the world.
 
I guarantee the mean IQ would go up if cars were made less survivable, so I am all for their acceptance.

I see your logic but the fault here is that smart people would still perish in accidents when their cars get slammed into by Bubba driving his paper maché truck with a lift kit made from rolled up copies of yesterday's news.
 
You're not wrong, but a good portion of those injuries come from being an idiot- overriding your skill level (or your headlight), taking dumb risks, and not wearing safety gear or wearing it wrong. A guy that wears shorts and a tank top on a sport bike is more or less asking to be flayed if the bike slides. It is amazing how many people don't even go as far as to wear heavy-denim jeans (which themselves are marginal at best for safety) or gloves, which not only protect in the event of a crash, but provide a non-slip grip on the handlebars and controls. Mine even have a padded palm to reduce fatigue.

Other people on the road in cars and trucks (and FUCK SUVs) are a big hazard to motorcyclists and I assume to Smart Car drivers, too. Smart phones have probably caused more near misses while I've been riding than anything else.

But hey, bones heal, chicks dig scars, and the United States of America has the best doctor-to-daredevil ratio in the world.
You mean my wrap-around sunglasses and tank top aren't safe? They have H-D logos on them! That's better than kevlar.

A couple years ago I hauled from Chicago to Seattle during Sturgis. I took i-90. Mistake. The motorcyclists were fine. Defensive and curteous as always. It was the RVs. Either doing 50 or 80 on dry rotted chinese tires with improper tow mirrors. Those guys kill people.

Also, BMW riders had the best safety gear. H-D worst. I think they spent all their money on their bikes and merchandise with the stupid logo on it.
 
I have driven a couple of smart cars, and they were really disappointing. You'd think they could make such a tiny car at least responsive, but no, they suck at taking off from a stop. The fact that they're expensive to repair and not really super cheap to buy just makes them stupid.

I'd be glad to drive a tiny, cheap car if they put a half decent engine in it and make it cheap to repair, and obviously it has to run on normal gasoline. A motorcycle is too open, and too vulnerable to one bad move by another driver. What would be an annoying sideswipe and a smashed up door is a potential fatality on a motorcycle.
 
I once was stuck behind a smart car trying to merge, that was really sad and really scary I pitied the person, but they chose to buy it.

Me on the other hand (at the time) was itchy to use the 500+ pony's I paid for.

Honestly, in the euro market and asian market I can see them as a decent fit, while over all what they are not a great car, how or why they came to NA to be anything aside a niche joke/deathtrap/meme is strange to me. To the point I put my tin foil hat on and think they are trying to normalize failures like that and elec only cars to take away our huffing V8s.
 
I once was stuck behind a smart car trying to merge, that was really sad and really scary I pitied the person, but they chose to buy it.

Me on the other hand (at the time) was itchy to use the 500+ pony's I paid for.

Honestly, in the euro market and asian market I can see them as a decent fit, while over all what they are not a great car, how or why they came to NA to be anything aside a niche joke/deathtrap/meme is strange to me. To the point I put my tin foil hat on and think they are trying to normalize failures like that and elec only cars to take away our huffing V8s.
They were originally designed to be air conditioned golf carts for retirees living in the Villages in Florida and other semi-separate enclaves. Then some idiot decided “Hey! Let’s market these as good mileage cars, after a few tweaks to make them street legal!”
 
They were originally designed to be air conditioned golf carts for retirees living in the Villages in Florida and other semi-separate enclaves. Then some idiot decided “Hey! Let’s market these as good mileage cars, after a few tweaks to make them street legal!”
I can't get the over seas glass headlights on my car because "safety' but some how an airbag in a golf cart is street legal.

Fuck USDOT.
 
Why not get a Prius? The newer ones are less dorky looking, they're still pretty small, and they get better mileage.
I once was stuck behind a smart car trying to merge, that was really sad and really scary I pitied the person, but they chose to buy it.

Me on the other hand (at the time) was itchy to use the 500+ pony's I paid for.

Honestly, in the euro market and asian market I can see them as a decent fit, while over all what they are not a great car, how or why they came to NA to be anything aside a niche joke/deathtrap/meme is strange to me. To the point I put my tin foil hat on and think they are trying to normalize failures like that and elec only cars to take away our huffing V8s.
I don't get the deal with electric-only cars either. What if you want to go somewhere with no electric charging stations?
 
If you yank the entire battery system out of a prius they putt decently enough, friend of mine is in real estate and does that he snagged one for nothing with a dead batt, we pulled the whole system and tada 50 mpg. (you know almost what a factory 92 civic hx got)

See above with the tin foil, more and more people get them, more and more places have to charge them or have systems... soon the ICE is gone. I do know someone who has a solar roof that makes him money and a volt but they use that only for quick trips and admit it's for the lulz and was a lot of money for cool factor.. I think his vette is cooler tbh.
 
If you yank the entire battery system out of a prius they putt decently enough, friend of mine is in real estate and does that he snagged one for nothing with a dead batt, we pulled the whole system and tada 50 mpg. (you know almost what a factory 92 civic hx got)

See above with the tin foil, more and more people get them, more and more places have to charge them or have systems... soon the ICE is gone. I do know someone who has a solar roof that makes him money and a volt but they use that only for quick trips and admit it's for the lulz and was a lot of money for cool factor.. I think his vette is cooler tbh.
I see where you're coming from, but I disagree. Electric car ownership is skewed toward certain parts of the country. There's going to be lots of states where there'll never be a huge amount of people with electric cars, and car companies will continue to make gas cars for them. Of course the real awful future is one where everyone has an electric car, except rednecks, who now all drive Ford pickups the size of tanks.

Putting my tin foil hat on, I think Tesla's going to fold within the next two years, and either it'll be because of a huge scandal, or after it folds it'll come out that their accounting was worse than Enron's, and this will lead to companies shying away from electric-only cars.
 
I see where you're coming from, but I disagree. Electric car ownership is skewed toward certain parts of the country. There's going to be lots of states where there'll never be a huge amount of people with electric cars, and car companies will continue to make gas cars for them. Of course the real awful future is one where everyone has an electric car, except rednecks, who now all drive Ford pickups the size of tanks.

Putting my tin foil hat on, I think Tesla's going to fold within the next two years, and either it'll be because of a huge scandal, or after it folds it'll come out that their accounting was worse than Enron's, and this will lead to companies shying away from electric-only cars.
Tesla was trying to have suppliers take back materials and give Tesla a refund in cash. Enron wishes they had the accounting department/PR firm of Tesla
 
I have driven a couple of smart cars, and they were really disappointing. You'd think they could make such a tiny car at least responsive, but no, they suck at taking off from a stop. The fact that they're expensive to repair and not really super cheap to buy just makes them stupid.

I'd be glad to drive a tiny, cheap car if they put a half decent engine in it and make it cheap to repair, and obviously it has to run on normal gasoline. A motorcycle is too open, and too vulnerable to one bad move by another driver. What would be an annoying sideswipe and a smashed up door is a potential fatality on a motorcycle.
With everything so cramped, a simple component swap will likely require major disassembly just to get to the part, hence the costly repair. I don't have firsthand experience fixing microcars but I work with someone who does, and they're a bitch apparently.

Yeah, smart cars are underpowered, except for the turbo. All gasoline powered smart cars have three cylinder engines btw.
 
The issue isn't that they're unsafe, it's just that, material and build technology has gotten to the point that you no longer have to build a car that small for efficiency.

You can get reasonable economy operation out of a "compact" car like a Mazda 3 or VW Golf these days to the point that making an even smaller car is a textbook case of diminishing returns, you aren't making it THAT much more fuel-efficient, but you ARE sacrificing utility (the amount of cargo you can haul) and personal space for no real appreciable gain. It's ironically, TOO small.

For what it costs to buy a Smart, you're already past 50% cost of getting a slightly larger "Economy" entry-level car that can do everything it can and more without using appreciably more fuel in the long run, or a decent secondhand car.

The market for them is really only graduates of Crunchy Granola University who want to virtue signal about how tiny their carbon footprint is, and a very extreme group of people in such a cramped/urban environment that a tiny car (even by car standards) makes sense. But added up, these groups represent such a small % that it's really not in any automaker's best interest to try and cater to them, either cynically or genuinely, you see this happen every 20 years or so, someone will invent a "microcar" in direct response to perceived excesses of the industry or spikes in gas prices and declare THIS is surely the way of the future, and it flops, for all the reasons above.

For all you have to "give up" you don't get enough in return to justify it, especially in the price.


The Peel P50, the Bond Bug, Reliant Robin, Isetta, Dale, Scion IQ, there are dozens of headstones in that ever-growing graveyard.

Pure electric is still being held back by the power-to-weight issue inherent in lead-acid batteries, barring a sudden leap in technology.

The best idea is the hybrid, with the gas engine covering the areas the electric car falls short while getting a great return on mileage.
 
The issue isn't that they're unsafe, it's just that, material and build technology has gotten to the point that you no longer have to build a car that small for efficiency.

You can get reasonable economy operation out of a "compact" car like a Mazda 3 or VW Golf these days to the point that making an even smaller car is a textbook case of diminishing returns, you aren't making it THAT much more fuel-efficient, but you ARE sacrificing utility (the amount of cargo you can haul) and personal space for no real appreciable gain. It's ironically, TOO small.

For what it costs to buy a Smart, you're already past 50% cost of getting a slightly larger "Economy" entry-level car that can do everything it can and more without using appreciably more fuel in the long run, or a decent secondhand car.

The market for them is really only graduates of Crunchy Granola University who want to virtue signal about how tiny their carbon footprint is, and a very extreme group of people in such a cramped/urban environment that a tiny car (even by car standards) makes sense. But added up, these groups represent such a small % that it's really not in any automaker's best interest to try and cater to them, either cynically or genuinely, you see this happen every 20 years or so, someone will invent a "microcar" in direct response to perceived excesses of the industry or spikes in gas prices and declare THIS is surely the way of the future, and it flops, for all the reasons above.

For all you have to "give up" you don't get enough in return to justify it, especially in the price.


The Peel P50, the Bond Bug, Reliant Robin, Isetta, Dale, Scion IQ, there are dozens of headstones in that ever-growing graveyard.

Pure electric is still being held back by the power-to-weight issue inherent in lead-acid batteries, barring a sudden leap in technology.

The best idea is the hybrid, with the gas engine covering the areas the electric car falls short while getting a great return on mileage.
Pure electric is no longer constrained by lead-acid battery chemistry. Teslas are lithium-ion. Hybrids are another repair nightmare unto themselves, both for the technician and the consumer.

I agree with your erudite assessment of the economics of microcars. Absolutely past the point of diminishing returns.

In addition to not being worth it, however, microcars have also been found unsafe in tests conducted by the IIHS, whose tests are far more stringent than Federal requirements.
 
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I see where you're coming from, but I disagree. Electric car ownership is skewed toward certain parts of the country. There's going to be lots of states where there'll never be a huge amount of people with electric cars, and car companies will continue to make gas cars for them. Of course the real awful future is one where everyone has an electric car, except rednecks, who now all drive Ford pickups the size of tanks.

Putting my tin foil hat on, I think Tesla's going to fold within the next two years, and either it'll be because of a huge scandal, or after it folds it'll come out that their accounting was worse than Enron's, and this will lead to companies shying away from electric-only cars.
Imagine owning an electric car in, say, Nebraska. Unless it's got solar and wind generators, that thing is gonna be mothballed pretty damn quick.
 
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